the POWER of PAUSE: UNCORKED with ADAM HAMMERMAN

In this UNCORK conversation, Tim Windsor and Adam Hammerman explore the dynamic tension between pursuing bold goals and embracing the power of “pause.” Through personal stories, practical insights, and compelling lessons, they challenge listeners to rethink the glorification of constant busyness and discover how intentional pauses can transform personal resilience and professional success.

Adam shares how a life-changing experience motivated him to push past his limits and become a volunteer EMT, teaching the importance of turning discomfort into growth. Tim reflects on the wisdom of creating margin in life, inspired by a farmer’s lesson on letting land lie fallow to regenerate. Together, they unpack practical strategies for recharging without guilt, honouring rest as a tool for productivity, and creating space for meaningful human connections.

Key Challenges and Lessons:

Breaking the Cycle of Burnout: Are you running so hard that you risk burnout? Adam and Tim discuss simple ways to press pause and regain clarity, even if you’re not ready for an entire “Sabbath” day.

Creating Margin for Growth: Learn why leaving "space" in your schedule, finances, and energy—just like a farmer leaves part of the field unharvested—can empower you to thrive rather than just survive.

Respecting and Empowering Others’ Downtime: Tim and Adam explore why respecting others’ rest—whether in your personal or professional life—is a vital leadership skill that builds trust and loyalty.

This episode offers practical wisdom and real-life applications for anyone ready to run hard, rest well, and live with intention. Don’t miss this inspiring conversation!

Tim Windsor
the UNCOMMODiFiED Podcast – Host & Guide
tim@uncommodified.com
https://uncommodified.com/
 
PRODUCERS: Kris MacQueen & Alyne Gagne
MUSIC BY: https://themacqueens.com

Transcript

PLEASE NOTE: UNCOMMODiFiED Podcast episode transcriptions are raw text files and have not been proofed or edited. They are what they are … Happy Reading.

© UNCOMMODiFiED & TIM WINDSOR

[00:00:00] 

Have you ever felt torn between the relentless drive to keep running after your goals and the deep need to stop and recharge? At the end of the day, life isn't just all about running hard and running fast. It's about knowing when to pause, when to reflect, and when to refuel. And in this core conversation.

We're going to explore the powerful tension charging forward with purpose and embracing rest as a strategy for building resilience and empathy in our life. Hey, my friends, welcome back to the uncommodified podcast. I'm Tim Windsor, and I'll be your host for another encore conversation. My favorite kind of conversation.

My guest tonight on the show is Adam Hammerman. Adam, welcome to the show.

Thank you Tim. Glad to be here.

That's gonna be awesome. Adam and I were recently introduced by a former guest of my show, Nancy Gento Boudre. If you haven't listened to that episode, you gotta listen to it. And I'm really glad that she connected us.

Adam and I, uh, chatted over Zoom a little while ago, and during that initial conversation, I just had this sense that, uh, I had to have Adam on my show and have [00:01:00] this conversation. So here's a quick intro just so you get to know him a little bit as well. Adam is the Vice President and Chief Financial Officer of the New York Medical College, a member of Truro University.

Prior to joining the team there, Adam held the finance and operations positions at the 92nd Street Y. The museum of the city of New York and the town school. And additionally, he's a New York state certified technician, and for over 30 years, he's volunteered with the Hotsalah Ambulance. Adam, this is an uncorked conversation.

I did warn you about this. And in these kind of conversations, I uncork a drink and then we get things started. What you going to be drinking tonight, sir?

I have a lovely single malt scotch right here. All ready to go.

Looks good. Looks good. What is that single malt scotch?

is a 15 salami.

that's a good one. That's a good one. Well, you know, since you're in the good old United States of America, I decided to go American bourbon. So I'm going to have some, I got this really nice bottle of Angel's [00:02:00] Envy bourbon.

that too is delicious.

a delicious bourbon.

And I got, so I just opened it specifically for this conversation

Not very

I figured that would be good. So cheers to you, sir.

Cheers.

That is excellent stuff. All right, let's get into this. So Adam, You and I are going to explore this idea again, how to turn bold ideas into action while honoring the sacred rhythm of rest and work and how it interplays in our life. And that's the interesting theme for me that came out of our conversation that we had.

