Ep 327: Speak Life: Prayers for Fertility Patients

 Fertility Docs Uncensored Today’s episode of Fertility Docs Uncensored is hosted by Dr. Carrie Bedient from the Fertility Center of Las Vegas, Dr. Susan Hudson from Texas Fertility Center, and Dr. Abby Eblen from Nashville Fertility Center. In this episode, the hosts welcome author Kathy DeGraw, who, along with her daughter Lauren DeBoer, wrote the book Speak Life. Kathy shares her personal journey through fertility challenges, including miscarriage and a molar pregnancy, and explains how her faith-based perspective shaped the creation of this book. Designed as a source of encouragement, the book focuses on prayer, hope, and scriptural truth, drawing from biblical stories of women who experienced infertility and ultimately found strength through faith. The discussion explores how speaking prayers out loud can provide comfort and a sense of connection during infertility, IVF, and pregnancy. What role can faith and prayer play in coping with infertility? Can structured prayer declarations help patients feel more empowered during IVF or pregnancy? The book is organized into sections that guide readers through preparing the body for pregnancy, addressing both female and male infertility, and offering continued support after conception. A unique feature includes 40 weeks of prayer declarations designed to accompany patients throughout pregnancy. Listeners will hear how Kathy’s personal experiences shaped their message and how their approach may resonate with patients seeking emotional or spiritual support alongside medical fertility care. This episode highlights the importance of addressing both the physical and emotional aspects of fertility journeys. This podcast was sponsored by IVF Florida. 

Transcript

Susan Hudson (00:01)

You're listening to the Fertility Docs Uncensored podcast, featuring insight on all things fertility from some of the top rated doctors around America. Whether you're struggling to conceive or just planning for your future family, we're here to guide you every step of the way.

Abby Eblen MD (00:22)

Hi everybody we're back with another episode of Fertility Docs Uncensored. I'm one of your hosts Dr. Abby Eblen from Nashville Fertility Center and today I'm joined by my co-host and friends Dr. Susan Hudson from Texas Fertility Center.

Susan Hudson MD (00:34)

Hello everyone!

Abby Eblen MD (00:36)

and Dr. Carrie Bedient from the Fertility Center of Las Vegas.

Carrie Bedient MD (00:39)

Hello, how's it going?

Abby Eblen MD (00:41)

And we have a special guest today, Kathy DeGraw. She is a faith-based person who really likes to make lives better for those who are going through IVF and through fertility treatments. And so she's here to talk with us today about her new book called Speak Life, Prayer Declarations for Fertility, IVF Pregnancy, Labor Delivery, and Healthy Babies. So we're excited to talk to you about that. But first, tell us a little bit about you. You said you had a really cool job earlier, a fun job.

Kathy DeGraw (01:12)

Yeah, I had a fun job when I was just starting to be a new mom and wife and it was nice because it gave me freedom and I never saw myself doing that and I was a Tupperware manager. I got to pop those little lids and let it express air out and go into people's homes, meet all kinds of people and try and sell this plastic product.

Carrie Bedient MD (01:39)

So, I wanna know how much Tupperware do you have in your house now?

Kathy DeGraw (01:43)

Now, I don't have that much, but I will tell you the funny thing about it was when we got married, we lived in an apartment for a year and I had my husband wash five huge, like your biggest packing box of Tupperware and he still talks about it today. I'm not washing another piece of Tupperware, but I have to admit now I am.

I'll call it a health nut, very health conscious and I don't want all those BPAs in my food. So I don't use Tupperware at all. No, no, don't want those hormone disruptors and yeah, all of that. So we've switched over to glass, but hey, it was fun. I got to meet a lot of very unique people. And it provided, I had a van and of lot of money and it was just good and I didn't mind it at the time.

Abby Eblen MD (02:37)

So did you go to people's homes? Did you have friends that would sponsor parties? Or how did that work?

Kathy DeGraw (02:42)

That was the worst part, honestly. You had to get your party and then you had to beg the guest to have a party. And I think that's kind of why it like fizzled out is I'm really bold right now. I could ask anybody anything. But back then I was shy, I would hide behind my husband when we were out meeting new people. I was so shy. It was hard to ask for a party. But you know what?

