'80s Movie Montage
Breaking down our favorite decade of flicks. Hosted by Anna Keizer and Derek Dehanke.
'80s Movie Montage
Dirty Dancing
With special guest and Dirty Dancing (1987) Mega Fan Michelle Lang, Anna and Derek discuss why this independent film went on to become one of the most beloved movies from the '80s. Probably has something to do with carrying a watermelon and not putting Baby in a corner.
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Anna Keizer and Derek Dehanke are the co-hosts of ‘80s Movie Montage. The idea for the podcast came when they realized just how much they talk – a lot – when watching films from their favorite cinematic era. Their wedding theme was “a light nod to the ‘80s,” so there’s that, too. Both hail from the Midwest but have called Los Angeles home for several years now. Anna is a writer who received her B.A. in Film/Video from Columbia College Chicago and M.A. in Film Studies from Chapman University. Her dark comedy short She Had It Coming was an Official Selection of 25 film festivals with several awards won for it among them. Derek is an attorney who also likes movies. It is a point of pride that most of their podcast episodes are longer than the movies they cover.
Michelle Henniges Lang is a self-proclaimed '80s movie buff and one of the biggest Dirty Dancing fans ever to roam the earth. Originally from Chicago, she now lives in Southern California. Her love for '80s movies started in childhood when she knew that there could never be a better-made movie than one by John Hughes, John Carpenter, John Landis, or Robert Zemeckis… just to name a few! Michelle graduated with a BA in Film and Television (Directing), and her love for this era of film has persisted, as she now is a Special Education Teacher who enjoys watching and sharing many of these great movies with her students.
Hello and welcome to 80s movie montage. We're not essential, but we wish we were. I'm Derek.
SPEAKER_06:And I'm Anna.
SPEAKER_02:And today we're here to talk about Dirty Dancing. Oh yeah.
SPEAKER_06:Yes.
SPEAKER_02:Amazing.
SPEAKER_06:This was my pick. I'm super excited to talk about it. And uh yeah, everybody, thank you so much for joining us today for this super fun show. We have a guest coming up later in the podcast. She is a dirty dancing mega fan.
SPEAKER_02:How much more of a fan is that than a super fan?
SPEAKER_06:I would say by about like exponentially, like tenfold.
SPEAKER_02:I accept that. Yeah, that sounds right. I mean, and she is, like she for sure is.
SPEAKER_06:So she's amazing. So, okay, cool. Dirty dancing. This one, the this one has my heart. I have loved this movie since it first came out. It was released in 1987. And like I usually do, I like to kind of do a little bit of a behind the scenes and talk about the people who were behind the camera uh before we dive into the movie and all the people who started it. I mean, you guys know, right? I mean, Jennifer Gray.
SPEAKER_02:Okay, who else? Isn't there like some guy that dances?
SPEAKER_06:There's this guy, his name is Patrick Swayze, and he's a pretty good dancer.
SPEAKER_02:He's a good bouncer, too, but that's another story.
SPEAKER_06:Oh man. Is Roadhouse even an 80s movie?
SPEAKER_02:I don't know. I mean, I don't think it's on the list. Darn. Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:So we'll we'll we'll keep moving along. So, Dirty Dancing. Like I said, released in 87. What's really interesting about this particular film is so, you know, like I mentioned, I kind of always go over like who wrote it or directed it or whatever. Kind of unlike some of our other films that we've covered so far, the person who wrote this, her name is Eleanor Bergstein. Or Bergstein. I think it's Bergstein.
SPEAKER_02:Okay, we can go with that. She apologies if that's not correct.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, apologies. She didn't really have any other films that she wrote.
SPEAKER_02:I mean, if you have this one, I don't know if you need a whole lot more.
SPEAKER_06:She's probably doing just fine. Yeah. I think she's doing just fine.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:And actually, so we talk we do talk about this with our special guest later on, but wanted to really quickly give a shout-out because I mean, I would love for people to stick with this podcast and and listen to what we have to say about dirty dancing. But for those of you who may also want to have some visual entertainment, and if you have Netflix, at least Netflix in the United States, there's this great little series called The Movies That Made Us, and there's an episode about Dirty Dancing, and Eleanor is featured prominently.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, she's it's basically her.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah. So if you want to know more about the person who wrote this film and kind of like the path to how it got created, go see the dirty dancing episode of the movies that made us.
SPEAKER_02:And just to be clear, we are not in fact sponsored by Netflix.
SPEAKER_06:We're not sponsored. Oh man, could you imagine?
SPEAKER_02:We're doing this just uh We're just doing this as a little of our for people that uh love dirty dancing, we want to give them even more dirty dancing content after you've listened to the podcast.
SPEAKER_06:Exactly. So, okay, so moving on. Um, also what's really interesting about this film, so it was directed by a gentleman named Emil Ardolino.
SPEAKER_03:Okay.
SPEAKER_06:Okay. And unlike a lot of other directors that kind of came up maybe through television or maybe through other like smaller films, actually, what this guy was known for was his dance documentaries.
SPEAKER_02:Oh wow, that is actually kind of interesting because there is, in fact, a fair amount of dancing in this movie. Exactly.
SPEAKER_06:So, you know, good on the filmmakers for bringing this guy on because he knew what to look for. He knew what would be compelling visually as far as the dancing goes, of which there is quite a bit.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, no, I think that was probably a pretty successful choice.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, so he did, I think he did great personally. And then, you know, he did go on to direct a couple other uh feature films. He has unfortunately passed. He passed actually pretty young. I think he was about 50. Um, but he directed Sister Act.
SPEAKER_02:Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_06:He directed not Three Men and a Baby.
SPEAKER_02:Three men and a little lady. There you go. Okay. Is that the how many of them were were there?
SPEAKER_06:Like there were Well, at least two.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. I don't know.
SPEAKER_06:And then also chances are. So he did a couple mainstream type films. Okay. Um, okay, I'm kind of like skipping over those people pretty quickly because the person I really wanted to get to who this individu this like person in this position and title is usually not mentioned in I think many movie podcasts. The choreographer.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, yeah, that's actually quite important here. Right? Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:So you might even recognize this guy's name. Does Kenny Ortega ring a bell to you?
SPEAKER_02:Wait, me? No. No, no, it does not?
SPEAKER_06:Okay, all right, all right. Well, he did choreograph this film, and actually he he he's like a huge name now. I mean, both for his choreography and for his directing. So really, okay. Yeah, just to give you like a little bit of background. So he he started off as a choreographer, and I think he still does a fair amount of that for his own projects, but he also kind of does like dual responsibilities of choreography and directing. So do you remember Xanadu? We might do Xanadu at some point.
SPEAKER_02:I love that. I remember seeing a poster for Xanadu and wondering Newton John. Yeah. It's amazing. And looking at the poster going, Gene Kelly. What is this?
SPEAKER_06:It's really good. Bizarre, but really good.
SPEAKER_02:Alright, so he did he did that?
SPEAKER_06:He did that. Uh he also was a choreographer, so he did a lot of like 80s and John Hughes affiliations. Um St. Elmo's Fire, which I'm not saying that's John Hughes, but Pretty in Pink, Ferris Bieler's Day Off, The Great Outdoors.
SPEAKER_02:With John Candy and Dan Aykroyd.
SPEAKER_06:That's correct.
SPEAKER_02:All right.
SPEAKER_06:Uh he was a choreographer for Shag. I don't that's probably I hate using this term, but it's probably more of a checkbook. So I'm not surprised if you've never seen it.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, no, I didn't know I didn't even know what that was. I was waiting for like a second part of that name or something.
SPEAKER_06:Like Oh wow. Okay, well.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I'm not familiar with that either.
SPEAKER_06:It's not an ED film, so we'll have to do that on our own. Okay, so I know you know this film because I think you have feelings about it. Hocus Pocus.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, yeah, yeah. Yeah, so real quick, Hocus Pocus is just not in our like generation's wheelhouse, but I I certainly appreciate that love this movie. Yeah, there's like a generation of people who are perhaps a little bit younger than us, and that's what they grew up with. And I'm sure there are movies that we grew up with that are like, what what even is that? What even is that is kind of my reaction to Hocus Pocus. And I gave it a fair shake this past Halloween because I I have heard so much hype about it. And so I turned it on, it happened to be on. I watched about five minutes, I'm like, yeah, no, this is this is not for me. I can't do it. Anyways.
SPEAKER_06:Well, okay, so newsies, he was the director on that.
SPEAKER_02:There was a lot of dancing in that, wasn't there?
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, quite climbed, yeah, for sure. And actually that's interesting because like I only have him down as the director for that. I guess I didn't see him as choreographer, but that would make sense if he was. Maybe he directed the maybe if that was like his first major directing, he didn't want to take on a book. Yeah, exactly. Okay, so do you know what I'm saying when I say this is it?
SPEAKER_02:Uh it reminds me of a Huey Lewis news. Huey Lewis in the news song, so probably not.
SPEAKER_06:So that was the documentary about uh Michael Jackson. Do you remember that? Oh yeah. And actually, one of our very dear friends, Jaclyn, worked on that film. Okay. She was an assistant editor. That's amazing. So he directed that. So he was the person who, you know, I think while Michael Jackson was still living, like he was there. It was a documentary, so a different kind of film. It's not a fictional narrative. Um, but he was behind that film. And then, I mean, we could talk about this a little bit later. I guess we could talk about it now, but we both have pretty strong opinions about like rebooting films from the 80s. I'm generally not a fan of it.
SPEAKER_02:I'm I'm open to the idea. It just seems like it never works out very well.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah. And unfortunately, as of right now, on IMDb, there is like a listing for a new dirty dancing.
SPEAKER_02:Well, they had the they had like the sequel in Havana. Havana nights at nighttime. Yeah. And then they had the TV series that seemed to not be super successful or well received necessarily. So why not?
SPEAKER_06:I mean, it it very let's let's go for it. I mean, it may not happen. I mean, a lot of times things are announced and they never move forward. But as of right now, it's been announced at the very least, and he is attached as director.
SPEAKER_02:Which do you think will come out first? A dirty dancing reboot or a big trouble in Little China beat reboot starring The Rock? You know, because I've I've heard I've heard things.
SPEAKER_06:That would okay. So here's the thing though, is that like you also have feelings about Big Trouble good feelings about Big Trouble in Little China. And I don't have that kind of attachment. I think usually when people get all grumpy about reboots or remakes or whatever, is when they have like an attachment to the original.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, they don't want that change, they like it the way it was, and they don't want a new one because it will feel different and it's not gonna be the same as what you like grew up with or or became attached to in the first place.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, so as far as I'm concerned, I'd be like, okay, that's fine. I could totally see the rock doing that, but I don't know as somebody who loves the original if that's like something that you would want to have happen. So it's not because it's flipped. Yeah. It's flipped for me. Like I don't want a new dirty dancing. So there you go. So, Mr. Kenny Ortega, very impressive uh resume. So we are going to finally move on to the powerhouses behind this film in terms of the stars. And we've mentioned Ms. Jennifer Gray and Baby Houseman. Yep. Uh baby Frances Houseman.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Well, I mean, IMDB does not list Frances, so it's possible they just made that up.
