Splash Considerations Ep. 30: An Ode to the Best (feat. Shayna Rubin)

On Episode 30 of Splash Considerations, Justice is joined by Shayna Rubin (@ShaynaRubin) of the San Francisco Chronicle to discuss Mike Krukow's decision to retire at the end of the season, the tragic passing of long-time Bay Area sports reporter Michael "Wags" Wagaman, the Giants' Wall of Fame Ceremony and the team's outlook for the rest of the season. 

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:27

Welcome to another episode of Splash Considerations. My name is Justice Delos Santos, San Francisco Giants B reporter for the Bay Area News Group, San Jose Mercury News, East Bay Times, whatever you want to call us, as long as you read, as long as you subscribe. And speaking of subscribe, subscribe to the YouTube channel, follow us on Apple, follow us on Spotify. A lot of things in this world cost a lot of money, but subscribing and following those things remain free 99 and just a moment of your time. And I'm joined once again by Shayna Rubin of the San Francisco Chronicle. Shayna, how we doing? Good. How are you? I'm here. I'm here. It was it was a long lead up to the the trade deadline after. I feel like I need like another week to recover from a seven-story day, but we're here.

SPEAKER_00 1:15

Seven story, that's right. Yeah. Feels like so long ago, and yet it wasn't.

SPEAKER_02 1:21

Yeah, it was it was a week ago exactly. The trades hadn't even been made a week ago exactly. That was one of the most tiring days I've had since joining this beat just this wild. It was like bam, bam, bam. Bam, bam, bam. But we're not here to talk about the trade deadline. We talked about that last week. If you're curious to hear uh me and Matthew Canower's thoughts on the deadline, go listen to the last week's episode. But uh this is gonna be a very different episode in tone compared to what we typically do. And Shane, this is gonna be a very emotional podcast for a lot of reasons, at least the first half of this. We'll get to just some Giants baseball in the latter half of this. But uh, as many of you who are listening know, maybe you've seen it on Twitter, maybe you've seen it on the news. Uh, obviously on Thursday, Mike Kruko announced he's gonna be retiring, and that was a lot, you know, for a lot of Giants fans in and of itself. But then for us personally, on Saturday, we get the news uh that Mike Waggeman, more affectionately known as Wags, uh, passed away 59, and then I think it was yesterday, uh Don Nelson uh passed away as well. Just one of the key fixtures of those We Believe warriors. So uh just a lot happening uh in the last four days. It's been a lot to process, a lot to take in. And Shane, I think the place that I want to start with, and I kind of want to focus more, you know, on Wags and Kruko uh with respect to the late Don Nelson. I'm sure you'll agree with this. They were very different in their personalities, but they were incredibly similar in just how funny they were, how they could light up a room, and just you know, they walk into a room and the room just automatically becomes better because of their presence.

SPEAKER_00 3:03

Yeah, it it feels like I mean, like it's endings in different ways. I mean, Kruko is um it's hard for me to this day, no matter how many years I cover baseball and the Giants, to separate uh my emotions towards Kruko as sort of a Bay Area kid and then my my uh relationship with Kruko as a reporter, because it's one of those things that when you hear his any announcer's voice out of the context in which you're used to hearing it, it's just it's almost jarring. Um but I one of the greatest pleasures I've had is getting to experience Mike Kruko um outside of my gro my uh understanding of him growing up listening to him. And I've since he announced his his retirement, um, I've texted him and and messaged him a couple of times to just say because I felt it was necessary almost just to say to add on to the sentiment that like I don't love baseball without you, and I you are the sound of my childhood, and you are the the narration of of a lot of everything that I've grew up on. And uh I can't I can say probably confidently the same for a lot of a lot of people that grew up here, and he uh he's he's heard that a ton, so I think he's just but he appreciates it. Um and that's but it's true. It's um it's one of those days that you fear forever that it's going to come, that he's going to announce his retirement. And uh we know for a long time, more than a decade, that his body was not keeping up with his mind um in terms of what he was able to. And I think that if you see him around the ballpark, especially the last couple of years and in his wheelchair, you think, oh, this guy is he's gonna do this forever. He's he's just so enthused and bright and um uh happy to to you you just got this feeling that he was he wasn't gonna stop ever. Um so when the news hit, it was just like, oh, that's reality. We we can dream up this dream that he was gonna keep going as long as possible. And then we didn't realize how long that actually was. So it's just it's it's hard to imagine a day where he's um it's hard to imagine next year when or whenever the lockout, whatever. It's hard to imagine him not being there um in the booth. So I'm sure he'll be around the ballpark though.

