Life Liberty and the Pursuit
Welcome to the Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit podcast. Come join Eric and Matt who are freedom-loving, meat-eating, gun-shooting American guys as they discuss a broad spectrum of topics ranging from States' rights, culture, and the 2nd Amendment to scotch, bourbon, and cigars. Eric & Matt are both former US Army combat veterans who served together while deployed to Iraq during OIF III. Eric is most notable for his YouTube channel Iraqveteran8888 which has over 2.75 million subscribers currently as well as his outspoken and no-compromise stance regarding the 2nd amendment. Matt, founded Ballistic Ink, a branding and merchandising company that serviced 2A content creators and the firearms industry. He also is a partner of Alliance jiujitsu Roswell located in Roswell GA and trains daily and competes regularly. He is very passionate about the 2nd amendment and freedom. Come along for the ride!
Life Liberty and the Pursuit
LLP #127: The Moral High Ground: Why Being Pro-Gun Matters
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The moral case for gun ownership transcends political divides and challenges mainstream narratives about armed citizens. When we examine the human condition throughout history, one pattern emerges clearly: violence has always been more common than peace. Against this backdrop, firearms represent something profound—they're the great equalizer that allows every citizen, regardless of size, strength, or status, to stand on equal footing.
What makes the pro-gun position morally superior? It's simple: those who advocate for universal gun rights are advocating for true equality. As we discuss in this episode, if someone claims to value equality but doesn't want everyone to have equal ability to defend themselves, what they actually want is a monopoly on violence. Nothing could be further from genuine equality.
The most telling aspect of responsible gun ownership is the fervent hope never to use your weapon. Most carriers view their firearms as tools of absolute last resort—something to be drawn only when all other options have disappeared. This restraint, having power but choosing not to use it unless necessary, represents true strength of character. We explore how the armed citizen isn't looking for trouble but stands ready to protect what matters when trouble arrives uninvited.
The data consistently shows that areas with higher legal gun ownership experience less crime. We examine how Constitutional carry has now passed in 30 states, creating the strongest Second Amendment protections in American history, despite mainstream narratives suggesting rights are being eroded. The case of Kennesaw, Georgia—where household firearm ownership is mandated by ordinance—demonstrates how an armed populace creates one of metropolitan Atlanta's safest communities.
Whether you're a longtime Second Amendment supporter or someone curious about the deeper philosophy behind firearms freedom, this episode provides a thoughtful, principled examination of why being pro-gun truly represents the moral high ground. Ready to challenge your thinking or reinforce your convictions? Listen now.
Welcome back everybody. This is Eric and Matt and this is Life, liberty and the Pursuit, your beacon of freedom and the American way of life. Tune in every Monday for a new episode as we dive into the world of liberty and what makes our country great. All right, boys and girls, welcome back. This is Eric and Matt here with LLP, and I hope everybody has had a fantastic week. We're coming at you hot Today's show. We're going to be talking about morals. Nice, we're coming at you hot Today's show. We're going to be talking about morals.
Speaker 2:Nice, we have those right.
Speaker 1:Well, sometimes it depends and why being pro-gun is the moral high ground.
Speaker 2:I can see that I can, definitely more so now than before.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So there's obviously a lot of things we're going to pick apart and talk about in today's show. We're going to talk about guns quite a bit and you know, just so people can kind of get an idea here, you know, I guess some housekeeping, so to speak. We do touch on a lot of different subjects here on LLP, you know, sometimes we talk about politics, sometimes we talk about world events, sometimes we'll talk about just stuff going on in our life. So this is a variety show where really anything goes in terms of the type of stuff that we might cover. But today is pretty much strictly guns. So we're going to be discussing that quite a bit and getting into the weeds on this and why being pro-gun is the moral high ground.
Speaker 1:And you look at so much of culture and history, and the history of mankind is steeped in violence.
Speaker 1:And when you look at peace in the context of, let's just say, the human condition and human history, peace is way more rare than violence is. And violence, it seems to be the talking point, it's the negotiating point, is our ability to carry out violence against others and it's what made people who they are today. And you know it's weird to think about Matt, that you are a product of the strongest and most viable people who came before you. The weak people died right. The weak people were conquered, they were taken over. Like to think that the person you are, the weakest, most terrible person you ever meet was still the strongest, somehow somewhere in the history of their ancestry. And it's odd to think how we got here, why we got here, what allowed us to soldier on and come to the point in the quest that we are right now, matt, and it's weird to think that history really is. You know about who's been the best killers, and it's not about who could live the most peacefully.
Speaker 1:It's about who was the most the best at committing violence towards people. And when we talk about pro-gun being the moral high ground, what do we really mean? What are we really referring to when we talk about being pro-gun from a moral sense, and that moral sense being that you hold the high ground morally because you're pro-gun? Why would we come to that conclusion? What would your take on that be?
Speaker 2:I think right now the biggest thing is, you know, outrage culture, which, in this particular instance, works out for the first time ever in gun owners favors, because it's always been oh it's. You want to have some type of outrage against something. Well, now the outrage is I want my guns. Like, don't take my guns away. So now you're starting to see a lot of people that previously and this is just my take previously would not have been so outspoken about, you know, firearms. Now that, um, you know it's okay to have outrage against stuff, they're willing to step up and say, hey, don't take my guns, don't change any laws as it stands.
Speaker 2:People like to say that the Second Amendment is being eroded, non-popular opinion and fact. The Second Amendment is actually stronger now than it has ever been in the past, with constitutional carry being passed to 30 states back more and more of our rights, albeit not the ones that everybody wants, like the machine guns, the NFA, the suppressors, the short, sbrs, sbss. That's been a hard fight. That's a hard fight, but for everything else we have a stronger standing right now with our two-way rights than we've ever had ever.
Speaker 1:I think that that's an astute way to look at it.
Speaker 1:I mean, I think anyone who's paying attention certainly sees that there's never been more of an appetite for the Second Amendment in the history of the United States, and I think that it even gets to a point where, all right, there was probably a point in the history of the United States where people just went about their day and owned guns and didn't think anything of it.