I think it really set me up for what I do today as a podcaster, TV host, public speaking. It gave me that experience. And so I think it really was a setup for me.

Susan Hudson MD (03:21)

I have to say I don't ever remember going to a Tupperware party but I went to my fair share of Pampered Chef parties and I still have I still have some of that because a lot of that's stoneware and things like that but I never wanted to host something but I always wanted to go.

Carrie Bedient MD (03:38)

I'm just imagining my husband's reaction as he is listening to this because he listens every Tuesday morning when a new episode drops. So, honey, I just want you to imagine a van full of Tupperware and how much joy that I would get out of that. Now, granted, we have also switched over to all of the glass-based storage containers, but I just, can see the steam coming out of his ears and possibly him grabbing his chest with a heart attack just thinking about a van of Tupperware. Honey, I love you.

Susan Hudson MD (04:10)

So funny, that's so funny. Well, let's do a question today. Our question today is, my husband and I are both 34. We tried to conceive for 10 months before seeing an RE for testing. After the official 12 month mark and an unexplained diagnosis, we headed right into estrogen priming antagonist stimulation cycle. After 12 days of stims that were sharply tapered at the end to nothing eventually, I had about 22 follicles measuring between 15 to 20 and estrogen about 4500. We did a Lupron only trigger for OHSS risk, 80 IU 36 hours before and another 80 IU 24 hours before. I was shocked to wake up and hear they retrieved 39 eggs. Does that mean I should expect a sharper drop off in fertilization blastocysts?

We are doing ICSI and PGTA testing. Sperm 121,000,000, 74% motile, 2 % morphology. She has an AMH of 3.75, FSH of 6.5, LH of 7.9. So what do we expect in the lab to happen?

Abby Eblen MD (05:22)

A lot of times when people get lots and lots of eggs, the body just doesn't make 39 eggs as well as it makes just one or two or 10 even. And so sometimes it goes from a really high number of eggs and a lot can be immature because a lot of times we go into smaller follicles. And sometimes it ends up there's only 10 eggs that fertilize. But then other times you can get 39 eggs and you can have 37 fertilized. So it really, there's no rhyme or reason. can happen either way basically.

Carrie Bedient MD (05:51)

The reason for getting a high number of eggs can also vary. So sometimes the reason is because they expected to get 20, but they got 40 because when you are measuring follicles on an ovary, you are measuring a 3D object in two dimensions. And it's very difficult to do that when you've got a ton of eggs that are all crowded in together. When you've only got four or five eggs, it's very easy to know where one egg begins and the next one ends. But when you've got 20, 30, 40, it's really hard to know, did I already count that one? Is that one the same one? Did I, just by moving a couple millimeters, did I switch right into a total new one that I thought I already counted but I didn't? So that's one potential reason to get a big difference in number. The other reason to get a difference in number is not every REI goes after the same size follicles. So some of us go after only the bigger ones, others of us go after absolutely everything.

Particularly when they think there might be a hyperstim risk, there's some value in going after absolutely everything because you get rid of all those granulosa and cumulus cells, you drain all the fluid, you get rid of the VEGF that might relate to hyperstimulation. But it's with the expectation of, yeah, I really did only drain 20 eggs, 20 follicles that were big and the other 19 or so were itty bitty. And if I get a good egg from them, fantastic, but I'm not expecting that.

Talking with your doc about what they expect maturity-wise and fertilization-wise is important because they will have a better idea of, I go into 40 eggs that were huge and beautiful and juicy, or did I go into 20 that were big and another 20 that were itty bitty piddlies?

Susan Hudson MD (07:31)

So the things that I would add are that I think the predictive factor is a whole lot easier once you get to your day one and you know how many fertilized. And generally speaking in most labs between day of fertilization and the actual blastocyst stage, so the stage where we can tell what parts can become the baby and what parts can become the placenta, and you can do the biopsy for the PGT-A, you're generally going to expect between a third to a half of embryos to make it through that process. So if you're starting off with say 40 eggs and let's just say 30 of them fertilize, you may get 15 embryos. But again, half of the ones that you do end up testing, we also expect to be chromosomally abnormal. And there's nothing wrong with you or your partner. It's just the way humans are made and as we get into our upper 30s and our early 40s, that number of chromosomally normal embryos is going to significantly decrease.