SPEAKER_02 5:33

Because that that guy can't stay away from the ballpark. Thank God. I mean, every time I see him, there's a baseball in his hand. Like I think if if you if you said if somebody said, Hey, we need a couple innings tonight, he would throw, I think he'd do the best of his ability to throw them. But you know, to to echo the point that you said, it's you know, I talked to Dwayne the day the news happened, and he said it's it's kind of like a meal you never want to end or a vacation you never want to end. Like it you know that eventually like the end is gonna come, but you know, both the combination of both of them, Kruok and Kype, they've just been they've been in our lives our entire life. Like it's there has never been a year in my existence, which kind of just speaks to I guess how young both of us are that that we don't know a Giants baseball without both of them. And to echo your point, you know, I've obviously had the privilege as well of talking to him in a non-broadcast capacity and just like hearing him him and Dwayne and John Miller as well. This is a quick aside, because I talked to John Miller as well the day of it happened, and we were just kind of talking after the recorders were over, and he was saying, like, yeah, I go I went to this gas station across the street and I grabbed some Celsius. I'm like, John, you're a Celsius guy? I did not know that. Just to like hear him like talking, like just it's the the vo it's he's not putting up a front. That's their voices, it's crazy. Yeah. Um, but got to talk to them uh when I did the MVP baseball 2005 story last year. I remember did doing a story leading up to them both being on uh the f up for the 4C Frick Award. I think it was the 2024 winter meetings, and uh you know, this point's been echoed so many times, but it was the way that both Krug and Kype just like they we kind of invited them into our living room into like this very you know it's a it's a safe space for a lot of us, and to you know, they they were the voice of because you know, and and baseball's the beautiful beauty of baseball is you don't necessarily have to like pay attention, like locked in, like it's a very good like just you can be doing stuff around the house voice and just like have them be the narrators of not just the baseball you're watching, but the life you're living more broadly. And so it's it's the one thing I do I am happy about is that you know I I'm reminded of this this one line by a rapper who unfortunately has kind of lost his mind in the last couple years. Um if you admire somebody, you should go ahead and tell them because people never get the flowers while they can still smell them. And it's gonna be a lot of flowers, it already has been, and it's gonna be a lot more over the last or the next couple weeks, and I can imagine just that final day at Oracle, September 27th. It's it's gonna be a lot. Like final games of the season are already a lot, but it's it's gonna be a lot. And I I think John Shea mentioned this in his story that you know Kruko grew up listening to Vin Scully. His final game was almost 10 years to would basically be 10 years to the day of when Kruko's last game is gonna be. So it's kind of a very poetic moment there that he gets to kind of go out in the same place where his own voice of childhood went out.

SPEAKER_00 8:34

Yeah, I might go full boomer and record all the last games or something like that just for preservation. I don't know. I don't know what I would do with those. I'm I don't know if I plan on like going back and listening to them just to like feel something, but I kind of just want to do that. I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 8:50

I mean, the beauty of the beauty of m modern technology is that if you go to YouTube, there's like a very specific way you can like punch in games. And like not just like because there's like the MLB Vault account and it's like, oh yeah, here's game five of the 2010 World Series. Like, no, if you want to watch like a game in June in 2009, there's like a very specific set of code that you can punch in. I think for the Giants, it's like SFN, and then you type in the other team, and then like you type in the date. So, like, if you want to watch like a uh I I don't know, uh who is the name of the dude that Madison Baumgarner like replaced in the rotation? What was his name? Why am I forgetting his name? Anyway, if you want to watch like a rookie Madison Baumgarner start with Kruko on the mic, like you can do that. There's like so much that's that's out there. And I think this is a this is a fun question to to lead you with. What is your favorite Krukoism? Because there's so many of them.

SPEAKER_00 9:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 9:47

There are so many. Or moment. It doesn't have to be like the the phrases. Like, is there a moment?

SPEAKER_00 9:54

Because there are all all the Krukoisms are just like when they happen, I'm like, yeah, that's good.

SPEAKER_02 9:58

Yeah, that runs.

SPEAKER_00 10:00

My favorite moment. Ooh.

SPEAKER_02 10:03

I mean, we talked about one earlier this year with the Bryce Eldridge walk-off grant.

SPEAKER_00 10:09

Yeah, drop trout. Yeah. That was like that's just like a piece de resistance for him.

SPEAKER_02 10:17

That is just like the like still can paint the corners, still gets still hitting 95.