Speaker 1:There wasn't a such thing as, like gun laws and gun control and people you know politicians passing laws that had to do with a person's firearms. Okay, now the owner of the saloon, for instance, you know, if he said, hey, I don't want guns in my place of business, ok, well, if you're on private property and that person doesn't want you to carry guns in the saloon, well then is he within his right to tell you to leave your guns at home or leave them with a friend, or check them in at the bar or whatever they were, whatever their process was back then? I mean, I guess if you respect law and order, then yeah, you have to respect that property owner's rights to do that. So I suppose there were people back then who let's just say like they didn't want people getting in fights and getting drunk and shooting each other in the bar and stuff like that. I mean that's on them right, but it's not like there was some you know. Let's just say statutory or or you know government control.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it wasn't, it wasn't bureaucratic, it wasn't government, you know, mandated control of guns. It was just people simply living in the moment, so to speak. And and maybe understanding in that moment hey, I'm, you know, absolutely ridiculously hammered. Will you hold onto my pistols? So I don't, you know, go crazy and shoot someone. I mean whatever you know self ridiculously hammered. Will you hold on to my pistols? So I don't you know, go crazy and shoot someone. I mean whatever you know self-induced, self-induced control of oneself.
Speaker 2:Well, we've all seen that.
Speaker 1:Which you know is normal. Everyone in society has done that at some point. When you're drunk, do you pass the keys on to someone you wouldn't drive home drunk. You would say, hey, man, take my keys.
Speaker 2:Well, I always would see that when you're looking at the movies and you're going into the saloon, you'd see the bartender say hey, check your firearms.
Speaker 2:And you'd have the kid walk up and he takes off his gun belt and hands the kid his gun belt. But they always had a backup. They'd always have the little Derringer like the pistol, like somewhere. That's right so, but to your point, yeah, like back in those days, that was like how it was. When you want to, you know, the sheriff comes in. He's like you know there's no, no guns in this saloon.
Speaker 2:You know, so you know to just to get back before I forget, when you said America is very proficient at violence and that opening statement it made me realize that I'm 41 years old. We have been at war for over half of my lifetime, like consistently g-watt 20 years iraq, afghanistan and you guys can say what you want about iran, about how we're not at war, when I don't know what else you call that. When you drop bombs and you release ordinance on another country, that's war now warish now, whether they fight back or not, that's on them, but when?
Speaker 1:you whether they declare wars on?
Speaker 2:yeah like if I go up to somebody and I just start wailing on them and punching them. That's a fight. Now, whether they want to fight back is on them, but I've started to fight. So you know, I think. But because, like you said, because amer America has been at war and we're very proficient at what we do as a country, that induces a certain reaction of like, hey, man, I don't want, I'm not going to punch back. Think about that for a second. You just dropped 14 30,000-pound bombs on a country and they go ah, we're good, don't worry about it, we've had. We're good, don't worry about it, we've had enough. Yeah, don't worry about it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and did it with the stealth what the B-2 bombers the stealth bomber, so literally snuck in past. Your air defenses dropped it.
Speaker 2:Seven and a half miles up With impunity.
Speaker 1:There's something about that that strikes power and it says, hey, we're here.
Speaker 2:What other country could do that? Yeah, what other country could do that at will and get away with it unscathed? You know Right, there's a reason that we do what we do.
Speaker 1:It is crazy, isn't it? It's wild, it is extremely crazy. And again it goes back to that. The concept that we talked about of the humanity, like the history of humanity and the history of mankind has been violence, yeah, and it's like it's all we've ever known, like the universal language of how we handle problems, has always been to fight it out, to take from others what we want for ourselves to. You know, you have land, we want it, we take it. You have things, we want it, we, we take it. You have things, we want it, we take it.
Speaker 1:And it's crazy how we think of history so much within the short context of our lives. We think, well, for the last 40 years it's been relatively peaceful. Well, we've been at war for 20 years of our 40-year life. One could certainly argue that's not peaceful, but let's just say the home we live in here, where we are, is peaceful. Right, you can go to the grocery store, you can go to the movie theater, you can go wherever you want in society and generally, outside of some specific situations, you're generally pretty freaking safe. Okay, you can carry your firearm, you can go about your business concealed carry and generally, as long as you don't hang around some real doofus people. You're probably going to be all right, and I think there's a beauty in that.
Speaker 1:There's a beauty in an armed society being a polite society, and what I think of when I say okay, well, why would being pro-gun be the moral high ground? Be the moral high ground? I think it's a moral high ground because what it tells other people, what it tells society, is that you value their life just as much as you value yours. What is a more concise way for you to ensure that other people are as safe as you are? Unless you say you know what I want gun ownership for everybody.
Speaker 1:I don't want any one person to have guns and others not to have guns, because that's how you create tyranny. That's how you create the conditions that are necessary for violence to occur against one specific group of people, or maybe it's a weak person and someone's. You know the weak and the strong, and so it is an equalizer. Firearms are an equalizer and if you truly do care about equality, that that that term gets thrown around all the time equality they say they want equality, but they really don't want equal share of what it takes to be equal Right, that's right. But if you say you really actually care about equality. That's a leftist trope, that's a leftist talking point is to say oh, am I about equality Right.
Speaker 1:you never want an equal share of the work or an equal share of what it takes to make it happen. You want 100% of the means of production. When you produce nothing, yeah, I can see how you'd want the means of production anyway. When you produce nothing, yeah, I can see how you'd want the means of production anyway, not to go down that rabbit hole. But the truth is, you claim to want equality, but if you claim to want equality and you don't want everyone to be on equal footing in terms of the ability to do violence if necessary, then that means you want a monopoly on violence. That means you actually care nothing about equality. You care only about your ability to have a monopoly on violence. So that's why I think that firearms are such a moral high ground for someone to be pro-gun. I want someone who even doesn't think the way that I do to be armed, because I care about equality.
Speaker 1:I may not agree with a person's politics. I may not agree with their religion. I may not agree with a person's politics. I may not agree with their religion. I may not agree with who they are. I may not agree with their morals and values or what they think of me, but I'll always agree with their ability to arm themselves, because I believe in equality. Everything else can sort itself out on the back end, right? If I say something, I can protect what I say with my guns. If you say something, you can protect what I say with my guns. If you say something, you can protect what you say with your guns. If it goes beyond that, that's what we have our guns for.
