Within Arm's Reach: Discussing affordable assistive technology with Symbionic’s co-founder, Rishi Krishna

After losing a limb to an unfortunate accident, Rishi Krishna came to the realization that his life had now forever changed. But providence proved potent, because when he was faced with a bank-breaking choice of functional prosthetics, his innate problem-solving acumen came through. Rather than settle for one “less-than”, Rishi 3D printed his own bionic arm - one that was 30 times cheaper and more functional than the imported ones! 

Tune in as we unravel Rishi Krishna’s inspiring journey of founding Symbionic - a startup that manufactures affordable prosthesis and bionics!

Transcript

Go-Beyond Podcast – Rishi Krishna Transcript

 Speakers:

AK : Akshay Kapur

RK : Rishi Krishna 

AK: Welcome to the Sony Pictures Networks Go-Beyond podcast where we go beyond the surface and uncover the extraordinary, I'm your host Akshay Kapur. 

In a world where information is accessible with the twitch of a fingertip. It's easy for us to find answers to almost any question in most avenues of life there's always someone who's been there and done that. Always another person's advice to follow or another individual's mistakes to learn from. In this world it takes a special kind of courage and determination to change a system that has long been accepted as par excellence that is exactly the brand of courage and determination showcased by today's guest Rishi Krishna. 

After losing a limb to an unfortunate accident, Rishi was faced with a bank-breaking selection of prosthetic limbs none of which would support his daily lifestyle, yet Rishi chose to be and proved to be quite the Alchemist. He morphed the circumstance around to manufacture his own bionic arm. One with greater utility and at a fraction of a cost. Today, his startup Symbionic manufactures prosthetic limbs that are nearly 30 times cheaper and more functional than the ones currently being imported in India. Without further ado…let's hear from the man himself. 

Rishi, welcome to the Go-Beyond podcast and we're excited to have you on the show. How are you feeling today?

RK: 

Hey Akshay, I'm feeling really good. Um I love the way you put it - alchemist.        

AK: 

Haha yes and I'm sure you know exactly why I've put it that way. (Laughs) I must ask you know Rishi we know a little bit about your startup and we know that the mission of Symbionic is to help people regain Independence by building affordable and functional bionics. Have you always been a strong-willed problem solver, and have you always been inclined to the tech industry? How did this sort of journey begin for you?            

RK: 

I mean yes, I've been tech inclined. But I'm not an engineer I think that should be the first um information to give. But The first question that you asked have you always been a problem solver. Yes, I have and most of those problems would be something of my own creation. So, there was no other way around that.

AK: (Laughs)

RK:

So my background comes from design, visual communication, photography and, and post my schooling, I did a visual communication degree in Chennai, and I worked as an assistant director for some time and then I worked in a nonprofit for some time I had a startup called Tungsten, where we worked with other startups and we built their technology. So, that is when actually um.. we got into tech.

AK: 

Very cool… What about design and photography drew you to that industry or what made you passionate about that ?                                                                                                                           

RK: 

So my father was an insurance surveyor. So, what he did basically was he would go to these car accident sites and take pictures of them. and most of these times I would accompany him and I would have the responsibility of taking the pictures. and these were those old cameras with rolls in it and so the the entire idea behind how photography is done and then waiting for the reels to be developed into photos and then seeing it was like super exciting to me. I think I've always been creative in that aspect I also had a lot of you know inspiration from the things I watch animes and stuff like that. 

AK:

Right. How from there did you end up..you know with your own startup in the design space you know can you tell us a little bit about the events that that fill the gaps in there?                                                                                                                                                                                                 

RK: 

so I think I have been a bad student in the general terms 

AK:

Yeah 

RK:

In fact, I've failed a lot of my subjects and I think um very recently we uncovered that I had ADHD um which is Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder and teachers would often term that as being naughty. Um and Obviously, you agree with the teacher, right? So, I would do tons of other things outside of you know studying and I got a lot of complaints for that. I mean my parents did, I didn't.                                                                      

AK:  

(Laughs) yeah  

RK: 

I mean marks was the least of their concern man at that point, they would just be scared what next complain is going to come. What has this guy done? Um and my first experience with entrepreneurship was when I kind of had this idea to crowdfund money and you know have enough funds to buy samosas and lemon juice from canteen for an entire month.