I was actually in my car when we had that conversation. Yeah, I was in my car and I was in a parking lot. We're having that conversation. So, you know, when we chatted, here's what I took away. It's pretty clear to me that your life embodies this spirit of charging forward. And, and getting things done, making things happen is a big part of who you are, yet you also have this ability to balance that somehow in your life, and that is fascinating.

So I want you to think about a moment when you [00:03:00] pushed yourself to the limit to accomplish something. When you dug deep, when you drove hard, and , you accomplished something that was very significant for you. I'm interested to know, what does that kind of journey look like in Adam's life?

Well, so there are two big stories, per se, in my life that really come, come to light when, when you ask me about pushing. You know, the first one, obviously, is when you introduced me about becoming an EMT. You know, when, uh, Hotzala was first being formed in, in the Riverdale area in the Bronx, , my father and I were approached, would you like to join?

And I was 18 at the time. And both my father and I looked at each other like, To have someone's life in your hands, that's a big responsibility. And it's a lot of studying, it's a lot of knowledge you have to have, and you know, God forbid something, it's just so much on your shoulders. Well, fast forward a couple of months, we go to Israel to visit my cousins, my aunt and uncle, they're my [00:04:00] cousins.

We, the plane lands, my aunt, my uncle, and my cousin who are both medics in the army there, pick us up, we pull out of the airport, and from the, between the time that they picked us up and they were pulling out, a garbage truck had flipped over, right there. The driver unfortunately went right through the windshield, hit the pavement.

We were like the first ones on the scene. And it was a mess. It was really, really a sad, sad situation. My aunt, uncle, and my cousin both pulled over. They jumped out of their cars. They had these small little, you know, emergency packs in their car. They ran over and, , they started to help the patient. , and, , unfortunately it was like the rest of us could just stand around and stare.

Ambulances came. They all took care of the patient. At the end, you know, we were just, felt terrible. And my father and I just looked at each other and said, Never again are we going to just be standing there. We are going to push ourselves to, no matter what it takes, this is something that, like, raises above, we should all be able to [00:05:00] help each other.

And, fast forward another year, by age 19 I became an EMT. My father became an EMT, my mother took the class with us, it was a very interesting time taking a class, an EMT class with your parents at age, , 18. Especially when it came up to trial birth. Here's a funny story. The teacher's saying, you know, in class, you know, once in a while you'll encounter, you know, you have to, , trial birth, once in a while you'll encounter a breach birth.

The teacher looks right past me, Yes, Mrs. Hammerman, Adam was a breach, it was terrible. So now, so the entire class and now everyone who's watching this podcast knows that I backed into this world.

Oh my gosh, that, that's,

yeah, so. But thank God we pushed ourselves, and that's what I'm talking about, pushing. We pushed ourselves, and then after that, for the past, you know, since I've been 19, and that's a good number of years ago, given the gray beard, I've been able to, thank God, be there for a [00:06:00] childbirth, for, unfortunately, having, having to deal with someone who CPR done.

for, for saving someone who's choking, for major traumas, all kinds of things. , I was there at 9 11, I was there at Miracle in the Hudson, , for different events. Times we pushed, and you have to, and suddenly, when you realize that you can handle it, you know, you feel, there is a sense of calm, because all of a sudden, now you're in an emergent situation, be it, not necessarily life threatening, but work environment.

I can handle this step by step. I know what to do. So pushing yourself sometimes really allows you to bring it down from the push to the every day we can handle this.

That's, that's, first of all, that's a fascinating story. It's, It's an interesting way that you find yourself, you know, saying, I can do this. And you're going to move beyond the discomfort of the learning process, which isn't easy. And so, this thing that happens to you where you see something [00:07:00] and you then are catalyzed towards action Is this a reoccurring theme in your life?

Does this show up along the way in Adam's life where you go? You know, I I this is going to be difficult, but I know I can do it and I know I can make that happen

The one thing I, have talked to people at work is we don't ever like to reward mediocrity. You know, mediocrity is not a way to, , Just get by in life. You know, some people, yes, you find a comfort level, you stay, but you always have to do just a little bit more. So, even like, you know, that second story I was going to tell you about when I was first started to work at the 92nd Street Y, I, I remember meeting with the executive director, just pulling this out, I had some, some one on one time with him, and I said, you know, Please, you know, you obviously started, he was actually a former accountant.