Susan Hudson MD (08:39)

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If you've been waiting for the right moment to get clarity, this might be it.

Abby Eblen MD (09:45)

Very good. Well, Kathy, tell us a little bit about your book, Speak Live. Tell us what inspired you to write it and who your target audience is.

Kathy DeGraw (09:53)

I think I went through a lot of things early on in my marriage and my fertility process. We did go through fertility issues for a year, had a miscarriage, partial molar pregnancy, different things along my path.

I used to say, I think I could kind of relate to all women in different aspects. And I didn't really know what that meant. And then I'm a grandma and we find ourselves in a few different situations in the last couple of years, having a medically complex grandson and then having a high risk pregnancy with a high risk for stillbirth.

And it was in that labor and delivery room when we saw some things not going how we wanted it to that I started inquiring of the doctor and I said, how specifically do we pray? And right then our kids said, are you going to write another book, mom? And I'm like, I think so. And I'm taking out my notepad because I've always had this passion if I can make it better for the next person, if I can make it easier, if I can change lives, if something I experience can make it different for someone else. And then my daughter came to me, it was maybe four or five months after her son was born and praise the Lord, he was alive and healthy, but he almost died four times during that process.

She said, Mom, let's write that book. And I'm like, yeah. We really wanted to be able to coach, teach, help people pray through the situation and give people hope. Because when we look at the Bible, there's seven stories of barrenness and six were overcome. And so there is hope for these families, these couples, these women. And we want to give them hope. And we also want to give them the prayers that we wish we would have had to pray through our situations.

Carrie Bedient MD (11:57)

So curious. What did the doctor do and say when you asked that question? Because that is not the standard question that we are used to getting in the exam room, the delivery room, the operating room. How did they react? What did they say?

Kathy DeGraw (12:13)

They actually loved it. And I actually had this same doctor on a previous labor and delivery and I was in the room and the baby was under fetal distress and stuff. And I was sitting quietly in the corner just praying a little bit like this. And the doctor looked over at me and said, you can pray louder because we were in a dire place and she wanted the prayer support. She already knew me and going into that, I'm like, how do we pray? She just gave me those precise prayers of how to pray for the cervix and the placenta and everything that was happening. All of the medical professional there, they were happy because they knew we weren't just praying for our grandchild, but we were praying for them and helping make their job easier.

Abby Eblen MD (13:00)

I always like when people pray for me. feel like I need all the help I can get.

Susan Hudson MD (13:01)

This is definitely a team sport and this is a great example to our listeners that working with your physicians that we're all working towards the same goal and there are going to be challenges that we're going to face and the idea is that we can face those together.

Kathy DeGraw (13:21)

Yeah, and praying for wisdom for our medical personnel because you have degrees and you have this experience, but you still encounter things and to give you that prayer covering and just more rest and peace and wisdom in the situation because, every situation seems to be a little bit different.

Abby Eblen MD (13:40)

Absolutely.

Susan Hudson MD (13:40)

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Abby Eblen MD (14:19)

So tell me a little bit about your book and how how it's divided up. Is it a book just of prayers or are there other things in the book as well?

Kathy DeGraw (14:27)

We give a little bit of insights, but it's a lot of prayers. It's faith based. It's even stuff after you've had a baby of, okay, what happens if you get mastitis and how do you pray against that? How do you treat it? So she gave a few of the tips that worked for her. During the writing of this on everything, we tried to add a little bit of life experience. We're not medical doctors. We don't have a background, but we did medically research out every prayer so that it was targeted of what needs to happen in your body. And then we gave that experience or that life story. We told some of our testimony and the things that we overcame to encourage.

My daughter was very raw and real in it. She just put it all out there and she's like, even if you get a bad diagnosis, it doesn't mean it has to be the worst thing that happens. Just pray and have faith and have hope and keep praying and have it overcome. And then she also talked how to, kind of partner with your doctor. I think you hear about a prayer book sometimes and people go, we don't want to get that because, we don't know if we trust Jesus to heal us. And what we're saying here is use this as a tool to partner with Jesus, to partner with your medical practitioner. People kind of sometimes shy away. But we feel like it's important to bring your medical practitioner into the process with you and into the prayer.

