From 1993 to 1996, a prominent businessman with a wife and children murdered young homosexual men he picked up in bars in and around Indianapolis, Indiana. After using them for his sexual pleasure, he strangled them to death, burned their bodies, and buried them in shallow graves. By the time he was found out, he'd murdered at least 25, and now we think maybe even more. Today, new DNA technology is allowing the authorities, who've never closed this case, to find some answers, and they need your help. He was a father, a husband, a businessman, and a killer. This is Herb Baumeister, Buried in the Backyard. Hey y'all, I'm Kris Calvert, and I'm her husband Rob Pottorf. Welcome to Hitched 2 Homicide, for better or worse, till death do us part. Welcome, welcome, welcome, and for our Thai friends, there you go. You know what, you put a lot of effort into this. Well, you know, I gotta, that's my golf claps for that. That's actually for my Thai friend, Pai Toon. Oh, hi, Pai Toon, we love you. Amazing guy. Yeah, and artist. Amazing artist, absolutely. He did work for Disney for a long time. He did Lion King and a bunch of other stuff. He's amazing, and a great friend. There you go. Yeah. Well, wherever you guys are listening, be sure to like, rate, and review. That helps other people to find us. You can join the in-laws and outlaws, and in fact, this case, the reason I am following up on this case, because this is a case that I did two years ago, but I've done even more digging on this case. Well, that's a bad word. I shouldn't say digging. I've done more investigating on this case, and the police in Indianapolis have never closed this case. They've kept it open, and we're going to talk about all the new searches that just happened last month, November 2022. Yeah. Okay. Before we get started, I want to thank the Indianapolis News, the Indianapolis Star, the Noblesville Ledger, the New York Daily News, ThoughtCo, Murderpedia, Wikipedia, The Big Book of Serial Killers, and Psychology Today. Also need to thank one of our Hitched 2 Homicide family members, Matt Goulet, for sharing the update in the in-laws and outlaws. It's what spurred me to do the case all over again. So, thank you, Matt. Yeah. You ready? Well, let's do it. Herbert Richard Baumeister is born on April 7th, 1947, in Indianapolis, Indiana, to parents Dr. Herbert E. and Elizabeth Baumeister. His dad is a doctor at Winona Memorial Hospital. It's a facility that's closed, since closed. He's the oldest of four kids. His childhood is pretty normal until he hits adolescence. Then it gets weird. Herb began to obsess over, like, vile, disgusting stuff. Like what? He developed a very dark sense of humor. Yeah. Okay. Like anything that was gross or morbid, he was totally into it. Really? And he seemed to have a really hard time telling the difference between right and wrong. So, rumors circulated about Herb urinating on his teacher's desk. What? Oh, jeez. And he even told some of the kids he wondered what urine tasted like. Oh. Yeah. Yeah, that's beyond dark. Yeah. Once he put a dead crow that he had found on the road in his teacher's desk, other kids at school, they stayed away from him because they thought he was bizarre and he had this morbid behavior. I think. In class, Herb was often disruptive. He was volatile. His teachers reached out to his parents for help. They're like, look it, something's up. Yeah. In his teens, Herb is diagnosed with schizophrenia and multiple personality disorder, which we now call DID or dissociative identity disorder. Okay. But he never got any further psychiatric treatment for his schizophrenia. So, they just identified it and they didn't do anything about it. Yeah. And you have to ask yourself why? Because Herb's dad's a doctor. Wow. Yeah. He's an anesthesiologist. Okay. Back at public high school, he's able to keep his grades up, but he's failing on the social front. And I read that at his high school, he tried really, really hard to get in with the cool kids, the football kids, apparently the football team. And football is big in Indianapolis, but he wanted to be in with the football kids and he's rejected because he's mentally ill and no one is helping him. Right. And he's just a kid at this point. So, I mean, I want to kind of be like, okay, as an adult, no excuse for his actions. Right. But he's a kid and kids need guidance and I don't think he was getting anything. Sure. He graduates high school with basically no friends, which is pretty sad. Yeah. Then in 1965, he starts school at Indiana University, but he only goes there for a semester before he drops out. Yeah. He drops out of IU and he acts strangely while he's on campus. Did they say why he dropped out? And people are put off by him. He didn't fit in. Yeah. He just didn't like it. He just didn't like it. He couldn't fit in socially. I think he's a smart kid. Yeah. I just don't think he's very socially awkward, as one might be if you're peeing on things. Yeah. He's a square peg trying to be in a round hole. Yeah. Yeah. He's going to go back to school in 1967 after his father pressures him and he's going to study anatomy because he's going to become a doctor like his dad. Now, if that's his idea or his dad's idea, who could say? Right. In November of 1968, Herb meets Juliana Julie Sater, a high school teacher and part-time IU student. Herb and Julie have a lot in common. They're both extremely conservative in their political beliefs and they both wanted to own their own businesses. These two marry in 1971 after Julie graduates from Indiana University, but six months into their wedded bliss, for an unknown reason, can't find it anywhere, Dr. Herb has son Herb committed to a mental institution where he stays for two months. Wow. In sickness