SPEAKER_00 10:24

I don't know if like this counts because it's not one specific moment, but I love it when he makes fun of people. Because it's just like it's such an art to be able to poke fun at people without it feeling like mean spirited. And it's just like I feel like the way that he did it with in symphony with like the broadcast was very much sort of like pure entertainment where you're capturing the spirit of the I mean like you make fun of fans, but players sometimes a little bit, or mostly just like if you felt like you were you felt like you were part of the show or that it was more of like a production and and entertainment as opposed to just watching a baseball game. Like just the way that just the way that he um it was almost like an honor. It's like I wish that Kruka would make fun of me a little bit. I wish that I wish that I was in that that chair and you probably could have the way that I was feeding a hot dog, or yeah, or uh or that I he catches me yawning and he makes me sound like a like a you know a Tarzan or whatever it is.

SPEAKER_02 11:30

That's like a such a good one too, because again, it's not a specific moment, but like some of the sounds it would make, just like it's so good.

SPEAKER_00 11:38

And it cracks me up every time when he does that. Every time. It's so simple, but I crack it up every single time. And I think it like I've always felt like Kruok and Kyle, and I think it's a known thing. They just capture the the humor of the Bay Area too. Like there's sort of just a dryness and like a punchy sort of um sarcasm and everything that they do and say, and like their tone is always very not monotone, but it's so consistent um that the sarcasm really always hits for me. And the way that they poke fun always hits for me. And he was just such a such a genius at making everything, making the right moments funny while also sort of coming the other side and and hitting me with just this insane, astute analysis about the picture, about the umpires, about the things behind the game, behind the game, behind the game that like maybe none of us even noticed, but he just sort of like said it so casually without it feeling like he was reciting a piece of knowledge. Uh it's just it's just so genius. And I I I I hope that we all can appreciate like just how amazing that talent is that he has. And I know that's oversimplic, but it it really is amazing.

SPEAKER_02 12:52

Yeah, I so one of the things that's tough for us, it's hard to listen to the broadcast while covering a game just because there's like a about a 15-second delay, and like that could just it messes with my head. And as much as I want to listen to them, it's like it's just weird, like it's it's hard to process like 15 seconds behind. But I tuned in yesterday for you know just the I think it was the the top of the second inning, and he was talking about Troy Melton, and Troy Melton has like 12 major league starts under his belt, and he's just like, Yeah, Melton's like whip is like 0.9, and like when you can get it under that, like you're like especially if you're a starter, like you're dealing with like really elite territory, and just like the way that it's like this is a guy like Kruk does not have to like he's at a point where he could just add lip, like he does not have to do his homework on a on a rookie with 13 starts under his belt. But that was kind of his commitment to the game, and that was the one of the things that you know again, talking with John Miller a couple days, he said that he made the argument that Kruk is probably at the top of his game right now, and that's come that's very high praise coming from someone like John Miller that's been around him for so long. And you know, you mentioned you know just the interplay of Kruok and Kype, and again, one of the beautiful things that's been said that Kype has said is you know, how often do broadcasters not just get to say, like, that's a partner I work with really well, but that's my best friend. And that's one of those things like when you hear him say it, it's just like it hits here. And you know, you spoke to the you know Kruk being in a wheelchair for the last couple of years, uh just to provide additional context, people who may not know the the entirety of the reason why he has a wheelchair. He's had uh the body myositis, I think that's how it's pronounced since he revealed it in 2014. He had been dealing for it with it four years prior. And it was basically Kype who, you know, found a not found the way, but was willing to find a mechanism to get his lifelong friend, not lifelong, but you know, since you know, working with the Giants, like in the booth together. That's how they do the split cast, that's how they're able to be in the it appears to be in the same place, and that's all that's a testament to just their friendship as uh overall. And again, like that always would bleed into the broadcast. Like it always felt like you were just kind of in on an inside joke all of the time. And again, it's it's not gonna be the first time that like after this season that Kype has worked with another color analyst. Like even this year, he's worked with like Sean Estes and I think Hunter Pence, but it's he said it, and we all know it, it's gonna be different because again, like so much of the beauty is like it's never feels like it's staged. It never feels like there's like these pre-cut lines. It is just very reactionary. Like the one, the one that I quote all the time is the uh guys down on a boardwalk having a schmag. I'm like, I would never even I'm like, I've never heard of a cigarette refer to that before like before that. And maybe that's just like me, but it's just like these small things where you're like, Did he just say that? And then there's obviously like the main ones when it's like ownage ownage, grab some pine meat in the squat. Like, those are just the things like we're gonna miss.

SPEAKER_00 16:05

I like ownage ownage because it's like, yeah, that's all sometimes I just that's what it is. Ownage ownage. It says so much and so well at the same time.