SPEAKER_06:First woman in the cabinet, I believe, is what in the film.
SPEAKER_02:I think I think that's right, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_06:So also what's really interesting about Jennifer, I don't know if you are aware of who she's the daughter of.
SPEAKER_02:In the movie?
SPEAKER_06:No, in real life. No, no, I'm not. So her father is Joel Gray.
SPEAKER_04:Okay.
SPEAKER_06:Okay, so Joel Gray, he himself is has a really impressive resume, but in general, he is an actor. Like, he's a hyphen it. So he's actor, dancer, choreographer. So she kind of has it in her DNA to be a good dancer. So it kind of makes sense that she was looked at for the movie.
SPEAKER_02:She really came along during this movie. I mean, at first it seemed like she couldn't dance at all.
SPEAKER_06:She had two Lafitte.
SPEAKER_02:By the end, she was phenomenal.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, she was amazing.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:And currently, well, I'm saying that as if at some point it's not going to be true. She's the wife of Clark Gregg.
SPEAKER_02:So that's Agent Colson from Oh, from uh Agents of Shield in the Marvel movies.
SPEAKER_06:So that's Jennifer Gray. I mean, this she okay, just like a ton of people that we've talked about in the all these podcasts, she's been working ever since. You know, before Dirty Dancing and definitely past.
SPEAKER_02:Was Ferris Bueller's Day off before or after?
SPEAKER_06:Uh those before. Okay. Those a year before. Or at least like release release dates.
SPEAKER_02:I just mean it kind of establishes a precedent for her having like a type, you know, with Charlie Sheen and then uh Patrick Swayze. She just likes that. She just likes that bad boy. Alright. Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:Um well what's interesting, okay. So I'll bring this up be just right now. So she and Patrick Swayze, they had already worked together. They were in Red Dawn.
SPEAKER_02:Oh yeah, I I've I've forgotten that many times, but yes.
SPEAKER_06:And the rumor is they really didn't like each other very much. I don't know what went down, but they just like weren't on great terms. And so she kind of had to be convinced to do this film because she just didn't want to work with him again.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I thought that they just kind of mutually didn't really like each other. Want to work with each other.
SPEAKER_06:If I'm I mean, like, don't quote me on this. Uh you read things and there's different perspectives depending on who you're reading. But that I think he came around a little bit earlier than she did, and so he actually kind of like extended the olive branch and was like, you know, you should do this film.
SPEAKER_02:That feels like a very sway thing to do. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_06:It's pretty sway.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:So you mentioned Ferris Buller's Day Off.
SPEAKER_02:I did.
SPEAKER_06:Um, she also, I know this wasn't your show, but she had like a recurring role on Friends. She was Rachel's best friend who then eventually married the fiance that she left at the altar.
SPEAKER_02:Okay. Yeah, no, I didn't know that.
SPEAKER_06:Great little part, great little part on friends. Um, she's also been a voice actor. She's uh a voice on Phineas and Ferb.
SPEAKER_02:Animation on uh Nickelodeon, I think.
SPEAKER_06:I guess so.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:This is okay, so this is what I love. She had a role on Grey's Anatomy. Jennifer Gray's Anatomy.
SPEAKER_02:Jennifer Gray's Anatomy.
SPEAKER_06:Jennifer Gray's Anatomy.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:And then apparently, right now, we haven't really kept up with the show, but she has a or recurring role on the Connors.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, yeah. The Connors. Um, man, that has a complicated history. Primarily because of what the Connors was called before it was changed to the Connors.
SPEAKER_06:But that that's probably And it was an 80s show, but we do 80s movies. So we will just move right along.
SPEAKER_02:Moving on.
SPEAKER_06:Moving on to Mr. Patrick Swayze. Um, you know, he's he's passed more than 10 years ago. Can you believe that?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:Um, such a shame. So truly, you know, when you say movie star, he was a movie star. He no, he really was.
SPEAKER_02:Like any scene, any movie he's in, anytime he's on the screen, like your eyes are drawn to him. It doesn't matter like how ridiculous it is, it could be something completely stupid in Roadhouse, or him like jumping out of a plane in point break. I don't think that's 80s, but anyways, it's a great movie.
SPEAKER_06:I think it's right on the cusp, it's 9091.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, no, he he definitely was like a huge movie star.
SPEAKER_06:He was amazing.
SPEAKER_02:Or making pottery.
SPEAKER_06:Or making pottery. Well, it was Demi Moore who was the potterer?
SPEAKER_02:How do you what's somebody who no, I think potterer is definitely it. Um yeah. I mean, he if he didn't help, his ghost certainly did.
SPEAKER_06:Well, he was still alive in that scene. Anyway, we're we're getting off track.
SPEAKER_02:I don't know. I don't I think there were some special features that show him making pottery.
SPEAKER_06:Also, okay, in the same way that Jennifer Gray, it kind of made sense why they would maybe look to her for this role because of like her at least assumed dancing background, um, given her dad and everything. Patrick Swayze was a dancer.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:He, a very accomplished dancer, and he actually was in videos prior to kind of transitioning into film where he was used as a dancer. And the reason why I bring this up is because there's a tieback to actually there's a couple tiebacks among all these different actors that were in the film, which I just find those things interesting. So he do you know the Toto song Rosanna? I know you do.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I do.
SPEAKER_06:Reason why, so in case anybody out there doesn't know, Derek and I are married. We uh we are a happily married couple, and whenever we're in the car and the song Rosanna comes on, because my name is Anna, I turned down the row part. So it's just Anna.
SPEAKER_02:There is an emphasis, silly emphasis on Anna during that song. Yeah. So anyway, he was a dancer in the I assume like if there are couples out there where maybe uh someone's name is Rose, they would just mute out the other part. And it works that way too. So there you go. Yeah, there's our tip of the day.
SPEAKER_06:So as he got into film, um, he's one of several actors that went on to do big things in The Outsiders. So, in that, we already mentioned Red Dawn. I remember being really little and already being enamored with him in the TV series North and South.
SPEAKER_02:Okay, so I remember that. I remember that he was in it, but I don't think I watched any of that brother versus brother show.
SPEAKER_06:I think there were you know, it's so strange, and again, sorry to It was a huge deal. It was a huge deal. A huge deal. I think they even like spread it out like the first part and the second part like by six months, so it was like this like they used to have actual TV events. Yeah, like you just don't have those anymore.
SPEAKER_02:Because now you have so many options to see whatever you want in so many different ways on different platforms at any time. But back then you were like kind of captive. I watched way more kung fu than I ever thought I'd want to because it just happened to be on all the time.
SPEAKER_06:And so he was in that, and I think I think the only reason why I mean that was very adult material. I don't even know why I was being allowed to watch it so young.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, the historical significance.
SPEAKER_06:Historical significance, and also like again, another film that really wasn't like kitty friendly per se, but I just adored was Gone with the Win. And so I think the whole Civil War thing really just like was something that appealed to me as a anyway.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, there was a time where that was oddly romanticized.
SPEAKER_06:Very much so. Yeah, you're not wrong. Okay, so moving on, Youngblood.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, yeah, yeah. He who was he in Youngblood, though? He wasn't because Rob Lowe was like was actual Youngblood.
SPEAKER_06:Which is just so interesting because you see these actors of the 80s, even though, okay, Rob Lowe was for sure part of that brat pack thing. Yeah, but you see a lot of actors from that era like being put in movies together over and over again. I just I just find that really interesting. I I don't think you really get that so much anymore, except for like Emma Stone and Ryan Gosling. Like there's they're always paired up. Or Jennifer Lawrence and Bradley Cooper. Haven't they been in a couple of yeah, they were because they were in Silver Lining's playbook and they were in um American Hustle.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, that's right. Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah. So so you see it sometimes, but just not as much. Um moving on, you already mentioned Roadhouse. You already mentioned, well, you mentioned most of these, so sorry about that. But that no, that's totally fine. Roadhouse, I didn't know you were such a pay Patrick Swayze fan.
SPEAKER_02:I mean, Roadhouse is just it it's so I I I need to add it to the list if I if I can.
SPEAKER_06:I mean I don't think you can.
SPEAKER_02:His whole his whole thing about like it's just there's so much effort into customer service related to being like a good it's so it's so ridiculous. It's so over the top.
SPEAKER_06:Oh, son of a gun.
SPEAKER_02:90.
SPEAKER_06:89. 89, okay. Oh man. This just in. At some point, way down the road, way down the road.
SPEAKER_02:Way down the road. Wait house.
SPEAKER_06:Moving on. Yes, yes, I I feel you. Um, Ghost, Point Break, which I love. I love point break. That is probably what probably second to this in terms of my favorite Swayze movie.
SPEAKER_04:Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah. And then we talk about this with our special guest a little bit later. He had a little bit of a cameo in a movie which we probably will never be watching, nope. Which is Dirty Dancing Havana Nights. Yep. So okay. So moving on. This film, a lot of really great actors. So you and I both have a shared love for Jerry Orbach, again, a gentleman who's no longer with us.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I I he is actually my favorite actor in this movie, notwithstanding Patrick Swayze's stardom, because I have just fond memories of watching Jerry Orbach in Law and Order.
SPEAKER_06:And he brings like a real integrity, I think, to the film. I mean, if they didn't have somebody of his caliber in it, I don't know if people would maybe take it as seriously. He grounds it a little bit more.
SPEAKER_02:There are some scenes that we'll kind of talk about later with our guest where like without saying a word, he he provides so much to a scene emotionally where like yeah, I think it helps to have someone that you can take seriously and and like feel that emotion coming coming through him without him having to say anything. So I don't know who else would do that.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, he was just simply a great actor. And some of his other credits, um, he had a role in Brewster's Millions. Yeah, he did.
SPEAKER_02:Really? Okay. Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:Crimes and misdemeanors.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_06:Um, he was on murder, she wrote. But then probably, okay, so you and I respectively love him also in two different roles. So, like, your thing was you loved him in Law and Order.
SPEAKER_02:I did, yeah, he was great.
SPEAKER_06:Detective Lenny Briscoe.
SPEAKER_02:Yep.
