Probate Mastermind Podcast

Million-Dollar Producer Shares Updates on Year 2 Listing and Wholesaling Probate Real Estate

August 26, 2020 Chad Corbett and David Pannell Season 3 Episode 1
Probate Mastermind Podcast
Million-Dollar Producer Shares Updates on Year 2 Listing and Wholesaling Probate Real Estate
Show Notes Transcript Chapter Markers

 “There isn’t anybody we can’t help, that we can’t monetize.”

David Pannell is one of the top-performing Probate Investors/Probate Agents in the country.  Combining the Probate Mastery approach with the dedicated prospecting strategies he developed in a decades worth of converting FSBOs and Expireds, David consistently converts probate leads at high rates and leaves lasting impressions on the people he helps.  His skill set has him out-competing iBuyers, Agents, Investors, and Wholesalers in his market with ease.  Listen now or navigate using the timestamps below:

Note: To watch this interview as a video and see the marketing pieces David shares, jump over to YouTube or the official episode webpage  

  • 0:00 Introductions: See More: David’s 2019 Interview On Year 1 in Probate
  • 1:47 The #1 Thing I Learned About Using an ISA for Investment Deals
  • 3:10 This is Our Best Lead Source: 47 Transactions, Two Producers, 4000 Leads.
  • 3:35 How David Leverages his Probate Book as A Story-telling Piece.
  • 4:44 The Best Way to Hire an ISA for Probate: See More Role Play Playlist David used to design his training.
  • 6:17 EVERY Probate Lead Can Make You Money.
  • 7:15 David and Chad discuss his live follow-up call with Betty:
  • 9:29 Consumer Psychology: How David designed His Key Marketing Piece.
  • 10:48 The Marketing Sequence of A Top Producer in Probate: David shares his marketing pieces and schedule.
  • 12:26 Segmenting Lists: Social Variables vs. Property Variables. See more: Probate Plus+ Property Fields
  • 14:28 Navigating Listings, Investment, and Wholesale deals . See More: The complete probate leads system
  • 16:00 The 80-20 Rule: How to Leverage Time, Generate Revenue, Reinvest, and Scale.
  • 20:50 Work-Life Balance and How To Retire Early Through Probate Real 
  • 27:47 Building a Real Cash Buyers List and Segmenting It. 
  • 38:41 Building Your List of Attorneys
  • 39:39 Becoming THE Probate Expert In Your Market

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Chad Corbett :

Welcome, everybody to this case study update today we've got with us David pinel, out of Fort Worth, Texas. Welcome, David. Welcome. Thank you. So you guys probably know his name by now you've seen last July 1, I believe it was we did his first case study. David was that his I don't remember 12 month mark, I think we're at 12 months. And he had at that time he had, you know, started out slow when it wasn't really using the system design. He started doing that in I think February of last year, you really became deliberate about it and systematic and by July he had 27. And in the 27 closing so far, and you finished up with was

Unknown Speaker :

47 for the year, David 47. And we're here today I actually have not heard the update. I wanted to I wanted to reserve that for for this. So there are a lot of questions I have for you kind of how the year has gone. As you know, it's unfortunate, I get to know so many great people, I don't always get to keep in touch as much as I would like. So David, we haven't talked a whole lot in the last year just a handful of time. So I'm curious to see what you've learned what advice you would would change that you might have given last year. You know, what, what advice you'd give anyone who's starting at this, who's struggling with this, all those things. So let's jump back in. And you had a baby this year. So we had we had COVID we had your firstborn. It's been an interesting year for you. So tell us Let's start with last July like how did the year finish up and what what what changes that you make in your business? What lessons did you learn positive or negative? Well, we went through

David Pannell :

The biggest thing is that we we thought we could have other people making phone calls for us. And I mean it does work I say the work I work with, we hired probably went through about 14 to 16 different people. And since this lead sources so long typically, the appointment is not an exact, you call them like an expired you go on the appointment or for sale by owner where you can get it for only three or four weeks. So it's really hard to hire this out without paying a salary in advance per month. But we found that people that don't understand the investment role of buying an actual home, I can walk into a house immediately tell people that I'm going to buy it for this price because of this situation. It's so hard to hire it out. So we did after I spoke with you in July. We we did really well up until probably the end of September. We ended up just letting everybody end up going because nobody was producing anything other than what me and Liz was doing personal time or personal business. But we ended up with a year of 47 transactions, which was amazing in itself. We bought from you guys 4100 leads somewhere close to that. So I don't know what I was gonna do the math on that, but it's To me, it's really good. It's our best resource for the amount of money that we have to spend for it. We did find out that I'm just better making the phone call. We reduce it down to two days a week that I make the probate calls. We still send the letters. But the biggest thing is I wrote a probate book that's 20 pages that really just dominates their mind when they receive it. It's all about testimonials and reviews and things that we've done in probate in the in the area. Now, it's really it's geared around a storytelling. So it's something that is Don't expect them to read it. I really don't expect them to read stuff on the front cover in the back cover. But it sets that impression when I do call or when I do some letter to them. Like the recording I sent you last night that you probably post next week is that they just know who I am when I'm calling now. And I have that trust. So if it takes me six to seven, eight months, I mean, I'm about to hear from a probate court date and probate lead we got 18 months ago, they finally go into court after 43 years. had to sign off on it. And hopefully in six days is probably going to be one of my biggest ones. I hope it goes through. But you know, just just back to that stuff. It's it's really hard to hire this out. That's what I found out. It's hard to hire someone that knows the real estate knows how to close a listing knows how to do a wholesale and it just takes too long really got to train that into somebody That needs a paycheck. So if you're out there and you're got you're going to get into probate, just make sure that they're focusing on another lead source, and probably put them on one or two days a week to farm the probate leads, and to get on your classes, and we even subscribe transcribed 35 a year roleplay calls, just so we have a book of training. And I narrowed it down to keywords in there. Because there's a lot of repeated stuff on the calls, but I've reduced it down to I think, 40 pages that somebody can read, and they have a really good idea of how to talk to somebody. If we do hire again. And you were so you had a team of four I'd say that right. She was at the high school. We had eight people make phone calls at the time. Well, what I what I learned is that it's a forming type personality. It's not someone like me, that's aggressive. It does work for me because I know how to switch it. Right. But most personalities, you got somebody that's

