From new artists selecting their target audience, to well-known stars switching up their style, building, maintaining, and even re-working their brand is a major aspect of an artist’s time in the spotlight. In this episode, we speak with the founder of Daemon, a company that offers modern music marketing by implementing a holistic marketing strategy across disciplines, and with executives at Harbor Park Media Company, which provides tailored media and management services to artists. Listen to this episode to hear about their time in the music industry working with artists and carefully curating the perfect image.
From new artists selecting their target audience, to well-known stars switching up their style, building, maintaining, and even re-working their brand is a major aspect of an artist’s time in the spotlight. In this episode, we speak with the founder of Daemon, a company that offers modern music marketing by implementing a holistic marketing strategy across disciplines, and with executives at Harbor Park Media Company, which provides tailored media and management services to artists. Listen to this episode to hear about their time in the music industry working with artists and carefully curating the perfect image.
Welcome to the Drop the Mic podcast where we'll dive into conversations with some of the music industry's most established professionals Like all of our episodes, what you will hear today has been created and curated by Stanford students who are breaking their way into the music scene. I'm Jay LeBouef and I lead Stanford University's music industry initiatives. Whether you're aspiring to launch your career in the music industry are already a music industry pro, or just curious to learn more. We've got you covered.
Nikita:Hello, lovely listeners and a warm welcome to another episode of Drop the Mic, where today's hot topic is brand development. We are Nikita, Alexa and Sophie, and we'll be taking you on a deep dive, into the marketing sphere of the music industry by chatting with J Scavo, Sam DeCencio, Jimmy Atkinson, and Conner Camp, who are certified pros in the field. The hard truth is, in the cutthroat world of modern music, a talent without strategy, even one with the force of a supernova, is often doomed to fail. The most recognizable icons in music history were able to cultivate such a wide following because they gave the public something to recognize: a unique image, a familiar personality, that special something that set them miles apart from the crowd. In other words, a brand. There is no single perfect formula for creating a powerful brand. Just take a look at Beyoncé, whose fans are obsessed with the luxury and mystery of her silent, personal life, and compare that to Cardi B, who rose to fame for her openness, relatability, and wild sense of humor. Sticking to the same brand for too long can also be just as detrimental as having no brand at all. That's why the most enduring artists are the ones that constantly surprise us. Think Taylor Swift, who has a versatile stream of hit conceptual albums under her belt or Miley Cyrus, who shocked the world with her good-girl gone bad, gone briefly good again, gone super bad eras. As you can see, brand development is one hell of a complicated process and that's saying the least. No one knows this better than our first guest, J Scavo, founder and CEO of Daemon, who has dedicated the last 25 plus years to tailoring comprehensive marketing campaigns for countless stars, including Selena Gomez, Green Day, and Michael Bublé, just to name a few. From social media management to e-commerce and merchandising, he's done it all and got an impressive track record to show for it. Without further ado, let's hear what the man himself has to say. Take it away, Sophie.
Sophie:Thanks Nikita. And thank you, Jay, for being here with us today. I can't wait to share all your incredible knowledge with our listeners. Let's start off with a pretty basic question. What led you to work in the music industry and more specifically to what you do today in the marketing world?
J Scavo:I was in a band in high school. I wasn't good enough to be the drummer, so they let me sing. We played high school parties and stuff. I was definitely the worst member of the band.
Sophie:I've always wanted to be part of a band, but I'm not sure I would have much to contribute. I've always said I can maybe really bang out some great songs on the triangle. That might be it for me.
J Scavo:Punk rock made it okay for you to not be good at your instrument.
Sophie:I might have some flute skills left over for middle school. I'd have to see.
J Scavo:And then I went to college. I didn't know what I wanted to major in. So I started working at the radio station and then I answered an ad that showed up in our college paper or maybe in the station for an intern at Island Records. It was amazing, great experience, met a lot of people who I still know. Summer came, internship ended. BMG had an internship program that was paid. So I did that. My boss was awesome and she got promoted. There was some room for me to move from being an intern. So I was very lucky. Long before I graduated, I had a full-time job with BMG and I fit school around it as best I could. And soon after that I got promoted. I was in distribution and I oversaw all the record stores when record stores were the main way that people got to music back in the day, for, I think three or four states. I went to a lot of shows, as you do as a young kid, and there was a band that I really loved and they didn't have a manager and I had a pager, which was cool back then, and I got free postage to send our tapes out, and a copier for shows. We said that we'd do it for one year and I was working at BMG at the same time. And at the very end of that year, like at the last, you know, week of that year, we got a slot to play South by Southwest and so it was our first road trip. And we show up to this place to play and it was like in the middle of the day, in this giant room kind of outside of Austin and there was literally nobody there. So I was like, well, this is it. Like, we'll do this show. I'll stop managing you guys. And you know, we'll have a blast going back home and we'll stay friends and good luck. And the most incredible thing happened. We got a call or something from Interscope Records, which was only probably two or three years old back then and just the hottest shit label in LA, you know, they were super cool. They were kind of independent. They had like Nine Inch Nails and Dr. Dre. Crazy, you know? And they told us this crazy story that they were going to, somebody else's show, they got dropped off at the wrong place, our place, they stuck their head in for like a second, liked what they heard and got back in the cab and went to the place that they were going to. They tracked us down and we ended up getting signed there. I managed bands for eight years and it was amazing. Being a manager is really great experience for almost any part of the record industry, for anybody who's wondering how to go get an education in the record industry; I think being a manager is one of the best for sure, because you're touching every single facet of the business.