SPEAKER_02 16:13

Some yeah, sometimes it's just like this guy's got me. Sometimes this guy's got me. So yeah, it's gonna on on Friday, there was a he got a very loud ovation during uh the game. I'm sure there's gonna be a lot there he also got an ovation during the Wall of Fame ceremony on Saturday as well, as they were as uh Kruk and Kype were making their way onto the field. Uh Kype Kuipe had a lion. They both talked during the ceremony, but Kype had a line's like, uh, he's gonna blow you guys kisses and I actually have to work. Which that's just that's just them uh in a nutshell. And I think one last point that I want to make, and everybody's made it. They gotta go in together. Like they can't, they're not eligible this year because of the way that the cycles work, they'll be eligible again in 2027, but they have to go into the Hall of Fame together. Like there's there's I have yet to hear a good counter-argument as to why they shouldn't. And like it's it's the idea that like individually they're really good, but together like they make something that we've never seen before. And for if no other reason than that. Like, if we're if we're not inducting them into the hall of fame together as a tandem, it's like what are we doing? What are we doing?

SPEAKER_00 17:26

Yeah, it's like you say, they they're they are uh Hall of Famers on their individual merit, but they are exceptional, uh otherworldly as a pair. So might as well just induct them on the on on at when they're at their best, which is when they're riffing off of each other. It just makes so much sense.

SPEAKER_02 17:45

That that if that does happen, that's gonna be like an all-time like hall of fame speech or like induction ceremony. Like you just rolled is like you just rolled. Yeah. Like they it would be unreal. And I can imagine like like current it might be tough for like current broadcasters, but I can only imagine like the people that they would be able to bring out for a ceremony like that just because of how much that they were both universally adored. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:12

I can see that.

SPEAKER_02 18:14

And you know, I I mentioned Wags as well. Um there's there's gonna be no easy transitions with this podcast because I you know, I I think Wags is similar to Kruko in that everybody that's been around Wags for like any period of time has a WAG story. And I I put this on social media yesterday, but I can't remember like the way that Mike and I like introduced ourselves, but over like the last two years, like whenever I saw him, it wouldn't be hi, it wouldn't be hey, it wouldn't be hello, it wouldn't be what's happening. I would say to him, 707, say it backwards, and he respond, tell him if they ask. Like that was like Wags, man. Like he was so effortless effortlessly cool all the time. Valeo is hell. I don't think I've ever met somebody that like rep their hometown as much as Wags. Rep Vileo. And again, he's he every time I saw him in the press box, like that's such a great attitude. Everything that he had been through, you know, after having the surgeries remove the tumor from his brain. Um Monty Pool wrote a fantastic story, you know, in tribute to him the other day. And in c in kind of Wag's form, like it is it's very it's it's objectively true to say that you know, after the surgery, he was, you know, a little like he wasn't as quite as sharp as he was, you know, prior, but he would also like point like playing like make fun of it all the time, too. He's like he he would you'd forget something, like, yeah, you know, point to his head, you know, I have the you know, something happened up here. Or he'd always say to me, he's like, if I ever had a podcast, I call it it's not brain surgery.

unknown 19:53

I'm like, wax.

SPEAKER_02 19:56

So our RFP to Wags, man. It's he always told me like how proud he was of me. And he'd always give me like those uh put the hand on the shoulder, like uncle speeches, and I just I it still hasn't fully hit me that he's gone. It just felt so sudden. And I'm gonna miss him, man. And shout out to the Giants. They they had the memorial in the press box, they put him up on the board yesterday, so it was just very touching that the Giants went that extra step to pay tribute to Wags.

SPEAKER_00 20:22

Yeah, it was it was really hard to be in the press box the day after, days after it happened because uh I'm gonna cry. It's um I think like he said he just the first thing I thought of when I heard is just thinking about the way in which he came back from brain surgery and how grateful he was to not just have survived the ordeal that he survived because it was such an ordeal and he would share so much about it. Not in a field star free me way, but in a holy shit, I can't believe we are capable of that type of way. But it was in a in a grateful way. And he was so grateful to be writing about sports, and he would just say, you know, this is this is the this is this job is a scam. We get paid to do this. I'm here to get paid. I just get to sit here and watch sports, and they're calling this a job. And just the his his perspective on life and his perspective on on the the work that we do and and and everything after going through such an ordeal just made it was it was just it was so special, and then and then hearing about the just the the sudden way in which he died and and thinking about how much he celebrated surviving how he did just really hurt me and hurt everybody. It was it was just it was just a really painful realization or um feeling. Um and he's just just such a Joy of a human. And then obviously, I think when anything like this happens, you think about, I can't believe I didn't do everything I could to tell him how much I appreciated everything, the way that he was, and everything that he said, and the encouragement that he provided everybody around him. And he went out of his way to be that person for everyone else. He was always looking out for everyone else in his own sort of sarcastic, sometimes dark humorous way. And he was always, he couldn't help but laugh. And it's such a cliche to say he lights up the room when he walks in, but it was so true because you could feel him miles away coming in, but coming into the room that you were in because he was just so happy to be there in your presence, in everyone's presence all the time. And it's just, I I wish that I got to tell him that at some point. I just I wish that I wish that I was I wish that he I hope that he knows how grateful we were for the type of person he was uh before and after the surgery. Because he's just uh he's a rare type of type of human.

