Inside Geneva
Inside Geneva is a podcast about global politics, humanitarian issues, and international aid, hosted by journalist Imogen Foulkes. It is produced by SWI swissinfo.ch, a multilingual international public service media company from Switzerland.
Inside Geneva
Geneva and climate change, start local and change the world
For our planet, each year brings new climate records, and they’re not good ones.
“We now know that 2024 is on track to be the warmest year on record. At the same time, we have accumulated more CO2 than ever in the history of human life on Earth,” says Celeste Saulo, Secretary-General of the World Meteorological Organization.
On Inside Geneva this week, we look at the damage from the perspective of United Nations (UN) aid agencies.
“Climate change is making us sick, and it’s making us sick because it’s increasing the possibility of having more infectious diseases and waterborne diseases like cholera. It’s also sometimes destroying the capacity to produce food,” says Maria Neira, Climate Change Director at the World Health Organization.
We also hear how aid agencies are trying to reduce their own carbon footprints.
“Anyone who’s in the field at the moment shouldn’t be using their own agency vehicles. We should be ride-sharing. We’ve got 6,000 vehicles. Why aren’t they electric? We’ve got 6,000 generators. Why aren’t they all solar-powered?” says Andrew Harper, Climate Change Advisor to the UN Refugee Agency.
It’s part of a local Geneva initiative called 2050 Today to encourage the city’s UN agencies, diplomatic missions and private enterprises to tackle climate change.
“In my small mission, we know that our contribution may be minor in comparison, but we also understand the power of collective movements. By sharing the 2050 Today tools with our other embassies throughout the world, we aim to reduce our emissions by 45% from our 2022 levels,” says Matthew Wilson, the Ambassador of Barbados to the UN in Geneva.
Sometimes great things start local – join host Imogen Foulkes on Inside Geneva to find out how.
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Host: Imogen Foulkes
Production assitant: Claire-Marie Germain
Distribution: Sara Pasino
Marketing: Xin Zhang
This is Inside Geneva. I'm your host, Imogen Foulkes, and this is a production from Swissinfo, the international public media company of Switzerland.
Speaker 3:In today's programme…. We now know that 2024 is on track to be the warmest year on record. At the same time, we have accumulated CO2 more than ever in the history of human life on Earth.
Speaker 4:Climate change is making us sick, and it's making us sick because it's increasing the possibility of having more infectious diseases.
Speaker 5:waterborne diseases like cholera is destroying sometimes the capacity of producing food, climate change, climate chaos, we're saying, is exacerbating human rights challenges across the board Displacement, conflicts, inequalities and injustice. Those who are impacted are those who are the least responsible for what is going on.
Speaker 6:Anyone who's in the field at the moment. They shouldn't be using their own agency vehicles. We should be having ride sharing. We've got 6,000 vehicles. Why aren't they electric? We've got 6,000 generators. Why aren't they all basically being solar powered, Howard.
Speaker 2:Hello and welcome again to Inside Geneva. I'm Imogen Fowkes and in today's programme the very first of 2025, we're going to try to provide a bit of inspiration, motivation and even perhaps optimism. Many of us feel helpless in the face of global challenges. Many of us feel helpless in the face of global challenges. Many of us are frustrated when our governments promise big and deliver very, very small. A recent example was the latest climate change conference, cop29, held in Baku in Azerbaijan. We now know that 2024 is set to be the hottest year on record. We know our chance of staying within the Paris-agreed limit of a 1.5 degree centigrade temperature rise looks more and more doubtful and we've seen more and more extreme weather events linked to global warming. But at these big climate summits, our governments just don't seem to take it that seriously. Even small decisions are haggled over for days. Meanwhile, our planet keeps on heating up For the first time ever global warming has exceeded 1.5 degrees Celsius for an entire year.
Speaker 9:Representatives of dozens of the world's least developed countries stormed out of a key meeting.
Speaker 10:We just walked out. We came here to this COP for a fair deal. We feel that we haven't been heard.
Speaker 9:This, in our opinion, will not address the enormity of the challenge we all face. Climate scientists are pretty much unanimous about the record temperatures and wildfires that are sweeping across Europe. These extreme conditions are a direct consequence of climate change and will only occur more frequently and with greater intensity if nothing is done to stop it.