He said, he used to joke around, I'm a reformed accountant. But he, he, uh, he, he said, Adam, everything you can read, [00:08:00] read. Get your hands on something here, read it, understand it. And I took that and I even went a step further. And I was a junior accountant at the time. And I remember the cash receipts manager had to go on a medical leave.

I remember saying to the controller at the time, instead of hiring someone as a temp, let me do it. I'll stay late. already know the basics of cash receipts. I'm going to learn more about it. Same thing happened when the accounts payable manager had to go in FMLA. I said, wait. I can do this and I'll get it done.

I had to work many, many more hours, but I got it done. And you know what happened? After I was able to start doing more and more, I was able to prove to everyone else around, I became the go to guy. And suddenly when the controller said that he was going to be leaving, and then the controller, I'm still friends with the, former associate executive director there, the, the former controller, but they basically, like I said, I'd like to apply for this [00:09:00] position as controller at age 25. They looked outside and they said, you know what? Adam is really the best choice. And at age 25, I became the controller. Of course I was a young guy and I had to, had a lot on my shoulders, but I made it work. And someone else once told me, when you're looking at something and there are problems and there's things that seem so massive, and this is a great example for life, step by step, step by step, one thing, just like even like you have to clean up a room.

Step by step. And, , it's really very, very helpful. So, you, you, pushing yourself, in general, is always a great way of, of doing things and of a great outlook. But if you take it step by step, like on an emergency call, step by step. Mm

experiences. You have this experience where you're at this accident event and it catalyzes you to move beyond. Say to yourself, you and your father say, you'll never find yourself in that situation [00:10:00] again. It calls you and catalyzes you to action. You have this experience as a young man as you're getting into your career where you see opportunities and you don't see them as, barriers.

You see them as opportunities and you say, I could do that. And then you. Press in and you move into that. You, you, you're called to action in that as well. So that, that's really interesting. So clearly you're a person who runs hard in your life, chasing those goals, the dreams, the aspirations that you have.

So as you're running hard, doing life hard, um, you also, in the conversation that you and I had, you have this other part of your life experience, which is very counterintuitive to this running hard. You have this understanding and have built in a discipline around taking time to stop and recharge and rest.

And of course, in your tradition and in your experience, this is what we would call Sabbath. [00:11:00] And so I'm interested, how does Sabbath or what role does Sabbath and resting play in energizing. This ferocity towards action that you have.

So, you know, there's always, you know, everyone always sees, like, you know, you look on a, the old tape recorders, there's that pause button. Mm hmm. And we always hit, hit pause, A, to just, okay, think about what you just listened to or think about what you just experienced. Even in watching a movie, pause. I want to take in what I just saw in life.

You know, we all have to hit that pause button. And I, I personally, during the week, my pause button and my escape is I'm going to go to the gym. And I'm gonna work out and, and, and really be able to say, you know, okay, I've been working, okay, in between sets, I can sit there and like, [00:12:00] While I'm working out, I'm focusing on not making sure the weight doesn't hit me.

But when I'm pausing, and because your body has to physically pause to get strength again to do that next set, you know, that's the time for me not only to like breathe, but also to think about what's going on. What's going on today? What happened today? What do I need to do? What email do I have to send later?

 To be able to refocus. Vacations, before we get into the Sabbath thing, vacations in general. In many businesses, they force you. You can not only get your vacation, but you must take vacation. Okay, because we don't want to get burnout. And life, if you keep going, if you keep going, your engines, you need to maintain them.

You need, we need to hit pause and take that vacation. Now, sometimes when you take a vacation and you're constantly touring, that's a very tough idea. But when you, everyone loves those vacations and those are the memorable ones. When you're able to sit back on a beach, sit back by a pool and just breathe.

And [00:13:00] feel the warmth and feel, feel, enjoy with the scenery, whatever it is, and just enjoy doing something. That's a , time to hit, pause and recharge.

Yeah. So so you're building this into your life on a regular basis throughout your career, , which obviously is important. And by the way, if you're listening, you're listening for a reason. You might be one of the people who, you know, sort of you believe that you are celebrated because you've never ever taken a day off.

And somehow that's a badge of honor. I think that Adam's giving you some wise advice here that you're more like the earth than you are like a machine.

Right.

it's that, it's kind of interesting. Years ago, a guy was born, I was raised in the city. I was born and raised in a city in Canada.