AK: 

Wow!

AK: 

(laughs) Ah so how did you crowdfund because these crowdfunding platforms were never available at that point.  

RK: 

Yeah, so what basically I did was I had this whole bunch of very excited kids who were um high on Pokémon cards and Pokémon in general.            

AK: 

Ah yeah. Um.                                                                           

RK: 

So we had my me and my brother would collect all these Pokémon cards and then.

AK: 

Yeah, I think I still have my collection buried somewhere in the cupboard.                                                                                                                                

RK: 

Essentially what I did was, I took one of these cards and then I will start drawing it on a A-4 sheet and then I will xerox it and I said whoever wants it can pay for it, 2 rupees each. and 2 rupees was affordable for kids, so they just bought it and I made like you know um 1.5 rupees per Xerox. so that was ah that was my initiation into entrepreneurship where the idea was that I had a problem like my funds for canteen was limited and I wanted more funds. Basically, so that's where I begin.                                                                                                              

AK:

That's quite inspiring because your even though it's a simple problem you were finding solutions at such a young age But. I got to ask you when did visual communication and design come into play?

RK: 

You know when I was just finishing my twelfth my brother actually told me that something like visual communication exists and in my twelfth me and a few friends of mine actually participated in a short film competition in a rival school, and we actually won so…

AK: 

Fantastic!         

RK: 

and and the entire short film was made on a digital camera actually that was a Sony camera. (AK: Laughs)                   

RK: 

and the idea behind the short film I remember was in 2020 we wouldn't be using cash and this was' in 2010.   

AK: 

so foreshadowing to the maximum. 

RK: 

So, foreshadowing to the present, actually. Yeah so I mean ah and that has come true. Um so good for us.     

AK: 

True     

RK: 

And that's basically I kind of felt very happy when we won, and I was so excited about making movies and it basically gave me this ah confidence that probably this would be a place where I would have a lot of fun and also you know make a career out of. And when I finished my school um I applied for a few colleges, and I got in DG Vaishnav and Obviously, the college itself the experience in college was not what I expected but then I um I mean in college you have more freedom. 

AK: 

What did you do with that freedom?

RK: 

Umm I had a 4 per cent attendance in the last semester, so you can guess.                                                                                                                                      

AK: 

Ah ah okay that's what we're talking about, just clarifying. 

(Both Laugh)

Okay so Rishi you talked about you you were working with NGOs. So can you tell us a little bit about the, the NGOs you worked with you know post college, your career and the sort of trajectory leading up to the moment that changed your life.                                                                                                                

RK: 

I mean nonprofit or working or volunteering these things have always been very interesting to me I mean all of us feel good when you volunteer right?                       

AK: 

Right.

RK:

But then during my last year of college, Chennai was facing these severe floods like a lot of parts of Chennai were super affected, they were not able to get their daily rations and stuff like that and my friend Vignesh, he told me “do you want to go and check out any of these nonprofits who need volunteers.” and, we just took our bikes and we left and that's literally how my career began. So starting from um organizing all the donations we got to going and delivering it in remote remote places like villages. Or like you know we even swam through a good few places which was deep enough to my nose so these were like all the sort of very exciting experiences and then I could not come out of that mindset. Okay this is something I want to do. So I I be with me and I'm still you know. In touch with them I still volunteer my time and literally went and worked for them for 3 years 

post my college 

AK: 

I think it's really amazing. you seem to be motivated to always create an impact.                                                                                                                                                                    

RK: 

Yeah, that's that's pretty true. I mean I think how my action can make a direct impact on someone's life is something that keeps motivating me at all times.                              

AK: 

No that's lovely I'm going to now ask you of course about the obvious question. Can you tell us about the accident that changed your life?  And can you also maybe highlight a few of the ways in which your life changed? 

