African Business Stories
African Business Stories is the go-to podcast for insights into the women shaping Africa’s business landscape. Africa is one of the world’s most promising frontiers for growth and innovation—and women are at the heart of this transformation.
Hosted by Akaego Okoye, this podcast spotlights female entrepreneurs who are breaking barriers, scaling businesses, and driving economic development across the continent. Through bold conversations, we explore funding, scaling strategies, digital transformation, and industry innovations—equipping you with insights, practical tools, and inspiration to navigate your own entrepreneurial journey.
When women win, economies thrive. These stories amplify success, challenge narratives, and create a blueprint for the next generation of female leaders in Africa and beyond.
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African Business Stories
Ifeoma Uddoh: Founder & CEO Shecluded - Innovating Finance: The Journey of Africa's First Female-Centric Fintech
What if the key to financial empowerment for women in Nigeria lies in one woman's journey from a police barracks to the boardroom? Join us as we welcome Ifoma Uddoh, the founder and CEO of SheCluded, a pioneering fintech credit company transforming the financial landscape for Nigerian women. Ifoma shares her poignant personal story of resilience, shaped by the early loss of her father and her mother's strength, to the highs and lows of her career—from PwC to launching SheCluded. Her narrative is a testament to grit and innovation, offering invaluable lessons on overcoming adversity and the power of determination.
Discover how a chance conversation pivoted Ifoma from a pharmacy hopeful to a tech trailblazer, despite not owning a personal computer during her studies. Her internships at Echo Bank and Diamond Bank fine-tuned her resilience and work ethic, while her role at PwC opened doors to a wider world of tech investing and exposed the glaring gender disparities in funding. Ifoma's eye-opening experiences in tech investing revealed how women juggle multiple roles and face unique challenges in entrepreneurship, igniting her passion to create a financial platform catered specifically to women.
In our conversation, Ifoma delves into the genesis and growth strategy of SheCluded, spurred by the personal challenges she faced during her third pregnancy. She lays out her vision for scaling the company and forming strategic partnerships across Africa to enhance women’s banking services. The discussion also tackles the subconscious biases in lending and the innovative use of alternative data to support female entrepreneurs. Ifoma’s insights on mindset shifts, business coaching, and networking provide a blueprint for aspiring women entrepreneurs. Tune in for an inspiring episode that underscores the transformative power of perseverance and vision.
Ifeoma studied Industrial mathematics at the Federal University of Technology (FUTO), Owerri in Nigeria and has a Masters in Management Science and Operational research from Lancaster University in the UK. She was named Top 5 female Entrepreneurs by UK Tech Hub in 2020. The recipient of the Google Black Founders Fund in 2021 and winner of the 2022 Select USA Tech Pitch competition, she was recently named a 2024 Echoing Green Fellow.
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Hi there and welcome to another episode of African Business Stories. Africa is the only region in the world where more women than men choose to be entrepreneurs. What this says to me is that the story of business in Africa is the story of the African business woman. So we are on a journey of discovery to find these women and tell their stories. On the show, we will hear from female innovators and entrepreneurs building and running businesses in Africa. They will share the highs and lows of their entrepreneurial journey and lessons learned along the way. Some of these women you may know and many you may not, but I assure you that all their stories are inspiring in their own right. My hope is that these stories will inspire you to reach for your dreams and leave a legacy for generations to come. It makes such a big difference to us if you can rate, review and share our episodes. You can do this mainly on Apple Podcasts, and you can find us on all podcast platforms If you're in Africa. Spotify is now available, so check us out there and don't forget to rate, review and share On the show.
Speaker 1:Today I chat with Ifoma Udo, the founder and CEO of SheCluded, a fintech credit company in Nigeria. We talk about an early childhood tragedy that shaped the person she is today. We trace her career trajectory from PwC into the Nigeria fintech ecosystem and how she landed on the idea of SheCluded, a company focused on improving the influence and finance strength of female entrepreneurs. Since it launched in 2019, shecluded has built a community of over 200,000 women, deployed over 1 billion naira in loans and, in 2023, launched the SheCluded Hub in Lagos, nigeria. The daughter of a teacher, she doesn't miss the opportunity to share lessons and insights from every experience or story. Let's get into it. Welcome to African Business Stories. Thank you for having me, kego.
Speaker 2:Nice to be here.