and in health, right? Yeah. Yeah. And she sticks by his side. Okay. When he is out, he goes back to school at Butler University in Indianapolis. Again, Herb's major is anatomy, but Herb couldn't keep it together long enough to finish college. And instead Herb's dad, daddy gets him a job at the local newspaper, the Indianapolis Star as a gopher or as a copy boy. So he goes from wanting his son to be a doctor to getting him a job getting coffee. And there's nothing wrong with that job running reporter stories between desks and doing like other errands at a newspaper. It's just that it's a startling switch in expectations. Yeah. You know, he went from being wanting to be a doctor to being a runner. Well, and his dad wanting him to be a doctor to getting him this job. Well, and it'd be interesting to know why. And I know you couldn't find it when he was admitted. Well, I mean, if he's been diagnosed with schizophrenia, maybe he's hearing voices. Yeah. But while Herb is working there, according to his coworkers, he acts like a child. He constantly looked for positive feedback from all the C-level people at the Indianapolis Star. So here he is a copy boy, and he's looking for like the editor in chief to give him pats on the back for getting coffee kind of thing. And when he doesn't get it, he sort of acts out. Wow. And when he doesn't get all of that recognition that he's seeking at the newspaper, he leaves and takes a job at the Bureau of Motor Vehicles in the cash audit department. And even though he's not a supervisor, while he's there, he reportedly bosses everybody around. I bet that went over well. Yeah. He like apparently publicly criticized people in front of other workers, in front of other coworkers. He's acting like he's everybody's boss, almost like he's playing a part in a play that wasn't his. Because his coworkers, they felt like he was like playing this role. And the water cooler talk is that Herb's bat shit crazy, and that he's a closeted homosexual. And why might you ask would they believe that he was a gay man? Well, one year, he sends out Kristmas cards to all his coworkers, and it's him and another man dressed in holiday drag. Okay. That's called foreshadowing. Now, while he's working at the Bureau of Motor Vehicles in May of 1980, I found this old newspaper article, and I just thought this was so ironic. But May 1980, Herb and another man happened to stop on the highway because there was an injured duck on Keystone Avenue near Indiana State 37. I know exactly where this intersection is. I used to in Indianapolis. The duck had flown into the path of a car. And if you know Indianapolis, you know there are lots of ducks around. And Herb tells the newspaper that he had stopped and wanted to take the duck to a vet. This is so ironic considering what he's going to do in his own personal life. But the other man who stopped said, well, it's okay. I work at the Indianapolis Zoo. Let me take the duck. Okay. Then Herb found out that the guy didn't work at the zoo at all because he called the zoo and asked for him. And what he finds out is that this man had taken the duck home, finished it off, plucked it, dressed it, and had it cooling in his freezer. Yeah. I was going to say he didn't take that to the zoo. He was going to eat this duck. Yeah. Yeah. Dinner. And Herb is mad. He's like really pissed off. And he calls the Department of Natural Resources Law Enforcement Division, and he reports this guy. And they made this guy bring in the duck. The duck that he had picked up, murdered, plucked, and frozen. Yeah. I mean, but it was basically roadkill. It was. Well, he was alive. I know, but he wasn't going to survive. Well, we don't know that because he never made it to a vet, which is what Herb wanted, which is so ironic. So was it must have been not duck season, I guess. Well, it's just the mallards that live in the area. Yeah. I mean, I guess they fly south for the winter, but they're back. And especially on the north side of town, they're everywhere. And when the press questions Herb about the duck, he said he was satisfied, quote, as long as that man doesn't get to eat the duck, end quote. Okay. And I just wanted to give this little snippet of his other life because he's very charitable. Right. And on the outside, he's very loving and caring. And he likes ducks. But there's a whole other side to Herb. Nine years into their marriage, Herb and Julie have three babies, a daughter, Marie, in 1979, a son, Eric, in 1981, and another daughter, Emily, in 1984. And he's still working for the DMV. Also in 1984, despite his horrible relationship with his co-workers, Herb gets a promotion because he's thought of as an intelligent go-getter, a weird, bizarre, intelligent go-getter. He's just obnoxious. Yeah. He's weird. Yeah. He's just, he ain't right. Right. Things were going so well that Julie quit her job to stay at home with the And then within a year of his promotion, he is fired. Want to know why? Does it involve ducks? No, but it involves bodily fluids. He urinated on a letter addressed to the then Indiana governor, Robert Orr. And when it's known that Herb's the guy who did this, well, then he's pegged for the urinating incident that happened months earlier on his manager's desk. This guy really likes, he's like a dog. Yeah, exactly. Marking his territory. He's peeing everywhere. Yeah. Herb stays at home with the kids and Julie goes back to work while he looks for gainful employment. And while he's home with the kids, he's a loving father. I mean, he really is. He's, which is good. He goes to every soccer game. He goes to every school play. He's always there for his kids. So other than his peeing, proclivity to peeing everywhere, he's kind of like a normal dad kind of