RK:

Sure, so.  Umm I was traveling with a fellow volunteer, And we were in a bus. So, the bus was slightly speeding and there was another vehicle that came from the side and it was trying to overtake the bus. Unfortunately, the guy didn't succeed in overtaking, instead the vehicle slipped a little or something and it came and hit the bus exactly where I was sitting. 

AK :

Oh no. 

RK :

For less than a second and because it happened so fast none of us know exactly what happened, but then what we have sort of assumed is in that time the hook from this pickup truck. it came and locked onto my shoulder and pulled me so fast to the front that my hand was crushed in that action. and and that it just pulled and left so from my shoulder to the forearm part all of these parts were crushed. And it was pretty gruesome and I think most of my pitches I would just tell the point that I met with an accident, but if if I were to go deeper than that, ummn people with ADHD are very good during times of crisis so when I saw, okay this is not good, the first thing that came to my mind and I my friend here was kind of scared and obviously I was scared too, but then my flight or fight response came in kicking and then it said dude no one is going to help you. You have to live, so I asked my friend to give me a towel. RIP the towel and he and (AK laughs) I just wrapped it around my hand and the shoulder part and everything and my shoulder was kind of open. Like cut from my shoulder blade, so I had to pick it up and lock it again and then tie it up and then we called an ambulance. 

Very fortunately there was this one guy who was doing ambulance service for free in memory of his wife and he was pretty close by and we were able to get in touch with him and then I just walked to the ambulance and went to the hospital with this guy and when we reached the hospital by that time I actually came to this realization on my own that probably this hand might have to be amputated because I tested whether the hand works, the fingers worked and stuff like that and and in all my consciousness. I told my doctor that you might have to amputate it but do it fast because I really want to stop feeling the pain. So, can you do this? 

And unfortunately, the guy said you know bro chill, we have to ask your family, so we waited for my family to come to the hospital and by that time we kind of made the decision and the entire thing happened. 

AK:

No, I can imagine your whole life kind of unravels after a split-second change of destiny. 

RK :

Ah, I mean when I was in the hospital. I came to this realization right that things are not going to be the same ever and that I would either have to be, you know, drowned by this or figure out a way where I can just come up and come out and make sure I'm OK, right? And I think a lot of what I would do is just make dark jokes a lot. 

AK: (Laughs) Yeah, yeah. 

RK :

I mean that that would be my coping mechanism, but then what I would essentially do is like I tried getting used to writing with my left hand and then using my left hand for eating or so the majority of things that I had to get used to was..I'm a predominantly a right hander, so understanding and living with a single hand, which is not your dominant hand was a little bit difficult for the first few months. But then in two months I was able to do 95% of my daily activities myself and and and that is that is not to say for grit, but just that humans are born with this neuroplastic mind that once you set your mind to do something. The problem I will tell you is not the person itself, but the environment around us, things are designed by right-handed, able bodied men and that is a sad reality of how the world works, because in the perfect world I wouldn't have to create Symbionic in the first place. 

AK :

That's true, but I think humor, I think it's a fantastic trait and I can tell that you have a great sense of humor through this conversation. How did it help you build acceptance about your situation?

RK :

I mean, I would not suggest this method to anyone else first and foremost because it is not healthy. And I realized that very late. But then at that point, that was the only tool in my arsenal, so my mom would get furious. And then I had a few friends who would like you know, come up with these super cool ways to pick up chicks in bar like you know, hey, do you need a hand?  And then I would give my bionic arm to them, once I get one.

AK (Laughs)

RK:

so these were all like, you know things that we would do. I mean, just make the best out of what you have right. I mean, I still do make those dark jokes and humor not being a coping mechanism now, but more of a just as a fun thing. I remember a friend of mine who came to visit after my accident and she told me that this is all cool and fine, but “Do you have anyone you can sit and talk to like you know about what you're exactly feeling and how you're going to how you're trying to cope up with all of these things?” And that's actually when it hit me like you know. Ya – No. and actually that also led me to understand that I should probably actually go and talk to someone about all of this, and it was a very genuine moment of realization so I went and sought a therapist to sort of unravel all of these things and after that, yeah. 

