When the COVID-19 pandemic struck, shifting operations to the virtual workplace was paramount to organizational survival. Organizations that were new to virtual operations focused their efforts on scaling technological connectively, but relationships matter more than tech. Relationships are about connection. In this podcast, Sylvia Melena joins Dr. Deanna Davis, Associate Professor in the School of Business at Northcentral University, to share ways of strengthening relational connectivity to create a thriving, vibrant, and productive virtual workplace.
When the COVID-19 pandemic struck, shifting operations to the virtual workplace was paramount to organizational survival. Organizations that were new to virtual operations focused their efforts on scaling technological connectively, but relationships matter more than tech. Relationships are about connection. In this podcast, Sylvia Melena joins Dr. Deanna Davis, Associate Professor in the School of Business at Northcentral University, to share ways of strengthening relational connectivity to create a thriving, vibrant, and productive virtual workplace.
Dr. Deanna Davis 0:01
Welcome to the Center for the advancement of virtual organizations podcast on relational connectivity, the most important soft skill in virtual leadership. I'm Deanna Davis, associate professor in the School of Business at North Central University. And today we are joined by Silvia Molina, founder and CEO of Molina Consulting Group, a leadership and management consulting, training and publishing company. She is also the international award winning and best selling author of supportive accountability, how to inspire people and improve performance, and the Vice President of the San Diego Book Awards Association. Sylvia's leadership philosophy has been featured by the Society of Human Resources, management, HR today, entrepreneur, and many other outlet. Welcome, Silvia. And thank you so much for taking the time to come and chat with us today.
Sylvia Melena 1:05
Thank you for having me, Deanna, I'm really excited and happy to join this amazing podcast.
Dr. Deanna Davis 1:11
Wonderful. So when the covid 19 pandemic struck, you know, shifting operations to the virtual workplace was paramount to organizational survival. And organizations that were new to virtual operations, they focused their efforts on scaling, technological conductivity. But some organization may have failed to realize the importance of building relationships and that relationships matter more than technology. So would you share an overview of the types of relationships we encounter, while working virtually, whether that's leader to team member or even team member to team member?
Dr. Deanna Davis 1:52
Yes, I will. So building relationships in the virtual environment versus a physical environment, it does have its differences. But there are a lot of similarities to and those similarities involved the types of relationships that we can expect. So the nuances may be different, but the types of relationships they're fairly the same. So for instance, in the virtual space, you will have leader to team member relationships, team member to team member, leader to leader and that's both the vertical, whether it's my relationship with my boss, or horizontal relationships, whether it's my relationship to to other leaders in the organizations, my peers, and so, so the relationships are the same, and then you add to the mix clients, we may have customers, other stakeholders, then the relationships become more complex. And if you can imagine all the different people as dots on a map, and then take lines and join the dots, and every which way, it shows the complexity of the network of relationships that we experienced, both virtually and in person.
Dr. Deanna Davis 3:01
That's true. And I like how you talked about, you know, the some of the relationships can remain the same. And, and so many times when, you know, we had to make that pivot to a virtual environment. You know, that was one of the issues that maybe some employees or even leaders felt that while there were like the dynamics change, but sometimes, like you said, it can remain the same, you can be consistent. And that's a unique aspect of, you know, building that relationship in the workplace. And then, like you say, when you add in the other clients, customers and other stakeholders, it can take on a different role. So I'm glad you touched upon that. So what do you think is different about building relationships in the virtual environment, as compared to the physical workplace?
Sylvia Melena 3:49
So we talked about earlier, as, as you were introducing the podcast, you mentioned the technological aspect, as well as the people aspect, the relationship building. So the foundational elements are the soft skills of how we build relationships virtually, are fairly the same as how we do them in person. What's different are the nuances. So share a couple of examples. So in the virtual space, we have what's a word is a perception of spatial separation. In other words, if you and I are having a conversation virtually, you will be in your location, and I will be in mind and I have that perception that we're spatially separated. And that perception can limit the feeling of togetherness, and it can also limit the feeling of belonging.
