Psychopaths is the latest the latest theme. First up, "White Heat", James Cagney classic star turn as Cody Jarrett, the psycho criminal gang leader who doesn't mind killing and also had a weird thing for his mother. The on screen violent tendencies are much milder in this film, than it is in our second feature, "Ichi the Killer". From Japan, Ichi is based on a popular comic book series and really goes for the gusto when it comes to crazy, bloodbath scenes.
Next, women thieves with Alfred Hitchcock's "Marnie" (1964) and "Emily the Criminal" (2023)
Have your own recommendations? Contact the show:
24theroadshow@gmail.com
Psychopaths is the latest the latest theme. First up, "White Heat", James Cagney classic star turn as Cody Jarrett, the psycho criminal gang leader who doesn't mind killing and also had a weird thing for his mother. The on screen violent tendencies are much milder in this film, than it is in our second feature, "Ichi the Killer". From Japan, Ichi is based on a popular comic book series and really goes for the gusto when it comes to crazy, bloodbath scenes.
Next, women thieves with Alfred Hitchcock's "Marnie" (1964) and "Emily the Criminal" (2023)
Have your own recommendations? Contact the show:
24theroadshow@gmail.com
1, 1, 2 Welcome to Two for the Road, Movies with Matt and Adam. I'm Matt. And I'm Adam. We are a monthly movie fairy podcast. Wow. Yeah. Every now and then, we will pick a movie, pick a theme, recommend a movie to each other based on the theme, watch and discuss. And we have a 25 year age difference, and so we come with a different set of movies. And sometimes life gets in the way. We have a busy, botchy summer. Yeah. Matt is pet sitting all over the goddamn New England area. I have no... I have like two weekends off this summer. Pet sitting. And I would contend that Matt watched our second movie one minute at a time. Actually, I watched it two... Two big chunks? Two big chunks. Okay. Chunks being the operative word for that movie. Chunks was the operative word. I was sure that would turn you off, but we'll get to that in a moment. So our theme this week is psychopaths. And I think we both had a different take on what that meant. Yeah. I think our first movie is White Heat. James Cagney. It's one of his most famous roles. One of his most famous lines comes out of this movie. Look, Mom, I'm on top of the world. But as far as the psychopaths that you see, you saw in 1949 on screen, compared to our second film, there is a huge, huge difference. Also culturally, right? We went from like 1940s America to like, what was it, 2001 Japan. Japan, yeah. Which is just, yeah. It's their, they got their own thing going on over there. Right, right. To put it mildly. Yeah, I mean, that's what it is. We're looking at America in the 40s right after the war. You know, there's gangsters. He's a gangster. He's got his own little crew. And, you know, he has a thing for his mom. You know. Yeah, but like not that much. It wasn't that weird, I thought. It was weird at the time. Weird at the time, I think. I think if they had made this film today, yeah, it would have been, you know, Dennis Hopper yelling, mommy. Well, if they had made it, it would have had to go way extreme. Like, it would have had to been like, it would have had to been like a mommy masturbation scene or something to really hammer the point home. Right, right, right, yeah. So, I mean, everything compared to our second film, everything in White Heat is sort of mild. I mean, pretty much everything, I think. You know, the violence, you don't really see that much, you know, especially compared to our second. Right, it's not Eat You the Killer, but I mean, what is, right? Like, we were comparing it to like one of the most violent movies ever made. So, that's not, I mean, I think it's maybe unfair to White Heat. Yeah, but back then, they didn't show a lot of violence. There were things, you know, the, what was called the Hays Board, they controlled what sex, what violence you could see on film. That doesn't exist today. You can pretty much do whatever you want. You know, back then, you couldn't. You know, not that they would, right? I mean, Raoul Walsh is an old director, guy has an eye patch. You know, he worked for D.W. Griffith. He was, you know, he actually, Griffith was going to make a film about Pancho Villa down in Mexico. So, he had Raoul Walsh go down there and hang out with Pancho Villa for a while. Just take some notes. Yeah, he's one of those directors like John Ford, and John Ford also had an eye patch. I don't know what, I guess I could see better with one eye, I don't know. But, you know, those old guys, they were a different group. They were real hard drinking, whatever it takes to make this film kind of thing. You know, so, he also made one of my favorite gangster movies. It's called The Roaring 20s with Cagney and Humphrey Bogart. Was Cagney kind of typecast as a gangster? Yes. Yeah. I mean, everybody, I remember back in the 60s, everybody used to do, anybody who did imitations did Cagney. Okay. This, okay. You dirty rat. Right, I was exactly going to say that line. Yeah. So, Bugs Bunny is making fun of James Cagney. Right. Okay. Right. Okay. Right. Everybody made fun of, and I'm sure if he ever said that in a film, it was one of those things where people just thought he said it, you know. It's like the Mandela effect, right? Yeah, yeah. He just didn't, I don't know if he really said it, but everybody did that imitation. But, also, he won an Academy Award for a musical. Is he a song and dance? Oh, yeah, he's a great dancer. Song and dance man? Yeah. Yeah, he's an old vaudeville guy, you know, so he could do comedy. He could do song and