Speaker 1:Thank you. I feel like this conversation is long overdue, long overdue, so I'm glad that we could make time to finally sit down, you know, and talk about your business journey. So thank you again. I believe that a lot of things that impact how we show up in the world flows from the experiences we've had, and I know that for you, you lost your dad early and I wonder what that experience I don't know how young you were when he passed and how that shaped growing up for you- so I was nine years when my dad died, and apart from that so my dad grew up in a home where it was for five boys, so he never had a sister.
Speaker 2:So when I was born, my mom was like gosh. She was like this is the best thing in his life. So I want you to know that I was daddy's girl. You know I knew that my daddy could die for me and I was the princess, and I think that's the way I grew up and waking up one day my dad traveled and whenever my dad travels he comes back in the night. He wakes me up, so it's like you know me and my dad.
Speaker 2:We're lovers me off. So it's like, you know, we have me and my dad were lovers. So one time he traveled and he never came back and my mom was 27 and we're four kids. I remember coming back from school that day and I saw my uncle in my house with my mom behind, and then my uncle told me the story about my dad going to heaven. At first I was just sad, but I thought that it was it. You know, I don't know what I thought. I thought that everything would change back, but it just didn't, and I think that that whole experience taught me that the only person that will be with you to the end of your life is yourself Experience. I should take myself seriously. That's what I went on to do with myself.
Speaker 1:I'm sorry. I know it's been a long time, but I still have to say I'm sorry for your loss, just thankful that you had the opportunity to experience time with your dad at least. Thinking about your childhood, you know, are there some fond childhood memories that you went on to experience, so I mean growing up.
Speaker 2:My dad was a policeman, so I grew up in the barracks yes, and the barracks know what it used to be now. It used to be like big and it used to be like clean and happy. You know communal life. And my dad was deployed to police college in keja and he teach taekwondo, okay. So after school, by three o'clock we walked to the police field to do taekwondo and then it was like um, I remember um, the junior staff coming to my house, maybe to cut grass, and I can remember my dad coming into police college and everybody's standing attention. So it was like it felt like a very prestigious job.
Speaker 2:So my dad had a prestigious job and that's why, you know, when conversations about like police and army and you know some sort of conversation, I'm emotional about it because that's not what I saw growing up. Then other fond memories was I think that one of the heroes in my story was my mom. Like, I was a daddy's girl and I just knew that he had this wife in the house that loved my brother and I quickly saw her evolve into somebody that I didn't know was there and I didn't know how much that was until one time, I think, when I was as a teenager, I would go to relatives' house to stay so that you know when I'm going to school. They would give me money for school.
Speaker 2:And I can remember going to one of my cousins' house in Sulari to stay and help them with a child and they brought in a new nanny and she was crying every day and one day, you know, I called her and said, hey, what's up like? Is it that you're not happy? Tell me and tell me your story. And she said that her dad died and her mother ran away because they had she had five children, so the five of them, they had to go to the uncle dad's brother and then they had to give them out because there's nobody to take care of them. And immediately my eyes opened and my mom actually ran away. It made me realize that pain and just your life falling apart can cause people trauma that they forget who they are, can cause people trauma that they forget who they are.
Speaker 1:And throughout that journey, I think it just made me feel like hey thank god, my mummy did not like run away, so yeah, so I had one childhood, so what did you aspire to be? You had this dad who was a police officer, who was so well respected, and, and so what did you aspire to be when you were um?
Speaker 2:so when my dad was alive, I think my only aspiration was to be a princess wow, so I mean after my dad died and I went to the university.
Speaker 2:What did I aspire to be? I think that at some point I aspired to be a pharmacist. So, um, we had this relative, emzo, so you know, she was rich and successful and I always knew. I think after my dad died, I knew one thing I was going to be rich and successful. That's always been where I knew I was going to be. How. I didn't know how. So I wanted to be here and become another big pharmacist. Um, but something happened One day. One of my mom's friends came. I wrote the first jam. I didn't get it and the second jam. I was about to fill the form and one of my mom's friends came visiting and he was asking what are you doing?
Speaker 2:What is your plan? And I said I wanted to study computer science. I wanted to study pharmacy, sorry. And he said what about computer science? Wanted to study pharmacy, sorry. And he said what about computer science? That computer is going to be the biggest thing. Blah, blah, blah. He said talking about computers. I've never heard anything like that before and I said this sounds like the best place to be and that's how I filled in computer science wow so I switched immediately to computer science and I went to like for FUTO.