Speaker 2:So what can we ordinary citizens do? In fact, we may not be as helpless as we think, and an organization right here in Geneva proves that. Its name is Geneva 2050 Today, and its aim is to encourage all the institutions in town, from the private sector to non-governmental organisations, to diplomatic missions, to the big UN aid agencies, to set targets which really will comply with the Paris Agreement. And not only set the targets, but stick to them. Last month, geneva 2050 Today held a high-level meeting at the headquarters of the World Meteorological Organization to adopt a climate action plan, hear from organisations who are signing up and then debate with some of the biggest humanitarian agencies the impact of climate change on health, human rights and refugees. Here at Inside Geneva, we got a ringside seat at that event, and we're going to bring you a flavour of that today, starting with the Executive Director of Geneva 2050 Today, jean-pierre Raymond, who reminded us how urgent the situation is.
Speaker 11:Greenhouse gas emissions linked to human activities have arisen by a further 1.3% between 2022 and 2023. The world is heading to a temperature rise with devastating consequences for population, for the planet and for economies. Redactions of 42% are needed by 2030 to avoid exceeding temperatures of 1.5 degrees, a reduction objective that will grow with each year of inaction. We, and I am very proud to say we, international Geneva, are turning the tide tonight. Our determination to act is the outcome of a joint and collective effort by the creation of 2050 Today, the Geneva Climate Action Forum, to promote the decarbonisation of this multilateral ecosystem.
Speaker 2:And in the spirit of multilateralism, multiple ambassadors were taking part and pledging their support to Geneva 2050. Today, here's Matthew Wilson, ambassador of Barbados to the UN in Geneva.
Speaker 8:In a perfect world, we may actually not have needed a 2050 Today. Countries, organisations, entities and individuals would automatically be aware of their carbon footprint, already have tailored plans to cut their emissions and to reduce food waste, would be using social media to share best practices and scalable and replicable solutions. But we are an imperfect world. The fact that we are in a climate crisis tells us that. The fact that 2024 is the hottest year on record tells us that the fact that we now speak of when we will be above 1.5 degrees, and not if. It is an imperfect world and we are imperfect organisations. This is why we need 2050 today.
Speaker 2:So how does 2050 today work exactly? Switzerland's ambassador, jörg Lauber, admitted that COP29 had been less than inspiring, but argued that starting local could have a ripple effect.
Speaker 10:As key players within international Geneva, we too can lead by example and take meaningful action. Switzerland has set ambitious goals reducing emissions by half by 2030 and achieving carbon neutrality by 2050. Locally, the canton and city of Geneva aim even higher, targeting a 60% reduction in emissions by 2030 and achieving a net zero balance by 2050. Achieving these ambitious objectives requires harnessing technological innovation and fostering collaboration across sectors. The essence of 2050's today mission lies in encouraging and facilitating action. This initiative serves as a bridge, connecting local projects with broader global objectives, creating platforms for dialogue and fostering synergies in ecological innovation.
Speaker 2:One of the main aims of 2050 Today is to mobilise as many Geneva-based organisations as possible and to encourage a multifaceted approach to tackling climate change. Cecilia Roselli of the Norwegian Refugee Council told us how her organisation joined 2050 Today at the start and then brought in other Geneva-based NGOs.
Speaker 7:It's really a pleasure to see how we can mobilise additional agencies and actors to become more responsible in the use of resources, to implement sustainable procurement by reducing general waste, by making recycling easier for our staff and supporting sustainable transportation. We all come to work by bike. I really think it's an achievement for the 150 colleagues that are joining the humanitarian hub, but I think more importantly, we strive to minimise our environmental footprint in our operations.
Speaker 2:Meanwhile, a UN agency was signing up to the 2050 Today Charter for the first time. Andrew Steens, Assistant Director of the World Intellectual Property Organisation, told us why.
Speaker 1:As the UN Agency for Innovation and Creativity, we at WIPO see a central role for the power of intellectual property in improving environmental outcomes. And, closer to home, we are committed to taking divisive action in the areas of the 2050 Today Charter. For example, we are reducing our energy consumption year on year. We're connected to the incredible Geneva Lake Water Network, calling. Our buildings, the park and the rooftops on our campus are designed to support local biodiversity and to reduce the costs and needs for watering. Like others, we're taking a whole of life cycle approach to procurement, including for our IT equipment, thinking about how we dispose of any item at the moment we buy it, not when we remove it. But there's a lot more we can do and I'm confident that the Charterwich signing today will drive much more further action at WIPO, in partnership with all of you, in partnership with International Geneva. This initiative sends the strongest signal of our collective commitment to remaining within our planetary boundaries and to turning the tide.