And when we got married, my wife and I, , rented a farmhouse, , just outside of our community and it was Owned by a community group of Hutterites, who are like, , sort of like Amish people, and they owned a series of farms, and so we lived in one of the farmhouses on this farm, and I'd never really [00:14:00] seen a farm before, and I noticed that they didn't use all their land.

Very wisely in my opinion. They, they had, you know, they had some crops and then they had land that sat empty and I, I thought that was a real waste of farmland. So one time, the guy's name was Joe, who the farmer came to, to work on our farm. We had, there was cattle, there were some pigs and stuff and he would come and I said to him, Joe, like, why, why do you guys not utilize your land better?

 Why do you not use this personal land? And he goes, Tim, you're from the city, aren't you? And I said, yeah. He goes, well, Tim, if we use the land. Every year, and we didn't let it lie fallow, it would eventually not be able to produce anything. And the idea of, leaving the land fallow to regenerate, I didn't understand.

And so he actually took me into the field and he had me touch the soil and experience it. And he imparted to me some really powerful wisdom that time about leaving Something fallow in the land and in your life [00:15:00] so that it can regenerate to grow more and that as a as a 21 year old, when I first got married, I was turning 21.

That was a life lesson. I'll never forget.

It's, there is a Jewish law about that, about your land has to actually, every seven years, has to sit fallow for it because there's a respect for it and there's a, you have to be able to allow it to sit fallow. have that hit pause. And for people who have visited Israel, they actually find that have to figure out how the farmers are going to work and sustain themselves during that time of hitting pause, so to speak.

And they get by, thank God. But, , in any event, as I said, there's that pause. And just like when we talked before about Sabbath.

Yeah,

 Everyone, everyone observes the Sabbath to their own extent. But for someone in my position as a modern Orthodox Jew, I [00:16:00] actually am, it's like a forced savings. It is that I have to watch the clock on a Friday, and at sundown on Friday, till sundown on Saturday, I must hit pause.

There are no, no phones. Obviously, to save a life, you know, when I was an EMT, to save a life, you can, I've gone into houses, you know, on a Sabbath, and I would like, call for an emergency. I'm like, why are the lights off? Well, it's Sabbath. You know, okay, I'm turning on the light because I need to see the patient, and that, that's going to be the, but, for on a regular Sabbath, there is the pause.

And you sit and you get to really step back and breathe and say okay, this is what's happened this week, let's be able to go through what, what happened, all the work we've done. But also now, everyone in your immediate circle is doing the same exact thing. How [00:17:00] many times have like, you've been like, I'm sure I, I know I've been.

A nice romantic dinner, you go to a restaurant, no matter how much you are appreciating being with that person, I am confident that there's a cell phone either on the table, even if you have it face down, or in your pocket or something like that. But, we don't have that. There is no distraction whatsoever, and suddenly you're forced to, in a really, really nice way, to be with your family, to be with the, or be with whomever, and be able to talk, and be able to really appreciate what it is we're working for.

Now, you can discuss things that happened at work, and all this, how was your week, what happened this week, what's going on, what's your hopes and aspirations for next week, what kind of, just to talk. And it's an incredible, incredible recharge, that very often you just have to say, wow, I get to do this. Some people would find it a burden.

It's like [00:18:00] oh my god. You can't you can't have the phone. You can't watch TV I mean when I was a little kid Saturday morning cartoons. Oh my gosh. I could not watch Saturday morning cartoons That was the biggest thing well people who I know who weren't observant or anything like that were watching say did you see this cartoon?

I never saw it. I felt like oh my god is terrible. You know what? I, I made it through. I made it through. And, and it's, it's an incredible, incredible time to, to just really, you know, you hit pause and it's like a, as I said, it's a forced savings. Right.

do think that, unfortunately, our culture has gotten away from so many of these things. I mean, I think back even like, obviously, I'm from Canada. I remember still in my day and age, I'm going to turn, I'm going to turn 60 this year. And, you know, when I was a child, for instance, 

there was no Sunday shopping. There was not like things were closed on Sunday. Totally. You couldn't go anywhere. Of course, it was, it was Sunday, in our culture, but there was a day of [00:19:00] pause. There was no, things weren't open. You couldn't shop. You couldn't do any of these things. And, you know, I'm not sure in our progression towards this idea of more and more and more and more.