dance. Yeah, he won for Yankee Doodle Dandy, which is the story of George Cohen, and he's really good in it. In this movie, he seems stumpy. He is. He's not very, he's one of those, he's like, you know, Bogart's not very big, but people were, you know, in all his films, people are afraid of him. Sure. And the same with Cagney. But Bogart seemed a little bit more, maybe more fleet of foot than Cagney? Yeah. But, I mean, if you ever saw him dance, you could, you know. Okay. Yeah, he was a huge star for, you know, 40 years, and later on, he was making, he did a movie called Mr. Roberts, he played the captain of the ship who, you know, they were driving crazy, stuff like that. So he could do comedy, he could do anything. He could do drama, dance, but he was kind of typecast there for a while as the gangster. What's his biggest hit? Maybe this one. This one? Yeah, I think so. Maybe this or, oh, Yankee Doodle Dandy was a pretty big hit, you know, trying to think of what else he was famous for, but. I'm guessing it was a play first, and then it became a movie? Yeah. It just sounds so vanilla, I guess. The musical? Yankee Doodle Dandy, I have no idea what it is. I'm a Yankee Doodle Dandy. I know, but like, what does that mean? I know the song, but. Yeah, I don't know. Yeah, it's just, yeah, he's most famous for Yankee Doodle Dandy, The Roaring Twenties, White Heat, and Angels with Dirty Faces, which is another gangster movie. So, a priest tries to stop a gangster from corrupting a group of street kids. That's Pat O'Brien, of course. He's the old priest, but yeah. So, he was kind of typecast as this, you know, slapping people around. Oh, there's one, what's the movie? He just, he and his wife are eating breakfast, and he's just tired of hearing her because she's just complaining, so he takes a grapefruit and shoves it in her face. My God. He did that. She didn't know he was going to do it. It wasn't in the script, and he just did it. Yeah. I can't remember the name of it. James Cagney smashes a grapefruit into May Clark's face. May Clark, yeah. Public enemy. Oh, that's another one. That might be his most famous. Okay. Public enemy, so. So, she's just yapping, and he's like, I have an idea. Take this. So, this movie, White Heat, this was later in his career? This was 49. Roaring 20s was 39. Okay. I think, what was it? The other ones were in the 30s, I think. Mostly when he was really popular. Okay. So, this was at the tail end, maybe not the end end, but like the, it was winding down for old Cagney. Yeah, he was, yeah, I think this is the point where he didn't make many gangster movies after this. He made, he mostly played, like he, there's a one where he plays a reporter. There's one where he plays, it's supposed to be pretty good. He plays a Coca-Cola executive over in Germany after the war, stuff like that. So. Damn it, he was working until 84. Oh, yeah, he did, the last film he did was Ragtime, I think. He played the police commissioner. Yeah, he did something after that too, a movie, Terrible Joe Moran, maybe. That was a film before, but he came out after. But yeah, wow, I didn't realize he was so prolific. So, I had heard his name, mostly like comedians make a reference to him, like probably mostly Dennis Miller. Yeah. And I was like, I don't know what that means, but it sounds funny. And I always thought that he was like a Cary Grant type. Oh, yeah, yeah. Like, I had no mental image of who this person was. I thought he was like dashing. Yeah. I didn't realize that he was like Joe Pesci 1.0. Irish Joe Pesci. Yeah, I didn't realize that he was like the prototype Joe Pesci. Right. Yeah, he would have been Joe Pesci if he'd come along in the 70s and 80s. Well, he was like Joe Pesci before Joe Pesci. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Joe Pesci came along, he's like, well, someone's got to fill that James Cagney role, so it might as well be me. Yeah, I enjoy him. I think he lights up the screen. I just, he's got a certain energy to him. He's definitely got charisma. Yeah. And it starts from the first scene of this movie. When they're robbing the train. Yeah. And he's telling everyone what to do, and it's pretty interesting. And then they get the guys, and it's like everything could go smoothly, but old Cagney's like, nah, I'm just going to kill him. Yeah, I'm a killer. Yeah, he just kills him. Yeah. Seemingly for no reason, which makes the crew go on the run. Yeah, on the lam, which is not a good place to be if you don't trust each other. Yeah, the crew wasn't very close. No. Yeah, a couple of, go ahead. Well, yeah, you just had the number two guy who was... Big Ed. Big Ed, who thought he was bigger Ed. You don't want your number two to be like a foot and a half taller than you. It's like not a good look. Yeah. And so we meet the crew, we meet Big Ed, we realize that they don't really trust each other, don't like each other. Cagney's got mommy issues. His wife... Verna. Verna. She's not totally on board. She's kind of on board with whoever... Whoever's in charge. Yeah. Whoever's going to get her to the beach, essentially. Yeah. She's like, can't we just get out of here? We have money. What are we doing? Why don't we hold up in this mountain hideaway? Yeah. She's played by Virginia Mayo, who... She had her stardom for a while. Every now and then I see these old starlets and... Maybe this is wrong, but my first thought is like, huh, why you? What made you... Wasn't a great actress, not particularly charming, maybe attractive for the day, wasn't really doing it for me. Like... Then sometimes you see them, she'll tell me, you're like, oh my God, wow. Yeah, definitely you. But... Yeah, you see Rita Hayworth or somebody like