Speaker 2:Listening to these Geneva organisations, big and small, and diplomats representing countries, big and small, it begins to become clear how 2050, today's ambitions can be achieved. Here's Ambassador Wilson again.
Speaker 8:In my small mission. We know that our contribution may be minor in comparison, but we also understand the power of collective movements. By sharing the 2050 Today tools with our other embassies throughout the world, we are supporting as many actors as possible to step in and to step up. We aim to reduce our emissions by 45% from our 2022 levels and to continue to look closely at actions around food waste and mobility. Already, we've been retrofitted with modern energy saving lighting solutions. We're working with our reggie to explore solar power. I can't promise you that you'll ever see me riding a bike on the streets of Geneva, like some of our European ambassadors, but you'll see me more on buses and trams. One of the most important things that this process has done for my small mission is to make us think. Think of the impact of our personal actions, remind ourselves that we have a choice to harm or help our country and vulnerable populations by making decisions that, cumulatively, will have an impact. Barbados is proud to be part of this quiet revolution of 2050 today.
Speaker 2:So, as I promised at the start, some motivational content for you on this first of the year edition of Inside Geneva. But of course, we shouldn't underestimate the serious challenges of climate change and the harm it is already doing. So, after hearing from the various organisations that are supporting Geneva 2050 today, we moved on to a debate with representatives from key UN organisations. We had Celeste Saulo, secretary General of the World Meteorological Organisation, nada al-Nasheef, un Deputy High Commissioner for Human Rights, marina Naira, director of Environment and Climate Change at the World Health Organisation, and Andrew Harper, special Advisor on Climate Action at the UN Refugee Agency. Advisor on Climate Action at the UN Refugee Agency.
Speaker 2:Here is a flavour of that debate and asking the questions. Well, you may recognise that voice. Good evening, it's great to see so many people here and it's also great, given the really challenging world we live in, to actually take part in a debate where there's kind of some cooperation and optimism. But you see our panel here to sober you up. We're going to hear from key UN agencies who are seeing the effects of climate change firsthand on the very people they are trying to serve. I would like to give the floor first to you, celeste Salo of the WMO. We would like to hear from your agency's point of view what you see are the really key striking challenges right now.
Speaker 3:Thank you very much, and thank you for this question and the opportunity to share with you. Starting from the very basic thing that is, wmo provides the science for you to know where you are and where we are going together. Thanks to the WMO, we now know that 2024 is on track to be the warmest year on record. At the same time, thanks to WMO, you also know that CO2, carbon dioxide, is increasing with respect to pre-industrial times on around 51%. So we have accumulated CO2 more than ever in the history of human life on Earth and we are continuing in that direction. So we are going in the wrong directions. That's why we are concerned. So you mentioned why we are concerned. So this is because of the information we bring to this table. We know that all the indicators from ocean, sea level rise, temperatures, greenhouse gases, everything is going in the wrong direction. So that's why there are two main things we are all speaking about adaptation and mitigation. Both are and we can contribute in both directions.
Speaker 3:Mitigation actions of course, we have been addressing this a little bit from the point of view of the World Meteorological Organization. What we can provide is a tangible, robust, scientific information for you to know where we are, in terms of mitigation, to make sure that all the policies in place are going, or not, in the right direction. So that is our greenhouse gas initiative. There are many initiatives associated with this to understand better the fluxes of greenhouse gases and then, in terms of adaptation, what we can provide.
Speaker 3:Okay, early warning systems are our priority. Why? Because they save lives. Because, thanks to a better forecast, thanks to a better warning, we can protect people, and we have many, many examples of how many lives we have saved thanks to early warnings. But the problem is that we live in a very unequal world where early warnings are not for everyone, and that's why we are also concerned and we work hard to try to really diminish this gap between those that are more developed and those that are less developed, Because, in the end, those that are less developed are paying the highest price for what is happening today.
Speaker 2:Thank you very much. Well, you heard it there. We live in a very unequal world and I expect our other three panellists are going to remind us of that. We have at the end of the panel here Maria Neira of the World Health Organisation. Maria, we've heard a lot about climate change and health. Perhaps you could outline for us what you're actually seeing, what concerns you most?
