The guys live brainstorm ideas on what they can do now to adapt to the dramatic changes we face and be better prepared for when the economy begins to reengage. They cover a wide range of topics, from pricing and products, to business practices, to marketing and social media. All while tossing back a few of their favorite drinks. Michael muddles some creative sugar with some business bitters to craft an Old Fashioned. Dan whips up a martini of brainstorming goodness. And Carl slams done some good old marketing moonshine. Informative and entertaining, grab your favorite beverage and press "play". And don't forget to subscribe!
Your Hosts:
Michael Mowbray, M. Photog., Cr., owns Beautiful Portraits by Michael in DeForest (Madison) Wisconsin and also owns MoLight. Learn more at:
www.beautifulportraits.com
www.gomolight.com
Dan Frievalt, M.Photog., M. Artist, Cr., owns Frievalt Photography in DePere (Green Bay) Wisconsin and also runs Seniors Unlocked. Learn more at
www.frievaltphotography.com
store.seniorsunlocked.com
Carl Caylor, M. Photog., Cr., ASP-Fellow, Kodak Alaris Mentor, owns Photo Images by Carl in Iron Mountain, Michigan and also runs Carl's Coaching Corner. Learn more at:
www.photoimagesbycarl.net
www.ccphotocoach.com
MoLight offers more than 20 different MoLight -brand softboxes and modifiers.
The guys live brainstorm ideas on what they can do now to adapt to the dramatic changes we face and be better prepared for when the economy begins to reengage. They cover a wide range of topics, from pricing and products, to business practices, to marketing and social media. All while tossing back a few of their favorite drinks. Michael muddles some creative sugar with some business bitters to craft an Old Fashioned. Dan whips up a martini of brainstorming goodness. And Carl slams done some good old marketing moonshine. Informative and entertaining, grab your favorite beverage and press "play". And don't forget to subscribe!
Your Hosts:
Michael Mowbray, M. Photog., Cr., owns Beautiful Portraits by Michael in DeForest (Madison) Wisconsin and also owns MoLight. Learn more at:
www.beautifulportraits.com
www.gomolight.com
Dan Frievalt, M.Photog., M. Artist, Cr., owns Frievalt Photography in DePere (Green Bay) Wisconsin and also runs Seniors Unlocked. Learn more at
www.frievaltphotography.com
store.seniorsunlocked.com
Carl Caylor, M. Photog., Cr., ASP-Fellow, Kodak Alaris Mentor, owns Photo Images by Carl in Iron Mountain, Michigan and also runs Carl's Coaching Corner. Learn more at:
www.photoimagesbycarl.net
www.ccphotocoach.com
MoLight offers more than 20 different MoLight -brand softboxes and modifiers.
Recorded live from the Mt. Delta sky club at O'Hare Airport. Hey, you mean all this liquor is free? It's the follow happy hour podcast. Hey, and welcome everybody. I'm your photo happy hour bartender Michael Mowbray I'm modeling some creative sugar with some business bitters to create an old fashioned cocktail of photography goodness. Joining me behind the bar are Dan Frievalt. And Carl Caylor.
Dan Frievalt :What's up, everyone? Hey, folks, how's it going? I'm mixing up a martini of goodness, I guess. I think I already made that drink once before, but let's make well, y'all.
Michael Mowbray :It's good to go back. Well, were they still?
Carl Caylor :Are they still still better than the well the walls is kind of watered down.
Michael Mowbray :True. True. So what are we talking about? What actually What are you drinking? Carl? What are what are you mixing up back to Wisconsin? Back to whiskey again.
Carl Caylor :I was in the in while we're gone. Since I've seen you. I switched to moonshine, and then flip back to this because
Michael Mowbray :I was out of the Tennessee, I switched to moonshine, I went to the hardware store
Carl Caylor :a lot of that stuff from Tennessee, but now I found out we can order that stuff from them directly here to so might have to get some of that
Michael Mowbray :I had to quit drinking hand sanitizer because I need that for you know, germ protections, right priorities. So, every week we typically have a topic and our topic this week is what are we doing to kind of plan for whatever happens when we get through all this? What are we doing for our business? What are we changing or shifting or what kind of ideas do we have brainstormed? What are you guys working on? I heard
Carl Caylor :that if in this crisis, the chronic crisis in case people are listening to this years from now, when this is hopefully all gone that if you have a wish Key in both hands. You can't possibly touch your face and it's good for the Coronavirus. So I was listening to that and figuring I'm gonna abide by it. So I just
Michael Mowbray :damn I just touch my face.
Carl Caylor :I saw that you have some whiskey
Michael Mowbray :drink you need if you need a drink. Did you know Did you know what whiskey means? where it came from? It's Gaelic for I can't remember how they pronounce it. But basically it sounds a little bit like whiskey, but it means water of life. Yes. Irish knew.
Carl Caylor :Yeah, they knew. They knew
Unknown Speaker :yes lies before. So
Michael Mowbray :anyway, every week we do a topic of sorts. And this week, we're just going to be talking about some of the stuff that we're brainstorming for our businesses. What we're going to be trying to do when we get out of this, try to be ready for whatever happens whenever it happens. So what do you guys working on? What do you What are you thinking about right now?
Dan Frievalt :Well, what I've started doing is doing session reservations. Which are actually started before this whole pandemic broke out. And it's basically because I was getting calls way back in January for senior to book for the summer already, which normally doesn't happen. And I don't like to actually book sessions, I find events because I'm not shooting until June. And until I go to some of the big conventions, I don't want to put out pricing and different ideas because I'm going to conventions and I'm brainstorming with my peers and listening to speakers and coming up with possibly new ideas and way to refine things. So I just put if you book your session, put $100 down, you'll save your spot, and we'll get you the rest of the information later. And I've carried that over now with everything that's happening, but I've added value instead of discounting my sessions. So I've added you can get a free montage, montage session, and a free family session. And those are all things we'll decide once everything once we get All clear on how we're going to handle everything but at least it reserves the spot and they are on with me and don't book with someone else.