Unknown Speaker :

Hi driver are very consistent. And probate you need someone that's in like a farmer role where they're, they can drive the conversation but not completely, but then they're consistent. I'm calling people that don't want to talk to them for months at a time, if that makes any sense. So I want to recap just kind of your your business model for anyone who might not have might not remember or might not have seen your original case study. But David is really a great example of the potential of this because he really gets that there. David, is there anyone that if they're in probate and they call you Is there anyone you've ever spoken to that you can't help and you can't monetize that? No, I could write every contact that calls right so that's an i would i challenge each and everyone that's watching this if you're in a position where if if there's any scenario where a personal representative reaches out to you, if you can't help them and you can't make money on it directly or indirectly, you're allowed to earn referrals. That's money. And even if it comes a year from now, I still count that. But if you've ever found yourself in a loss of words on a lack of service, like I don't, I don't know what I can do to help this person. I challenge you to up your skill set because David's a great example of someone who has figured out and it's why it's hard for his ishs to keep up with him because he's using you know, he's using all of his brain he's thinking outside of the box to come up with solutions. He's doing investor deals, he's on brokerage deals, he does creative financing deals, but he the number one thing that I want everyone to take away and and we'll link to that voicemail or that that recorded call that David mentioned, you know, is this you you actually are showing that you care about the people and you're putting their best interests first. And with that call with Betty the thing a few things like the first thing that was really popped out to me is she doesn't know who you were. You've been chasing her for months and you never never actually talked to her. You didn't bother going through your USP and saying here's who I am. Here's what I do because you put that marketing piece out in front of you and I want to come back to that but she had obviously read your marketing piece and knew who you are and knew what you're capable of and you you recognize that and didn't waste time you just jumped right in the conversation. And then you you try it You took you you made it clear that you would prefer to buy the house. But then when you when you kind of felt her flinch, and she pulled back a little bit you you took the broker route. So what David's talking about, it's hard to get the Isay to realize that point where you and it's it's really, man, it's almost done by feel it's like intuitive, right? Like you feel Betty was starting to pull back and like Well, I don't know if you know, it's really I think we want to get the most amount of money. And that's where you switched and you chose a different path for the conversation. And that's what's incredibly hard to teach. And I say so for anyone who's listening like if you don't be so discouraged that you'll never try and I say just understand David planet like this level, because he truly has taken this to heart. And he has options for no matter what the situation he can help and he can make money. And when you're running at this level, you can retire from this one strategy. It's incredibly profitable and incredibly fun a little bit. And it's actually pretty easy once once you get the first one or two done this way. Like it becomes fun. It's almost like a it's like the Lego set of real estate, right? You become the transaction engineer, and the solution engineer. But so anyways, I'm curious on the marketing piece, and we can David, you shared a video on our Facebook group. David has a really actually yeah. So this isn't some piece. I'm like, it's really about storytelling. It's nothing special. I don't expect them to read now expect them to open it because I know they're not going to but it's every other page. First, it's the USP and who I am when you initially open it, but I got it. I got it folded into it. Then it opens up in the middle of the book when someone opens it. So it goes right to a story of somebody we helped. That was in probate that was actually facing foreclosure, that we made him an extra $77,000 on the sell of his property. Just because I mean, we we actually door knock this one I think. And he was about to sell it to an investor in the neighborhood, or 77,000. below what we just put on the market for we had at his open house with 42 people. So we did take the listing on this one. But that's just the power of it. It's like, Okay, I know he doesn't want to sell cheap because that's his equity. I don't want to take his money from him. But there's some people that just don't want to deal with the process. And I hate to say it, but we will buy the house. We will and I prefer to buy the house so I could run it in the show. Like I prefer to clean up the property and remodel or do whatever I need to do to it. But the situation in the book, I have all those scenarios. in there so just let's talk about your marketing sequence now so last year last July when we did this you were hitting the phones one call a day for the first seven days then falling back to Weekly follow up and then monthly follow up. And at the same time you were sending a series of I believe six letters right? Or you were doing at least six months. Right? So how is that evolved? I mean, obviously you you've it seems like you're you're making the calls yourself. So you're making less calls but with a higher level of skill set. When does the that booklet what's the cost to get that out? And when does it come into play in your sequence? are you leading with that with 100% of them or At what point do you drop that premium? mailpiece? No, because this is a premium milky SAP this asked me this book and all the other some of these three mailpieces go out. I am I in the probate book are coming soon process if they want to lose But it just filled with examples of what we do to market someone's property. And then 151 steps that we take care of for somebody that isn't the book that is out there in the internet. You could copy it from anybody. But you know, to have it coming same process to have a probate book that goes to their mindset what they need to do. And it comes into play, once we find out that they have a house to sell and they are going to sell it. Okay, so let's so your day one, let's say now where you're at today, when you get your list what happens as far as your marketing sequence? Good. Day one, I divide the leads into three categories. I have found in through your training, in through listening to all the roleplay stuff is the spouse's kill my mindset. Yeah, I mean, they literally do I I will not call someone with the same address. So if I see the same address and they have a house, I'm putting those people in a home valuation. 