I wonder if it's really taking us in the direction we want to go in the end. I wonder if we're we're actually getting something we don't want in the end with this, because the reality is, is that when you build in these times at rest and have a habit of that, I would imagine that your productivity is probably uniquely enhanced.

As a result of taking pause. Whereas it's counterintuitive because we think that seems to be a waste of time.

It, it, the term burnout, it's, it's not, it's not just a term, it's a reality. And being able to hit pause in whatever shape or form, You know, look, not everyone has that ability to just turn things off and, you know, I, you know, look, when I was on, [00:20:00] when I, when I'm being an EMT, I had the radio with me all the time, okay?

But, you know what? That was to save a life and, you know, and I didn't go on every single call, you know, and as I got older, I went on fewer and fewer calls, ambulance calls. , but I even say to this day, point though, I let the younger guys do it. Thank God for the younger guys who were able to jump. but, It's a gift to be able to say, I am going to hit pause and focus on, focus on me, you know, a, a Saturday afternoon nap.

We call it a Shabbos nap. You know, it's an incredible thing. Yep.

phone down on the weekend and leaving it. I guess I put it on my dresser and I leave it there. And, and I found that to be you know, really, really healthy for me. You know, at the end of the day, if somebody needs us they can contact my wife.

But you know, I often think back to the time we didn't have cell phones and you had a [00:21:00] at home, if you were out, you just didn't answer the phone. I mean, that's just the way it was. But we've become so dependent on so many of these things where we, where we, we feel we have more connection, but probably are less connected than we ever are to ourselves and to the world around us.

So as an executive, I mean, you obviously have, a, big, big job that you do every day when you go to work, you manage lots of people, big budgets, all the stuff that you're doing in your world. What do you think that these, this sort of habit, how has it made you better at what you do, do you think?

I respect people's downtime.

Hmm.

When I need someone. during, during the day, you know, yes, they're there and they're having an incredible team is very important. And the word I will always use is team. And that puts [00:22:00] things us all together. You know, we're all on, on the same playing level. I try to be a good coach where I can, but we all work towards the same goal.

And I, and I always tell people, you know, I, I hate the term my staff, my staff, my staff. The team, our team, we're gonna figure this out together. But when the team goes home. I'll send emails. I tell people, I don't expect you to answer it. Oh, I, if we all, some people need their downtime , and they have their, dinners and sometimes they go back to their emails after dinner or some people shut down early but wake up early.

You know, everyone has their downtime and I don't expect everyone to be focusing on my time. So, that's the most important thing that I see in terms of The hitting pause is respecting other people's pause, in whatever capacity they take it.

That's, there's a lot of, a lot of wisdom in there. Again, if you're listening in, I'm just going to challenge you to think, what does this mean for you? So what does it mean [00:23:00] to run hard, to make things happen, to see a problem? Like Adam did in his life and say, I can solve that. I can make it happen. I can learn, I can build capacity to do great things at the same time.

While not, not, but, but, and honoring this understanding of rejuvenation and replenishment in our life, I, that's a very powerful idea. And again, if you're listening in, I really want to challenge you. Maybe right now you got to hit pause in this podcast and just ask yourself, why am I listening? And what is.

This conversation mean to me, because that to me is a really important thing. And, you know, Adam, we said we would sort of find the conversation along the way that we wanted to have. So I'm interested explore this idea. So you have within your tradition this idea of the Sabbath rest, this idea of pause.

 You mentioned that, you know, I was telling you about my experience on the farm. You mentioned that, you know, within that your tradition, there's this idea again, letting land lie [00:24:00] fallow every seven years, , if I understand correctly as well, and I, I do a lot of reading. So I have maybe a cursory knowledge of some of these things, not that I think the same knowledge that you would have.

But I also think that there is a principle within Jewish tradition, also from the farming sort of tradition around leaving a margin in your field, the, , the outskirts of your field and not actually harvesting all that you can. you plant or that you could gain food or income from.

That's true.

 What, help, help me understand a little bit more about that.

And what do you see in that idea that's also informative? Because I think they're connected ideas.

, so there, there is that, , you leave a portion of your field, there's that rule that for, , As like a, , I guess a way of saying as a donation. , and you let other, the poor, and they come and they can harvest it themselves. [00:25:00] It's basically giving charity, but not actually handing it to them. Letting them like go forth and get it themselves on their own.