SPEAKER_02 23:13

Yeah, I think there's been I I think I can speak for both of us, like from that element of just how he the joy that he had and just how much he would be able to, again, like you said, light up a room. Like it just made me take a step back and it's very easy to be jaded in this job. Like I know that Wags made it look he made it look so effortless, but like it's so easy to succumb to the day-to-day and be like, I gotta do X, Y, and Z, that it's easy to miss the forest for the trees. And Wags never missed the forest for the trees. He was he was always grateful before the surgery even happened. He was always eternally grateful to be at the ballpark. He was always a joy. And even more so, you know, after just like this aura of appreciation. And you know, you Shana, you know this more than anyone. I tell I love taking pictures of everybody. And I was, you know, I looked through my hard drive the other day, and uh, because I know I'd taken a couple photos of Wags. There's some in there that I actually there was one of him and Jamie McCauley that I completely forgot that I took, and in every single one of those photos, he just had this like ear-to-ear smile. The one with him and Manolo, that the one I posted the other day, it just like encapsulated him so well, like this beautiful spirit, and he just had this way of making you feel better about yourself, too. Like he it's funny, with like a name like mine, like it kind of just lends itself to having variants of nicknames, and he's the only person that ever called me Los. He's like, What's up, Los? I'm like, no one's ever called me that. I feel so cool. You call Los. Los. Like he just always had this way to like make you feel good about yourself. And he he'd never and the one thing I want to mention too is like he never it didn't matter how long you've been doing this. It could be it could be us, it could be some of the new kids on the block, it could be folks like Susan or John Shaq. Like it didn't really didn't matter. Like he was gonna treat you with respect regardless of who you were.

SPEAKER_00 25:09

Yeah. He was um and he had this funny way of treating everyone with respect, but also doing sort of like a light roast at the same time. He was he had such a such a good sense of humor about like, hey, we all love each other, but let's also let's not let's be real, but like he was just he was just so real about everything. He he he wasn't he wasn't he was such a light spirit, but also that he brought that to sort of like being able to jab us a little bit and jab everyone a little bit. So he was just he was always observing everyone else and letting everyone else know what he was observing about them. And that's uh it's such a privilege to be around someone that is actively so uh extroverted like that.

SPEAKER_02 25:55

Um yeah. I think because I think we do need a laugh, I'm I'm gonna spare the specific details of this, but the past two years, both back-to-back seasons, these I'm not gonna say exactly what happens. I think you know both of these stories, but there's been the the thing about Wags is like as beautiful as a spirit he is, he is Vallejo as hell, and he does not take kindly to disrespect. So there's been like there's been again, I'm gonna keep this in-house for both of us. But it was it was in Sacramento back last year and this year, and somebody tried to disrespect Wags and he a flip switch, and like he's like, I I don't play that. That's all I'll say. He does not play that, and like I'll hear these stories of like Wags, I love you, dude. I kind of like Agamon too, like, yeah, get him Wags, get him Wags. Like, and also like hearing him like explain his side of the story too. I'm like, Yeah, I get what you're coming for.

SPEAKER_00 26:57

He doesn't suffer any fools, he's just like, if you don't, you're gonna know.

SPEAKER_02 27:02

Yeah, don't don't take the the playfulness and the joy for being a punk. You can't punk Mike Wagabin. You you can't punk him.

SPEAKER_00 27:11

That's true.