thing. I mean, he's weird, but he's so weird. Yeah. But nothing like crazy yet. Well, it depends on your definition of crazy, honey. That's all I can say. All right. I'm just trying to get a picture of this guy in my head. Yeah. Well, I'll post a picture of him for sure. But while he's home and his wife is working, he's drinking heavily and he's starting to cruise gay bars in Indianapolis where he calls himself Brian Smart. So is that like a personality in his head? You know? Yeah. His alter ego. Well, if he has schizophrenia and DID, maybe Brian Smart was somebody that he didn't really know about, even though Brian Smart is the guy. Right. In 1985, after getting a slap on the wrist for drunk driving and hit and run, he's then charged with stealing a friend's car. All of these things get dismissed. Really? All of it dismissed. How'd they I don't know if daddy made it go away or what. But he finally lands a job after bouncing around from place to place. He lands this job at a thrift store. And this is his light bulb moment. This is his epiphany. The light bulb goes off and Herb realizes this is my future. Herb sees the potential of the business, this whole business sector, and he spends the next three years learning the thrift store business inside and out. And when his father dies in 1988, Herb borrows $4,000 from his mother and opens a store called Save-A-Lot. I've heard of that. Yeah. Yeah. There were save-a-lots. There were a lot of save-a-lots. I mean, we're in Kentucky. So that was Herb. That's Herb. Wow. Yeah. They filled it with gently used quality clothing, furniture, and other used items. And Herb and Julie decide to give a percentage of their profits to the Children's Bureau of Indianapolis. Nice. Yeah. I mean, he seems like on the outside. I know. That's why this is all confusing. A great guy. Yeah. He was deeply devoted to his three kids. And like I said before, he's guy who never missed a school play or a soccer game. Right. In three years, this business is a-boomin'. Business is a-boomin'. And suddenly, Herb and Julie are wealthy. But in the last few years, the stress of the business begins to take its toll and working together became almost unbearable for Julie because Herb is a bossy asshole. So they're making a ton of money, but he's a dick. Yeah. He treats her like she's an employee. He actually treats her worse than you would treat an employee because she can't sue him. Sure. And honestly, they don't have a marriage in the biblical sense because later on, Julie is going to say that in all of the years they are married, they had sex nine times. What? Nine times. Wow. Nine times, three kids. Wow. Wow. Yeah. Hey, all you husbands out there, count yourselves lucky. Yeah. She's definitely fertile. Nine times. Yes, yes, she is. Now, still, they're making money and these stores on the inside are perfect. They're like OCD perfect. In 1991, the Baumeisters moved to their dream home, an 18-acre horse ranch called Fox Hollow Farms. It's in the upscale Westfield area, just north of Indianapolis in Hamilton County. And the large, beautiful, million-dollar mansion had all the bells and whistles, including a stable for horses and an indoor pool because it does get cold in Indianapolis. And remarkably, Herb had become a well-respected, successful family man who gave to charities. And that's what it looks like on the outside. And it's like, oh, what a beautiful family. Right, right. He and his wife have built this together. They love each other so much. It's like a family to be envious of. Okay. And behind the scenes, that's not what it is. It's chaos. Yeah. And like I said before, the Save-A-Lot stores are perfect inside. Remember I said OCD perfect? Right. But this is not the case inside their million-dollar house. The home is dusty and dirty, and the grounds are like overgrown. And the only thing Herb keeps clean in this house is the indoor pool house. It's perfect. He keeps the wet bar fully stocked and even decorates the whole area himself. He adds this slew of mannequins all dressed up for the pool party. Whoa, whoa. So he has fake friends at his pool party. On a scale of one to 10 creepy, that's about a 27. So can you imagine going over there and like, hey, let's go for a swim. Wow. Why are there all these mannequins from Macy's staring me in the face? All dressed up in tropical attire too. Reminds me of that Geico commercial where the guy goes upstairs and the little gecko turns on the light and there's all these mannequins sitting around in the attic. The guy that's buying the house goes, no. He walks out. It's creepy. I mean, it's creepy. At this point, even Julie takes advantage of any opportunity to be away from her husband. Can you blame her? So when the summer hits in 1993, she takes the three kids and heads to Lake Wawasee, where Herb's mom has a house. May 28th, 1993, Johnny Bear, a 20-year-old man, was last seen on his way to his 3 to 11 shift at a Carmel, Indiana McDonald's. Johnny grew up on the south side of Indianapolis. When he drove away in his blue Dodge Aspen, he told his mother, quote, I'll see you when I get off work, end quote. Johnny's mother filed a missing persons report and his car was found on June 9th with eight parking tickets under the windshield. It was parked at 9th and St. Clair in downtown Indianapolis. His wallet and his toothbrush were in the car. Really? Yes. Wow. July 19th, 1993, Jeff Jones, 31, was last seen at the Salvation Army Rehab Center. July 31st, 1993, Richard Hamilton, age 20, is last seen leaving his apartment at 2 a.m. to get cigarettes. August 9th, 1993, Alan Livingston, age 28, is last seen getting into a white car. And that very same night, Manuel Resendez, age 31, is last seen at a nightclub with his friends. When