Carl Caylor :Yeah, I'm doing something similar. Actually. I was working on it this morning. And it's good that this is kind of a brainstorm things. I'm not completely in concrete as to how I'm gonna do it yet. But I started laying out a new mailer. And I was hoping to be able to get the names from the schools again, or at least the schools that had been getting and send out something kind of like what Dan was talking about, but schedule your session or pay for your session now. We're not going to schedule it yet until this whole pandemic thing is over. But give them I was thinking actually, half price sessions and some photo credit in order credit of something and I'm not sure what Yes, maybe we can brainstorm about that come up with you can recall together can come up with what I'm going to tell my seniors, but I'm also looking at, we can add to this later, but we'll get back to it. But I'm looking at adding more commercial stuff, and really putting out more feelers for the businesses in town because they're going to be hurting just like us. And so I'm trying to think of ways that I can package something for them to advertise right now, the most efficient way they can. But with,
Michael Mowbray :with our services included, I guess, I'm also kind of working on a few things that are, I think, stemming from the whole social distancing thing because I don't know when that's going to be alleviated. They might pull back on, people still might have some trepidation on meeting in person. So a couple of things I've been thinking about is one is giving an option on my normal three hour session. That's typically 45 minutes to an hour in studio and then two hours on local I've been thinking, Okay, what if I, why don't I break that out? If people just want to do two hours outdoor, you know, then we've got fairly good social distancing. That's one thing. And the other thing I've been really struggling with and I'm really chewing on is the in person selling, because that's something I've always been an advocate of. And I think the business has always benefited from that. But what if customers are really reluctant to come in? What if they're really reluctant to sit in a room with you for two hours going through images? You know, you always had that problem, though, then
Unknown Speaker :that's true.
Unknown Speaker :Back down and get your checkbook out. You can't
Carl Caylor :you don't have to pay to come in but you got to
Michael Mowbray :lock the door when they come through. Yeah, anyway, but so so I've been trying, I've been struggling with you know, gee, do we do some sort of online thing, which is one of the things I've always always taught against it. doing online but is there a way to make it work where it works to your advantage and might be something that's you know, people would be open to and still not really, really cut into sales and profits? I don't know. That's one of the things I'm exploring and looking at and waiting for Dan to invent some online selling software.
Dan Frievalt :Exactly. Yeah, that software that I've been talking about for two years which would be kind of cool to walk you through the in person sales types wizard I guess it would be called but without having to actually sit down and go through that with people and I think the main key is and I know you we talked about this off the air Michael is like getting money down you know, with anything you put out there online. You know, it can be used against your screen captured everything. So you know, coming up with a way to grab some type of money so that people make that commitment. And you know, then They don't, if they steal anything, it's no big deal because you've already have their money and they, they, those type of people put money down are not gonna be the ones that steal from you anyways, so, yeah,
Michael Mowbray :yeah, and I'm with you there because one of the things I'm really leaning towards is taking my, my most commonly purchased product and one of the 80 to 90% of my senior clients purchase anyway, in bundling that in with, you know, 2020 images in one of my senior art books and bundling Digital's with that at x price and get that up front and then so I've got that prepaid then I then I think I feel comfortable putting that online and say pick out your 20 you know, from the online gallery, you guys can pick them out and then I've already got payment on it and submit those and I can just make the book and heck I at that point, I could just drop ship it to you make it you know, make it a touch was system which is again, kind of counter to what we've talked about for years because we want to make this a very You know, a warm, fuzzy experiential experience. And it's kind of hard to do that right now.
Dan Frievalt :It is and I want to like shift gears a little bit as far as the reason I included like a free family session is which I always include anyways, it's usually with $1,000 portrait investment, they get a free family session and we do it in the fall. But I feel this time this quarantine when people are together with their families or their although they may be kind of at Wit's in being with their family, they also might realize just how important family is and the value of that family. And I'm also sending out emails to my past clients. To say I'm going to still honor that free family session is only good for the same year that the senior graduates but graduates but a lot of families, their college kids are home and everything and that's always the hard part is getting everyone together to get these family portraits. On and if we can actually do these sessions once, like before the senior sessions, like once we get the all clear, while everyone is still together before everyone scatters again, it might be a nice little boost in in revenue, as well as an incentive for new bookings and grandparents as well. Like I was talking to my neighbor from a distance the other day and he's like, Yeah, I just can't wait till I can hug my grandkids. You know, and it's like, yeah, you know, I you know, when in I think that's just a lot of people are, are missing that. And if you know, in honor grandparents with a grandparent session might be another thing that we can capitalize on.
Carl Caylor :We'll look at how many kids are born. Oh, and grandparents haven't seen him yet. Our friend john hartman. He became a grandpa now and he's like, I can't wait until I can see my grandkids that you Right. I mean, there's, I'm sure you know, thousands and thousands me kids are born all the time. Thank goodness. So But you know, you just give me a great idea damn what about this is like Wisconsin deer hunting the earn a buck? You can't afford it you can't go and shoot a buck until you shoot adult because they're trying to get the proportion down you know in the in the herd. Well how about we can't we won't do your senior session until you come in for a family. So you have to do that and I'll give you a break on it's a half price family session, but you have to do it in order to be to be able to come here for your senior portraits. I was
Dan Frievalt :there for a second if you're saying you're gonna if you're
Unknown Speaker :gonna take out take out that hurt before he can get booked for here. I was thinking about it and I'm like oh, but where's he going with it?
Unknown Speaker :Maybe should go back to the car.