Carrie Bedient MD (16:01)

Is this something that is specific to Christianity in particular, or can people of other faiths come through and use it and get value from it? Or is it something that is their reading that it's really much more directed towards Christianity, Jesus, and that line of faith?

Kathy DeGraw (16:09)

No, we really just felt like it was giving faith and hope and that this was for all people and we were hoping it was even for people that didn't have faith that it would encourage them to bring some faith in it. So it's for every religion, it's for people that aren't even in religion because it's so practical of things that we can speak out to help form that life and have that faith and that hope. So we really believe that this is going to branch off and hit people outside of faith because even though the core, everything I do and everything we do is Jesus, but this was written in a way that everyone could relate to it.

Susan Hudson MD (16:59)

Very nice.

Abby Eblen MD (17:00)

For patients out there that maybe want to involve their doctor in prayer, is there anything that you've written in the book that helps them approach their physician, maybe their physicians of a different faith? How are patients able to do that or how should they do that?

Kathy DeGraw (17:14)

Well, I think we have to respect each other's beliefs and each other's disbeliefs. And so just talking to your physician, like my physician, every time I leave, he goes, hey, can I pray over you? We like that. But you could just say, I had a procedure, I had a situation where I had something in my uterus, and I asked my gynecologist, I said, could I take this to prayer before we go into a procedure?

I just kind of approached it from a faith base and asked my gynecologist, I don't know if they were faith based or not, but they said, yes, what's going on in your uterus isn't an emergency. So if you want to take a few more weeks to pray about it, go ahead. I just take a gentle approach instead of this boisterous approach. I can be boisterous ladies. I can be very boisterous.

But I want to respect the other person and honor the other person. Talk gently and just say, hey, I have fear in this situation. What do you think? Or maybe put your faith out there and see if your physician has faith and can stand in agreement with you. But ultimately, you have to, I always say, be you. Everyone else is taken. So do what you need and be you.

Susan Hudson MD (18:29)

That's a great perspective. You definitely have to be you.

Abby Eblen MD (18:33)

Some people I think just sort of pray kind of what comes to mind. Other people sort of have like a little bit more of a rigorous or rigid kind of way that they pray. Do you talk about that at all in the book or is that something that you like to do or do you just, whatever comes to mind is what you say in your prayers?

Kathy DeGraw (18:50)

I really believe in Proverbs 18-21, says, death and life is in the power of the tongue. If we look at how Jesus and the Father created the earth, the Father created by speaking, Jesus spoke out a lot in His ministry. And we look at the Word of God, we see that there's power when we speak out in audible prayer. I've actually been healed 17 times miraculously without a medical procedure.

I'm not saying I didn't go to a doctor during that. A lot of times I did, found out was wrong, prayed, did some home remedies, sometime was supernaturally healed. But what I always found out, it was speaking out in audible, out loud. And Jesus said, I give you authority. So we have authority over things. And I believe in audible prayer and I also believe in precise prayer and in precision.

One of the ways I talk about that is with diabetes, we need to be praying precisely that our cells are opening up to receive the insulin. And so just teaching people how can we pray that body part to do what it's supposed to be doing. And that's part of what Jesus said, I give you authority. What I tell people, if you're praying and it's not working for you, try a different way.

What's wrong with trying a prayer or just reading these prayers? If it's going to co-labor and help you achieve your objectives and your goals, it just takes a few words and a little bit of time to speak out in faith.

Susan Hudson MD (20:25)

What are your thoughts about unanswered prayers?

Kathy DeGraw (20:27)

God does not answer every prayer. We know that. And I actually talked about that in my last book because my last book was on physical healing. And as I said, I've been healed 17 times without a medical procedure, but that doesn't count the times that I did need a medical procedure or wasn't healed. We don't know why God doesn't answer prayers. But this is a thing that I discovered about fertility when I was studying out the Scriptures in the Bible.