they are ready to leave the bar, they can't find him. Now, the police are baffled because these men are just disappearing and they don't make the connection between these disappearances. The one thing that these young men all have in common is that they are either gay or they are closeted gay. So the gay scene picks up on this fact, but the police do not. Right. Then the summer of 1994 comes and it starts to happen all over again. June 6th, 1994, Alan Broussard, age 28, is last seen leaving the gay bar Brothers, a place he frequents. This time, even though the police are saying, hey, he's a grown man and if he wants to disappear, he can. I mean, they have no body, no crime, right? Nobody, no crime. There's nothing to speak of. But Alan's mom isn't having any of that. And she goes out and she hires a man named Virgil Vandegriff, and he's going to start looking into the disappearance of her son. He was a retired cop who had started a P.I. agency. Gotcha. July 22nd, 1994, Roger Alan Goodlett, age 33. He spends the day with his mom, then waves goodbye, catching the bus to head into downtown Indianapolis. His mother reports him missing the next day. And again, the police say he's not missing until he's been gone for 30 days. Nobody, no crime. They have no reason to believe that something bad has happened to him. Right, right. Alan goes by his middle name. Roger Alan Goodlett goes by his middle name, Alan. And Alan Goodlett's mama gets together with Virgil Vandegriff and they start posting flyers. And then lo and behold, a man named Rick Rigney comes forward to say, hey, I'm Alan's friend. And I saw him get into a car. He was hitchhiking in downtown Indianapolis. And I watched him get picked up and they were heading north. And Ricky says he waved to the person driving the car and then got in. That was the last time anyone saw Alan Goodlett. Days after Alan disappears, another man goes missing, Stephen Hale, age 26. He vanishes from outside Indianapolis Central Library. And this is a known gay cruising area at the time. Now, the number is eight men, eight men with ties to the gay community. And I used to live in Indianapolis, in fact, very near the location of all of this from 1990 to 1993. On the north side of town in Indianapolis is a hub for the gay life in the Midwest. At least it was back then, because if you're gay and living in rural Indiana among the corn and soybean fields, Indianapolis is where you wanted to be. There were 12 gay bars in Indianapolis back then and three LGBTQ plus newspapers. So it really was a gay friendly city. And this is the 90s, right? Right, right. These LGBTQ plus newspapers took notice and they started running stories, even though the mainstream Indianapolis star was not. They were just ignoring it. They were ignoring it. And all these flyers started going up in all the bars and phones started ringing. And Detective Mary Wilson of the Indianapolis police had been following the disappearances. And even though she had zero leads, Mary went to the FBI behavioral sciences department for help. And this is where she found Stephen McVeigh, an FBI profiler who said, this is a white guy, mid 40s, probably bisexual or closeted gay with an above average IQ. Nailed it. But here's the problem. They have nothing but the disappearances of the men that link them together. Until August 1994, a friend of Alan Goodlett is at a gay bar in Indianapolis and he sees this guy staring at one of the flyers about Alan. And this man who identifies himself with two different names, he's protecting his own identity with the cops. He calls himself Mark Goodyear and he also calls himself Tony Harris. So Tony calls Detective Wilson and says, hey, all these reports, you're saying you're looking for someone odd. And this guy looked odd. I'm paraphrasing, but that's what he said. If you look at odd in the dictionary, there's there's herb. Yeah. So Tony said the odd man looked kind of familiar to the gay bar scene. He had seen him before. And when he'd come into the bars, he always looked uncomfortable and would keep to himself. So odd guy is reading this flyer and Tony walks up to him and starts chatting him up. And Tony gives an interview where he says that this odd guy was acting like he was concerned over all the missing men, but he felt like something was off. He said it did not feel genuine. So this really piques Tony's curiosity. And weird guy calls himself Brian Smart. Now, one thing leads to another. And Brian Smart asks Tony if he wants to get out of the bar and come with him to his boss's house. I've got my air quotes up just north of the city. He says, I'm house sitting while my boss is away. And Tony said that it was a very long drive into the suburban woods. But later, he's not going to be able to say exactly where he went, which is a problem. So I don't know if he'd had a little something to drink. He was at the bar. Or if he was drugged. Or if he, yeah. Or maybe he had been doing drugs or maybe he had been drugged. Yeah. But Tony later tells Detective Wilson that the house was big, but it was dirty and dusty. And in the pool house, there were dozens of mannequins posed in different positions. And when Tony asks Brian Smart, why the F? Do you have these creepy ass mannequins? Herb tells him, quote, the owner does not like to be alone, end quote. Wow. So he's kind of telling the story, but he's also like telling on himself. Yeah. He doesn't like to be alone. He likes talking third person using another ID. Yeah. Yeah. Brian Smart. Yeah. Tony said that they got into the pool and Brian started to drop hints about what he's into sexually. He placed a rubber hose around Tony's neck. Now, Tony later recounts that this wasn't a threat. It was a question like, are you