Speaker 2:Um, when I did my admission in FUTO what I applied for was computer science and I got into mathematics and computer science department. So year one, year two, we did um foundation and we did different things on computer mathematics and I quickly realized that by the third year we had to choose a major. I didn't have a computer. My mom could not afford a computer.
Speaker 2:And here I was writing for trans every day and I just thought to myself and I said you know what I can't do? Computer science, because I there's no point writing a programming, and that's how I went to do mathematics.
Speaker 2:so I had a major so even though our department is maths and computer science. My major now became industrial maths. I had a major in mathematics, so it showed how and that's why I'm passionate about like deploying capital to things that matter for people, Because up to today I feel like a computer will have made a big difference.
Speaker 1:Wow. So what did career look like for an industrial mathematician Interesting?
Speaker 2:So, in school, my only target was to make it to one. So I made sure I was that bookworm. You know, like you know, triangular student, church school, my hostel, church school, my hostel. I was that boring, I just wanted to make good grades. I didn't know where. I think I came out at the era where I showed that if you make a good grade you get a good job. That was what I had when I was growing up Get a good grade and get a good job. And so my goal at that time was just to get good grades. So when I finished, I came out and I came back to Lagos, because I schooled in Futo O'Hare but my parents and we grew up in Lagos. So when I finished, I came back to Lagos and I know everybody was thinking about relaxing and I was thinking, hey, I need to get a job. And I know everybody was thinking about relaxing and I was thinking, hey, I need to get a job.
Speaker 2:I've been working since my second year. I worked at Echo Bank. I remember my first job was 8,000 a year. I was so fat and I came back and I remember. So we used to have water issues and I bought this black butter for us to store water in the kitchen and I felt proud, so proud of myself that I'm finally contributing to the family. So that sort of like built my resilience. Then, my fourth day, I worked in Diamond Bank. Having superiors at that time I mean not like this the way it is now. Having superior at that time that can say, hey, sit right, oh, tuck in your shirt, oh, go and buy food for me, taught me so many things that I fear that maybe these generations might think that are not necessary, but they actually you know contributed to who I was you know this saying I take to the age to raise a child is actually true.
Speaker 2:So when I finished I came out and I was looking for the best paying job sorry if you.
Speaker 1:What kind of work were you doing? Um, when you were working like diamond bank, for example, what kind of work were you doing? I'm assuming that was part-time because you were studying. Yes, it was internship.
Speaker 2:So second year we had three months internship and fourth year we had six months internship. So for my internship, as second year, we had a three-month internship and fourth year we had a six-month internship. So for my internship second year, I was in Diamond Echo Bank. Then, by my fourth year I was in Diamond Bank. So for the first one I was the teller, so deposit money. I can remember my first mistake on the job. Somebody came for a bank draft draft and I undercharged them and I remember my manager at the end of the day, finally, I undercharged them by how much? So it was something like I felt that maybe 1,000 something. I didn't think it was that big, but she was really frustrated until I said, hey, I was going to pay for it and she now said okay, so I paid for it.
Speaker 2:I think every time people ask me what are one of the things that changed my journey and my story from a barricade, um, from a police, um, from police and my mom was a primary school teacher before she started doing business is the fact that you know one, when I got into school I was trying to put it. You know people, education school doesn't matter, but it teaches you skills to just stay in. I stayed in and I was like, oh, this is book, I need to try and make good grades, I need to put in the effort. Then when I finished I got into PwC. I felt that it was another major step in the way that I in my story, because I got into an opportunity where it was sort of like the elite and it changed my thinking. And when I got into PwC I still working I saw like rich kids, I saw smart kids, smartest people around the world. I saw things that I never would have said if I was not in PwC in fact to say how.
Speaker 2:PwC impacted me. You know I was the what next girl because this wasn't where I was going to. I'd finished, but confirmed that PwC still working. I was like, no, I need to increase my salary by 3x. And I looked at the trajectory and I said another job to get another job, to be very mobile, I needed a master's. So I was thinking of master's, master's, master's. I couldn't obviously afford anything abroad and you know I was applying for local masters. I actually got into African University of Science and Technology on a World Bank scholarship for masters but I went in there and it was like pure maths.