90 day follow up. So they're going to get a CMA or a link for my estimate my home. That's not it but estimator home, calm, whatever. It's a CMA valuation website in and it's text to them from a number outside of my company. And when they fill it out, I know they usually put 3679 months or two years they're going to sell so I don't even have to deal with them. The next division is the kids or the relatives, the aunt uncle someone in town that is dealing as the executor or administrator. They're the next hardest ones to deal with because they have lost somebody close to them and they really don't want to deal with it. So they're in their quick their probate. quicksand the most, right, but thousands are really in quicksand. The ones that I've found, and this is going to be probably the golden ticket of this call is if you find people that are out of state And are out of the area two and a half hours out three hours out. I call the Austin bubble because they have to drive more than three hours to get to four. They don't really want to deal with it, and it's gonna take them a longer time to get through it. So, as you said yesterday, that the longer they're dealing with this probate, the more frustrated they are getting with the process. The more frustrated they get with the process, the less they want to list the property. In the end, I would love to list their house or put it on the market and help them get the most amount of money. But typically, they just want to get rid of it. And that's when you come in and buy it as a wholesale or, or you can sell it as a wholesale to an investor or buy it as a flip or in a rental property. So I want to pause right here I want to put put a pen and so something that's really notable about your methodology. Now it's different. So a lot of folks sort by, you know, if you're a probate pilot subscriber now you know which ones are real estate how much the real estate's worth how much debt is on it, if there is any, if it's on MLS, if it's if it's already transferred, but even if you don't have probate plus, a lot of people are sorting by, you know, in town or out of town. You're actually you're sorting not on any, any other any real estate variable, you're focusing on the people variables. You've got three groups of different kind of social mindsets. You've got people, highly emotional spouses, mostly emotional children, like immediate family members, right? And then hardly emotional, you know, public, public administrators or distant relatives that live live, or someone that just assigned Yeah, so so one of the things if you guys want to try to do it this way, you can use the shortcode function in our CRM, you can go in and when you see matching addresses, you could do shortcode spouse Save, and you can actually customize the all the lead CRM so it will actually kind of code For you, and you can rate them spouse, immediate family, unrelated. Like, you could have those three categories. And you could use the shortcodes. And then sort by add shortcode to your column view by going to customize columns shortcode. And then that adds it in your ListView. So you just simply click ascending or descending, and it'll sort by your three categories. Anyways, for anyone who wants to try this, I wanted to let you know there is a simple way for you to do what David is doing now. David, you're still using Sierra interactive. You're so David has a custom CRM that you want to tell them how much you've spent on development. 20,000 Yeah. So you're doing the probate right? And you're making 11 to $22,000 a contact, you can invest in your business and I would definitely tell you to do it. If on one point you just mentioned if you're struggling with probate and you're not getting the contacts, and you're getting a list of say 300 contacts from you guys narrowed down so your letters are more impactful. So it's it goes back to the 8020 rule. If you're, if you if you just want, I hate to say this, but if you're just getting started, you don't have the cash, focus on those out of town or people on that list, narrow it down and then send those letters that you've liked to them, it doesn't matter what letter you sent them, they're not going to read it, they're getting 20 others. It's the consistency, the free thinking something in the mail with your picture name on it, and then calling them that's gonna get you the most. Get that go ahead. So we'll jump back to where you were. So you've got your three categories. Now you've got you've got highly emotional, somewhat emotional and probably non emotional based on who they are their relationship to the deceased. Now what then we're making the phone calls to the people that we're just going so we're going to put the spouses in the CRM. If we have an email address or a phone number, they're going to be assigned but instead I need email and a phone number and an address to put them as a lead. So I'm going to put them in spouse's go into a separate system. So I could text them, so they could fill out that evaluation tool. Or I could retarget them on Facebook to get their information for the, for the kids or relatives for the most amount, or for the kids or relatives. I'm still going to do the same thing, but I'm calling them to see a timeline to see if they have a house to sell. So they are on the call list. And then the towners are definitely so that's I'm narrowing the list down I'm going to call those people from the phone call and the information I gathered, say out of 100 people I talked to 20, which is real realistic. Then I'll come out with nine people that actually probably going to get my packet for the day and July, June 28. I sent out 34 packets in one day. So that tells you how many people I talked to you Have, I had 1600 contacts to go through that I had not talked to. So it's just so it's narrowed the list down so I could afford it. Or anybody could afford it. You're going to make the calls, see if they have a house to sell, see if they have a coordinate. They're not going to have a court date when you first get the list. But your older leads will, they'll have some idea when they're going to court. And then you have you find out the coordinate the house, they have a house they're willing to sell, then you send them something so overwhelming that they never forget your name. Yep. Now, you may have said this, and I might