Sophie:Right.
J Scavo:I wanted a change, so I went to interview at places, I interviewed at Hollywood Records, which was the record company, the frontline company of the Disney Music Group and ARTISTdirect, which was probably like the first big music company ever. But, I ended up going to Hollywood because the job seemed way cooler, was head of artist development. And that really started like what I would consider the traditional part of my career, where I ran the artist development deparment of Hollywood for six years, I think. It was amazing. I got my MBA while I was there. I went to go run MySpace Records, which was born after Fox bought MySpace. I went back to Disney to run their Digital Marketing Department and then I went to Warner to do the same. I also ran the merch department the VIP ticketing department, fan clubs. And then I went off on my own and started this Daemon company. I was lucky enough that I had some people call and they needed some very specific kinds of help and the help that is difficult to get outside of a label. And so it started as a one man job, now there's three of us, and I love it. It's, it's incredible.
Sophie:So, what is it that you do at Daemon?
J Scavo:So what we do, we're sort of a record company that people hire to put their records out on their own. So we function much like a general manager and a marketing and a sales team would, if you were at an indie label or a major label. And then we also have born out of necessity a social part of our company. So for some of our artists we also run their social sort of soup to nuts where we're calendaring, creating content, ideating with them, coming up with things that they should post, going for best practices, growing their base, figuring out each new platform as it comes online. Is it the right fit for them? Snap or TikTok or whatever.
Sophie:So, how do you think that a brand new artist should go about creating their brand? If you were working with someone who is new to the industry, how do you come to decisions about what their brand is going to be, what their vibe is going to be, and what they're going to be putting out there for their fans and their audience.
J Scavo:That's the million dollar question, man. Usually, I tell people, even if you're making super mainstream pop, you need to have something to say and you need to have a worldview that's unique and your own. And you need to make art that helps express that worldview. And maybe it's a worldview that can be shared by a lot of people. And maybe it's a worldview that can just be shared by a few people, but even a few people can make a career. You know, a lot of people can say, but no music is unique, because everything has been done, but combining influences is really a key attribute for people that are making cutting edge music. And if you can do that and you know, now it's so easy to get your music out, but that's just step one. Just creating the music isn't good enough. Unless you get really lucky. There are people who create music in their bedroom and part-time, and somebody at a DSP finds it and falls in love with it and puts it on a giant playlist and you can build a career like that for sure. But you have to plan on not being lucky and once you create it and you put it out, what are you going to do to support it? What social accounts make sense to you and feel right for your brand? What do you put in those social accounts? What are you going to say to people? What art do you want to put out there to represent you? Do you want people to get to know you? Is it super personal? Is it informal? Is it arms length and like more mysterious? Whatever that is, it should fit with what the music is as well. A super informal pop or punk band, it would be really awkward if you went to their Instagram and they were very standoffish and was just the facts ma'am and there was no personality there. It would also be weird if a classical artist was doing hashtag contests or whatever. You need it all to fit into a brand that should be driven by your worldview and your message I think a lot of people just want to put stuff out and that could be cool. So, if you just want to put stuff out and hope that somebody finds it, that has worked, it's leaving a lot to chance and it's pretty rare. And if you don't want to do the work, and that's why people often come to us like they just want to make music and they want us to do the marketing for them. That is clearly in a way that things can happen as well.
Sophie:Right. So kind of building off of that. Um, do any particular artists come to mind when you think of someone who brands themselves really well and is doing a good job of marketing to their target audience?
J Scavo:Taylor Swift is like, she's done a marketing, like doctorate, you know? Her music and her brand and her message is so consistent and so on point, and it's found a really big audience. There's probably a thousand Taylor Swift type artists that never made it. You know what I mean? She made it, she put the time in marketing has always been important for her. I assume, I don't know her, I don't want to like, speak like me and TayTay hang out often. But, she's a full fledged machine. The art is incredible. Her brand is great, it's consistent. Her worldview seems really clear and a bunch of people have bought into it. Other bands that come to mind, Linkin Park, who I did have the pleasure of working with. Everything seemed consistent with their sort of worldview in their art. They broke a lot of rules when they had the opportunity to, and it worked out well for them. I think those are the types of bands and, and commitments to your art that it's shown that they can survive over decades at this point. I think a lot more artists now are having singles sort of go viral, but, really building a career, and fan base one by one that can last longer than you're in a specific playlist is really what I consider success. Even the playlisters will tell you, they really want to champion artists that can have a real fan base and have merch and can go tour and have a vibrant social profile. They want the whole package and those are the artists that have a shot at getting into the big game, which is having a years to decades long career.