Carl Caylor :Yeah, maybe. Yeah, I kind of miss that stuff. I'm not losing hallucinating is good after that, but or since then. But but know what If we didn't earn a session, we have to do a family portrait. Before you can even come. I mean it's a gimmick. It's a gimmicky thing, but
Dan Frievalt :it's not. Yeah, I mean, we're brainstorming So yeah, that's not a bad, but
Unknown Speaker :that's exactly what they always
Michael Mowbray :say in brainstorming sessions. There are no stupid ideas. They're only stupid people.
Unknown Speaker :Sorry, guys.
Michael Mowbray :Folding back, I've always used that like in class and stuff. It's like, well, I'm gonna ask a stupid questions like, No, no, wait, wait, wait. There are no stupid questions that are only stupid people. always like this was trying to process that the longer it takes to process that I'm like, Oh, yeah, that one hit home did that.
Carl Caylor :Oh, yeah. All right. Yeah.
Michael Mowbray :interesting idea there, Carl, is something has been tickling around in my brain is commercial. Because I've dabbled in commercial here and there and my background was I worked in advertising. for quite a few years, so, you know, shot a little bit of stuff are directed a bunch of commercial photography, and I've been kind of toying with, with getting back into that a little bit more, I shoot a little bit now, but I'm thinking about sending mail out or email out to local companies and product shots and whatever, it's not the kind of thing that I normally do, but I can do so there's, you know, maybe a potential opportunity there.
Carl Caylor :And you think to get some more income in right now and, and, and later, because who knows, I mean, we're all thinking, Okay, as soon as this is done, you know, the floodgates are gonna open and we're going to be swarmed with seniors and families. We might not we might not so I mean, back to the don't put all your eggs in one basket kind of thought. You know, maybe branch notice in a bad idea bad. Oh, yeah.
Dan Frievalt :Yeah, that's right. If you can name what that quote is from friends. Oh, you gave the answer like oh, I'm sorry, I'm sorry. Yeah, I think I think Yeah, doing pivoting or, you know, trying to have your finger on the pulse of what the emotions of people are feeling and not to take advantage of those emotions, but just be real, like, I posted something in that group today. And I know this is going to air later, but it's like, you know, we as photographers are, you know, if you're a wedding photographer, you're part of these big events in life and in even like newborn photographers, and we're, you know, we're such a big part and that sense of people's lives and special moments seniors and graduation and really think about it where they're through those big moments in life. And can we big, be there now still, you know, try and be there for our clients and show them that we're we care about them and that we want to help support them if they have a business or be there. Ready when things get the all clear and Just or if nothing else, just post images. We have images and flood social media with beautiful, happy, joyful images and maybe get people's minds out of an anxiety state, you know, still try and do that. We don't have a camera in hand. We can't do it that way. But we can do it other ways. So
Michael Mowbray :what was the thing you posted was either today or yesterday about the wind in the sails or whatever? Yeah, it was, it was but I looked at it. I was looking at the bones like, that's a rowboat. Oh,
Dan Frievalt :the girl Well, that is my social media. Va that that is doing all my social media that I hired. So she is coming up with all those quotes and posted now So yeah, I was the first one like what I don't remember post anything. I'm like, oh, cuz technically I didn't.
Unknown Speaker :Oh,
Unknown Speaker :I want people
Dan Frievalt :yeah, so I outsource my I started this beginning of the year. No, I take that back. Now, beginning of the year when this all went down, I was saying I need I need someone to take some of these things off my plate, though I just can't keep up. So I have more time to drink. So I can do these podcasts. Yeah. I could spend more time here on Facebook,
Carl Caylor :dilly dally,
Dan Frievalt :I hired a social media person so that I can spend more time on social media.
Michael Mowbray :It's like circular logic.
Carl Caylor :Right, right. Yeah. And
Dan Frievalt :so yeah, so you know, when this all went down, I was like, Oh, do I keep going forward with this or not? It's like Yeah, I definitely I'm gonna go forward because now more than ever, I need to double down on my social media in being you know, Top of Mind awareness and in starting to have the session reservation and stuff and so I, I talked to people today about senior stuff and I'm even looking at changing my entire pricing structures, some To what we were talking about earlier, it's like how do we pivot? How do we change big on in person sales and to create a collection, but I'm thinking about making a lot of different changes with this. I don't know if we're gonna do it yet. You know, I have a system that's been working, so it's kind of scary to switch it up. But Heck, now might be the time zone.
Michael Mowbray :Yeah, it's a moving target. Because you don't know what you don't know what the target is. I mean, it's one thing to when you know what the target is, but or when the target is we don't know. We don't know when we don't know what the target is going to be. It's. It could be, you know, stay your butt at home until September. You never know. I don't think so. But,
Carl Caylor :Dan, we're never going to go hunting with Michael anymore. Just because it's a moving target doesn't mean we don't
Dan Frievalt :know.
Michael Mowbray :No. All right now you saw just a little slasher Brown. You don't know if that's a deer or okay. Your Guernsey or Holstein or whatever the black and white ones, you don't want those.