have missed it. Do you have $1 amount like what does it cost to produce and mail that piece? Each book is like 325 apiece, and then mailing is them. Another three bucks is $12 per contact. Okay, so if I go to the post office with 34 of them, obviously I'm gonna spend 150 bucks to mail it out. Same with you guys is the same numbers with you guys. If you're going to know the whole list you're spending I think you said that toll dollar number sometime in the past just remember where if letters is 12 bucks or something, if you're sending you know 12 months worth of letters at $1 50 apiece I mean you're that's that's you know, yeah adds up so you basically you're investing $12 on on the one the conversation when you have dialogue in there Israel estate, that's where it bucks. Yeah. And then from there you do you customize your follow up with based on the conversation you had or do you or do they go into a standard follow up sequence now they are usually put on a depending on the conversation in the court date, they're usually put on at the most 2021 day follow up. So three weeks. Okay. And then I just like you, do you when you did probate? You went on appointments Friday and Mondays, right? So I try to do that too. Now. But I call my probate people on Wednesdays and Thursdays because it gives me time to get that phone call by Friday to set the appointment still. But still, I don't want to work weekends anymore. I really don't want to work Fridays. So with probate, it's allowed so much flexibility. It's amazing and I've gotten I hate to say it halfway retired. I do want to spend time with my son now he's five months old. And, and from what I was gonna say last September, you know, like I said, on the when we first got on the call is that I did all these deals, we made lots of money. I end up buying three houses, and we remodel all of them. And it took me all the way till March. And I really didn't make any more phone calls, which I'm sad to say I closed deals but then COVID hit and then a baby came. So I'm just now getting back to work a little bit and we've done 11 I think probate so far this year, so I mean, it's not hitting out of the ballpark. But now I know how to now know how to leverage that when I go on appointments and it's amazing that I'm not waking up every morning wondering what expireds I got to call for sale by owners got a call. So I'm gonna say you need to show yourself some grace like, have you ever watched a guy watch a tight walk a tightrope? Like at the circus like that spent a lifetime doing it? Have you ever seen him just stop and balance like, it's not true? It's a fallacy. And like, You're, you're like me, it's easy for you to be hard on yourself when you took time off or you had other things happening in life. Like you step right back into it because you've got a proven system and you get you get a consistent result by using the system that you have in place. And being halfway retired is sure as hell nothing to be ashamed about. That's called living a good life, right? So I would caution you to not feel ashamed of having the ability to take off and just just don't, don't stress out, go enjoy your baby. Go enjoy. Your life. I've never had the flexibility with any lead source or any real estate business. I'm telling you probate was the only thing that gave me that to like fizbo expired like everything else was a bunch of damn tail chasing and probate like if just if you guys didn't see if you've never heard me talk about this what David was referencing. At one point I said, What if I, if I set boundaries on my time, and I never work weekends, I only go out of the office on Fridays and Mondays. That gives me three administrative days and three prospecting days. So from 8am to 8am to 10pm 10am and 4pm to 6pm. Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, those were sacred sacred prospecting blocks. Nothing happened but outbound phone calls. Everything in between on those days were admin it was transaction making sure the transaction coordinators were doing their job talking with title companies putting out the inevitable fires and babysitting buyer's agents for the most part, like the ones that got overly emotional because the closing Didn't happen on the exact minute they thought it would. And those were the days I did the work that I didn't really enjoy, but it was necessary for the real estate company to go ahead to operate. Fridays and Mondays are my day man. Because all the work on Wednesday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday was to set up like back to back to back appointments on Fridays or Mondays and a lot of times I would just block out Friday and grab them all the Monday and I could do three or four listings on a Monday morning through afternoon. And by Thursday night they were all in queued upload. They hit the market on Thursday night or on the hot seat the next weekend. We had them sold the next week. In a market where there was no urgency. There was no multiple offers. We were pricing consistently 10 to 15% under market calling for offer on Thursday night we would list call for offers the following Friday, not the next day Eight days later. And we would not review anything we turn we it was all disclosed in the private remarks. We would present offers to the seller would review offers the following Friday at 5pm. Eastern, and it was so consistent that, like I had, you know, you know how much unpredictability there is in your real estate schedule. If you've been in brokerage business for very long, you know what the roller coasters like, right? It's it's like, one day you're sitting there twiddling your thumbs and now your hair's on fire and like everything's just you know, chaos around you. It kind of like even though that out in my business, so people respected my time more when I said, Well, you know, David, I've got some I meet with families on Mondays or Fridays, which works best for you. Okay, about three or one. And it helped me set the appointments so much easier. But what was really the interesting, the thing I didn't expect from that is those people had they saw me as an authority. They saw me as someone like they, they really, really respected my time and my level of professionalism. And just like I think we talked we I know we talked about this last time, I didn't show up and shorts and a T shirt. shirt and flip flops, even though that's what I wear pretty much all day every day. It they, they're in a situation where, you know, they're emotional and I'm being judged against other people in the level of professionalism. So, on Friday and Monday I wore, you know, an $800 sport coat and a pair of nice shoes and a nice crisp dress shirt. Because they deserve