Speaker 1:I mean I guess, at the end of the day, if it comes to shooting, then I guess we've come to that impasse. Well then, everyone should have the ability to come to that impasse. Right and that's civilized society. It keeps everyone civil. That's civilized society. It keeps everyone civil.
Speaker 2:Well, kennesaw Georgia enters the chat, because Kennesaw, georgia, actually has a city ordinance that states every single head of household must own a firearm. It is in the city ordinance. Now, I don't live in kenesaw, georgia, but it is a very well known like city ordinance, because I think they're the only city that mandates that created that ordinance. That is out there. I don't know anybody, any other city, any other town, any other state that does that and consequently, statistically speaking, they are one of the safest cities in the metro Atlanta area. I looked it up. I mean, it is what it is, man. Now do they enforce the ordinance? No, they're not going door to door like forcing it, but I just think it's really cool for them to do that and say, hey, this is your right, this is ordinance. You have to have it because if you don't, bad things can happen.
Speaker 1:It's up to you to decide which household does or doesn't. We're telling everybody to have a gun, whether they do or don't. We're not going to make a big deal about it, but you should know that in our eyes, every house should have a gun, and I think that makes thieves and potential criminals think twice. And that's why it's such a safe area.
Speaker 2:It's just like….
Speaker 1:Kennesaw is a big college town.
Speaker 2:Yeah, KSU.
Speaker 1:KSU up there and you know great school and a lot of the people there. You know it's a pretty based college. They're very open-minded about carrying. You can have your gun at college.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think they were one of the first ones to say that was okay they had campus carry and you know what.
Speaker 1:It's safe. You haven't seen any shenanigans going on up there, have you Nope? You haven't seen any shenanigans going on up there, have you Nope?
Speaker 1:What I find to be so crazy, matt, is that in society we are expected to continuously give in to these leftist talking points and I say leftist but let's just say anti-gun points of how well, if we ban guns, if we put more restrictions on ownership of guns, the carrying of guns, the type of guns someone can own, let's just say restricting the type of guns, magazine capacity, carrying all of those sorts of things, let's just say firearms at an eagle eye level that we're going to just have stricter rules on how guns are dealt with in society.
Speaker 1:That we're expected to believe somehow my phone is on, I'm about to turn the ringer off, sorry about that, but so we're expected to believe somehow that if we keep following you know their advice on the subject matter, that it's somehow going to change, like the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and over again and expecting a different result.
Speaker 1:And I find it so crazy how the anti-gunners seem to just consistently get it wrong over and over and over again, but they won't listen to anyone's solutions, right? But when we say, hey, here's the data. Right, here's the crime data, here's the FBI statistics, here's the you know gun data, whatever data we give them, this is just raw data. Right, do with it what you wish, here's the raw data we interject the data and we say look, according to this, that the more people are armed we have campus carry, we have armed teachers, we have open carry. Whatever We've made it easy for people to defend themselves with a firearm in society, crime goes down. Wow, what a concept. And it's so easy to prove. It's so unmistakably and quantifiably easy to prove using data. It is so crazy to me how the anti-gunners can continue their tirade of stupidity in the face of such irrefutable and unmistakable facts 100%.
Speaker 2:Look at the schools that chose to basically promote the fact that they are their teachers carry. They were. Uh, we know, when there was a whole bunch of like school shootings going on, there were schools that would put big billboards out in front of the school that said our teachers carry they. Just let you know up front don't come in here trying these shenanigans, you're going to get dealt with, that's right. How many of those schools had anything happen to them? You know, like, if you're just like, hey, they choose people that want to do violence. Choose soft targets, not hard targets. But what if everything's a hard target? There's like your slim pickings. There's not going to be that much to choose from.
Speaker 2:I have conversations with all kinds of people. We run a jujitsu academy. We have all kinds of students come through there and we don't talk politics. Part of what we do there is we say, hey, we can talk about anything except two things. We don't talk about two things religion and politics. We found that anytime you start mixing those two things in, people don't get along. Yeah, so we're like hey, if you don't, if you don't take to the art yeah, like you can talk about whatever you want no religion, no politics.
Speaker 1:You know it is so funny that you mentioned that and I'll tell not really a story, but it's just kind of to support what you're saying is, uh, some of the I don't even want to say it's like some of the communities that I am involved in or things that I've done over the years, but like I guess a good example would be, I like music and I love to play music and sometimes I like to go and sit in at like open mic gigs or go sit in with my friends who play music, you know, and sit in with their band or whatever, and it's so funny that, like there's a stereotypical image of people who are into music, that they're of a certain political affiliation or they have a certain view on guns, and and those stereotypes very well may be true in some circles, right that maybe some certain types of musicians or artists or actors or people that are into sports whatever
Speaker 1:that they may have a certain view on guns, that maybe it's not, they're not necessarily anti or pro-gun, but that they simply just don't discuss it Right. And I find that those communities are kind of like that, like generally, everybody kind of gets along and gets together and has fun and plays music, and they're there to make music. They're not there to talk about their religion or their views or their politics. And it's so interesting how, when you just keep those things out of the equation, you find that most people actually get along quite well and if you don't know who someone is or what they're really thinking, you could be jamming with someone having a great time. They might be anti-gun as hell and they may not know that I'm one of the biggest gun voices out there, but we can still get together and make music and have fun and no harm, no foul, no one hates anyone, that's right. There's just something interesting about the idea of community and what that shows, what your situation at the Jiu-Jitsu Academy, at your dojo, what that shows and what my situation shows and the circumstances I've been in and being in public and being with the artist community and the musician community is that people have to look for common ground and transcend the barriers based on things they agree on, not what they disagree on. And I think that's where things start to get slippery in terms of arguing about well, should someone be pro-gun or anti-gun or whatever? Let's just look at it under the tiny little lens of firearms ownership, which is an extremely small part of someone's actual overall personality, right?