Speaker 2:And I was like gosh, I don't want to do pure maths, I don't want to end up lecturing. And I came back to PWC and one day at work I was sitting down and I saw them say, hey, congratulations Onyeka. And I asked her what happened and they said she got a full scholarship to LSE to study something in human resources that you know. It included stipends and so many other things. And I remember thinking and and saying, wow, this girl is lucky, this is possible.
Speaker 2:No, I said this girl is lucky and her parents are even rich. And one mind said, what if you can get a scholarship? And that's when I was like wait a minute, I thought it was for special people. And something said, I mean, you can as well, just try, you never can tell. And I said, I mean you can as well, just try, you never can tell. And I started applying to schools in the UK. I got a scholarship to Lancaster University. So I feel like that whole experience taught me that just being in the right place with the right people can rub off things that you never can tell where they can take you to.
Speaker 1:That is so incredible. That is such an amazing story. You know being in the right environment can influence how you think and how your life and your career progresses. So you finish your master's, you come back to Nigeria. Do you go back to PwC or do you find that I wanted to go?
Speaker 2:back to PwC. Then my friend in PWC said hey, there's this thing called tech startups and there's one that's looking for people smart people to join and blah, blah, blah. And I talked to Jason and I felt that if I go back to PWC, I know the road that I was going to end up in. But this thing sounds exciting. And Jason's energy was contagious. You know, he felt like he was breathing. The next, you know, whatever it is, you know this, this? And I said, hmm, this sounds good. And also I mean, I'd learned analytics, I'd finished my master's, and I just felt like I wanted somewhere to demonstrate what I was doing. You, you know, like just to see that mathematics is actually applied to things, real life things. So I said you know what? And I went and joined Jason in Iroko and that was how I stumbled into the tech sector. Another lesson I learned from that was she recommended me for that job because I worked with her in PwC and when I was working with her, even though she was more senior, I showed up and I tried to show up. Well, so your pairs are your first sponsors and stuff. People are getting that and that was very key for me and in Iroko it was. It made me fall in love with building. I was seeing the whole. We're trying to build a website. We're trying to build, create something. I just liked it.
Speaker 2:I learned so much from that whole experience of trying to create something new and it made me feel like you know what I think I like startups, you know. I think that was where I like you know, because, you see, you know, people work in big companies and sometimes they don't get to see the ripple effect of their daily decisions. I liked the fact that I could see the daily. You know when I come to the website. And then it was movies. I could look at the data and say, hmm, all the movies on the homepage, this is receiving the less click. What's the problem? I think there's a problem with this movie. I will click it and maybe there's no sound, as in. I saw how so many times people visit a media site and they think that it's just a fancy page.
Speaker 2:But actually there's a lot of analytics that goes into what should be there, what shouldn't be there. I mean just knowing that, hey, if you want to make $100,000, where to place your marketing ads, just knowing that customers have retention Nigeria movies have a retention curve at some point, so you need to be able to do it. Just knowing when to put SS, when not to put SS, and being able to use data to show that decision. For me it was pretty exciting. So how long were you at UOK? I was there for a year and a few months before I got my next job.
Speaker 2:So someone I worked with in PwC said hey, there's this guy, Femi Akinde. He started a company in Nigeria and he's looking for somebody to run the Nigerian operations and I wanted to know if you were interested in it. And I said, okay, let's have a chat. And I remember chatting with Femi and feeling like, hmm, this sounds like another opportunity to build something. And that was it for me. That was the attraction for me. I went to Femi and we started trying to build a slim trader and it was fun. It was also a lot of learning, a lot of disappointments so you know when people think about entrepreneurship and why they give up.
Speaker 2:I feel that the journey with my other experiences taught me that this is a very high and low kind of experience. You know, it's like I felt like I was given the opportunity to see people. That people you know. You know how sometimes you see people in front of the papers and you're like man, this guy is it? Ah, he reaped 10 million dollars, um, 50 million dollars. He's building this. He's speaking in panels.
Speaker 2:I sat down closely with them and I saw that they were human. Maybe right before that press release the site went off, or right before this. So I was there serving them and I could see and I felt that when I was, when I started my journey and when I started working with women, I noticed that that was a very vital set of information and that was a privilege for me, because I saw that the game is imperfection. You're building in Nigeria, with all the challenges, knowing.