that right? Even though I like to be an entrepreneur, I like to sit here and Under Armour most of the time I gave them that respect. But once I did those things like it just became it was clockwork I mean, Mary Lou Tyler, the author of Predictable Revenue, she she was watching me and she's like, can you start giving me your KPIs? And like she used my probate strategy as part of a keynote like for her a case study for her keynote speeches for Predictable Revenue. Because just like you when once you get it right, and you get it out in it, you can literally flip the switch on and off on it if you'd like, but it's better to have it. If you can delegate your way out of it. Yeah. Where you have good agents, but that's comes with a challenge to it's hard to find a listing agent that will do the job you'll do, especially if that also includes acquisition manager, it's incredibly hard to find that person who will stick around for more than six months because once they learn your system, they'll become your competition. So you just have to be real careful who you who you bring in and teach the trade secrets to. Okay, so looking on that front, I got a guy named Chad lako, my team and he, he's done for the probate this year. And it's just a blessing to have him answer the phone and take some of that weight off of me a little bit of knowing that now you can walk into a house and get the price that we need if we're going to buy or be honest with the people about the listing price. So yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. So you get your leads that come in you segment them kind of based on the the mindset, which is a really interesting twist as an interesting innovation. So you segment based on mindset, you hit the phones with the easiest First and work your way to the hardest ones. The ones who you have dialogue with that do have real estate and an intent to sell that real estate, they get a premium, the premium mailpiece then they get set up on a follow up no more than every 21 days they hear from you. And you keep in touch with them until they close. Now, when we talked last year, 65% of your deal flow was on an acquisition, like you were buying the house and 45% were listing as that held up, are you buying more or buying less? Like what's your ratio now? Yeah, I'm really trying to get away from I do like to list property and I like being a broker. But it's really gotten to almost 9010 at this point that most of the people that we're getting to touch with, they just want to sell a property and and that that gives me over the last eight months I've really took in my job. I went on the Facebook groups and got a bunch of real estate investors. But now I'm down to 16 people that will actually buy a house from me. site on you know, I've narrowed down to like you had people that like like long term rentals or, or I've gotten category for land or whatever leaked out that they prefer to buy in. And most times, they're not even looking at the houses anymore. Because I take a video and I take good photos, and I sell before they even get there. So we'll know when I send a house out, they better be sending me a contract, or a commitment within five minutes. And it better be way above my list price that I tell them. So even if you're in brokerage, but especially if you're a wholesaler, listen to what he's saying. This is something I talked about on usually in mastery, but you really, you know, you don't just need a buyer's list. And I'll say a buyer's list as somebody you've had dialogue dialogue with that would remember your name. If you say you have a buyer's list and they don't know your name, you're lying to yourself and everyone else, and you buy some list online and I don't give a damn who's selling it if you're buying a list of cash buyers in your market. Get that is hardly worth the paper it's printed on, asked me how I know. Because that's how I tried it. I believe that that had value. I have zero relationships with anyone off of those lists. Well, you risk real quick, you risk those people going behind your back, and not being loyal to you if you have too big of a list. Yep, they're your competition no matter what. So you got to be real careful on that. But what David has done and what we're what he's talking about is building a real relationship with a buyer. And this is something you know, and mastery, I kind of get on my soapbox and rant about this, but you really need to understand like a cash buyer is what you need to get way more specific than that. So yeah, great. They're a cash buyer. Are they a landlord a fix and flip a portfolio buyer? Like what is their standard? How do they underwrite what is what is their minimum standard for a deal? And what you'll find is, it's all over the place. Some guys are like, well, I don't know hundred dollars a door sounds good to me. Money is money. And others are like Listen, man, if it's not an 8.35 cap, or have a one point three three debt coverage ratio and 80 80% LTV, I can't do it because I got to put it under a blanket blanket commercial lien with my community bank. And like that's a whole mouthful, but that's real criteria that I have like some of my buyers use community bank financing. I go to the community bank, I understand the loan program that they're using the restrictions the lender places on them, so then I know which deals I can send to that guy. And that's why I could sell a portfolio of 50 or 60 houses with one text message or two at most. And so as you're building your cash buyer list, get to know this person, are they doing creative financing, are they doing long term buy and hold? Are they doing fix and flip? Are they private money lenders? Are they portfolio buyers? Are they commercial buyers land buyers, Timberland buyers, equestrian land buyers like there's there's all these segments and the better you understand the better you can you can curate the houses you send out. So for example, a lot of my pro almost all of my probate Went to landlords off market. And we would typically put those out. You know, they'll sell for 80 cents on the dollar. So you put that out at 80 cents on the dollar to a landlord. He's all over. Boom. It's a 1415 cap all day long because all it needs is cosmetic rehab, it doesn't need much. Usually, the H fac is good, the electricals good, the roof and windows are good. It just literally needs paint carpet kitchens and bathrooms. And in two weeks, I've got it rented at a premium premium workforce housing, right? So they'll pay me 80 cents on the dollar for that if I send that to a wholesaler to someone a wholesale buyer a fix and flip or you know, someone like looking for a deep discount, then what happens to my credibility