AK:

Right. So, when..when did you first realize that you were looking for a prosthetic limb and how did that circumstance evolve? 

RK:

So, I I think so, in in when you're when you're in the hospital, a lot of doctors tell you a lot of things right.  I mean they do it with the best of their intentions. And then a few of them also told me there are options available for prosthetics and I should look for it. And my brother showed me some videos of prosthetics and these are all not like ones that are currently available, but these futuristic things in research and stuff like that and my expectations had already been so high from all the uh, references from anime and so.. I thought it would be that cool. And then when the reality hit and I went to, you know get prosthetic and I was so excited. I was like, I want this. I want that I want each finger to work like this and all of that stuff. And this guy was like, in charge of that prosthetic clinic, like listen, sit down. I know you are very excited, but this is not what is possible today, so you need to have your expectations managed 

AK :

Oh no!

RK :

that's where I felt so disappointed with the options that he showed me and and the price and that that basically gave me such a shock. And all the ones that he showed me was a muscle powered prosthetic that would basically be a piece of wood connected with a thread to your shoulder and you have to, you know, push your shoulder in the front to control open and close of the hand and these were also ridiculously heavy and uncomfortable that you wouldn't wear it for more than 10 minutes. And I'm the kind of guy that doesn't wear jeans because they are uncomfortable. 

AK (Laughs): 

Yeah, so how ridiculously expensive was it? 

RK:

The ones that was quoted to me, started anywhere between 12 lakhs to 30 lakhs uh 45 lakhs. and these were all told to be the most advanced prosthetics, but then why would I spend 15 lakhs or 30 lakhs on something that doesn't last more than four years? 

AK:

Right

RK : 

and this has been the same statement that almost all my users say - why would I spend so much money where I can buy a house, and some have in fact bought a house? 

AK :

And is that What motivated you and inspired you to make your own prosthetic? 

RK :

Yeah, as I've told you right, as a person I have always thought about solving problems and when the problem was my own, I obviously was very motivated. But then I could definitely not have done this myself. My best friend Niranjan, when the day he heard that I had an amputation, he immediately started looking out for how to 3D print prosthetics. 

AK:

Oh Wow. 

RK:

and we also did crowd funding to buy a prosthetic hand. And when I had, you know half of the amount. and I was like bro, what would we do like even if we raise 15 lakhs how are we to go and buy something like this? Morally, that is incorrect to do

AK:

I’m guessing this wasn't crowdfunding with selling Pokémon cards. Of course, this one must have been a more formalized way of crowdfunding. 

RK:

Honestly, my main job at Chudar was to raise funds and a lot of people who knew me who I've been networking with, they are the ones who also supported me during this journey, because even in the hospital the doctor came and told me bro. Who are you? Why are there 50 people outside the hospital? 

And I don't have the words to express how grateful I felt for all these people who had my back during these days and Niranjan and I started discussing and we kind of thought OK, why don't we instead of spending 15 lakhs we spend a little bit of that money and design and 3D print our own hand, you know. And there are already open-source technology available. Which we can use, and that's basically where it all began. and Niranjan is my co-founder now. (small pause needed here)

AK:

That's fantastic, so you, you crowdfunded with the intention of buying a prosthetic limb. But you ended up using the crowdfunding to 3D print what would essentially become the prototype of a business that you founded later correct? When did the idea of Symbionic come to mind? 

RK:

Before my accident I also had a startup called Tungsten where I was working with other startups. 

I would do their digital marketing. I would create their digital identities, brand and stuff like that and one of my clients from Tungsten. We were very close friends, and when I told them that this is something that we are trying to do, and we would need some help. And they said, you know what you guys are doing such an amazing job. Let me introduce with you to the incubator that we are a part of and they took me and Niranjan to this VIT Vellore. 