into this? And Brian Smart says he likes to be strangled. So he asks Tony if he will choke him while he polishes his rifle or polishes his trophy or tugs on the timber or however you want to say it. Right. And Tony obliges him. And when Brian gets close to passing out, Tony stops. And he later says that Brian fell into the water and then came up and looked directly at him and said to him that the rush that he gets from this sexual asphyxia, it's actually called erotic asphyxiation or breath play. That's what he's into. He loves the rush. Wow. And people who are into breath play say it can heighten sexual arousal and make sex more intense. This is because oxygen is deprived to the brain. Now, he wants to do this to Tony, who's reluctant, but agrees. And he later says that this man had such a way with his hands. He could bring on a kind of ecstasy that he had never experienced before. And he stops Brian. Tony stops Brian before it goes too far. He doesn't let completely choke him out. Right. And Brian Smart tells Tony that seeing the bulge in his eyes as he's about to pass out, that's what really turns him on. Wow. He explains that the lips swell up and discolor. He says that this is his jam. This is his thing. And Brian explains that he's, quote, familiar with death, end quote, and that he never confessed to murder. But he said there had been, quote, accidents and bad nights when things had gotten out of control, end quote. Well, that should have been a clue. So he's kind of confessing. And Tony knows at this point, this dude's killed somebody. Yeah. I mean, that's what he's thinking. This guy's killed somebody. The FBI has stated that an asphyxiation addict will increase the period of strangulation with each encounter to get a bigger high. And at some point, they end up killing. Killing others. Yeah. So Tony tells his new friend, Brian, you're hurting people. You've got to stop. Right. And when Tony says he's going to the authorities, Brian says, quote, no one will ever believe someone like you, end quote. So Tony contacts the private investigator on all the flyers and says, here's what happened to me. And this is the break that Detective Wilson's been waiting for. Someone who narrowly escapes. And the police try to find the place where Tony thinks they were. But this house is way off the road. Right. And if you know Indiana, it's pretty flat. And every wooded area looks like the next flat wooded area. Yeah. And the investigation leads nowhere. Yeah. I'm surprised that Herb even let him go. Especially after he said, you know, I'm going to report you to the, you think that he would have just taken care of business right there. Yeah. Well, you'd think. But maybe, maybe Tony was bigger and stronger than Herb. That's true. Because Herb's not, he's not hitting the gym. I've seen the photos. Not hitting the gym in any way, shape or form. Yeah. Yeah. But this investigation goes no place until the fall of 1994 when Herb Baumeister's 13-year-old son goes for a walk in the woods behind his house. Okay. Now they have like 18 acres attached to this place. Right. And this boy walks out the back door of the house and calls for his mother. And when Julie goes outside, she finds her son with a human skull hanging from a stick. Whoa. Yeah. Just been out exploring the property, mom. Look what I found. What I found. It's a head. Wow. Wow. What do you think a normal person would do at this point? Scream and run back in the house and call the police. Call the police. Yeah. Yeah. But Julie does not call the police. Instead, she waits for her husband to come home. What? Now remember, he's very domineering over her, over Julie. She's a tad bit afraid of him. So she waits. And when Herb comes home, she not only shows him the skull, she takes him to the other bones that the boys have found. Oh, wow. Because he just brought the skull to the house. Sure. But there were other bones there too. Right. And at this point, you'd think to yourself, this is it. Yeah. This is it. Nope. Herb tells Julie that they are old bones from his father's medical days. So what he tells her is, remember how the big skeletons used to hang in doctor's offices? I mean, because his dad was older. Right. That's what he's telling his wife it is. He found it in their garage and threw it away with a bunch of other stuff in the woods where he burnt it all. And Julie doesn't bat an eye. She doesn't question him. He promises to clean it all up. And when Julie goes out to check a week later, it's all gone. All gone. Meanwhile, the police are still trying to identify the man who choked out Tony Harris. Spring 1995, April 1st, Michael Kehern, age 46, is reported missing when he doesn't show up for work. August 1995, Jerry Williams Comer, 35, disappears. His car is later recovered from a shopping mall. Jerry is the 10th man in three years. Then one year after Tony Harris has his encounter with Brian Smart, Tony spots him again in a downtown gay bar. Tony is afraid that Brian's going to see him and identify him. Right. And he says, you see that weird guy over there? I need you to follow him out into the parking lot. And whatever he's driving, you write down his license plate. There you go. So his friend did exactly that. Then Tony Harris goes to the police and the plates come back registered to local upstanding charitable businessman Herbert Baumeister. There you go. For three months they watch her. Then in November of 1995, they go to his Save-A-Lot store. And Detective Wilson later says that her first impression of Herb was that he was a very strange man. He colored his hair. It was very noticeable that he had colored his hair and he was really, really nervous. And I would be too if the police were knocking on my door and I'd killed a