For the Love of Goats

Cache Valley Virus: One Breeder's Experience

May 11, 2022 Deborah Niemann Episode 72
For the Love of Goats
Cache Valley Virus: One Breeder's Experience
Show Notes Transcript

Until recently, most goat breeders had never heard of Cache Valley Virus. I heard about it two years ago when an animal scientist told me that they were having a horrible time with it in their research flock.

Today's guest had never heard about Cache Valley Virus until a few months ago when she started seeing a lot of very weird things happening in her goat herd — a doe freshening with no milk, kids born with birth defects, kids dying within the first couple of weeks after birth, a tiny 2-pound LaMancha kid, an amorphus globosus, and more.

Cache Valley Virus is spread by carrier mosquitoes that bite a doe or ewe in the second month of pregnancy. In this episode we are talking to Briana Desfosses of Fox Pride Dairy Goats in New Hampshire about her experience when Cache Valley Fever struck her herd this past kidding season.

See full show notes here >>  https://thriftyhomesteader.com/cache-valley-virus/

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Introduction  0:03  
For the love of goats! We are talking about everything goat. Whether you're a goat owner, a breeder, or just a fan of these wonderful creatures, we've got you covered. And now, here is Deborah Niemann.

Deborah Niemann  0:16  
Hello, everyone, and welcome to today's episode. This is going to be a really interesting episode—and don't freak out. Because I'm telling you, it can be really easy to freak out about what we're going to share with you today. But, be sure to listen to the whole thing. Listen carefully, because we're talking about Cache Valley virus, which causes Cache Valley fever. And we're going to talk about one breeder's experience with this infection that can cause a lot of problems with birthing and deformed kids and things like that. Things that none of us ever want to have in our herds. So today, we are talking to Bri Desfosses, owner of Fox's Pride Dairy Goats in New Hampshire. Welcome to the show today, Bri.

Briana Desfosses  0:26  
Oh, thank you. Definitely the first time I've ever done anything like this, but it's fun!

Deborah Niemann  1:10  
Yeah! I promise it will be completely painless. It's just like a couple of friends—a couple of goat-loving friends—having a chat about what we love most. 

Deborah Niemann  1:20  
So, I saw your story on Facebook and thought, "Wow, I need to talk to this person," because you had quite an ordeal this year with your kidding season. So, why don't we just start at the beginning? Tell us, how did your kidding season start? Or actually, even, I guess it started during your breeding season, right?

Briana Desfosses  1:42  
So, we were planning on breeding a lot more does this year, because I wanted to prove out a bunch of my bucks. So, we were actually gonna have twenty-one first fresheners—which, I usually average about eight. And I figured, "Well, if I'm going to survive this on my own, I am going to start kidding really early in November." So we did CIDRs, and we did the, you know, whole hormone protocol. Which is not something we typically even do, but, you know, in order to get them to cycle out of season, that's what we needed to do. And it was an unusually wet, hot, humid summer for us up here in the Northeast. We had a hard time even getting into our hay fields to cut hay, it was just so wet. But, you know, being in the Northeast, there are certain things that we just don't... I'd never even heard of Cache Valley virus. And so, it was not even on my radar. 

Briana Desfosses  2:32  
I had a doe kid the end of November, you know, no problem. I had a bunch of does bred that were due in January. And I guess the first thing that kind of tipped me off that something might be happening was that we had several does that were ultrasounded as having, you know, viable embryos, and then they reabsorbed. You know, one here or there every couple of years is one thing, but certainly when you start having a handful of them, you start questioning what could be going on, because it's not a common thing for us. You know, we've been doing this since 1968. So, I'm the third generation; I've seen a lot, but to see quite a few does reabsorb was was different. But, you know, things happen, and we eventually did get them bred. But the real tipping point for us actually was the first week in December, I had two does due. I had an older doe—an eight-year-old—due. She's kidded before, huge kids, no problem. She went four days over and didn't really come in with much milk. She had a single doe that presented normal, but I could not get her out. I did finally get her out after about an hour and a half, but even to this day, I'm stumped why I couldn't get her out. She should have just slid right out. The second doe was actually a first freshener; she kidded four days later. And she took me by surprise, because she didn't bag up at all. And I'm not saying, like, you know, made an udder but didn't really make any milk. I mean, she had no udder at all. This is a doe whose father has been on the elite list the last three times for daughter's production. Her mother's a champion and a 91. You know, milk is definitely something that's behind her background. And my grandmother, Mary Fox, has done this for 54 years, and she said she's never seen it before. Talked to my vet, talked to multiple people—nobody had any idea, you know, what in the world... Why this doe literally had no milk. I mean, two squirts in each teat, no udder, nothing. 

