Anush A. John Podcast
Anush A. John Podcast
The Person Matters - On Competency and Authenticity
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https://www.anushjohn.com/post/the-person-matters
Tbilisi, Republic of Georgia, October 2023
anushjohn.com
The Importance of Boundaries in Ministry
Speaker 1Good morning . Yesterday we looked at the overall goal , the mandate and how to get there . Today we will look at the person , at the missionary itself . In an economy that's driven by capitalism , the single biggest factor is money , right ? So if in the West , where everything is driven by capitalism , the bottom line is money and everything else is built on top of that , so if you work at a place and you work there for 30 years and in your 31st year you are not producing as much as they would like you to produce , they may let you go because the basis is money . This is completely opposite to what the Bible is or the Christian faith is Christian ministry . Money is necessary , efforts are necessary , work , ethic are all necessary , but the single biggest factor , that is the basis of everything that is a center stage , is the person itself . This morning , in a sermon entitled the Person Matters , we will look at the issues of competency and authenticity in ministry . Now there are two sides to the sermon , so there are two parts to the sermon . In the first part we will look at competency and we will look at personal matters , and in the second part we will look at authenticity , and I want to talk about three different aspects of a person , and the first one is personal self-development .
Speaker 1Who are we as persons ? We all play different roles . So at one time we are a child , we are a parent , we are a sibling , we are a colleague , we are a friend , we are a church member , we are a missionary , we are a neighbor , we are a leader , we are a follower all of that at one time . And each one of those roles take time and effort , and not every role needs equal amounts of time , but every role needs appropriate amounts of time to function . But some roles can take an inordinate amount of our resources , such that other roles are suppressed . So , for example , in the ministry , the ministry can take your role as a minister can take so much time and effort and resources that the other roles that you play can be suppressed . We need to have some boundaries with our roles . We need to have boundaries with every role we play so that we can play every role appropriately .
Speaker 1In the US , because of the focus on the individuality of a person , if somebody , if a pastor , told a church member saying , oh , I would love for you to come this evening to go visit the hospital and pray for some of our believers who are in the hospital . And if that person says , oh , actually I have to take my child to basketball practice , that would be seen as an appropriate response because they are caring for themselves . Now I'm not saying that's right or wrong , I'm just showing one side of the story . Now , if that same thing were done , let's say , for example , in India , if a person gave the excuse , oh , I want to take my son for basketball practice , the expectation would be I know your son has basketball practice , but you need to sacrifice that and come into the ministry . Now , I'm not saying that is right or wrong , I'm just showing you the other side of the story . Now . Both of them are different extremes , where we let the ministry overtake the role of a parent . On the other side , we take the role of the parent , overtake the role of the ministry , and so we ask which is the right approach ?
Speaker 1Let's look at what Jesus did . Turn your Bibles to Mark , chapter 6 . Mark , chapter 6 and verses 30 to 34 . Mark , chapter 6 , 30 to 34 . Let me read it for us .
Speaker 1The apostles returned to Jesus and told them all that they had done and taught . And he said to them come away by yourselves to a desolate place and rest a while , for many were coming and going and they had no leisure , even to eat , and they went away in a boat to a desolate place by themselves . So far , so good . Jesus is drawing boundaries and they are going to take a rest Verse 33 . Now many saw them going and recognize them and they ran there on foot from all the towns and got there ahead of them . When he went to shore , he saw a great crowd and he had compassion on them because they were like sheep without a shepherd , and he began to teach them many things . So Jesus drew a boundary and he wanted to get rest and , as we see , that didn't happen .
Speaker 1So there is rest and personal roles on one side , and then there is the urgency of the ministry and compassion for people on the other side . And how do we bridge this ? We need to find a balance right . I think the way to bridge this is by drawing boundaries , but not being rigid with it , allowing for changes to happen based on the circumstances . But we should not draw boundaries . We have got to draw boundaries with each of our roles so that we can have some semblance of sanity , so that we can perform those roles , but at the same time , we can't be rigid with it to the point that we say I've got to go for basketball practice and I cannot come for the ministry . So from this passage it looks like Jesus didn't rest .