And they feel like, I'm gonna harvest it myself. I'm gonna do the work. Now granted I couldn't have done it without the farmer letting me do this. But it's empowering people. And that's what we do, like, not only does it allow, I think that there's the term, , in Catholicism, like a tithe.

 So, just like, in synagogue, we have charity boxes, people do have them at home, and just like in church, you know, you have the baskets that people through, you're giving through. Here, in a farm, It's like, this is their way of giving a, percentage to the, the poor and allowing them not only just to take the handout, but to work for it.

And when you allow people to really work and learn. You know, what's that saying? You know, give a man a fish, you know, you feed him food, you teach a man to fish. You know, that [00:26:00] may be allowing suddenly the poor who don't necessarily have that ability, suddenly they start learning, oh, how am I going to start harvesting?

Oh, maybe I could do this on my own. Maybe I could start, you know, and it'll allow me to grow even further. , when I, , worked with, junior accountants, I could very easily, very often, you know, figure certain things out of how we're going to do it. I remember one accountant. who came into my office and they kept questioning me and questioning me.

What about this? How do I do this? How do I do this? I remember saying to the person, I trust you. And we're just doing accounting here. I want you to go through the entire process. And you know what? If you make a mistake, we can reverse the journal entry. But I, I believe in you. And all of a sudden it's like, they suddenly are like, oh yeah.

 We're just doing counting, you know. When, when people learn things, when people understand things. You know, also, another way of hitting pause is an, an EMT story. I was once on a very bad [00:27:00] call in a health club, where I was the first one on the scene, and there was a first responder who happened to be, you know, working in the health club.

They knew the basic first aid. And the person was deteriorating very quickly. And I had an ambulance on the way to back up, and I'm there, and I said, you know, I'm taking out my BVM, my Bariatric Vascular Mass, because I know I'm going to end up having to breathe for this person. And the first responder says, Oh my God, I think they're going to stop breathing.

And I had a look at them, and I said, And if they do, we know what to do. And they looked at me and they said, You're right. You empower people. All of a sudden you realize, okay, I have this knowledge. I'm going to grow and I'm going to be able to do things. We can, you know, every step by step it all circles back.

Step by step. Yeah. , it's a very interesting thing. You know, you know, I love this idea of, again, empowerment and that this idea of leaving that margin of the field, which is interesting because it, what it [00:28:00] does is it dignifies the person actually

Mm hmm.

to, to do the work required to harvest, to eat.

But I also think, and I wonder if this is, I don't know, but I wonder historically that, you know, we talk about, you know, leaving a margin in our life, and I wonder if maybe ideas are connected because I think the challenge for all of us is we don't have any margin in our life. We live right to the edge of everything.

And I think that's problematic. I think unfortunately our culture rewards it. It lauds it celebrates it in some ways, but when you always live to the margin of your life, whether it's physically, whether it's financially, if you're always living to the extent of your bank account and maybe into overdraft, which a lot of people do as a company, as an organization, if you don't have margin, if you don't have.

 You know, if you don't have some, some excess that you used as a buffer zone, you're going to run into a subset of personal and professional, , financial problems. And [00:29:00] most of our society, unfortunately, if you think about it, lives well beyond the margin of their financial life because they use, they exist on credit.

They live well beyond their margin. And this is a macro problem in our life and it's a macro problem in business, in our society. Would you agree? Yes.

Oh, I, my parents taught this to me and I taught this to my kids. Never go grocery shopping and pay on credit. Meaning you can use your credit card as long as you pay that off. I use my credit card because heck, I can get the points. But, but you pay, when it comes to food. You make sure you can, you can pay for that.

Obviously, we all, you know, have certain times. I personally don't like living on debt at all. Obviously, for a mortgage, that's one thing. But for regular credit card expenses, if I can't afford it, I'm gonna, you know, think twice about it. Now, that's my personal. Obviously, business is, you know, there's a whole way of living on debt, you know, and operating on debt.

And, you know, I mean, you know, just a matter of fact, you know, [00:30:00] when you want to build something, that's how we come up with bonds and things like that, where you can't afford it, but there's a way to make it happen because that's how the world revolves in terms of

Yeah, no, for sure. So let me ask you, I want to sort of bring this conversation and wrap it up and I've got a couple questions that I'd like to do this. So if you were giving somebody coaching advice, we were giving me coaching advice and you were helping me say to take action. Maybe I was coming to you and say, Hey, I see a problem and I wish I could solve it, but I don't have the skills and I don't, I don't know if I can do it.