Briana Desfosses  4:20  
Sort of fast-track to about mid-January: I saw Tufts put out a flyer just sort of warning the people in the Northeast about what Cache Valley virus even was. It's not something—like I said—that any of us had ever even heard of, because it hadn't really been documented too far east of New York at that point. I spoke to my vet, who actually is the assistant state vet for New Hampshire, and he used to work in Pennsylvania and was very well aware of it, but it wasn't even on his radar as a possibility. He still wanted to discuss things like chlamydia and toxoplasmosis and things like that that are much more common. You know, in his mind, CVV was not even a possibility. We sort of agreed that we would wait and see how the first round of does went the beginning of February for me, and then kind of revisit it. Meanwhile, that single doe kid that I had had born out of the eight year old, we ended up losing her about five weeks in. She was born with a lazy eye—which I had never seen—and clearly had some sort of, like, congenital brain deformity. Really bizarre. Never really thrived. I mean, she grew, but she was different, if you know what I mean. 

Briana Desfosses  5:32  
So, first round of does. We had a break until the beginning of February. And the beginning of February hit, and it was like... It was like a warzone here, is really all I can describe it. We had a big wave of does due, and I felt like there was just problem after problem. They were so unthrifty. I lost multiple kids to all different kinds of issues. And we just don't lose kids. You know, we've done this for so long. You know, you might lose one here or there, but I think I buried six kids in the first couple of weeks of our kidding season, and it's just unheard of. You know, for us and from what I've read, we actually still had it pretty good. We didn't lose any grown does; we didn't have any major issues with their actual deliveries. But we had a lot of weird things. You know, I lost a lot of kids. I had does that just didn't really come into good milk. And, you know, I guess what I found interesting was that every doe presented a little different. Every kid presented a little different. 

Briana Desfosses  6:31  
And so, you know, I finally talked my vet into testing for CVV. And what do you know? Seven of our ten samples came back as positive. And those are does that either reabsorbed, or had kids with issues, or had kind of weird deliveries, you know, or mummified kids, or things like that. And so, I guess through the whole thing, what was the most odd to me was that no animal reacted to the virus the same way. And so, if I hadn't seen the flyer about CVV and even known it could be a possibility, I would have never gone there as my possibility of what could be causing it.

Briana Desfosses  6:31  
Yeah, exactly. That is so strange. Was there anything in particular that caused you to suddenly say, "Let's do the test for CVV?"

Briana Desfosses  7:17  
So, I would say definitely the first tip-off that just didn't make any sense to me—because I mean, we all have bad kidding years. It happens. When you've done this as long as we have, you know, I can go back and tell you exactly what years were really rough where we saw, you know, things, and it happens when you're kidding out that many does. But the thing that tipped me off was the doe that didn't make any milk. You know, that to me... Just, there was no explanation for that. I was down at the barn, milking her four times a day, trying to encourage anything to come in, and I mean, literally, she had two teats; there was no udder there. This is from high-production Nubian lines. Like, it just didn't make any sense to me. And so, when I saw the flyer from Tufts, the first thing I did was a Google search. And the first link that came up on that Google search was a study that Cornell did—just recently, within the last couple years. And as I'm reading it, the very first paragraph, it discusses a flock that had had no issues prior, and in one season had multiple ewes lamb with one single, small lamb, and come into no milk or have any udder development. And when I saw that, honestly, all the light bulbs went off. And I actually felt a little bit better and not so frustrated, because that, to me, was the first thing that I had seen in all the research that I had done up to that point, trying to figure out why this doe hadn't even freshened with an udder, you know, it finally made sense. 

Briana Desfosses  8:42  
And so, that was kind of the push point where I, you know, I sent that study to my vet. We took that information along with, you know, the flyers that we had seen, and then I read up on a couple other sources, and he was like, "All right, let's do it. Let's see if this is really the case." And at that point, he figured I was probably on to something, maybe had a couple, but I gotta tell you, he was just flabbergasted when we had seven of the ten samples come back as positive. He just could not believe that it was this far east. I mean, we're in southern New Hampshire; it gets cold pretty fast here, but we were trick-or-treating in T-shirts last year. So, it's so out of our ordinary for our environment to be that warm. We're usually breeding does when the mosquitoes are gone, you know, so it makes sense why we've never really seen an issue—and we live on wetlands. We have a pond; it's pretty wet here. So, we definitely have a mosquito issue. 