Speaker 4:Thank you, Imogen, and thank you all for attending to this call. Thank you, WMO, for inviting us, for hosting us, and really a pleasure to discuss about that. Many of us we were in Baku a few days ago attending this COP29, where definitely the level of ambition and the speed at which the decisions were taken is not responding to the magnitude of the problem we are facing, particularly for somebody like me who works in public health and we are used that when we have an issue, we need to respond as soon as possible, as quickly as possible. Climate change is making us sick. If I can summarize it in one word, it's making us sick, and it's making us sick because it's increasing the possibility of having more infectious diseases waterborne diseases like cholera, obviously vector-borne diseases like dengue or malaria or other diseases transmitted by vectors is destroying sometimes the capacity of producing food, destroying the agricultural capacity, and therefore we will have massive nutritional problems. The same causes of climate change are contributing as well to air pollution and therefore we have 7 million premature deaths every year due to the air pollution, the bad air that we are breathing. Climate change is causing this massive displacement and, of course, people lose this capacity to receive good health services, Mental health.
Speaker 4:We are having more and more evidence every day about the impact of climate change on mental health and, of course, we have all the issues related to heat waves and the extreme weather events that are having a direct impact on the health of our people. And for all of that, at Baku, we're presenting what we call our report, which is health is the argument for climate action. We are convinced that health can be not only the one that will motivate us to respond to this massive crisis, but as well the one that will motivate us in a very positive way, Because, if we implemented the Paris Agreement, in fact this can be the most powerful public health treaty ever, because all the recommendations under the Paris Treaty are nothing else than public health recommendations. That's why we are so happy to have this very strong collaboration with WMO on joining forces on the preparedness, on collecting meteorological data, not only on extreme weather events, on air pollution as well, which is very, very positive. I can keep on the positive part later on, if you want. Thank you.
Speaker 2:Nada Al-Nasheef, deputy High Commissioner for Human Rights. Maria there said climate change is making us sick. Now, health is supposed to be a human right. I imagine you are seeing the effects on people's living standards and their fundamental rights.
Speaker 5:Absolutely, with many thanks to everyone for coming together. We see that climate change climate chaos, we're saying is exacerbating human rights challenges across the board. What we already face in terms of displacement, conflicts, inequalities and injustice, this idea of irreversible loss and damage. There is nothing that we can do in many areas, particularly because those who are impacted are those who are the least responsible for what is going on. The disproportionate effect on people is those in vulnerable situations, of course, which is a very big concern marginalized communities I mean indigenous people, people on the move, women and girls, people with disabilities, older persons, children, young people, and the list goes on particularly the link to conflict.
Speaker 5:All of this drives further inequalities.
Speaker 5:It exacerbates risks directly indirectly affecting the enjoyment of a wide range of human rights.
Speaker 5:So the impact on from we heard already of course, health, but also life in general housing, water, food, all of the rights that we believe are intrinsic and the concern, really more than that, is that the situation is only expected to get worse, and I think this is the prism that the response to the human rights impacts has been wholly inadequate, as we've heard so far, and I think we are risking going into tipping points from which we will never recover.
Speaker 5:As far as the resources are concerned, we are dealing with a tension deficit, but with the proliferation of humanitarian crisis, I think we are seeing compounded inequalities, and the world is still spending a lot more to subsidize fossil fuels than to support climate action. We've already heard about the lack of ambition and I think, from this vantage point, we're very clear that climate solutions have to be inclusive. They have to be gender responsive for them to really work. They have to be youth driven. We have to amplify the marginalized voices in this space, and these constituencies have to meaningfully participate in order to begin to craft. If we have an opportunity, in this little nexus that we're talking about, to be able to look at climate change and human rights coming together in a more positive, healthy dynamic, we hope UN refugees.
Speaker 2:The last time we talked, I was actually interviewing you specifically about displacement and climate change. I think you have some fairly alarming statistics around that to share with us.
