{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"startTime":0.04,"endTime":1.96,"body":"At the end of this."},{"startTime":1.96,"endTime":5.64,"body":"This is a new program where,"},{"startTime":1.96,"endTime":5.64,"body":"I mean, I've used Riverside a few times,"},{"startTime":6.0,"endTime":9.24,"body":"and it's the recording"},{"startTime":6.0,"endTime":9.24,"body":"quality is incredible."},{"startTime":10.2,"endTime":14.88,"body":"But the only thing is at the end,"},{"startTime":10.2,"endTime":14.88,"body":"it will it'll take a bit of time"},{"startTime":14.88,"endTime":17.0,"body":"depending on your internet to upload."},{"startTime":17.0,"endTime":20.08,"body":"So I might just have to ask you"},{"startTime":17.0,"endTime":20.08,"body":"just to leave the screen open while it"},{"startTime":20.16,"endTime":21.12,"body":"show upload."},{"startTime":21.12,"endTime":24.12,"body":"But yeah, just go about your day."},{"startTime":24.24,"endTime":26.64,"body":"However, you need to,"},{"startTime":24.24,"endTime":26.64,"body":"I won't hold you off."},{"startTime":26.64,"endTime":29.08,"body":"It's just that"},{"startTime":26.64,"endTime":29.08,"body":"we just need to keep that open."},{"startTime":29.08,"endTime":31.8,"body":"It's all,"},{"startTime":31.8,"endTime":33.04,"body":"All right, so"},{"startTime":33.04,"endTime":36.0,"body":"I will do a quick little intro,"},{"startTime":36.0,"endTime":40.2,"body":"and then let's talk about your book"},{"startTime":36.0,"endTime":40.2,"body":"and all the juicy things that."},{"startTime":40.6,"endTime":42.96,"body":"Yeah, research"},{"startTime":40.6,"endTime":42.96,"body":"and everything that you've done."},{"startTime":42.96,"endTime":45.84,"body":"I'm so excited to. Yeah. Pick your brain."},{"startTime":48.0,"endTime":49.08,"body":"So today"},{"startTime":49.08,"endTime":52.92,"body":"we are speaking with Valerie Ringland,"},{"startTime":49.08,"endTime":52.92,"body":"author"},{"startTime":52.92,"endTime":56.92,"body":"of the transformative book"},{"startTime":52.92,"endTime":56.92,"body":"Healing Through Indigenous Wisdom."},{"startTime":57.8,"endTime":61.2,"body":"In her work, Valerie drops"},{"startTime":57.8,"endTime":61.2,"body":"some pretty profound"},{"startTime":61.2,"endTime":64.28,"body":"truth bombs and gives a 52 week,"},{"startTime":65.84,"endTime":70.08,"body":"52 weeks worth of practical activities"},{"startTime":65.84,"endTime":70.08,"body":"that are designed to help us explore"},{"startTime":70.08,"endTime":74.64,"body":"and deepen our connection"},{"startTime":70.08,"endTime":74.64,"body":"to ourselves, our land, and our ancestry."},{"startTime":75.96,"endTime":78.4,"body":"Valerie, who holds a PhD"},{"startTime":78.4,"endTime":82.24,"body":"and has extensive knowledge,"},{"startTime":78.4,"endTime":82.24,"body":"extensive experience in both Indigenous"},{"startTime":82.24,"endTime":87.28,"body":"and Western healing practices,"},{"startTime":82.24,"endTime":87.28,"body":"is here to challenge cultural expression"},{"startTime":87.68,"endTime":91.8,"body":"and help us break free"},{"startTime":87.68,"endTime":91.8,"body":"from the patterns of diseased thinking."},{"startTime":92.32,"endTime":97.68,"body":"She's on a mission to inspire"},{"startTime":92.32,"endTime":97.68,"body":"healing and connection and reconnection,"},{"startTime":97.84,"endTime":102.44,"body":"but guiding us to recover"},{"startTime":97.84,"endTime":102.44,"body":"our indigenous identities"},{"startTime":102.72,"endTime":107.6,"body":"and integrate supportive tools"},{"startTime":102.72,"endTime":107.6,"body":"and practices into our lives."},{"startTime":108.12,"endTime":110.16,"body":"So welcome, Valerie."},{"startTime":110.16,"endTime":112.12,"body":"So nice to have you here."},{"startTime":112.12,"endTime":114.24,"body":"Thank you. It's a lovely intro."},{"startTime":116.04,"endTime":117.96,"body":"You're so welcome."},{"startTime":117.96,"endTime":123.08,"body":"So I'm only halfway through your book"},{"startTime":117.96,"endTime":123.08,"body":"at the moment, and I just"},{"startTime":123.2,"endTime":127.76,"body":"what I love about it"},{"startTime":123.2,"endTime":127.76,"body":"is, is the, the tie between."},{"startTime":127.76,"endTime":130.28,"body":"There's just so many concepts"},{"startTime":127.76,"endTime":130.28,"body":"and so many things within it."},{"startTime":130.28,"endTime":134.76,"body":"You know, you go from grief"},{"startTime":130.28,"endTime":134.76,"body":"to ritual to ceremony to trauma,"},{"startTime":134.76,"endTime":139.76,"body":"and there's so many avenues"},{"startTime":134.76,"endTime":139.76,"body":"that you not only just read about, but"},{"startTime":139.76,"endTime":143.72,"body":"you're unpacking your internal landscape"},{"startTime":139.76,"endTime":143.72,"body":"by doing the practices."},{"startTime":144.04,"endTime":149.04,"body":"And I would firstly just love to know"},{"startTime":144.04,"endTime":149.04,"body":"and hear your story around"},{"startTime":150.6,"endTime":153.24,"body":"wanting to write this book"},{"startTime":150.6,"endTime":153.24,"body":"and dive down this path"},{"startTime":153.24,"endTime":157.52,"body":"of helping people"},{"startTime":153.24,"endTime":157.52,"body":"to recover their indigenous identities."},{"startTime":158.88,"endTime":161.16,"body":"Thank you."},{"startTime":161.16,"endTime":164.84,"body":"I can't say that I had this conscious idea"},{"startTime":161.16,"endTime":164.84,"body":"any time."},{"startTime":165.2,"endTime":168.28,"body":"It just emerged"},{"startTime":165.2,"endTime":168.28,"body":"after quite a lot of work. But,"},{"startTime":169.68,"endTime":172.72,"body":"I'll just quickly say"},{"startTime":169.68,"endTime":172.72,"body":"that I'm very privileged"},{"startTime":172.72,"endTime":176.84,"body":"to be on beautiful UN country"},{"startTime":172.72,"endTime":176.84,"body":"on the south coast of New South Wales now,"},{"startTime":176.84,"endTime":181.64,"body":"and to currently be looking out my window"},{"startTime":176.84,"endTime":181.64,"body":"at the beautiful Goolagong Mountain,"},{"startTime":181.64,"endTime":187.12,"body":"which is, a mother mountain to all of us"},{"startTime":181.64,"endTime":187.12,"body":"here, and very sacred to the UN peoples."},{"startTime":188.56,"endTime":191.56,"body":"And there's something really"},{"startTime":192.12,"endTime":193.56,"body":"healing happening"},{"startTime":193.56,"endTime":198.0,"body":"that had very strong human mother figures"},{"startTime":193.56,"endTime":198.0,"body":"about feeling"},{"startTime":198.0,"endTime":201.48,"body":"this connection"},{"startTime":198.0,"endTime":201.48,"body":"with, a land for mother figure."},{"startTime":201.96,"endTime":205.36,"body":"And I feel like that's really important"},{"startTime":201.96,"endTime":205.36,"body":"in a lot of this work is,"},{"startTime":206.76,"endTime":210.36,"body":"I think we've been over relying on humans"},{"startTime":210.36,"endTime":214.0,"body":"in a way that's quite ungrounded"},{"startTime":210.36,"endTime":214.0,"body":"for a really long time."},{"startTime":214.72,"endTime":217.56,"body":"And I hadn't sort of consciously"},{"startTime":217.56,"endTime":220.44,"body":"realized that,"},{"startTime":217.56,"endTime":220.44,"body":"until farther in my journey,"},{"startTime":220.44,"endTime":224.84,"body":"because on my dad's side,"},{"startTime":220.44,"endTime":224.84,"body":"we're indigenous to northern Germany."},{"startTime":224.84,"endTime":227.84,"body":"We're a small group called East Friesians."},{"startTime":228.12,"endTime":230.76,"body":"He was the first one to move away"},{"startTime":230.76,"endTime":233.76,"body":"from country that we know of."},{"startTime":234.6,"endTime":238.32,"body":"And so we used to visit there"},{"startTime":234.6,"endTime":238.32,"body":"every second year, and it was like"},{"startTime":238.32,"endTime":243.36,"body":"I got this refueling being on the land,"},{"startTime":238.32,"endTime":243.36,"body":"but then being,"},{"startTime":244.96,"endTime":249.12,"body":"also from my mother's lineage,"},{"startTime":244.96,"endTime":249.12,"body":"which is Jewish, Sumerian"},{"startTime":249.12,"endTime":252.2,"body":"and very ungrounded, having been away"},{"startTime":252.2,"endTime":255.56,"body":"from country for many, many generations,"},{"startTime":257.16,"endTime":260.72,"body":"dating way back to southern Iraq"},{"startTime":257.16,"endTime":260.72,"body":"originally."},{"startTime":262.32,"endTime":264.84,"body":"I feel like I always had this"},{"startTime":264.84,"endTime":269.96,"body":"dual lens of having some understanding"},{"startTime":264.84,"endTime":269.96,"body":"of that depth and belonging"},{"startTime":269.96,"endTime":274.12,"body":"and some understanding"},{"startTime":269.96,"endTime":274.12,"body":"of the struggle and dislocation."},{"startTime":274.72,"endTime":278.4,"body":"And then my father, having moved,"},{"startTime":274.72,"endTime":278.4,"body":"had this first generation dislocation."},{"startTime":278.4,"endTime":282.64,"body":"So I was born on Shawnee land,"},{"startTime":278.4,"endTime":282.64,"body":"what we would call"},{"startTime":282.64,"endTime":286.64,"body":"Ohio in the US and grew up in the US."},{"startTime":287.28,"endTime":292.56,"body":"So then there's that other piece"},{"startTime":287.28,"endTime":292.56,"body":"of multiculturalism for me, which is my"},{"startTime":292.56,"endTime":297.56,"body":"body is from Turtle Island, and so I have"},{"startTime":292.56,"endTime":297.56,"body":"this very profound connection there."},{"startTime":297.56,"endTime":301.04,"body":"And to,"},{"startTime":297.56,"endTime":301.04,"body":"some of the indigenous practices there."},{"startTime":301.04,"endTime":306.36,"body":"And I've been really fortunate to do"},{"startTime":301.04,"endTime":306.36,"body":"quite a lot of, knowledge sharing work"},{"startTime":306.36,"endTime":309.76,"body":"with some of the indigenous peoples"},{"startTime":306.36,"endTime":309.76,"body":"there, specifically,"},{"startTime":310.16,"endTime":314.52,"body":"a elder"},{"startTime":310.16,"endTime":314.52,"body":"and his community named Joseph Real. And."},{"startTime":317.64,"endTime":320.44,"body":"An Aztec dancer some years ago."},{"startTime":320.44,"endTime":324.2,"body":"So then I grew up as well,"},{"startTime":324.2,"endTime":327.68,"body":"on former Cherokee land."},{"startTime":327.68,"endTime":330.2,"body":"That was the start of the Trail of Tears."},{"startTime":330.2,"endTime":331.92,"body":"And it was also slavery, land."},{"startTime":331.92,"endTime":334.0,"body":"It was also Martin Luther"},{"startTime":331.92,"endTime":334.0,"body":"King's birthplace."},{"startTime":334.0,"endTime":337.44,"body":"So very tumultuous land"},{"startTime":334.0,"endTime":337.44,"body":"with lots of trauma in it."},{"startTime":337.44,"endTime":339.6,"body":"In the South."},{"startTime":339.6,"endTime":342.12,"body":"And I feel like"},{"startTime":339.6,"endTime":342.12,"body":"I just got this sort of cocktail."},{"startTime":342.12,"endTime":345.76,"body":"Growing up, I always knew I wanted to"},{"startTime":342.12,"endTime":345.76,"body":"do conflict resolution because it was just"},{"startTime":346.32,"endTime":347.84,"body":"constantly in my world."},{"startTime":347.84,"endTime":350.84,"body":"I had this Jewish, German, indigenous,"},{"startTime":350.92,"endTime":353.92,"body":"slavery, black, white,"},{"startTime":354.2,"endTime":354.76,"body":"genocide."},{"startTime":354.76,"endTime":356.4,"body":"Like I just had all this stuff around me."},{"startTime":356.4,"endTime":359.4,"body":"And then in my own life,"},{"startTime":356.4,"endTime":359.4,"body":"I had a lived experience of,"},{"startTime":360.24,"endTime":362.88,"body":"sexual trauma"},{"startTime":360.24,"endTime":362.88,"body":"and some other intergenerational traumas"},{"startTime":362.88,"endTime":365.88,"body":"in my family that wasn't dealt with well."},{"startTime":366.52,"endTime":369.52,"body":"So in my own healing journey,"},{"startTime":369.8,"endTime":372.6,"body":"I got into the restorative"},{"startTime":369.8,"endTime":372.6,"body":"justice movement."},{"startTime":372.6,"endTime":375.08,"body":"I did that for about a decade."},{"startTime":372.6,"endTime":375.08,"body":"I was really passionate about it."},{"startTime":376.68,"endTime":378.08,"body":"Sort of culminated for me."},{"startTime":378.08,"endTime":381.84,"body":"I was working in Melbourne"},{"startTime":378.08,"endTime":381.84,"body":"and I was facilitating circles on clergy"},{"startTime":381.84,"endTime":385.32,"body":"abuse"},{"startTime":381.84,"endTime":385.32,"body":"with what we called priests of integrity,"},{"startTime":385.32,"endTime":388.32,"body":"who really wanted to take responsibility"},{"startTime":385.32,"endTime":388.32,"body":"on behalf of the church"},{"startTime":389.04,"endTime":392.48,"body":"and people who had been abused"},{"startTime":389.04,"endTime":392.48,"body":"or had family members who'd been abused."},{"startTime":394.0,"endTime":397.0,"body":"And I found it really amazing that,"},{"startTime":397.8,"endTime":400.52,"body":"level of healing"},{"startTime":397.8,"endTime":400.52,"body":"that people were able to go through"},{"startTime":400.52,"endTime":404.4,"body":"when it was linked with spirituality,"},{"startTime":400.52,"endTime":404.4,"body":"because previously I had done"},{"startTime":404.4,"endTime":408.16,"body":"a lot of restorative justice"},{"startTime":404.4,"endTime":408.16,"body":"in more sort of sterile"},{"startTime":408.16,"endTime":412.16,"body":"environments in a school or university or,"},{"startTime":408.16,"endTime":412.16,"body":"you know, something like that."},{"startTime":412.8,"endTime":417.48,"body":"So that really got my juices flowing,"},{"startTime":412.8,"endTime":417.48,"body":"and I thought, I know it's taboo, but"},{"startTime":417.48,"endTime":420.56,"body":"how would you do the spirit of restorative"},{"startTime":420.56,"endTime":423.6,"body":"justice in sexual trauma healing?"},{"startTime":423.6,"endTime":425.6,"body":"Because that's what I feel like I need."},{"startTime":425.6,"endTime":427.68,"body":"And at that point, like a lot of people,"},{"startTime":427.68,"endTime":431.8,"body":"I been looking around,"},{"startTime":427.68,"endTime":431.8,"body":"I had gone to an energy healer."},{"startTime":431.8,"endTime":435.96,"body":"I'd, you know, been to the jungle and,"},{"startTime":436.72,"endTime":439.56,"body":"worked with a shaman"},{"startTime":436.72,"endTime":439.56,"body":"and done some ayahuasca."},{"startTime":439.56,"endTime":442.92,"body":"And I tried a lot of things,"},{"startTime":444.32,"endTime":444.6,"body":"and I"},{"startTime":444.6,"endTime":447.8,"body":"just found certain things were not enough."},{"startTime":447.8,"endTime":452.44,"body":"I found therapy, which was this"},{"startTime":447.8,"endTime":452.44,"body":"sort of standard approach to trauma."},{"startTime":452.44,"endTime":454.44,"body":"Healing was just not enough for me."},{"startTime":454.44,"endTime":457.44,"body":"It wasn't getting to what I needed to."},{"startTime":457.8,"endTime":460.12,"body":"I really needed ritual, I needed ceremony,"},{"startTime":460.12,"endTime":463.12,"body":"I needed community."},{"startTime":463.32,"endTime":466.32,"body":"And so I ended up deciding to do a PhD."