Sophie:So, naturally, you know, as time goes on, if artists are having these super long careers, they're bound to change and grow over that time. Taylor Swift has had a pretty successful rebrand during her career going from her innocence country roots to her new pop persona. But, obviously there are a ton of artists who have attempted that rebrand and have not had success in that. So, what do you think makes a successful rebrand and how should an artist go about their rebrand in order to ensure success?
J Scavo:Again, I don't want to fake like I know anything about the Taylor camp. But, as an observer and a marketing person and somebody who really has a profound level of respect for her and what she's built, her songs, whether they were the earlier country stuff or the pop stuff are undeniable, like the songs are great. And the subject matter from her earlier records to her later records, the words might be different, but the sort of worldview and the stuff that she's singing about is pretty consistent. She's always been a strong believer in herself and the power of women. And that's only grown throughout the years. That that was the thing that did not shift when the music shifted. I do feel like her rebrand was pretty slow. I mean, every album, she like layered a little bit more pop into what she was doing. She did it because she speaks true to her brand. The music was undeniable, but the tracks themselves were undeniable and her fans were so strong that they came with her along that journey. I also think that she got a lot of young fans and, like her, young fans grow up and what you're into at 13 isn't even cool when you're 14, much less when you're 18. I do feel like for a legion of kids they kind of grew up in with her. She just kept delivering hits to them, whether it was when they're 28 or when they were 18. That's special, you know, I don't know many other artists who have done that. A lot of times fans freak out when people change their style or whatever, but I would counter and say only special bands, like The Ramones can make the same sounding album over and over and over again and get away with it.
Sophie:That's really great insight. You've said that you've had kind of established artists going to TikTok if it suits their brand. Lately on TikTok a lot of people have been blowing up just like songs going absolutely viral just with people, you know, playing the guitar in their bedroom. Do you have any thoughts on TikTok as a starting point for a new artist in terms of building their brand beginning on TikTok and how that can potentially be moved into the larger industry and kind of start a career from there?
J Scavo:So on TikTok there's two different sort of things that happen. One is there are someTikTokers who regularly publish who understand the editing mechanics of the platform, who make great content, who also do music. Right? And then there's usually people who aren't on TikTok, musicians, who have a song or a hook that gets virally picked up as a sound that a bunch of people end up using. And it's really, um, difficult for what I would consider a regular band to become a TikToker and really publish a lot of content often trying to be relevant on the platform, jump into other trending hashtags, do other people's stuff, because usually when you're a musician, the music is your life. You don't want to have to listen to other people's songs or cover other people's songs. You just want to do your own songs. You have to sort of be smart about the other content that you place in TikTok surrounding your original work to get people there for the reasons that people like TikTok. Whether it's funny or it's deep or it's insightful. These posts that you have to make that don't really feature your music. They have to be there too to get the people in the door where then you can drop your, you playing in your bedroom your own song or whatever. But it is important, especially when you're starting out, to think about there are songs that get picked up and go viral and that could launch a career, or if you're inspired by the platform and you understand that editing piece of it, that's so important, you can commit to like really being a TikToker, who's focused on music and breaking through that way. And I think in that sense, it's a fantastic forum.
Sophie:Awesome. So this last one is probably one that you get a lot, I would think, but I think it's a good way to leave our listeners with something. So, what advice do you have for any of our listeners who want to follow in your footsteps on this path in the industry?
J Scavo:Here's what I'd say. If you want to really work in the record business on the business side, and frankly, as well as on the artist side, you definitely should not have a Plan B. There are a line of people miles long dying to work in the music industry because it feeds their passion. I think the arts inspires that in people. And just know that that's your competition: people who would do anything, work for free for years just to get into the door. It's really hard. People are really shrewd. People are really smart. Usually the shrewdest and the smartest are the ones that survive. I would say, if you want to do this, you need to find whatever you can do, work for whoever you can, make any connection you can. Everything on your resume makes a difference. Whether that's helping out at your local club, being part of a high school club, managing a friend's band, working at a record store, all that makes a difference and can lead up to something like a job at a label or a management company.
Sophie:Awesome. Thank you so much. That is great advice. I just want to thank you one more time for being here with us. Your insight and your advice is so appreciated and is worth so much. So just thank you again for being here. Great to talk to you.
J Scavo:Yeah. Awesome.