Carl Caylor :Don't shoot those. Yeah,
Dan Frievalt :they're a bugger to drag. And then and what I'm trying not to do, which I'm sure a lot of photographers in business people in general are trying not to do is to panic and change yours of systems that we know works. Just because what happened I know it's, it's stressful and it's it's life changing what happened? Do we go completely a different direction. So I'm looking at changing but not revamping everything, just kind of throwing a couple of things in and some things I've been honestly toying with for, like two years now, because a couple years ago, I started the all inclusive, which is my way of selling digital files. And it was it's 20 $700. You get an eight by eight album and 40 digital files that you can print, whatever you want with them, and then you also get 30 percent off anything you would have printed through me. Because just like everywhere, everywhere around the world, people are wanting digital files. So instead of just saying, okay, here's a digital file, and here's it for super cheap, I would go out of business, I can't afford to do that. So I've came up with a system, basically like what when I used to show shoot weddings and give digital files years and years years ago, it's like, Okay, if you want to drop down, drop down three grand, I can give you the files, I'm fine with that. That doesn't cut into my average. In fact, it boosted my average up. But now I'm looking at having a little bit lower price point of entry. So it's not like 2700 you know, less files less money and then bump them up from there. So those are kind of the things I'm looking at. In fact, right before we went on, we were talking a little bit about that. I've been crunching numbers the old calculators by now. So
Carl Caylor :So how are you thinking? What are you thinking about? As far as bumping them up? I mean, different kinds of products or more numbers more volume. What do you what's, what are the next day that's
Dan Frievalt :kind of what I'm working on. The original idea is you don't have to create a collection where they have to get one item from four different steps. The steps are album wallets, gift prints, which eight by 10s, five by sevens and some type of wall portrait. They bundle that together, they get a discount. I'm looking at wallet sales have been going down and in teaching throughout the years, probably a good four or five years now everyone's like I'm not selling wallets, but they're still popular. We're a little bit behind in the Midwest, I think. And people still get wallets. I was still selling wallets. But the seniors still want social media files. So I had different incentives to get social media files or if they got a wallet, they read a social media file. So I'm looking at just adding maybe it's They can either get wallets and or social media files in that step. Or they can have different breakdowns and be like, Okay, if they wanted, if they just want social media, it's going to be this amount if they want printing rights, it's going to be this amount, but it's going to be a combination still with prints. That's kind of like looking at
Michael Mowbray :I thought you had more to say they're stopped and like, I know,
Dan Frievalt :I did, because my, my phone actually rang and it went through my headphones, like,
Unknown Speaker :Oh my gosh, that's loud. Like you guys hear that?
Dan Frievalt :No, awkward stop, like,
Unknown Speaker :oh.
Carl Caylor :So do your guests have to get something in print form first, or is that the book you're talking about before they get the social media file?
Dan Frievalt :Yeah, they always have to get something in print because I do not want. I this is the one thing where I do force them into something I want them to to get something that's printed. Because I don't trust that in that they'll ever print anything. And really, yeah, looking back on old images, or, you know, heirloom images of my mom, my grandmother all that, I mean, I love that I can have those and look back at them. And I want someone years down the road to have that, you know, for instance, okay, whoever thought that something like this pandemic would happen, it would shut the entire country down the entire world down. Right, right world. So think about this. Everyone's like, Oh, I have images on the cloud, the cloud safe to call it safe. Well, if something can shut the entire world down, what happens if the cloud disappears one day? If your phone system goes down, if your computer system goes down, you know not to be like, one of those guys, but
Michael Mowbray :Well, what is the cloud? The cloud is just a computer someplace else. That's all it is. It's like, Oh, I'm gonna get off my computer. I'm gonna put it on the cloud, it'd be safer. Well, that's just some else's computer Now, granted, they likely have backups and backups. But you know, it's not foolproof, it's not 100% safe.
Dan Frievalt :It's it's not it's it's digital, it's not analog. And the same thing with analog. I mean, accidents can happen flooding fires, unfortunate things, tornadoes, and so you could lose that too. So, there is nothing that's foolproof, but I like to, you know, give something that's tangible other than just a desk, it's me it just feels especially the price people are paying and the experience and everything I want them to have something and you know, they can hold on to they can touch it, feel and look at
Unknown Speaker :enjoy.
Michael Mowbray :And as an artist, I want to give a finished product that some of some of some sort even though some of the files have been really artwork and they could make pretty nice prints probably. I want to give something that I've completed Boom. You know, that's one of the reasons why if I do the thing I was talking about, they get the book, you know, and the book is tangible like you're talking about thing that you know, I completed this is something I actually made versus fuzzy digital things not fuzzy. They're all the photo happy. And really sure, USA Golden Eagle provides. Y'all we all shoot. We all shoot Sony now. We're just amazed at how sharp they are. Check out. WWE Oh my gosh. new HD monitor my exclusive monitor I'm working on right now. Isn't that nice? NBC 27 inch but then everything is just so stinking sharp on that Ben Q. It's like I have to sit back. Take your glasses off. You'd be fine. It's my eyes. Yeah.
Dan Frievalt :I'll blur back out again. Yeah.
Carl Caylor :So what should I do you guys I mean, should I give a percentage off of senior sessions to if they pay? Pay right now? Or what would we have them pay me Do I don't want to have them pay that the full session or do I haven't paid the half price of the session now to get the half price session when we can do it?
Unknown Speaker :Oh, heck yeah.
Michael Mowbray :Yeah, if you're gonna, I mean, seriously, if you're gonna give a half price off, yes, they gotta pay it. In my opinion, they got to pay it to reserve it to get the deal. Otherwise, they couldn't wait. You know, if they don't want to do it now they can wait and they'll pay full price. That's true. There's your incentive. Yeah.
Dan Frievalt :And the thing with the half off that I always struggle with because I used to do that every year too. And what I found is the people who who took advantage that were people were going to book me anyways, the half off didn't wasn't an incentive to book because it's people like I know that's where I'm going over their past clients. So it's fine if it's a past client because I would give them a discount anyways. So I'm, that's where this year I'm like, I'm not doing any discounts. I'm adding value to to it, you know, and, and that value is ultimately going to benefit me more, because I'm going to sell more product in the end, you know, or maybe it's adding a prom session I was talking with a senior mom this year and I did the free prom thing. I just shut it down because they had 26 people apply and like 24 hours. And so I'm like, I don't want to overextend myself. But you know, instead of maybe instead of a family session, it's a prom session. And I was just kind of hashing ideas with her because she's like, yeah, like my daughter bought the dress she can't go she's devastated devastated and Mike Yeah, what if you did, and did it smart like a day where you book them back to back they could book online, tell them to get glammed up, get an address, even like afterwards, or bring their boyfriend in if they want and afterwards, they go to dinner, kind of have prom without actually having the prom dance which
Carl Caylor :Hollander Stay tuned. Yes,
Dan Frievalt :right, right. You know, you can, yeah, how long they stay. So, you know, maybe, you know, maybe have something like that or maybe it's, it's a mark that's a marketing thing. They don't, they don't, they don't actually your senior clients but it, it's they you get them in the door, maybe it's a really inexpensive session just to get people in your doors and then you you supply them with senior information that they walk out with or say hey, you know, if you book if you book with me, then you get some sort of discount wherever because those are clients that are are new and fresh and kind of work it that way to us as far as marketing and goodwill all in one.