when a deal to them is 60 cents on the dollar. And Chad always sends them these houses at 80 cents on the dollar. That's crazy. I mean, that's like hiring a real estate agent to say hey, we want to look at houses in the 250 to $300,000 range. And then they bring you stuff in the fives and sixes you're like well, what the hell am I gonna do with this? My strategy, right? So as you're building your cash buyer list, make sure they're real relationships. You do this at the courthouse steps. You do this at absolute auctions. You do this with real estate investors Association. You do this in Facebook groups, just like David said, Like there's tons of places to meet them. You can meet them through the the commercial loan officers at community banks are one of the most overlooked opportunities in the real estate investment space. overlooked because they can introduce you to other investors who have a sound finance strategy and understand it as a business overlooked because they can help you understand the finance products available, create a real relationship, and capitalize yourself. So if you don't know Community Bank officers or loan officers and your market, go to every bank that under $3 billion and get to know the commercial loan officer at that bank, they can connect you with so many people. And these aren't tire kickers. They're not time wasters. They didn't learn this this on YouTube. They're running at a level where they can buy a house like that and walk away from the closing table with more money than you do. And I've done that time after time. I remember the first time I'll leave it with john. But I sold john a house I bought a house subject to first second third house I bought here in Roanoke. I bought it subject to thinking I was going to keep it. Then I decided that I would rather have the cash to reinvest in the business because I was doing more rent to own stuff. So I bought this subject to ended up wholesaling it I made a $16,000 wholesale fee for holding a piece of paper for a day. JOHN walked away with the house on a $38,000 check from the closing table. Well, being in residential real estate, I'm like, But wait, how's that possible? It was because he was working with a community bank on a commercial loan program. And I made a $16,000 wholesale fee which was great for a day's work. JOHN got a house and the money to rehab it and then some ended up with you know, an ARV of probably 110 and so, but this those get the he that's that's when I followed the money I went from john to the loan officer who wrote him that loan, I got to know that person they introduced me to others. So it's a really good way to build quality buyer relationships where you can dump you can offload houses and literally in minutes without showing the other thing I want to I want to want to point out that David's doing I've actually been reported to the state for practicing with with practicing broker and without a license. I choose not to be a broker. I like to have a salespersons license I like it so much, I've had four of them. But I don't want to be a broker I don't want the liability the expense you know that just the added headache. It's it doesn't serve me. So I have an investment brand and I have a brokerage brand. And I've been reported three different times I've had to talk to the state investigators never went more than two or three minutes because I wasn't actually doing anything wrong. But because I had professionally printed signs with my LLC like the you know, the there's a disclaimer on my side that says managing member of resolutions LLC is a licensed real estate agent. No agency relationship exists on this property, yada yada. I got put a disclaimer on my son because I know tattletale they're out there right? But I have these professional real estate signs that go in the yard I do professional photography, and like then I'll put it out to my list but she had a wholesale deal we'll go like that if you if you just because the powers off and a lot of these houses like if you just do long exposure photography like HDR where it looks nice, where everyone else is running around with their cell phones, taking pictures, trying to hustle hustle and deal over text message. Like it's unreal the amount like you don't get people beating you up on your price your by your investors. They pay what you ask and they don't even come see the house most of the time. And john was that guy like he did. He's like he knew if it was a Chad house, he didn't even have to drive across town. He's like I should I'll see it when I close and the bankers didn't come Look at it, john didn't look at it. I mean, I sold to one of my guys 58 houses. I didn't leave my desk the entire time I did I use DocuSign to get the listing, I sent out an email to about 15 people and of those 15 to engaged and made offers and other two one closed, we never went and saw a single house. We actually didn't even go to the closing we I didn't do any I didn't I know both of the guys but I didn't meet either one of them throughout the whole process and like for I think it was 30 days. But you can sell 58 houses in a single package cash deal, no contingency with a 30 day closed by not leaving your desk if you do this. So anyway, that was that was a long rabbit hole. But I think it's important that people understand. You're not just going to like watch YouTube a couple times and haphazardly go into this and get the same result David to getting. You need to be deliberate and professional about it. And like pay attention like David's a mentor. He's Hear sharing his time. That's why I'm pulling so much out of this and pointing out what I think is important for you guys to take away. Because if you go out and just say, well, I've got 50 cash buyers on my list and nobody will buy my deals. The question is why? Yeah, you can learn you can learn from people like David like how what it takes to sell a house with one text message in three minutes. And it's because of the way he's he's doing business. And that's what's so, so valuable about your I appreciate your willingness to share so much and be here and even do it again. Because you guys can learn so much from people like David and watching how he's running his business. And that really goes into building your list of attorneys to when I'm on the calls with you guys. It was like how do I build a list of all these attorneys in town? And really is the as you go through the process of helping these families, you're going to meet their attorney and I've got I think now six attorneys that I could communicate with and they'll pick up the phone when I call them, because we did a deal successfully with them. And now they're giving me referrals. So