Speaker 1:Think about golf, right? Okay, have I ever swung a golf club? I have. I've gone to the driving range, but would I consider myself a golfer? No, do I own a set of golf clubs? Nope, never have. Will I ever own a set of golf clubs? Nope, probably never will. Do I think that golfers are dumb or lazy or boring? No, I think. Hey, if someone likes to golf, by all means go and golf.
Speaker 1:That's how some people look at gun owners. They may not care about guns. Maybe they don't wanna own a gun. They never will. Maybe they've been to the range. Maybe their friend took them to the range and they had an experience and they shot their first gun. Are they going to go buy a gun? No, they may not. Will they ever own a gun? Probably not. Do they think guns are boring? No, guns are fun. Hey, we went to the range and shot guns in a controlled environment. Hey, we had fun. Okay, guns are fun.
Speaker 1:Are they going to philosophically look at the Second Amendment in the way that we would, as being this important moral high ground of protection and shepherding the community around us? Maybe not, but do they think otherwise? Do they think that it's a bad thing? Maybe not. So again, it comes down to when people.
Speaker 1:I guess the point I'm trying to make is that when people come into a conversation and they try to find something they agree with first, you're always going to have a much more positive experience than if you begin the conversation with something that's extremely divisive like that. And I guarantee you that if politics came up, if religion came up in the context of that environment, I would be able to have probably a much more civil conversation with someone that, hey, like, wow, we love music, we love art. We agree on something first, and then when we found something we disagree on, we might kind of laugh that off. And I think that's the difference. People, they don't ever want to laugh something off, they don't want to agree, to disagree, they want to simply start with the disagreement. And when you start with a disagreement, right out the hole. It's just going to become a freaking blood bath, and when the blood's in the water and the sharks, they start circling.
Speaker 2:You know, what's so crazy about that is that you literally just described a conversation that I had with my eight-year-old daughter yesterday and the way and I and so she was drawing a stitch from Lilo and stitch and I'm using this as a comparison because it just puts you in the mindset of a lot of people that you argue with. Sometimes they think like an eight-year-old. So she's drawing a stitch and she messes it up and she starts crying. She's like I'm not a good artist, I'm not a good artist. And I look at her and I said what makes you think you're an artist? And she kind of looks at me. She's like what do you mean? I was like all right, how long have you been practicing drawing? How long have you been training drawing? She's like I haven't said then you're not an artist, you haven't earned that. Yet.
Speaker 2:I said imagine my daughter wrestles 20 to 25 hours a week. She trains extremely hard and she's proud of it. I said imagine someone, one of your friends, does two wrestling classes and says I'm a wrestler, now how would you feel? It's like well, they're not. I said well, why aren't they? Because they've only done it twice. And I said all right, so what makes you think you're an artist. And then she looks up and she's like huh, like a light goes off in her head.
Speaker 2:And I said so at the same time I'm applying this to gun ownership. You own a gun. That doesn't mean that you're an advocate for the Second Amendment. It just means you're a gun owner. You haven't become that steward of the Second Amendment yet. That doesn't mean that you can't amendment yet. That doesn't mean that you can't. It just means that you haven't done what you need to do in order to represent the second amendment and in the way that other people want you to. So it's like when you look at the news and they say, oh, this is a gun owner, what is your opinion? You can have your opinion, but don't say that you're a second amendment advocate yet opinion.
Speaker 1:but don't say that you're a second amendment advocate yet. You know, I do agree with that a lot and I think it's true. And look, I might catch some flack here for saying this and you, you probably be the last thing you expect somebody like me to say, but the truth is it's not even required for you to be a steward of the second amendment. If you don't want to be like, if you want to be a casual gun owner that just owns a gun and maybe hardly ever use it, I wouldn't recommend that. I would recommend you get some training and actually understand the tools at your disposal at a high level. We're not talking about a set of golf clubs you can put in the closet and just forget about and maybe every now and then break them out and go to the driving range with your buddies. That's different. If I go to the driving range and I suck at golfing, that's okay.
Speaker 2:But you're not calling yourself a golfer Right? I'm not going to call myself a golfer.
Speaker 1:If someone says do you like to golf? Yeah, I like to golf, what do you have? Well, I have a set of golf clubs. Yeah, I have golf a bit. Yeah, I golf a bit. I'm not a professional golfer, I enjoy golf. I like golf.
Speaker 1:At that overall level, you could say that. But as a gun owner, I feel like you don't necessarily have to be some shepherd or steward of the community if you don't want to be. You don't have to let everybody know you're a gun owner if you don't want to. I think you should.
Speaker 1:I think it's almost when we view gun ownership as this. I don't know, it seems like some within the Second Amendment community view gun ownership as this strange religious quantifiability. It's almost like this odd small religion that you're a part of, like, oh, I'm a gun owner, I'm going to spread it like a gospel and that's important. Yeah, you have to be. You know, sometimes the Second Amendment, gun ownership in general it does require someone to get someone else into it for them to care about it. So it requires ambassadorship for someone to go. Well, wow, I never thought about going to the range and shooting, but man, this is fun. I kind of actually care about this. And then once you change someone's mind enough to at least go out and give it a try and just be open-minded enough to give it a shot no pun intended then you can kind of start changing their mind on.
Speaker 1:Well, you know why we have this right. You know why we have gun ownership right. Well, you know why we have this right. You know why we have gun ownership right. You know, because a tyrannical government tried to, you know, control us and tax us, and we fought a revolution. So then you explain, like, why gun ownership exists in the United States. Like this is not just so we can go out and shoot ski. This is not so we can go out and hunt animals, although those are popular pastimes that are important to the American culture that before all of those things existed, refusing to allow an oppressive state to have a monopoly on violence was the first reason. Then you can explain to them this is the actual reason we have this and that light bulb goes off in someone's head and they go wow, I didn't realize it was that deep. Yeah, it is deep. Like there's a very deep and philosophical reason not philosophical, but just like a very important logistical reason for this to exist.
Speaker 2:That is not just about hunting or anything like this is way deeper than that Well, I think that's the biggest taboo that people don't want to get behind is that you nailed it. It's like when someone says, well, I'm a gun owner, but you don't need this to go hunting. It's not about hunting. The whole purpose is that you have a way to combat the government if they overstep. It's not about hunting, and that's the hardest part. That's codified, yeah, and that's in our.