that, you go, whoa, bim-bam-bing. But yeah, she was like, okay. Yeah, you're right. I mean, her acting style wasn't all that great. You know, I think somebody with better chops could have done a better job. Chops. I think we're back in the 1940s time now. So all this is happening, the gang is leaving, some guy got burned by steam at the train robbery, so they leave him behind. One guy lets him live. He's supposed to kill him. Supposed to kill him. But you know, yeah, kill him with a heart of gold, let's him live. And that's enough for our... We meet a cop with a cigarette holder, which is an interesting choice. Always. And they figure out, in the morgue, they figure out that one of the guys that died is this henchman of Cagney's. Right. Cody Jarrett. Cody Jarrett? That's his name. First Cody on film? Could be. Could be, yeah. Yeah, I never heard that name before. So Cody Jarrett and his crew, they relocate to Los Angeles, I think it was? Yeah, they're outside of LA, I think. All right. And they're holding up in a hotel. The mom goes out to get some stuff. Cops figure out who she is. There's a pretty interesting police chase for the time. Yeah, that was pretty interesting. Almost like computerized, you know, I can't remember the name of the thing they were using, but it was really ahead of its time. It was like how to follow somebody. Yeah, they're like triangulating, like where their coordinates are at and stuff. They're getting the whole string out on the map. What happens, then the mom gets there, she gets killed. No, she's still alive. She gets pinched. She gets pinched, but she's alive. Yeah. Cagney peels out of there. And they don't have anything on her. Right. So they can't hold her. There's another police chase with Cagney. At this point, I'm kind of like zoned out. I'm like, okay, like two in a row, come on. Yeah. But you know, I imagine that's what the moviegoers wanted at that time. So it all boils down to Cagney comes up with a scheme. He's going to confess to a lesser crime that happened in Illinois. The same day that they robbed the train. So he goes to jail. The cops put a man inside, Victor Pardo. And the whole point is like you get close to Cagney or Cody Jarrett, I guess I should call him, and get his, just kind of keep track of him. Right. Right. Right. We figure out what he's doing. And that was Edmund O'Brien, who was also a big star later on. So, yeah. All these names. I'm just like, this is washing over me. I have no idea who that person is. Verna's getting antsy. She's waiting to take off with the money. So she's getting cozy with Big Ed. So Big Ed suggests that maybe Jarrett will get got in prison. So Big Ed has some kind of a plan. Get got in prison. So Big Ed has someone inside who Jarrett thought was helping him, but he's actually working for Big Ed. Trying to kill him. This is like a kind of a convoluted death scheme. Dropping something on him. It's like, you ever heard of a shank? Yeah, right. What is this? Just shake the dude. Roadrunner? What are you, Wile E. Coyote? You gonna drop something on this guy? Yeah, that's a good point. So he gets shanked. But so he gets saved by Pardo, which ingratiates Pardo into the Cody Jarrett gang. So everything's going good. Pardo saves Jarrett. They got a scheme to escape. Yep. And then he finds out his mom is dead. Yeah. And he does not handle it well. No. That was pretty cool scene though. He's just, he's just misery because he gets these headaches. Yeah. You know. But you would think that it's almost like a relief. It's like maybe that's the end of the headaches, right? Yeah, yeah. That's where the headaches came from, I'm sure. So just for everyone listening, we watched this movie like a month and a half ago. So I'm running off notes. I don't remember everything scene by scene. Cody gets a gun. Yeah, he's one of his cellmates has a gun, has access to a gun. They decided, and then the cops, they had a whole escape plan. And then when he got put in the hospital because of his mother dying, the plan got scrapped. So the cops are, you know, okay, break it up. You know, he's not going to do it. Blah, blah, blah. We're not going to use our oscillator. Right. Yeah, oscillator. That's what it was. So then he decides to go through it a different way. Before it was a kind of a non-lethal way, but now he's got a gun and he's going to just blast his way out if he has to. And he's still got Edmund O'Brien with him. So it ends up all the men are in a car on the way out. And he says, if we don't make it, I got six slugs in this gun, one for each of us. Yeah, right. It's like I'm killing all the others, I'll kill myself. Yeah, yeah. It's like, okay. Yeah, he's got the doctor from the hospital, the insane or whatever. He's got the doctor with him as a hostage. But that is a that would be like one point in his psychopath bucket. It's like, I'm not just going to kill all of you. I'm also going to kill myself. That's that. So now, you know, I'm that crazy. Yeah, yeah. There's no reasoning with me because I'm going to I know I'm going to die at the end of this. But they get out fresh out the hoose gal. Got to get all tailored up. So the men go and get their suits. Cody's in there back in California. Yep. Cody Jarrett seems pretty chill. Big is back on the scene. Seems a little nervous about what's going down. They're back in this big house. They install a bell to make sure like if anyone comes in or out. Yeah, he's worried that Cody's going to come and get him because it turns out a burner killed his mother. He thinks a big head did it. So he knows Cody's going to come and try to kill him. Yeah. Yeah, I couldn't go through a window. Right. He had his little belt. This is a