Carl Caylor :So let's just say June 20. For some reason everything we're back to being able to play again. And but those that you said the girls still are devastated because they bought the dress and they wanted to the prom. Okay, well All our businesses and our restaurants are hurting up here. I know, it's got to be the same way everywhere. What if we got into with one or two restaurants and said, hey, let's do something together and say this is going to be our new prom date. And it's not just for your school, it's for all the schools within our listening distance, whatever it can be come in, if you do your meal here and stopping at my studio for photographs. Have your date, you know, set you know set it up so that you can go eat a good meal, have your photographs taken, and yeah, you don't have the dance with other decorations that nobody really pitched in for any way or stayed very long anyway. But you got something for your senior year for your your junior prom, you know, I mean, some kind of experience. But I think Co Op in liquor store
Dan Frievalt :or store,
Carl Caylor :the pharmacy
Dan Frievalt :liquor store, definitely.
Michael Mowbray :We're gonna waive checking IDs for this day. Yes, yes,
Unknown Speaker :that's all.
Dan Frievalt :Yeah, I mean, a hair salon. You know, everyone's gonna be needing some grooming. Note and hair color and stuff. So you throw that in. Yeah, right. We all have hats on. Well, except with Michael. You know, graphy. So, so yeah, you could run some sort of like, and you could run that right now, which is great. Because you can you can Co Op with, like, you said, a restaurant. Oh, yeah, even a limo company, if you wanted to kind of really go all out, you know, have or have different packages. Here's, you know, salon, salon and photo session, salon dinner photo session, you know, something along those lines, and you're, you're bringing business to other businesses, but also, you know, creating an event that you know, and then leverage any other businesses and they're wondering, as well.
Carl Caylor :I talked to the car dealerships here, because I know they're hurting too because I can't sell a car right now. No, I'm not gonna know.
Dan Frievalt :One gets a car I know.
Carl Caylor :But no if I wonder if there's a way for them to take their sales staff and say for one night you will add this in our as a community service whatever for prom quote unquote prom night. And you know, go and pick with some of their nice vehicles and go pick the couple up and be the driver to the restaurant. And you might not have the same driver from the restaurant to the photo place or to the next place but I wonder if there's a way of incorporating them into because like you said, You got restaurants we got maybe the hairdressers for sure. This the salons? Maybe? How many more people can we include how many other businesses can we include in this? to help them out too, because we're all hurting florist florist.
Dan Frievalt :Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah, that's true. I'm not sure liability wise. If you could be driving. Then people around.
Michael Mowbray :No, no. I like the idea of, of bundling. And but some impacts it too, because you never know, the guy doesn't just take the girl. It's always like, the guy's friend and him and the girl and her girlfriend. So someone packs a two. So rather than selling one, so make sure you're always selling the cool group rate or package of two.
Dan Frievalt :Yeah. And the hard part is the uncertainty because I've also heard like, when things do open up, there might be phases, you know, kind of like how it shut down. It's like, oh, first, there's no groups of 150, then 25. You know, so restaurants, maybe aren't going to be able to open or there's going to be every other booth and, you know, right, that's talking
Michael Mowbray :about the
Dan Frievalt :Yeah, so I mean, that's kind of the hard part because no one really knows.
Michael Mowbray :Yeah, they're also saying that that's likely what's going to happen with restaurants and it will probably drive up meal costs quite a bit because you know, if you used to build To your restaurant could hold 120 Now you're going to be limited to 30. Yeah, right. Yeah, was distancing between tables. But you still have the same, you know, the same overhead costs, right? Those come drive up meal costs. Yeah, for whatever restaurants are still existing.
Carl Caylor :I was just talking to my banker yesterday and right, a client of mine as well. And, and we were having a discussion about this, and he's like, you know, small businesses. I said, I, I don't know what to think. And this is a financial advisor and a bit of the head of the bank. He's the, you know, the CEO, and he's like, I'm gonna guess my opinion is that small businesses 40% are gonna drop 40% are going to be out of business when this is all done. And I said, Well, I hope not, but I could see it happening because How'd you come back from? We still have bills? Think about this. We have? Yes, we don't have to pay our vendors right now because we have no product. All right. And that's a good thing. But really my most I don't know about you guys, but my biggest bill every month, every year, when it comes down to when you do taxes, and you look at it, it just makes you sick isn't all the insurances that we're paying? And we're still paying those, you know, the liability and the homeowners and the business and the equipment. And I mean, that's like 60 to 65% of all things. Bills I pay is stuff that I'm going to start to put in other businesses I'm sure the same way. So if they have no income at all, man, there's gonna be a lot of people hurting right now. And when this is all done, they might not be able to weather the storm and I hope not, and then hope it works. But, you know, his estimate was like, 40% right? It's a scary number by Those scary
Michael Mowbray :well on that note, it's time to take a quick break everybody grab a drink and you know stare solidly Yeah, well, we'll be back in just a second.
Carl Caylor :To succeed in anything you need a good coach one that can evaluate your own work with professional advice as to how to improve coach Carl Carl's coaching corner gets to know your photography so that he can structure a custom learning platform that is ideal for you and your art. Check it out at cc photo coach comm at cc photo coach calm
Michael Mowbray :and welcome back. So what other kind of things could we be doing right now?