},{"startTime":467.32,"endTime":469.4,"body":"I thought I was going to apply"},{"startTime":469.4,"endTime":472.4,"body":"restorative justice to."},{"startTime":473.6,"endTime":475.64,"body":"Some of the sexual trauma healing."},{"startTime":475.64,"endTime":480.04,"body":"But I ended up, finding colonial roots"},{"startTime":480.04,"endTime":483.04,"body":"and the restorative justice movement and,"},{"startTime":484.16,"endTime":488.16,"body":"the leaders that I went to work with"},{"startTime":484.16,"endTime":488.16,"body":"ended up in lawsuits against each other,"},{"startTime":488.16,"endTime":492.28,"body":"which seems so wrong for what we claimed"},{"startTime":488.16,"endTime":492.28,"body":"we stood for."},{"startTime":493.68,"endTime":496.08,"body":"That I pulled back and I was like,"},{"startTime":493.68,"endTime":496.08,"body":"okay, well,"},{"startTime":496.08,"endTime":499.84,"body":"restorative justice is based on indigenous"},{"startTime":496.08,"endTime":499.84,"body":"understandings of justice."},{"startTime":499.84,"endTime":504.28,"body":"So why is it that that occurs"},{"startTime":499.84,"endTime":504.28,"body":"differently for me than for these people"},{"startTime":504.28,"endTime":504.96,"body":"I'm working with?"},{"startTime":504.96,"endTime":508.8,"body":"And I realized it was a real world view"},{"startTime":504.96,"endTime":508.8,"body":"issue that I hadn't got to the bottom of"},{"startTime":508.8,"endTime":510.24,"body":"until then."},{"startTime":510.24,"endTime":515.16,"body":"I had been coming from this indigenous"},{"startTime":510.24,"endTime":515.16,"body":"worldview because of my father's ancestry,"},{"startTime":515.16,"endTime":518.8,"body":"and I'd always had that lens, and that's"},{"startTime":515.16,"endTime":518.8,"body":"how I'd been able to do knowledge"},{"startTime":518.8,"endTime":522.76,"body":"sharing and different things"},{"startTime":518.8,"endTime":522.76,"body":"with some other indigenous peoples. But,"},{"startTime":523.8,"endTime":525.72,"body":"other people who are coming from purely"},{"startTime":525.72,"endTime":528.72,"body":"what I would call the Western"},{"startTime":525.72,"endTime":528.72,"body":"or Judeo-Christian world view."},{"startTime":529.88,"endTime":532.08,"body":"And so my way of sort of describing"},{"startTime":532.08,"endTime":535.08,"body":"it was recognizing that"},{"startTime":535.68,"endTime":537.44,"body":"there was some level of judgment"},{"startTime":537.44,"endTime":541.28,"body":"and then forgiveness in everything"},{"startTime":537.44,"endTime":541.28,"body":"that I perceive them to be doing."},{"startTime":541.48,"endTime":544.48,"body":"And I was taught"},{"startTime":541.48,"endTime":544.48,"body":"that in my Jewish worldview,"},{"startTime":544.88,"endTime":548.8,"body":"but in my indigenous worldview,"},{"startTime":544.88,"endTime":548.8,"body":"I wasn't experiencing that."},{"startTime":548.8,"endTime":553.48,"body":"I was just expressing acceptance"},{"startTime":548.8,"endTime":553.48,"body":"of whatever happened and rolling with it."},{"startTime":553.48,"endTime":555.16,"body":"Right. Okay, I've accepted this."},{"startTime":555.16,"endTime":556.64,"body":"And now what? Boundaries do I need?"},{"startTime":556.64,"endTime":560.92,"body":"Or, you know, like I can still feel"},{"startTime":556.64,"endTime":560.92,"body":"the anger that set the limits, but"},{"startTime":560.92,"endTime":565.2,"body":"I didn't feel like I was in that process"},{"startTime":560.92,"endTime":565.2,"body":"of judging, forgiving, judging, forgiving,"},{"startTime":565.8,"endTime":570.64,"body":"and in fact, in my culture,"},{"startTime":565.8,"endTime":570.64,"body":"that's not considered"},{"startTime":570.64,"endTime":574.2,"body":"like the role of us humans"},{"startTime":570.64,"endTime":574.2,"body":"to do the judging and forgiving."},{"startTime":574.64,"endTime":579.04,"body":"That's considered like, something that"},{"startTime":574.64,"endTime":579.04,"body":"separates larger than us take care of."},{"startTime":579.2,"endTime":580.0,"body":"Right. So,"},{"startTime":582.28,"endTime":583.68,"body":"I was noticing that conflict."},{"startTime":583.68,"endTime":587.4,"body":"So I ended up doing this"},{"startTime":583.68,"endTime":587.4,"body":"sort of funny dual PhD where"},{"startTime":588.64,"endTime":590.64,"body":"most of the people I worked with"},{"startTime":588.64,"endTime":590.64,"body":"at the university"},{"startTime":590.64,"endTime":594.0,"body":"didn't understand half the work"},{"startTime":590.64,"endTime":594.0,"body":"I was doing, or maybe more than half"},{"startTime":594.6,"endTime":599.32,"body":"because I was apprenticing with,"},{"startTime":594.6,"endTime":599.32,"body":"indigenous elders and community members"},{"startTime":599.32,"endTime":602.4,"body":"and working with my own ancestors,"},{"startTime":599.32,"endTime":602.4,"body":"doing a lot of,"},{"startTime":602.6,"endTime":605.6,"body":"ritual and ceremony work."},{"startTime":606.16,"endTime":609.88,"body":"As well as the university work"},{"startTime":606.16,"endTime":609.88,"body":"where I was reading"},{"startTime":609.88,"endTime":613.68,"body":"a lot of work by indigenous scholars"},{"startTime":609.88,"endTime":613.68,"body":"and trying to weave"},{"startTime":614.76,"endTime":617.76,"body":"people's knowledge in that space"},{"startTime":618.04,"endTime":621.88,"body":"with knowledge"},{"startTime":618.04,"endTime":621.88,"body":"in the indigenous science realm."},{"startTime":622.76,"endTime":626.68,"body":"So I ended up doing a PhD on indigenous"},{"startTime":622.76,"endTime":626.68,"body":"trauma healing."},{"startTime":626.68,"endTime":629.68,"body":"And just in the flow of life,"},{"startTime":629.88,"endTime":632.88,"body":"when you want something,"},{"startTime":629.88,"endTime":632.88,"body":"you know, life tries to bring it to you."},{"startTime":633.12,"endTime":638.16,"body":"I met a woman whose ex-partner"},{"startTime":633.12,"endTime":638.16,"body":"had sexually abused their children."},{"startTime":639.32,"endTime":640.76,"body":"She was in touch with him."},{"startTime":640.76,"endTime":642.4,"body":"Her children were grown."},{"startTime":642.4,"endTime":644.44,"body":"He'd already been through prison."},{"startTime":644.44,"endTime":647.52,"body":"He'd done"},{"startTime":644.44,"endTime":647.52,"body":"a lot of work to improve himself,"},{"startTime":648.0,"endTime":650.68,"body":"and he wanted to do"},{"startTime":648.0,"endTime":650.68,"body":"a surrogate dialog with me."},{"startTime":650.68,"endTime":652.8,"body":"So this is what I'd been wishing for"},{"startTime":650.68,"endTime":652.8,"body":"for years."},{"startTime":652.8,"endTime":657.52,"body":"Was this opportunity to dialog with"},{"startTime":652.8,"endTime":657.52,"body":"someone who'd been in that offending role,"},{"startTime":657.52,"endTime":661.68,"body":"but had done a lot of their own unpacking"},{"startTime":657.52,"endTime":661.68,"body":"and wanted"},{"startTime":661.68,"endTime":664.84,"body":"to share their journey and listen and"},{"startTime":666.16,"endTime":669.2,"body":"not judge, but be in that exchange"},{"startTime":669.2,"endTime":672.2,"body":"space of accepting each other"},{"startTime":669.2,"endTime":672.2,"body":"and learning from each other."},{"startTime":673.2,"endTime":675.48,"body":"So I did a dialog with him"},{"startTime":675.48,"endTime":680.0,"body":"and we both found it quite powerful,"},{"startTime":675.48,"endTime":680.0,"body":"and he was very emotional at the end."},{"startTime":680.0,"endTime":684.84,"body":"And then he put me in touch with a"},{"startTime":680.0,"endTime":684.84,"body":"group I didn't know existed,"},{"startTime":685.92,"endTime":687.52,"body":"which was a support group"},{"startTime":687.52,"endTime":690.84,"body":"for people who were sex offenders,"},{"startTime":691.36,"endTime":694.8,"body":"legally in the US"},{"startTime":691.36,"endTime":694.8,"body":"or family members of sex offenders,"},{"startTime":694.8,"endTime":698.0,"body":"because, it can be quite hard,"},{"startTime":694.8,"endTime":698.0,"body":"for example, when you"},{"startTime":698.76,"endTime":701.76,"body":"get out of prison to find a place"},{"startTime":698.76,"endTime":701.76,"body":"you're allowed to live or a job,"},{"startTime":701.76,"endTime":704.76,"body":"or there's a lot of rules around"},{"startTime":701.76,"endTime":704.76,"body":"having that,"},{"startTime":706.32,"endTime":708.36,"body":"label on you for the rest of your life."},{"startTime":708.36,"endTime":709.96,"body":"Basically."},{"startTime":709.96,"endTime":714.12,"body":"So I got put in touch with a support group"},{"startTime":709.96,"endTime":714.12,"body":"and sent out an email."},{"startTime":714.12,"endTime":715.96,"body":"Who else would be interested in Dialoging?"},{"startTime":715.96,"endTime":719.28,"body":"And I got more responses"},{"startTime":715.96,"endTime":719.28,"body":"than I could accommodate."},{"startTime":719.68,"endTime":722.28,"body":"So I decided to just, meet"},{"startTime":722.28,"endTime":725.28,"body":"with people who could meet me in person."},{"startTime":725.84,"endTime":728.56,"body":"And I did dialogs with,"},{"startTime":728.56,"endTime":732.96,"body":"other people who had offended"},{"startTime":728.56,"endTime":732.96,"body":"and also family members, moms"},{"startTime":732.96,"endTime":736.6,"body":"and an a partner of someone"},{"startTime":732.96,"endTime":736.6,"body":"who'd been accused. So."},{"startTime":739.52,"endTime":742.52,"body":"The people"},{"startTime":739.52,"endTime":742.52,"body":"at the university where I was were,"},{"startTime":742.6,"endTime":745.28,"body":"pretty scared of what I was doing,"},{"startTime":742.6,"endTime":745.28,"body":"to be honest"},{"startTime":745.28,"endTime":748.28,"body":"and very hands off of me."},{"startTime":749.72,"endTime":752.08,"body":"It's still considered quite taboo."},{"startTime":752.08,"endTime":754.92,"body":"It took me over"},{"startTime":752.08,"endTime":754.92,"body":"five years to get that research published,"},{"startTime":754.92,"endTime":758.52,"body":"and I had some of what I consider"},{"startTime":754.92,"endTime":758.52,"body":"the most absurd critiques."},{"startTime":758.52,"endTime":761.04,"body":"I was called a, victim."},{"startTime":761.04,"endTime":763.88,"body":"Blame her, though in this instance"},{"startTime":761.04,"endTime":763.88,"body":"I would have been the victim."},{"startTime":763.88,"endTime":767.92,"body":"So I was told I don't understand"},{"startTime":763.88,"endTime":767.92,"body":"the limits of empathy."},{"startTime":768.28,"endTime":771.28,"body":"It was a real struggle"},{"startTime":768.28,"endTime":771.28,"body":"to get that work out."},{"startTime":773.84,"endTime":774.8,"body":"But for those of us"},{"startTime":774.8,"endTime":779.56,"body":"who participated, everyone,"},{"startTime":774.8,"endTime":779.56,"body":"including myself, reported feeling really"},{"startTime":780.12,"endTime":783.68,"body":"profound healing"},{"startTime":780.12,"endTime":783.68,"body":"and I was asked to continue doing more."},{"startTime":783.68,"endTime":786.68,"body":"But I ended up moving to Australia."},{"startTime":786.84,"endTime":789.24,"body":"Also,"},{"startTime":786.84,"endTime":789.24,"body":"to be honest, it's quite painful work"},{"startTime":789.24,"endTime":793.28,"body":"and it was a different sort of pain"},{"startTime":789.24,"endTime":793.28,"body":"to sit in than the pain"},{"startTime":793.28,"endTime":795.16,"body":"that I had been through myself."},{"startTime":796.76,"endTime":798.04,"body":"Which was really valuable in"},{"startTime":798.04,"endTime":801.52,"body":"terms of feeling like I was more"},{"startTime":798.04,"endTime":801.52,"body":"fully holding the experience."},{"startTime":802.32,"endTime":806.36,"body":"But not something I felt a calling"},{"startTime":802.32,"endTime":806.36,"body":"to put myself through for years and years."},{"startTime":806.76,"endTime":811.32,"body":"So that was a big part of that journey of,"},{"startTime":806.76,"endTime":811.32,"body":"for me,"},{"startTime":811.32,"endTime":815.92,"body":"really feeling like whole and then saying,"},{"startTime":811.32,"endTime":815.92,"body":"all right, for me, justice is healing."},{"startTime":815.92,"endTime":818.56,"body":"That's where I landed."},{"startTime":818.56,"endTime":820.56,"body":"And what does that look like practically?"},{"startTime":820.56,"endTime":822.16,"body":"And how have I got here?"},{"startTime":822.16,"endTime":824.8,"body":"And what can I do that"},{"startTime":824.8,"endTime":827.16,"body":"people don't all need to have"},{"startTime":824.8,"endTime":827.16,"body":"that particular experience."},{"startTime":827.16,"endTime":827.36,"body":"Right?"},{"startTime":827.36,"endTime":832.32,"body":"But what can I do in terms of unpacking"},{"startTime":827.36,"endTime":832.32,"body":"my process of how I landed on this"},{"startTime":832.32,"endTime":836.16,"body":"and had these experiences"},{"startTime":832.32,"endTime":836.16,"body":"that felt really healing in the process"},{"startTime":836.16,"endTime":838.6,"body":"leading up to that,"},{"startTime":836.16,"endTime":838.6,"body":"and during the time of those,"},{"startTime":840.04,"endTime":842.4,"body":"dialogs."},{"startTime":842.4,"endTime":845.12,"body":"So I worked for some other number of years"},{"startTime":842.4,"endTime":845.12,"body":"in Australia"},{"startTime":845.12,"endTime":848.96,"body":"and some Aboriginal communities,"},{"startTime":845.12,"endTime":848.96,"body":"non-Aboriginal communities,"},{"startTime":849.92,"endTime":852.72,"body":"government, nonprofit work."},{"startTime":852.72,"endTime":854.84,"body":"But I sort of kept"},{"startTime":852.72,"endTime":854.84,"body":"coming back to feeling like"},{"startTime":854.84,"endTime":857.84,"body":"I had something brewing in me"},{"startTime":854.84,"endTime":857.84,"body":"that wanted to be born."},{"startTime":858.6,"endTime":862.04,"body":"So we ended up as life organizes"},{"startTime":862.04,"endTime":865.4,"body":"things,"},{"startTime":862.04,"endTime":865.4,"body":"moving into this little shed in the bush."},{"startTime":865.4,"endTime":868.68,"body":"And my husband had enough work"},{"startTime":865.4,"endTime":868.68,"body":"that I didn't have to make money"},{"startTime":868.68,"endTime":871.68,"body":"for a little while,"},{"startTime":868.68,"endTime":871.68,"body":"and I could birth the book."},{"startTime":872.6,"endTime":876.12,"body":"So the 52 week"},{"startTime":872.6,"endTime":876.12,"body":"book came to me week by week."},{"startTime":877.8,"endTime":881.0,"body":"So I wanted it to have that integrity"},{"startTime":877.8,"endTime":881.0,"body":"of feeling like quiet,"},{"startTime":881.04,"endTime":884.72,"body":"very slow and deliberate of people"},{"startTime":881.04,"endTime":884.72,"body":"wanted to do it that way as well."},{"startTime":885.6,"endTime":888.6,"body":"And I just would get the topic,"},{"startTime":888.76,"endTime":890.8,"body":"for the next week, at the end of the week."},{"startTime":890.8,"endTime":895.2,"body":"And then I'd have, you know,"},{"startTime":890.8,"endTime":895.2,"body":"insights and experiences during that week"},{"startTime":895.8,"endTime":898.8,"body":"that then led me"},{"startTime":895.8,"endTime":898.8,"body":"to feel like all of a sudden"},{"startTime":898.8,"endTime":901.84,"body":"one day I'd sit down"},{"startTime":898.8,"endTime":901.84,"body":"and it would just come out of me."