SPEAKER_06:So for me, even though this is not even probably in my top five animated Disney films, he was the voice of Lumier and Beauty and the Beast, which I just think is just so fun. That this guy who is known for like kind of these like heavy-hitting type roles was Lumier.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, that is pretty cool.
SPEAKER_06:It's pretty cool. So uh that's Mr. Jerry Orebac. So moving on. I love this woman, and I think that like she's maybe a little bit overlooked. Cynthia Rhodes. So she That was uh Penny, right? Yes. So she plays Penny and Dirty Dancing. Um, longtime friend, once upon a time lover of Johnny Castle, Patrick Swayze. And so she also very much, I mean, you you can't even there's no getting around the fact that she is like a professional dancer.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, no, she's she's obviously a professional dancer, isn't she?
SPEAKER_06:She's amazing.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:And the reason why I brought up Patrick Swayze specifically being in that Toto video is she is also in the same video.
SPEAKER_02:Well, they were longtime friends, so that makes sense.
SPEAKER_06:But isn't that I mean, I think that's amazing. What are the odds? They're both they're both in that Toto video for Rosanna. She's the woman in red. Okay. So there you go. All right. Um, and then this makes a lot of sense given her background. She is in a couple other 80s films that have quite a bit of dance flash dance. She has a role in flash dance.
SPEAKER_04:All right.
SPEAKER_06:And then also she has a role in staying alive. So makes sense. Um, and then so part of the reason why she really kind of like I who knows, maybe she didn't even want to continue acting anyway, but she was also in a video for Richard Marks. They fell in love, got married, had kids, and she kind of moved out of the acting world.
SPEAKER_02:So she's still married to they are not. Well, they're not. I think she made the right choice.
SPEAKER_06:Wow. Uh throwing some Richard Marks shade.
SPEAKER_02:Never a big fan. Wow. Okay.
SPEAKER_06:Well, we'll save that for another podcast, I guess.
SPEAKER_02:He always offered a really good reason to like change channels or move the radio station over, like, uh yeah.
SPEAKER_06:Never knew. Okay. Um, and so yeah, we have, you know, other individuals who have great credits, like longtime careers, the gentleman who plays Max Kellerman, Jack Weston. Um, I just had to mention.
SPEAKER_02:I I hope you're mentioning who I think you're about to mention, but you might not be. But go ahead.
SPEAKER_06:Oh, no, I'll leave that one to you. I know you get so much joy out of it.
SPEAKER_02:It's fun to me.
SPEAKER_06:Um, so yeah, the guy who owns this um this like retreat.
SPEAKER_02:Who like runs the place? Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, he so that's that's who I'm talking about. He also was an Ishtar and Short Circuit 2.
SPEAKER_02:I mean, those are three amazing movies Dirty Dancing, Ishtar, and wait, Short Circuit 2? Two. Oh, never mind.
SPEAKER_06:Okay. So the next person I'm so Lisa Houseman, baby's sister. Her real name is Jane Brooker.
SPEAKER_04:Okay.
SPEAKER_06:Um not not an extensive acting career, but the reason why I'm bringing her up is because she had a role on One Life to Live. Quite a few actors do this where they have stints on um soap operas. Oh, yeah. And eventually it launches them to other things. I think if I'm remembering correctly, well, I don't I don't remember the time frame of when she was on One Life to Live. But also the mom in Dirty Dancing, so she plays Marjorie Houseman, but her real name is Kelly Bishop. She also was on One Life to Live.
SPEAKER_02:Were they in the same I don't know.
SPEAKER_06:I don't I don't know anything about their characters. But I just thought, again, that was kind of interesting. A little bit of like crossover.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. I just I wanted to bring up uh Max Cantor. Sure. He plays the role of Robbie Gold.
SPEAKER_06:Yes.
SPEAKER_02:Who is the uh I guess the gentleman that causes a lot of the problems throughout the movie. Also the name of a former field goal kicker of the Chicago Bears.
SPEAKER_06:Yes, that's a good thing.
SPEAKER_02:I can only assume that he was not, I don't have any dates. I'm not gonna look for them, to be honest. Sure, okay. But I can only I can only surmise that Robbie Gould's parents did not, in fact, rot name him after this character in Dirty Dancing, because that would be bizarre.
SPEAKER_06:No, I'm pretty sure that okay, so the reason why Derek is bringing this up.
SPEAKER_02:I just want clarification on this. I just I'll feel a lot better.
SPEAKER_06:You're bringing this up because I'm a Chicago Bears fan. And I what? And I uh was pretty heartbroken when we released Robbie and but he's gone on to, I mean, they almost won it with uh the 49ers.
SPEAKER_02:So sorry for that brief distraction.
SPEAKER_06:I just sorry, this is not a sports podcast. Um, but any case, and and the gentleman that you're speaking of, Max Cantor, unfortunately, he's also um passed away. Um much younger uh than he should have been upon passing.
SPEAKER_02:But um getting back to There is one more person in the cast.
SPEAKER_06:Oh, yeah. Wait, who are you about to bring up?
SPEAKER_02:I'm about to bring up Wayne Knight.
SPEAKER_06:Okay, sure, go for it.
SPEAKER_02:Great longtime character actor from such greats as Jurassic Park and Seinfeld and a million other things.
SPEAKER_06:I mean, arguably this guy has done the best out of anybody.
SPEAKER_02:Like, he shows up pretty early in the movie, too. And when I first see him, like, whenever you see him in something, it's like, wait, it's it's Newman.
SPEAKER_06:He's truly just comic relief in the film.
SPEAKER_02:I mean, he's kind of just this like, you know, funny kind of He's like a magician slash camp organizer.
SPEAKER_06:And and from what I can tell, that's like as the character in the film, that is his role. Like he's there to like make people laugh and smile and the whole deal.
SPEAKER_02:And uh I feel bad for him because it appears as though this whole like retreat situation is is predicated on the compulsory dancing of all of its guests.
SPEAKER_06:A lot of dancing going on.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:And he kind of disappears.
SPEAKER_02:He comes back at the very end.
SPEAKER_06:He does in that final scene.
SPEAKER_02:He he is, yeah.
SPEAKER_06:Huh. I wonder why I didn't miss or why I missed him.
SPEAKER_02:Or maybe I'm thinking at the there's like a midway point when baby's cut in half and he does that.
SPEAKER_06:He does that.
SPEAKER_02:But I think I think maybe he's at the end too. Yeah, then he gives her a duck, we're all confused, and the movie moves on.
SPEAKER_06:In any case, Wayne Knight, as of right now, 123 acting credits on IMDb. So he's he's done quite well. Yeah, quite well for himself. So, okay. Um, just a really quick shout out to Lonnie Price. He plays Neil Kellerman, kind of the guy who's like trying to put the moves on, baby, but is unsuccessful. Also, the nephew Swarmy. But he's actually gone on to uh have a really great directing career. All right, also directed episodes of One Life to Live.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_06:Crazy. Um, also has directed episodes of Desperate Housewives, Two Broke Girls, and then he's kind of um veered off. So he now directs great performances in life from Lincoln Center. So some really interesting yeah, really interesting stuff.
SPEAKER_02:So, okay What is this movie even about?
SPEAKER_06:Per IMDB, because I always read their film synopses and then maybe break down how accurate we think they are.
SPEAKER_02:Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_06:Spending the summer at a cat skills resort with her family, Frances, baby houseman, falls in love with the camp's dance instructor, Johnny Castle.
SPEAKER_02:That is as concise and accurate of a summary I could hope to get.
SPEAKER_06:It's pretty spot on.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, that's it. Um there's a lot more that goes on in the film, but that's that's pretty much the gist of it is this love story. I mean, okay, so as far as like first memories of this film, I I mean I've said this time time and again at this point. I I have few memories of like seeing films in the theater in the 80s because I was just too young. This is one of them I don't really have a recollection, but I do know I saw it pretty early because already by the time I went off to college, I mean, this movie was playing on my dorm floor all the time.
SPEAKER_02:Wow.
SPEAKER_06:All the time. I mean, the I hate to be this way about films because I don't like the whole like chick flick or you know, dude movie or whatever, but like the women on my floor just loved this film. It was always on in somebody's room.
SPEAKER_02:I think the there's less of that emphasis on like films being made specifically or marketed specifically for men versus women. It still happens, I think, but at this point, dirty dancing is such a a classic that it is enjoyed across across the spectrum.
SPEAKER_06:Okay, but then. That brings up the question.
SPEAKER_02:At the time, at the time, okay. It certainly was not. And so I don't even remember when the first time I watched it was. It certainly had been out for quite a while.
SPEAKER_06:Well, we I mean, as we do with all the films that we talk about, we screen it before we we talk about it. So I mean, was that the first time that you had seen it start to finish?
SPEAKER_02:No, no, it wasn't. I'd actually had seen it from start to finish before. Okay. Probably probably with me. Probably. Probably with me. That's probably true.
SPEAKER_06:And you know, I gotta say this, as far as like what I thought about it upon rewatch, I this is one of those films that I have seen so often that I'm not sure if my perspective has shifted all too much about it because I've just seen it. I mean a couple dozen at the very least times at this point. Um I think one thing that really came to mind upon this last viewing though is how amazing the music is and how much it does for the film. I mean, I do remember when we were watching the movies that made us, they talked about how like a significant part of the budget was, you know, licensing all of those.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I don't think it would have worked if they had I mean they they had popular songs that people knew and would love and would pair very well with with the dancing. And there were a few like specific songs that were obviously like intended for certain scenes. I don't think it would have worked as well if they had like skimped out on the budget for for music.
SPEAKER_06:Agreed. Totally agree.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:I mean, I I I'm not trying to take anything away from the film or the story or the performances, but I think had it not had that amazing soundtrack, I don't I don't know if it would have held on the way that it has.
SPEAKER_02:If you're gonna make a movie about dancing, it better have good music.
SPEAKER_06:Exactly. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Otherwise, what are we all doing?
SPEAKER_06:Exactly. So I think with this last viewing of it, that's that was my biggest takeaway. Is like, wow, the movie or the music really, really supports this film.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:Um, what about you?
SPEAKER_02:Anything that um, I mean, I I think I kind of touched on it earlier where it seemed like kind of a strange vacation idea to to drive out here and just like constantly be going from one dance lesson to another. That is not my idea of a vacation, but uh Well, again, it's fine.
SPEAKER_06:I, you know, to bring this up one more time in the movies that made us, you know, the the writer of this script talks about how this is like based on her experience. So she doesn't go into detail. I think she wants to leave a little bit of mystery there, but I mean, I guess that's maybe and also maybe we we're not of that era. So this is set in 1963.
SPEAKER_02:I'm sure that's a huge part of it, is that there were just like there's the emphasis on different social activities and just activities in general, because uh I I don't know. Like people weren't gonna go watch Netflix.