Chinese restaurant. That's what the bell. So big heads, big heads, gangs. Takes off for some reason. Yeah, they're not around, are they? Yeah, I'm getting I'm going for my notes. I don't totally remember what happened. Big Ed Black knows Vernon's staying. He'll tell Jarrett that she shot his mom in the back. Vernon makes a break for it and runs into Cody. Cody's outside. So Vernon says Ed did it. Right. Smart. And he's got this bell. He knows you're coming. So go through a window or something. So it ends up Ed gets shot. Right. So, okay. Now, he's got a gun. So, okay. Now, we learn about the traitor. And the traitor is like this inside man who's helping Cody do all these heists. Right. He's got the information. Unclear what his role is in the bigger scheme of things. Like, is he does he work for the government? Does he work for industry? Is he a cop? I wasn't totally sure like what exactly was. I don't even know that we were supposed to know. No, he's just a schemer. Just an up in the ranks muckety muck. Played by Fred Clark who was a million things over the years. All right. Shout out to Fred Clark. So, he learned about this gas truck heist. The plan is to. Yeah, the gang had bought a gas truck. Yeah. While Cody was gone. He's going, what? Spent $37,000 on this thing. Then he figured out a way to use it. So, the gas truck is tried. So, Pardo tries to make a break for it to go tell the cops what's going on. He runs into a couple of guys. Suddenly, Pardo knows judo. Yeah. He runs into Jarrett and they bring him back in. But Jarrett still believes that he's on the right side. Right. Pardo tells him, I was going to go see my wife. Hadn't seen her in a long time. She's right there in LA. He believes it. They go back inside. On the way to the heist, Pardo leaves a bathroom note in steam. Is that right? Or was it in something else? I can't remember. It was maybe soap. Soap. I don't know. Yeah, he leaves it on the mirror. And then, oh no, it's Bo Creel. So, we forgot to mention that Pardo had like an enemy. Right. It's like, I'm fine as long as this one person doesn't see me. Who's Bo Creel. And they almost saw each other in the prison. And now, yeah, he's the guy driving the truck. So, during the gassed heist, Bo Creel figures out, oh, that's Pardo. Everything goes down. The cops are coming in. There's tear gas. Pardo escapes. There's a shootout. Jared's boy tries to give himself up. He gets shot in the back. By Jared. Yep, there's a sniper rifle on Jared. He climbs up, shoots a gas container. Made a ma. Top of the world. And boom, credits. Yeah, there was a big payroll at the gas thing. They weren't robbing. They weren't stealing gas. They were stealing the payroll. So, yeah, so he made it to the top of the world, which his mom always said he would. And that's the famous line, look, ma, I made it to the top of the world. And he went out his way. I love that it ended that way. Yeah, there's no resolution. There's no wrapping things up. It was like, pffft. Then cast. What did you think? As far as these older gangster movies go, not in my upper tier. Right. Definitely get my attention through the whole time. I like Cagney. Yep. I like Pardo. I don't think it was too long. No, it wasn't too long. I don't know. Just it could have been, you know, it's these little things, right? Right. Could have been a little wittier. The Dame could have been a better actress. These tiny things that would have kicked it up a notch. It was good, but it wasn't great in my estimation. Yeah, I think it doesn't hold up. I mean, I think it's a great film and it's one of his best films. But if we're watching stuff from that period, I prefer the noir stuff, you know. Although the Roaring Twenties, which was 10 years earlier, is very similar. But you got the two together. You got Cagney and Bogart together. And one of the greatest female... Her name is... I love their name, Panama Smith. It's pretty good. Yeah, yeah. So, but, you know, I do. I mean, yeah, I looked at this and, you know, I'd seen it many, many years ago when I was a lot younger. And I look at it now. I go, okay, yeah, that was okay. It wasn't great. I mean, for me, I'm sure it is considered a great film. I mean, the plotting is very, like, controlled, you know, like, no wasted scenes, nothing like that. There's no... I'm not like ever watching going like, why are they doing this? It doesn't make any sense. It's very tight, very tight and very like, systematic. And I mean that in a good way. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I think it's one of those movies, you know, like we used to watch like on a Sunday afternoon. It was on TV, that kind of stuff. And we enjoyed it. But I like it. I think people should see it. But not everybody likes movies from that era either. So, yeah. You do the right. I do the right. Yeah, if you watch it, you got your best Cagney impression. Right. Yeah, he was... Yeah, he does not look like I was expecting him to look. All right, Matt, anything that you want to say about this before we go to the scores? Oh, he's nominated for an Oscar. Wow. Screenplay maybe? No. Yeah, best writing. It was written by a name. That's right. I remember seeing that in the credits. It was written by a woman. What's her name? Virginia Kellogg. Oh, okay. That's weird. Yeah, it is weird. I mean, not that, obviously not that women can't write, but for the time. Well, it's a gangster movie and it's 1949, so you didn't see a lot of women's credits in the writers. So let me know if, I'm going to give you the five movies with the winner and let me know if they got this right. This is a best writing motion picture. The Stratton Story is the winner. It's a baseball movie. It happens