it's not about going out and getting 100 attorneys that don't know you send them 100 packets or letters, outs, attorneys, which in the beginning, if you want to find but it's the same with the same with that as the investor list, just I guess the less less is more quality relationships. Yeah, absolutely. So of the 11 you've done this year so far, how many of those came from attorney then any of those? Just Just one so far? Okay. So one, and then one came from online. So that's another lead source now that once you have enough videos or testimonials online, of helping other families, you can do your own SEO and or I had somebody in my CRM that inherited a property That we weren't even on the probate list are flagged. And they called me said, hey, I've been watching your stuff for a year. I think you could help me. They didn't talk to anybody else. That's awesome. Yeah, it's just, that's, you know, you got you got your list of your spouses, you got your relatives, you got your out of towners, but then you got online resources once you have probably nine to 10 deals close and you make them public. And you get your attorney network built up. This process is going to take 18 months to three years to build up like any source. But man once you're once you're rolling, it's it's very beneficial. And once your flag is in the sand, it's incredibly hard to unseat you. I mean, just like look at look at the top reo agent in your market. Go in and go in and try to take the Fannie Mae or the HUD account from that person, you're not going to do it. Like it's based on a solid real relationship and they will laugh your ass out the door. Now, it's not to say that you can't but you're gonna have to work your way up and you're gonna slowly gain market share. If you're gonna To take that guy off the top of the hill, probate is the same way. In the next 45 years you have 130 $6 trillion in wealth that will transfer from the 76 million baby boomers that are left won't be with us beyond most of them won't be with us beyond 2060. It's a dark statistic, but it's happening. Just like technology is changing the world. You know, the world we live in. This is changing real estate it's causing it's called the silver tsunami. It's it's threatening the business models of nursing homes, funeral facilities, elder cares is not sure what they're going to do about this. So you're we're at the forefront of one of the biggest opportunities you probably the biggest opportunity you will see in your real estate career. And if you do what David's done, and you build the foundation and put your flag in the sand now, by the time you retire, you'll have a sellable business. Around this one strategy, someone will buy this because they're not going to be able to unseat you They can't just take over your market share you create a blue ocean and that becomes an acquisition target so you have a real business to sell and a real retirement plan and if you're not doing that I hope you are David like build it as because you're becoming a brand like people in your sphere of influence are now I'm starting to say, hey, that guy can help me. I got this house I don't know what to do with it's a bigger You know, I've never done anything like this, he can help me. So make that brand a scalable on a sellable brand. And this will be like the best money bath time you ever spent in real estate. And what I love about it so much is it's the most rewarding thing I've ever done in real estate. Like you shared that one voicemail of a lady that said you literally she literally viewed you as an answer to her prayer. And that's happened me like dozens and dozens of times. I've heard that and if you're in the Bible Belt, you're gonna hear it more often. But now I have clients though, you know, and that's action plans. When I when I do send my packets out three Four or five weeks or six months down the road they get this random voicemail have they been Oh, helping this lady? And they just like, Oh, I got your voicemail That was amazing. So, you know, yeah. And it's so powerful. So anyways, I know you've got a closing to go to so I'm gonna I'm gonna wrap it up any any advice? last advice you'd like to share anything you want to get through to the group? Yeah, I think this call really has to leverage towards probate plus, because now you can narrow your leads down dramatically. I mean, you still got letters, you still got to send letters. If you're unwilling to make phone calls, which is the death of anybody you got to make phone calls these people even if they're no, even if they screw with your mindset in the beginning, you don't have to say I call it Betty was not perfect. But the flow was perfect. And the lead to the point was perfect. I had to think on my feet and in every probate person is different. So study the scripts, study the lines, study the key words But don't think you have to say verbatim on on these. And then one. One last thing is the target of people is the biggest wealth transfer people that are helping their parents sell their property. And they are typically 60 to 55 to 70 years old. So, get out of your own way about me, me, me, me, or talking to talking to them, like they're your friend, you got to talk to them. highly professional, you got to come across to them, like you're going to help them not help yourself. So it's a take some courses on the language patterns of these people that are older, because you're, it's gonna help you when you're on appointments. That's why I wear a tie. That's why I dress out. I clean my car before I get there. I do everything that they know that I'm a young professional, and that I'm there to help them. I'm not there because I took a weekend class and I let them know that If I shine my shoes for God's sakes, I show up as that professional as they would show up to an interview themselves. truly important and that just shows how empathetic you are. And that's really you know, a lot of people ask me what the secret all this is or like, the key to all this guys is empathy is like 99% of getting this right is really appreciating the position they're in appreciating their, their, their generational expectations of who a business person is, you know, it's a business person doesn't show up on a dented up pickup truck with paint on the side of it and a pair of car hearts on a stained white t shirt. Like a business person shows up in a wash car in a tie and also where you're at, like if you know David's in Texas like it's so pay attention to BMW either. You know, people need to know that. Don't drive up in your fancy Audi or BMW or your fancy Lamborghini to appointments. That's not going to help you with somebody that just lost a family member six months