Speaker 2:I feel like one of the things that women entrepreneurs struggle is like. I mean, all their life they've told them that people like perfect women and everything has to be perfect. That's why they like ironing their clothes, tying their ghillie very well, making their makeup, everything. But doing business in Nigeria is dirty, it's imperfect, far from perfect, and sitting down and seeing these people and helping them, you know, and making sure I do my own role to make sure that everything works, was, I think it was a privilege for me Just being able to be there, and it was something that I realized when I started Chiclo. It was a learning point. You know how, like, sometimes I feel like. Oh, I should say thank you to my all my former bosses and I hope that they know that when our success story is being mentioned, they should say yes, that's part of what I did well.
Speaker 1:So I know that before where I'm itching to get into the whole story. But just one more experience from your past I think is relevant to touch on, just to add more color to your story, because you have quite an interesting background. You then went at some point to be COO of a seed funding company yes that's the way I think that's. Did I get it right?
Speaker 2:so I mean after spending, I think, over three years with Femi. I went on maternity leave and I came back and obviously because I was I mean you can imagine being in a company for over three years, having not gone anywhere I was the it man and I remember coming off of maternity leave and the people on there have been promoted. And I remember having that conversation with my boss. I said, see, femi, you were away for like six months. We had to do something. And I and and he was right that was the right thing to do at the time, because I'm a very I'm the kind of person that what has to be done has to be done. The company has to move on. And I feel like when I came back, I just felt like it was time for me to look for another adventure. And I saw an ad for a seed funding company looking for a CEO and I went for the interview.
Speaker 2:I remember going for the interview the first time and I was like I don't think I want to work here. The second time the guy called me and said, hey, come for the interview. And I said no, I'm not interested, that's not what I want to work. And it also showed me the importance of having a good HR person. The guy really persuaded me and said you should come for this interview even if you don't want the job, just come. Our boss or CEO wants to meet you. Blah, blah, blah and I came for the interview and I met Collins on Weibo and we had a chat and I felt like this guy is grounded and I felt like I wanted you know I'd played in the game, in the startup game. You know the whole BS startups. I've done it and this felt like an opportunity to be on the other side and.
Speaker 2:I see what it was like. So I said you know what, let's get in, and that's how I got into. That's how I got into, that's why I took the role. It was a fantastic role for me because I was sitting on the other side. For once, I understood what it was like to deploy capital. I understood what it's like to vet a lot of applications and just try to look for the best. I started learning how to meet people, how to just be on the other side, and I think it was when I was doing that job that I started saying where are the women? Before then I'd never paid attention to where are the women. But I remember the first day I came for the meeting, you know, and they had this big table, executive table and I noticed I was the only female on that table and I was like wait hmm, okay, this is weird.
Speaker 2:And I started looking around, I started getting pitch tech and I started seeing I think this was around 2015, when it was like Nigerian tech was hot I mean, they would give people money just for thinking of tech and maybe three months later the company is closed. And I'm like, and all this money was going to men. And I sat down and said you know what? I want some of this money to go to women too. And I quickly realized that genuinely, there were like there were no women. You know how it's like you get women and she's not qualified. No, we did not get. The best woman that I met in 2015 was dami shutlass. She has gone on to raise four million dollars, but I can remember then seeing her and her coming to be to us and I was thinking, oh wow, this girl, this girl is bold and I want to know that at that time, I'd never you know how it has never flashed my mind to be an entrepreneur.
Speaker 1:So when did you start thinking seriously that you wanted to do this? Because here you are, at a job, you are the one deploying capital. You see, this gap where the women, where the women. And then how did this idea of starting a business, you know, take root?
Speaker 2:So I mean, I was one of those women that they say have to lose cash in their account.
Speaker 1:So one day.
Speaker 2:I remember sitting down with my seatmate that was a manager in the manager's corner and he said hey, how about this?
Speaker 2:money in your account and I said yes, and I said, okay, why don't you invest it? And I said, oh, what's that? And he sent me this damn big investment and I said, okay, I tried to put money in there. And the next day he came and said, hey, I have a problem, can you lend me money? And I did and he paid and after a while in the office it's like when people had issues they said, hey, lend me money, I'll pay you on payday. Hey, lend me money, I'll pay you on payday. And we stayed doing that.
Speaker 2:I realized that I was happy that it solved their problem. At the time. You know, maybe someone would say my mother, this, this, I had an impulsive barrier and stuff. I just liked it. You know they would give me and they would say thank you so much. I mean just then. And I liked it.