},{"startTime":902.44,"endTime":905.44,"body":"That was my experience"},{"startTime":902.44,"endTime":905.44,"body":"of writing the book."},{"startTime":905.76,"endTime":910.36,"body":"And I took a break when I had a child, a"},{"startTime":905.76,"endTime":910.36,"body":"human child, in the middle of writing it."},{"startTime":910.36,"endTime":913.36,"body":"So then I finished it"},{"startTime":910.36,"endTime":913.36,"body":"when she was about six weeks old."},{"startTime":913.72,"endTime":916.32,"body":"So it took me slightly longer than a year."},{"startTime":916.32,"endTime":919.6,"body":"And then I prayed for about six months"},{"startTime":916.32,"endTime":919.6,"body":"and waited,"},{"startTime":919.6,"endTime":922.6,"body":"and I got the name of a publisher"},{"startTime":919.6,"endTime":922.6,"body":"come to me in a dream."},{"startTime":922.92,"endTime":926.0,"body":"I wrote them a submission,"},{"startTime":922.92,"endTime":926.0,"body":"and I waited a few months, and the day"},{"startTime":926.0,"endTime":928.4,"body":"I was giving up in about to email"},{"startTime":926.0,"endTime":928.4,"body":"someone else,"},{"startTime":928.4,"endTime":930.36,"body":"I got a call saying,"},{"startTime":928.4,"endTime":930.36,"body":"we want to publish you."},{"startTime":930.36,"endTime":934.56,"body":"So thank you to Rockpool"},{"startTime":930.36,"endTime":934.56,"body":"for following through with that."},{"startTime":936.0,"endTime":937.52,"body":"So that's been the process."},{"startTime":937.52,"endTime":940.52,"body":"It's been very magical and"},{"startTime":942.48,"endTime":943.28,"body":"very for me,"},{"startTime":943.28,"endTime":946.64,"body":"based in like that sense of flow and trust"},{"startTime":943.28,"endTime":946.64,"body":"and faith."},{"startTime":946.64,"endTime":952.36,"body":"Like if I'm doing the unpacking"},{"startTime":946.64,"endTime":952.36,"body":"in the building, the rebuilding"},{"startTime":952.36,"endTime":957.96,"body":"that I need to be doing, then what I need"},{"startTime":952.36,"endTime":957.96,"body":"comes to me and that sense of trusting"},{"startTime":957.96,"endTime":961.56,"body":"that life is always there for you,"},{"startTime":957.96,"endTime":961.56,"body":"even when it's hard, it's there for you."},{"startTime":961.56,"endTime":964.56,"body":"So what's the lesson"},{"startTime":961.56,"endTime":964.56,"body":"that you can turn that"},{"startTime":965.04,"endTime":966.08,"body":"hard stuff?"},{"startTime":966.08,"endTime":969.08,"body":"You know that"},{"startTime":966.08,"endTime":969.08,"body":"crap into fertilizer in your life?"},{"startTime":969.68,"endTime":973.52,"body":"So that was maybe a long answer"},{"startTime":969.68,"endTime":973.52,"body":"to your question, but that it's still not"},{"startTime":973.56,"endTime":974.76,"body":"perfect."},{"startTime":974.76,"endTime":979.64,"body":"It's really beautiful to hear your story,"},{"startTime":974.76,"endTime":979.64,"body":"because I think I think,"},{"startTime":980.16,"endTime":984.4,"body":"you know, you always see the golden thing"},{"startTime":980.16,"endTime":984.4,"body":"at the end of someone's journey,"},{"startTime":984.4,"endTime":989.32,"body":"but you actually don't see the"},{"startTime":984.4,"endTime":989.32,"body":"the mud and the muck and the, the soil"},{"startTime":989.32,"endTime":992.72,"body":"that you had to birth from"},{"startTime":989.32,"endTime":992.72,"body":"to create something."},{"startTime":992.72,"endTime":994.2,"body":"And I think"},{"startTime":995.2,"endTime":995.92,"body":"the fact that"},{"startTime":995.92,"endTime":1000.56,"body":"you were brave enough"},{"startTime":995.92,"endTime":1000.56,"body":"to explore some of this stuff, and I think"},{"startTime":1000.56,"endTime":1005.0,"body":"a huge thing within, in our society"},{"startTime":1000.56,"endTime":1005.0,"body":"and within the world is the fact that,"},{"startTime":1005.6,"endTime":1008.6,"body":"you know,"},{"startTime":1005.6,"endTime":1008.6,"body":"so many of us have moved through trauma,"},{"startTime":1008.6,"endTime":1012.48,"body":"and often the behavior"},{"startTime":1008.6,"endTime":1012.48,"body":"that comes out from trauma can be,"},{"startTime":1013.72,"endTime":1014.32,"body":"shunned."},{"startTime":1014.32,"endTime":1017.4,"body":"It can be, you know,"},{"startTime":1014.32,"endTime":1017.4,"body":"pushed to the side and, and it"},{"startTime":1017.68,"endTime":1021.16,"body":"and healing happens"},{"startTime":1017.68,"endTime":1021.16,"body":"so much more within community."},{"startTime":1021.16,"endTime":1025.28,"body":"And so actually calling people out"},{"startTime":1021.16,"endTime":1025.28,"body":"more for their behavior"},{"startTime":1025.44,"endTime":1030.88,"body":"seems to be more productive"},{"startTime":1025.44,"endTime":1030.88,"body":"than, than pushing them out to the side."},{"startTime":1030.88,"endTime":1033.88,"body":"And then there it just kind of circulates."},{"startTime":1034.88,"endTime":1039.16,"body":"I would love to firstly, before"},{"startTime":1034.88,"endTime":1039.16,"body":"I would love to talk about trauma"},{"startTime":1039.16,"endTime":1042.8,"body":"at some point"},{"startTime":1039.16,"endTime":1042.8,"body":"because I think it's a really it's really,"},{"startTime":1044.2,"endTime":1045.24,"body":"interesting stuff."},{"startTime":1045.24,"endTime":1048.28,"body":"And I think the more we, we process trauma"},{"startTime":1048.76,"endTime":1052.04,"body":"individually, but also within community,"},{"startTime":1048.76,"endTime":1052.04,"body":"the more we have capacity"},{"startTime":1052.04,"endTime":1056.84,"body":"to show up for the people in our lives"},{"startTime":1052.04,"endTime":1056.84,"body":"and for ourselves and for the earth."},{"startTime":1056.84,"endTime":1059.96,"body":"And I think"},{"startTime":1056.84,"endTime":1059.96,"body":"it's really important in this time."},{"startTime":1060.44,"endTime":1067.64,"body":"But I firstly would love to, to unpack"},{"startTime":1060.44,"endTime":1067.64,"body":"belonging and what belonging means and,"},{"startTime":1067.64,"endTime":1071.16,"body":"and the disconnect that we all sort of"},{"startTime":1071.96,"endTime":1076.88,"body":"share in a sense of like, you know,"},{"startTime":1071.96,"endTime":1076.88,"body":"a lot of us share that, you know,"},{"startTime":1076.88,"endTime":1082.04,"body":"my ancestors are from England and, Ireland"},{"startTime":1076.88,"endTime":1082.04,"body":"and I've never even been there."},{"startTime":1082.04,"endTime":1082.44,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":1082.44,"endTime":1086.32,"body":"So there's like, I don't know what"},{"startTime":1082.44,"endTime":1086.32,"body":"their rituals are or the ceremonies are."},{"startTime":1086.32,"endTime":1089.36,"body":"And so there's this deep longing,"},{"startTime":1089.36,"endTime":1093.28,"body":"I think, for many of us"},{"startTime":1089.36,"endTime":1093.28,"body":"to have that sense of belonging,"},{"startTime":1093.92,"endTime":1097.4,"body":"and that sense of community"},{"startTime":1093.92,"endTime":1097.4,"body":"as well, through belonging."},{"startTime":1097.72,"endTime":1102.12,"body":"And I would love to hear you"},{"startTime":1097.72,"endTime":1102.12,"body":"how how you've helped"},{"startTime":1102.32,"endTime":1106.36,"body":"others as well rediscover"},{"startTime":1102.32,"endTime":1106.36,"body":"that connection with their ancestors and"},{"startTime":1106.68,"endTime":1108.44,"body":"why it is important that"},{"startTime":1109.4,"endTime":1111.76,"body":"you know or why"},{"startTime":1111.76,"endTime":1114.96,"body":"we can start moving towards"},{"startTime":1111.76,"endTime":1114.96,"body":"that, you know,"},{"startTime":1114.96,"endTime":1119.12,"body":"how can we spark people's curiosity"},{"startTime":1114.96,"endTime":1119.12,"body":"about doing that and why that's important?"},{"startTime":1120.0,"endTime":1123.0,"body":"Yeah, it's an interesting question."},{"startTime":1123.0,"endTime":1125.0,"body":"When,"},{"startTime":1125.0,"endTime":1127.72,"body":"you know, whoever's culture"},{"startTime":1125.0,"endTime":1127.72,"body":"it is, when your culture,"},{"startTime":1127.72,"endTime":1131.36,"body":"what that means to you stopped"},{"startTime":1127.72,"endTime":1131.36,"body":"honoring and festers."},{"startTime":1131.36,"endTime":1131.76,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":1131.76,"endTime":1134.84,"body":"Because some people I've talked to"},{"startTime":1131.76,"endTime":1134.84,"body":"in Australia don't even know"},{"startTime":1134.84,"endTime":1137.84,"body":"where their grandparents were from. And,"},{"startTime":1139.0,"endTime":1140.96,"body":"that's really new in"},{"startTime":1140.96,"endTime":1143.96,"body":"human history"},{"startTime":1140.96,"endTime":1143.96,"body":"that we would be that disconnected"},{"startTime":1143.96,"endTime":1146.96,"body":"and that we would have"},{"startTime":1143.96,"endTime":1146.96,"body":"that level of mobility possible as well."},{"startTime":1147.52,"endTime":1149.96,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":1149.96,"endTime":1152.96,"body":"So my perspective on ancestors is"},{"startTime":1153.08,"endTime":1155.76,"body":"you could look at it"},{"startTime":1153.08,"endTime":1155.76,"body":"in the Western science of epigenetics,"},{"startTime":1155.76,"endTime":1160.04,"body":"you could look at it in a more spiritual"},{"startTime":1155.76,"endTime":1160.04,"body":"way of, you know, looking at your lineage."},{"startTime":1160.04,"endTime":1162.84,"body":"Or you could look at it in past lives,"},{"startTime":1160.04,"endTime":1162.84,"body":"whatever resonates with you."},{"startTime":1162.84,"endTime":1167.76,"body":"But it's it's spirits, people, energy,"},{"startTime":1162.84,"endTime":1167.76,"body":"however you want to think about it."},{"startTime":1168.72,"endTime":1171.6,"body":"That wants"},{"startTime":1168.72,"endTime":1171.6,"body":"you to succeed because it led to you,"},{"startTime":1171.6,"endTime":1174.8,"body":"you know, being a seed"},{"startTime":1171.6,"endTime":1174.8,"body":"that has blossomed into being alive."},{"startTime":1174.8,"endTime":1179.24,"body":"So there's there is a desire"},{"startTime":1174.8,"endTime":1179.24,"body":"from some amount of these energies"},{"startTime":1179.24,"endTime":1184.16,"body":"that you thrive here and carry"},{"startTime":1179.24,"endTime":1184.16,"body":"on that legacy of connection."},{"startTime":1184.16,"endTime":1187.16,"body":"Right. So,"},{"startTime":1188.2,"endTime":1189.0,"body":"That doesn't mean"},{"startTime":1189.0,"endTime":1193.72,"body":"that you resonate"},{"startTime":1189.0,"endTime":1193.72,"body":"with all of those energies."},{"startTime":1193.72,"endTime":1195.56,"body":"You might have some values conflicts."},{"startTime":1195.56,"endTime":1198.56,"body":"There might be some trauma"},{"startTime":1195.56,"endTime":1198.56,"body":"in there. Right."},{"startTime":1199.16,"endTime":1203.2,"body":"But there is something to work with you"},{"startTime":1199.16,"endTime":1203.2,"body":"are you are wanted."},{"startTime":1203.2,"endTime":1206.2,"body":"So that's sort of the human energy side."},{"startTime":1207.08,"endTime":1208.88,"body":"But I think"},{"startTime":1208.88,"endTime":1211.56,"body":"we're thinking about indigenous science."},{"startTime":1211.56,"endTime":1214.56,"body":"The deepest trauma you can have from that"},{"startTime":1215.16,"endTime":1218.16,"body":"worldview is disconnection from country."},{"startTime":1219.2,"endTime":1223.64,"body":"And the vast majority of us on the planet"},{"startTime":1219.2,"endTime":1223.64,"body":"right now experience that daily"},{"startTime":1223.64,"endTime":1228.08,"body":"to a point of, I think, being numb to it"},{"startTime":1223.64,"endTime":1228.08,"body":"and the pain and grief of that,"},{"startTime":1229.52,"endTime":1231.0,"body":"most of us have lineages that"},{"startTime":1231.0,"endTime":1234.56,"body":"have been disconnected,"},{"startTime":1231.0,"endTime":1234.56,"body":"you know, so multiple times, if not,"},{"startTime":1235.84,"endTime":1237.8,"body":"multiple lineages"},{"startTime":1235.84,"endTime":1237.8,"body":"being disconnected. Right."},{"startTime":1237.8,"endTime":1239.96,"body":"And all of the people"},{"startTime":1237.8,"endTime":1239.96,"body":"with European ancestry"},{"startTime":1239.96,"endTime":1242.48,"body":"who think you're the bad guy, as we call"},{"startTime":1239.96,"endTime":1242.48,"body":"in, as other people."},{"startTime":1242.48,"endTime":1243.08,"body":"Sure."},{"startTime":1243.08,"endTime":1246.08,"body":"But you were colonized by the Romans"},{"startTime":1243.08,"endTime":1246.08,"body":"and the Mongols and the,"},{"startTime":1246.08,"endTime":1247.4,"body":"you know, just keep going back."},{"startTime":1247.4,"endTime":1249.44,"body":"We don't know how it all started."},{"startTime":1249.44,"endTime":1252.44,"body":"A lot of people have experienced"},{"startTime":1249.44,"endTime":1252.44,"body":"both sides of,"},{"startTime":1253.24,"endTime":1256.44,"body":"in your ancestry being removed"},{"startTime":1253.24,"endTime":1256.44,"body":"from your country and then removing"},{"startTime":1256.44,"endTime":1258.0,"body":"someone else."},{"startTime":1258.0,"endTime":1261.64,"body":"It's been a cycle going on"},{"startTime":1258.0,"endTime":1261.64,"body":"around the world for a long time,"},{"startTime":1262.68,"endTime":1265.2,"body":"which isn't to excuse it, it's"},{"startTime":1262.68,"endTime":1265.2,"body":"just to help"},{"startTime":1265.2,"endTime":1268.2,"body":"have compassion"},{"startTime":1265.2,"endTime":1268.2,"body":"for the different angles of it."},{"startTime":1269.84,"endTime":1272.48,"body":"And there's a sense"},{"startTime":1269.84,"endTime":1272.48,"body":"to, for me, of trusting that"},{"startTime":1274.08,"endTime":1274.72,"body":"the earth"},{"startTime":1274.72,"endTime":1278.72,"body":"is wanting us where we are"},{"startTime":1274.72,"endTime":1278.72,"body":"and that it's actually possible"},{"startTime":1278.72,"endTime":1281.84,"body":"to feel belonging"},{"startTime":1278.72,"endTime":1281.84,"body":"where you are now, there's"},{"startTime":1281.84,"endTime":1284.84,"body":"some reason that you're there."},{"startTime":1284.96,"endTime":1288.44,"body":"So I want to bring in a concept,"},{"startTime":1288.96,"endTime":1292.4,"body":"that comes from some Native"},{"startTime":1288.96,"endTime":1292.4,"body":"American cultures."},{"startTime":1294.56,"endTime":1297.04,"body":"Sometimes called Wendigo or where to go."},{"startTime":1297.04,"endTime":1299.8,"body":"Or would Taeko"},{"startTime":1299.8,"endTime":1303.32,"body":"I learned of it"},{"startTime":1299.8,"endTime":1303.32,"body":"first from Cree and Ojibwe peoples."},{"startTime":1304.04,"endTime":1307.4,"body":"And it's personified"},{"startTime":1307.4,"endTime":1310.4,"body":"as a cannibal"},{"startTime":1310.64,"endTime":1313.6,"body":"that is never satisfied."},{"startTime":1313.6,"endTime":1316.8,"body":"It's just constantly needing"},{"startTime":1313.6,"endTime":1316.8,"body":"more and more and more and more and more."