And so that's one nuance another nuance is the inability to fully read a person's body language and in some instances, the facial expressions, so you know, how your, you've delivered either virtual training or a virtual class, or just a virtual meeting and you have some people who turn off their cameras, so then you're not able to see that person's facial expression or you Have people that have their cameras on but they're so close to the camera that you can't see the body language. So when we're not able to fully see a person's facial expression or their body language, we lose some of those, those visible cues that help us helps us make sense of the conversation.
And so you know, we need to see the hand gestures, the way our bodies positioned, so that becomes challenging. The other difference is the technological aspect and that's a huge one because technology basically is the the vehicle by how we're communicating so we may encounter some tech challenges where things don't work or people don't know how to use them competency is also part of it. If the leader is uncomfortable using the virtual tools, it might take a little bit of wrapping up and developing and that's true whether it's a WebEx or zoom or teams or whatever tool we're using. So there's those are some of the key differences
Dr. Deanna Davis 5:57
true I agree with that and and like you mentioned about you know, the body language and I really think that you should be visible during those meetings and and be engaged as well and so you know, we're we're inundated with meetings whether that's like you said via zoom or WebEx or team and so sometimes you know you're sitting in these these virtual meetings but sometimes it's hard to gauge the engage the level of engagement because you know, you want to participate and I think that people should be authentic and be them whether that's even just eye contact you know, and not you know, looking around while someone's talking or whether you know and so you talked about that and that's really important that and I know for me be just trying to get acclimated to those new technologies such as WebEx and zoom and Microsoft Teams and because I believe it or not, I'm not that technical read my whole life um, you know, I just I do the basics so um, so I know how it can be daunting for a lot of people in this virtual environment you know so
Sylvia Melena 7:12
well and it's interesting because I can relate to that so I'm I I speak a lot and I train a lot so in person I'm a duck in water I feel like I'm in my comfort zone and it's safe the pandemic came and I had to transition and pivot and I was a late pivoter so and I'll give you an example so when I'm when I'm delivering an in person training and I'm connecting whether it's a you know in house training or training for another organization, I can I can connect with the people because I'm seeing you I'm getting that verbal feedback if you're engaged if you know and sometimes of course you make misread someone but I can I feel like a duck and water transition to the virtual world and now I have even if it's a small group of 26 people I I'm feeling like I'm not getting engagement pudding looking at a camera doesn't feel the same to me as looking at the eyes directly at the eyes of the person that I'm talking to so that that creates that feeling of and I'm just going to be honest and real a feeling of insecurity is am I really engaging or are they bored in and you just you just have to know that it is different and and it's just a transition that mentally we have to get in that space knowing that it is different and if you want to know how they felt about the conversation then just simply check in and create that trusting relationship where they can be open and give you that the true feedback that you need to get better at it.
Dr. Deanna Davis 8:43
That is true and and like you said it's just we all have to get acclimated in a very fast pace to this new modality and so you know use you in both eyes well I've been so used to in person workplaces and trainings and interactions and you know, trying to foster that and translate that to the virtual experience you know can be challenging for us and has been challenging for us so so with that in mind, what do you what do you feel are some challenges in building relationships when working remotely
Sylvia Melena 9:20
so you know, the the challenges that I just mentioned, the whole spatial separation, the body language, facial expressions, tech, etc. They are smaller challenges. I'm not that I'm minimizing them completely. Yes, we do have to overcome them. But in comparison to what they can create if we don't address them. There are some bigger challenges and two of the biggest that I've seen, and these are huge because they can have relationships, productivity and results, their trust and team cohesion. So it's already challenging to build trust and team cohesion in that In person environment, but then add that remote virtual vehicle into the mix. And it creates another level of challenge. And those two things are super important. So I need to have a trusting relationship, and my team needs to be cohesive, if we're going to achieve organizational mission. So, for instance, let's, let's look at one of the nuances of not being able to fully read a person's body language. So if I can't read you, I can't make sense of you. And so I can't trust you. And if I can't trust you, I'm not going to open up and get close to you. And then that then just cycles and affects my feeling of belonging and that you know, hampers team cohesion. And it's like a vicious cycle. So again, trust and team cohesion are the two that we should really be striving for, as leaders in in the virtual and the and in person space.