Speaker 1:That's the reason for it.
Speaker 2:Exactly, but they don't see it that way. And and that's what I was trying to get at with that original story was that. How many times have you heard someone say, when they give their opinion on something, I'm a gun owner. Just leave it at that. If you would have stopped your sentence right there, everything would have been good.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I never really trust anything somebody says. If they say I'm a gun owner or a butt, yeah, anything after butt is just crap. I mean, you know, everyone's entitled to an opinion and I suppose that's something important to remember too is like there are gun owners out there who may not agree with what I like to do as a gun owner, you know and that's.
Speaker 1:OK, they don't have to agree with me. I think it's a little bit. Well, it's actually a lot, a lot of it very self-defeating to apply your own boundaries to your own rights. I've never understood that, how someone can say, well, all I do is hunt deer. Therefore, I don't understand why you need your AR-15. It's not required that you understand why I have it. It's not even required that you understand why your own rights even exist. But it's certainly not your place to scrutinize the gun owners. That do understand. I'm not going to say that you're in the wrong to just want to hunt deer with your bolt action rifle. That's fine, that's what you want to do, go ahead. But I think it's just. It's very self-defeating for someone to just easily give in and say, well, I don't understand the reason. Therefore, you shouldn't have it. It's crazy.
Speaker 1:That's the worst that's like that's like saying you know, I drive my F one 50, 70 miles an hour down the interstate, but I don't understand why F one race car exists. Yeah, you don't need to understand why a 250 mile an hour race car exists. You're driving an F-150. It's a completely different purpose. Both are going to get you from point A to point B, but one is made for something vastly different than the other and both are relevant to the people who want that tool for that purpose. Before we get too much further in the show, I would like to give a shout out to today's sponsor, and that's Allegiance Gold. You ever notice how gold doesn't get much airtime until the system starts to shake. Well, here's what nobody's talking about.
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Speaker 2:There's only so much gold.
Speaker 1:It has a cap and the prices on gold have consistently been going up. Silver has its ups and downs, but I would say generally I don't have as much gold as I need to have, but but gold is a really great investment. It's been very consistent it really goes in hand in hand with the gun community.
Speaker 2:Like people are into guns, it seems like it is kind of weird how that happens yeah, they're into investing in gold even when you look at like ig, you see posts of like gucci guns and like gold coins. They go together.
Speaker 1:Especially lots of silver. At one point I bought a whole bunch of Morgan silver dollars. I still have them somewhere. In fact they might be here in the studio somewhere. I'd have to look. But I got a metric ton of Morgan silver dollars Like.
Speaker 2:I think I bought gosh.
Speaker 1:I think at one time I had about 300 of them. Nice yeah, and those things are worth like 35 bucks a piece. I think I bought gosh. I think at one time I had about 300 of them.
Speaker 2:Nice, yeah, and those things are worth like 35 bucks a piece.
Speaker 1:Yep, I need to find them bad boys yeah, I was like you should know where those are at. I might have to sell them. Bad boys I got a bunch and they're in like in these little plastic tubes.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but gosh, at one point I think spot was at like and this has been some years back, but I think spot price on silver per ounce was like. I want to say it was like $22, $21. And I bought a bunch and now it's double, easily worth double. I think spot on silver like $41 an ounce.
Speaker 2:Nice, yeah, not quite the hike that you see with gold, but you know.
Speaker 1:But still a sound investment that's right, and today's high price is tomorrow's money that you could have doubled your money on Yep. That's why bullion is such a sound investment. The price of the dollar becomes worth less and less and less. But imagine buying into silver at $21 an ounce, only to find out if it's worth $41 an ounce. Well, what got worth more money? The silver still sat there. It didn't change. The dollar got worth less. That's really what happened. It's just scary to think about that. They can just arbitrarily change the value of your money, just based on usury, based on interest rates and based on them, just printing, just raising the debt ceiling and just you know this, fractional banking. I mean not to get off on this tangent because I didn't want today's podcast to be about that, but it's wild to me how much they manipulate the value of money through various mechanisms that I'm not going to pretend to understand every little nuance, but I tell you I'm definitely paying attention to it.
Speaker 2:That and the way that other countries handle debt, like managing their buying debt, their trading debt, their calling debt to manipulate the markets for a long or putting someone in jail over debt.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think that is a very the people in prison.
Speaker 2:sometimes I was going to say that's a very unique American thing of jailing people for being in debt.
Speaker 1:All right, especially to the IRS. That's crazy to me that this group of people knows exactly how much money I'm supposed to pay them and even I don't know.
Speaker 2:But won't tell you and they won't tell you. They won't tell you, you have to guess that's the most wild thing ever, I mean imagine the person that came up with that concept. It's like hey, you owe us money, Well, how much you tell me? You tell me how much you owe me. It's like the Wheel of Fortune. You start throwing like $20,000.
Speaker 2:Nope, they always seem to know, they know, but they won't tell you. Of course, dude, I'm going to tell you a story. Man Hit it. The IRS came at me hard man, this was right when I sold my first business. I sold my first business and I had been out of. I sold the business. It was doing well, but I wanted to do something else.
Speaker 2:And about four years later, the IRS came after me saying that I owed them like 50 or $60,000. And I was like, okay, I don't think that's completely true. But they said you owe us $50,000 and you need to send us all this paperwork showing that you don't owe us the money. And if you don't, if you don't send us them, if you can't prove to us that you don't owe us the money, you owe us the money. And if you don't, if you don't send us them, if you can't prove to us that you don't owe us the money, you owe us the money. I was like, where am I going to find this, these documents from like four or five years ago? So I had to call my CPA. Thank God he held on to these documents that I needed and he sent it over to me. I, I sent it over to the IRS and they literally were just like all right thanks. And that was it. They were like all right thanks for sending over these documents. You no longer owe us any money.
Speaker 1:It was just that simple.
Speaker 2:It was so simple One fax. One fax saying hey, I don't owe you this money and this is why All right. Thanks, yeah, and this is why All right.
Speaker 1:Thanks yeah.