},{"startTime":1319.04,"endTime":1322.04,"body":"So the idea is actually"},{"startTime":1322.6,"endTime":1325.68,"body":"when we look at a number of cultures"},{"startTime":1322.6,"endTime":1325.68,"body":"and we say, oh, look,"},{"startTime":1325.72,"endTime":1329.92,"body":"you know, the European colonists"},{"startTime":1325.72,"endTime":1329.92,"body":"came to Canada and they brought smallpox"},{"startTime":1329.92,"endTime":1333.76,"body":"and they brought this and that in a lot"},{"startTime":1329.92,"endTime":1333.76,"body":"of the indigenous people died."},{"startTime":1333.76,"endTime":1335.96,"body":"That's the Western perspective on it."},{"startTime":1335.96,"endTime":1337.92,"body":"And that's valid. I'm not belittling that,"},{"startTime":1338.92,"endTime":1341.0,"body":"but in an indigenous science perspective."},{"startTime":1341.0,"endTime":1345.32,"body":"So from some of those cultures"},{"startTime":1341.0,"endTime":1345.32,"body":"as well, actually, there's this,"},{"startTime":1346.08,"endTime":1349.96,"body":"cannibal virus, we,"},{"startTime":1346.08,"endTime":1349.96,"body":"we consider it a psycho spiritual virus,"},{"startTime":1349.96,"endTime":1353.0,"body":"meaning it starts in the head"},{"startTime":1349.96,"endTime":1353.0,"body":"and then enters your spirituality."},{"startTime":1353.48,"endTime":1358.44,"body":"So the idea is it's really natural"},{"startTime":1353.48,"endTime":1358.44,"body":"that we sometimes have thoughts like,"},{"startTime":1358.44,"endTime":1361.52,"body":"I'm more valuable than you,"},{"startTime":1358.44,"endTime":1361.52,"body":"or that trees better in that tree"},{"startTime":1361.52,"endTime":1364.52,"body":"because I can do these things with it,"},{"startTime":1361.52,"endTime":1364.52,"body":"or my tribe"},{"startTime":1364.52,"endTime":1367.52,"body":"is better than that tribe or whatever"},{"startTime":1364.52,"endTime":1367.52,"body":"the stories are."},{"startTime":1368.0,"endTime":1371.72,"body":"But the problem with having those thoughts"},{"startTime":1368.0,"endTime":1371.72,"body":"and not reining them in"},{"startTime":1371.72,"endTime":1375.76,"body":"and processing them is"},{"startTime":1371.72,"endTime":1375.76,"body":"we can start to believe them."},{"startTime":1375.76,"endTime":1377.16,"body":"And when we start to believe"},{"startTime":1377.16,"endTime":1380.72,"body":"in these stories of supremacy,"},{"startTime":1377.16,"endTime":1380.72,"body":"we disconnect ourselves from"},{"startTime":1381.68,"endTime":1385.88,"body":"the interconnectedness of life"},{"startTime":1381.68,"endTime":1385.88,"body":"from the rest of the planet and the Earth."},{"startTime":1386.96,"endTime":1389.36,"body":"So the story from some of the"},{"startTime":1389.36,"endTime":1392.36,"body":"Ojibwe people"},{"startTime":1389.36,"endTime":1392.36,"body":"they have passed down and shared is that"},{"startTime":1393.12,"endTime":1395.28,"body":"when some French fur trappers first"},{"startTime":1395.28,"endTime":1398.44,"body":"came to some of their communities,"},{"startTime":1395.28,"endTime":1398.44,"body":"they weren't trying to steal the land."},{"startTime":1398.44,"endTime":1400.2,"body":"They were taking animals"},{"startTime":1400.2,"endTime":1403.32,"body":"and mailing them back home"},{"startTime":1400.2,"endTime":1403.32,"body":"to turn into hats, fur coats, etc."},{"startTime":1404.0,"endTime":1408.28,"body":"but just encountering,"},{"startTime":1404.0,"endTime":1408.28,"body":"like three men who were trapping"},{"startTime":1409.32,"endTime":1412.12,"body":"their perspective was"},{"startTime":1409.32,"endTime":1412.12,"body":"they had so much of this psycho"},{"startTime":1412.12,"endTime":1416.56,"body":"spiritual virus, they believed so much"},{"startTime":1412.12,"endTime":1416.56,"body":"in these stories of supremacy"},{"startTime":1416.56,"endTime":1419.44,"body":"and disconnection from country,"},{"startTime":1416.56,"endTime":1419.44,"body":"and that their culture"},{"startTime":1419.44,"endTime":1421.64,"body":"was better than another culture,"},{"startTime":1419.44,"endTime":1421.64,"body":"and the men were more valuable"},{"startTime":1421.64,"endTime":1424.64,"body":"than women, and just layers"},{"startTime":1421.64,"endTime":1424.64,"body":"and layers of these stories"},{"startTime":1425.36,"endTime":1426.8,"body":"that encountering them."},{"startTime":1426.8,"endTime":1430.52,"body":"That community was constantly doing"},{"startTime":1426.8,"endTime":1430.52,"body":"sweat lodges and purification"},{"startTime":1430.64,"endTime":1432.8,"body":"and vision quests"},{"startTime":1430.64,"endTime":1432.8,"body":"and using all of their tools."},{"startTime":1432.8,"endTime":1434.36,"body":"They had to try to heal."},{"startTime":1435.44,"endTime":1435.72,"body":"And I"},{"startTime":1435.72,"endTime":1438.72,"body":"couldn't it just absolutely overwhelm them"},{"startTime":1435.72,"endTime":1438.72,"body":"before"},{"startTime":1439.0,"endTime":1442.8,"body":"more people even came and wanted to settle"},{"startTime":1439.0,"endTime":1442.8,"body":"and take any of the land."},{"startTime":1443.88,"endTime":1446.88,"body":"So for me, that concept, really resonates."},{"startTime":1447.16,"endTime":1450.16,"body":"And I see it a lot."},{"startTime":1450.88,"endTime":1452.84,"body":"You can see it, and in capitalism"},{"startTime":1452.84,"endTime":1455.76,"body":"you can see it in certain"},{"startTime":1452.84,"endTime":1455.76,"body":"politics and social groups."},{"startTime":1455.76,"endTime":1460.0,"body":"But to me, any of those stories"},{"startTime":1455.76,"endTime":1460.0,"body":"of supremacy, when we put belief"},{"startTime":1460.0,"endTime":1463.56,"body":"into them, become incredibly destructive."},{"startTime":1464.36,"endTime":1467.04,"body":"And when we believe that"},{"startTime":1467.04,"endTime":1470.04,"body":"in any of those, then it's like a"},{"startTime":1470.28,"endTime":1475.16,"body":"stop from us connecting back"},{"startTime":1470.28,"endTime":1475.16,"body":"with what I would consider the"},{"startTime":1475.16,"endTime":1479.0,"body":"all because we've removed ourselves"},{"startTime":1475.16,"endTime":1479.0,"body":"literally from that web of life."},{"startTime":1479.92,"endTime":1484.92,"body":"And so what I see around the world"},{"startTime":1479.92,"endTime":1484.92,"body":"and struggling is a lot of people"},{"startTime":1484.92,"endTime":1489.48,"body":"experiencing social connectedness, and"},{"startTime":1484.92,"endTime":1489.48,"body":"maybe they would call it social belonging."},{"startTime":1491.56,"endTime":1491.96,"body":"Full of"},{"startTime":1491.96,"endTime":1496.04,"body":"supremacy"},{"startTime":1491.96,"endTime":1496.04,"body":"stories and yet not experiencing it"},{"startTime":1496.32,"endTime":1499.16,"body":"with other cultures and societies"},{"startTime":1499.16,"endTime":1502.16,"body":"and with the rest of the web of life."},{"startTime":1502.16,"endTime":1504.52,"body":"So it can be challenging."},{"startTime":1504.52,"endTime":1508.0,"body":"I find when we doing some of this"},{"startTime":1504.52,"endTime":1508.0,"body":"unpacking and ourselves,"},{"startTime":1508.0,"endTime":1511.32,"body":"we might actually lose"},{"startTime":1508.0,"endTime":1511.32,"body":"some sense of social connectedness."},{"startTime":1511.32,"endTime":1515.24,"body":"So, for example,"},{"startTime":1511.32,"endTime":1515.24,"body":"I can say I went through a period,"},{"startTime":1515.8,"endTime":1519.84,"body":"of my life"},{"startTime":1515.8,"endTime":1519.84,"body":"where it's like there's a shared wound,"},{"startTime":1520.52,"endTime":1523.52,"body":"in a large way"},{"startTime":1520.52,"endTime":1523.52,"body":"among people with Jewish ancestry,"},{"startTime":1523.68,"endTime":1526.56,"body":"and I could be anywhere in the world,"},{"startTime":1523.68,"endTime":1526.56,"body":"and another person could pick me"},{"startTime":1526.56,"endTime":1529.04,"body":"out of a crowd and say,"},{"startTime":1526.56,"endTime":1529.04,"body":"you're Jewish and come talk to me."},{"startTime":1529.04,"endTime":1531.84,"body":"And I had that experience very many times."},{"startTime":1531.84,"endTime":1535.76,"body":"And at some point in my healing journey,"},{"startTime":1531.84,"endTime":1535.76,"body":"I started having dreams and visions of"},{"startTime":1536.52,"endTime":1539.76,"body":"pre Jewish cultural roots."},{"startTime":1541.0,"endTime":1542.36,"body":"And I felt"},{"startTime":1542.36,"endTime":1545.48,"body":"some things in my body shift and change,"},{"startTime":1545.76,"endTime":1549.88,"body":"and I experienced"},{"startTime":1545.76,"endTime":1549.88,"body":"complete social disconnection from people"},{"startTime":1549.88,"endTime":1553.76,"body":"who still identify as Jewish and practice"},{"startTime":1553.76,"endTime":1556.84,"body":"that religion, which"},{"startTime":1553.76,"endTime":1556.84,"body":"never really resonated with me personally."},{"startTime":1557.36,"endTime":1558.96,"body":"Now obviously I have some friends"},{"startTime":1557.36,"endTime":1558.96,"body":"who are Jewish."},{"startTime":1558.96,"endTime":1561.2,"body":"It's not like this big,"},{"startTime":1561.2,"endTime":1565.56,"body":"block, but it's just now"},{"startTime":1561.2,"endTime":1565.56,"body":"no one would pick me out that way anymore."},{"startTime":1565.56,"endTime":1566.6,"body":"Something's changed"},{"startTime":1566.6,"endTime":1569.8,"body":"inside me and in my energy,"},{"startTime":1566.6,"endTime":1569.8,"body":"in the way I move through the world."},{"startTime":1570.76,"endTime":1571.64,"body":"And what I carry."},{"startTime":1571.64,"endTime":1574.64,"body":"So that has been a really interesting,"},{"startTime":1571.64,"endTime":1574.64,"body":"very visceral experience"},{"startTime":1574.64,"endTime":1577.64,"body":"of that social belonging changing,"},{"startTime":1578.96,"endTime":1581.96,"body":"through doing some of this ancestral"},{"startTime":1578.96,"endTime":1581.96,"body":"healing work."},{"startTime":1582.08,"endTime":1585.08,"body":"And I want to say to"},{"startTime":1582.08,"endTime":1585.08,"body":"when we look at ancestry,"},{"startTime":1585.76,"endTime":1587.96,"body":"we definitely look at our lineages."},{"startTime":1587.96,"endTime":1590.84,"body":"We also look at ancestry of land."},{"startTime":1590.84,"endTime":1594.4,"body":"So land where your ancestors"},{"startTime":1590.84,"endTime":1594.4,"body":"have been born or lived"},{"startTime":1594.4,"endTime":1599.32,"body":"for periods of time, land where you live"},{"startTime":1594.4,"endTime":1599.32,"body":"now, land where you were born,"},{"startTime":1600.76,"endTime":1602.16,"body":"and then"},{"startTime":1602.16,"endTime":1604.52,"body":"land where maybe you feel some connection"},{"startTime":1604.52,"endTime":1607.52,"body":"that is important to you,"},{"startTime":1604.52,"endTime":1607.52,"body":"but you don't consciously know why."},{"startTime":1608.0,"endTime":1610.76,"body":"And then what I call ancestors of spirit."},{"startTime":1610.76,"endTime":1616.12,"body":"So maybe you just feel some kinship"},{"startTime":1610.76,"endTime":1616.12,"body":"with a particular culture or place."},{"startTime":1616.12,"endTime":1619.92,"body":"And again, you don't consciously know why,"},{"startTime":1616.12,"endTime":1619.92,"body":"but that's something that you"},{"startTime":1619.92,"endTime":1620.92,"body":"also want to honor."},{"startTime":1620.92,"endTime":1624.2,"body":"So when I talk about ancestry,"},{"startTime":1620.92,"endTime":1624.2,"body":"I'm thinking about those different"},{"startTime":1624.64,"endTime":1627.64,"body":"definitions of it."},{"startTime":1627.92,"endTime":1632.12,"body":"And then"},{"startTime":1627.92,"endTime":1632.12,"body":"how do we honor that in our lives?"},{"startTime":1632.12,"endTime":1635.12,"body":"I feel like is an eternal question"},{"startTime":1632.12,"endTime":1635.12,"body":"we could mull on every day."},{"startTime":1635.12,"endTime":1635.32,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":1635.32,"endTime":1637.76,"body":"You might honor it by,"},{"startTime":1637.76,"endTime":1639.32,"body":"having a little altar in your house."},{"startTime":1639.32,"endTime":1640.0,"body":"You might honor it"},{"startTime":1640.0,"endTime":1643.0,"body":"by cooking a favorite meal"},{"startTime":1640.0,"endTime":1643.0,"body":"that your great grandmother passed down."},{"startTime":1643.0,"endTime":1645.96,"body":"The recipe for. You might honor it by"},{"startTime":1646.92,"endTime":1648.76,"body":"cleaning some,"},{"startTime":1648.76,"endTime":1651.32,"body":"bush near your house"},{"startTime":1648.76,"endTime":1651.32,"body":"that has been mistreated, right?"},{"startTime":1651.32,"endTime":1653.56,"body":"There are so many different ways,"},{"startTime":1651.32,"endTime":1653.56,"body":"but it's more"},{"startTime":1653.56,"endTime":1656.92,"body":"just that the way"},{"startTime":1653.56,"endTime":1656.92,"body":"that you hold the value of it, that then"},{"startTime":1657.56,"endTime":1660.2,"body":"the actions will move through"},{"startTime":1660.2,"endTime":1663.2,"body":"you is what I've found."},{"startTime":1663.28,"endTime":1663.64,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1663.64,"endTime":1665.64,"body":"And that's so beautiful, being able"},{"startTime":1665.64,"endTime":1669.4,"body":"to do these practices"},{"startTime":1665.64,"endTime":1669.4,"body":"that we can actually reconnect back."},{"startTime":1669.4,"endTime":1671.6,"body":"And I feel this even with."},{"startTime":1671.6,"endTime":1674.92,"body":"So my,"},{"startTime":1671.6,"endTime":1674.92,"body":"my grandpa at the moment has dementia"},{"startTime":1674.92,"endTime":1677.72,"body":"and he seems like he's transitioning."},{"startTime":1677.72,"endTime":1681.32,"body":"And, you know, he feels like he's"},{"startTime":1677.72,"endTime":1681.32,"body":"in two different worlds in a sense."},{"startTime":1681.32,"endTime":1684.92,"body":"And you know,"},{"startTime":1681.32,"endTime":1684.92,"body":"every time I start singing, I,"},{"startTime":1685.24,"endTime":1688.44,"body":"I feel his presence"},{"startTime":1685.24,"endTime":1688.44,"body":"and I feel his like love and"},{"startTime":1689.24,"endTime":1692.0,"body":"it's been a beautiful way to reconnect,"},{"startTime":1692.0,"endTime":1695.0,"body":"even though I can't connect"},{"startTime":1692.0,"endTime":1695.0,"body":"with him physically."},{"startTime":1695.12,"endTime":1695.88,"body":"And so"},{"startTime":1697.04,"endTime":1700.2,"body":"there's it's it's just so beautiful"},{"startTime":1700.2,"endTime":1703.2,"body":"to be able to come back to that"},{"startTime":1700.2,"endTime":1703.2,"body":"and to know that"},{"startTime":1704.28,"endTime":1706.28,"body":"even when we grieve, there's"},{"startTime":1706.28,"endTime":1710.52,"body":"there's this love and this deep honoring"},{"startTime":1710.88,"endTime":1714.2,"body":"within that grief"},{"startTime":1710.88,"endTime":1714.2,"body":"of when someone's passing over to,"},{"startTime":1715.84,"endTime":1717.92,"body":"And I love how you spoke"},{"startTime":1717.92,"endTime":1723.44,"body":"as well about the the never enough this"},{"startTime":1717.92,"endTime":1723.44,"body":"you know, I think that that happens a lot"},{"startTime":1723.44,"endTime":1726.64,"body":"within our society and we're always"},{"startTime":1727.84,"endTime":1730.96,"body":"not and not so much being present"},{"startTime":1727.84,"endTime":1730.96,"body":"in our reality."