Nikita:Well, there you have it! One glance at J Scavo's extensively-packed LinkedIn profile or his polished company website may have you feeling extremely intimidated, but hopefully this conversation proves that everyone starts from humble beginnings, and anyone can become a big player in the music industry if they forge connections, take risks, and keep their wits about them. Still having doubts? Maybe our next guests, Sam, Jimmy, and Andrew, the brains behind the up-and-coming Harbor Park Media Company can hit a little closer to home and be a bit more convincing. Their story is definitely an inspiring one. Amidst the chaos and uncertainty of the year 2020, they birthed their entreprise from a tiny apartment in Philadelphia, where they were living as ambitious college kids, just like us, with an insatiable love for music, especially towards the bands they thought weren't receiving the exposure they deserved. Harbor Park provides a vast array of content services from promotional photography shoots to fully fleshed video production. With their more relaxed and intimate approach to branding, which prioritizes the artist's creative control when collaborating on ideas, we can certainly see them going far, which is why we jumped at the opportunity to interview them. I'll hand it over to Alexa.
Alexa:Thank you guys all for joining. I'm so excited to talk with you about Harbor Park and the media and entertainment industry and music industry more generally. My first question is how did Harbor Park Media Company come about in the first place?
Sam Decencio:Um, so I guess technically I started Harbor Park, obviously Jimmy and, Connor were doing video stuff way before that media stuff. But, uh, the idea came to me and my one roommate, so well, backstory Harbor Park is actually made out of five owners. There's me, Jimmy, Connor and two more. There's our friend Jack Ballard and my roommate, one of my roommates, Andrew at college. And the idea originally came to when me and Andrew, like one night we were sorta just, we both love music, especially sort of like the indie alternative, like wave, I guess, garage rock. And we just, we found a band that was a bit smaller. From our area. And we were like, wow, we really like these guys. We're like, why aren't they famous? Like they deserve to be famous. So then we sort of just almost sort of like, that's what we should sort of do, like help bands manage them, promote them to try to get them to one day be famous.
Alexa:So very artist-focused, like getting them out there, getting their names out there. I saw from your website, Sam that you are the head of business development, Jimmy, you're creative director and Connor, what's your role?
Connor Kamp:Officially I'm the head of content.
Alexa:So can you, can you talk a little bit about what each of those roles entail?
Sam Decencio:I'll start off sort of as head of business development, almost just sort of overseeing Harbor Park and just like, obviously moving forward, things we want to to focus on just like overall viewpoint. I will say I also, like, obviously everyone has a title, but it's sort of almost loose we all work together on things, although like definitely Connor and Jimmy are more, they know a lot more about like the video stuff and the media side. So that's sort of why we have these titles, but I got, like I said, I also like to help a lot with like promotion and marketing as well.
Alexa:What about you guys?
Jimmy Atkinson:So in terms of talent relations and talking, I think my, my title is set up is like creative director, head of talent relations or something along those lines. I mean, I think full disclosure we were just tossing out titles at the beginning to see what would stick, but, uh, also in terms of responsibilities, I think it, uh, you know, I think it's pretty spot on a lot of the talent relations thing is, is just kind of keeping up with artists, keeping in contact with them, letting them know, like, you know, we're still working behind the scenes, whether or not we're, You know, in contact all week with them, like it's still good to be in touch with them. Um, a lot of it was reaching out to bands and recruiting people early on. So a lot of it was like straight up social media DM-ing and uh, a lot of just grunt work to try to, you know, explain the company, the idea to people. And then, and then from there, hope they like sign on but in terms of town relations, I think like most of that is, is essentially just kind of keeping up and keeping in contact with these people that we're working with.
Connor Kamp:As far as like head of content goes and I've been doing media creation for years and years, and it's something I'm really passionate about and something Jimmy and I work well together on. And so, Yeah, I'm taking the helm as far as, um, photography and music, video shoots and, uh, you know, any other content that we might produce and, um, and just, you know, seeing that through.
Alexa:Yeah. Awesome. So the focus of this episode of the podcast is artists brand development. I'm wondering how you guys think brand new artists should go about creating a brand for them selves. And if you're working with someone new to the industry, how do you and the artists come to decisions about what their brand is going to be? You know, do you leave it up to the artist or do you guys take more of a concrete role in that process?
Jimmy Atkinson:I'll take this one. If you guys don't mind. I think the best example that we could use talking about brand right now, uh, in terms of our artists is this guy, Javie Bahama, who, uh, we're out here working with. We're actually going to meet up with him tonight to shoot some pictures and just get to know him kind of thing. But, um, his brand right away in, in terms of artist's brand, a lot of the things that we look for is like their casual, actual, genuine personality. And like, that was a big thing that we really liked about Javie was, that he has this super genuine, like Instagram page where he'll just casually posts like memes and stuff. And we just think that that like, right away. The idea was that he didn't really have a brand. He was like being himself. And that, that would be a lot easier to promote if we weren't like forcing this because we were working with another band, from another country. I won't name them because we're not working with them anymore, they had different ideas about their brand and, and kinda, and different ideas about how fast and how hard promotion-wise and stuff when I think our opinion is in, in this kind of genre of music and the indie scene this casual vibe that, that Javie's got going this genuine, like low key low effort kind of like brand is, uh, it fits the music and it fits the, the, you know, social media, we're big on social media content, especially if it's, if it's like just genuine, like posts that the band or the artists like would actually post and not, we don't, we don't want stuff to feel forced, you know? So I think, um, Javie Bahama is a great example of brand and, and, uh, how we build brands with people. And that was really just a lot of hands-off like, hey, Javie, keep doing your thing.