SPEAKER_02 27:12

You can't punk him. And you know, the other thing I was thinking about, and the one the place I kind of want to, you know, end off here is you know, I was thinking of very symbolically, is you know, obviously the very journalistic thing is at the end of a story, you have the dash 30 dash. And you know, when I think of Mike's story, and I I I I think I thought about this when I saw Monty's story. Like there is no third there is no 30 at the end of his story, because if we take that element of wags and like we carry within ourselves like being who we are, like not letting ourselves be jaded, uh finding the joy in the fact that we get to watch sports for a living. The way he said, it was robbery. It was robbery, the fact that we got to do this. If we carry that within, then the spirit of Mike Wagman that never goes away. Oh, yeah. That never goes away. Okay. Let's stay on memory lane a little more right here. Uh, because the Giants did have the Wall of Fame ceremony over the weekend as well. Buster Posey, Brandon Crawford, Brandon Belt, Pablo Sandoval, and Joe Panic were all inducted into the team's Wall of Fame. That's the 61st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, and 5th plaques uh that have been unveiled. And, you know, it was a fun time for you know both of us growing up in the bay, watching both of those teams to go down memory lane. And, you know, Buster's probably gonna be part of a bigger celebration uh next year, assuming he is inducted into the National Baseball Hall of Fame as expected, potentially with Bruce Bochi, potentially with Dusty Baker, and you know, we don't have to wax poetic about these guys. I feel like we've done that before, but I do want to bring up this point super quickly. They were asked because one of the one of the guys that is eligible for the Wall of Fame that hasn't been inducted is Tim Linsigum. And Linsicum hasn't been at Oracle since I don't even know if it was called Oracle yet. He hasn't been there since Bruce Bochi's final game in 2019. I think it was still like TNT. And, you know, the house just like when he made that appearance, like the house came down, and you know, it's funny because like Linsigum kind of has like this Bigfoot-esque like reputation now, where like anytime somebody sees him or it's like, oh my god, Tim Linsigum out in the wild. And like I think part of the allure is like he is so mysterious. And I think if he ever did decide I don't know like what it I don't think it would take a lot. I I think he'd have to be willing to come back to the ballpark for the ceremony to happen, but if that happens, like I think the place is gonna explode. Like with no disrespect to any other active Bay Area athlete, that includes like Steph and even Clay, if you want to put lump him in there. No one gets the live the love that he does.

SPEAKER_00 30:04

Yeah. Yeah, I mean, um sorry. I think I I would imagine that see my take on Tim Woodsigam is that part of there's something really special about like the mythicism that he has now, like the Bigfoot factor, where he had such a like sharp peak and abrupt fall. And the peak was so high that it's just like it left a lasting imprint on everybody. And then after that, he after his career kind of when where it went that he is basically um nowhere to be found is kind of like a special sports story in a way. Like it's it's kind of crazy, it's not special in a good way. I wish we could see Timothy him all the time, but like it makes the anticipation of seeing him at the ballpark again, like, oh my god, that's an event, right? Um, and I think there's something kind of like cool about the way that he's gone about everything. He I wish he was more available, but I also think it's it's just so interesting that he's not available. Um, he's playing hard to get. But um, yeah, I it's hard to also hard to imagine a wall of fame without him because he's the most in a very unique way. Like there's so many beloved giants, but he is beloved in such a unique way that it's just and he was part of sort of this this like perfect time in recent Giants history of bridging the gap between the post-Bonds years and the the dynastic years, but it was with such a one of the the best pitching performances that we've seen in baseball over the last 20 years or whatever. Um and it's it's it would be it would be it would feel wrong for him not to be on the wall because he is fame, he is the giant, he is the wall of fame. Like that's he's emblematic, representative of everything that I feel like that whole uh situation is supposed to be. So it'd be great if he could come back and and just that could be his uh entryway to reminding fans of his his existence. And I know he's been through a lot lately uh in his personal life, so I can imagine that it might, I don't know, have something to do with the fact that he's laying low. Who knows? But um it'd be tight if he came back and uh be cool to see how he is.

SPEAKER_02 32:33

Yeah, it was interesting timing the Wall of Fame because I think Jeff Passon went on all the smoke and was talking about how he first saw Linskum and was talking about how this probably probably I don't want to say never, but he was so unique. Like his like nobody had the mechanics that he did and how he was able to kind of extract every ounce of velocity from a very pretty frail frame. He was like 5'11, 170. I mean, and it's kind of everything that part of the reason pet people love him is he was like he's kind of like Steph, in that he was you know, Steph is a lure, is like he's a tinier dude. Like Linskum was just like a dude. Like the the famous In N Out order is like what like the three double doubles and like the shakes and the two fries. I mean, like the like when he got pulled over and everyone, like I think he was probably like the bet like that was the best like merging of a city and person because everyone was like, Hell yeah, bro, like in the like the let Timmy smoke shirts, and it it's like the epitome of the you know, the the candle that burns twice as bright goes out twice as fast. And I don't know if you've ever had these debates, but I I've heard you know these debates of you know, would you rather had a career like Linsk's or Canes? Like the longevity versus like the kind of shooting star. And I think there is something extra to be said that you know he is laying so low in like the social media era where everybody is so constantly available, it's so like because again, like every time someone sees him, like you see it on Giants Reddit, you see it on Twitter, it's like, oh my god, Linskum was here. It's like I it's he's just kind of you know doing whatever he wants to do. And I think that you know it would just be so much fun, even if it's for one day to see him out the ballpark. I could guarantee that that place will be packed out like no other. Like, with all due respect to you know, Jeff Kent, who's his number's gonna be retired and Buster Pose when he has a celebration next year, and same thing with Bochi, and same thing with Dusty, they are not gonna be able to hold a candle to whatever reception that Lynts can get whenever he decides to come out, just because he would he was the guy. He he was he was the he was a guy because he was a dude. He was just a dude that happened to be really damn good at baseball.