},{"startTime":1730.96,"endTime":1735.12,"body":"And we're constantly seeking"},{"startTime":1730.96,"endTime":1735.12,"body":"that, like, okay, but when I get here,"},{"startTime":1735.12,"endTime":1736.0,"body":"I'm going to be happy."},{"startTime":1736.0,"endTime":1738.92,"body":"But when I get here,"},{"startTime":1736.0,"endTime":1738.92,"body":"I'm going to be happy or,"},{"startTime":1738.92,"endTime":1741.4,"body":"you know, and I think, you know,"},{"startTime":1738.92,"endTime":1741.4,"body":"you spoke in your book as well"},{"startTime":1741.4,"endTime":1745.28,"body":"about addiction"},{"startTime":1741.4,"endTime":1745.28,"body":"and that developing through trauma and"},{"startTime":1746.16,"endTime":1750.68,"body":"yeah, I would love to hear about hear more"},{"startTime":1746.16,"endTime":1750.68,"body":"about those underlying causes of trauma"},{"startTime":1750.68,"endTime":1755.24,"body":"and how they play out within our society"},{"startTime":1750.68,"endTime":1755.24,"body":"and how, you know, coming back"},{"startTime":1755.24,"endTime":1759.96,"body":"to, to, indigenous wisdom"},{"startTime":1755.24,"endTime":1759.96,"body":"can actually help us move through that."},{"startTime":1760.88,"endTime":1762.2,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":1762.2,"endTime":1765.52,"body":"Well,"},{"startTime":1762.2,"endTime":1765.52,"body":"one of the things that, really strikes me"},{"startTime":1765.52,"endTime":1769.12,"body":"when we look at different cultural"},{"startTime":1765.52,"endTime":1769.12,"body":"perspectives on trauma is even just"},{"startTime":1770.24,"endTime":1771.8,"body":"the, the definition."},{"startTime":1771.8,"endTime":1775.88,"body":"So the way you look at something"},{"startTime":1771.8,"endTime":1775.88,"body":"is then the way you think about healing"},{"startTime":1775.88,"endTime":1778.88,"body":"or in more of a Western mind,"},{"startTime":1775.88,"endTime":1778.88,"body":"maybe trying to fix it."},{"startTime":1780.08,"endTime":1782.24,"body":"So if you think about trauma"},{"startTime":1782.24,"endTime":1785.64,"body":"with our Western mind"},{"startTime":1782.24,"endTime":1785.64,"body":"that we all have at this point, right."},{"startTime":1787.12,"endTime":1789.4,"body":"It's usually pretty negative, right?"},{"startTime":1789.4,"endTime":1791.64,"body":"We have this idea of, oh, well,"},{"startTime":1791.64,"endTime":1794.16,"body":"get through it,"},{"startTime":1791.64,"endTime":1794.16,"body":"build your resilience, you know."},{"startTime":1794.16,"endTime":1795.32,"body":"Oh, that was tough."},{"startTime":1795.32,"endTime":1798.32,"body":"But you'll be a stronger person, right?"},{"startTime":1799.36,"endTime":1801.56,"body":"It's not that inspiring."},{"startTime":1801.56,"endTime":1805.24,"body":"And nobody is really like,"},{"startTime":1801.56,"endTime":1805.24,"body":"oh, I want to go through trauma."},{"startTime":1805.24,"endTime":1807.8,"body":"They're like, oh, okay. I got, you know,"},{"startTime":1805.24,"endTime":1807.8,"body":"I got it this time."},{"startTime":1807.8,"endTime":1810.96,"body":"Let me see"},{"startTime":1807.8,"endTime":1810.96,"body":"what if I can get through this or what"},{"startTime":1810.96,"endTime":1813.96,"body":"it looks like on the other side."},{"startTime":1814.0,"endTime":1817.8,"body":"And, and trauma"},{"startTime":1814.0,"endTime":1817.8,"body":"certainly has an element of ordeal to it."},{"startTime":1818.36,"endTime":1821.16,"body":"And that isn't necessarily fun,"},{"startTime":1821.16,"endTime":1823.8,"body":"but our understanding around"},{"startTime":1823.8,"endTime":1827.88,"body":"the value of that"},{"startTime":1823.8,"endTime":1827.88,"body":"can make a huge difference to the way"},{"startTime":1827.88,"endTime":1833.12,"body":"we experience it and also the"},{"startTime":1827.88,"endTime":1833.12,"body":"the community and social support"},{"startTime":1833.6,"endTime":1837.76,"body":"that we experience"},{"startTime":1833.6,"endTime":1837.76,"body":"around what we learn. So"},{"startTime":1839.6,"endTime":1839.84,"body":"there's"},{"startTime":1839.84,"endTime":1842.84,"body":"this idea"},{"startTime":1839.84,"endTime":1842.84,"body":"in a lot of indigenous cultures of,"},{"startTime":1843.2,"endTime":1845.68,"body":"for lack of a better word, in English,"},{"startTime":1845.68,"endTime":1847.96,"body":"what I would call a shaman's illness."},{"startTime":1847.96,"endTime":1854.04,"body":"So if you are a really great swimmer,"},{"startTime":1854.36,"endTime":1857.92,"body":"chances are, as you were growing"},{"startTime":1854.36,"endTime":1857.92,"body":"up, people around you noticed."},{"startTime":1858.12,"endTime":1861.92,"body":"And if you wanted to develop that gift,"},{"startTime":1858.12,"endTime":1861.92,"body":"they probably,"},{"startTime":1861.92,"endTime":1863.96,"body":"you know, offered you some help."},{"startTime":1863.96,"endTime":1865.68,"body":"We could take you to these lessons."},{"startTime":1865.68,"endTime":1868.12,"body":"You could try out for this, right?"},{"startTime":1868.12,"endTime":1871.4,"body":"If you are an a really amazing empath,"},{"startTime":1872.84,"endTime":1874.76,"body":"you are an amazing visionary"},{"startTime":1874.76,"endTime":1879.2,"body":"and can just see all sorts of things"},{"startTime":1874.76,"endTime":1879.2,"body":"with your inner I."},{"startTime":1879.2,"endTime":1881.44,"body":"I mean,"},{"startTime":1879.2,"endTime":1881.44,"body":"I could name a number of different guests."},{"startTime":1881.44,"endTime":1884.32,"body":"We would consider more spiritual gifts."},{"startTime":1884.32,"endTime":1887.8,"body":"In our current culture,"},{"startTime":1884.32,"endTime":1887.8,"body":"you're much more likely"},{"startTime":1887.8,"endTime":1892.12,"body":"to at best feel invisible and more likely,"},{"startTime":1893.96,"endTime":1896.96,"body":"feel problematize,"},{"startTime":1897.4,"endTime":1900.68,"body":"and really struggle to develop those gifts"},{"startTime":1900.68,"endTime":1903.68,"body":"with not a lot of guidance."},{"startTime":1904.52,"endTime":1907.04,"body":"So in a more traditional,"},{"startTime":1907.04,"endTime":1910.4,"body":"you know, communal"},{"startTime":1907.04,"endTime":1910.4,"body":"indigenous cultural setting,"},{"startTime":1910.4,"endTime":1913.4,"body":"which we all have had somewhere"},{"startTime":1910.4,"endTime":1913.4,"body":"back in our ancestry,"},{"startTime":1914.84,"endTime":1916.4,"body":"wise elders"},{"startTime":1916.4,"endTime":1919.4,"body":"would have picked out people"},{"startTime":1916.4,"endTime":1919.4,"body":"with all sorts of different gifts,"},{"startTime":1919.88,"endTime":1922.88,"body":"you know, physical gifts,"},{"startTime":1919.88,"endTime":1922.88,"body":"spiritual gifts, emotional gifts,"},{"startTime":1923.24,"endTime":1925.16,"body":"whatever it is, intellectual gifts."},{"startTime":1925.16,"endTime":1929.08,"body":"And then offered guidance on how to,"},{"startTime":1925.16,"endTime":1929.08,"body":"you know,"},{"startTime":1929.08,"endTime":1932.08,"body":"slowly, slowly,"},{"startTime":1929.08,"endTime":1932.08,"body":"step by step, develop them."},{"startTime":1933.56,"endTime":1936.44,"body":"In lieu of that, I find that a lot of us"},{"startTime":1936.44,"endTime":1939.44,"body":"with spiritual gifts and modern culture,"},{"startTime":1941.12,"endTime":1943.8,"body":"Experience a number of traumas,"},{"startTime":1943.8,"endTime":1946.52,"body":"near-death experiences,"},{"startTime":1946.52,"endTime":1949.6,"body":"have all sorts of things"},{"startTime":1946.52,"endTime":1949.6,"body":"that are pretty dysfunctional in our lives"},{"startTime":1949.6,"endTime":1953.2,"body":"by the time we leave our parents house"},{"startTime":1949.6,"endTime":1953.2,"body":"and often"},{"startTime":1953.2,"endTime":1958.28,"body":"are struggling to understand"},{"startTime":1953.2,"endTime":1958.28,"body":"why things are so hard for us."},{"startTime":1961.24,"endTime":1963.6,"body":"But some of it"},{"startTime":1963.6,"endTime":1969.84,"body":"from this perspective, is a calling,"},{"startTime":1963.6,"endTime":1969.84,"body":"and it's actually a huge spiritual gift."},{"startTime":1969.84,"endTime":1973.4,"body":"And it's really important to heed"},{"startTime":1969.84,"endTime":1973.4,"body":"that calling and say, for whatever reason,"},{"startTime":1973.4,"endTime":1977.4,"body":"I wasn't picked by, you know, life"},{"startTime":1973.4,"endTime":1977.4,"body":"to be the best swimmer I've been picked"},{"startTime":1978.6,"endTime":1980.84,"body":"to heal some,"},{"startTime":1980.84,"endTime":1984.76,"body":"you know, ill in my family or culture"},{"startTime":1980.84,"endTime":1984.76,"body":"or whatever it is."},{"startTime":1985.2,"endTime":1988.64,"body":"And so this is my gift"},{"startTime":1988.64,"endTime":1991.64,"body":"to my family, community, etc.,"},{"startTime":1991.96,"endTime":1994.96,"body":"to go through this ordeal."},{"startTime":1995.12,"endTime":1996.08,"body":"Learn."},{"startTime":1996.08,"endTime":1999.92,"body":"Because when we go through trauma,"},{"startTime":1996.08,"endTime":1999.92,"body":"we change our sense of identity and self,"},{"startTime":1999.92,"endTime":2000.24,"body":"right?"},{"startTime":2000.24,"endTime":2003.24,"body":"Learn, change"},{"startTime":2000.24,"endTime":2003.24,"body":"my understanding of myself in the world"},{"startTime":2003.24,"endTime":2006.64,"body":"and then come back with this new knowledge"},{"startTime":2003.24,"endTime":2006.64,"body":"and share it."},{"startTime":2007.16,"endTime":2012.04,"body":"Now. Ideally we would be supported"},{"startTime":2007.16,"endTime":2012.04,"body":"through the process recognized"},{"startTime":2012.16,"endTime":2015.84,"body":"when we're going through it,"},{"startTime":2012.16,"endTime":2015.84,"body":"and then our knowledge would be valued and"},{"startTime":2016.0,"endTime":2018.04,"body":"implemented"},{"startTime":2016.0,"endTime":2018.04,"body":"when we get out the other side."},{"startTime":2018.04,"endTime":2019.32,"body":"And in the current society,"},{"startTime":2019.32,"endTime":2022.44,"body":"sometimes none of those things happen,"},{"startTime":2019.32,"endTime":2022.44,"body":"and it's just hard."},{"startTime":2023.16,"endTime":2026.8,"body":"But part of valuing ourselves"},{"startTime":2023.16,"endTime":2026.8,"body":"and valuing our own lives"},{"startTime":2026.8,"endTime":2030.64,"body":"is continuing to go through it"},{"startTime":2026.8,"endTime":2030.64,"body":"and and find our own, you know, community"},{"startTime":2030.64,"endTime":2032.76,"body":"and support networks where we do"},{"startTime":2030.64,"endTime":2032.76,"body":"feel that."},{"startTime":2032.76,"endTime":2035.8,"body":"So that's been a big drive for me"},{"startTime":2032.76,"endTime":2035.8,"body":"in creating the book."},{"startTime":2036.6,"endTime":2039.76,"body":"And the small community"},{"startTime":2036.6,"endTime":2039.76,"body":"that I can help sustain is"},{"startTime":2040.76,"endTime":2043.76,"body":"helping"},{"startTime":2040.76,"endTime":2043.76,"body":"people feel a bit more social belonging."},{"startTime":2043.88,"endTime":2047.32,"body":"When we step out"},{"startTime":2043.88,"endTime":2047.32,"body":"of some of those supremacy stories"},{"startTime":2047.32,"endTime":2050.32,"body":"of belonging that most of us grew up in,"},{"startTime":2052.04,"endTime":2052.96,"body":"so that we feel"},{"startTime":2052.96,"endTime":2056.08,"body":"some social support"},{"startTime":2052.96,"endTime":2056.08,"body":"while we're also feeling"},{"startTime":2056.44,"endTime":2060.4,"body":"all of this interconnection"},{"startTime":2056.44,"endTime":2060.4,"body":"with the rest of the earth."},{"startTime":2060.4,"endTime":2064.92,"body":"And I do really have an attitude of like,"},{"startTime":2060.4,"endTime":2064.92,"body":"people often will say, why me?"},{"startTime":2064.92,"endTime":2066.32,"body":"And I think that's quite a victim."},{"startTime":2066.32,"endTime":2069.24,"body":"Thought what it's really it's,"},{"startTime":2066.32,"endTime":2069.24,"body":"you know, why?"},{"startTime":2069.24,"endTime":2070.0,"body":"Why not me?"},{"startTime":2070.0,"endTime":2073.8,"body":"Like there's so many species"},{"startTime":2070.0,"endTime":2073.8,"body":"going extinct on the planet."},{"startTime":2073.8,"endTime":2075.76,"body":"There's trees"},{"startTime":2073.8,"endTime":2075.76,"body":"trying to grow out of concrete"},{"startTime":2075.76,"endTime":2077.92,"body":"and all sorts of terrible chemicals"},{"startTime":2075.76,"endTime":2077.92,"body":"in the water."},{"startTime":2077.92,"endTime":2079.16,"body":"Fisher breathing like,"},{"startTime":2079.16,"endTime":2082.96,"body":"why not me experiencing trauma to, like,"},{"startTime":2079.16,"endTime":2082.96,"body":"why wouldn't I be right?"},{"startTime":2083.44,"endTime":2085.52,"body":"There's just a lot of it"},{"startTime":2083.44,"endTime":2085.52,"body":"going around right now."},{"startTime":2085.52,"endTime":2087.76,"body":"We're kind of big transition. So,"},{"startTime":2089.36,"endTime":2092.08,"body":"so that's"},{"startTime":2089.36,"endTime":2092.08,"body":"a big one is really valuing that."},{"startTime":2092.08,"endTime":2095.08,"body":"And and seeing it"},{"startTime":2092.08,"endTime":2095.08,"body":"potentially as a spiritual calling,"},{"startTime":2096.2,"endTime":2098.08,"body":"to become an elder, maybe before"},{"startTime":2098.08,"endTime":2101.08,"body":"you feel ready, to"},{"startTime":2101.76,"endTime":2104.16,"body":"bring some gifts to the world"},{"startTime":2101.76,"endTime":2104.16,"body":"and then work out"},{"startTime":2104.16,"endTime":2108.2,"body":"where they're going to be valued"},{"startTime":2104.16,"endTime":2108.2,"body":"and how you can share it in a creative way"},{"startTime":2108.2,"endTime":2111.32,"body":"in the current society,"},{"startTime":2108.2,"endTime":2111.32,"body":"that some people might receive it"},{"startTime":2111.72,"endTime":2114.08,"body":"and it might not be the people"},{"startTime":2111.72,"endTime":2114.08,"body":"you want to receive it."},{"startTime":2114.08,"endTime":2115.96,"body":"You might really want your family"},{"startTime":2114.08,"endTime":2115.96,"body":"to listen to you,"},{"startTime":2115.96,"endTime":2117.8,"body":"but you find that they're just not ready."},{"startTime":2117.8,"endTime":2119.6,"body":"And these people over here"},{"startTime":2117.8,"endTime":2119.6,"body":"are really ready."},{"startTime":2119.6,"endTime":2122.16,"body":"You know, going"},{"startTime":2119.6,"endTime":2122.16,"body":"where it's fertile is important."},{"startTime":2122.16,"endTime":2124.0,"body":"I think."},{"startTime":2124.0,"endTime":2126.8,"body":"So that's a big part of trauma"},{"startTime":2124.0,"endTime":2126.8,"body":"healing from that perspective."},{"startTime":2126.8,"endTime":2131.32,"body":"And then two others I'll just touch on"},{"startTime":2126.8,"endTime":2131.32,"body":"and we can unpack more potentially."},{"startTime":2132.64,"endTime":2135.12,"body":"I said disconnection from the Earth"},{"startTime":2132.64,"endTime":2135.12,"body":"as a big one."