What, what's the best advice you would give me that would make me sort of seize the moment and say, get, just get up and do it. You can, you can do it, Tim. What, how would you encourage me to do that?

You, you're not necessarily, you don't know everything that you want to do, okay? But there's always a way to get to it. Like for, for example, when in my field, [00:31:00] when I was at, at the 92nd Street Y, I oversaw, aside from accounting, I oversaw operations as well. And,, I remember telling people, I don't know how to fix an HVAC system.

But I know the people that do. And I know enough to have them explain to me , what's going on, what the issues are, where, and also resources how to get further. If someone, if someone's out of work, is not working, is not at work that day, and I know that he's the expert, okay, or she's the expert, I can go to this other person, this vendor, how am I gonna get this done.

Same thing with anything that you're gonna be doing. As long as you know the direction to go to where you want to get . Be it a, I, I want to get a further degree. I want to get more information. I want to learn. I want, I'm not an accountant, but I want to learn accounting, okay? So many of us are very smart and we work with very, very smart people who know this is, I know this, but I know I can learn more.

[00:32:00] Do it. Just like that first advice that I ever got from the executive director of the 92nd Shrevepark. Read everything you can.

Yeah, you know what it's a good it's good advice because I think sometimes what happens is is that we we live it with a Sense of limitation when in fact we we have great capacity that we usually don't explore So let's move this question now in this direction. Let's say I'm saying let's say I'm on I'm starting to burn out in my life I'm not honoring the principle of Sabbath.

I'm not I don't I'm not getting this idea of rest You What would be your first piece of advice if I was going to try to move into something, start to explore that? What's the simplest way I can start doing that?

You know, it's again, you're trying to realize how you need to hit pause to think it through, and every morning many people make lists, or the night before they make lists of what they're planning on doing, either that day or the next day of the week. That's their way of hitting pause and being able to [00:33:00] regroup and regroup.

Even if it's a to do, oh, I gotta do this, and I gotta do this, I gotta do this. Well, that's a kind of way of saying, I'm pausing, and I'm lining things up. I'm organizing my life as to what has to happen. When I was at, at two, two different places, we were using antiquated accounting systems. And every night I'd go home and I'd be like, ah, this is, this is tough.

And I started to just do my own little research. And I remember back in the day, I We were using this old AS400 terminal based system. And I said, I know there's new stuff out there. And I remember talking to the director of IT, and I said, in this past weekend, Sabbath, I started just to think, and I'm like, There's gotta be something we can do.

His eyes opened so wide. I remember it's Connie Cadigat. He was such a guy. I'm so friendly with him. He was able to, he suddenly said, Yes, I want this. We can [00:34:00] do this, Adam. You know, and he was, and suddenly I had a partner in the IT department. And Connie and I went and we went to different vendors. And we went to different other places.

And we ended up putting a brand new accounting system in. You know, obviously, it's not just two of us that it took an entire village, so to speak, to get it done. But it's because we sat back, we hit pause, we talked about it, we thought it all through. And, and I actually ended up putting another accounting system in, in another place I worked, at the museum, when I was there.

And, because it made it a little bit easier that I had the experience of what had to go through after the first time. But I remember, It's only when you hit pause, do you get some clarity. Even those lists every day, every night. You get clarity of what's going to be. And that's my, that's my attitude.

It's great. It's great. And again, I think that makes it so accessible. So again, you know, you probably, you know, if you're listening in, you're probably not Ready to press pause from sundown [00:35:00] to sundown to sundown, probably not ready for that yet. You may, maybe, maybe someday, but a little pause, just what's a little pause that you can press day to day, week to week and get some habit forming and then maybe build up to larger times of pause.

But there's some real wisdom in this conversation. I'm going to encourage you to think about this as you leave. Again, we want to get stuff done. done. We want to accomplish great things. We want to take great action. We want to solve great problems, big problems, but we also want to understand that we need to recharge and reenergize ourself for the journey.

So real wisdom in this conversation. So let's, let's end our conversation here, Adam. So for me, this podcast is born out of this idea of uncommodified uncommodified for me is this idea that, if we're not careful, we become a commodity, not, not just the things we sell or the things we buy, but we become a commodity.