every spring. That is also a baseball movie. That is a baseball movie. Come to the Stable. Never heard of it. Is that a horse movie? Yeah. And Sands of Iwo Jima. That's a John Wayne one, I think. What a pitiful year. Because Monty Stratton's story, it's Jimmy Stewart. It's a true story. I'm going to hit a home run. He plays a pitcher who, I think he loses his leg. Oh, man. Even back then they were doing that? It was a true story. Oh, okay. It wasn't that great. What was the second one again? It happens every spring. Yeah. I think that's about baseball. Somebody invented some stuff to put on a ball. People couldn't hit it. So this name had a pretty good career. The Road to Reno. Mary Stevens, MD. Stephen Holiday. Meet the People. T-Men. White Heat. Caged. Screaming Eagles. Caged is another, I think, another cagney. It's about a women's prison. Oh, that's right. The story of a women's prison today. A gentle, naive, impregnated 19-year-old widow is slowly inexorably ground down by the hardened criminals, sadistic guards, and matron at a women's prison. I see who plays the matron. Who's that? She always played that kind of role. This horrible human being. Is that Agnes Moorhead? No. But Agnes Moorhead is in it. You know who she is, don't you? No, I don't know her. Gypsy Bewitched. She played her mom. Ellen Corby is the matron? Who's the matron, Matt? I was actually watching the video. Oh, okay. Alright, you want to get some scores? Yep. Alright, just a second. So IMDb, we got... 34,000 people checking in. I'd say 7, 7? You went low. 8, 1. Whoa! Yeah, that's amazing. That's really good for an old movie that I've never even heard of. Right. You know what I mean? Like sometimes you hear these old ones, I'm like, oh okay, like you know, like all about Eve I'd heard of. Yeah, well that was, yeah, the next year is all about Eve. Like this one I've never even heard of. Yeah, but yeah, people love it. 8.1. That's big. Very high. Yeah, on the old IMDB scale. All right, so White Heat on Rotten Tomatoes. We have only 36 reviews and just over 5,000 audience. I'll go 92. 97 critics. Okay, audience? 90? 93. Oh, wow. That was a beloved film. That's one of the highest ones we've ever had. It is. All around a favorite. This is a critic's consensus. Ralph Walsh's crime drama goes further into the psychology of a gangster than most fear to tread and James Cagney's portrayal of the tragic answer here is constantly volatile. Yeah, not when you watch E.T. the killer. Right, right, yeah. Did it really go like further than most dare to tread? I think it's 49, yeah. Fair enough. You gotta judge movies where they came out. You can't judge them now, but it's hard not to look at this and go, okay. Back then it was either you were a good guy or a bad guy. There was no melting of the two. I think the biggest first example of that came in John Wayne's The Searchers when he was the anti-hero. Well, so Cagney, definitely a villain, right? We don't have any sympathy for him? No, no, no. Okay, I guess we view things differently. I mean, yeah, I liked him. He got double crossed, you know what I mean? He got his gang and they double cross him. He's just trying to do right by them. He wasn't like taking all the money for himself. No, oh, he split everything. Yeah, he took care of everybody. He's fair. Yeah, he didn't kill his gang unless he had to. True, very few unnecessary killings. All right, Matt is taking an important call, so we will take a break and come back with Ichi the Killer. Alright, we're back. Second Psychopath Movie of the week coming straight out of Japan. 2001, Ichi the Killer. Matt, I'd like to apologize. Have you seen this before? I had seen pieces of it and I knew the director. So I kind of knew what I was getting into. Director Takashi Mike, his... I don't know if this is his most famous movie, but the movie that made an impact for me was actually earlier than this. It's called Audition. And it's like this movie where this single guy is auditioning women to date, and then it flips and becomes this murder, torture, porn kind of thing. So I knew it had that gear to it. I didn't realize... It had a fifth gear. I didn't realize the title sequence would be written in semen. So there's that. Oh my god. But yeah, so I kind of would like to apologize to you, but also curious. What'd you think? Like I said, I watched it in two big lumps. I was confused by a lot of it. I didn't know what the hell was going on. It is not easy to follow. And it's... the violence is way over the top. And it seemed very similar sometimes. They're doing the same thing. You know, the way they were killing people, and it just seemed like the same scene over and over again. But I was interested. I mean, I generally don't like these movies. But I kind of enjoyed it. I kept watching it. It was like watching a train wreck. You know, it's like, God, this is interesting, but really... I hate it, I like it. You know, that kind of thing. See, I always think of movies like this where the violence is so over the top. It almost is like going back to the Wile E. Coyote thing. It's almost like a cartoon. That's what it seemed like. It's not realistic, so it doesn't really phase me. Isn't this based on a comic book? A manga. Yeah, it's a comic. It's funny sometimes. They use a little humor, but I thought the acting was pretty good. I don't know. I really liked the guy that played the blonde guy. Yeah, kind of the main guy, right? Yeah, he's a psycho himself, but he just likes pain inflicted on himself. Right. So he's really interested in this Ishii guy that he hears. He wants to be killed by him, I guess. I don't know. He's really looking forward to their date. Yeah. So just sticking on