Speaker 1But actually there are five times that Jesus withdrew from Jewish territory into Gentile territory . We know that Jesus came for the Jews , but they rejected him . But there were five times , and this is one of them . So after this incident where he fed 5,000 , they tried to make him king and Jesus withdrew from Jewish territory to Gentile territory . The second time it happened was when he healed the daughter of the Syrophoenician woman . The third time it happened , he fed 4,000 people . The fourth time it happened , he chided the disciples for their dullness and on the way across , across the northern border of the Sea of Galilee , he healed a blind man . The fifth time it happened where Jesus withdrew was towards the end of his ministry , when he came down to the southern part , to the side of Bethany , where he raised Lazarus from the dead .
Speaker 1And each of these withdrawals was for several months at a time . It was not just a short break , it was a major withdrawal , and the reason for that ? There were a couple of reasons . One was because he was trying to avoid Herod Antipas , who was trying to get him . Another reason was because he was trying to avoid political interest groups . For example , after the feeding of the 5,000 , they wanted to make him king and he didn't want any of that , so he withdrew . But one of the other major reasons why he withdrew was for rest and to teach the disciples . So Jesus did draw boundaries and Jesus did use those boundaries , but at the same time he was not rigid in the way that he drew the boundaries .
Speaker 1So we have to pay attention and make time for each of the roles that we play , and each of us have different roles and each of these roles need different amounts of time . So as adults , we don't need to spend that much time being a child . We are children , but we don't spend that much time as children , like we do parenting . So in different seasons of our lives we are Parenting takes a huge chunk of our time , and then we come to another season where something else takes a huge chunk of our time . As long as we are aware of the different roles we play and the different boundaries that we need to draw and have time that is proportional for each season . Obviously it depends on the culture . So when we were in India , if you drew boundaries in the ministry and somebody wanted to see you and you had any boundaries , that would not go well . It didn't work . Even in churches , even in Indian churches in the US , it doesn't work . The boundaries don't work because people don't accept those boundaries culturally . So whatever works in your culture , we have to find a way to make it work .
Speaker 1The second aspect is personal spiritual development , personal spiritual development . In personal spiritual development , time is the biggest factor . It's not like we don't want to grow spiritually , but time is the biggest factor . And personal spiritual time is different than ministry time . Sometimes we can in the business of ministry , we can pass off ministry time , as the Lord was speaking to me during that time , and that's probably true . But we have to in our minds have a separation between the two .
Speaker 1Come back to Mark , chapter six , where we were , and at the end of that story , in verse 42, . And they all ate and were satisfied and they took up 12 baskets full of broken pieces and a fish and those who ate the loaves were 5,000 men . So they were tired and they wanted to eat and they came for rest . But that didn't happen . There were 5,000 men and other women and children there , and they went through this whole process where Jesus taught them , to the point that the listeners were now hungry , and they fed them . 5,000 men , they fed all of them . And then not only was that done , they had to gather up . After you host a party , the others go home , but you've got to clean up . So the disciples were cleaning up and now they're exhausted . What does Jesus do then ? Does Jesus say okay , now you guys have done so much ministry , let's all go take a nap . Look at what he did In verse 45, . Immediately he made his disciples get into a boat and go before him to the other side , to Bethsaida . While he dismissed the crowd and after he had taken leave of them , he went up on a mountain to pray the spiritual time that he didn't have during the ministry time he made up later .
Speaker 1The ministry has to flow from spiritual growth and it cannot be substituted . Spiritual growth cannot be substituted by ministry time . In fact , ministry time should be proportional to spiritual growth . Otherwise we will be giving what we have not received , and if we do that , we are working on our own ability . We need to receive from God so that we can give in our ministries .
Speaker 1The third aspect is personal skill development . Personal skill development and to develop our skills , we need to know what our skills are . Obviously , most of us know what our skills are . You go through so many tests and personality stuff and you know what your skills are , but many people in the church don't know what their skills are . That should be one of the first few classes that are done to find out what your skills are . What are your spiritual gifts , so that you can be useful in the ministry .