Carl Caylor :I'm gonna go back to being a lumberjack
Dan Frievalt :rather than drinking
Carl Caylor :and drinking. The drinking lumberjack mission. Maybe we'll say songs I'm gonna have my my guitar case open up. There you go. The tar case opened up and collected or looked through my junk. Are NCLEX $70 to the church?
Michael Mowbray :Like I did yesterday?
Carl Caylor :like Michael dead? Yeah. No, I think part of being creative now too with all this is maybe going back to what we used to do all the time. And I kind of mentioned it before in the mailers we used to I mean, that was the thing. We sent out mailers, we sent out brochures and pamphlets and magazines and stuff like that. I mean, it got really elaborate sometimes. And then we kind of faded away from that because we had senior reps and social media, couldn't get mailing lists. And you could get mailing list right now. I have one school that that I can get it from up here. And then there's another one that I have a feeling if we just tell them hey, you know, normally we are to the schools actually. You always offer that we can put our mailers in the office for the kids to pick up. Well. Hello. The kids aren't there. And they're missing out because of it. And we don't want them to miss out on an opportunity for things that you guys need. And you guys ask us, your school asks us, for the yearbooks appear, they ask us for it for free. And we do it. You know, it just we do. And we we have good relationship with whoever the yearbook advisor is. But I think getting something in the mail right now, is I think it would be a nice gesture. It'd be something that I mean, I would love to get something in the mail. That's other than a bill right now. Okay. I mean, I was I was in trance yesterday. I got the the northern tool catalog. Yes. New Line. Did you guys get the Uline one?
Michael Mowbray :Oh, yeah. See,
Carl Caylor :I had no idea all the cool stuff that they sell other than, you know, envelopes and poly bags and stuff. But, man, there's even so chainsaws are kind of on me. cards and wheels and oh my gosh.
Michael Mowbray :Oh yeah, they
Dan Frievalt :got everything you and I talked about,
Michael Mowbray :you know, insurance being one of the biggest bills you look at on your taxes every year and you're like, holy crap. You line for me for Mola. Yeah, I'm buying all these boxes, you know, and I'll buy a couple hundred dollars worth of boxes and all it cost me $200 an item shipped via UPS. On flats. It's like, Whoa, what? Yeah,
Carl Caylor :yeah, shipping costs more than product.
Dan Frievalt :But that's I always think like lab should have a recycling program. It's like, okay, I'll send you these boxes back to you. And you give me a credit. I think instead of everything going in the recycling bin, you know, plus, it saves me a trip because I have to bring mine in. I don't have recycling at the studio. But yeah, kind of getting back to what Carl was saying too is you know, I'm looking at sending thank you cards out in the mail to to past clients as well just let me know I'm thinking of them. And, again, just being Top of Mind awareness. You know, again, some some bright lights and beacon a bright light with all the, you know, anxiety and bills and stuff coming in if you can kind of, you know, reach out and and be there for your clients. I think that's that's really the only thing we can do right now. And you know we're such a referral based business. Anything you can do to, to reach out i think is is not only goodwill, but good marketing. So
Michael Mowbray :I'm looking on my phone right now. Because just tagging into that there's a service that I know I have an app for and I can't find it right now where you can send like a thank you postcard but it's got one of their images. I think there was one I found an app.
Carl Caylor :And I you know, I'm glad you're reminding me I completely forgot about it, but you could have actually put your own image in. And, yeah,
Michael Mowbray :exactly. That's what I'm talking about. And I'll have to I'll do some research here because I don't want to this recording and scroll through my phone, which I'm doing anyway. But I'll find I'll find whatever that services and what that app is and because something I was using, I'd actually forgotten about I was using it for thank you cards. So I grab an image from the session and send a little little postcard with a thank you on it. They had their photo on it and it's like, that would stand out in the mail right now, wouldn't it? I mean,
Carl Caylor :yeah, well that's what I was gonna ask you what do you what are you gonna do for your Thank you, you know, to me, was the physical product it can be that you send out to them.
Dan Frievalt :I have just blank cards that from White House custom color that I have printed up that I always send out thank you cards after the session, I handwrite them send it out. So I have those I have my logo and everything on so it wouldn't be like a photo of them. But it's I never do that anyways, but I like the photo idea. So mine would just have the logo and it just says you know, thank you and then I have a space where I write a little thank you note to them. So You know, sending. That's what I'm looking at doing. I just found it. sending that out.
Carl Caylor :Touch notice was the one that I had Nate.
Unknown Speaker :Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, that's it. Touch note. And now I'm trying to find the app.
Dan Frievalt :Now I gotta figure out yeah, this segment sponsored by touch No. We don't get anything for telling you this but sponsored
Michael Mowbray :by the place that we Yeah. So you know, think of the name of so maybe they need to call it something else. Yeah.
Carl Caylor :Yeah. Yeah. Well, this is a brainstorming session. Today, right?