And of the six cases where women did get pregnant, it was a matter of timing and destiny. It was their offspring had something great to accomplish. Sometimes we don't know the timing. Sometimes we don't know why he doesn't answer it, this side of heaven. And, even healing, people will say, well, Kathy, they didn't get healed. They died. We can't explain that. We're not God.

It's all we can do is have the faith and move forward and still hope. And that's what I would say to anyone listening. I don't care if you've been in IVF one year, 17 years, whatever it is, just keep hoping, keep hoping until that very last minute, until that very last breath, because you never know when it could happen. And we don't want to get in doubt when our breakthrough could just be right around the corner.

Abby Eblen MD (21:51)

Well, one thing too about hopelessness too, think that patients a lot of times if they're hopeless, then they tend to just quit and like, I'm done, I can't keep doing this. I would say resilient patients are the ones that eventually get pregnant because they just keep bouncing back and bouncing back and bouncing back. And certainly I think things like prayer can be really helpful in that regard too for a lot of patients.

Kathy DeGraw (22:10)

Yeah, well, and doesn't even stress prevent it? You know, if they're not in hope, then they could also be in stress and that could prevent them from getting pregnant, correct?

Susan Hudson MD (22:23)

Always find it more difficult to actually get somebody pregnant who doesn't believe that it can happen. I can say all of us have gone into embryo transfers with patients who are like, this isn't going to work. We're always like, no, no, no, no, no, you can't think that way. You have to have a positive outlook. And it's hard. It's challenging. Abby and I have both been through infertility treatments and IVF ourselves and it's a stress. It's a stress on you yourself. It's a stress on your body. It's a stress on your relationships. And if you can do things that bring you more peace, such as going to prayer through this type of venue, then it can be a beneficial thing.

Kathy DeGraw (23:10)

Yeah, I think you just said the key word that really is about this book. It's don't say I can't. It's not going to happen. This book is so much about the power of our thoughts and the power of our words and what we're speaking out. I'm very passionate about that. We cannot speak out the negative.

Our neural pathways are going to go in the direction naturally of what we're always speaking out. And we have to be positive. And that is really living by faith and not by sight. And when I needed a healing in my body and I was just praying, I'm like, Lord, heal me. He said, Kathy, go by faith and not by sight. Every time I saw this manifestation of a negative symptom, I'm like, no, I'm going to go by faith and not by sight.

You got to talk yourself happy. You got to talk yourself into positivity. You got to talk yourself into faith. You got to talk yourself into belief. Proverbs 18: 21, death and life is in the power of tongue. You say, no, this is going to be the time. I am going to get pregnant. God has blessed me. He says the fruit of the womb will come forth, and just keep speaking it out. Just speak it out in faith. Even if you don't feel it, just speak it out. It's so powerful.

Carrie Bedient MD (24:25)

It sounds a lot for people who don't necessarily have a religious or spiritual background. It sounds a lot like manifesting, which you hear about from a different group of people than those who perhaps have a more traditional faith background. It seems like there's a place for this book in the hands of those people as well, because it gives more direct instruction as to what you are trying to manifest by speaking into existence.

Kathy DeGraw (24:55)

Yeah, as I said before, think it's really a book for everyone. It's for, no matter what your belief or where you're at. I think this is an all purpose book.

Susan Hudson MD (25:05)

Well, thank you for coming and telling us about your book. We understand the heart and soul of writing a book, obviously. And we applaud that for you.

Kathy DeGraw (25:18)

Thank you.

Abby Eblen MD (25:19)

Thank you so much. And to our audience, thanks for listening and tune in next week for more. Also tune in subscribe and we'll review in iTunes. We'd really love to hear from you.

Susan Hudson MD (25:28)

Visit Fertilitydocsuncensored.com to submit questions and sign up for our email list. Pick up your copy of the IVF Blueprint today at Amazon, Barnes & Noble, or your favorite bookstore. Check out our Instagram and TikTok for quick hits of fertility tips between weekly episodes.

Carrie Bedient MD (25:43)

And as always, this podcast is intended for entertainment and is not a substitute for medical advice from your own physician. Subscribe, sign up for emails, and we will talk to you soon. Bye.

Susan Hudson MD (25:53)

Bye.