Briana Desfosses  8:53  
You know, so it was definitely the doe that had no milk that tipped me off that something was up that was different, because I've never seen anything that says, you know, chlamydia or toxoplasmosis or anything like that—Q fever—can cause no milk. That was sort of that one outlier that, you know, didn't make sense to me. And I know multiple herds locally who are show herds with high production does who now have tested their does and have positives, and it's the same thing. That was the tip-off for them, was no milk out of these does that might be champions or, you know, previously high-producing animals. So, that is definitely the point where I was like, "Something really weird is up."

Deborah Niemann  10:15  
Yeah. Yeah, because I think with toxoplasmosis, and most of those things that cause abortion storms, it's just really the fact that does are giving birth early, or to kids that can't survive, and stuff like that. I don't think I've ever heard anybody say that their milk doesn't come in.

Briana Desfosses  10:32  
Yep. Of course, what do you do when you have something weird happen? You go online and you start searching Facebook groups and, you know, things, and I'm one of those people that tends to not post on, like, the different goat health pages. Like, "Help! What do you think about this?" Because I feel like you get everybody's opinion that might not be necessarily valid. 

Deborah Niemann  10:52  
Right.

Briana Desfosses  10:53  
So, I just did a bunch of searches, and you start searching through and, you know, everything I read said, "Oh, it'll come in. Oh, it'll come in. It'll come in eventually." Which, you know, we've done this long enough. I know that there are does that sometimes take longer to come into their milk. That's perfectly acceptable. I'm okay with a doe who's a little slow to start. But I mean, this doe had no milk. She didn't even have an udder. It looked like she was still a dry yearling. If I hadn't known that she was due to kid and hadn't, you know, found the kid at her side, I would have never guessed that she had kidded. She just literally looked like a dry yearling still.

Deborah Niemann  11:29  
Wow! Yeah, that is really crazy. 

Deborah Niemann  11:32  
So, one of the reasons that Bri is talking about wet, warm, hot summer and mosquitoes is because the way that goats get infected with Cache Valley virus is through a mosquito bite. So, for example, we had a kid that was born—it was a schistosomas—a month or two ago, and people were like, "Are you sure this isn't Cache Valley virus?" And for us, the timing on it really just wasn't right, because the doe has to be in her second month of pregnancy when she gets bitten by a mosquito, and that's when infection can happen. It doesn't happen in the first month. It doesn't happen in the third, fourth, or fifth month. And so, that's why it basically kind of ran its course. Like, so in your case, all of the does that were in that second month of pregnancy when mosquitoes were still bad, after they had kidded, then you still had more does left to kid and everything just went back to normal?

Briana Desfosses  12:27  
Yep. It was really very bizarre. We had that big wave of does that were due the beginning of February. I had a doe who, at this point, we suspect was probably another positive, but we didn't actually draw her, that kidded mid-February and needed a C-section—which we've not ever had to do, you know, in all the years we've done this—that had ringwomb. Which I, again, had heard of but had never seen. And it was like, all of a sudden, magically, after that, everything was smooth sailing. Everybody from then on came in with good milk, they had normal deliveries, their kids were thrifty, you know. And, especially in that first round of does that kidded, I was like, "What is up with these kids?" They're not thrifty. They took so much work to get them going. You know, we had a kid that had basically, like, a mesoesophageal issue where, you know, if you'd feed him, the milk would pour out of his nose even though he didn't have a cleft. And we had kids that just kind of failure to thrive, but then their litter mates will be perfect. 

Briana Desfosses  13:26  
And that's the other bizarre thing about it, is that not all the fetuses necessarily are affected. You know, and that was, like, the craziest thing to go through, because at the time I was questioning, "What did I do different this year? What did I do management-wise that these kids are not strong and vigorous and healthy?" You know, we pull them at birth; we bottle-feed them. They're actually in the house for the first couple days, even. And I had kids in my house for two weeks that just needed so much work. And so, at the time, I remember just being so frustrated, because I was like, "What did we do different that has caused all this? And how am I going to get through the rest of the season?" And then, like you said, magically, all of a sudden, things were smooth sailing, and there were no more issues, and kids were, you know, healthy and vigorous. And it was just really bizarre. It was a really bizarre experience to go through. 