SPEAKER_06:They weren't you know, they so and going to the Catskill, like this was something that people do.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:Um, a whole season of the Marvelous Mrs. Mazels devoted to them going to a similar kind of resort.
SPEAKER_02:So in the in the way that we'll watch the movies where it seems kind of strange that, like, oh wow, all these high school kids appear to be professional dancers, it seems striking to me that, like, oh wow, these people are coming here to spend a week where they're just constantly dancing.
SPEAKER_06:But there you have it. Yeah, that was that is what the movie is.
SPEAKER_02:That's that's what it is.
SPEAKER_06:So, okay, so let's let's dig in a little bit. I mean, I'm kind of working under the assumption that even if some of you out there haven't seen dirty dancing, I mean, it is so much part of kind of like the cultural zygeist. That'll work.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_06:At this point that you kind of know the story. And so, like I just mentioned, set in 1963, baby and her family, mom, dad, and sister for the summer. So for the entire summer, they go up to this. Oh, it is the whole summer. Okay.
SPEAKER_02:That that leads me back to my last point, even more now.
SPEAKER_06:Well, okay, look, but here, they have to fo it's called dirty dancing. They have to focus on that element of it. I'm sure they did tons of other things while they were there.
SPEAKER_02:Tell me there's like some fishing or maybe canoeing.
SPEAKER_06:They show that. Did it okay? Yeah, okay. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:So I feel better now.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah. How did I miss that? Well, it's like a quick shot. I think it's yeah. Anyway. Um so they go to this resort. Baby, she is about to go off to college. Uh, I believe she tells Neil that she's gonna be studying like the economics of underdeveloped countries.
SPEAKER_02:I think that's exactly right.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, she is gonna go into the peace course, so she has huge dreams and it all kind of circles around making a difference in the world.
SPEAKER_04:Yep.
SPEAKER_06:And she is incredibly close to her father, who is a doctor. They share a lot of the same ideologies. Um, you don't get a lot from the mom, I think, in this movie.
SPEAKER_02:You really don't.
SPEAKER_06:It's until the very end. She she finally kind of puts her foot down. But um, so I guess better late than never. And then the sisters, the exact opposite. Lisa is all about looks and fashion. She complains that she didn't bring enough shoes when she already brought 10 pairs, and so very different sisters. Um and also you, of course, get the distinct impression that this is a white-collar family, and as is everybody who goes to this resort, otherwise they wouldn't have been able to afford it.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, there's there's a pretty clear distinction between all of the guests and all of the workers. Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:And even Robbie, so he it's interesting because so Robbie is a waiter, but he's about to go into med school in the fall. And so he kind of has this bro not romance, it's too strong, but like uh baby's father immediately takes a liking to him because of that. Yeah. As he is also a doctor. And so even Robbie, even though he's a waiter at this resort, he kind of falls more into the white collar crew.
SPEAKER_02:He's part of that family, yeah. He doesn't he doesn't need this job. It's like a way for him to pass the summer and earn a few extra dollars that he probably doesn't need.
SPEAKER_06:He gets a couple chicks on the side. One of which Penny is Penny. Yeah. So Penny, Johnny, all their other friends who I think are nameless. I don't think we ever are really introduced. We recognize faces because they come up again and again, but it's really uh Penny and Johnny. So they are the professional dancers at the resort, Kellerman's, who are there to, you know, as Max Kellerman says, at least to the the guy dancers, like show show the girls a good time. Um, but there is so Johnny walks in while he's giving this little speech to everybody else. I don't think we're ever really uh told what has happened that has caused such bad blood between Max and Johnny, but basically, just as he's telling all the other guys, like show the girls a good time, like make them feel pretty, whatever, he tells Johnny, like, accept you.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and that's a kind of interesting point. I mean, he he does go out of his way to address Patrick Swayze, Johnny Castle. And w why? Like, was there has there been an incident, quote unquote? We don't really know.
SPEAKER_06:It's never mentioned. And as far as like what you get a sense of from Johnny Castle, it doesn't he seem like he's an upstanding guy. Like, it's we again, it's weird.
SPEAKER_02:Look, if he didn't trust his good looks and smooth dance moves, I don't blame him. Like, lock it down, Johnny Castle. Keep it together.
SPEAKER_06:So, so there's this, you know, divide in terms of like what the other workers can do and what Johnny can do. And he's he's already uh it's very obvious he's already on thin ice. So Baby sees this interaction, and you could tell she's also instantly her interest is piqued by Johnny.
SPEAKER_02:How could it not be?
SPEAKER_06:How could it not be? And uh, you know, later in that evening, I think maybe, or a day or two, not too much time goes by where she helps out Johnny's cousin, who also works there. What's his name? I don't even know.
SPEAKER_02:Johnny's cousin?
SPEAKER_06:Johnny's cousin. And uh and they go to this backhouse where all the professional dancers are kind of on their off time.
SPEAKER_02:No guests allowed.
SPEAKER_06:No guests allowed. They're they are dirty dancing.
SPEAKER_02:It's yeah. They're dirty dancing to a song where I'm like, huh. I never imagined this kind of dance.
SPEAKER_06:A little bit off for what they're doing. But hey, they make it, they make it work. They make it work. And then finally, Johnny and Penny join them. Um, baby, you know, he Johnny's like, what's she doing here? Uh they have like a dance. She is like comically inept at dancing in the very beginning.
SPEAKER_02:She's really bad.
SPEAKER_06:She's really bad. But moving things along.
SPEAKER_02:Still not worse than me.
SPEAKER_06:Penny finds out that she is pregnant. It is Robbie's child. Robbie knows, doesn't care.
SPEAKER_02:Robbie is so dismissive in in such an insanely offensive way. I mean, his whole defense is essentially like, oh, she's been with all the guys here. It could be anyone's.
SPEAKER_06:Which that's another thing.
SPEAKER_02:He doesn't even owe up that it's his.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, and and also what you see of Penny's character, like, she does not strike me at all as somebody who's like a different guy every night.
SPEAKER_02:She has time for dancing and Robbie. And Robbie screws that up.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, so it's really weird, these like forced opinions of these characters that we're kind of supposed to maybe believe that like she could have been hooking up with anybody and that Johnny did something to get him in trouble.
SPEAKER_02:Anyway, um you just go along with it though. Like when he says that, I'm like, oh sure, what else is he gonna say? Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:So Baby also finds out about this. She confronts Robbie because at this point, Robbie's making the moves on her sister, and Baby is like appalled that not only does Robbie not care and is not gonna do anything, but he's so dismissive of the whole situation. And so, baby being baby, she doesn't tell her dad what she wants the money for. So it's really like the first time she's ever like lied to her dad, as far as what what we can tell. But she asks for money so that Penny, this is a very controversial element of the film, yeah, can get an abortion because again, this is 1863.
SPEAKER_02:And they had a um they had a performance coming up in another neighboring town or neighboring uh escape place where people also go dance for an entire summer. Yeah, another retreat.
SPEAKER_06:Or hotel or something.
SPEAKER_02:So the timing was such that um she was going to help out, but then it did they already know that she was gonna have to cover for Penny's dancing for like that one day or something?
SPEAKER_06:Who, baby?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:Well, basically, like you know, they're trying to figure out how to, so to speak, fix Penny's problem.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:They are aware of this guy who can perform an abortion for her, and so they think that there might be an answer to this situation, but then they find out that like literally the only I mean, it's a little contrived, but literally the only evening he can do this is the same night. Is the same night.
SPEAKER_02:Who I think that's uh Johnny's cousin that tells us all exactly. Johnny's cousin is basically the same role as was it Fred from The Karate Kid.
SPEAKER_06:Oh yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, where he's he's actually really good.
SPEAKER_06:He pushes through a lot of acquisition.
SPEAKER_02:Let me tell you what's happening. All these guys are dancing.
SPEAKER_06:He's kind of like he he's like the narrator, like kind of like a Greek chorus in a way. Um he tells us what's happening. So so that's how Baby gets pulled into this situation because literally the only way that Penny can get this abortion done is if Baby jumps in and performs this dance with Johnny, so that they get paid what they need to get paid, which they need to get paid because they're blue-collar, they're barely making it as it is, and that they also are asked back for the following season.
SPEAKER_02:Exactly.
SPEAKER_06:So so there are stakes involved. Um, lots of stakes, actually.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, definitely.
SPEAKER_06:So I think that that's you know, we can go down a whole rabbit hole with the storyline. I I'll just say this. I think that it's really interesting and and quite progressive that they are putting in, I mean, I don't I don't think anybody ever thought that dirty dancing would be as mainstream as it was because it was a small independent feature. But the fact that a film in the late 80s, which is covering a st or is about a story in the mid-60s, and there's an abortion storyline that is incredible.
SPEAKER_02:That's kind of heavy.
SPEAKER_06:It's he very heavy.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:Um, so so that's what's going on. But but this really heavy storyline is basically the trigger for the love story.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, it's I mean, it is itself a heavy storyline that doesn't really get a whole lot of attention except to the extent necessary to move the rest of the story along.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, because you know, long story short, in a manner of speaking, the abortion happens, but he is nowhere near like a qualified doctor. Um, Penny is in great pain. Because of this, baby has no other um alternative except to get her dad in the middle of the night and drag him over to where Penny is because he's a doctor and he's the only one that can help her. And really after that point, you know, she recovers and yeah, it's not it's not really talked about again, and kind of everything moves on. But between this and the the like theme of social class, it's really interesting again that this film is so beloved, and people upon like you know, if when you say dirty dancing, you think love story and kind of a schmalty love story at that. But there's really heavy themes that are being woven throughout this film that I think sometimes it doesn't get credit for. Um anyway, yeah. Yeah. Just just saying. Um so okay, so baby and Johnny, they are forced to practice together. Initially, they really don't like each other. Um, but eventually, as it happens, they become affectionate.
SPEAKER_02:It turns out not only do they like each other, they love each other.
SPEAKER_06:They love each other. I don't know if they ever say I love you, but I think it's implied.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. So in my mind, I choose like everyone takes their own thing away from this movie. In my mind, they're definitely in love.
SPEAKER_06:They're in love. Okay. So they sleep together. Um, they have this, you know, by all accounts illicit affair, because nobody can know.
SPEAKER_02:I mean, no, she's already been banned from being around them. I mean, her dad, her dad uh has a particularly negative opinion of Johnny because when he first walks in after Baby brings him in to help Penny, he asks, Who's like who's responsible for for this girl? And Swayze, Johnny Castle says that he is because he's like her best friend. He kind of looks out for her, and Jake, the dad, takes that to mean that he's the one responsible for getting her pregnant. And in this happens a lot in movies where if these characters had just taken 30 damn seconds to say, no, what I mean is this. But instead, it's like, no time, I'm not gonna listen to this.