Speaker 1There are numerous tests that can be done . The one I like and this is from Rick Warren's purpose-driven ministries the shape test , where his spiritual gifts and then heart is what do you like to do ? And then ability is what are you able to do ? Because there are some things that you like to do but you're not able to do . And then , what is your personality type ? What fits in with your personality ? So if you're in a super introvert , even though you may like to be a super extrovert , it's not gonna work . So let's find something that fits in with your personality . And fifth is experiences . What experiences have you gone through or your family has gone through that can contribute to what ministry you can do . And so every member of our churches need to take a test at the beginning of their Christian work so that they can know how they can be useful .
Speaker 1And we need to develop our skills . What are our gifts ? Once we know what our gifts are , we need to develop it . We can't just be okay I learned three chords 30 years ago and I still play the three chords for all these 30s . No , if you're a worship leader and you play the let's say you play the drums you can't just go with the four beat . You gotta learn something . Advance your skill , no matter what your skill is . Let me give you a couple of examples from my life . We my primary ministry is preaching and teaching , and so I have got to advance those skills .
Speaker 1When I was doing my doctor of ministry program , one of the courses that were there it was not mandatory , but one of the courses that was there was a course in biblical Greek . For various reasons , I wasn't able to learn languages in my previous theological studies , so I jumped on it and I learned biblical Greek , for it was an eight credit course out of 48 . So one sixth of the thing was biblical Greek . So I jumped on it and I learned it Last year in the course I'm doing now on Christian apologetics . It is not mandatory for this course , but I took a course on biblical hermeneutics . I taught how to interpret the Bible . I had read up about it , I had done so much about it already , but I wanted to have some formal education . So I did a course on biblical hermeneutics for two months .
Speaker 1Why ? Because , if this is my gifting , I need to advance it . I need to get better at it . So when I read the Bible , it's not just to preach , which is good , but I'm learning the Bible , interpreting the Bible , just for me to learn how to read and how to interpret . And so , whatever gifting you'll have , we need to advance our skills in that particular gifting so that we get better and better at it . Because my gifting , or my ministry , is preaching . I'm constantly looking at finding stories and illustrations and how something connects back to Jesus , because that's the bottom line of every sermon how does something connect back to Jesus ? So in our lives , whatever our gifting is , we need to be thinking in those terms constantly to advance our skills . I want to mention two more things in this section . One is what I'll call gifting versus role-playing , Gifting versus role-playing .
Speaker 1About 10 years ago I was asked to speak at Liberty Christian Fellowship in Kansas City , where Mark and Drew and the others are , and I spoke on the topic of evangelism . And as I was preparing for this topic , I decided to look up the times where it said the word evangelist in the New Testament . And so the word evangelist appears three times in the New Testament and I'm gonna read it for us . And as I studied it I had an idea . Let me just read it for us . Acts , chapter 21 , verse eight .
Gifting vs. Role Playing in Ministry
Speaker 1On the next day we departed and came to Caesarea and we entered the house of Philip the evangelist , ephesians four , verse 11 . And he gave the apostles , the prophets , the evangelists , the shepherds and the teachers this is talking about Jesus in Ephesians , chapter four , giving gifts of leadership to the church . And the third verse second , timothy , chapter four , verse five as for you always be sober-minded , and your suffering do the work of an evangelist . So in the first two verses it says Philip the evangelist , and then it says the evangelist . And then Paul tells Timothy , do the work of an evangelist . So I thought , oh , I wonder if there is some difference between the first two and the third . I looked up in the Greek and there seemed to be no obvious difference . But as I thought about it it was as if Paul was telling Timothy to do a particular work , whether he's gifted or not .