bunch of people. Yeah, exactly. You've murdered a bunch of people and the police are at your door. I guess I would be a little nervous. Yeah, but don't forget, no body, no crime. Yeah, but still, he knows. No body, no crime. And he does know. And he's nervous. And Herb denies being in any of the bars until they tell him, dude, we've been following you back and forth from there for the last three months. And Herb is angry and says, quote, nobody in my family knows I go to gay bars, end quote. He's found out. Yeah, he's been found out. They ask for permission to search Fox Hollow Farm. And Herb says, no. So without proof that Herb has anything to do with the missing men, Detective Wilson goes to Julie. And they sit Julie down without Herb and they tell her that they are investigating Herb for homosexual homicide, to which she replies, and I kid you not, quote, what is that? Wow, Julie. Pretty self-explanatory if you know what homosexual is and you know what homicide is. Yeah. Bless her heart. She's in the dark. She tells him over the next few weeks as Herb is being belligerent to her at home to stop harassing Herb, quote, he's not a killer. He doesn't even spank the kids. He couldn't possibly kill someone, end quote. It's kind of like those neighbors that say, I had no idea that he was a serial killer. I have said that about some of our neighbors every time I always say he's got a body in the freezer. Stop it. But Julie tells the police, look it, get yourself a search warrant because Herb's kind of schooled her and said all they have is circumstantial evidence. They can't get a warrant on that. There's no probable cause. All they have is the word of a man who won't even give his real name and couldn't find the house and farm after his encounter. Now, on the outside, Herb and Julie are showing a united front, but underneath, trouble's a-brewing. It's bubbling up. Herb is moved out of the house. They even spent Kristmas of 1995 apart. Oh, wow. The save-a-lot business was in dire straits and they're on the brink of foreclosure. Wow. January 1996, Julie files for divorce and Bill Windling, Julie's attorney, says that Julie doesn't understand what's going on. God love her heart. She's in denial, but she does tell Bill in confidence about the skull her son Eric found on the property. Now, if you're talking to your divorce attorney and you want to do the best for your client and she's told you that body parts were found on the property. That's pretty good ammunition. That's a lot of ammo. Yeah. So, Bill Windling calls Detective Wilson and says, quote, don't give up on this lead. Houston, we have a problem. Yeah, he doesn't come out and say, Herb, you know, they found a skull. He just says, quote, do not give up on this lead. Because there is, you know, the client privilege. That's right. He's not going to break client confidentiality, but he wasn't going to let it go either. Right. June 1996, Herb closes the store impulsively, picks up their son for an impromptu vacation to the place where Julie has always taken the kids for summer and spring break, Herb's parents' place on Lake Wawasee. And Julie calls her attorney, Bill, and she's like, she's worried. He's like picked up a kid and taken him. Right. And she finally thinks that Herb is unstable. Like after years. I was going to say it only took this long. And years. She's been treated like dirt. They've only had sex nine times to get the mannequins and the skull and the bones. And finally, she thinks this is hinky. Yeah. Yeah. Julie tells her attorney she'll take them up on their offer to chat about Herb with the police. And meanwhile, police show up at the lake and request to take custody of their son. They're like, hey, hi, we're not here for you, but we are taking this young man with us. Oh, wow. So police collect their son and Herb lets him go. He's thinking that all of this is a part of Julie's divorce show. Right. He's thinking she's doing this for show. This is all about the divorce. Yep. When the police come to Fox Hollow and Bill tells them about the skull Julie's son found and the police ask for permission to search the property. Julie and her attorney walk out behind the house and the first thing they find as they're walking are human bones. Oh, wow. I thought he got rid of all of them. There's no way. There's so many bodies buried back there. OK. All right. Bill looks down at the site where the officer says this and realizes he's standing on the bottom jaw and teeth of someone. This is her attorney and the police. They walk out onto the property together. Yeah. Yeah. A backhoe is brought in and with every dig, they find even more human remains. Good grief. Forensic anthropologist Stephen Narocki divides the backyard into two areas and large intact bones are found on the west side of the property by a small stream and smaller fragments are found right behind the house because they had been burned into tiny pieces. Wow. At the time, all in all, there were 5,000 tiny fragments that had to be pieced together and analyzed. When they're discovered, what they found was that they had seven left-hand first metacarpals, so they knew that at the very least, there were seven bodies right there. Right. Right. They also found handcuffs and Miller genuine draft cans because that is Herb's favorite beer. Wow. When they start searching the house, they walk into the pool house and it is exactly the way Tony had described it. And what they found out was that Tony didn't realize that there was a hidden video camera in the pool. But when police start looking, there are no tapes. So they they they're going through this pool house and they're like, hey, there's more of the mannequins here, dude. They're hidden cameras. Right. But there was