SPEAKER_00 34:44

He was a dude that was really good. Yeah, it's just it's not to take away from what everyone else, the kind of reception that everyone else would get, but it's he's just he's just in a different sort of tier of different just he's a different type of person, he's a different type of alum, he's a different type of former giant. There's just a he's in his own category, I'd say. And it's you could put a finger on it or not. I think that but I think the the overwhelming thing is an impuster even or someone, one of the five said it was just like, yeah, the roof's gonna absolutely blow off this place when he's here. Everybody knows that everyone in San Francisco, the Bay Area, etc., is just waiting with bated breath to see him again. So it's uh yeah, he's uh he's a unique type of legend for sure.

SPEAKER_02 35:32

Unique type of legend for sure. All right, Shane, I think we've done it. I think it's time to talk about actual Giants baseball now. Let's do it. Uh Shana, you will be shocked to learn that after trading Robbie Ray, Louisa Rias, Tyler Malley, Elliott Ramos, Caleb Killian, and Eric Miller, that the Giants are significantly worse than they are about a week ago before all these trades were made. Wow. Uh they dropped two or three to the Texas Rangers, they dropped two or three to the Detroit Tigers. Both of those series kind of played out the same way in that they won the first game, they dropped the latter two. They are currently sitting at 49 and 69. This is the first time they've been under or 20 games under 500 since 2017. Uh that team lost 98 games. They're currently on pace to win 95 games, winning percentage of 415. Uh but uh as we'll get into this this roster looks signific it is significantly more depleted, and I don't think it's you know outlandish to say like the 100 loss question is definitely going to be in play. And I think just generally speaking, I think it, you know, we've kind of seen it with some of the lineups over the last couple days. I think you know, if you want to be really mean and crack fun, it has been some guys that you do need to Google because you know, Oslevis Basabe and Buddy Kennedy, like they're not household names. Like this is with all Eddie's Leonard, like these with all due respect, like these are not household names. And there are gonna be opportunities there. We're gonna get to that in a second, but it's it's gonna be some rough baseball for the last for the next 45 games, wherever they're at.

SPEAKER_00 37:08

Yeah, I think part of the is I don't know if it's an issue, but what's happening now is this isn't really a rebuild. It isn't really uh a tank. It's more just an odd transitional period. Uh you don't have a lot of a lot of their their their farm system is way more valuable now than it was even two years ago, maybe even last year. Um, and has a lot to do with the fact that their top prospects are all like teenagers and they're all like they're all they're all in the lower levels of the minor leagues. Um this isn't sort of a a phase or a period where you can sort of flip all these players that you were getting to to buy and win now and go for it with the veterans you have. It's um it's it's more of a time where they've given up on the the rush that they built to win, and then they're in this, okay, how do we fill the gaps with the players that are available to us? Um, and that's not to slight everyone that's playing right now, but it just feels a little bit of a patchwork team right now. Um, which is to say there aren't a bunch of top prospects that we're going to see on the pitching side or the position player side that um are going to sort of give us this full picture of what's to come in the next years and maybe next year after the lockout or whatever the heck is going to happen. Um, so it just feels a little bit like, okay, this what are we looking at here? This is um, these are some guys that were in triple A this year. These guys, it's really great that they're getting their shot and seeing guys like Leonard make their debut, and they're just that that's a lot of the times that's what this is all about, these sort of awkward last few months after the deadline is guys getting their shot. But I think when it comes to satisfying this idea that um we need to see the giants move on um from one sort of build of the roster to something that leaves a little bit more young, it's hard to it's hard to picture that forming right now in the last few months. I mean, we're getting a look at some of the pictures like Blade said while like Carson was in hunt um to see, in essence, if those guys can be starters, I think that they need to start thinking about how they're gonna fill the rotation next year in a real way that isn't just patchwork free agent signings that didn't work out this year. Um and it's hard to say with any certainty that the guys that we've seen fill that those roles. It's hard to say that Wizen Hunt's gonna fill that role. It's hard to say that Blade Tidwell's gonna fill that role, although he's he's looked pretty good. Um, but it's there's an opportunity for those guys, and it's it that's the the case within situations like this to have a little runway and make their case. So uh nothing super um thrilling to watch, I'd say. Just just a lot of weird transitional baseball.