Speaker 1So sometimes we do ministry based on our gifting , sometimes we do roles because that's what the need is . I grew up in a church where my dad was a pastor back in India and it was a home church first . That grew bigger and so we had our own church and , as you know , in a small church that starts with a church . There's numerous tasks , numerous ministry opportunities and anybody gets put into any ministry role . So the ministry role they fell on me was teaching kids Sunday school . It's not my gifting . If I never taught another kid Sunday school for the rest of my life , I would not miss it . I taught kids Sunday school for a few years . I taught kids Sunday school that came for a season and taught Sunday school that had the gifting to teach Sunday school and the kids loved it and these guys were great . They knew how to bring the energy and they knew how to teach , how to engage . It was their gifting . And then they would go away . And who were they stuck with ? They were stuck with me and for 15 years I taught kids Sunday school Because there was a need . It wasn't my gifting , but during the time I was trying to figure out what my other gifts were . My dad's gifting is the gift of evangelism . If you have the gift of evangelism , I have longed for the gift of evangelism . I mean , it is an amazing gift to have . If you've seen a person with the gift of evangelism share the gospel , it's just you're like watching a musician play and it's just beautiful .
Speaker 1We used to go for summer holidays from Bangalore to Kerala . Bangalore is where I grew up and we used to go to Kerala for summer holidays and we used to take the train . And when we take the train , we get into the train at nine o'clock in the night and we reach Kerala at twelve o'clock in the afternoon . And if you've been on an Indian train , it's one compartment with multiple sections and each section has three bunk beds on one side and three bunk beds on the other side , so there are six beds . So in the night six people sleep on it , but during the day the bunk beds become just places to sit . So there are about 20 people sitting in each section or each part of the train Without fail . Every single trip that I can remember , we got in at nine pm in the night and by the time we reach our destination at twelve pm the next day , my dad has shared the gospel to all 20 people in that section and anybody else who managed to peek in , because he had the gift of evangelism . I have done street evangelism In Bangalore . We took Bill Bright's the Force Virtual Laws and we would go out and meet people on the street . But that was not my gift . I was playing a role .
Speaker 1There is a difference between gifting and role playing . How does this play out in the church ? In the church , you , as a leader , list every single task that there is . In the ideal world , there will be a person with the gift that you can match up to the task . But we don't live in an ideal world . So what do you do ? You find as many people as possible that have the gifts to fill in whatever tasks are possible . What happens with the remaining tasks ? Roles Everybody picks up some roles to play . So everybody in a church should be using their gifts one or two gifts , or three gifts and should also be picking up several roles that they need to be playing until a person with the gifting comes along .
Speaker 1The importance of knowing who is playing a role is important because we can be less judgmental of them . If you're in a church , you're the pastor of a church , and you have this person teaching kids Sunday school , and they are doing a mediocre job , it's the best they can do , but their job is mediocre . If that's their gifting , then that's their problem , but if it's not , they are doing the best they can because they are just fulfilling a role . Sometimes , when we fulfill a role , it may look like this Belgian shot potter who competed in a 100-meter hurdle race to prevent a team from getting disqualified . That's how the role players may look doing certain roles . We've got to be patient with them because they are doing the best they can . They're filling in a gap , otherwise there will be nobody doing it . It's better that they do it rather than somebody that nobody else does it , until , of course , in the ideal world , like I said , if the guy with the gift comes in , that's great , they'll do it . So we cannot compare the gifted person with the role player and of course , the role player will need encouragement because that's not their gifting , but every now and then they will need some encouragement , which the gifted person does not need , but the role player will need .
Holy Spirit Enables Authentic Relational Connection
Speaker 1The second thing that I want to say , and finish up this section , is enabling by the Holy Spirit . We are never fully qualified , never . No matter how much we advance our skill , no matter how many courses we do , we are never fully qualified . If we were fully qualified , we would do ministry on our own strength , and God does not want us to do ministry on our own strength . God wants us to be dependent on Him . You know how , when you go for a job for the first time it's your first day at work you're nervous , your palms are sweaty , your brow is sweaty and you've got butterflies in your stomach . That may be the feeling that we may have for the rest of our lives in ministry , because we are always going to be slightly less qualified for the job . It is God who qualifies us during the job . We may never come to a point where we say , okay , I've got this and I'm going to do it . We may always be at the point where we're always learning , always making mistakes , always struggling , but always dependent on the enabling by the Holy Spirit .