Dr. Deanna Davis 10:55
Yes, and both of them are extremely important and vital, and really work together and building that fostering that positive relationship, you know, in the virtual workspace. And, Mike, you mentioned trust. And if you don't feel that you can trust someone, it's like, how can you really feel that you are part of the team? And how can you feel that to Team cohesion. And if you don't feel that, you know, that person is trustworthy, or you just don't feel the level of intrinsic trust, or I, you know, for that relationship to foster So,
Sylvia Melena 11:33
and if I, if I, if I don't trust my leader, then if I have something to contribute, whether it's, hey, we can do this better, or, hey, let's not go that route, because that has, you know, some challenges, or I see some pitfalls that are coming, that I may not verbalize. And unfortunately, if I'm not opening up, then it, it, I'm losing out on that brain trust of that person. So trust is super important. And I want to go back to some of the challenges of spatial separation and body language and tech challenges. So for builing, which, I have to say that, it's that one of the things that we can do is when we're talking to people is show more than the face even though I you know, when you show just the face, and I know a lot of people say I've read, some of the experts say show your face because you want them to see you really up and close. But when I'm speaking with your data, you would not feel comfortable.
If I'm right up in your face, that's not a comfortable space to speak. So showing maybe a little bit more of your mid, a little bit more of of your face and a little bit of your of your torso, then when you're moving your hand gestures, people can see them, and that engages them a little bit more, and whatever works for you. So that's one small thing that you can actually do to be a little bit more engaging when you're having those virtual conversations. And then when it comes to trust is some people are quiet, like I'm not like I mentioned, I'm not the most comfortable in on video and on camera, but I have to do it. So I do. So if I know I have a team member and it comes back to getting to know it, each individual is helping them overcome that in whatever way I can make it more comfortable for them. And then it's asking them for their opinion, because sometimes not everyone's going to offer it up. And when they give me their opinion, and maybe it's something that I don't like or it hurts my feelings or whatever, it's not reacting to it in a negative way.
Because then when we do react, then they're not going to give us your honest opinion next time around. So there's a lot of small things that we can do to really start building that. And the more that we're consistent because people want consistency, the more that people will start opening up to the point that it I've I've had some teams where they've opened up so much that it's almost like being in family, that's how open it's I can really express that I'm not happy. And I know I'm not going to be judged, and I'm not going to be labeled, and that the team is going to really lift me up and we're going to move forward. So there's a lot of ways to really build that trust.
Dr. Deanna Davis 14:11
Well, and I know that, you know, that's very important, and I'm sure our listeners, you know, are thinking about that the importance of building that trust and even opening up, you know, in in the virtual environment and how that can lead to you know, a better relationship amongst the team and, and definitely that interaction with your employer and the leader. So, one of my questions so be is is is great to have that family type of feeling in the workplace. But what happens like when you're building a relationship with some kids, you know, because it can be easier with others than certain people but how do you build a relationship with someone who you just, you know, you don't seem to click with If you don't feel like you say the trust or you don't feel that relationship, how do you build that?
Sylvia Melena 15:07
That's a really good question. So a lot of conflict and not all. But a lot of conflict simply stems from our differences. So the differences in how we view the world, our differences in our priorities are differences in how we approach our work. And we tend not to click with those that are different from us. And we tend to gel with those that are like us. So those who, who really see things the way we do, because that's comfortable. And whenever we're in our comfort zone, it's less painful. And as human beings, we want to avoid pain. It's just we don't like pain, whether it's psychological or physical, we weren't uncomfortable with pain. The other thing about our differences is that they tend to color the way we view things. So we can make a lot of assumptions about other people's intentions based on what we observe in their behavior and the things that they say.
And simply because maybe their personalities a little bit different. So in other words, I might be a more direct communicator, and someone might take offense to that, because they're a little bit more reserved and a little bit more gingerly in the way they communicate. Neither one is better than the other, they're just different styles. And the best way to counteract that conflict that stems from our differences is to really get to know the other person, because that builds trust. So if I know you, I can like you, and if I like you, I can trust you. And it doesn't matter if we're different. And if I know you, and you're a little bit and not that you are I'm not I'm not speaking about you dn a bit a bit if I know you, and you're a little bit gruff. And I know that's just the way you are, I can accept you, because in your heart, I know your heart, and I know your intentions towards me are good. So knowing, liking and trusting is going to really cover a lot of the, the difficulties that we can encounter.