So we just got on a car and we left next morning and our prototype - it was like this 3D printed piece of crap like, wires and threads and stuff like that. It was so bad and out of some sheer stupid decision I also had my hair colored red for some reason. 

AK (Laughs)

I'm trying to figure out which anime character and maybe bleach inspired you to do that. But did it function? At least Did it serve your functions? 

RK :

Yeah, yeah it was working. We had it controlled through my muscles and stuff like that, but it was very rudimentary. It was far from what we wanted in the world out there, right? But during this process, the realization that we had that is essentially why we even thought about building this as a startup. And me an Niranjan we just sat down, we put an Excel, we put all the parts that are involved in a prosthetic hand and then put a price of it. Like you know in different vendors and stuff like that and then we saw that the total and what is available in the market is like there's no comparison behind between those, right? 

AK :

Right ?

RK :

So, there is no way something like this should be sold for 30 lakhs.. 

RK :

And because this is not a luxury good, this is an essential good. So we have real case studies where people have mentioned having a prosthetic limb or some sort of support would have helped them in their careers and most of them lose their jobs after losing their limbs. 

AK:

I gotta ask you, When it comes to, you know, taking this vision forward with Symbionic, it's critical obviously that you have to build a team that shares that same level of EQ and the same vision. So could you tell us a little bit about the Symbiotic team and how you put the organization together and the role each one plays in bringing your product and your vision to fruition?

RK:

So Akshay before that I would like to tell you that I've never been very good with interpersonal relationships, so. 

AK:

You're definitely pulling my leg. 

RK:

No, I I tell you that you know. I mean I, I would definitely be someone who networks a lot. But building a team is the most difficult part of any venture, and I realized that when I was building Symbionic because we still face that problem. But then the luck I had was I I I didn't start alone.  I had another friend who joined during this time. His name was Hari. And he was working at that point at Qualcomm. Like getting paid like a big fat cheque. But then he said you know what? Let me quit that and join you guys. And and these these things happen in movies, right? 

And I had a friend who introduced me to this, uh, electronics guy, Aditya. So this was the initial team, right? The four of us and none of us knew what the heck prosthetic is. And we started meeting with people who knew who knew their stuff right? and it took time the learning curve was not easy, but then I had these amazing group of people with me who were also invested in this idea. And we got a lot of interns from VIT and this is where I found our next gem, Tarun, and Tarun basically heads the product development cycle like you know the innovation taking care of um, hiring or interviewing so when he came he was this Introvert kid who would be you know, kind of scared to talk to new people. But now Tarun would be coming with me accompanying me to investor pitches and he would do such an amazing job. So, this this journey has not just been mine. So, that's what I'm trying to tell you it has been this whole group of people who have been working together learning and growing and this has happened through the platform Symbionic.

AK:

you say you're not great with interpersonal skills. But you're winning me over by the way of being so altruistic in sharing the credit of the journey with so many people who've been involved with you. 

Rishi I noticed that your WhatsApp display picture is Edward from full metal alchemist. So, I must confess as an anime fan I really enjoyed that. Um, you've mentioned that you often draw your creative inspiration from anime, from pop culture from science fiction. Can you tell us a little bit about how this inspires your designs and your innovations at Symbionic?

RK:

Yeah, definitely um, a lot of what we do in our you know careers and things is like inspired from what you're excited about in your childhood right? And my brother introduced me to anime when I was a kid, and I've been hooked ever since. I mean you know we started with Dragon Ball Z, Naruto and just kept going on and on. But a lot of inspiration Be it personal or like you perseverance or things like that you could always go watch animes to find these things right? if say for example, when I wanted to and figure out what kind of designs, I would want for my prosthetic hand and I said okay Anime Prosthetics Bionics Google search and you get all these you know inspiration and I I already knew I wanted something like full Metal Alchemist and that is the coolest hand ever and we would have all these posters of anime characters with prosthetics all over our office and it would be seriously cool and um, there’s also ‘The Game’ with Keanu Reeves I mean you could check that out that that would that was another awesome Prosthetic. So, these these inspirations did help us figure out the design part of things how it should look, feel. And more more than that I think what is important is the feel it gives that something cool is being built right? We want to build something so futuristic that that pushes the entire community at least 10 years ahead. You know, just say that. Okay, We are in the future that we wanted as children.