Speaker 1We looked at personal matters . Second , let's look at people matters . We will look at relational authenticity . Turn the Bible to John , chapter 13 , verses 34 and 35 . John 13 , 34 , 35 . The new commandment I give to you that you love one another just as I have loved you , you also are to love one another . By this , all people will know that you are my disciples if you have love for one another .
Speaker 1Now I don't need to say that love is the basis of our ministry , right ? Every church , every ministry , every Christian organization is built , or supposed to be built , on love , and every interaction should be based on love . But I wanted to see if there was an objective way to measure it . Yes , I need to love my church members , I need to love my colleagues in the ministry , but is there an objective way to measure it ? And so I'm going to ask this question what would we do differently if we considered the church or ministry as our family ? What would we do differently if we considered the church or ministry as our family ? And I'm going to give you five things that we might do differently if we consider the church or ministry as our family . I'm sure there are more . I could just come up with five If you have an infant .
Speaker 1Each infant is different , right ? Each infant takes time to reach their milestones . When I was in medical school , during our pediatric rotation , I think we had two or three months in pediatrics . So during our pediatric rotation we saw many little kids , from infants to about 12 years old , and there's the American Association of Pediatrics that has written out what the milestones should be . So if there's a six-month-old that came with her parents , we would look at this print out of what the milestones for a six-month-old should be and ask the parent okay , or the verbally how are they ? Are they responding to you ? Are they doing this and that ? So we expect certain things for a six-month-old , but as parents , sometimes we forget what our kids should know at certain ages . Right , if you're , if you're a parent of a five-year-old , we sometimes we are hard on them because we forget , okay , what does a five-year-old really know , or what are they supposed to know ? Milestones are different for different kids , even of the same age .
Speaker 1In a church setting a believer who is three months old , we'll have different milestones from another believer that's three months old , and this depends on their background and their culture and where they came from , what they know . So , for example , if in India you were doing evangelism to a Hindu , their their response in the first few months will be Different . If they were a Hindu that had no contact with anything Christian , or if they're a Hindu that grew up in a Christian school . There's a difference because of the background that they have . There are a variety of reasons why development can be different for different people . If we consider the church or the ministry as our family , we would be More patient during development . We would be more patient during development .
Speaker 1Let's say that your little infant has grown up and it's a little toddler now , and toddlers do all kinds of ridiculous things that , no matter how many times you tell them , they just continue to do the same thing . It's like you never told them . When my , when my son was one year old , he he tipped over his glass of milk on my brand new MacBook and destroyed it . He's gonna graduate from high school next year . So at that time , when he was one , I told him that I'm gonna take away $1,500 from his non-existent college fund . But he didn't understand it at that time . But kids do all kinds of stuff . I had a patient when I was a Truman Medical Center who had a two-year-old and the two-year-old was sitting on the mother's lap and Inexplicably , like toddlers do , the two-year-old got up and the head Hit her right on the nose and busted her nose . Of course she came to our hospital and we fixed her nose .
Speaker 1There are people in the church that are toddlers in the Christian faith and If we consider the church or ministry as a family , we would have more tolerance with actions of ignorance . We would have more tolerance with actions of ignorance . There may be new believers that still do things out of ignorance . If you are in a setting where there's other religions and you and the person becomes a Christian from , let's say , a Hindu or Muslim religion , they , in their first few years , they may Syncretize the two religions . That's , that's their ignorance . They don't know about it . Or another example is if they had a disease and they prayed and Jesus healed them and they become a Christian , what do they think ? They think you just have to pray and God will heal all your diseases . As Older believers , we know that that doesn't happen every single time , but they are toddlers and we'll be more tolerant with actions of ignorance . Or there are new believers that still struggle with their Sins that they just left behind or they still continue some of those Sins into their toddler Christian life . Of course , even as adults we struggle with our sins from way back . Imagine the toddlers in the Christian faith that struggle with recent sins .