We become like everybody else because we're conditioned to fit in and sit down and and sort of fall into the background. But I actually believe that we were created in [00:36:00] unique ways to bring unique contributions. I think, Adam, you're a rather unique individual who's brought unique contributions to the worlds that you've interacted with over the years.

That's what intrigues me so much about you. just meeting you and talking to you. So here's a question. When you walk into a room and you're bringing that unique expression, that is Adam Hammerman, this, the unique expression of Adam into a room and you're being your most uncommodified self, you're being free to be who you were created to be.

What are you doing that is bringing a positive contribution in that room? What's that unique thing that Adam's bringing into that space that you know is providing a positive impact on the people you connect with?

One thing I, growing up, I was a very quiet kid. I, and people find it hard to believe. I used to like, you know, be at a, be at a table [00:37:00] and, you know, I'd look for someone, and Can you pass the salt? You know, wait for them to make eye contact. And I was always wowed by the guy who could walk into that room and start talking.

Well, I found that when I could not, I broke out of that shell and I said I'm gonna come in and not only am I going to emulate the people that I was wowed by that could walk into a room and say hi to everyone. I was also wowed by the people who, when they shook your hand, and when they looked at you, they made that connection.

People talk about, you know, Bill Clinton, how he was able to make it so that no matter what was going on you were the only person that he was talking with. I tried to do that, very much so. When I meet people, when I say hi to them, I look at them, I shake their hand. I'm always, I'm always, I'm always Uh, this is made by people who like, shake your hand, they're like, oh, and they start looking around, or they're just, you know.

Focus on the person that's in front of you. That will make them feel good about [00:38:00] their connection with you, and they'll remember that. And try to use their name. It's like a Dale Carnegie kind of like a trick, you know. Use their name. Remember their name. Any, and I actually, even if I've seen people, like if you and I would, would see each other, In a couple of weeks from now, I'll be like, Tim, Adam Hammerman, of course that, but this way it puts you at ease because let's just say, ooh, who's that guy I just, you know, and people will say, of course, Adam, I know you.

Yeah, that's great. Terrific. I just didn't make a difference. Now you're at ease. Put people at ease and make them appreciate having a conversation with you.

That, that's great advice and it really is an uncommodifying thing because there's so many times when we are with somebody sharing space and we're really not there. And so to actually be present in that moment for another human is a unique gift in and of itself. Adam, really wonderful conversation, really appreciate having it with you.

 I'm really challenged by [00:39:00] this conversation because rest is something I'm not great at. Admittedly, I am not great at it. My wife, my wife is really good at this from she understands it and I often say that I often say actually in the book that I wrote, talk about the uncommodified people that I've met their action and non action superheroes.

And I tell a story in that about my wife, and, when we go on vacation, if we go to, let's say, the Caribbean, you know, I jokingly say that my wife measures, , the quality of a day based on the depth of the lines that the chair has left in her legs.

that's great.

Uh, she knows how to rest, but she also Knows how to meditate.

And so she's almost every morning for the last, we've been married 38 years. And so over 30, yeah, it's probably a serious relationship by now, but every morning that I can remember for the past 38 years that we've lived together, [00:40:00] my wife has taken time and put it aside for meditation, for prayer, for her.

And that is a time a form of, pausing and collecting. And I am admittedly horrible at this. And so it's one of the reasons why I actually wanted to have this conversation with you, because this really is part of my own journey. I know how to get stuff done. I know how to work hard. I know how to make things happen.

I don't know how to rest well. And when I was talking to you and talking about all the accomplishment and all the things you did, and then all of a sudden we, we sort of went through this portal about rest. That was quite intriguing to me. And so thanks for giving me the gift of this conversation, because it's a real provocation to me.

I believe it'll be a provocation to the people who listen, and I really appreciate your time. And so as we finish up, I just want to say, if you listened in, you're listening for a reason. Do me a favor, email me at Tim at uncommodified. com. Look me up on social media, DM me, but let me know as you uncork the this conversation and contemplate it and [00:41:00] apply it.

Let Adam and I know what you're doing with this idea. How are you activating new things to get stuff done? And how are you activating times of pausing the button on your machine so that you can replenish yourself? Thanks again for listening. Have a great day. Cheers.