SPEAKER_06:And what is particularly funny about this film is that there are multiple chances for that misunderstanding to get cleared up.
SPEAKER_02:I'm not gonna listen.
SPEAKER_06:And yeah, I mean it's it's again, it's a movie thing.
SPEAKER_02:It's fine, it's like it's fine. It's gonna be a half-hour movie.
SPEAKER_06:Um so yeah.
SPEAKER_02:So yeah, she she had to keep that entire romance secret because she was already not supposed to be around any of the other dancers. Famously, all of the signage around the uh workers' quarter said no guests allowed. Uh, and then she was also spending even more time with Johnny after her dad had successfully helped out Penny.
SPEAKER_06:Exactly. So what ends up happening, now what we do know is that at least up until the time that baby and Johnny get together, he he has had dalliances.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, it turns out he was a male prostitute.
SPEAKER_06:Kinda. Yeah. I mean, yeah. I mean, look, he's just trying to get by in the world.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, look, that's that's his hustle. That's do a little dance.
SPEAKER_06:Make a little love. Um so there is an older woman, married older woman at the resort whose husband whose husband was just more than happy to throw money towards. I mean, literally paying the guy to sleep with his wife while he We're playing cards all night.
SPEAKER_02:Why don't you uh give my wife a good time?
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, exactly. So I mean it's really funny. And um at this point, though, because baby and Johnny they they have a bit of a falling out because Johnny realizes that baby was like kind of embarrassed of him, that she was never gonna tell her dad that they were together.
SPEAKER_02:She wouldn't uh stick up for him. Yeah, she it was he was upset at the fact that she had to keep their relationship secret.
SPEAKER_06:Whereas in contrast, Lisa is, you know, bringing Robbie around and the dad couldn't be happier about it.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, not a good idea though.
SPEAKER_06:Exactly. So he does turn down this guy's ask to give his wife extra dance lessons.
SPEAKER_02:She's not happy about it.
SPEAKER_06:Which means that they were gonna have the chance to sleep together. She, yeah, she is very not happy about it. Um she, oh, coincidence, sees that baby is leaving Johnny's little cottage or whatever it is the next morning because instead of sleeping with Johnny, she went and slept with Robbie. So there you go. And so she makes up this lie because here's the thing all throughout this film, wallets are getting stolen.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, yeah. That's something that's easy to uh overlook for the the movie. Because if if you haven't noticed it, it gets to a certain point and you're like, is this movie really about like a gang of like wallet snatchers that are that are like just traipsing throughout the cat skills? I don't know.
SPEAKER_06:I mean it's really it's kind of it's kind of like a six sense kind of thing where it's you only realize it upon rewatching it, and you're like, oh yeah.
SPEAKER_02:I'm not even joking when I say every five minutes you find a character saying, Where's my wallet?
SPEAKER_06:And you I am joking. And you Yeah, you're joking about that. But you realize that um you see these this little old couple throughout the film, and sure enough, they it was them who were stealing the wallets, and they were caught, and and they will be properly prosecuted and the whole deal. But this married woman, out of spite, says that she thinks it was Johnny.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. In in playing an elaborate game of clue, she said it was Johnny Castle in the dance hall exactly with I don't I forget whatever. There's something.
SPEAKER_06:And baby knowing that this isn't true, I mean, it wouldn't have been true anyway, but she was with him all night, so of course he didn't do it. And to try to clear his name, she admits in front of her father that she had been with him all night.
SPEAKER_02:She admits in front of her father that she had spent the night with the guy who her father believes got somebody knocked up who he had to help perform some backup uh medical care for a botched abortion. Exactly. Not a great trip for the dad. No, this is this is not a good vacation for the dad.
SPEAKER_06:Understandably the dad's upset. Yeah. Um Johnny's also fired anyway because he was convorting with a guest, even though the truth is found out. And that leads us to probably one of the most iconic uh like finales of a film.
SPEAKER_02:Is there like an iconic like phrase or line or something that comes out of this movie? Do you think it is?
SPEAKER_06:Perhaps, perhaps.
SPEAKER_02:You think? Okay.
SPEAKER_06:So we are going to play the scene that uh that everybody already knows. Oh, I just happened to have that, so let's do it. Great. Okay, let's do it. Let's roll.
SPEAKER_02:Here we go.
SPEAKER_00:Nobody puts baby in a corner. Somebody about the disruption phones. But I'm always doing the last dance of the season. This year somebody told me not to. So I'm gonna do my kind of dancing with a great puppy. Who's not only a terrific dancer, but somebody who's taught me that there are more people willing to stand up for other people no matter what it costs them. Somebody who's taught me about the kind of person I want to be.
SPEAKER_06:Sit down, Jake.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, sit down, Jake.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah. Sit down, Jake.
SPEAKER_02:I mean, really, what was he so like he just heard her name after he was talking about how great of a person she is, and he just like leaps up out of his chair.
SPEAKER_06:Because at this point, he still just doesn't know that the the truth of the I'm sure he's uncomfortable with that level of familiarity or him like everybody knows, like, oh, these two have been getting it on.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, purporting to know so much about his daughter, I'm sure that was like the last draw for him.
SPEAKER_06:But thank goodness he did sit down because what ensues is just this amazing dance number. Um, it's the same dance number, kind of. They they riff a little bit on it, but it's the one that they performed to basically cover Penny that one night that they didn't do particularly well. And this time it's beautiful, everybody's cheering, and it's uh dance to Time of My Life, which uh won best original song.
SPEAKER_02:It is a great song.
SPEAKER_06:It's a great song. And like I was saying earlier, and really quickly to get into the montage part of this podcast, what's really interesting. So, okay, so that final that's not a montage, it's the whole dance, it's the whole deal. But two of the other montages in this film, so there are like three major ones. The first is when Baby is first beginning to just like learn how to dance and she's Dancing 101. Dancing 101. It's played to wipe out, it's supposed to be kind of funny and that sort of thing. You see her continually on this like little bridge trying to do her dance moves, and she's getting a little bit better as it goes along. But then just like a couple minutes later, it segues into yet another montage, and this is like the romantic oh, they're developing a relationship. And this one is uh this montage is to hungry eyes.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_06:And and this is one of the few contemporary songs that is in the film, but it they pull it off seamlessly.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, it works really well. And like I I apologize for going back, but I realize that in our enthusiasm for telling Jake to sit back down, we overlooked what that clip started with, which was baby being put in a corner.
SPEAKER_06:Yes.
SPEAKER_02:And then Patrick Swayze vehemently saying that that no one does that to her.
SPEAKER_06:Nobody puts baby in a corner.
SPEAKER_02:No one.
SPEAKER_06:No one.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, that line.
SPEAKER_06:It's I mean, it is by far the most famous of the lines in this film, of which there are several really great lines. Um, but yeah, I mean, it's okay that we overlooked it because it is so big, it can't, in the grand scheme of things, be overlooked. It's fine, it's fine.
SPEAKER_02:That line is totally indifferent to us like overlooking it.
SPEAKER_06:It doesn't care. It doesn't care. It doesn't care.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:It's bigger than either one of us.
SPEAKER_02:For sure.
SPEAKER_06:There you go. Um, and then the reason why I like went back to the songs, it's because Time of My Life, another contemporary song that's brought in, which I again I'm just really impressed because then the third, and this is also the third montage, is She's Like the Wind, which is also sung by Patrick Swayze.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:And that's when he's already left the retreat and baby's kind of like just mourning the fact that he's gone and trying to move on.
SPEAKER_02:He's like packing up his stuff and like peels out, leaving a massive cloud of dust for her to stand in and look longingly on at like him as he's gone, right?
SPEAKER_06:So it I would say that like as far as these montages go. I mean, the last one, um, I mean, I don't know if they just like really wanted to get that song in. I don't know if like we really needed like you know, a segment devoted to like seeing her being all sad that he's gone. I mean, I think it's kind of assumed, but I I don't know.
SPEAKER_02:I mean it is, but I think it's like I I don't know if they just really wanted to get that song in. It's his song. It's his song.
SPEAKER_06:I think he co-wrote it.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:Um, but the other two, I mean, I think it's funny that they do virtually like a back-to-back montage, and both of them are just her learning to dance, but they have very different tones to them, but it works.
SPEAKER_02:So in any case, either they learn from a blood sport, or blood sport learned from them in the stacking of montages.
SPEAKER_06:I was actually thinking about that when we were watching. I was like, good Lord.
SPEAKER_02:When was the last time I've seen something like this?
SPEAKER_06:So they have this amazing final dance, they do the lift, the lift is everything.
SPEAKER_02:The lift, which has been parodied in in many amazing insurance commercials.
SPEAKER_06:Exactly.
SPEAKER_02:Where the lift fails.
SPEAKER_06:And also, uh, yeah, that's actually a really great commercial. I think it's also is I mean, it's in everything. I mean, there's an episode of Family Guy, I think, that has the lift- Well, they've parodied everything. They've parodied everything. Um and then finally the dad realizes the truth because Robbie inadvertently tells him as much. He takes away this check that he had given Robbie, which is amazing because he finally got his like kind of comeuppance. Kind of.
SPEAKER_02:Well, I yeah, I think As much as he was going to in the film. Robbie likely lost the job that he didn't need, and it will have very little impact on him getting into med school.
SPEAKER_06:You're so cynical. I'm very cynical.
SPEAKER_02:I think that this entitled little shit is gonna live his life being an entitled little shit.
SPEAKER_06:So, so cynical about Robbie.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Well, nothing in this movie leads me to believe that he's going to really think about what he's done. Maybe, maybe one day he will develop that maturity and become a better person. We'll see. That would be the spin-off no one ever wants.
SPEAKER_06:The days and nights of Robbie Gold.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Um Robbie Gold MD.
SPEAKER_06:So then the dad comes up to Johnny and he doesn't actually say I'm sorry, but what he does say is when I'm sorry, I say I'm sorry, even though he doesn't say I'm sorry. It's kind of funny. Um and so I guess they patch things up.
SPEAKER_02:He it's like this acknowledgement that, like, when I when I'm sorry, I say I'm sorry. I'm not really saying I'm sorry, but I acknowledge that you weren't the dirtbag I thought you were. Yeah, exactly. Good luck. Also, you still have lost your job, but good luck.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, so but they patch things up. He and Baby have a sweet hug. Um, because they had been on the ounce with each other as well. You know, there there is a really, you brought it up earlier, really emotional like confrontation scene between him and baby where he doesn't say a single word, but it is so impactful, his performance in that scene. Her dad? Yeah.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:Jerry Orbak. And, you know, she's basically telling him, like, you know, I know I've disappointed you, but you've disappointed me. And she's basically calling him out on his hypocrisy of, you know, you you say you want me to be a certain person, but it's a certain person that like you think is upstanding. And, you know, not everybody has to be that way in the world, so to speak. And um, you know, kind of just calling him out on his like white-collar bias.