Speaker 2:But imagine how many people they catch without the, without holding onto the documentation for like four or five years, and they're like nah, you owe us 50 grand it always makes you think of Ron Swanson and that picture where he he pulls out a little like why can you do this? And he pulls out a little thing and it's just like I have a permission slip and he opens up and just says I can do whatever I want.
Speaker 1:That is the.
Speaker 2:IRS man. They can literally come after you for anything and you're done.
Speaker 1:So we have a podcast that we're going to be doing in the future. I haven't really figured out how I want to structure it, but the concept that we had is called in America, the accusation is the punishment and again, not getting into lawfare in today's show, because this is mainly about guns that we're talking about. But it is crazy how the accusation is actually the punishment, where you may be able to absolve yourself of whatever they're saying that you're guilty of, but the process of that, of absolving yourself of that crime, is the punishment. It costs money, it costs resources. You have to hire lawyers, you have to go to court and they're using your money. They can go all day, they don't care. They have unlimited money to hire all this money to clear your good name, and all the while, here you are, you know, going broke in the process, and then they're trying to make you broke in the process by trying to, you know, hammer you to the wall over money.
Speaker 2:Well, it's crazy because it's wild, with the IRS specifically and you might be talking about things outside the IRS, but the IRS specifically, it's a long game for them because they're charging interest penalties like every time, like, even though you're you're trying to defend yourself every time that you're late on a payment you're getting you're getting that little letter in the mail and that freaks you out. You're like what?
Speaker 1:it is wild interest how big the tax code really is. There's so many lines in the tax code.
Speaker 2:Can't get away from it.
Speaker 1:The garnish wages.
Speaker 1:Yeah, when we look at the tax code, you can also apply this chicken little complex of the tax code to the way that guns are looked at in terms of laws and things. So look at all the gun laws that are on the books. We kind of pivot back to firearms. You know which? I love guns. I love guns because they're a tool of liberty. You know they are a passive, inanimate object that has a potential for many things, good and bad and they only amplify the soul and intention of the people that hold them. I think there's a kind of a strange power in that. It's a power that if you choose to wield it responsibly, it should never be used. It shouldn't have to be used only when you've been left with no choice but to utilize that power. I I mean imagine, I don't know Lord of the Rings and having the ring. It's like that kind of mentality where the more you wear that ring, the more it corrupts you.
Speaker 2:I thought you were going to say Lord of the Flies and you had the conch.
Speaker 1:It could be the conch shell too, from Lord of the Flies, but the truth is, I mean one of them lords, right, but yeah, lord of the Rings. It's like the more you wear the ring, the more it poisons you and corrupts you, and it's like you're left with this choice of being invincible and all knowing and having the superpower, whatever it is. But yet, the less you use it, the more it beckons you and calls you and drives you insane to wield his power. And some people will never understand what it's like to have power and choose not to exercise it. I think that's the ultimate display of love and restraint that a person can have is to be given power and refuse to exercise it unless it is absolutely necessary. And to me, that's what guns are.
Speaker 1:I think the greater part of society view gun owners as a group of people that are bloodthirsty and they're carrying their guns everywhere and they're looking for a fight, they're looking for trouble. Now, I'm not going to say there aren't people out there that do I mean. Maybe there are. Maybe there are some people that they're just dreaming of the day they're going to get in some crazy OK Corral, gunfight or something. But the reality is, those of us that have been in combat. Those of us that have been in a pickle or two. You know, matt and I have seen a thing or two. Now is that to say that we've been in every little crazy situation. We could write an entire volume on gunfight 101, maybe not, but we've been in enough scary situations to know that violence should be reserved for when no other choice is available. Now war is different because it's a little bit more straight to the point. I mean, like they're trying to get you and you know it's either kill or be killed in those situations, or defend yourself or or deal with whatever they're going to do to you.
Speaker 1:But I think that, generally speaking, a lot of people tend to lose sight of the fact that firearms are something that you're going to carry it to protect yourself. But the most positive and outcome you want the most is for it not to be used. Right, if you go about your day and you never have to use your gun, that's a good day, and I think that's how most people view it. They don't want to have a situation where they're going to have to use their firearm. That's the last thing an average gun owner wants to do, not only because of the moral consequence or the logistical consequence of having to do something like that. Maybe you're risking. You don't want to have your family have to see that. Maybe you're with your family and the last thing you want to do is think of having to do something like that in front of your family. But you also can't think of the idea of somebody hurting your family.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:So it again becomes a matter of once that the point of no return comes. Do you fight or do you run away? It's the fight or flight which is a famous phrase we use here on this podcast. We've used quite a bit. So what do you do? Do you fight back or do you run away? Both are viable solutions. Do you fight back or do you run away? Both are viable solutions, depending on the circumstance and context. I think fighting is going to get you further, and having the will to fight and the tools to fight If you do have to fight, you better dang well, have a gun. You're not going to bring a freaking knife to a gunfight.
Speaker 1:You're not going to bring fists to a gunfight. In my mind, if I have a gun and I don't have a choice but to fight you, better believe I'm going to have a gun. That's my view of it. If I can escape a situation without bloodshed, I'll depart. If I have a going to see myself out of the situation. But, if I have to, you better believe I'm going to have the means and the ability.
Speaker 2:I think you said the key word there is if I have to. There are lots of people that have the misconception like they want to get into a little bit of a tussle. My obligation is to my daughter and to my wife and to my family and to make sure that I, you know I'm around to raise them. If I'm in a situation where I can not have to put myself in that position, I'm not going to, I'm going to walk away. Uh, if it's a driving incident, I'm going to slow down, I'm going to let them pass. I'm not going out of my way to put myself in those positions because you never know what can happen. You, a husband that's going to come home, that my daughter is going to have a father that's going to come home, and that's my priority. Outside of that, it is what it is.
Speaker 1:And you better believe that, if it does come down to the situation where there is no other choice and you do have to exercise, oh, extreme violence.
Speaker 2:You better believe it's going to be the best it's going to be the worst violence.
Speaker 1:It's going to be the fastest, the most lethal, the most the worst thing that person's ever seen.