Briana Desfosses  14:17  
And, you know, even at that time my vet was like, "Are you sure you want to test? I think we can probably chalk it up to CVV." But for me, I needed to know. I needed to know it wasn't something that I had done wrong. And honestly, getting those results was sort of like a breath of fresh air. And going forward, we're going to kind of change some of the ways that we do things in our breeding schedule. But yeah, it definitely was a wild ride, and having never heard of it before, I felt very blindsided as as a producer. But, you know, at this point, we learned a lot, and we're getting through the worst of it.

Deborah Niemann  14:53  
Yeah, exactly. So, Tufts University, as you mentioned, has a really great handout to this. And we will share that in the show notes so people can have that to refer to. But what you see, the symptoms of this are just really crazy. So, like, as you mentioned, you had some does that lost pregnancies. Like, you knew they were pregnant, because you had ultrasounds that showed them pregnant, and then they weren't. Abortions, dystocia.... So, but you said in your case, you really didn't have any—well, you had the one dystocia—

Briana Desfosses  15:24  
Yep.

Deborah Niemann  15:24  
—with the eight year old.

Briana Desfosses  15:26  
Yeah, we had only one case. And that's the other thing, too, with CVV is usually the kids are... I guess the deformity that you see the most is limb deformities, or deformities of the spine, where they've got major scoliosis. And we didn't have any of that. You know, and it was almost, like, partway through that wave of kids, at one point somebody had said to me, "Do you think that this is the CVV?" And I was like, "No, it's not weird enough." You know, so that's, like, the most common thing that when you see flyers and stuff, these kids have, like, you know, legs that resemble like corkscrews, and they're all, you know, deformed. And, you know, we had one mummified kid, and then otherwise any deformities, any kids that I lost were to things that you couldn't even visually see, you know, which was kind of bizarre. But that's the crazy thing, is that the symptoms are so widespread. You know, but otherwise, all these does—except for the one case of the older doe—they all kidded very smoothly. And that was another reason why at first, I questioned whether it really could be it, because a lot of the does that came back positive had extremely easy deliveries; it was only the kids that tipped me off that something could be off.

Deborah Niemann  16:39  
Yeah. So, in case people are wondering, there is no vaccine for CVV. And really, the only thing you can do to prevent it is to plan your breeding so that your goats are not in the second month of pregnancy when you still have a lot of mosquitoes flying around.

Briana Desfosses  16:57  
Yep. And that is our plan going forward. You know, I'm curious to see how our summer is going to be up here. The summers have been kind of all over the place the last several years, but we were still so, like, humid and warm and wet in the fall, we just would have never in a million years thought that that would have been an issue. You know, and we are curious; we've been told and everything that we've read says that once they've had it once, they cannot be affected by it again. So, right now our sort of plan is that the does that we know are positive will be the earliest does that are bred. And then we'll kind of go from there going forward. 

Briana Desfosses  17:32  
You know, the hard thing is that these does, when they're tested, they're tested for titers. So, it's only going to tell us if they've had it at some point; there's no way of pinpointing which pregnancy of what year it actually affected them. Now, in our case, obviously, we've never seen this before. We had an odd fall. So, we can pinpoint that it was this current pregnancy that they just went through. But you know, that's kind of the hard thing even about testing is, unless you know for a fact it was the pregnancy that they're in now, it's hard to say which pregnancy it affected them. You know, so it's kind of strange. And we're a little nervous going forward to see if that does in fact hold true. And we're hoping it holds true. But, we'll kind of see where it goes. 

Briana Desfosses  18:17  
But yeah, no vaccine. And, you know, some people were asking if they should be testing their herd prior to kidding. And really, the only thing that that's going to do for you is at least just prepare you. Otherwise, there's nothing you can do about it. And you know, and for us, the reason why we even put out our posts on Facebook and detailed each instance that we had was mainly because their symptoms are so widespread. But also, because people in our area have never heard of it. You know, so we decided to put ourselves out there. We called all the local livestock vets, because I had already been told by multiple producers in the area that their vets were not wanting to test, because they didn't feel it could be possible it was in our area. You know, so once we got those legit positive results, we made lots of phone calls, and we put that post together, because more than anything we just wanted people to realize that it is possible—and also to not get scared or frustrated. You know, I know some people who said, you know, "This is it. I'm not doing this again after this year, because it was so hard to go through." And so, our sort of take home message on all of it was, "Don't let it get you super frustrated. It's awful to deal with. But there's a reason for it. At least we know what it is, and going forward, we can kind of make some adjustments."