Speaker 6:I do, but I'm not too sure how useful that is, because I think we already know it. I can say that there's 60,000 people being sorry, 60,000 displacements taking place per day. I can say there's 123 million people displaced by conflict at the moment. But what we need to be doing is looking beyond the statistics and say these are individuals and what is the themes? The themes are that conflicts are not being resolved, the international community are taking steps back in terms of trying to address the underlying root causes for those conflicts and, at the same time, you've got climate change but also other mega trends exacerbating those grievances and so, unless we do more in terms to looking at these root causes, you're not going to resolve them. We're going to be in much more of a serious situation. Going to resolve them. We're going to be in much more of a serious situation. But what I will do is sort of focus a little bit more on the positive and saying that there are options in terms of getting money out there, Like what we can see in the international community is there is money but there's a lack of prioritisation in terms of people. Like whether you look at the amount of money being invested in AI and we're talking hundreds of billions of dollars per year, the amount of money which flows through Geneva in terms of trading, what's being brought forward in terms of petrochemical profits, but we're losing in terms of the human dimension. So, again, we don't have the time to go through it, but at another point, we can. On the positive side, what I will say is that we can all make a difference, and that's supposed to be why we're here. So we provide unfortunately, we have to provide millions of blankets and tents per year, so we have, for instance, reduced the amount of new plastics. So all of these have been using recycled materials. This has brought about a reduction of some 20,000 tonnes of CO2 emissions.
Speaker 6:We've got 590 offices around the world. They're all trying to introduce new mechanisms. Anyone who's in the field at the moment. They shouldn't be using their own agency vehicles. We should be having ride sharing. We've got 6,000 vehicles. Why aren't they electric? We've got 6,000 generators. Why aren't they all basically being solar powered? And a lot of it has to do with upfront money. And so what I would like to ask and I'll be very upfront here there's a lot of things which you can achieve in Geneva, and this is great, but Geneva is not the field, and where I come from, I've got an objective, not any objective. I've got a responsibility to help our officers, our teams, in Chad, in Mozambique, in Sudan, in Iraq, Colombia, and so what we need to do as the next step for 2050 is not just look at Geneva, but look at how we can ensure that the good practices, the technical expertise, the drive, the ambition doesn't stay in Geneva, but gets to these locations where people need it.
Speaker 2:Thank you, Thank you very much. It's very interesting the examples you gave there of what a UN agency is also doing to reduce its own carbon footprint. I do remember when Antonio Guterres first became secretary general, he wanted to make climate change the absolute centrepiece of his time in office. Unfortunately, the world has shifted on its axis somewhat. We have, as you've all referred to, escalating conflicts. I'm wondering how well you all are finding it to work together on this issue, and maybe also how attentive member states are, since their focus is Ukraine, middle East, at the moment. Who wants to address that first?
Speaker 5:Just to say, because I have a list of things that may sound terribly bureaucratic, but they're all important in the sense of bringing us together, as you've just heard. So we are. You know, there is a UN Environment Management Group, there is a coordination mechanism, there's an issue management group. We're all sitting on these things. We are working with UNEP, with UNDP, on a lot of these issues in sustainability terms. The Secretary General has an initiative on the critical energy transition, minerals, which, again, if you're not involved, but but these are very tangible policy platforms, as well as, I think, places like the greening the blue initiative, which are trying to help us standardize our work, move together to reduce environmental footprint, at the same time making sure that we are aligning with global sustainability goals. So I think all of that we have a UN sustainability strategy, one of many that we're all working to. So I think all of this is trying to make sure that we can advance environmental and social targets within the UN system In some places, with HCR between us and refugees, a platform on disaster displacement, the migration network, of course, and with WHO.
Speaker 5:Many we've heard already about early warning. I think this is a very big imperative for all of us. So there are a lot of initiatives to try to make sure that we are in addition to, of course, common premises and common procurement guidelines in the field that are trying to help us make sure. I must say that it's a little bit. The headwinds are very strong these days. There is an anti-rights agenda, which I think we have to be very clear about, which mitigates, I think, the space that we have to be very clear about, which mitigates, I think, the space that we have for these conversations, but also some of the more affirmative action, because, as I said, there are only so many soundbites available in any one newscast and certainly the way that we cover the news and we deal with it and, more importantly, this analysis of root causes is not happening as comprehensively as it should.
Speaker 2:Celeste, I think you wanted to come in as well.
Speaker 3:Maybe I would like to add certainly. Yes, the UN Secretary General has a strong position in terms of climate action. I would say that, in translating climate action, the early warnings for all initiative is a concrete call to countries and to the UN agencies, not only the three of us that are more engaged in each of the pillars, but all of us, all of the UN system is really responding to this call and I would say that it is becoming a brand. So many countries are also taking into consideration that working on early system helps them, and this is, I would say, a result of multilateralism that I would like to highlight here in this context in particular, and also a big effort of the UN system to work together, understanding that, of course, climate is very transversal, so it's everywhere. Of course climate is very transversal, so it's everywhere, but the risk that you have something everywhere, it may be nowhere at the same time. So be attentive and work with us along these lines. Thank you very much. Final words.