Speaker 1:I mean, because we as men and I don't maybe I can't really speak for every guy, of course I can't speak for, obviously, for women either. I can speak for myself. I tend to be the kind of person that I kind of reserve it, I hold it in reserve, I try not to let petty little things bother me, which we're all guilty of allowing a little petty thing to get under our skin from time to time. I mean, we're all human, allowing a little petty thing to get under our skin from time to time. I mean, that's, we're all human, it's natural, right. But I think I tend to be the kind of person that, like I try to sweat, you know, sweat off the small stuff, not let it bother me. But there's always like that little kernel that stays there and you kind of throw it in the grain bin and it's like all right, it's just a piece of it, but we're just going to, we're going to let it lie, but eventually that grain bin kind of gets full.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, fills up and it's like you kind of sit there with your hand on the lever and thinking that, man, when someone opens up this grain bin, it's going to be so bad for them. You know what I mean. So you're like saving those micro frustrations up for the moment that you need it to empower you. I think that's ultimately, in my mind, what true masculinity is all about. All these people have it so wrong with guns, matt. They say well, you have a gun because you're afraid to fight, You're afraid to have an altercation, you're afraid to get in a verbal argument with someone, you're afraid to use your verbal judo, you don't know how to fight, you don't know how to use hand-to-hand combat. They'll come up with any excuse oh, you got a little dick, whatever.
Speaker 1:They'll use any excuse they can, other than saying that you know what? If someone owns a gun, that doesn't mean anything. You own a golf club, you own a baseball bat, you own a kitchen knife. Is that to say, oh, you own big kitchen knives? Oh, you're trying to compensate for something? No, it's just. The fact is that you understand the nature of violence. To have a tool such as a gun and refuse to use it only if in the most unexcapable situation, I think makes you way more deadly than someone who would just indiscriminately use a gun in the wrong circumstance.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, and I think Beware of the person who doesn't want violence, because that person, when they are pushed to violence, it's going to be bad.
Speaker 2:Well, we've seen that video and I know you've probably seen it where the guy pulls a gun out he's in traffic, walks up to another guy's pickup truck, has it in his hand and he goes to knock on the window and the guy shoots him through the glass and it's like the person.
Speaker 1:That guy opened up the freaking grain silo.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Well it's that you could tell the guy that had the gun in his hand he went to the gun first. Like that should be your last option. Second of all, you shouldn't be walking on people's cars, man, like you don't know you're going to get shot doing that. But yeah, don't do that. But to your point is like when I carry a, I carry a firearm, I do everything in my power to not use it. I walk away. I'm diffusing situations. It's the pulling that firearm is the last thing on my mind. Matter of fact, sometimes I don't remember I have it on me until I need it. It's like I'm not like, oh my God, it's a situation. It's like, hey, I'm just, it is what it is, man, have a great day you know, always use your verbal judo.
Speaker 1:Verbal judo is a superpower, right, you know? I think. I think it's important for law enforcement too. You know, law enforcement, sometimes they have a hard job, like you know they. They have to be bartender, they have to hear everybody sob story, everyone's innocent.
Speaker 2:I get it.
Speaker 1:I know it gets tiresome, but this is so important for cops to use their verbal judo and not be shooting people left and right, and I think that we should all be the same way too. You should always try to talk down a situation. Don't escalate the situation, and I'll tell you, it's just so wild to think about. There's one video that always comes back to my mind. I don't think we can show it on YouTube. It's not that it's necessarily violent, but I think it's like copyrighted or something. But I know y'all seen it. Look it up.
Speaker 1:Is the video where the, where the, the gas station clerk gets robbed. Okay, and this guy, um, he's um, an Afghanistan veteran. He's got like long hair, he looks kind of hippie-ish and even so, unassuming you would never think this guy would handle himself in this way. But this guy walks in with a gun, points it right at the guy you know what I mean. And this dude, without even looking up from his magazine, like he's kind of got his head down just looking at a magazine, he looks up and the guy's got a gun in his face and, almost like as natural as having a conversation with this guy, he reaches up and produces a Beretta M nine and has it in the guy's face before this dude can even process what happened.
Speaker 2:I've seen that video. He's like, and the guy's like yeah, the guy like he wasn't ready for violence.
Speaker 1:That guy was unprepared to commit violence. That veteran, that Afghanistan veteran, he was ready. Yeah, it was that Afghanistan veteran. He was red. Yeah, it was like he didn't even look up from his magazine. He could not even be bothered to look up from his magazine and he didn't even move his head. He just he did this. He didn't look at the gun. He didn't point the gun. He looked right in that guy's eyes and psyched him out and just pointed the gun right in his skull and that guy was like whoa dude, that guy was like I don't want no part of this and he left.
Speaker 1:He already had a gun pointed. So who was ready to commit violence in that moment? The guy that had the gun pulled on, the clerk, or the clerk? I guarantee you that clerk was ready. If that guy would have waited a split second, he would have been catching around to that Beretta right to his face. And I mean what do you do? And that guy probably would have went home that night and not lost a wink of sleep, absolutely not, he would have probably slept better, right.
Speaker 1:But that guy. The way he reacted is just so wild. When you want to talk about someone who's not ready to kill versus someone who is, watch that video, you'll see what I'm talking about. Compare the body language of the two of them and you'll see like which one who which one was ready to do what was required and which one wasn't, and that's that's a precarious situation.
Speaker 2:That's like a rock and a hard place, right guys there, you don't know what's going to happen. Yeah, is he gonna. Is he gonna shoot you after you give him the money? Yeah, so I mean you have nothing to lose at that did.
Speaker 1:He have every right to shoot in that moment oh dude, I'm surprised he didn't right.
Speaker 2:I'm surprised he didn't. He didn't the cops what took more restraint?
Speaker 1:what took more restraint? The robber not to just shoot him or him not to defend himself against a robber? I mean, of course there's every Monday armchair quarterback that's going to say, oh well, he had every right to shoot, yeah he had the right to shoot, but he didn't.
Speaker 2:He was calm as a cucumber. He handled the situation really well.
Speaker 1:He did I mean that's not an easy thing to deal with. It's not normal to have a gun pointed at you.