},{"startTime":2135.12,"endTime":2137.64,"body":"And, we talked about that."},{"startTime":2137.64,"endTime":2140.84,"body":"The other two"},{"startTime":2137.64,"endTime":2140.84,"body":"that I found through my research was,"},{"startTime":2142.84,"endTime":2145.84,"body":"a concept called soul loss,"},{"startTime":2145.96,"endTime":2148.48,"body":"sometimes called Sisto in some,"},{"startTime":2148.48,"endTime":2151.24,"body":"Latin American cultures"},{"startTime":2148.48,"endTime":2151.24,"body":"where there's this idea"},{"startTime":2151.24,"endTime":2154.68,"body":"that if we experience, like,"},{"startTime":2151.24,"endTime":2154.68,"body":"a real terror, it's,"},{"startTime":2155.56,"endTime":2159.0,"body":"it's like part of us"},{"startTime":2155.56,"endTime":2159.0,"body":"dissociates to protect ourselves,"},{"startTime":2159.56,"endTime":2162.4,"body":"but then we don't feel whole"},{"startTime":2159.56,"endTime":2162.4,"body":"because that part of us"},{"startTime":2162.4,"endTime":2165.4,"body":"is not connected with the rest of us."},{"startTime":2165.52,"endTime":2168.6,"body":"So there's this idea of like, well,"},{"startTime":2165.52,"endTime":2168.6,"body":"somehow we have to"},{"startTime":2169.68,"endTime":2172.68,"body":"call that energy back."},{"startTime":2172.68,"endTime":2177.16,"body":"And usually when it when that comes back"},{"startTime":2172.68,"endTime":2177.16,"body":"to us, it's, it's a challenging process"},{"startTime":2177.16,"endTime":2180.16,"body":"because it was a trauma"},{"startTime":2177.16,"endTime":2180.16,"body":"that disconnected us in the first place."},{"startTime":2180.56,"endTime":2180.76,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":2180.76,"endTime":2184.04,"body":"So in Western science,"},{"startTime":2180.76,"endTime":2184.04,"body":"I found it really helpful to keep in mind"},{"startTime":2184.48,"endTime":2190.28,"body":"that as far as we're aware, neuro"},{"startTime":2184.48,"endTime":2190.28,"body":"biologically trauma lives in our brains"},{"startTime":2190.28,"endTime":2195.48,"body":"at the intersection of terror and aversion"},{"startTime":2190.28,"endTime":2195.48,"body":"or disgust."},{"startTime":2196.0,"endTime":2202.0,"body":"So consciously, why would you walk into"},{"startTime":2196.0,"endTime":2202.0,"body":"a part of your life that feels terrifying"},{"startTime":2202.0,"endTime":2205.0,"body":"and that you feel like"},{"startTime":2202.0,"endTime":2205.0,"body":"you don't want to go,"},{"startTime":2205.16,"endTime":2208.48,"body":"but you would do it consciously"},{"startTime":2205.16,"endTime":2208.48,"body":"if you're trying to heal trauma?"},{"startTime":2208.48,"endTime":2212.44,"body":"And that's where some of our discernment"},{"startTime":2208.48,"endTime":2212.44,"body":"comes in, is like, okay, is this actually"},{"startTime":2212.44,"endTime":2215.32,"body":"something happening right now"},{"startTime":2212.44,"endTime":2215.32,"body":"that is threatening me,"},{"startTime":2215.32,"endTime":2218.56,"body":"or is this something"},{"startTime":2215.32,"endTime":2218.56,"body":"I'm carrying that I have the power"},{"startTime":2218.56,"endTime":2222.24,"body":"to move through and,"},{"startTime":2218.56,"endTime":2222.24,"body":"and allow healing to occur in my life?"},{"startTime":2223.56,"endTime":2224.92,"body":"So that's part of the work"},{"startTime":2224.92,"endTime":2228.8,"body":"in soul loss"},{"startTime":2224.92,"endTime":2228.8,"body":"is reconnecting with parts of yourself"},{"startTime":2228.8,"endTime":2234.6,"body":"that have been, very wisely hiding"},{"startTime":2228.8,"endTime":2234.6,"body":"because it wasn't safe to be present."},{"startTime":2234.6,"endTime":2237.84,"body":"And now you can bring"},{"startTime":2234.6,"endTime":2237.84,"body":"that energy back in your life."},{"startTime":2238.28,"endTime":2242.0,"body":"And that also relates to another idea"},{"startTime":2238.28,"endTime":2242.0,"body":"of trauma"},{"startTime":2242.0,"endTime":2245.0,"body":"and indigenous science,"},{"startTime":2242.0,"endTime":2245.0,"body":"which is unhealed ancestral trauma."},{"startTime":2246.04,"endTime":2249.12,"body":"So, years ago when I went to"},{"startTime":2250.52,"endTime":2254.8,"body":"the jungles,"},{"startTime":2250.52,"endTime":2254.8,"body":"and did some ayahuasca ceremony with some,"},{"startTime":2255.56,"endTime":2258.92,"body":"indigenous peoples in Peru"},{"startTime":2255.56,"endTime":2258.92,"body":"outside of Iquitos,"},{"startTime":2259.96,"endTime":2262.64,"body":"the shaman,"},{"startTime":2262.64,"endTime":2266.36,"body":"leading the ceremony had been doing it"},{"startTime":2262.64,"endTime":2266.36,"body":"for 40 years."},{"startTime":2266.36,"endTime":2271.6,"body":"And he said, most people come here"},{"startTime":2266.36,"endTime":2271.6,"body":"and think that they have really big"},{"startTime":2271.6,"endTime":2275.68,"body":"egos that need to be knocked down"},{"startTime":2271.6,"endTime":2275.68,"body":"and and changed."},{"startTime":2275.68,"endTime":2281.32,"body":"And he said,"},{"startTime":2275.68,"endTime":2281.32,"body":"I feel like 10% of their problem is ego."},{"startTime":2281.32,"endTime":2283.64,"body":"And 90% is ancestral trauma."},{"startTime":2283.64,"endTime":2285.68,"body":"And that really resonated with me."},{"startTime":2288.4,"endTime":2288.92,"body":"And I feel"},{"startTime":2288.92,"endTime":2293.8,"body":"like it helps as well to recognize work"},{"startTime":2288.92,"endTime":2293.8,"body":"and not personalize and individualize"},{"startTime":2293.8,"endTime":2296.8,"body":"a lot of what we go through and just say,"},{"startTime":2293.8,"endTime":2296.8,"body":"all right, well,"},{"startTime":2297.08,"endTime":2300.04,"body":"I'm not going to heal"},{"startTime":2297.08,"endTime":2300.04,"body":"all of my ancestral trauma in this life."},{"startTime":2300.04,"endTime":2301.28,"body":"It's not actually possible."},{"startTime":2301.28,"endTime":2306.44,"body":"But, if I have the opportunity"},{"startTime":2301.28,"endTime":2306.44,"body":"to experience some amount of healing and,"},{"startTime":2306.44,"endTime":2310.84,"body":"and dedicate some amount of attention"},{"startTime":2306.44,"endTime":2310.84,"body":"to that, then I can stop certain cycles."},{"startTime":2311.44,"endTime":2313.56,"body":"That feels like a win, right?"},{"startTime":2313.56,"endTime":2319.12,"body":"And then I can at least have some tools"},{"startTime":2313.56,"endTime":2319.12,"body":"to pass on so that the next generation"},{"startTime":2319.12,"endTime":2323.24,"body":"has more tools to try to stop"},{"startTime":2319.12,"endTime":2323.24,"body":"what comes up and emerges in their time."},{"startTime":2323.24,"endTime":2326.24,"body":"Right. So,"},{"startTime":2326.32,"endTime":2326.64,"body":"yeah."},{"startTime":2326.64,"endTime":2329.56,"body":"So ancestral trauma is"},{"startTime":2329.56,"endTime":2331.96,"body":"a really big one for all of us,"},{"startTime":2329.56,"endTime":2331.96,"body":"whether you look at it"},{"startTime":2331.96,"endTime":2335.72,"body":"as epigenetics or you look at it"},{"startTime":2331.96,"endTime":2335.72,"body":"in a more spiritual way of,"},{"startTime":2339.16,"endTime":2342.76,"body":"Disconnection from,"},{"startTime":2339.16,"endTime":2342.76,"body":"you know, knowing your cultural identity,"},{"startTime":2342.76,"endTime":2345.76,"body":"knowing your ceremonies,"},{"startTime":2342.76,"endTime":2345.76,"body":"knowing your rituals,"},{"startTime":2346.48,"endTime":2349.8,"body":"knowing that you belong to the land,"},{"startTime":2346.48,"endTime":2349.8,"body":"where to do"},{"startTime":2349.8,"endTime":2352.8,"body":"certain ceremonies,"},{"startTime":2349.8,"endTime":2352.8,"body":"where the sacred sites are,"},{"startTime":2352.84,"endTime":2356.8,"body":"what to do different times of year,"},{"startTime":2352.84,"endTime":2356.8,"body":"what your cultural creation story is."},{"startTime":2356.8,"endTime":2359.08,"body":"I could go on a whole list"},{"startTime":2356.8,"endTime":2359.08,"body":"and we might both say,"},{"startTime":2359.08,"endTime":2360.92,"body":"I don't know that I wasn't taught"},{"startTime":2359.08,"endTime":2360.92,"body":"that right."},{"startTime":2360.92,"endTime":2364.8,"body":"It's just a lot to revive sometimes."},{"startTime":2365.24,"endTime":2367.84,"body":"And sometimes"},{"startTime":2365.24,"endTime":2367.84,"body":"when you're not on your traditional lands"},{"startTime":2367.84,"endTime":2370.72,"body":"anymore, or your ancestors"},{"startTime":2367.84,"endTime":2370.72,"body":"from multiple lands, you might sort of"},{"startTime":2370.72,"endTime":2373.4,"body":"throw up your hands and go, well,"},{"startTime":2370.72,"endTime":2373.4,"body":"I don't even know what's mine anymore."},{"startTime":2373.4,"endTime":2378.68,"body":"And you just have to be with that"},{"startTime":2373.4,"endTime":2378.68,"body":"not knowing for a while"},{"startTime":2378.68,"endTime":2381.68,"body":"and see if it comes to you."},{"startTime":2382.68,"endTime":2386.08,"body":"So that that seems to be my answer"},{"startTime":2382.68,"endTime":2386.08,"body":"for that question about."},{"startTime":2386.12,"endTime":2389.08,"body":"Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah."},{"startTime":2389.08,"endTime":2391.48,"body":"And it's it's interesting."},{"startTime":2391.48,"endTime":2395.28,"body":"I feel like I,"},{"startTime":2391.48,"endTime":2395.28,"body":"I started reading about epigenetics."},{"startTime":2395.28,"endTime":2397.08,"body":"I think it was through Bruce Lipton."},{"startTime":2397.08,"endTime":2401.08,"body":"He's, he does a lot of studies around"},{"startTime":2397.08,"endTime":2401.08,"body":"that and research."},{"startTime":2401.08,"endTime":2403.72,"body":"So it's such an interesting"},{"startTime":2405.16,"endTime":2408.4,"body":"way of unpacking, you know."},{"startTime":2408.56,"endTime":2413.44,"body":"Oh, I see that in my parents"},{"startTime":2408.56,"endTime":2413.44,"body":"and I don't want to pass that down."},{"startTime":2413.44,"endTime":2415.76,"body":"Or I see that my grandparents"},{"startTime":2413.44,"endTime":2415.76,"body":"and I don't want to pass it down."},{"startTime":2415.76,"endTime":2417.16,"body":"And that could be a behavioral thing."},{"startTime":2417.16,"endTime":2419.8,"body":"It could be an energetic thing or."},{"startTime":2419.8,"endTime":2420.16,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":2420.16,"endTime":2423.16,"body":"So I really resonate with that. And"},{"startTime":2424.0,"endTime":2427.32,"body":"yeah, I something else"},{"startTime":2424.0,"endTime":2427.32,"body":"I would love to unpack with you is,"},{"startTime":2427.8,"endTime":2430.84,"body":"you know, shame and grief and humility"},{"startTime":2430.84,"endTime":2434.68,"body":"being some of the key theme themes"},{"startTime":2430.84,"endTime":2434.68,"body":"within your book as well. And"},{"startTime":2436.44,"endTime":2438.64,"body":"underlying a lot of these cracks as well,"},{"startTime":2438.64,"endTime":2442.24,"body":"that we do have"},{"startTime":2438.64,"endTime":2442.24,"body":"within us in many cultures."},{"startTime":2443.72,"endTime":2446.68,"body":"So maybe we, we unpack one at a time."},{"startTime":2446.68,"endTime":2451.72,"body":"But speaking to shame, I mean, shame"},{"startTime":2446.68,"endTime":2451.72,"body":"is a huge core wound that a lot of us"},{"startTime":2452.32,"endTime":2455.32,"body":"have, you know, whether it's"},{"startTime":2452.32,"endTime":2455.32,"body":"through the education system and,"},{"startTime":2455.32,"endTime":2458.6,"body":"you know, the whole rewards"},{"startTime":2455.32,"endTime":2458.6,"body":"and punishments and you get punished"},{"startTime":2458.6,"endTime":2462.24,"body":"for something that you then carry shame"},{"startTime":2458.6,"endTime":2462.24,"body":"throughout your whole life"},{"startTime":2462.24,"endTime":2466.08,"body":"just from one fracture moment within,"},{"startTime":2462.24,"endTime":2466.08,"body":"you know, your teacher said"},{"startTime":2466.08,"endTime":2467.32,"body":"something that you were bad at"},{"startTime":2467.32,"endTime":2471.16,"body":"and you feel really shameful about that"},{"startTime":2467.32,"endTime":2471.16,"body":"and you don't carry that on."},{"startTime":2471.16,"endTime":2472.52,"body":"And so,"},{"startTime":2472.52,"endTime":2474.12,"body":"you know,"},{"startTime":2472.52,"endTime":2474.12,"body":"it might be like sharing your voice,"},{"startTime":2474.12,"endTime":2477.16,"body":"it might be singing and someone might say,"},{"startTime":2474.12,"endTime":2477.16,"body":"you're a really terrible singer,"},{"startTime":2477.16,"endTime":2480.72,"body":"so you feel shame every time"},{"startTime":2477.16,"endTime":2480.72,"body":"that comes up again throughout your life."},{"startTime":2480.72,"endTime":2481.44,"body":"And so,"},{"startTime":2483.6,"endTime":2485.84,"body":"yeah, I would"},{"startTime":2483.6,"endTime":2485.84,"body":"love I'd love to hear your perspectives"},{"startTime":2485.84,"endTime":2489.36,"body":"on on shame and the blocks"},{"startTime":2485.84,"endTime":2489.36,"body":"that it creates in our lives."},{"startTime":2489.76,"endTime":2491.32,"body":"Yeah. Thank you."},{"startTime":2491.32,"endTime":2494.12,"body":"I feel like when people even have"},{"startTime":2494.12,"endTime":2497.6,"body":"an interest in looking at ancestry,"},{"startTime":2494.12,"endTime":2497.6,"body":"then shame is often"},{"startTime":2497.6,"endTime":2501.48,"body":"a big thing that starts to come up"},{"startTime":2497.6,"endTime":2501.48,"body":"and can be really deterring."},{"startTime":2501.48,"endTime":2504.48,"body":"I've watched some people start"},{"startTime":2501.48,"endTime":2504.48,"body":"an ancestral"},{"startTime":2504.68,"endTime":2508.92,"body":"altar practice, have something like that"},{"startTime":2504.68,"endTime":2508.92,"body":"come up and then throw the altar away"},{"startTime":2508.92,"endTime":2512.56,"body":"and I'm like, oh, that probably isn't"},{"startTime":2508.92,"endTime":2512.56,"body":"going to work out well for you. But,"},{"startTime":2516.36,"endTime":2518.16,"body":"so I,"},{"startTime":2518.16,"endTime":2521.56,"body":"I feel like shame, in the Western way"},{"startTime":2521.56,"endTime":2524.56,"body":"that it gets talked about,"},{"startTime":2521.56,"endTime":2524.56,"body":"we have, on the one hand,"},{"startTime":2526.24,"endTime":2528.04,"body":"someone like Brené Brown"},{"startTime":2528.04,"endTime":2531.24,"body":"has a really big voice and has done"},{"startTime":2528.04,"endTime":2531.24,"body":"a lot of interesting work unpacking it,"},{"startTime":2532.52,"endTime":2535.52,"body":"but from an indigenous science"},{"startTime":2532.52,"endTime":2535.52,"body":"perspective, to me,"},{"startTime":2535.72,"endTime":2539.24,"body":"she unpacks a lot of the ins"},{"startTime":2535.72,"endTime":2539.24,"body":"and outs of it"},{"startTime":2539.24,"endTime":2543.76,"body":"and what's sitting there,"},{"startTime":2539.24,"endTime":2543.76,"body":"but not the value of it."},{"startTime":2544.16,"endTime":2548.32,"body":"And she'll she'll go to the level of"},{"startTime":2544.16,"endTime":2548.32,"body":"saying, okay, we'll just get rid of it."