the violence real quick, I was watching this on my laptop, and my wife was in a chair next to me, so she couldn't see what I was watching, and she just hears like, splat, scream in terror, splat, erotic scream. She's like, what are you watching? I'm like, oh, this Japanese woman. She's like, oh, okay. I know. I know all about this. She's like, okay, that makes sense. Yeah, and that was another thing was the women in it were just brutally... Yeah, that was tough. That's why I don't like rape scenes, especially with the amount of violence that was inflicted. I don't know if you're baiting me to say that I like rape scenes. I also don't like rape scenes. No, no. The podcast is against rape scenes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I just don't enjoy those. It's too long. It's too confusing. I don't get that kind of comic book stuff, but like I said, I kept watching it. It was an interesting film. Yeah, you never see anything like it. No. I feel like there was like maybe too many characters in this. I got confused on who was who. And not because they're Asian. No, listen, I will take that bullet for us, Matt. This is my rant. Like if you're... Okay, so let me flip it. I'll take my wife's perspective. My wife is Korean. When she's watching an American movie and the actors look similar, like if it's like, oh, handsome brown-eyed, brown-haired guy. Oh, handsome brown-eyed, brown-haired guy. Both very well fit. Both similar height. She kind of gets confused who they are because people don't walk around saying their names. You know what I mean? So it's like, wait, who is he again? Who is he? And the same thing happens with, look, it's Japanese guy in dark hair, dark eyes, dark suit. I mean, sorry. Now, who are you again? Right. Are you good guy, bad guy? There was no good guys in this. No, there's no good guys. But it was hard to figure out what is everyone's motive. You know what I mean? What's your angle, dude? Where are you coming from? That's what I had trouble with. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it was not even totally clear after watching it. I was like, what were they doing? So we should probably talk about the plot. So the movie starts with our boy, Ichi, number one killer. And he's watching some gangster beat up his woman. Right. And he jacks off to it. Then the camera... Yeah, he's a peeper. Yeah, he's a peeper. Bit of a peeper. Bit of a... clearly has some issues. Maybe not the best with the ladies. No. Or the dudes. Yeah, he wasn't really good with anybody. Right. Then the camera flies through Tokyo, which I thought was kind of a cool scene. Yeah, yeah, it was a cool scene. And we get to this other bar or place or room, whatever. And we see this Yakuza group, just kind of... whatever, like generic Yakuza group. You don't have to know much about them. And they're talking about their boss, what's going on with the boss. And we come to find out the boss is missing. And your blonde dude, whose name I don't remember. He's second in charge. Yeah, he's kind of like the enforcer kind of guy, right? Right. Oh, I'm still... Kakehara? Kakehara. Kakehara. Kakehara. Let's see with your Japanese pronunciation. Have you been practicing? I was. That's one of the easier ones. Right. So, Kakehara, he's this dude, he's got these piercings through his cheeks. Very interesting face. Looks like he's had barbed wire raked across his face. Blonde hair, dresses like a 70s pimp. Just, he stands out. Well, when we first meet him, there's a scene where he's smoking. And you see him from behind. And you see the smoke coming out of his two cheeks. I thought that was pretty cool. I thought that was pretty cool, too. And so you're just like, what is this dude's deal? And everyone seems kind of scared of him. Rightfully so. Because he's not the baddest guy, but he's the craziest guy, right? It's like, you might be tougher, but I'm crazier. And crazy always wins. Crazy always wins. So, the boss is missing, they're trying to figure out who did it. There's a couple different groups. There's these three guys who were ousted from the Yakuza, and they're doing cleanup jobs. They're basically just cleaning up Ichi the Killer's messes. Yeah, they work for the guy who's Ichi's handler. Who just has Ichi kill whoever he doesn't like, pretty much. And these other guys go and clean up. They're all ex-cops or something? I don't know. I got confused on all that. The Killer was an ex-cop, and his son, and I got really confused. Then we got this other group, who's kind of a rival Yakuza, and that's who they suspect initially. Start torturing this one dude, string him up. Oh, yeah. By his back, meat. Yeah, I don't know. That's an image you'll never forget. Oh, that was awful. It looked real. It was disturbing. It was interesting. I've never seen anything like that before. It's one of those things you're like, okay, now I know what that looks like. I wonder how they did it. Yeah, I don't know. Who knows? Props to the special effects department here, because it seemed pretty low budget, but it looked real. So, they string him up, poke him up, cut off his ichi. It turns out he's innocent. He's trying to get revenge on the guy who did it. Yeah, Kakehara. So, we got Kakehara looking for his master, Anjo. I can't remember his name. It's one of those two. I don't think we ever see the dude, right? No, we never see him. So, that's happening. Also, we got ichi going through his own things. He's an incel, right? He's an incel who has been told that he witnessed this rape when he was younger, and that's what troubles him, but also it's what he fantasizes about. It's kind of these both things at the same time. He gets really uncomfortable when