Alexa:So would you say it's more like you guys seek out these people who are, as you say, really accessible, really down to earth and, authentic, or, do you maybe see potential in an artist and then help them realize that in themselves?
Sam Decencio:Yeah, I would say that like, so our big thing for us is I know there's some like management, like media companies out there that will just work anyone and everyone. Especially, like, obviously we would do music video for almost anyone, but like when it comes to like people we want to work with and manage and like be with for a while, like the number one thing for us is like their music. It's like something that we like have to like, and like really appreciate and think that other people will appreciate it. And we feel like that's the best way to sort of promote. And on top of that with, um, like branding every, like, if your music's good, in my opinion, and you have like a, just a nice genuine presence, I think people really like dig that in this day and age.
Alexa:Can you guys think of examples of artists who fit that bill, who you think, have really, you know, good music to back it up, but have also branded themselves well and authentically?
Jimmy Atkinson:Uh, Boy Pablo. I think Boy Pablo in terms of, uh, I mean, they kind of exist like in our space of like the indie alternative scene and, uh, I mean, they blew up quick because of YouTube and then what that's like a, 18 year old Chilean slash Finnish kid. And, and like, Yeah. It's, it's great music. And, uh, and their music videos are just on point it's this whole brand of you know, uh, he is, he's a kid like, like he's 18 or 19, so it's very you know, youthful and fun, but you would have to watch his music videos. I think his music, these are fantastic, but that's a, that's a great idea that I would, or a great example. I'd love to, for a brand.
Sam Decencio:I'd say another artist as well, like one I personally like Day Glo, I forget his real name, but he's like a relatively new artist. And like, he just was a college student, Texas, and I'd say probably a year and a half ago, he started like releasing, released his first album. And now so many people know him. And I will say on top of that his music videos that are really creative. And like it just sort of is a genuine sort of fun happy music video, which I think a lot of fans, like.
Alexa:So, we're talking about these people who have kind of blown up, Jimmy, you were talking about blowing up on YouTube. And before we started recording, I know we were talking a little bit about Tik Tok and how, you know, maybe you guys are veering away from that sphere, but I'd love to talk a little bit about Tik Tok as this kind of fame generator. Recently, we've seen a rise of artists using the app to build their brands. Have you worked with any artists who are using Tik Tok to promote themselves? Talk to me a little bit about that experience and how do you feel about the platform as a starting point for artists and as a marketing method for artists who are already established?
Jimmy Atkinson:The perfect question, Sam, you want to talk senior year?
Sam Decencio:Yeah. Um, so we're actually very big Tik Tok people, honestly. And I, we think, I think that it's probably one of the best ways to like, go about just free promotion now for bands, especially, um, one of our clients is a band called senior year who we found, well, I think I, maybe Jimmy found them, but we sent it to each other, but it was like before they had actually released any music. So right now they have only one song released, but we found them right before and we were just like, wow, these guys are really good. And like on top of that, going back to the genuine, like personality, presence, they are just like, we just like, they sound like really cool guys. So I just reached out to them. And after a couple meetings we were like, they fit really well with us.
Jimmy Atkinson:Yeah. They, they hit like 50,000 streams on a, on a Tik TOK before they even released any music. I think it was just like, it was a nice riff that they had that they were practicing and it was like, um, music dropping soon, like kind of like a little bit of like, they were promoing themselves without even kind of realizing that they were promoing themselves. It was like a genuine post, but it blew up and we were like, yo, these guys are accidentally good at marketing themselves, they haven't even come out with anything yet. And they're already building like a fanbase on Tik Tok.
Sam Decencio:Yeah. The singer and I think, yeah, singer/guitarist, Simon. He was like the one who put their band because he like had a Tik TOK himself originally. And like, he would just post guitar stuff on there and started like getting a bunch of followers. It was like, our band has to do this too. So that's sort of like the way they went about it, which I definitely think is a smart thing to do if you're a new band.
Connor Kamp:Tik TOK is a great tool. I think there's no doubt about that. I think it's easy to lose yourself and maybe lose sight of what you're trying to accomplish with Tik Tok.
Sam Decencio:I mean, there's just like the small, little, like factors as well that like, if you especially using like your own music that you've released, like as a sound, there's just always a chance that for some reason they can just blow up.