},{"startTime":2548.32,"endTime":2549.76,"body":"It's not useful,"},{"startTime":2549.76,"endTime":2554.12,"body":"but actually it's there for a reason,"},{"startTime":2549.76,"endTime":2554.12,"body":"spiritually from my perspective."},{"startTime":2554.36,"endTime":2556.68,"body":"So for example,"},{"startTime":2556.68,"endTime":2562.8,"body":"I have a mixture of ancestry"},{"startTime":2556.68,"endTime":2562.8,"body":"on my, indigenous German family"},{"startTime":2562.8,"endTime":2567.2,"body":"who were Nazis and were against the Nazis"},{"startTime":2562.8,"endTime":2567.2,"body":"as a lot of families had."},{"startTime":2568.4,"endTime":2572.12,"body":"And there's a lot of shame around"},{"startTime":2568.4,"endTime":2572.12,"body":"that whole experience."},{"startTime":2573.88,"endTime":2576.76,"body":"And so."},{"startTime":2576.76,"endTime":2578.48,"body":"That shame"},{"startTime":2578.48,"endTime":2581.24,"body":"created a lot of dynamics through my life."},{"startTime":2581.24,"endTime":2584.92,"body":"Even though my father was born"},{"startTime":2581.24,"endTime":2584.92,"body":"after the war, he carried"},{"startTime":2584.92,"endTime":2586.6,"body":"a lot of cultural shame."},{"startTime":2586.6,"endTime":2588.92,"body":"It led to him marrying a Jewish woman."},{"startTime":2588.92,"endTime":2592.72,"body":"It led to really bad power dynamics"},{"startTime":2588.92,"endTime":2592.72,"body":"between them, where she bullied him"},{"startTime":2592.72,"endTime":2596.24,"body":"because of his shame and all sorts"},{"startTime":2592.72,"endTime":2596.24,"body":"of things played out in my life, right?"},{"startTime":2596.44,"endTime":2600.0,"body":"She wasn't alive during that war"},{"startTime":2596.44,"endTime":2600.0,"body":"either, and her family wasn't in Germany."},{"startTime":2600.0,"endTime":2601.44,"body":"But never mind."},{"startTime":2601.44,"endTime":2604.12,"body":"Those are still some of"},{"startTime":2601.44,"endTime":2604.12,"body":"the dynamics that happened."},{"startTime":2605.08,"endTime":2606.2,"body":"It also led to him moving"},{"startTime":2606.2,"endTime":2609.44,"body":"to America because his father"},{"startTime":2606.2,"endTime":2609.44,"body":"was so ashamed of Germany."},{"startTime":2609.48,"endTime":2612.36,"body":"He decided with the supremacy story,"},{"startTime":2609.48,"endTime":2612.36,"body":"America was better"},{"startTime":2612.36,"endTime":2615.64,"body":"because America had rescued people"},{"startTime":2612.36,"endTime":2615.64,"body":"and ended the war in his mind."},{"startTime":2615.64,"endTime":2617.88,"body":"So it created a lot of flow on."},{"startTime":2617.88,"endTime":2620.24,"body":"That's led to me."},{"startTime":2620.24,"endTime":2623.24,"body":"And being with that same."},{"startTime":2624.88,"endTime":2627.0,"body":"Has helped me then"},{"startTime":2627.0,"endTime":2631.56,"body":"feel what I can be proud of in my culture"},{"startTime":2627.0,"endTime":2631.56,"body":"and in my ancestry."},{"startTime":2631.68,"endTime":2636.68,"body":"So I'm making the space to be with that"},{"startTime":2631.68,"endTime":2636.68,"body":"rather than pushing it aside and saying"},{"startTime":2637.24,"endTime":2641.32,"body":"sort of defiantly, while I'm proud,"},{"startTime":2637.24,"endTime":2641.32,"body":"which I'm watching a number of,"},{"startTime":2642.88,"endTime":2645.28,"body":"people do, I feel like in, in the US at"},{"startTime":2645.28,"endTime":2648.36,"body":"the moment is saying,"},{"startTime":2645.28,"endTime":2648.36,"body":"I'm not going to unpack it."},{"startTime":2648.64,"endTime":2651.2,"body":"I but I'm entitled"},{"startTime":2648.64,"endTime":2651.2,"body":"to be proud of my culture."},{"startTime":2651.2,"endTime":2654.04,"body":"And I actually do"},{"startTime":2651.2,"endTime":2654.04,"body":"think we all have things to be proud of."},{"startTime":2655.44,"endTime":2658.76,"body":"But I don't think we are entitled to be."},{"startTime":2659.2,"endTime":2662.84,"body":"So it's sort of going, what was the"},{"startTime":2659.2,"endTime":2662.84,"body":"what was the purpose of that shame?"},{"startTime":2662.84,"endTime":2668.12,"body":"And for me, the purpose of that shame"},{"startTime":2662.84,"endTime":2668.12,"body":"was actually really reinvigorating inside"},{"startTime":2668.12,"endTime":2671.84,"body":"of my being the the value of truth,"},{"startTime":2671.84,"endTime":2676.88,"body":"the value of justice,"},{"startTime":2671.84,"endTime":2676.88,"body":"and actually standing up"},{"startTime":2676.88,"endTime":2681.08,"body":"and and being willing to physically die"},{"startTime":2676.88,"endTime":2681.08,"body":"and leave my body."},{"startTime":2681.08,"endTime":2684.92,"body":"And I'm not saying that dramatically"},{"startTime":2681.08,"endTime":2684.92,"body":"because I've had that experience and say,"},{"startTime":2684.92,"endTime":2689.08,"body":"I actually I stand for truth"},{"startTime":2684.92,"endTime":2689.08,"body":"because I am not going to go like"},{"startTime":2689.36,"endTime":2694.2,"body":"my grandfather tried to fight a bit"},{"startTime":2689.36,"endTime":2694.2,"body":"for the Nazis and then deserted"},{"startTime":2694.2,"endTime":2697.36,"body":"and then got caught"},{"startTime":2694.2,"endTime":2697.36,"body":"and have these really terrible experiences"},{"startTime":2697.64,"endTime":2700.64,"body":"of being tortured."},{"startTime":2701.36,"endTime":2704.04,"body":"But I think he hated himself"},{"startTime":2701.36,"endTime":2704.04,"body":"for having thought that."},{"startTime":2704.04,"endTime":2705.44,"body":"Oh, basically,"},{"startTime":2707.16,"endTime":2709.52,"body":"and I had the"},{"startTime":2709.52,"endTime":2713.28,"body":"opportunity then to try to shift"},{"startTime":2709.52,"endTime":2713.28,"body":"that cycle and show up in the world"},{"startTime":2713.28,"endTime":2716.56,"body":"and say, okay, I'm actually"},{"startTime":2713.28,"endTime":2716.56,"body":"putting my physical life on the line."},{"startTime":2716.56,"endTime":2720.76,"body":"And this happened in my 20s"},{"startTime":2716.56,"endTime":2720.76,"body":"when I was working in South Africa"},{"startTime":2720.76,"endTime":2724.92,"body":"and say, I stand for truth,"},{"startTime":2720.76,"endTime":2724.92,"body":"and this is what needs to be said here."},{"startTime":2727.12,"endTime":2729.08,"body":"And then in my own family,"},{"startTime":2727.12,"endTime":2729.08,"body":"I had the opportunity"},{"startTime":2729.08,"endTime":2732.08,"body":"to again and say, well,"},{"startTime":2729.08,"endTime":2732.08,"body":"I stand for truth and I was abused."},{"startTime":2732.12,"endTime":2734.88,"body":"And if you're all denying it,"},{"startTime":2732.12,"endTime":2734.88,"body":"then I guess I'm not in a relationship"},{"startTime":2734.88,"endTime":2735.76,"body":"with you anymore."},{"startTime":2735.76,"endTime":2738.52,"body":"If you're siding with the offender"},{"startTime":2735.76,"endTime":2738.52,"body":"and not willing to look at this, right."},{"startTime":2738.52,"endTime":2742.32,"body":"Like, I've had these opportunities"},{"startTime":2738.52,"endTime":2742.32,"body":"and it's been really painful"},{"startTime":2742.32,"endTime":2747.08,"body":"to live with them, and yet I've had this"},{"startTime":2742.32,"endTime":2747.08,"body":"knowing that I couldn't do it."},{"startTime":2747.08,"endTime":2750.64,"body":"Another way,"},{"startTime":2747.08,"endTime":2750.64,"body":"because that would be such a betrayal."},{"startTime":2750.64,"endTime":2755.84,"body":"And my ancestors know"},{"startTime":2750.64,"endTime":2755.84,"body":"that betrayal of values so deeply, that's"},{"startTime":2755.84,"endTime":2760.72,"body":"the value of the shame, is having unpacked"},{"startTime":2755.84,"endTime":2760.72,"body":"that, I know that so deeply."},{"startTime":2762.08,"endTime":2765.44,"body":"I value we value truth, justice."},{"startTime":2765.44,"endTime":2768.4,"body":"Right. Some of these things. Yeah."},{"startTime":2768.4,"endTime":2771.32,"body":"And that's been about a big part"},{"startTime":2768.4,"endTime":2771.32,"body":"of the gift of unpacking."},{"startTime":2771.32,"endTime":2774.32,"body":"The shame for me is getting back to"},{"startTime":2775.68,"endTime":2776.88,"body":"what you might"},{"startTime":2776.88,"endTime":2779.88,"body":"hear Aboriginal Australians"},{"startTime":2776.88,"endTime":2779.88,"body":"call law or law,"},{"startTime":2779.92,"endTime":2784.64,"body":"but every culture has law and law,"},{"startTime":2779.92,"endTime":2784.64,"body":"whether we're conscious of it or not,"},{"startTime":2784.64,"endTime":2787.64,"body":"we all have some way"},{"startTime":2787.64,"endTime":2791.2,"body":"of holding justice"},{"startTime":2787.64,"endTime":2791.2,"body":"and holding each other to account."},{"startTime":2791.2,"endTime":2794.64,"body":"And it's a bit different in different"},{"startTime":2791.2,"endTime":2794.64,"body":"cultures and different in different lands,"},{"startTime":2795.4,"endTime":2798.64,"body":"but it's still there and"},{"startTime":2795.4,"endTime":2798.64,"body":"there's still some core values in common."},{"startTime":2799.0,"endTime":2799.76,"body":"Right?"},{"startTime":2799.76,"endTime":2804.16,"body":"So for me,"},{"startTime":2799.76,"endTime":2804.16,"body":"that's a big part of the value of shame is"},{"startTime":2804.88,"endTime":2807.4,"body":"what why is it there?"},{"startTime":2807.4,"endTime":2812.8,"body":"What was betrayed"},{"startTime":2807.4,"endTime":2812.8,"body":"like what value is so important"},{"startTime":2813.04,"endTime":2816.04,"body":"that was betrayed,"},{"startTime":2813.04,"endTime":2816.04,"body":"that has led to you carrying this shame?"},{"startTime":2816.64,"endTime":2819.04,"body":"Was it that you didn't"},{"startTime":2816.64,"endTime":2819.04,"body":"treat another person with dignity?"},{"startTime":2819.04,"endTime":2820.4,"body":"Was it that you judge somebody?"},{"startTime":2820.4,"endTime":2821.88,"body":"Was it that you lied to yourself?"},{"startTime":2821.88,"endTime":2823.48,"body":"Like what was it? Yeah."},{"startTime":2823.48,"endTime":2827.8,"body":"And then when we get to the root of that,"},{"startTime":2823.48,"endTime":2827.8,"body":"it's like this blossoming of knowing"},{"startTime":2827.8,"endTime":2830.8,"body":"ourselves on this deep level"},{"startTime":2827.8,"endTime":2830.8,"body":"and knowing something about our,"},{"startTime":2831.52,"endTime":2832.92,"body":"our culture and our community."},{"startTime":2832.92,"endTime":2835.68,"body":"It's a it's a real, for me, revival of"},{"startTime":2836.92,"endTime":2837.4,"body":"the human"},{"startTime":2837.4,"endTime":2840.48,"body":"spirit, really to sort of go, actually,"},{"startTime":2837.4,"endTime":2840.48,"body":"I stand for this."},{"startTime":2840.48,"endTime":2842.32,"body":"I'm not in the shadow anymore playing"},{"startTime":2842.32,"endTime":2845.56,"body":"any of these games"},{"startTime":2842.32,"endTime":2845.56,"body":"that don't feel quite right, you know."},{"startTime":2846.08,"endTime":2847.16,"body":"Yeah, absolutely."},{"startTime":2847.16,"endTime":2850.88,"body":"It's also me is making"},{"startTime":2847.16,"endTime":2850.88,"body":"the unconscious conscious and that like"},{"startTime":2851.8,"endTime":2857.4,"body":"the inquiry into the many parts"},{"startTime":2851.8,"endTime":2857.4,"body":"that we actually hold within us."},{"startTime":2857.4,"endTime":2863.12,"body":"You know, I think we do we often"},{"startTime":2857.4,"endTime":2863.12,"body":"have these hot, feelings of like, shame,"},{"startTime":2863.24,"endTime":2866.2,"body":"guilt that we want to"},{"startTime":2866.2,"endTime":2869.36,"body":"just push away, like you"},{"startTime":2866.2,"endTime":2869.36,"body":"said, just hide away."},{"startTime":2869.36,"endTime":2872.96,"body":"And actually, if we inquire about, well,"},{"startTime":2869.36,"endTime":2872.96,"body":"why are they there?"},{"startTime":2873.16,"endTime":2875.88,"body":"Why is that coming up"},{"startTime":2873.16,"endTime":2875.88,"body":"and why is it different?"},{"startTime":2875.88,"endTime":2879.28,"body":"And for me, compared to the person"},{"startTime":2875.88,"endTime":2879.28,"body":"standing next to me?"},{"startTime":2879.28,"endTime":2881.36,"body":"And within that inquiry,"},{"startTime":2881.36,"endTime":2885.48,"body":"you just learn so much about your true"},{"startTime":2881.36,"endTime":2885.48,"body":"essence and your true gifts"},{"startTime":2885.48,"endTime":2888.72,"body":"that you have for the world"},{"startTime":2885.48,"endTime":2888.72,"body":"and how you can show up better or"},{"startTime":2888.76,"endTime":2893.24,"body":"how how you want to show up differently,"},{"startTime":2888.76,"endTime":2893.24,"body":"or it just it creates,"},{"startTime":2894.36,"endTime":2896.44,"body":"and like you said earlier, it"},{"startTime":2896.44,"endTime":2899.44,"body":"once you change that in a landscape"},{"startTime":2900.16,"endTime":2905.12,"body":"and bring awareness to it, it also shifts,"},{"startTime":2900.16,"endTime":2905.12,"body":"the way people view you and the way"},{"startTime":2905.12,"endTime":2908.2,"body":"that people behave around you too,"},{"startTime":2905.12,"endTime":2908.2,"body":"because you're showing up differently."},{"startTime":2910.08,"endTime":2914.6,"body":"So I can't believe we're almost at time"},{"startTime":2910.08,"endTime":2914.6,"body":"here, so."},{"startTime":2915.08,"endTime":2918.68,"body":"But, if we want to quickly just, I know,"},{"startTime":2918.72,"endTime":2920.88,"body":"probably can't quickly go over it,"},{"startTime":2918.72,"endTime":2920.88,"body":"but like,"},{"startTime":2920.88,"endTime":2924.0,"body":"grief and humility,"},{"startTime":2920.88,"endTime":2924.0,"body":"if you just had a few things to say about"},{"startTime":2924.4,"endTime":2929.0,"body":"those two things"},{"startTime":2924.4,"endTime":2929.0,"body":"I would love to hear, hear about about."},{"startTime":2929.04,"endTime":2932.04,"body":"Yeah. How they play out as well."},{"startTime":2932.4,"endTime":2935.4,"body":"Well, I will just say about grief,"},{"startTime":2935.4,"endTime":2937.48,"body":"grief takes a lot of energy."},{"startTime":2937.48,"endTime":2940.52,"body":"It takes time to to be with that sadness."},{"startTime":2940.52,"endTime":2944.08,"body":"And I find, especially in terms"},{"startTime":2940.52,"endTime":2944.08,"body":"of that disconnection from,"},{"startTime":2944.48,"endTime":2948.04,"body":"from the earth"},{"startTime":2944.48,"endTime":2948.04,"body":"and that, like, essential mother energy,"},{"startTime":2949.68,"endTime":2952.36,"body":"that when we first start to"},{"startTime":2952.36,"endTime":2956.32,"body":"feel that grief,"},{"startTime":2952.36,"endTime":2956.32,"body":"it can start to be overwhelming."},{"startTime":2957.16,"endTime":2959.88,"body":"But I promise there's a bottom"},{"startTime":2959.88,"endTime":2963.88,"body":"is the best I can say"},{"startTime":2959.88,"endTime":2963.88,"body":"is just making a bit of space for it"},{"startTime":2963.88,"endTime":2966.88,"body":"and allowing that energy to flow"},{"startTime":2963.88,"endTime":2966.88,"body":"sort of over time."