AK:

Right. So, you've talked about anime you've talked about um the support you've got from friends and family. You've talked about the inspirations that you've had. Empathizing with other people's journeys would you say there's been any one biggest source of inspiration for you to keep pushing forward and if so what is that?

RK:

I think that the inspiration part is exponential. The first thing that inspired me was my own mom. Uh she had polio when she was a kid so she has a bit of a disability in her lower limb so she can't walk well. And she has given that very gracefully all her life and um. And I think that's where all my inspiration to move forward comes from. 

And I think during this entire journey of Symbionic we've met so many people who lost their limbs, Um, our first user lost her limb very early in her childhood in an accident. And a lot of that was due to negligence of hospitals and doctors in that area like it could have been saved but it it wasn't. And I see zero regret or zero lack of motivation or inspiration in this girl who who wants to become an artist. She's she came out of her um village on her own and she's living in the city on her own and she's going and attending like you know college and finishing her degree in arts and now after college to keep herself afloat financially, she does wall paintings she's actually climbing stairs and painting the walls with the single hand and she tells me that she wants to act in movies and these are all things that you can't see these unless you actually meet these people right? and I think these are all the places where I draw my inspirations from. 

AK:

I think that's lovely, and I have to say that I think my biggest inspiration from our conversation today has been the humility with which you share your story. Is that something that has been a part of who you are throughout?

RK:

I mean yeah, I guess that part of me has been growing like you know, ah you grow as a person.  So, I think the way I could explain this is when grief strikes you It's something that you can't help you can't avoid grief, or you can't avoid pain. And trust me on that because the more you try to do that the more it would ruin things for you. So, what you can instead do is increase the size of the container as much as possible. So that part of that pain or grief that ball is not affecting your other parts of your life and I guess that is one of the reasons for like you know, being humble and just to add on that a lot of pop culture has glorified the jerk entrepreneur, but then being an entrepreneur is like being a parent and you need to um, understand yourself and be as aware as possible and that doesn't happen when you're a jerk to everyone.

AK:

Right. (Chuckles) as we wrap up this conversation Rishi, I wanted to ask you looking ahead looking into the future. What is your vision for Symbionic and the impact you wish to create for the community?

RK:

Yeah, I think our vision has and always will be a future where people have access to technology that can improve their lives. Because you know a lot of what we are building could have been done 10-20 years ago. You see so much advancement in your phone in your computers. And I've I've met a lot of entrepreneurs from this sector and our consensus is the same.

And our vision at Symbionic or my personal vision would be we want to make sure that every single person who are even you know god forbid loses a limb does not have to feel “okay my life is over”  that is not the question that somebody should ask.

AK:

right.

RK:

All they need to think about is what color prosthetic am I going to wear. And the future that we want to create is that where people think about disability. Um, more of a hindrance than loss of life. and no one would look at you with pity, but in awe oh wow that looks so cool! and that future really excites me and that does this like you know when I'm like feeling lazy or feeling demotivated, I would do these exercises with myself right. Where I would say okay, if she had a bionic arm would she feel more empowered to go and act in movies and this sort of scenarios keep weighing into my head and how would it look when he wears a prosthetics and he's like you know he's able to ride his bike and these are all the futures like it is not a single future but it's like a collective um like you know future for all of the people in this community and who you know and we can together change this reality for them.

AK:

I think that's inspirational note to end this conversation on. Rishi, thank you so much for taking the time to join us on the show and I must say I thoroughly enjoyed this conversation.

RK:

Yeah, I think it has been the same for me. Thank you so much Akshay. I mean you don't get a lot of opportunities to sit and rethink what you've done and the impact it is making. So yeah, thank you again for this.