Speaker 2:I think to Andrew and Maria.
Speaker 6:I think it's important that we obviously work close within the UN, but I don't think that's the key element.
Speaker 6:I think it's important that we obviously work closely within the UN, but I don't think that's the key element. I think it's more about working with the populations that are being impacted and finding out what it is that they require in terms of adaptation and resilience, what are their goals, what are their aspirations in terms of best practices as well. And if there's anything that can bring all the different elements together, it's the climate crisis, but it's not just the UN, it's academia, it's research. It's the climate crisis, but it's not just the UN, it's academia, it's research, it's the financial system, it's the private sector, it's the development actors, because we cannot be working in silos in this area, because no one can tolerate that Least of all the populations, who are expecting a much better and more substantive engagement than's ever happened before, because we also don't have the money to waste, nor the time to use COP operates on a different timeframe to people who have been displaced by conflict, and that's why this sense of urgency needs to be brought to the fore.
Speaker 2:Maria, I guess COP also operates in a different time frame to people getting cholera or malaria exacerbated by climate change.
Speaker 4:Yeah, let me maybe keep on this positive spirit of responding to the crisis that climate change represents. You know, the health sector represents 5% of the global carbon footprint 5%. If we were a country, we were on the top polluting countries. But of course we need in our hospitals, we consume a lot of energy items and supplies, so it's not a question of reducing that. But we are creating a mechanism to decarbonize the health system. So it's, of course, who, who premises and the country and all of our operations, even WHO, purchase a lot of supplies drugs, medicine and all of that. So we are doing that now with the countries with all the procurement, with Gavi, for instance, with UNICEF, with the Global Fund, all the procurement, unitaid we are looking now at how to reduce that. And, of course, with the private sector. Imagine the pharmaceutical companies. If, upstream, they reduce the plastic that will go around, one of the drugs that we use. Imagine, at the end of the chain, the tons of plastics that you can save. So we work as well with the CEO of the big pharmaceutical companies to reduce all of the plastic and on the supplies in the procurement.
Speaker 4:But this is decarbonizing the health system is possible for those countries where our health systems are having access to energy and therefore they are contributing to the carbon footprint Many countries around the world. They do not contribute to the carbon footprint around the world. They do not contribute to the carbon footprint. So for them, what we are doing the health systems is to make sure that they will have gained access to sustainable sources of energy. So we are putting solar panels in many healthcare facilities, because there is no explanation why in many countries in Africa we don't have solar panels in our healthcare facilities. Or worse, we have a solar panel to keep one vaccine and one refrigerator. So you end up having a roof on a healthcare facility with three solar panels and still not electricity on your healthcare facility.
Speaker 4:So, with UNICEF and Gavi and others, we are putting in place a system to make sure that we are gaining access to clean sources of energy in order to produce those health services without giving a carbon footprint. Every year, we buy all of us an incredible amount of supplies and procurement for medical devices and we need to do it in a more appropriate way. We have all of those recommendations and criteria and standards that are contributing to that. We have all of those recommendations and criteria and standards that are contributing to that. Many healthcare facilities are still on emergency situations and even the poor countries are using diesel generators to perform operations at the healthcare facility. You see what that means it means very expensive, not reliable, fully pollutant and making you very dependent on importing this diesel. So many solutions that are in our hands and very positive ones.
Speaker 2:So here too, there is inspiration and innovation. Those big UN agencies are seeing the effects of climate change on the poor and vulnerable, but they are also thinking carefully about their own carbon footprint and how they can reduce it while still continuing the invaluable work they do. Their examples should be, we hope, an inspiration for the rest of us, in particular those governments who think tackling climate change will cost too much, or those individual citizens could one of them be you who thinks it will all be just too much sacrifice. That brings us to the end of this edition of Inside Geneva. My thanks to Geneva 2050 today, to the WMO and to all our guests for their participation.
Speaker 2:I'm Imogen Fowkes. Thanks for listening and do join us next time. A reminder you've been listening to Inside Geneva, a Swissinfo production. You can email us on insidegeneva at swissinfoch and subscribe to us and review us wherever you get your podcasts. Check out our previous episodes how the International Red Cross unites prisoners of war with their families, or why survivors of human rights violations turn to the UN in Geneva for justice. I'm Imogen Folks. Thanks again for listening.