SPEAKER_02 39:58

Yeah, if you're looking ahead to 2027, which again, lockout permitting, like you can start, you know, if you assume that Matt Chapman returns from the core injury, he's probably gonna undergo season ending surgery uh sometime. It's either this week. Um he's gonna fly to Philadelphia, and Casey Schmidt's obviously out for the remainder of the season, or probably gonna be out due to the torn meniscus. Um, we might see Marcelo Mayer. Um, he's you know, he flew to Arizona yesterday. He's gonna get in some rehab games with Sacramento. Uh, we're probably gonna see him on that upcoming road trip, which you know that's gonna be fun for him to return to Boston. So Meyer's gonna be one of the guys to watch going forward. But, you know, I think the biggest overall question going into these final 40-ish games is you know, who can play on a competitive 2027 Giants team? And again, when you start like looking forward like towards next year, it's like okay, third base should hypothetically be Casey Schmidt, second base, hypothetically, Matt Chat or not, Matt. No, flip that. Third base, Matt Chapman, second base, Casey Schmidt. Then you got Rafi and Bryce and Willie, and then probably Jung Hoo and Wright. So then now it's a question, like there's a couple spots, there's a couple areas, and it's like, okay, like who these guys are gonna get opportunities. And some of these opportunities might not be as stars, they might be guys off the bench, but like who can you know be on a realistically a team that contends? And you know, Carson Wizenhunt has struggled since kind of getting these opportunities. Blade said well, rough first inning in his last outing against the Rangers, but five innings, two earned runs, he ditched the splitter, uh, add more of a traditional changeup. He's playing with the curveball. He is if depending on your perspective, it's either a five or a six-pitch mix. You got some guys in the bullpen that are, you know, despite the bullpen not being great, we've talked about that a lot, that are still intriguing. And, you know, how do they fit into a bullpen that might have Randy Rodriguez and Rowan Wick and there's another name, Jose Butto. Like you're starting to get like a framework of what next year's team is, but it's like who among this current team could actually be effective? And they are gonna get their opportunities. Like Nate Furman made his debut as well, Trent Harris made his debut as well. And so if you're looking for the optimistic lens, is that you know these guys are gonna get runway that they wouldn't have had if this was a competitive team. The opposite point of view is that it's just gonna be some very it's gonna be some growing pains with a lot of these guys. It's gonna be rough. You're gonna get games like Saturday where they lost eight to nothing and there's some sloppy play, and it's kind of just one of those shrug your shoulder games, and then you go from there.

SPEAKER_00 42:35

Yep, that's uh thrilling baseball to come. Very excited to watch it.

SPEAKER_02 42:40

Thrilling baseball to come. And as you mentioned, though, you know, a lot of the top prospects in this organization, they're teenagers. Uh we're not, or they're in their early 20s. Like you think of guys like Jasmuar Gonzalez, Luis Hernandez, Yoniel Hernandez, even he's in the DSL. He was acquired in the Robbie Ray trade, Bresnayan, Canner Martinez, Kayama, like these guys are all very young. We you might get a Bo Davidson or a Parks Harbor, but a lot of these guys are still coming through the system. So it is this really weird transition period, and it'll be very interesting to see how the Giants kind of bridge the gap in the offseason. Like, how do they get guys that are competent while also not logging up these positions going forward? So uh, but that's a question for the offseason. Shana, any parting thoughts before we get out of here?

SPEAKER_00 43:25

Um RIP Wags. I miss you, dude.

SPEAKER_02 43:31

R.I.P. Wags. RIP Wags. If you are in Vallejo, go get some tacos jaliscos on his behalf because I don't think.

SPEAKER_00 43:38

And if you have a chocolate chip cookie, you microwave it for a couple seconds. That was his favorite.

SPEAKER_02 43:43

That was the move. That was always the move for Mike Wagaman, more affectionately known as Wags. Wags, we miss you so much. And you know, hopefully we have an opportunity to pay more respects to him in the coming weeks uh and months. Um, but Justice Delos Santos, Shana Rubin, Splash Considerations Podcast, thank you for listening. Subscribe if you do feel so inclined, and we will catch you in the next one