Deborah Niemann  19:30  
Yeah. And I think it is really good news that they should be immune to it once they've had it. And, you know, the timing on that really works, because like you said, the goats that tested positive are going to be the first ones that you breed this year, so that if anybody could be bitten by a mosquito in the second month, it's going to be goats that should have that immunity already. And then, obviously, goats that are going to be first fresheners next year don't have that immunity, and that's fine. You know, that's nice. You breed your youngest ones a little later anyway, give them a couple more months to grow, so that seems like it actually could work out really nicely for you.

Briana Desfosses  20:06  
Yeah, we're hoping so. We've tossed around doing some more blood testing in the fall, just to see where we are at. You know, it is a test that is not currently direct to farmers. So, you have to have a vet at least, you know, fill out your paperwork and assist you in the process. We did draw the blood ourselves, and we overnighted it to Cornell. And it's not a super expensive test. But certainly, you know, especially in this day and age, everything costs more money. So that decision we'll probably make in the fall in exactly, you know, planning out our breedings. Generally speaking, I usually do breed my youngest does later. And usually, it's my older does that I'm attempting to do artificial insemination with will be the first does that get bred. You know, so we'll kind of play that by ear and go forward. But yeah, that's sort of our game plan at this point.

Deborah Niemann  20:06  
Yeah, that sounds like that could definitely work. So, if someone had some weird kiddings, you know, a couple months ago, and they do the math, and they realize like, "Ooh, yeah, that goat could have been in her second month of pregnancy and gotten CVV," they can still get that goat tested. And, if she comes back positive, then you know she should be immune, and you don't need to worry about her again.

Briana Desfosses  21:23  
Yep, exactly. And I know some some producers in the area have opted to not test, and they're just assuming what they saw was CVV. I guess my takeaway on that is that, for me, it was good to know it wasn't anything that I was doing. If you're experiencing things like, you know, does giving birth preterm or anything like that, there are a lot of other things out there that can cause these issues, too. And for me, I would want to know for sure that it's not one of those other things. You know, I know of a herd specifically who assumed what they were experiencing was CVV, and finally sent in a fetus for a necropsy, and it turns out, it was actually chlamydia. So they've got a major issue that they're dealing with now, but if they hadn't actually tested for CVV, they wouldn't have known to look elsewhere. You know, so I guess my takeaway is, if you're seeing a lot of issues, I would still want to know. As a producer, it really helps you just feel better, too. But if there's an issue going on, you know how to handle it. 

Briana Desfosses  22:22  
But yeah, you know, if you had a rough spring, and you saw things that were were not typical, you can definitely still test even months later, which is the nice thing about testing for titers. What we did find in our test results was that the older does that clearly have just more antibodies and immunities over the years, their levels were far lower than the younger does who were maybe first fresheners—which was kind of interesting to see when we were going through our results. So, you know, just sort of note: If you have an older doe, and you wait an extended period of time, her numbers will probably be really low, but she should still test positive. They're not going to test positive generally for titers if they haven't actually had it. It's not necessarily an antibody. So.

Deborah Niemann  23:07  
Yeah, exactly. This is so good. And that's one of the things... You know, I get emails from people sometimes, and they're like, "My goat gave birth to a dead kid. Why was it dead?" And I always tell people, like, "You need to send it in for a necropsy." Like, you know, there's, like, dozens of reasons that a kid can be born dead. And, even as you've discussed here, there's so many reasons why kids can be born deformed, too, or, you know, some of these other things can happen. So, I know personally, as a goat breeder, like, I don't want to just go on Facebook and have thirty people telling me like, "Oh, it could be this or this or this." Like, I want the real answer. And that generally means you send it in for a necropsy, so that you can get your definitive answers, because you've got to have the diagnostic testing to know what's really going on.

Briana Desfosses  23:55  
Right. Well, and you know what? Things like that cost money, but I can't even tell you how much better I felt knowing what it was. I just... It was such a stressful spring. And, you know, I'm fortunate I have a lot of help, but there's still many parts of the day and in the middle of the nights that I'm kind of on my own. And I gotta tell you, there was definitely moments where I was ready to throw the towel in. It was just, it was hard. But to know the reason behind it, and then also to know that I didn't have to be treating my animals for something else that they could have been exposed to... You know, we do a lot of shows, and we do stud service, and we do other things that, you know, biosecurity is put at risk. You take those risks when you do those events, and just to know that we're doing everything right and that there wasn't anything more I could have done was just a relief, and it gives me sort of that kick in the pants to keep going. You know what I mean?