ago, I need to sell something. You know, that's the wrong impression as well. You're not trying to attract a luxury client. So I take the Safe Road, I show up in a Duramax. Like it can go either way. It can be luxury or work, right. Yeah, there you go. The ultimate utility vehicle. But yeah, I mean, the key is, yeah, it's really, really pay attention to what how David uses empathy. I mean, the way he speaks the way he dresses the way he designs, marketing pieces, the way he segments, the database, that's the common thread through everything he's doing. And that's the foundation I believe that's the foundation of your success is being empathetic and compassionate. And quite frankly, just giving a shit for real and caring about the outcome for others more before the outcome for yourself. And even when it's disappointing, and I heard this in your voice on that call with Betty. I know exactly what it feels like when you want this house because it's in the right zip code the right Schools on the right Street. And you're like, Oh, this is gonna be such a fun project. No, yeah, he actually really needs to sell this house for more money because her motivation is not that high. Okay? And then you put on your realtor hat and you get out the listing agreement and pass the blue pin. And it's like, Damn, and I wish I could have bought that one. And I've done it so many times, and I heard your voice shift. But what I what I observed was you put her best interest before your own, even though it probably cost you about 80,000 bucks on that phone call. Yeah, but you did the right thing. You have no trouble sleeping at night and the next deal will come to you and you'll make that up. She'll be a good even listings that probates a tough process for them to get through. So when you show up as a guiding light, it the expectations already met before you even do any business with them. So when you come through form, the testimony you could get on video camera, even on your iPhone. is going to blow everything out of the water and get you, every video testimony you get is going to be worth 10 deals to 12 deals in the next 10 years, it's at least worth one deal a year if somebody you have not met, that's going to give you another deal. So, no matter how you monetize these contacts, you just always got to take care of the people. Yeah, the stories are some of the best currency in this niche, like, like just having having people that your clients can call that they can watch on video that they can read. You know, I mean, David, you've got voicemail, you've got call recordings, you have a variety of different different ways that they can kind of vet you. That's what was really interesting. Like all the cameras make calls, which if you've been doing this for longer than six months, you start to get a pretty consistent stream of Come let's make calls about 1%. So if you have 100 leads a month, you could expect one come let me call at least a month, pretty much every month after six months. But what was really Interesting about those as they, they spoke like they knew me like, like, I talked to them before. And I'm like, embarrassed. I'm like, Sam, I'm sorry, have we ever talked before? And he's like, Oh, no, we got your letter. And we went to the website that you had on there. And we've checked you out on LinkedIn and Facebook and xylo. And these other places true lie, or whatever that site is, you know, we feel good about you just come on over this. And I'm like, crap, and it was really that easy. So I they do go look for this stuff. And you know, they do listen to your testimonials, and they do read every word of your website. So you should capture every single story that you can as you do this, no matter how small capture that story and say, You know what, here's here's how we help this person save $77,000. Here's how we couldn't help this person because their ego was in the way they listed but they dumped this, dumped it to this investor and lost $50,000 in equity. But here's the listing from the investor and what he made on this house. Don't let your family giveaway generational wealth, let our team preserve generational wealth for your family and Senator Yes, lock that in, send it to the printer, David, that's awesome. People have no one on this call today that please don't call me to recruit me on your team. I love to run my own business. I like to do my own thing. So please don't call me to recruit me on your team at all. Yeah, and I want to back you up on that. So David is extremely generous to be here. And and being transparent. He doesn't have to be and he actually has reached out to us because he wants to give, but you need to respect the boundaries that he's setting. Please don't don't harass him or try to recruit him or try to take all of his marketing stuff or have him build your business for you. Take what you've gotten here, be grateful for it interact with David in our Facebook group. But understand that if you were in his position, would you really want someone doing that? Right? So just be respectful, be reasonable, and and, you know, be grateful that he's willing to do This weather So Dave, I can't be I can't thank you enough, man. I really, if you come back anytime you want, I really love appreciate that you're part of our community and always willing to contribute. And I just love talking about success. I like seeing you do what you're doing. Yeah, I appreciate it. And this is going to be the biggest will transfer. So if you're not investing with all the leads, and you're like me for the first year, I was in the shadows on yours calls not saying a damn word. I was I was that guy. And I know there's people out there that think it's way too expensive. And I mean, there is an expense to doing this but man it is. It is 12 fold 1415 fold ROI return that I can't stress I should have started five years ago when I first found you guys and that's when I think y'all started. And I just put it off for a long time because I was sending handwritten notes to these probate people in Tarrant County and just trickling in the business not even making the phone call. So you guys also have come through huge For me on the training wise on the letters on the phone calls, so it just all correlates. I really appreciate you guys too. Yeah. Well, thanks so much, man. And we'll have david back soon guys for an update. You can always find him in our Facebook community all the leads mastermind, and he's pretty active in there. If you have questions, please step up. But again, be respectful. And we'll see you for the next next case study. Dave, thanks so much. I don't want to make anybody's phone calls for

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