there were no tapes inside. Okay. Now, at this point, Herb's at the lake. And because there are these human remains, Detective Mary Wilson's case that she's worked on for the past few years is now turned over to the Hamilton County Sheriff's Department where they wait an entire day before they look over Mary Wilson's work. Really? Yeah. Why? I have no idea. You know, I don't want to I don't want to say it was because she was a woman, but they just didn't look at it. Yeah. By the end of June, Julie and the kids are prisoners in their own home while authorities are digging up the backyard. And meanwhile, Herb's disappeared. And Julie hasn't heard anything from him. He's hiding her hair, hiding her hair, not a word. On June 30th, Herb calls his brother. He's on his way to Canada and he needs money. And a couple of days later, a Canadian police officer finds him asleep in his car under an overpass. And in the backseat, the police officer sees luggage and videotape. Oh, yeah. Oh, man. Herb, you burnt bodies, but you didn't burn your tape. Yeah. Well, he's taking him with him because he wants to watch him, I'm assuming. Wow. Wow. On July 3rd at Lake Huron in Canada, Herb uses a 357 Magnum to commit suicide by shooting himself in the forehead. He leaves behind a three page note that mentions the failing marriage and the bankruptcy of all of his save a lot stores. He apologizes. This is crazy. He apologizes for messing up the park with his suicide. He never mentions the dead men, the bones in the backyard. He talks about other places he wanted to kill himself, but didn't. His last words in the note are, quote, I'm going to eat a peanut butter sandwich and go to sleep. End quote. Wow. Now, when police are putting it all together, they realize that when they line up the dates that the men go missing, Julie is always away with the kids. Really? All of the disappearances happen over the kids' spring break. Wow. Or the summer months when they're at the lake. He's all alone. Yeah. We explained why there was, you know, space in between the times that he was killing. And why he could bring a man back to the house, in the pool house, and he was, there was nobody there except for him. Now, the gay community, as you might imagine, is angry because the newspaper and mainstream media depict Herb as a businessman who killed, quote, men on fringes of society. End quote. Yeah. And they're angry because these men should have been treated with more respect, and they should have. Yeah. And not to mention when it comes out that two men, Michael Kehern and Jerry Williams Comer, went missing after Herb and Julie's son found the skull. The skull that Julie never reported because Herb told her it wasn't real. Right. So, she's got to live with that. Right. She didn't do anything with that, and two other men disappeared. Right. Herb left the bodies so casually close to the areas where his kids were playing. He was arrogantly confident, and according to the FBI, this is indicative of someone that's had a long string of successful murders. Yeah. If you get away with it for a long, long time, you're so confident. Well, too, in the 90s, you know, mainstream media, they sort of ignored all of that, you know, as far as the gay community. Yeah. Oh, yeah. They gave them nothing. Yeah. So, he was pretty confident that, hey, I can do whatever I want because it's not going to be reported. Right. And I'm a fine, upstanding businessman that gives to charity. And, you know, if you go to the police, they're not going to believe you because you're a gay man. Wow. Right. Because he even said that. He even said that. He said that to Tony. Yeah. But that's not where this story ends. From 1980 to 1990, young men with ties to the gay community in Indianapolis began to disappear and then turn up weeks or months later in isolated locations all along I-70, the interstate that connects Columbus, Ohio and Indianapolis. Right. There were 12 men found. All were strangled to death. And what did Herb do? He strangled men while having sex. Right. He would dump the bodies nude or semi-nude in a river. And, in fact, one eyewitness said that it was Herb who left a bar in 1983 with Michael Riley, who was later found dead among all of those people. And I-70 between Columbus, Ohio and Indianapolis is a road that he used all the time. Yeah. Okay. So, Herb and Julie moved to Fox Hollow in 1992. And one year after that, the I-70 murders stopped. And the very same year, the Indianapolis men found in Herb's backyard go missing. And Julie has since said that Herb made over 100 trips on that interstate doing business. And police have now said that they believe Herb killed at least nine of the men who were along this road in the 1980s. Man. Wow. Julie eventually sold the estate at Fox Hollow at a third of its$2.3 million asking price. They sold it for $987,000. Okay. And soon after, the new owners, Vicki and Rob Graves, noticed that strange things were happening. And lots of people think that this area is haunted. Really? And ghost hunters have spent loads of time on the property and they've seen shadow figures of men walking in the woods. There are documentaries and movies made about what happened at Fox Hollow. There's a list of them and I will put it up in the In-Laws and Out-Laws. In 2019, Noah Herron, who owned Urban Vine Winery and Brewery in Westfield, bought eight acres of the property just north of Herb's former estate. He wanted to build a home for his family there. And by this time, authorities think that there are remains of at least 16 people. See, the number just keeps going up. Yeah. And then just last month in November of 2022, the Hamilton County Sheriff's Office began another search on the grounds of Fox Hollow. The Westfield coroner