Jimmy Atkinson:I think uh Tik Tok its kind of randomness like its volatility is definitely like a little like worrying in terms of like promoting, I think, a cool thing, that like both, it's hard from our end, like our business end, but it's also pretty cool about Tik Tok is that like, I think it's very hard to make something just blow up, like un-genuinely. Like I think things genuinely blow up if they're like genuinely enjoyed on Tik Tok when on a lot of other social medias, like if you pump enough money or pump enough, like views into it, like it'll just, you know, it'll get enough views. But I think with Tik Tok, like and our approach to Tik Tok has been just kind of telling our artists and you know, encouraging them to get on Tik Tok and just be themselves, like not really force any Tik Toks, like put their music in there and then just, you know, do something like casual, like just do you know, something that you would actually do and don't try to force it because I think you can tell when it's trying to be forced. And I think Tik Tok itself as like a, as a social media is like stuff won't really work, if you're like, you're trying to force music onto the Zoomer kids. Like, they're not gonna, they're not gonna take that.
Sam Decencio:My last sort of, comment about it, just like to piggyback off that it's like, sort of a behind the scenes, almost of like a band, many people will like an artist, but like Tik Tok and actually behind the scenes of like, how they genuinely are, and like how Jimmy said, just something that you like post on that you wouldn't normally do. Cause I mean, your fans will probably like that.
Alexa:That's so true. It's like they can stream your music and follow you, watch your videos. But they will also want to get to know you guys as people. Right? So, so they want to go behind the scenes as well. So, um, can you guys talk a little bit about if you haven't already, the artists that you've worked with or artists that you've worked with, who have made the greatest impact on your careers?
Jimmy Atkinson:You can go, you can go a couple of directions with this one. Um, I would say, I mean, the, the artists to me, uh, right off the bat, like getting our first artists was a spectacular feeling like getting, um, it was Photo Negative, right, Sam?
Sam Decencio:Yeah, our first meeting with a band and our first actual band that we signed that night.
Jimmy Atkinson:Yeah. And that was uh, to me, it was just right away. It was like, damn. Like we have, you know, it kinda, it kinda made me realize like, we're we have something to offer to bands and that you know, bands are interested in this idea of, because essentially what we were offering them is like free promotion and free marketing. Like, that was kind of how we got our foot in the door. It was to be able to like go to these bands and be like, hey, like, you know, we'll work for you. We'll do whatever you need. Like, we can talk money later, like about media, um, performances and, and, you know, making a music video or something. But until then, like let's just attach our names together and let's like, and we'll promote you and blah, blah, blah. And I think, um, getting Photo Negative was through like a friend of a friend, um, at, at Boston college and, um, you know, once we got them on it and once we were talking to them and I think realizing that they were like genuine college kids like us and you know, just normal fun guys who were really into music, same way we are, that's kinda when I realized like, oh, this can like really work, like this can, there's a lot of bands out there like these people that you know, are like us and love music and, uh, are open to having more help. And so, I mean, that, that was the greatest that-- we're still real young. So I guess, uh, we haven't really had any artists like really affect us, but I think first getting the couple ones on board was, was, was awesome.
Connor Kamp:Yeah so I mean, Jimmy did touch on this at the end. We like are still definitely getting off the ground and it is somewhat difficult because our artists are literally all over the country. And, um, so working face-to-face with them is not always the easiest, but I'm really looking forward to this meeting that Jimmy and I are, Jimmy just mentioned, um, with Javie Bahama, one of our artists. And, uh, we're doing that tonight. And I think that's going to be really great to just kind of get a feel for how he works and like his creative process and how he is as a person, even more so than like, cause we've had quite a few phone calls with him and he's great. But you know, just being able to interact with him in person is going to be awesome. And um, and I think that that's probably like going to be the first step in building a really meaningful creative relationship with this guy.
Alexa:So this is your first time meeting him face to face.
Jimmy Atkinson:Yeah.
Connor Kamp:Great guy, uh, he's got this incredible film camera called, uh NISHIKA n8,000, I believe is what it's called. And it's what, um, it's what people use for those-- you can do it on your phone with an app, and it's like a parallax photo where it like shifts. We're going to do some shots with that. And then I've got my camera and we'll do some, we've been, you know, uh, talking about ideas for like a Tiny Desk Concert or like something like that that we could use to promote his music. So we'll see how it goes.
Sam Decencio:Definitely agree with everything they've said a, um, another client they haven't really touched on yet is, um, Deep Sea Peach Tree, one of our clients as well. And it's sort of just like the thing about them is they've probably established themselves more. They've been around for a few years, few years now. Than like our other clients, but like, they're just also all of our, one of our favorite artists and just like, absolutely loved their music. So just like being able to work with them, it's just like a great thing is makes me excited to like be a part of Harbor Park.
Jimmy Atkinson:Yeah. We, we spent the whole summer listening to this band, like before the idea of Harbor Park came around, we spent the whole summer and like last year, too, just like listening to this band. And once we kind of started, we were like, yo, down the line, let's hit, you know, Deep Sea Peach Tree up. And then three months later, we did and it worked. And like, that was, that was pretty surreal.