SPEAKER_02:Well, yeah, she says that uh you told me that, you know, we live in a world where where like good things can happen to everyone or for everyone. And then I think she says, but you really just meant people like us.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, exactly. So it's it's a dynamite scene. Um, and so it's nice. It's nice that at the end they come back together.
SPEAKER_02:Gotta get that uh resolution at the end.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah. Yeah. It's well done. So so that is dirty dancing.
SPEAKER_02:What a roller coaster of emotion.
SPEAKER_06:Exactly.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:And like we said, we have an amazing special guest. Her name is Michelle Lang. She is a good friend of ours. Um, but just as importantly, she is a dirty dancing mega fan. We, I mean, we've known Michelle for a long time now, and we have always known that she adores this film. And so I think even before we hit record on our very first podcast, we knew that we were gonna have her as a guest.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, when we were just coming up with lists of movies, we always knew that this was gonna be on the list, and we always knew that we would love to be able to have a conversation with her, with Michelle going through it.
SPEAKER_06:And she did not disappoint. So let's just uh jump in, and here is our our special guest segment with Michelle Lane, Dirty Dancing Mega Fan. So, folks, we are here with a self-proclaimed dirty dancing mega fan. Her name is Michelle Lang. She is a great friend of ours, and Michelle, welcome to the show. Welcome.
SPEAKER_05:Oh, thank you so much. I'm very excited. I have to say, I've been waiting for this moment for a few weeks now, and I feel very honored and excited to be here with you guys.
SPEAKER_02:I think um I I think I speak for everyone here, and by that I mean myself and Anna that we have waited for this episode and you to be the special guest since the moment we started to do the podcast. Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, we knew before we even hit the record button on the Very first episode that when we decided to do dirty dancing, that you would be the person that we needed to have on the show. So we are the honored ones to have you on.
SPEAKER_05:Oh my goodness. Okay, okay, it's mutual. Let's let's mutual. It's a move honored.
SPEAKER_06:Well, we are going to just like dive into this because what are we waiting for? Um so Michelle, you and I, just for a little context, we went to the same film school. So I know that you know movies. Correct. But given that, why is Dirty Dancing the film for you? Like out of all the films out there, all the films that you know and that you love, why is this the one that just like grabbed your heart the way it did?
SPEAKER_05:Okay, so I have to start with my first viewing. So I was 10, it was 1992, and I was with my mom. We were home, and it was um, I don't know, I think it was in the summer, but anyway, it was on a VHS, and she said, Okay, I don't know how to use this VHS machine because dad has to do it all the time, but I'm gonna try my best so we could watch this movie together. So we were fiddling with the VHS machine, and finally it came on, and it was like we could both look at each other when the movie was on, and we had the same facial expressions. Me, a 10-year-old, and my mom, who was you know, in her early 30s, which is what I I'm oh well, she's mid-30s, so I'm 37 now, so it's kind of like me now having my child watch it with me. So we would look at each other and we would giggle and we'd laugh and we'd we'd be so excited about this movie, and it was like a a true life escape fantasy of excitement. I think that I I got out of this movie. Yeah, it was like um I I like so okay. When I go to movies or when I watch movies, I like to to exit my own life. I don't want to think about this escapism. Yes, exactly, escapism. And so this was the first one that I think really brought me out of anything I'd ever been a part of. So I'd never gone on a vacation and met a gorgeous dance instructor and had this whole exciting time for a summer with an amazingly handsome man. And will that ever happen? You know, most likely you're a married woman now. Yeah. True, this is true. But you know, had I dreamed about it before I married my husband, of course. But the chances very, very slim. So it was that escapism, it was that idea, like, oh my god, I mean, somebody wrote this script for me. This was my story, like this was my exciting moment that uh that that they they designed for me. Like, I was 100% Frances Houseman. She was me. It was amazing.
SPEAKER_06:I love that. So wait, let me ask you something, because you said that you were so you were like 10 years old. 10. Your mom wasn't her. Had your mom seen the film before, or were you both watching it for the first time together?
SPEAKER_05:For the first time together. She had not gone to the movies to see it with her girlfriends or anything like that. She had waited, like she had heard about the movie, and she waited until I was 10 to show me because she had obviously it was it was made in 85, so I was three when it was made. And it was right. I couldn't watch it then. And so she, you know, 10 was a nice age. I could watch it at 10. There are some very adultes. Well, that's what I was just about to ask.
SPEAKER_02:I mean, holy hell, there are some adult themes in the movie.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, I mean, exactly. So at 10, did I have a clue that Penny was having an abortion? No. Did I get it explained to me? Absolutely not.
SPEAKER_02:Did I and that guy was such an asshole because he gave this lady a tummy ache and then she had to go see a doctor?
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, exactly.
unknown:Exactly.
SPEAKER_05:Exactly. I mean she had too much candy. Yes, too much candy, exactly. I mean, it was just it was just kind of like skipped over and washed over. I never asked questions and my mom never explained anything, so it was fine.
SPEAKER_06:As it usually happens when you're that age, the parents just hope that you didn't notice. So I'm also curious, not to like do a deep dive into your like you know, mom psyche with this film, but so she was in her mid-30s in the early 90s. She was, I mean, she was probably like she was a little bit older than baby in the 60s, but did she feel like she kind of identified with the era? And did she ever talk to you about that?
SPEAKER_05:Okay, so I wouldn't say my mom ever identified. I think my mom had the same exact feeling I do because we still talk about the movie to this day. This is also, I should say, Dirty Dancing is my mom's favorite movie as well.
SPEAKER_04:Oh followed.
SPEAKER_05:I love that. Yes. Um, so we still talk about it, and the music for my mom, I think, was a a whole character in itself. She loved the music. I remember her singing along and like playing music, and and when the soundtrack came out, forget it. My mom had it in her car. I think she had one in it has an amazing soundtrack.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, it does have it does have pretty good music. I even uh very much enjoy The Time of My Life, if that's the correct title of the song. But the Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I do I do really enjoy that song.
SPEAKER_06:It's it's a great song. I mean, it won uh one best original song, I'm pretty sure. For yeah.
SPEAKER_02:I don't know who the the the guy's voice who is the the male. It's um his voice is incredible.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, if I okay, so I'm pretty sure I'm right on this. I don't recall his name. We'll we'll we'll find the name, but he is one of the two Everly brothers.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, yeah.
SPEAKER_06:Oh and then Jennifer Warren right is the female. Do you know Michelle?
SPEAKER_05:As far as the song goes, no, yeah, that's where I am not uh the expert.
SPEAKER_06:That's okay, that's fair. That's okay. Sorry to put you on the spot.
SPEAKER_04:Where do they live?
SPEAKER_06:What are their middle names? Goodbye. Um, and you're you know what, you're absolutely right. I this the music, the soundtrack to Dirty Dancing brings so much to the film. It really puts you into that era. I also think it's really interesting the way that they do have a couple contemporary songs that they mix in that all did really well because you have like you have all the songs of the era, but then you have Hungry Eyes, right? You have She's Like the Wind, which was sung by Mr. Patrick Swayze.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Yeah, they I don't think I ever even thought about that until the last time we watched it. Where I'm like, obviously, some of the music is more like in in line with the time period.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And then they mix in some other songs that that fit so well that I've probably seen it I don't I don't not nearly as many times as either of you, but this last time was when I actually asked, wait a second, yeah, why is this song here?
SPEAKER_06:But it's really it it's integrated really well, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:It works fine.
SPEAKER_06:So Michelle. Yes, we talked about how, like, when you were a kid, a lot of the more adult themes kind of went over your head. So I know you've seen this film like a thousand times, I think. All the time. All the time, all the times. Oh, yes, yes, all the times. So can you do like a little bit of a comparison for us? Like you you taught you, you know, did a great job of like kind of telling us like the feelings that you were feeling when you watched it as a kid, but now as an adult, like do you see more layers to the film? Like, how do you feel about the film as an adult versus as a kid?
SPEAKER_05:Um, so I still hold on to the excitement and and just love that I had when I saw it when I was a kid, but it definitely you know touches different spots. Okay, so right. So the the abortion, the awful situation that Penny was in, obviously is is something that I didn't know then, but know very well now, and and can understand how hard of a scene that is. But I have to say, I think it was done so well because it it was an awful moment. Like you you felt her pain, you felt that that what this guy Robbie Gold did was awful, and then you saw that she, you know, gosh, technically, you know, had it taken care of, yikes, right? And then she's she's growing, like you can see that she's she made the right choice, it was a hard choice, but you knew it was okay, and you knew that at the end of the movie, you knew, you know what, she was better and going to be okay. And then Robbie Gold, you see how he thinks he gets away with it, but in fact he doesn't, and then but you also you know, you don't I don't want to say that he's like a super villain. I also thought, like, you can also say he was young and stupid, and hopefully when he got older, he realized what awful things he did. And I think that it just I like how they made it where you couldn't really hate anybody that badly in this movie, but you could also kind of see that there was growth from beginning to end.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, and actually that's a really great point because I think a lot of people focus so much on baby and Johnny that there, I mean, there are great, it's a great cast of like secondary characters in this film. Yes, and I think you're totally spot on with Penny. She is to me one of the more intriguing characters, and I think you're right. I think as much as anybody else in the film, she goes through enormous growth and change from beginning to end. And I think that's just another aspect of this film that really shows you why it has stayed this beloved film for like 30 years on. Yes, and because it's really it's really well done and really well acted. I like also adore Jerry Orbach, the dad. I know, isn't he the best? That guy's amazing.
SPEAKER_02:I will I will still always think of him as uh one of the detectives from Law and Order. Sure. But yeah, it's good to know that he was a doctor before he went into police.
SPEAKER_05:I mean, pretty severe choices. Yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_06:He's he's intense, but he's also there to help people, and he's also uh the voice of uh Lumiere in the Isn't he amazing?
SPEAKER_05:Yes, he is. Yeah, I I think my favorite moment for him is uh at the very end when he hugs baby that face he makes. I don't know what it is, but it says a million things in just one facial expression. Like he said, right? He's like, I love you, I'm sorry, I trust you, you're the woman I want you to be, and it's just such a great little, just a sweet what, five seconds that you see him, even not even five seconds, and you just feel all that which is the mark of a great actor that they can convey so much in such a short amount of time.