is looking for DNA from descendants of possible victims to identify more remains that have been found. Wow. Now, the home is still owned by Rob Graves and just recently, cadaver dogs from Indy Canine Search and Rescue spent an entire day going through the woods behind the former home of Herb Baumeister. There were 11 dogs working and the dogs have alerted to several new spots on the property. Gee whiz. This was last month. Wow. Now, before they released their new findings, to date there have been more than 10,000 bones and bone fragments found on the property of Fox Hollow. Good grief. And the Hamilton County Chief Coroner, Jeff Jellison, has asked that family members of young men who went missing from the mid-1980s to the mid-1990s submit a DNA sample to them. It's a simple cheek swab. Because now, 26 years later, DNA is such, it's so much more. It's so sophisticated. So if you think you are a relative of a missing person who is possibly connected to this case, I'm going to give you a phone number. Please contact the Hamilton County Coroner's Office at 317-770-4415. 317-770-4415. They're trying to connect all of these remains to the family members. Yep. But that is the story of Herb Baumeister. I'm telling you, buried in the backyard. Scary. That's all I have to say about that. Hey, Hitched 2 Homicide listeners. This is Kris Calvert. I love doing research and writing about real crimes, but I also love writing about fictional people who commit horrible atrocities. When you're ready to take a break from true crime for fictional crime, go to Kriscalvert.com, where you'll find all my books, including some free ones to get you started. Jane Doe is one badass chick who quietly hunts terrorists in the United States. The Sex and Lies books are all FBI and CIA cases with a little romance on the side. And coming summer 2022, book 10 in the series Sex, Lies, and Rock and Roll releases. You can find all of these books everywhere, and if you like to listen instead of read, you can find them all on Audible. So go grab a free book or take a listen. I love all the characters I've written. I've given them pain, ruined their lives, make them suffer, and maybe even throw in a heroic death. Or maybe they live to fight another day. Check it all out at Kriscalvert.com, and thanks for being a listener of Hitched to Homicide. Wow. Herb was a busy boy. Yeah. A sick busy boy. I mean, can you? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it'd be, well, it wouldn't be very, it'd be a little crass Halloween costume, but you could go as Herb and then carry a couple of mannequins with you around. That's even too creepy for Halloween. Oh, I know. It's true. But if you're into true crime, we're a little different anyway. That's true. That's true. What can I say? All right. Well, let's lighten it up just a little bit with something completely ridiculous and a little bless your heart. All right. We have a special thanks for someone that submitted this on our In-Laws and Out-Laws, Kathy Boyd Black. Thank you, Kathy. Thanks, Kathy. Yeah. For the bless your heart. She knew somebody's heart needed to be blessed. Yeah. She saved me some time this week. We have a list of them, honey. I know. I know. All right. So here we are. A man wearing an ankle monitor robs bank and uses birth certificate to write demand note. Really, dude? That's pretty low down on the list. Yeah. A man in Springfield, Missouri attempted to rob a bank using his own birth certificate for the demand note. Really? You couldn't find anything else to write on? Seriously? Just grab a napkin or some toilet paper. Yeah. Anything. Not only did he give away information about his own identity, but the suspect was also wearing an ankle monitor at the time from a previous robbery. So they're tracking him and he's handing over not only who he is, but the time of day he was born and who his parents are. Well, and once again, all it was missing was the spring loaded pointing fingers at his face. Michael C. Lloyd, 30, could be sentenced up to 20 years in federal prison without parole for his crimes. Here's how Lloyd was finally caught by law enforcement and how much money he stole. Now, he was not exactly in disguise. Lloyd has tattoos on both arms, which were clearly visible during the robbery. The writing on the note was written in pink ink, according to the criminal complaint filed in the U.S. District Court for the Western District of Missouri. Ten minutes later, police got a tip off from someone who claimed to be Lloyd's girlfriend's roommate. When police arrested Lloyd... This is so bizarre. When police arrested Lloyd, he immediately confessed to the robbery. According to law enforcement, Lloyd said he robbed the bank to prove a point to his girlfriend. He managed to get away with $754. That was not worth $754. Which he started throwing out the window of his truck in a panic as he drove away from the bank after seeing police cruisers heading toward the location. He also threw his ID birth certificate out the window. So there you go. Drugs. I'm gonna say there were drugs involved in this. You think? I think there were drugs. Well, we'll post a picture and you'll see his face. Okay. Now, a picture's already been posted in the In-Laws and Out-Laws. That's right. So go ahead and take a look at his face. Yeah, if you haven't seen it, it's pretty good. Oh my gosh. Well, bless his heart. Well, if you know somebody whose heart needs to be blessed, all you have to do, or your heart needs to be blessed, hopefully not like this, you can go to Hitched2Homicide.com. There's a pull-down menu. You can also suggest a case. We'd love to have you do that. That's my amazing husband out there. And that's my beautiful bride. Join us next time on Hitched 2 Homicide.