Connor Kamp:With Harbor park it's like all these artists that we have, like we're genuinely fans of their music. We wouldn't work with them if we didn't like really love what they were doing. And so it makes it that much easier to like build relationships with them because we already loved their music.
Alexa:I'm hearing this repeated theme of you don't want to be kind of just like an open door, like we'll work with anyone. You want to be a little more selective about the artists that you work with. Can you talk to me a little bit about why you use that approach as opposed to kind of being more like we'll work with anyone?
Sam Decencio:I'm not sure, like I would work with like anyone. I just, I don't think I'd like, sort of be able to say,'cause at some points, like if I'm working with someone, I don't really like enjoy their music as much. And they're like pushing me and they're, they're asking us, why is this not getting enough recognition? I wouldn't really be able to tell them it's not good enough. So I guess just a really good advantage of-- like everyone would work at like, they'll send me like a new song or send us some new songs, or a thing they're releasing and I'll be like, that's a really good song. You should release that. So, um, I think that's more like, that's my reasoning to why I like to be a little selective. It's just,'cause it almost like makes our job easier.
Jimmy Atkinson:Yeah I would agree. I think that the whole like selective idea is like, we're selective, but, but just kind of like out of preference, like it's not really like-- we're open to working with everybody. Like, I mean, you know, we want money and we want, we want to work. You know, the ideas that we could do media for, for anybody, but like, there's this next level of partnership in which like, you know, we're working Harbor Park and this band. And like for that, that's like an extended relationship. That's when the talent relations I guess, will come in. I think like bottom line is, like I think for us, like in order to feel like the, the passion and like the constant drive, it needs to be somebody like, we really believe in and that's not to say that like a band could come up to us like, hey, can you work with us? And we'd be like, no, you suck. Like, it's more just like, we really sought out these specific bands we're working with because you know, their music is incredible. And it's like, if we, I think if we really believe in the product that we're pushing, it makes it a lot easier to, to do all the promotion, all the grunt work and stuff. Because I think a lot of promotion, a lot of marketing feels very fake. Like I like, I keep using the word genuine, but like, I think that's a big focus for us, is to do very, natural promotion. Like let people find the music who are going to enjoy the music. Don't push the music onto people who are not in the demographic or not in the, in the genre. So I, I think for us to, to you know, pursue this like genuine goal, um, it helps to work with bands that we like actually listen to.
Alexa:If you had to choose an artist you've worked with who you think you've made the greatest impact on their career, who would it be and why?
Jimmy Atkinson:I mean, I think Photo Negative would probably be my choice. I think, um, I think it was, uh, like in terms of impact that we've had on their career so far, I think, um, in this very early stage, the biggest impact we could point to, is just kind of showing people that like there's interest in their music, like a lot of the bands and a lot of the artists that we talked to, were surprised when we DM them, like, that's awesome you guys are listening to my stuff out on the East coast or like, wow, like you got merch? Like that's crazy. And it was just, it was always funny to us because like, dude, like your songs are amazing. Like, what do you mean? Why are you surprised about this? And so I think, um, early on, especially with Photo Negative, like it's a student band, a bunch of kids our age, Boston college. I don't think they ever really expected anything like this. And I think it kind of pushed them into like go mode a little bit. Like they got recording again. They started you know, getting ready, like they got the whole band together and all that. And I think once they see that, like that's the biggest effect that I think I can point to is that like, just them seeing that, there's a team full of people that are passionate about the industry and passionate about their music who are willing to help them out for free pretty much.
Sam Decencio:I was actually gonna say pretty much exactly everything that Jimmy just said the, yeah, like the biggest impact may not just be like getting, they-- we promoted them, like they are like a next level now, but just the fact that they were like, I just, I'm really happy, someone else like likes our music. It was just like the push they needed like more motivation. I mean, like due to COVID, I mean, probably due to COVID they hadn't released a song in like, uh, a year or two since the original like EP. So that was like a nice push for them in this winter. And now they're all back together at school. I like caught up with them multiple times and they've just been all really excited. They've been like recording stuff. They send me a couple of new songs they have that they're planning on releasing. So, I mean, everything's going pretty well with them.
Alexa:How has COVID impacted you guys and what you guys are doing?
Jimmy Atkinson:So we were, we were kind of born out of COVID we, um, I think COVID, uh, was, was, because a lot of our focus when we first kinda got together was like, so like, things are going to start opening back up within you know, we got together in like October and LLC and all then we were hoping it'd be, you know, COVID would be gone by around now, but no, we got, we got a couple more months, but, I think, I think us meeting together and coming together in this space, especially in a time where like with COVID a lot of promotion and a lot of like, like, I mean there's no live performances. We see a lot of bands doing like online Zoom performances and stuff. And I think, um, like we recognized that that was a very good opportunity to hop into this space and become new players in it because you don't really, you, we didn't have to know anybody. Like we didn't have to like show up anything. It was all DMS. It was all like, just hitting people up and building a brand for ourselves and, and building the website and just kind of presenting ourselves as ready to do this. And, and I think that COVID was a big part of that because like, without all these bands online, like trying to do promotion and trying to do, you know their band stuff, but like in an online sphere, uh, it would've been harder to get into it. And I think it would have been harder to get, you know, bands on board to work with us. So I think, you know, I think COVID, you know, was a, was a benefit on our side.