Speaker 2:And I was pregnant around that time with my third baby and for me, I quickly started realizing that with each pregnancy I felt like I got less confident. You know the whole. I used to be like that girl that worked 24 hours. You know, if you had me on your team, it's like I need to deliver, like you know how people say they get there, I get my, I get fulfillment from being valuable. So I was that person. I was. If I was on your team, I had to show up and I noticed that with each child it felt like gosh. I was juggling so many balls and I couldn't think about it and it hit me so you know how, moving from a mindset that women were absent because they were just not putting in the work, and by my third child I realized that women were upset because they were juggling so many balls and they couldn't cope. I felt sorry for for taking their absence as not being like. They were not determined. It made me feel like I don't know. It just made me feel bad. And then I saw and I experienced firsthand what I felt that an average woman would have experienced.
Speaker 2:I was pregnant for my third child. I had two babies, a lot was going on in my life. I had to show up at work and look normal and for me it just felt like, wow, this is what women go through and knowing that many of them would never get funding just felt like gosh. I need to to change this and I started doing a lot of research on saying that. You know women.
Speaker 2:You know where, where are the funding for women? Where? What's happening in that? And I noticed I was the same thing with other financial services, like credit, like um insurance, like women were just not using it and and for me it didn't make sense because I come from a mathematics background. If the population of Africa and Nigeria is 50% approximately 50% men and 50% women and 95% of the startups fail, it means that we have no sufficient data to prove that the other half of the population is incapable of making change. Do you understand what I mean? Like from a pure scientific point of view? That was my driver. I just felt like nobody has tested these demographics to see what can they do, and I was brooding over it.
Speaker 2:And I remember at the time when I felt like, hey, I think I was brooding over it. And I remember at the time when I felt like, hey, I think I was brooding over it so much and I was thinking at my job, things were evolving. The company was evolving because by that time, the investing tech bubble and so many companies closing was coming down, so everybody's eyes was clearing and everybody was like, okay, maybe we need to be more cautious with tech and just breathing a bite. One day I think I felt like go and start a company that's for women and I was like nothing like that existed at that time.
Speaker 1:What year were we?
Speaker 2:in 2018. I said, you know, first of all, start a company. Like seriously of all the people start a company. I mean it felt like the biggest joke. You know, I'd never seen myself. I'd seen myself sitting down at a table. You know World Bank, ifc, signing big policies.
Speaker 1:But you know how I've seen myself as a CEO.
Speaker 2:No, that hasn't crossed my mind that's like for crazy people. So, but they. I can remember the first person. I told that, hey, I wanted to go and start a finance company that's just focused on women. And the person said how can you do that? That's not profitable, that's not, that doesn't make sense. And I said, yeah, this guy is right. How can you start a business? Are you cut out 50 of the population?
Speaker 2:Well, every time I went to my quiet place to see you know what, what kind of business, what kind of what do I want to do? Next? It's going to start a company for women. And after a while I just said you know what? I was getting older to notice that I don't think that. Um, I have time. You know how, when you start getting old, I think at that time I was over 30 and I realized that, wait a minute, the chorus is actually time, not money. So I said you know what? I would start a company and I would try it out, and if it doesn't work out, I'll go and get a job. And that's how I started Chicloaded you know.
Speaker 2:I remember the few people I pitched at the time to say, hey, I wanted to do Chiclo Dead. It sounded very weird to them and I thought about you know what, how do I start this? And I said I needed to show that my point of view works, Like a female-focused financial services can actually move the needle in terms of funding or access to finance for women. And I remember going to withdraw all my investments and all my and saying that I want to put it as the capital to be able to deploy and yeah, that's it.
Speaker 1:So where did you get the name she cluded from?
Speaker 2:so when I uh, when I was thinking about it, the name and that's the name of our um, that's the name that was on our first CAC document was included. I wanted to include more people into finance. So one day I was brainstorming with my colleague then Victor, he does design and stuff and I said no, because it's for women. We need to make the name look like it's for women and that's how we say know, we say she, not say she included yes instead of included, and we said, yeah, that sounded nice.
Speaker 1:So just going back to coming up with your business case and selling it at a time when it wasn't, you know. Today, you know talking about women-focused businesses is a thing, you know you can build a whole career around it, but what was that like for you in a country like Nigeria? I mean, when I started SheCluded.