Speaker 2:And it could have been very well that that wasn't a real gun. Lots of times like not the not well, I say that because Maybe he noticed it wasn't real or something. Well, no, maybe he didn't, but maybe the guy didn't realize. So lots of times these robbers are going in there with airsoft guns and they're just trying to make it like you're trying to do a quick robbery, because in realistically, why would he have not shot him, like the, the robber person?
Speaker 2:yeah, why would the robber outside, outside of the fact that maybe you're right, he's not ready to commit violence. He wasn't committed to it, he's he. He was expecting the easy lay down. Hey, I have a gun, give me the money. Yeah, easy payday no intention. Yeah, he had no intention no, no, he did not have the intent to murder somebody that day. Obviously, the, the afghanistan vet, was fully committed to like hey, we can do this, we can dance, yeah I know that's crazy I mean someone's got the drop on.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean you're still gonna pull your gun. It's like that. That's that takes balls.
Speaker 2:So, my, my only thing I can think of is that two things you. That guy did not have the intent to commit murder. He wanted the easy money or two, he didn't have a way to commit murder because the gun wasn't real and he thought it was going to be easy lay down and he almost lost his life, yeah.
Speaker 1:Over down and he almost lost his life, yeah, over a freaking airsoft gun. Maybe he was woken up in that moment to realize, like dude, this guy does, this guy does not give a crap like he.
Speaker 2:He literally had a gun pointed at him, didn't care, he still pointed a gun, because there was another video of like three teens going in and like they walk in with a handgun and then they don't even make it through the door. Man, like the glass door he's walking in, he opened, he goes to open the door with a pistol and that guy- just I think that on that one I think they saw him on the, on the on the camera.
Speaker 2:One of them like dude. He hit one of them like three times. Man just dropped him right there.
Speaker 1:I mean door you got a right to defend your business, man. I mean, I guess it just depends on how, how threatened you feel. I mean, all right, in the heat of the moment again not playing monday quarterback, but in the heat of the moment if I saw three armed men showing going in the front door and I'm there alone, it's late at night, it's a place of business. They're carrying guns. What do you think's gonna happen? They're not coming there to be like hey, let me show you my, my gun no, they're coming to show and tell, right, yeah, it ain't show.
Speaker 1:And tell you, better believe I'm going to be grabbing my iron.
Speaker 2:Yeah, which is exactly why they would argument you don't need more than, like, seven rounds, like.
Speaker 1:I don't know about that. Yeah, man Scary, but I think today's show was really good man.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I enjoyed the conversation. Yeah, it was a good conversation.
Speaker 1:It was a good, wholesome conversation about why our rights are so important and why, I think again, the moral high ground is to support firearms, and I hope that more people will see it in that way and see it from that light.
Speaker 2:That's my goal with a lot of this content is to get people on the right track to thinking about it in the way, getting their mindset where it needs to be. I mean, if we could do that and don't think of it as like I'm just a gun owner, but also become a steward, a shepherd of the Second Amendment, go, take that extra step.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I mean, get people involved, even if it's not politically. Take someone out to the range, give them some exposure to it, you know, maybe train someone, give them a little bit of time to you know. See that that is not a bad thing, it's just completely normal. Yep, I think that there are a lot of gains being made, as much as it's easy to have a very negative opinion about how all this stuff has been handled over the years and how things politically have been going in terms of laws and things of that nature. I think we are gaining ground both culturally and legally. On the legal front, I mean, we've had some good Supreme Court cases.
Speaker 2:So you know, we'll see. Yeah, Now it's just the states.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, I think the outlook is pretty good, so we'll see. We're going to keep the pressure up. Anything else to add, matt, before we head on today?
Speaker 2:No man, that was a great conversation. I enjoyed it. You know, it's always fun when we get to talk about guns.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, absolutely. Look, y'all, we post every Monday at 9 am Eastern Standard Time, if I remember to upload the show, usually I do. Okay, I'd say there's probably about a realistically, I'd say probably about a 70% chance that the show is going to be there at nine o'clock on Monday. But 70%, I'd say 70%, it's about a solid 70%. Anyway, we typically post the show 9 am Monday, 9 am Monday sharp Eastern Standard Time. If you want to see our ugly mugs on YouTube, it's over on the YouTube channel IRAC Veteran 8888.
Speaker 1:Lots of content also, since today's show is about guns, if you want to learn about guns, I have gosh 1,600 videos about guns, so plenty of stuff for you to go through and learn. If you want to learn more about firearms Also, you can follow us and download the show everywhere. All of your favorite podcasts come from Spotify, stitcher, apple Podcasts, etc. Make sure you leave us a good review so that we can show up further in the search results. It does help our show get more traction and we appreciate all the folks who have supported us in our endeavors and, of course, all our sponsors who have supported the show, and we're always looking to do bigger and better things.
Speaker 1:I do want to do some more flights. Those do require a little bit more, let's just say, involved preparation. But you guys might recall our flight or fight series Kind of made me think about that today we talked about it. So we do flights of different things, different food and alcohol and things of that nature which I don't drink anymore. But maybe we'll do some, uh, more hot peppers or some hot sauces. That's always fun, you know.
Speaker 1:Maybe we'll do some uh so let me know what's your favorite crazy hot sauce. Uh, maybe we'll get some jars of hot sauce and do a taste test. Be kind everybody, I want the hottest ones, but not necessarily the hottest ones, the best ones. What hot sauces do you like?
Speaker 2:There's always the Last Dab. It's a pretty popular one. What are?
Speaker 1:your favorite hot sauces, let us know down below and we will put together a flight and we'll do another hot sauce flight. That'd be fun.
Speaker 2:Okay Under duress. Yeah, turn my ear and force another hot sauce flight. That'd be fun. Okay, all right Under duress.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah, turn, turn, turn my ear enforcement. All right, y'all have a great week. Thanks so much for tuning in. We appreciate it. We'll see you soon. Bye everybody. Thanks for listening to Life, liberty and Pursuit. If you enjoyed the show, be sure to subscribe on Apple Podcasts, spotify and anywhere else podcasts are found. Be sure to leave us a five-star review. We'd really appreciate that you can support us over on Ballistic Inc by picking yourself up some merch and remember, guys, dangerous freedom. Have a good one.