},{"startTime":2967.72,"endTime":2970.52,"body":"We just have moments of feeling it"},{"startTime":2967.72,"endTime":2970.52,"body":"and then it flows,"},{"startTime":2970.52,"endTime":2972.16,"body":"and then we feel that deeper connection."},{"startTime":2972.16,"endTime":2974.48,"body":"Every time we move through the grief,"},{"startTime":2972.16,"endTime":2974.48,"body":"then we feel that"},{"startTime":2974.48,"endTime":2976.52,"body":"little more deeper connection."},{"startTime":2976.52,"endTime":2979.0,"body":"Usually we feel more in our bodies, like"},{"startTime":2979.0,"endTime":2982.0,"body":"maybe"},{"startTime":2979.0,"endTime":2982.0,"body":"we'll have some energy awaken around."},{"startTime":2982.24,"endTime":2984.88,"body":"Probably like your your hips,"},{"startTime":2982.24,"endTime":2984.88,"body":"what we would call"},{"startTime":2984.88,"endTime":2988.84,"body":"like lower chakras or something,"},{"startTime":2984.88,"endTime":2988.84,"body":"maybe your toes and feet."},{"startTime":2988.84,"endTime":2991.84,"body":"You'll feel that little more energy"},{"startTime":2988.84,"endTime":2991.84,"body":"coming up from the earth,"},{"startTime":2992.92,"endTime":2993.88,"body":"into your body. But"},{"startTime":2994.96,"endTime":2997.16,"body":"that often can be hard, that grief."},{"startTime":2997.16,"endTime":3001.32,"body":"And it it really is"},{"startTime":2997.16,"endTime":3001.32,"body":"just a patience practice a lot of the time"},{"startTime":3001.32,"endTime":3005.16,"body":"and persistently just allowing yourself"},{"startTime":3001.32,"endTime":3005.16,"body":"to be with those feelings."},{"startTime":3005.16,"endTime":3009.44,"body":"And it could be just sitting and doing"},{"startTime":3005.16,"endTime":3009.44,"body":"an earthing practice, walking barefoot,"},{"startTime":3009.44,"endTime":3012.88,"body":"just sitting somewhere in the bush"},{"startTime":3009.44,"endTime":3012.88,"body":"for a bit regularly,"},{"startTime":3012.88,"endTime":3015.88,"body":"and just allowing yourself"},{"startTime":3012.88,"endTime":3015.88,"body":"to feel what you feel."},{"startTime":3017.24,"endTime":3020.24,"body":"And in terms of humility."},{"startTime":3022.0,"endTime":3024.6,"body":"For me,"},{"startTime":3022.0,"endTime":3024.6,"body":"it's a really important spiritual value."},{"startTime":3024.6,"endTime":3026.4,"body":"And it's,"},{"startTime":3026.4,"endTime":3029.16,"body":"arrogance can be quite dangerous."},{"startTime":3029.16,"endTime":3032.16,"body":"I don't think there's an answer."},{"startTime":3032.44,"endTime":3037.36,"body":"And I think it's really valuable"},{"startTime":3032.44,"endTime":3037.36,"body":"to always have a little bit of doubt,"},{"startTime":3037.36,"endTime":3041.88,"body":"even when we feel very strong and certain"},{"startTime":3037.36,"endTime":3041.88,"body":"about something, because zealotry"},{"startTime":3042.72,"endTime":3045.72,"body":"can be quite dangerous"},{"startTime":3042.72,"endTime":3045.72,"body":"and disconnect us from"},{"startTime":3046.6,"endTime":3049.96,"body":"the all other people, Accenture,"},{"startTime":3046.6,"endTime":3049.96,"body":"anyone who thinks or feels different."},{"startTime":3049.96,"endTime":3051.2,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":3051.2,"endTime":3054.32,"body":"So even when I'm really, really confident"},{"startTime":3051.2,"endTime":3054.32,"body":"I'm going to act on it,"},{"startTime":3054.72,"endTime":3059.76,"body":"I still intend and aim"},{"startTime":3054.72,"endTime":3059.76,"body":"to hold a little bit of that doubt."},{"startTime":3059.76,"endTime":3063.92,"body":"Like, I may feel so sure,"},{"startTime":3059.76,"endTime":3063.92,"body":"but I may fall in my face."},{"startTime":3063.92,"endTime":3065.04,"body":"It could happen."},{"startTime":3066.72,"endTime":3070.48,"body":"And that that humility helps ground us"},{"startTime":3066.72,"endTime":3070.48,"body":"literally."},{"startTime":3070.48,"endTime":3070.8,"body":"Right?"},{"startTime":3070.8,"endTime":3076.92,"body":"Like there's so many spiritual traditions"},{"startTime":3070.8,"endTime":3076.92,"body":"where you bow to go through a doorway"},{"startTime":3076.92,"endTime":3078.36,"body":"or you have to lower yourself"},{"startTime":3078.36,"endTime":3081.48,"body":"to go into a sweat lodge,"},{"startTime":3078.36,"endTime":3081.48,"body":"or you literally pray on the ground."},{"startTime":3081.84,"endTime":3083.56,"body":"There is something really valuable"},{"startTime":3081.84,"endTime":3083.56,"body":"at that."},{"startTime":3083.56,"endTime":3087.6,"body":"Physically humbling ourselves"},{"startTime":3083.56,"endTime":3087.6,"body":"and just recognizing we're human."},{"startTime":3087.6,"endTime":3089.04,"body":"We make mistakes sometimes."},{"startTime":3089.04,"endTime":3092.56,"body":"There's all sorts of signs and messages"},{"startTime":3089.04,"endTime":3092.56,"body":"around us and I'm like, I'm sorry."},{"startTime":3092.56,"endTime":3094.2,"body":"I'm the, like, silly human."},{"startTime":3094.2,"endTime":3096.88,"body":"I know there's messages"},{"startTime":3094.2,"endTime":3096.88,"body":"and I'm not getting it."},{"startTime":3096.88,"endTime":3098.36,"body":"Try again."},{"startTime":3098.36,"endTime":3099.84,"body":"But be patient with me."},{"startTime":3099.84,"endTime":3101.88,"body":"Right."},{"startTime":3101.88,"endTime":3105.96,"body":"But I find if"},{"startTime":3101.88,"endTime":3105.96,"body":"if I start having thoughts of like,"},{"startTime":3105.96,"endTime":3109.52,"body":"I've got it all figured out, usually life"},{"startTime":3105.96,"endTime":3109.52,"body":"will find a way to humble me anyway."},{"startTime":3109.56,"endTime":3112.52,"body":"So usually that works itself."},{"startTime":3112.52,"endTime":3116.52,"body":"But yeah, that arrogance of I've got it"},{"startTime":3112.52,"endTime":3116.52,"body":"and I've got the plan"},{"startTime":3116.52,"endTime":3117.72,"body":"and I've got the path."},{"startTime":3117.72,"endTime":3120.72,"body":"And you know,"},{"startTime":3117.72,"endTime":3120.72,"body":"I get actually quite scared of it."},{"startTime":3120.72,"endTime":3123.6,"body":"I find it dangerous"},{"startTime":3120.72,"endTime":3123.6,"body":"if someone is talking that way."},{"startTime":3123.6,"endTime":3125.4,"body":"I'm really wary of them."},{"startTime":3127.24,"endTime":3127.56,"body":"And I"},{"startTime":3127.56,"endTime":3131.96,"body":"think at the moment we are in pretty"},{"startTime":3127.56,"endTime":3131.96,"body":"uncharted territory around the planet, and"},{"startTime":3132.56,"endTime":3137.64,"body":"a lot of us are reviving and, traditions,"},{"startTime":3132.56,"endTime":3137.64,"body":"but then having to adapt them"},{"startTime":3137.64,"endTime":3142.32,"body":"to a new place,"},{"startTime":3137.64,"endTime":3142.32,"body":"to a cultural blend, to a modern context."},{"startTime":3142.72,"endTime":3147.56,"body":"And so I feel like even with revival,"},{"startTime":3142.72,"endTime":3147.56,"body":"with indigenous people on our own lands,"},{"startTime":3147.96,"endTime":3151.44,"body":"we still have to maintain"},{"startTime":3147.96,"endTime":3151.44,"body":"a lot of humility and say,"},{"startTime":3151.44,"endTime":3153.12,"body":"well, we're not doing this the same way."},{"startTime":3153.12,"endTime":3156.6,"body":"We can't do ceremony for ten days because"},{"startTime":3153.12,"endTime":3156.6,"body":"we don't have ten days to do it anymore."},{"startTime":3156.6,"endTime":3158.24,"body":"We've got to somehow condense it to one,"},{"startTime":3158.24,"endTime":3160.24,"body":"even if we know what it's supposed to be"},{"startTime":3158.24,"endTime":3160.24,"body":"still."},{"startTime":3160.24,"endTime":3162.88,"body":"Right. So,"},{"startTime":3162.88,"endTime":3163.2,"body":"yeah."},{"startTime":3163.2,"endTime":3165.0,"body":"So really valuing that humility."},{"startTime":3165.0,"endTime":3168.0,"body":"But that isn't the same"},{"startTime":3165.0,"endTime":3168.0,"body":"as low self-worth, right?"},{"startTime":3168.36,"endTime":3172.52,"body":"So recognizing"},{"startTime":3168.36,"endTime":3172.52,"body":"if we're sitting in low self-worth"},{"startTime":3172.52,"endTime":3175.52,"body":"that that isn't very healthy either."},{"startTime":3176.2,"endTime":3179.04,"body":"And, and sitting with that"},{"startTime":3176.2,"endTime":3179.04,"body":"and trying to unpack, like,"},{"startTime":3179.04,"endTime":3180.96,"body":"where are we punishing ourselves?"},{"startTime":3180.96,"endTime":3182.52,"body":"Where are we putting ourselves down?"},{"startTime":3182.52,"endTime":3186.84,"body":"And that's a really valuable process,"},{"startTime":3182.52,"endTime":3186.84,"body":"because that isn't the same as sitting"},{"startTime":3186.84,"endTime":3192.36,"body":"in that space of allowing yourself"},{"startTime":3186.84,"endTime":3192.36,"body":"to not know or not be sure."},{"startTime":3193.72,"endTime":3197.16,"body":"Yeah, humility is a big one, isn't it?"},{"startTime":3197.16,"endTime":3201.24,"body":"Because sometimes it really can be that"},{"startTime":3197.16,"endTime":3201.24,"body":"fine line between"},{"startTime":3201.92,"endTime":3205.56,"body":"doubting yourself too much"},{"startTime":3201.92,"endTime":3205.56,"body":"and showing up with too much doubt."},{"startTime":3205.56,"endTime":3208.56,"body":"But then, on the other hand, you can"},{"startTime":3208.68,"endTime":3212.28,"body":"you can walk around"},{"startTime":3208.68,"endTime":3212.28,"body":"with a mask on with this like,"},{"startTime":3212.76,"endTime":3215.56,"body":"no, I've got this, but really you don't."},{"startTime":3215.56,"endTime":3217.2,"body":"I'm so insecure."},{"startTime":3217.2,"endTime":3219.64,"body":"Yeah, I'm so insecure. Yeah, yeah."},{"startTime":3219.64,"endTime":3220.52,"body":"And yeah."},{"startTime":3220.52,"endTime":3223.6,"body":"The amount of times"},{"startTime":3220.52,"endTime":3223.6,"body":"I've fallen flat on my face too."},{"startTime":3223.6,"endTime":3225.84,"body":"And it's just it's the human condition."},{"startTime":3225.84,"endTime":3229.32,"body":"We're always continuously learning"},{"startTime":3225.84,"endTime":3229.32,"body":"and I think, you know,"},{"startTime":3229.44,"endTime":3232.52,"body":"I think if we continue to have humility"},{"startTime":3229.44,"endTime":3232.52,"body":"and we keep this open"},{"startTime":3232.52,"endTime":3236.4,"body":"mind,"},{"startTime":3232.52,"endTime":3236.4,"body":"the more we can actually step in and,"},{"startTime":3236.4,"endTime":3239.4,"body":"and come from a place of like,"},{"startTime":3236.4,"endTime":3239.4,"body":"oh, I'm just"},{"startTime":3240.12,"endTime":3242.68,"body":"a human here"},{"startTime":3242.68,"endTime":3245.2,"body":"learning, you know,"},{"startTime":3242.68,"endTime":3245.2,"body":"learning about the world around me,"},{"startTime":3245.2,"endTime":3249.6,"body":"learning about myself and how to show up"},{"startTime":3245.2,"endTime":3249.6,"body":"better and how to do the the best I can"},{"startTime":3250.24,"endTime":3253.08,"body":"with the tools"},{"startTime":3250.24,"endTime":3253.08,"body":"and the resources that I have"},{"startTime":3253.08,"endTime":3256.52,"body":"and really go from there. But"},{"startTime":3257.56,"endTime":3261.76,"body":"before we wrap up, I would love to hear."},{"startTime":3262.56,"endTime":3265.84,"body":"So this whole series is, future studying."},{"startTime":3265.84,"endTime":3269.68,"body":"Obviously, but, this sub series"},{"startTime":3265.84,"endTime":3269.68,"body":"is all about stories from the heart."},{"startTime":3269.68,"endTime":3273.96,"body":"And I feel like, you know,"},{"startTime":3269.68,"endTime":3273.96,"body":"connecting to our ancestors and doing this"},{"startTime":3273.96,"endTime":3278.24,"body":"deeper work is really connecting"},{"startTime":3273.96,"endTime":3278.24,"body":"back to our heart as well,"},{"startTime":3278.24,"endTime":3279.72,"body":"and coming from the place, from my heart."},{"startTime":3279.72,"endTime":3282.8,"body":"And I would love for you to tell."},{"startTime":3282.8,"endTime":3287.88,"body":"Tell us what you believe being heart"},{"startTime":3282.8,"endTime":3287.88,"body":"lead means and coming back to the heart"},{"startTime":3287.88,"endTime":3292.04,"body":"and how how we can lean in"},{"startTime":3287.88,"endTime":3292.04,"body":"as individuals towards"},{"startTime":3292.04,"endTime":3295.04,"body":"that and as a community towards that."},{"startTime":3297.24,"endTime":3298.32,"body":"That's a big question."},{"startTime":3298.32,"endTime":3301.32,"body":"It's a beautiful one."},{"startTime":3301.48,"endTime":3304.96,"body":"For me, growing up in a lot of,"},{"startTime":3306.0,"endTime":3309.0,"body":"Christian evangelical culture around me,"},{"startTime":3309.16,"endTime":3312.16,"body":"I felt a lot of people in the heart"},{"startTime":3312.48,"endTime":3315.68,"body":"that were grounded"},{"startTime":3312.48,"endTime":3315.68,"body":"in different values to mine."},{"startTime":3316.56,"endTime":3317.64,"body":"And I also would say"},{"startTime":3317.64,"endTime":3320.92,"body":"I felt a lot of people in the"},{"startTime":3317.64,"endTime":3320.92,"body":"what I would call the back"},{"startTime":3320.92,"endTime":3323.92,"body":"of the heart and not necessarily"},{"startTime":3320.92,"endTime":3323.92,"body":"the front of the heart."},{"startTime":3323.92,"endTime":3326.64,"body":"And I feel like that that can be tricky."},{"startTime":3326.64,"endTime":3328.76,"body":"So I think that's my contribution is"},{"startTime":3330.6,"endTime":3331.32,"body":"coming from the"},{"startTime":3331.32,"endTime":3334.32,"body":"heart and querying yourself like you can,"},{"startTime":3335.44,"endTime":3338.88,"body":"can you physically feel"},{"startTime":3335.44,"endTime":3338.88,"body":"where is it coming from?"},{"startTime":3339.76,"endTime":3344.04,"body":"Is it coming from sort of the back"},{"startTime":3339.76,"endTime":3344.04,"body":"of the heart, which is a bit shadowy"},{"startTime":3344.04,"endTime":3349.32,"body":"and maybe needs to be unpacked more"},{"startTime":3344.04,"endTime":3349.32,"body":"so it's more of a front heart shine?"},{"startTime":3349.32,"endTime":3353.44,"body":"Is it coming from the heart"},{"startTime":3349.32,"endTime":3353.44,"body":"connected to a belief"},{"startTime":3353.44,"endTime":3356.88,"body":"that disconnects you from somebody else"},{"startTime":3356.88,"endTime":3359.88,"body":"or from the earth or,"},{"startTime":3361.36,"endTime":3364.32,"body":"what is that coming from the heart"},{"startTime":3364.32,"endTime":3368.84,"body":"grounded in for me, coming from"},{"startTime":3364.32,"endTime":3368.84,"body":"the heart is really, really important."},{"startTime":3369.08,"endTime":3372.24,"body":"And, it has to be grounded in the earth."},{"startTime":3372.36,"endTime":3375.36,"body":"So that's how I look at it."},{"startTime":3375.84,"endTime":3377.32,"body":"That's beautiful."},{"startTime":3377.32,"endTime":3379.32,"body":"I think it's a beautiful way"},{"startTime":3377.32,"endTime":3379.32,"body":"to end it, too."},{"startTime":3379.32,"endTime":3382.32,"body":"Thank you, thank you, thank you so much."},{"startTime":3382.44,"endTime":3384.8,"body":"I'm just going to press"},{"startTime":3382.44,"endTime":3384.8,"body":"stop, but we can, continue."}]}