Speaker 2:I mean, the capital was my money, so it was like fine, but I noticed quickly that there was a gap. I mean, when I focused on building the tech and everything, I thought that the women would come, but they didn't. And quickly I realized that I had to do more and I went to that meeting with women. I remember asking somebody oh, where can I find women? And the person said go to Instagram. And I went to download and I saw a lot of women and I started chatting them to say, hi, do you need money to grow your business? And I saw a lot of women and I started chatting them to say hi, do you need money to grow your business? And many of them said, you know, yes, but you know they don't want a loan. You know, their grandmother took a loan and she died of the loan, you know.
Speaker 2:I started noticing that, the gaps in information. I quickly noticed that the worldview for women and the worldview that I was used to, based on my work experience and based on the tables I sat, were very different and that's why interventions made for women, especially women entrepreneurs in Africa, we feel like the way that a typical woman entrepreneur thinks and the way that a normal person has been incorporates that down thing is very different. So I started trying to learn and trying to see the how to reach them, how to communicate with them, who are their role models, because the role models in our world and the role models in their world is very different. Like you know, it was really like how do I? It was really me trying to wear another hat to say how do I think and how do I be like, where is this woman going to be? Where is she going to get her information? And try to be there. Do you understand?
Speaker 2:I know that when I started I was thinking of you know, go to business day, put an article, put this, put that Women don't read. Many women don't read to business day Many women entrepreneurs. So I started learning from that and just started building. My only customer is a woman, so I needed to get the intelligence to be able to serve them and I needed to communicate with them and I needed to make sure I don't lose my money. So I think all those drivers was the point.
Speaker 1:So what does your customer look like? What does a secluded customer look like? I know you say it's women, but it can't be all women.
Speaker 2:So it's exciting that you asked that question. When I started, my first blanket was to show the blanket to all women and I realized getting bond. I think I still learn in different demographics from stay-at-home mom, from women that earn less than $50,000, from women that earn less than $500,000. I stay classifying them. Right now, I think 70% of our customers are peri-urban women. They typically have social capital.
Speaker 2:It means that they've invested a bit on their social capital. They typically have invested in their business, a certain threshold of money invested in their business. The other, let's say 20% or less, we try to dedicate it to, to upcomers, those that we think that you know maybe they are young. We see the potential for the business to be able to thrive. I mean sometimes, at different seasons, depending on different partnerships that we've been able to do, we've also tweaked it sometimes. I mean sometimes we see some of the partners that we work with on different stuff saying, oh, we want a certain type of women and we've tried to do it, but typically we are looking at targeting aspiring women that are looking to grow so that they can employ more people and get and more money.
Speaker 1:I think that that it so. I know you started the business with your capital, but what has raising funds been like for you in terms of money to deploy? How have you gone ahead to increase the pool of resources you have to deploy?
Speaker 2:So we have three seed funding I call them patient capital and I feel like aside are aside, saying the Shikluda story is incomplete without them, because I mean, I remember my first seed investor, mike, said yes, that he noticed that he did that investment because he said he had sisters and in the UK he would notice that it was easier for him to get loans than his sisters. The UK he was noticed that it was, it was easier for him to get loans than his sisters, so that there's a gap. And then came Ngozi, and Ngozi was like I'd always wanted to invest in women. Then Isaac Isaac is not just an investor, he's also a. I feel like he's his sponsor because, in terms of some of the links that we're able to get with the US, isaac has done some of those introverts.
Speaker 2:We've also been able to think about other ways of raising money, whether it's through partnerships with different financial institutions or just thinking of, like you said, right now, it's in to help to be women and we happen to have done a lot of verifiable work in this space women and we happen to have done a lot of verifiable work in the space. So we we had, we have, a few funding for women programs that have come to us and because right from the first day I said I should go to the discipline to make sure that my cost and my income is, you know, like we don't spend more than we make. It's just been growing. You know, my work really is to grow a I mean maybe it's from the pwc days like it has to make business sense. So it has to be that it's growing and it's profitable for it to be worth my time.
Speaker 1:I know so, as we think about growth, you've done a lot in Nigeria and I know that you started thinking about the continent. So what does growth look like for SheCluded? Going forward, so when?