he's around women because he gets aroused, but also he wants to kill them. Rape them and kill them. Rape them and kill them. I don't think he rapes them. No, that's true. He can't. For some reason, he just wants to kill them. His technique is he's got this blade on his boot, which seems like that's your one move. I don't know. It seems like people would figure it out eventually, but maybe not. They don't have a chance. I guess. He's so fat. People are surprised by him. That's true, but we'll get to the end. Again, we watched this movie a month and a half ago, and I'm just going from memory. There's all these competing factions, kind of like different people trying to track down each other, and there's this dame involved. We should mention her. She was a real interesting character. She was, I think, Chinese but spoke English, and she was kind of – I don't know if she was the head of a brothel or just popular in a brothel. Her name is Karen. Karen, yeah. Always Karen. Spoke English. Yeah, she was just kind of like a hooker who knew things. Right. So she gets roped in. First of all, she gets involved with Kakihara, and they have this brief relationship where we realize that Kakihara actually likes being tortured. Right. That's his whole thing. And then later it's revealed that that's why he's so resolute to find his master because his master would torture him, and there's this indication that maybe there's some eroticism there as well. Right. Like maybe you all never banged, but you got off on him torturing you. Yeah. If that makes any sense. Yeah. Who knows what they're thinking? So him and Karen have this brief thing, and then Karen gets roped into getting Ichi to do something. It seems like he was going to do it anyway. Anyway, so she tries to seduce him, but she's like, wait, wait, wait, I'm just joking, but he's already, once you flick that Ichi trigger, he's on. Right. And so he— Kills her. Yeah. He slices her neck open and that's that. Or he cuts her in half. I can't remember. Cuts her in half. Or no, I think first he cuts her throat. I don't know. I got those mixed up too. Now, she wasn't the one who came and said, yeah, I was the one that was raped. She was. Yeah, okay, she was, okay. Yeah, she came and she was like, actually, you're rape fantasy, that's me, and I want to like—she was kind of like, I want you to rape me again. Right, right. And then he's like, okay, and then she's like, wait, stop. It's like, what are you thinking? I don't understand, like, what did you think this transaction was going to end like? Right. Like, either you get raped or you get killed. They're not great options. Right. And so he kills her. Doesn't really impact the story as far as I understand. It's just one more thing that happens. No, it's just one more thing that happens. Yeah. So we got Ichi's handler who—let me grab his name real quick. It's not Suzuki. It's Jiji. Jiji. Which means old man. Yeah. So the old man is now trying to, like, for lack of a better word, sick Ichi onto Takihara and that crew. And so he does. And Takihara's crew is like these two twins who I think were cops or used to be cops. They used to be cops. And they were played by the same guy. It wasn't real twins. Movie magic. Yeah. Yeah, they're ex-cops because there is another ex-cop that's with them. I forgot about him. Yeah, see, that's— It's convoluted, right? It was just kind of an unnecessary character, I thought. I don't know. All right. So, yeah, we'll talk about that cop. So that cop, that ex-cop who was a sharpshooter, they made clear to mention that, never comes up later. No. Right? He never, like, saves the day with his sharpshooting. No, it's just a throwaway line almost. And so Ichi befriends his son. His son's getting bullied. Ichi kind of saves him. And then later, this guy, this ex-cop befriends Ichi because he's all beat up and he takes him and buys him some noodles. And the cop is kind of like flashbacking, flashing back to how he was in the same situation. And that's how the gangsters found him and sort of like brought him in. And so that's how he became a gangster. Yeah. So that's right? I think that's how it is. Okay. Did we watch this movie? A month ago. Yeah. And so, and then also, Takihara has this henchman or friend or guy who's like this really deep voice guy. And he's just sort of like, I'm just here hanging out. And the final showdown comes down. Gigi gets involved with that big tough guy. Gigi rips off his clothes. Turns out Gigi is a bodybuilder. He's like this big, he's short. He just looks, it's almost deformed. I mean, that's something that plays much better in the comic book, I think, than the movie. Because it made no sense. It came out of nowhere. It was never referred to again. It was just kind of like, this thing happened, okay. But I guess he's pretty tough, too. Because he ripped this guy, killed this one guy. Yeah. He didn't really need Gigi. He didn't really need Ichi. Right. Yeah. So there's a showdown on the roof. Takihara and Ichi are fighting. And Takihara is kind of like wanting to die. Like this is the ultimate ecstasy is like to be killed by this grand killer. Right. He does. He gets killed. And then that cop's son is there. The cop gets killed. Things turn blue. Right. And it looks like the son is killed. Ichi kills the son. But then we flash forward to what looks like an older version of the son is walking down the street. And we see the old man hung himself. The end. Thoughts, Matt? The end. I don't know. This movie's a trip. Yeah, I just got so confused a lot of times who in the hell everybody was. I probably would have actually enjoyed it a little more. I mean, it's got, you know, some great shots. Oh, yeah. Yeah. You