Dan Frievalt :It it is and I think again, if you can get people to to commit and book there, people are looking, I mean, they're looking for some sort of normalcy. I think, you know, in staying active in social media, doing social media videos, I know I doubled down to and I hired another girl who is writing blog articles for me with all fashion tips and trends in clothing things. So it we wanted to record videos as well now, we can't do the videos, but I'm still moving forward with the blog posts, which is good SEO, I hired photo biz to do my SEO, I've been wanting to hire them for a while they're the awesome 50% off. So I took advantage of that. And I want to capitalize on, you know, it's one thing to get good SEO and be on the top, but then how do I convert those people? And because my price point is is quite high. I feel like my Google people who would contact me via Google weren't always pre qualified. So I'm working on steps to give them information that helps not only with the imagery, stand out and be different but also with the information this is why it's more expensive, not just the imagery, but we're going to do clothing consultation, I have a fashion consultant we're even talking of we're gonna hire I'm gonna people can hire her to go shopping and I think ran that pass the mom today I talked to and she's like, Oh my God, that's great. Because think of a 17 year old, senior and a mother how much they're gonna fight outfits to wear, right? A lot. So I can have this girl who's 23 years old, who I did her senior pictures when she was 17. She's been through the entire process. She works for a she manages a Oh, she holding store. And so, yeah, so she's gonna put all this you know, go shopping with them. They're going to pay her directly. She's going to spend a day shopping, get everything outfits and accessories, put it all together shop, any place they want to shop and she's the go between, you know, she's at the perfect age where she's gonna, and I've coached her through things that work and she knows too but things to stay away from in that and so I think it's another offering no one may take it, take us up on it, but that's okay. It's something that makes me stand out, be different and justify why you're just not getting a disk image.
Michael Mowbray :You know, it's like you're poisoning me Oh, I got a drink that's it's a it's a drinking term. guys remember the old the old old style beer ads were old style with christening which was like this bs German term owes for an antiquated way of making beer but but turned it into an advantage is like we've got christening photo images by Carl with Carl North
Carl Caylor :Carolina. Oh, dang it. I can't even say I need some more drink. Hold on a minute.
Michael Mowbray :Carl worked with Dan Tony.
Dan Frievalt :Yeah, Tony. Dantonio I you know it. You know and Carl, you brought up a thing where the bankers like oh, you know, 40% are gonna drop pots. And, and things like that. And it's a scary time. It's a scary number. I don't have all the answers, but I feel like you know, if we really buckle down and tighten up our systems, I know I've said this before, tighten up systems, implement new things, be active in social media, contact and be in, you know, contact old clients and be top of mind and try and get new clients I think, you know, the more you can be prepared when this does open up, like you're gonna, might have a little bit of a head start and be able to capitalize on some of that, you know, some other people, at least for me, because this is all I do. So other I have to do that, you know, and maybe some people will drop out not so much for the financial maybe a little bit but mainly because it was a side hustle, and they need to focus more on their, their real job or maybe they have to get a second a different second job that is more reliable than the industry of photography. So It might open up some opportunity, unfortunately, as well. I'm hoping so because yeah, otherwise, my fallback was always to be a bartender, but shoot, no bars being close. And nobody.
Michael Mowbray :You know, your business banker was saying, you know, 40% of small businesses might be gone. In a normal year, what percent of businesses spend their first
Carl Caylor :in their first year?
Michael Mowbray :But yeah, this obviously puts extra pressure on businesses. We're running pretty lean anyway. And a lot of small businesses are, but yeah, maybe it'll create a whole different environment. Once we get out of this. Maybe there'll be fewer photographers, maybe they'll be more photographers anymore.
Carl Caylor :It'll be more.
Dan Frievalt :Yeah, I know. It could be Yeah, exactly. And, and this is one thing I always stress when I teach too, like I put, don't be afraid to, to pivot to say that again. But my session fees They fluctuate throughout the year. And they're you know, say you want to start your session fee lower do a discount, that's fine. And you get X amount of seniors booked, you know, but you know, crunch your numbers, how many seniors, you, you need to book each year, how much of an average you think you need to get to be the amount of income that you want and kind of work backwards. So what I'll do is like, Okay, I'm going to book my first couple sessions, they're going to be the least expensive. Let's say, this is what I used to do all the time. And then you start booking every person that calls Okay, well, then guess what my session fee just went up, and then you start, okay. Now, I'm still booking every person, let's say, Okay, well, that session fee went up again. Now I'm booking every other or every third person, you know, you work your numbers until you come up. And that's with a session for you that kind of works. And that's how my session fee is $550. I think it's crazy. It's ridiculous. But that's I started at like $200, and I kept raising it. Every year, and then the last couple of years, I'm like, I'm just gonna start at this. And people were still booking me. So, you know, and there's nothing to say that Okay, now it's backfiring. And no one's booking me like, Okay, I'm gonna run a special, like, every store does that. But I think as artists and photographers, we feel like, okay, we printed this flyer, our session fee is in this I can't change the year. Why? Why, you know, you're gonna, your business could go down, you know, you could that could be a dagger in your business. So it's like, you know, it's like, Okay, this is a special that I'm running every store does that if someone comes back and say, well, so and so got less expensive and be like, yeah, they got in a special, you know, or if it's like, okay, I'll give you a discount on your product, you know, for that make you feel, you know, better.
Michael Mowbray :I've always wanted to, like in when I was doing brochures, I really haven't done a brochure for a while but because who am I going to send it to because again, I can't get a mailing list around here, but I always wanted to put Instead of a price for the sessions, I always want to put market price. Like when you go into higher end restaurants for lobster or whatever, fish its market price. Well, what's the market price? changes on the day you call? Yep.