SPEAKER_06:I think that for for me, I mean it's it's a really emotional scene, but when baby confronts him and basically says, like, you know, I know I disappointed you, but you disappointed me too, and he doesn't say a single word and an entire scene.
SPEAKER_02:But you can see you can see all that emotion in his face.
SPEAKER_06:So well done. It it's really realistic of this like struggle between, you know, a daughter who's entering adulthood and this father who had who did have expectations, who did have kind of this bias again against certain individuals without even and he but he's still a great guy, you know.
SPEAKER_02:I mean I look, I'm I'm not the expert on this movie, but it seems like baby was exactly the person that everyone thought she was, and that she was she got into all this by trying to help somebody who needed help and who had nowhere to go. And I think once he once her dad understood that, you know, that that's what like yeah, I love you. You you are the person that I want you to be, because really she was the person that she always was. She was just trying to help people, and she has a slightly idealized view of the world, and she's probably grown up quite a bit throughout this movie. But um, I think Robbie has not grown up at all, and I think I think he's just gonna keep doing whatever the hell he wants to do because he seems like that kind of person, and I don't think he really gives a damn about losing that job.
SPEAKER_05:Oh no, for sure doesn't care about the job. Absolutely, totally agree. But you don't even think 40-year-old Robbie realized I was pretty shitty.
SPEAKER_02:I I don't, I really don't, I really don't.
SPEAKER_06:I that's that's a really see, I think that is fascinating to try to like project uh characters into the future. Well, okay, here's a question for you, Michelle. Yes, do you think that baby and Johnny could have possibly had a lasting relationship beyond just a summer at Kellerman's? Okay, great question.
SPEAKER_05:In my mind, they went on to be married, have children, have grandchildren, great grandchildren. In my that's in my mind. Obviously, I would I would feel that probably most people would not agree. Most people thought it ended there, maybe went a little longer, but basically ended there. But I think I connected to their stories, like the idea of baby and Johnny knowing that they were the other part of each other. You know, obviously the other half. I just there's no way in my mind that they did not live forever together and love each other forever.
SPEAKER_02:I think the way it happens is they obviously have to split up after, you know, after he has to leave because even though he's found innocent, he still has to he still has to go. He doesn't get his job back. I don't think uh and and baby does serve some time in the Peace Corps.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, I was very curious. Does she still go to the Peace Corps?
SPEAKER_02:She does, and then she comes back and she sets up a Facebook account, and that's when when Johnny, who started his own dance studio, just happens to realize that they both live in Ohio and then they meet up, and that's how it all comes together.
SPEAKER_05:That's quite a sequel. I don't like that either. I I don't mind that story either, Derek. I do appreciate that that as well. Like they did, but then they did reconnect it ultimately. I do also like that idea.
SPEAKER_06:Speaking of sequels, apparently, I mean, the the film was such a big hit that they of course wanted to do a sequel, but I guess uh from what I read, Swayze just wasn't a fan of sequels, and so he refused to do it.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, yeah. So they did one anyways and called it something different, right?
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, they did Havana Nights. Well, I wanted to ask uh you about this as well, Michelle, because okay, so yes, they did do uh dirty dancing Havana Nights. Apparently, he does put a dance instructor in it. I I say what have you seen it, Michelle? I haven't seen it.
SPEAKER_05:Absolutely, 100%. I didn't see it. I did not like okay, hate is a strong word. I truly disliked it, but I of course saw it because it was a anything to do with dirty dancing, I have to see. It doesn't matter. I have to see it. So did I like it? No. Did I love his little cameo? Yes. Did I get okay?
SPEAKER_06:So you do notice him in there.
SPEAKER_05:Oh, yeah, there is a whole moment. He he is a dance instructor in the in Havana Nights, and he is uh it's it's a very it's not a very um long scene, and it's also just once you see him in that scene. Um, but that's the only part of the movie I like, and of course I cried the whole time that scene.
SPEAKER_02:So he was he was playing the same character. He was Johnny.
SPEAKER_05:Is he playing Johnny? You know what? I I can't say yes or no to that. I feel like it's a no. I don't think he is, I think he's just this dance instructor who helps the girl, the main character, the lead girl character, um do a little dance number. Okay, but I don't think it's Johnny Castle. That's wild.
SPEAKER_06:That's wild. We said we'd put that in there somewhere. So, okay. I'm gonna kind of bring up the elephant in the room, which is baby at 16 years old.
SPEAKER_02:Oh yeah.
SPEAKER_05:Uh, excuse me, I have to correct you. I apologize. Oh, she is 17. And not that that's much different, but she's her final year, right? And and gonna move into the Peace Corps. Okay.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, wait, where did I get the number 16 from, though? Don't they say that in the film? Or am I making completely making that up?
SPEAKER_05:Um, I I to be honest with you, I don't know that they said it in the film, but I have had to argue this before. Oh, really? All right, later on. Yeah, come on, give us this argument. I don't the argument is that people are saying that he basically is a pedophile or that he's like this, you know, rapist, even. And I'm like, how can you say rap? And so, okay, so I had to look it up, and I and I I I should have seen now. I'm disappointed in myself. I won't be able to send it to you. But there's a site uh that I found with information, of course, and it said that technically, or that actually she was 17 years old because she's gonna be graduating. That's true. No, you're right.
SPEAKER_02:I guess what really matters is the age of consent in that state at that year.
SPEAKER_05:Was 17. That's the point of this.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, and different I get it, different times. And look, I'm I'm truly not throwing shade at the film. I just was genuinely curious if you had thoughts on that. Because uh, quite honestly, like I don't know how old Johnny is supposed to be. I mean, he obviously looks like he's at least in his 20s, but I was gonna say 19. We're not yeah, I was really do you did you find any information on that, Michelle, of how old Johnny was supposed to be?
SPEAKER_05:I think he's um I I think he was supposed to be in his mid-20s, 25, born 25.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. He's young enough that we can still call him Johnny and not John.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Ugh, yes, you know, eventually he'll grow out of that nickname.
SPEAKER_06:Just like Ricky Schroeder and Rick Schroeder.
SPEAKER_02:Exactly like that.
SPEAKER_05:Rick Schroeder.
SPEAKER_06:He's or Debbie Gibson and Deborah Gibson.
SPEAKER_02:Just like that too. Just like that too. Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah. It happens. So, okay, so so you said that you had to argue this. So I mean, how I'm not gonna say like how do you justify it, but is it is it something where you feel like yes, it was different times, and there was I I totally agree with you that there was real love and affection between them. So again, I'm not throwing shade at the film. I was just like curious, right?
SPEAKER_05:So, yeah, exactly. Different times. I mean, uh people were starting their lives with with a partner a lot earlier then than they do nowadays. But um also, I just it it never occurred to me, it never occurred to mind. That's in the first line of the movie. So it never, it truly didn't. I never thought about I never saw watched this movie and said he's too old for her, she's too young for him. That was never something I thought of until somebody brought it up to me. And I was like, what do you mean? They're the same age, and then obviously they're not the same age, and when you step out of the movie, I have to I have to sometimes step out of this love that I have for the movie and just look at it as somebody who is watching the movie and not somebody who's obsessed with the movie, and you do realize, okay, yes, she is far younger than him, but it doesn't matter to me.
SPEAKER_02:I mean, it it like looking at it, and we we kind of do this with all the movies, we look at them through the lens of 2020 versus you know, a lot of them are are 80s movies that are set in the 80s. This isn't even set in the 80s, so yeah, I think looking at it from that perspective, it it totally makes sense. And I never really thought a whole lot about that. Watching it now, like the last time we watched it, we said like, wow, yeah, how old how old is she? Like just from like the point of like just the relative maturity of the two characters, I guess you could there's an argument that like she's she's too young for him given their varying levels of experience. But from like a legal, I like I would never say that Patrick Swayze's character is a pedophile for entering into a romantic relationship. Like, like if they're yeah, no, I I think even more so than some of the other 80s movies that we're looking at. This one you have to go back even further and look at whether or not that relationship would have been appropriate. And like the biggest problem for everyone wasn't the age, it was like, oh, this guy's a dance instructor, and you're the daughter of a successful doctor.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, it was more like a socioeconomic kind of kind of thing. Like um, basically like blue collar versus white collar. Right.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. They wait like, well, we don't care how old he is, but this is what he does.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, exactly. And then when he has to tell her kind of with shame that he would be part of like, because she was like, Oh, what union when he asked, or when he tells her about a possible job, and he's like, I'm I'd be a painter, essentially.
SPEAKER_05:A house painter, union, something, something, something. Oh, I know. Yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah. So great segue, Derek. Because yes. This brings up the question of given all these factors, Michelle. Do you think that this is a movie that could be made today? Like if somebody was pitching this in a room, where do you think it would go if it would go anywhere at all?
SPEAKER_05:Um as is, it probably wouldn't get made, right? I feel like a lot of changes would have to be made. I I mean, which is unfortunate because I feel like sometimes there's too much in movies these days. Like just let it be a sweet story or let it be a sad story. You know, whatever it is, just let it be uh lighter. I mean, I feel like movies these days are just oh, what else can I put in here? What other thing can I have? What other element to this story can there be? Not even, I won't even go as far as to talk about all the special effects and the CGI and all that. That is in uh isn't is in and of itself, but just a story of a film cannot be made simple anymore. There cannot be a simple story anymore, which is what bothers me the most. I love sweet, simple movies. Um and I think that they stop making those in in the 90s. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, that's I mean, if I wanted hyper realistic movies with storylines that like perfectly run parallel to live current events, then like no, I don't really want to see those movies. I want to see movies to escape from actual current events.
SPEAKER_05:Exactly. Thank you. Exactly. That is why you go to a movie. I mean, and how many times have you heard that in movies or in interviews or wherever? You go to the movies to escape your real life, right? And I that is what I need from a movie. I do not want to be brought into some story that I'm like, oh, I can connect to that here, or that is happening here, or oh my god, and and it's just too much.
SPEAKER_02:I just that doesn't mean that like they all need to be like comedies or avoid me feeling things. I'm fine feeling things in movies. I just would prefer it to be not like contrived based on what people think they have to do based on current events. Just make the story that you want to make, and if it's just a straightforward, simple, goofy story, that's totally fine.
SPEAKER_05:Exactly. 100% agree.