know, good acting kind of, you know. It does a lot with very little. Right. Yeah. So it's an interesting film. It's not a piece of crap, but there's very few people that would like this movie. It is so violent. It's violent, and it's also convoluted. So you're like, what the hell is going on? Why are they doing this? Right. It's one of those movies, like, you have to watch it, read about it, and then watch it again and go, oh, okay. Right. Which I don't know if that's the sign of a great movie. No, it's not. If that happens. Yeah. But I did like the way that it portrayed the Yakuza as, like, a bunch of, like, low-life, like, literal dirtbags, like, living in, like, grime. Right. You know, so many movies you see them in, like, it's like shiny suits, high life, you know, but these guys were, like, bottom of the barrel. Yeah. It's like watching Donnie Brasco when you find out, oh, these guys are just breaking into parking meters, these hoods. You know, they're not flashy. They're not anything, you know. Yeah, same thing. You see this. Yeah, it's just it just goes too far. I mean, it's repetitive a little bit, you know, with the killing. So, but, yeah, you know, big thumbs up to the people who did the artwork and stuff like that. The guts. The guts and stuff like that. Yeah, there's that scene where, like, those three guys walk in and clean up after Ichi, and they're slooping around on the guts. Yeah, yeah. It's pretty good. Yeah, it's got a little, you know, it's got a little humor to it, which I think, you know, you said in the first movie there should have been a little more humor in it, I think. So, if I'm trying to make sense of this movie, Takihara is in love with his master. Right. Ichi is in love with... Nobody. No one? He's an incel. He's an incel. He's just really messed up. The cop wants to be a gangster like Takihara? I was trying to understand, like, what is everyone's deal? Like, what's the... Why does this character exist? What's their motivation? What's propelling the action forward other than Ichi's cutting chicks' heads off? Right, right, right. It didn't quite flow for me, I guess, in a way. Like, maybe it's over my head, I'm just missing it. Maybe there's subtext there that's just beyond me, but I couldn't quite figure out, like, why is everyone doing the things that they're doing? Yeah. I don't know. I guess it's because it's a comic book, you know? But, I don't know. I'm trying to think of... I think I know one person I could recommend this movie to. One of one? Well, he's the one who turned me on to Oldboy and things like that. I mean, it's in that world. Right, right. Yeah, I don't know. Like, Oldboy's maybe more disturbing in a way. This is a comic book kind of violence, you know? Yeah, a little bit. It seems less serious. Yeah, you're the killer. Any other thoughts, Matt? No, I'm thoughtless. Thoughtless, yeah. All right, you want to guess some scores? Sure. IMDB, we have 58,000 people checking in. 7-1? You went one too high. Exactly a seven. Is it? It's in the sevens. Yeah, low sevens. Yeah, low seven. You'll never see anything like it, but also maybe there's a reason for that. Right. Oh, yeah, there's so many things we forgot. Like, we forgot about the time where Kaki Hara cut out his own tongue. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, that was... oh. Because he wronged the gangster in a way that was... He didn't want to give up his life, so he's like, how about this? And he throws it out, and the guys are like, I don't want this. So there was a lot going on in this movie. I don't know, like the connection, I don't know, it just didn't add up to me. It's like they're just throwing stuff against the wall and hoping it's stuck. That kind of thing. Yeah, I mean, in a way it's stuck, but also it's like, I don't know. Maybe I need to watch it again. Maybe that's it. Maybe I was just zoning out too much or just turned off by the violence or trying to make my wife not think I was a creepo for watching some crazy Japanese violent porn thing. All right, Matt, this is a first, I think. Zero reviews on Let's Make a Meter. Really? Yeah. I guess there's no score. There's no score. The audience, fewer than 50 ratings. I'll go 7, 6. 50%. Yeah. Not a lot of fans of Each of the Killer. You know, it's funny because I thought this was considered more like a cult classic than the numbers are bearing out. Like 7 on IMDb, that's fair. I thought maybe it would be like 7, 2. I don't think it's a 7, 2, but I thought it would be like a 7, 2, 7, 3 just based on how I've heard people talk about this movie. Right. But maybe that's how people talked about this movie 20 years ago. Yeah. Maybe it's lost its luster. Yeah, they re-released it. So maybe that's… I mean, we watched the uncut version in case you were wondering. Yeah, no wonder. All right, are you ready to wrap it up? Yeah, well, next week, what are we… Next week, the theme is Lady Thieves. We're going to watch an old Hitchcock movie called Marnie. I think Sean Connery is in there. There is Sean Connery. And a new Netflix movie starring Aubrey Plaza called Emily the Thief. Okay. All right, peace. Bye. He's a philistine. What's a philistine? It's a guy who doesn't care about books or interesting films and things. Then I'm a philistine. No, you're interested in books and things. No, I'm a philistine. You've been shitting in my yard. I have not. You want me to hold the chicken, huh? I want you to hold it between your knees. So Jane, what you do here in effect is a count of owners. I'm sure that I agree with you 100% on your police misdereliverance. I'm in the kitchen. You in the kitchen. I'm as bad as hell and I'm not gonna take this anymore! It's fun!