Carl Caylor :Who like that? Right? I was watching TV yet. Oh gosh, it was last night. Last Man Standing. Great show. I was just so much fun. Right now I need comedy. It's either that or I'm gonna cry one or the other but the daughter was starting her own fashion business. And it was interesting because you know Mike Baxter, the dad he's the marketing genius for outdoor man. And he was helping out his daughter and said, Well, you know, you got to change your prices. Because you know you You're all your your expenses are fixed. I mean, this is what it is. So, if you want to make more money, either you guys saw a lot more, or you gotta raise your prices. He said, Well, how do I raise my prices? He went to the keyboard. He's like, well, you press this button right here and keep raising it up. He said, You changed a number. It's not a big deal. I said, 11 good, huh? Yeah, I guess it's not hard to raise your prices? No, you got to make it. We I mean, when it comes right down to it, we're discretionary income product, we are luxury items. Plain and simple. We are a luxury item. And, you know, it's about time we, you know, really look at it that way. So, like you said, you know, in your sessions, or that you start at this price and Dan said, You moved up and pretty soon He's like, I just start there, because that's what people are paying. I love the idea, the market price. I think that's great, because this should be a fluid thing. And I've thought about this in my mind, since this is a brainstorming session that we're doing in podcast here today. I've thought myself Over and over, because people are like, well, you should have your prices on your website, you shouldn't have your prices website, you should have your prices in your mailers You shouldn't have your prices in your mailers. Which one is it? Oh my goodness, but and so I opted always to keep it off, you know, but when people called to give them a range, you know to talk about a range and try to qualify, because I do not want somebody coming to my restaurant and not being able to order a meal that is on my menu. And so I liked the idea of it being fluid and saying market price, but this is the range you can expect to spend on this luxury item. Let's treat it like a luxury item. So with that being said, back to my mailer, since we're promoting a luxury item, what would what would be viable? What would I guess be the right thing to do for A mailer piece. I mean, do we want something that is really high end material? and simple? Or do I want to get elaborate with a whole magazine to send out to people? What are your thoughts about that? Let's brainstorm a little bit about it.
Michael Mowbray :I've gone back and forth on it. And I think it shifts every year because I did a few years ago I did I did pretty elaborate. I did a box. So box it was customized black box, I had my logo on it, open it up. And then there was a multi fold brochure that pretty much almost like a pop up, because, you know, from the fold, and I believe, I think I had a DVD in there. So that's all Oh, this was this probably goes back five years at least. It was a beta game. Yeah, it was. It was a LaserDisc. So I spent a fair amount per piece And then it goes to a mailing list that my reps got me because one of the requirements I had for my, my models and my reps was that they had to give me 30 names and addresses of kids from their class. And I didn't have that many models. So, you know, I think I had a mailing list of, you know, maybe two or 300, but at least I knew they're qualified. And I didn't see a major uptick. I spent quite a bit of money on this thing. And I didn't see a major uptick. I've done magazines. One year, I did a magazine great next year, pretty much the same thing. Just changed photos out not so much. So it's so fickle.
Dan Frievalt :It is, but I'll go back to the age old advertising trick of frequency. I think, you know, people, even the clutter of mail and social media, everything like you have to hit them a few times. So lesser quality, but yeah, three to five times or more. So If you just did a postcard or maybe your your first one was a bigger mailer, or your last one was a bigger mailer to make a lasting impression, or your first impression, and then smaller cards in between, which are less expensive to mail out and hit more frequency. And along those same lines, I see a lot of photographers, myself included, it's easy to get caught in this web, but jumping from social media platform to social media platform, and not really focusing on any one platform. And you know, if you can be king or queen on one platform, you're at least have market share on that platform. You know, so, if it's Instagram, great if it's Snapchat, great. If it's Tick tock,
Michael Mowbray :I'll be working on my vitals
Dan Frievalt :think also too, you know, but also think of like how, you know, tick tock, oh, everyone's on Tick Tock. Now they say, but is there a way that it can be shared and you're going to get viral and people are going to see it or as you're just on their act? Cool, you know, at least with Instagram, you have Instagram stories you have Instagram TV, you have, you know, the multi images, they can swipe you can take people in your stories and then they can reshare them and story. So there's a lot of benefit to me with like focusing a lot of effort on one platform and I think Instagram right now is that platform. I mean, if you can't keep up with one platform, why are you going to be on every platform? Because you're just spinning your wheels and it's not really helping. So
Michael Mowbray :Well speaking of spinning my spinning wheels, spinning wheels towards another drink here. Any any parting shots before we go shots? Or was that your parting shot?
Dan Frievalt :I think I just gave I think I just gave my parting shot. I'm ending with that.
Michael Mowbray :Oh, maybe a parting shot is if you haven't done this already. You don't take a step back and get a piece of paper. paper or a notepad and just start brainstorming and write things down and let the creative ideas flow on. Maybe ways you could, you know, shift something in your business pivot or enhance something you think you're already doing well, so it's all set when, when the time is right.
Carl Caylor :You know, I think what my takeaway from this today is that, you know, a lot of us have been in this business for a long time, and admittedly, a lot of us maybe got comfortable with what we have. And, you know, this is hard work in maybe we're not working as hard as when I first started. And Dan talking about the thank yous, the handwritten thank yous right now, I think made a lot of sense and it kind of hit close to home right now and that we are going to have to start working very hard again, in our business and being that it's a luxury item. Be more than a person Nature with people so you know maybe you're gonna have to go back to QuickBooks and dig through my client list and and start writing you know start contacting these people in a more personal level. I think that's my, my biggest takeaway from from today's podcast so I'm glad we had this. Thanks, guys.
Michael Mowbray :Good hopefully it helps out. Well, today's episode was brought to you by unicorn tears Jen LeCour. This at proof jen mcore claims to be made with real unicorn tears that were harvested right in front of the animal's eyes. Keep that's kind of sad. I'm crying. Ask for it by name unicorn tears Gen look cooler, which again, is a real thing. You can you can get this. So that's all we got for this week. Till next time, cheers to you. Cheers.
Unknown Speaker :Cheers. Last call.
Michael Mowbray :You've been listening to the photo happy hour podcast. Be sure to hit that Subscribe button to not miss a single action packed episode and join our photo happy hour Facebook group where we'll post links to the stuff we all talk about. You can find my mo light gear online@www.go mo light com. That's geo mo Li gh t comm you can find the Facebook page under MoLight store and I also run the Godox flash help group on Facebook. You can find Dan SR unlocked website at www dot seniors unlocked.com. That's seniors with an S at the end unlocked.com and the Facebook group under seniors unlocked and you can find Karl's coaching corner@www.cc photo coach comm cc photo coach calm until next time, cheers to you
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