Deborah Niemann  24:51  
Exactly. Well, this has been such an interesting story, and I hope people have found it helpful. And, like I said at the beginning, don't get freaked out, because your goats can only get this during the second month of pregnancy if they get bitten by a mosquito that carries it. So, it's really almost like a needle in a haystack situation. And like, wow, you were really unlucky that the infected mosquitoes found your your goats during the second month of pregnancy.

Briana Desfosses  25:18  
Yeah. Yep, absolutely. And, you know, I had people that were shocked that we put out our posts. They were like, "People could look at that and judge your herd, or..." And I'm like, "It's not contagious." 

Deborah Niemann  25:28  
Yeah. 

Briana Desfosses  25:29  
We had bad luck. We had our animals bit by certain mosquitoes that were infected. We now know that it's an issue that we have to be aware of. We are sort of tossing around the idea of having a company come in and do a natural spray, depending on how this summer goes. But you know, I just felt like it was so important that people knew it was something that was going on. Otherwise, if somebody else hadn't shared it, I would have had no idea and would've just chalked it up to one of the hardest kidding seasons we've ever had.

Deborah Niemann  25:57  
Yeah, exactly. I know, I had never heard of it until two years ago. And I had a kid born with arthrogryposis, which is where the legs are bent and the joints are fused. 

Briana Desfosses  26:10  
Yep. 

Deborah Niemann  26:10  
Which can be a symptom of Cache Valley. And I had just started my podcast then, and I was talking to a researcher who said, "Oh, that sounds like Cache Valley." And she goes, "Have you been having problems with that?" And I'm like, "I've never even heard of that." And that was the very first time I had ever heard of it. And it was just that one kid. I had never actually seen that before or since, until we had the schistosomas—which, schistosomas just, as a rule, have arthrogryposis. But yeah, I had never heard of it until two years ago, when a researcher told me about it, you know, when I happened to be interviewing her on another topic for my podcast. Like, you know, it was, like, that before-podcasting chatter. And she is in Arkansas, and she said that they had actually had a really bad time with it the year before in their research flock of sheep. And theirs was the situation where you said, where, like, they just had tons of deformed kids that looked like, you know, your idea of like how somebody would draw a little monster sheep, because they were just so grossly deformed. But, like you said, they don't always look like that. 

Deborah Niemann  27:17  
One of the things that was interesting, too, on the Tufts thing is that if goats are infected early in their second month, they're more likely to abort. Whereas if they get infected later during that time period, they're more likely to produce the malformed kids and lambs. And I'm sure there's so many more little tiny nuances in terms of, you know, what causes what specific symptoms in the dam and also in the kids, because it's just a really long list of things you can see. 

Briana Desfosses  27:48  
Yeah. 

Deborah Niemann  27:49  
Is there anything else that you think people should know about this? 

Briana Desfosses  27:54  
Um, no, I think we touched pretty much everything. You know, it is. It's such a bizarre sort of thing. I know from sort of talking to people, it sounds like it's very localized, where if one herd ends up with, you know, a bunch of positives—or flock—that it's pretty common to have a bunch of others in the area pop off. Which stands to reason. You know, but no, I think we pretty much covered everything. 

Briana Desfosses  28:17  
You know, like you said, it's very wide-ranging, sort of what we experienced. You know, we usually are done kidding by now; I have does due in a month to a month and a half from now that all were CVV does that had reabsorbed. So, it's definitely been a wild ride. But we really felt like it was important that people knew that it is possible in areas like ours. And even having been doing this my entire life... Yeah, it's just something that we don't hear about in certain areas of the country. So, I'm just glad to kind of help get the word out so people have some understanding that what they were seeing this spring could be something that was totally out of our control.

Deborah Niemann  28:59  
Yeah, exactly. And just in case people have other livestock: As I mentioned, sheep can also be infected. But cattle and horses, although they can be infected and spread the virus if a mosquito bites them, they don't actually develop clinical symptoms. So, it's really just sheep and goats that wind up with the clinical symptoms and the problems that we've talked about. 

Deborah Niemann  29:24  
Thank you so much for joining us today, Bri! I'm sure this is definitely going to help a lot of people

Briana Desfosses  29:29  
Not a problem at all. And I'm just glad to get the word out.

Deborah Niemann  29:33  
And that's it for today's show. If you haven't already done so, be sure to hit the "subscribe" button so that you don't miss any episodes. To see show notes, you can always visit ForTheLoveOfGoats.com, and you can follow us on Facebook at Facebook.com/LoveGoatsPodcast. See you again next time. Bye for now!

Transcribed by https://otter.ai