Speaker 2:I'm thinking about growth. I'm thinking of being bought by a bank to run their women banking. I think that what that does for us is one to focus on the things that we know how to do well engage women to grow. Our algorithm in terms of using alternative data to lend to women is also something that we can share with them and just be able to make more funding come to women. I think that that's what I was looking at. In terms of growth.
Speaker 2:We've also thought about partners across Africa, so we've had a few women reach out to us from different countries to say, hey hi, this bank's here to don't give us money. I think I was shocked when I said this. I thought it was a Nigerian problem, but we're shocked to start receiving emails from Malawi, from Uganda, saying that hey hi, the banks don't want to give us money, and it made me realize that, wow, this subconscious bias is strong. I think one of the things that amazes me is how intangible subconscious bias is, but it's big. How something can be this big and it can still be invisible is something that I feel. This big and it can still be invisible is something that I feel.
Speaker 2:So we have a few clients that we've served, maybe from the accelerator programs or just from investors and referrals. But we are looking at more strategic partnerships with either MFBs that we've been talking to or, like women are interested in starting like a SheCluded in their countries and stuff. I think that that's what we're looking at for growth. We also have some funding conversations that we have some developmental organizations that we are hoping that we'll pull through. I know that this conversation sometimes it takes time, but we are positive that we're still on track to do the things that we do.
Speaker 1:That's excellent. So I know you were selected as one of NASDAQ's milestone makers for your contribution to reducing inequality. Tell us a bit about that and how that has helped you in your business journey.
Speaker 2:That was the first time I had a business coach and I can remember one of the coaching period. That coach came and she said hey, so let's play a game, get a book. Assume the first seven years of your life is chapter one, chapter two, chapter three, chapter four, you know, up to the age you are, whatever. And each chapter she says close your eyes, give it a title, and you tell me a little bit about it. And it was really a reflection of the collection of my life. And she said something. She said now you're in chapter I think was it chapter seven at the time and she said write down what's going to happen in this chapter. And for the first time, as I was writing it down, I realized that I had the privilege to write my history before it began. And that was, for me, the moment that I felt that my life began Immediately. That was a mindset shift to know that I was writing a book and the name of the book was Informa and it has to have me in it. So I feel like after that experience, if it's anything I got from that experience, was just the impact of a business coach on telling me and giving me permission to write the book that is called the Fulmer.
Speaker 2:I remember writing no Ordinary Life and since then it's never been. I mean, since then we've gotten what funding? I mean, since then we've gotten funding. We got 350,000 euros from the Netherlands, from CFYE. I just got into a program I mean they've not yet announced and it's in the US and I felt like she changed my life. I just said you know, because I felt that at so many points you know as women. So many definitions, so many images of who you should be, how you should act, how you should show up can be conflicting, and just her telling me that this book is called Ifama Udu, you have to actually write it made me realize that, man, I am a writer and I'm going to write this book and write a good book.
Speaker 1:In terms of wrapping up. You know, I normally ask my guests two questions. One is really like a reflection what do you think? I mean? Your business is all about impact, but if you could talk about one thing that you would say has been the most impactful, or one of the most impactful things that you've done in building this business, what? What would you say it is?
Speaker 2:I think one of the most impactful thing true, she included and the work we've done. I've seen people say, hi, you made my dream come true and that for me, is it's all I need to make life worth it for me. So, knowing that I can just show up at work sometimes or I can just say, hey, hi, this logo, I can design something quickly for you and send it to somebody, and the person said you changed my life or you made my dream come true, is is worth it for me that's fantastic, and if you could give advice to other women who are building businesses in Africa, what advice would that be?
Speaker 2:Try to get access to communities, networks, beyond your social, economic and cultural class Whether it's a USS Laredo, whether it's a US accelerator, whether it's a US fellowship, whether it'sa conference and get comfortable with not knowing what's happening in that room. In fact, the more you sit down and you're like gosh, this is supposed to be a conference for manufacturing companies and I don't know it's in the right room. Just keep taking notes and stay there long enough. Trust me it to change your income.
Speaker 1:Yeah, your network is your net worth. I totally agree. Thank you so much, ife. This has been a great conversation.
Speaker 2:Thank you, thank you so much for having me and do have a nice day.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much for listening. If you're not already subscribed, please do so on Apple, spotify or wherever you get your podcasts, and don't forget to leave us a review so we know how we're doing. I'm Akego Okoye and you have been listening to African Business Stories.