Alexa:So you've obviously said that you guys are new, you're getting off the ground, but I'm wondering, is there something that you have learned that you wish you had known starting out?
Jimmy Atkinson:That's a great question.
Sam Decencio:I mean, I just have a smaller thing. Something that I learned when we originally were able to work something out with Deep See Peach Tree and like they became an official client, was that, I don't know. It was like, sort of just that, like anyone-- it's not like where we were always, like at the time, limiting ourselves to like really kind of smaller bands that are just starting off. But like the thing was that, like I realized, like anyone could be a client. And reaching out to people, like the worst that's going to happen is they're just going to be like, sorry, no, like, everyone's really cool like in this music community that they're not just going to-- they're not going to be like, no, why would we want to work with you? Like, that's so stupid. It's just like, they're just like, sorry, no, thanks. Uh, so that's like like what I learned from the very beginning.
Jimmy Atkinson:I think, um, what I would point to is like, yeah, along the same lines, is I mean, I think early on when we were first jumping into Zoom calls with bands and stuff, I was like intimidated going into them. And I think, uh, I remember Sam and I like sitting on my couch, right next to each other, just like kind of putting on our business faces for a band and spending like 50 minutes straight, like just like rattling off like long business sounding stuff. Looking back at it, um, a lot-- yeah. I think like the number one thing I learned is that like, it's, it's easier than you think it would be. Like, everyone's very genuine, like what Sam's talking about. These people are passionate about music and I think a certain kind of quality, like a personality trait that comes with being passionate about music is that like, you know, they're just creatively open, and they're open to ideas and they're open to talking to people and they especially love when we love their music. Like, and so I think that's, that's what I've learned is that it's like really good vibes around here. Like, and I think going into it, I probably would have expected that the music industry is a little grimy. Like I remember saying that a lot at the very beginning, it is grimy, but I think where we are in this space and in this sphere of, of like, like this genre of music, I think the vibe is perfect. And I think the people are nice.
Alexa:Do you think that, that, this kind of, uh, more indie folk rock sphere is different from, from, you know other spheres in meaningful ways? Like, like you, you kind of alluded to the people are really nice and really open. Do you think that that's specific to this genre?
Jimmy Atkinson:Yeah, and, and I, I think, um, cause I know, I know your focus is brand, right? So I, I think, um, I think brand goes hand in hand with garage rock. Like I, I think there's like an inherent brand in this, in this, you know, music scene where it's indie music, so nobody's really blowing up. Like if you're at the top of the game, like you're getting maybe like a million, a couple of streams on, on some of your songs and I, I think with that being the case, it's not very corporate. It's, it's, it's a lot of just genuine people doing, like making the music they genuinely enjoy making and, and like just posting dumb stuff on Instagram rather than like having a social media manager, blah, blah, blah, and I think, um, the space itself, just kinda, yeah. It lends itself to this brand of, of casual, like music making and genuine passion for the art. And yeah, it's carried over to everybody we've met so far too. It's like a lot of, a lot of bands or a lot of artists seem like they don't really care about making it or getting more streams. They're just happy with the music they make. And I think that's like a beautiful thing. Like I think that's wonderful.
Alexa:So where can our listeners find you guys online, on social media? Where can they listen to your artists' music?
Jimmy Atkinson:So harborparkmedia.com has got all our info, all of our bands, all, all the music there. There's a playlist on there too. And that's got every song by a Harbor Park artist compiled together. Fantastic playlist, highly recommend.
Sam Decencio:It's under Jimmy's account, but yeah. And I was going to say, you also, if you go-- our, uh, Instagram's the same thing, Harbor Park Media, you can see all the bands that we manage and their Instagram accounts and everything, find a way to their music as well.
Jimmy Atkinson:Also, our Instagram accounts are on there too.
Alexa:All right. Well, thank you guys so much for speaking with me today. I learned so much about what a media company entails and how you guys visualize brands and about the genre of, of garage rock that I didn't know existed before today. So thank you.
Nikita:And that's a wrap! In summary, the inspiring individuals in this episode make it clear that there is no right time or method for getting involved in the music biz you just have to get up, keep getting up and go for it. We would just like to express our heartfelt thanks to J and the Harbor Park team once again, for taking the time to sit down, discuss with us, and answer our burning questions. Lastly, we hope that you, the listener gained some valuable insight into the intricate and demanding field of brand development, as well as a newfound respect for the people behind the scenes who carefully construct, curate, maintain, and update all the things about your beloved artists that make them so lovable. Best of luck in all your endeavors and we hope to see you next time.