Dr. Deanna Davis 17:01
Yes. And like you, as you mentioned, Sylvia trust is like Paramount, I mean, it's, it's just resonates with the importance of building that relationship. Because when you trust, then you can overcome in a set differences. And you can accept the change, you know, that's coming in, that we're dealing with on a daily basis, and you're less resistant to getting to know one another because you believe you know, you trust them. And so, I mean, that really serves, you know, besides, like you mentioned the team cohesion, but trust is really a foundation, it is building that relationship.
Sylvia Melena 17:36
It is and it doesn't matter what relationship, it could be relationships at home at work at school,
Dr. Deanna Davis 17:42
that is so true. We all need to trust each other just a little bit
Sylvia Melena 17:46
more. Right? Absolutely. We can always work on that.
Dr. Deanna Davis 17:50
Exactly, exactly. So. So, um, now what are some tools or ways that you recommend leaders use to build relationships,
Sylvia Melena 18:00
okay, so the biggest way that we can build strong relationships, and again, that's whether it's virtual or in person is the relationships don't change. It's about being intentional as leaders and how we approach the people that we were hired to serve and see ourselves as service. And this is true, again, both virtually and physically. Now in my book supported by, okay, I don't think I mentioned that in my book, supportive accountability, how to inspire people and improve performance. I outlined three pillars of a strong supervisor employee relationship. Now, they're really three pillars of leader member relationship, and it's based on leader member exchange theory. And the three pillars are trust, effective communication, and empowerment. And if you do a research, these three come up consistently in the research in different management and leadership literature. And so we talked about trust. Effective communication is the one it's frequent.
It's high quality, it's positive, it's honest, but more importantly, it's simply a conversation. It does, it's like you and I are talking right now. That's quality communication. The more we speak with one another, the more we get to know each other, and then empower him. empowerment is really about giving people the power, to be autonomous, to really have the freedom to engage in work the way it suits them best. It's about you know, knowing what's meaningful to them and supporting that. So the opposite of empowerment is micromanaging. Where you're just giving people not just here's the outcome, because it's okay to say here's the results we have to hit. But then some leaders take it a step further and give them a play by play a step by step and really just micromanage it to the person doesn't have the freedom to think and use the use the brain trust that they bring to the table. And it's about autonomy, we have to be sure that we're able to work in the best way that works for us.
Now empowerments went to look very differently for different people. And it goes back to getting to know each one individually. So as as an as an employee, I might want more of my leader in terms of support and engagement. If they don't come around too much I might feel not supported, then I might be another type of employee that it can come around way too much. I'm feeling like you're you're looking over my shoulder. So it's where this How does a person want to be empowered. And then as a leader, I have to get to know the person who really support them in the way that works best for them. And then, of course, you have to also do it in a way that works best for you as a leader.
Dr. Deanna Davis 20:44
That is, that is really true. And I mean, all three of those pillars, I mean, they are excellent ways to improve the relationship, because if leaders empower their employees, they make them feel that there was you know, they're supportive, and they don't stifle creativity, because that's what I feel a micromanagers they can do, you know, stifle the creativity of employees, when you don't provide them with autonomy to do their jobs. And then when leaders provide that effective communication, and it's productive, and it's quality, communication, I mean, that builds the trust. I mean, so it's like it's all cyclical, it all works in tandem, together. And, you know, that definitely can resonate with the workplace in the workplace environment, whether that's in person or even, you know, in a virtual workplace, because those three pillars can really foster a positive interaction among teams, and among leadership in teams as well.