Speaker 1Thirdly , let's say that your son has now grown up . Let's say that your son grew up and stole all your money and decided to cut ties with the Christian and decided to cut ties with the family and left . And For 20 years you've not seen your son and Suddenly one morning you open the door and bury his . What do you do ? Do you say you stole my money and you left , get out of my house and say that it's your son ? You will do what the father did to the prodigal son you will throw a feast , you will call everybody , you will kill the fatten calf , you will put the stroller on his back , you will put a signet ring on his finger , you would put shoes on his feet and celebrate . You've just forgotten everything that he did to you . If we treated the church or ministry as a family , we would have more forgiveness with actions of intention , more forgiveness with actions of intention . We get hurt by people in the church for the Easiest reasons right . Forget that they stole all your money and hurt you for 20 years . Forget that part of it . Forty in a healthy home .
Speaker 1As the children grow , you know when kids are really young you do everything for them , but as they grow , you expect them to start taking some of the responsibilities . It's partly true , because as we age , we don't want to do every single thing , so we want them to do some of their own stuff . But on the other hand , as a healthy family , as a responsible parent , we are teaching them how to become responsible adults . So they need to wash their own clothes , they need to clean up after themselves , they need to put the dishes away . We give them responsibilities so that they can grow . Do they perform the responsibilities perfectly every single time ? Absolutely not . Most of the time they mess up . What do we do then ? Do we say , all right , from now on you don't wash your own clothes because you left it too long in the washer and now it smells like sweaty feet ? Are you gonna say that ? No , you still tell them to wash their clothes and dry their clothes so that they can assume responsibilities and be responsible adults .
Speaker 1If we treated the church as a family , we would be more trusting with responsibilities . In 2 Timothy 2 , verse 2 , paul told Timothy what you have heard from me , in the presence of many witnesses , and trust to faithful men who will be able to teach others also . Many times , christian leaders or church leaders give , give , give , give , give , give and the people receive , receive , receive , receive , receive and that's all they know . But in a healthy church , just like in a healthy family , the parents give responsibilities to the kids and help them become mature adults . Fifthly and finally , what would we not do for our kids ? We would do anything for our children . If a thug came to your house and pointed a gun at your daughter , you , without without a a minute of thinking , you would tell the thug you take me , let my daughter go . Wouldn't we Turn your Bibles to Romans , chapter nine , to to read this astounding verse , romans , chapter nine .
Speaker 1Let me just tell you the context of this verse . In chapters nine through 11 , paul is discussing God's righteousness in view of his temporary rejection of the Jews . That is a context . In Romans , chapter nine , verses one , two and three , paul writes this I am speaking the truth in Christ , I am not lying . My conscience bears me witness in the Holy Spirit that I have great sorrow and unceasing anguish in my heart , for I wish that I myself were accursed and cut off from Christ for the sake of my brothers , my kinsmen . According to the flesh , he is saying that he is willing to go to hell so that his countrymen can go to heaven , and that is something similar to what Moses said when the Israelites made the golden calf . In Exodus , chapter 32, . When God said that he is going to destroy the Israelites , moses said Lord , forgive them or blot out my name from your book of life , exodus 32 , 32 . If we treated the church as a family , we would be more willing to sacrifice oneself . Love is what the Christian ministry is based on , because Jesus loved us first .
A Mother's Sacrificial Love
Speaker 1Cara Coombs was a 38-year-old mother in Missouri , mother of three , and she was pregnant with her fourth child . When she was 23 weeks pregnant she found out that she had stage 4 melanoma , and stage 4 melanoma can spread to your brain . The oncologist said you need to deliver this baby now so that you can start your oncology treatment , your cancer treatment , your chemotherapy . But the mother knew that if she delivered the baby at 23 weeks , the baby is less viable to survive , less likely to survive . So she waited until the 28th week , when the baby is more likely to survive outside . She waited five weeks and gave birth to her baby on December 5 . Three days later , the mother died because she had waited too long and she could not take chemotherapy .
Speaker 1That's exactly what Jesus did 2,000 years ago , isn't it , where he died to save us and gave us the reason why we need to love him and why we need to love the people that we are serving . Thank you , I'm going to give a time of reflection . You can just close your eyes . Heavenly Father , we thank you for the message you have given us . We know we need to love . We don't even need to manufacture it . You have shown us what it means to love . I pray that you would help us to find ways to make love as the basis of all our relationships . In Jesus' name , I pray amen .