SPEAKER_06:And I mean, Michelle, I I agree with you completely. I think that's also, to be quite honest, a reason why when we started this podcast, we decided to do 80s movies. Of course, there are very serious 80s movies out there, but by and large, the reason why we both love these the films of this era so much is because they make you laugh and they take you away. I think it was an amazing era for escapism. And and that's why we love these films. And and even further back in in history, to your point, I mean, Great Depression, the movie theaters were doing great. Right. Exactly. Because of exactly that point. People wanted people open, they were they were open, first of all. But people wanted to go and escape. So totally agree with you. And also, I really um your point about you know, just having a sweet, simple story. I think that unfortunately, too many studios and too many production companies are so terrified of losing an audience. Like, I get it, attention spans are short, but they're so afraid of losing people that they feel like they have to stimulate them with, I mean, in part, visual effects and action and all that kind of stuff, literally every second of the film. And that's unfortunate. Yeah, absolutely is.
SPEAKER_05:And it really is.
SPEAKER_02:Because you miss out on a lot of great stories. So I think we were talking about this movie, would it be made now? It was almost not made then, right?
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, yeah, it was really close. I'm assuming, Michelle, or I shouldn't assume, but um, I wanted to give a shout-out because it's it's a great little series. I hope they add to it. But the Netflix series, the movies that made us.
SPEAKER_05:Yes, yes. I've watched that episode at least four times.
SPEAKER_06:That's amazing. So, for all the people out there, if you're not aware of what we're talking about, there's a great little series. Um, there's only four episodes as of right now, but it's called The Movies That Made Us, and Dirty Dancing is one of those episodes. And they go into great detail, much more than we're going to on this podcast, of kind of the heavy lifting that it took to actually get this film made because it is technically an independent film. It wasn't it wasn't backed by a major studio. And so it's it's really interesting. If if you want to know more about those that side of things, then you should definitely check out that episode. You should watch the entire series because it's all all the episodes are great. Um, and actually, Michelle, you know, kind of tying in a lot of the things that we've already talked about, you know, one thing that's really interesting is that the the screenwriter of the film, like this is largely based, she didn't go into like a lot of minute detail, but this is largely based on her own experiences. Right.
SPEAKER_05:But how about can I touch on that on the episode? Yeah, please do. Because how funny was it when they kept going back to her and she kept saying, It's not a story of my life, but it is, but it is it is, and I just it makes me laugh.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, it's it's really interesting because she kind of plays both sides of that coin. Like she she talks about how it's about based on her experiences, but then she really doubles down and saying, But it's not exactly what my like, it's like it's fine, it's fine. If if you had an affair with a man maybe a decade older than you, that's fine.
SPEAKER_02:Maybe she was uh the sister that's saying that often.
SPEAKER_06:Maybe she was the sister. Yes. Uh so okay, actually, that's that's an interesting point. Just we don't we don't have to dwell on this, but I am curious. What did you think of Lisa? I mean, is she a character that appealed to you?
SPEAKER_05:Um I love Lisa, I think she's a a hot mess. Like she is, but she's like the perfect type of hot mess. Like, I can believe 100% that there are people like Lisa. Like, there is not a part of her story where I'm like, oh come on, that that can't happen. Or no way, not really. I mean, could she really be that delusional? No, that that girl is like that. That sister is her. That's that's perfectly who she is. And when the the scene with her dad at the breakfast table, that is my least favorite scene in the whole movie. Like, if I were to talk about um anything bad about that movie, which is very hard for me to do, that is the only bad part of that movie. I hate that it was that he treated both of them that way, how he treated Baby in that moment and how he treated Lisa in that moment. Because Lisa is not a bad person, she's not a bad sister, she is a ditzy, sweet, not all there together with what's going on in the world type of person, and for the dad to like all. Of a sudden, show her that interest and then take it away like he did when he walked away so uninterested in what she was saying was so hurtful. That was like that was definitely the scene that that bothered me the most in the movie.
SPEAKER_06:No, I actually that's that's a great point you're making, and now that I'm thinking about it, it really is him playing the two sisters off each other or against each other. Exactly, and basically like rewarding them with attention based upon his approval of who they are in that moment, kind of.
SPEAKER_05:But he doesn't even hold on to it, like he starts that, like he attempts to have that moment with them, and then he instantly throws it away when he gets up and ignores her. And I hate that. No, that's really that's a fair point.
SPEAKER_06:That's really fair.
SPEAKER_02:Um I still don't like her singing.
SPEAKER_06:My god, it's amazing. What are you talking about? It's it is it is a tough scene to get through.
SPEAKER_02:So part of why that that scene is is my least favorite is because then suddenly for the next several hours, I'm gonna have this like song on repeat in my head that's like just nonsense. It doesn't I like I don't even know what it is that's singing in my head. I just hear like these sounds tentacles dig in deep.
SPEAKER_06:It's it's hard to not have that tune. It's in my head right now just because I thought about it. Yeah, anyway. Um, I will say this about Lisa, and I thought this was like a really, really spot on sister moment.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:After Johnny leaves and baby is, you know, all melancholy about it, and Lisa sits down next to her and she says, like, I'll do your hair, you know, make you look pretty, and then she like turns to her, she's like, No, you're prettier in your own way. It's such a sister thing to say. Right?
SPEAKER_05:It was amazing. It was definitely a sister thing to say. Absolutely. It's like she's being nice, but she's also kind of being a sister, where it's like, in your what is in your own way supposed to mean?
SPEAKER_06:What exactly do you mean by that, Lisa? But okay, so we're gonna we this this has been amazing. Honestly, Michelle, this has been even more fun than we could have imagined. You you are the dirty dancing mega fan, mega fan, mega fan. And um, I thought that it would be fun to maybe end things with okay, so obviously the line, the line that everybody knows from this film is nobody puts baby in the corner. Right. I mean, I think it's like ranked actually.
SPEAKER_05:It is, it's and it's been in a lot of things, and songs have been named after it, people have used it in other shows and movies. It's pretty hilarious.
SPEAKER_06:It's it's amazing the way that this one line is stuck out. And again, from what I read, Swayze hated the line.
SPEAKER_02:It's so like the way that it like comes up in the movie is so bizarre. Like he just he just like runs up to their table, happens to see that she sees she for all we know, she sat herself down in that in that.
SPEAKER_06:She just maybe maybe she just liked to lean back against the wall and like it's an amazing moment because I'm like, what? So it very I think we can all agree. Awesome line, but there's like a couple other really fun lines in that film. So outside of nobody puts baby in the corner, Michelle, what would you say is your favorite line of the film?
SPEAKER_05:I have a I have a tie for two. Can I say okay? I have a tie for two. The first being, I carried a watermelon. Yep. That line. And perfect, it's perfection. It is, and the other one being, I did it for nothing. You lost your job, I lost my family, I did it for nothing. I love that moment and how she says it in his little like sleeping room, like uh hangout area.
SPEAKER_06:I love how that moment plays out. I I'm like you first of all, you did it really well. You said that line really spot on to the way that she said it, and I'm like completely picturing like with her arms flailing and her like walking back and forth. Totally. Yeah, yep. No, those are two really great, great lines. Though that's worthy of a tie.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, those are all my same ones too.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, those are yours too. What a coincidence. And Michelle, this has been such a pleasure. We have absolutely loved having you on the show, and just thank you so much for being part of it and for just having fun and and telling us why you love it. I mean, it's it's so crystal clear how much you do love this film, and that actually really kind of makes me emotional. Like, I love when films can do that to people.
SPEAKER_05:Same here. Oh my god, me too. When people think about their favorite movie and you just see their eyes light up, it makes me wish that there's like that still little part of me that's like, oh, if I was still in the business, maybe I could make that next movie that does something, something like that to somebody.
SPEAKER_06:Of course, uh no, but I love yeah, yeah, no, love it so much. And honestly, like, even though dirty dancing we know is like capital T, the capital F film for you. Yeah, we know that you also have a monster love of just all 80s movies, and so you know, we'd love to one day have you back on the show if you're up for it.
SPEAKER_05:I'm up for it a hundred percent.
SPEAKER_06:You woo! All right, well, Michelle, thank you again for your time, and uh we'll talk to you soon. Thank you. Talk to you guys soon. Okay, bye.
unknown:Bye.
SPEAKER_06:So that was Michelle. We again were so thrilled to have her on the show, and definitely she'll be back again because just like us, she although dirty dancing is is it for her, she also has a huge love for other 80s films. So I'm sure we'll have her back again.
SPEAKER_02:I hope so.
SPEAKER_06:Hope so too.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_06:Um, I mean, she said she would, so hope she keeps her word.
SPEAKER_02:I mean, I see no reason why she wouldn't.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, she's an honest person, trustworthy. Unless she's just not happy with this podcast and decides I'm never a guys, that's that's it. I don't, I mean, we could have, you know, as we mentioned, like a multi part uh dirty dancing, a breakdown. Exactly. But but I think for now we're pr we're pretty good. Um as far as like a call to action, I mean I know what you're not gonna say.
SPEAKER_02:We're not gonna even do that. I'm not gonna ask people to talk about that one time they went to a summer camp and had no. I'm not gonna do it.
SPEAKER_06:I'm sure there are stories out there. I'm sure there are. So so in lieu of that, we'll just move on to our sneak peek.
SPEAKER_02:Tell us about that one time you practiced for an entire summer for a talent show where you would do a song and dance and then get completely upstaged by your sister who decides to get together with the dance instructor and do their own original performance in the middle of everything.
SPEAKER_06:So selfish. Right? So self-indulgent. Um, so sneak peek. This is your pick.
SPEAKER_02:Yes, next.
SPEAKER_06:It's a great one.
SPEAKER_02:Back to the Future, starring Marty McFly as played by Yeah, and Christopher.
SPEAKER_01:I I totally forgot that actor's name.
SPEAKER_06:Oh Mr. Michael J. Fox.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Well, so for some of these characters and actors, I'm like, I was about I almost said, like, starring Alex P. Keaton.
SPEAKER_06:You know what? Here's what I'm gonna say about that though. I think in a lot of ways, actors would not be insulted by that. If you if they left such an impression on you as a character, I think you can only be proud of that performance. So don't take it too much to heart.
SPEAKER_02:I I've already forgotten it.
SPEAKER_06:Okay, great.
SPEAKER_02:So yeah, it's uh the f I should I specify that we're doing the first one?
SPEAKER_06:The original you really should.
SPEAKER_02:The original Back to the Future.
SPEAKER_06:Uh we we have kind of this part two and part three nonsense.
SPEAKER_02:We have wildly differing opinions of two and three.
SPEAKER_06:Um but I'm right in my opinion.
SPEAKER_02:Mostly that I I find them at least watchable, although I don't not a big fan of the Western third act.
SPEAKER_06:But uh but also we will have a special guest.
SPEAKER_02:We will.
SPEAKER_06:And I know that he's gonna knock it out of the park, as they always do. And on that note, thank you guys. Uh continue to stay safe and healthy and sane. And we look forward to having you next time.
SPEAKER_02:And always we'll try to be better next time. Bye.
SPEAKER_04:Bye.