Sylvia Melena 21:47
And then I want to, I want to mention just one thing that I didn't share. So when when I talk about positive effective communication, I don't want people to think that that means that I don't address challenges or performance areas that can improve. So I can do that in a way that's positive, and that builds the person up. And if my intentions towards that person who needs to bring up their their performance, just a tad or maybe a lot, if my intentions towards them is their success. And it's there is them succeeding and excelling and doing well and loving their job. They're going to perceive that people are super smart, they're going to know that I'm having this conversation because I have your best interest in mind. So it's being honest, and really not sugarcoating. But also not being brutally honest, because those are two opposites. So it's there's a balance there in between.
And then I want to touch base on on the tool, because we're talking about effective communication. So one of the tools in my leadership practice, I use several assessments, to develop leaders to help in leadership development. And one of the ones that I really love is called the disc assessment. And that assessment, it really helps us understand people's needs motivated behaviors and emotions. So it's the needs that motivates the way people behave and the way people feel. And that's, again, part of that soft skills is understanding the feelings that most people make decisions based on their feelings, not on logic. And so feelings are super important in the workplace. And they'll just doesn't measure intelligence. It doesn't measure it doesn't measure skills, education, experience, or values. And the model has four key styles, their dominance, influence, steadiness, and conscientiousness. And then the model also has a specific issue.
Each of the four styles has specific areas where people have areas of focus, people have behavioral tendencies, and people have specific pace and priorities. Now, I'm not going to go into the details of that because it is it is actually robust, and I love it a lot, but we won't go into it too deeply. What I do want to point out is that pace and priority are huge sources of tensions between the fourth disc styles. And so to give you an example, so and I'll give you the example of two polar opposites styles, the dominant style and the steadiness styles are on the opposite end of the spectrum, it's a four quadrant model. dominance is faster paced, and they focus on the task. In other ones words as a dominant style and, and by the way, I am one, I want to work faster and I want to get the job done. Now a person with the steadiness style is going to be slower paced and are going to focus on people that's their priority. So I want to take my time and I want to attend to the needs and the feelings of the people now Imagine those two polar opposites in a in a in a team.
And there's a deadline looming. But so dominance has to, we got to get this done, we have to meet the deadline and finish the task. But there are some people that are hesitating or not comfortable on the team with moving forward. So steadiness is paying attention to that. Now there could be some tension and conflict, especially if those two are leaders in the same level trying to move forward. And also, if it's a supervisor, lithium, a dominant supervisor trying to move the test along. And the steadiness person is looking at a different value things differently. Now, again, neither one is better than the other one, they're different, and they can, cause it can cause conflict. And what this does, it helps people understand, and it helps them become self aware, become aware, aware of other people and how they would like to be treated and communicated with and then how I can adapt as a leader to their their style, knowing knowing everything that I know about my style in theirs. So it's a great tool to use. And there are several other tools, there are emotional intelligence, there's motivators. So there's a lot of assessments on the market that can help you really understand other people.
Dr. Deanna Davis 26:17
Okay, well, thank you for, I mean, that sounds like an excellent tool and, you know, assessment to use in the workplace. So thank you for discussing that in detail. And I'm sure our listeners love to learn more about that. So, but I would just want to thank you, Silvia, so much for sharing your insight into strengthening relational connectivity to create a thriving, vibrant and productive virtual workplace. Are there any additional pieces of advice that you would like to leave with us today?
Sylvia Melena 26:50
The biggest thing is just to be ourselves, we we are who we are, and we don't have to be someone else. And people will learn to appreciate us by being genuine and transparent.
Dr. Deanna Davis 27:03
Thank you for that. For those listeners who would like to learn more about your book or products and services. Can you share how they can contact you or your your website to gain additional information?
Sylvia Melena 27:14
Yes, so my website my leadership website is leadership strength.com and the first page has a you know, leadership, strength, calm and do anything they need to get is right there up front. And if they have any questions are welcome to email me at S. Molina at Molina consulting calm.
Dr. Deanna Davis 27:34
So Sylvia, thank you so much for joining us in support of the Center for the advancement of virtual organizations. We truly appreciate your insights. And we know our listeners will benefit from your experience, and has definitely been my pleasure to speak with you today.
Sylvia Melena 27:54
Thank you, Deanna. And it was a pleasure and an honor to join the Cabo podcast and to contribute to the amazing work that you're doing in the area of virtual organizations.