{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":1.079,"endTime":4.229,"body":"Welcome to creating"},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":1.079,"endTime":4.229,"body":"synergy where we explore what it"},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":4.229,"endTime":8.399,"body":"takes to transform. We are"},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":4.229,"endTime":8.399,"body":"powered by Synergy IQ. Our"},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":8.399,"endTime":11.459,"body":"mission is to help leaders"},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":8.399,"endTime":11.459,"body":"create world class businesses"},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":11.489,"endTime":15.719,"body":"where people are safe, valued,"},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":11.489,"endTime":15.719,"body":"inspired and fulfilled. We can"},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":15.719,"endTime":18.749,"body":"only do this with our amazing"},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":15.719,"endTime":18.749,"body":"community. So thank you for"},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":18.749,"endTime":19.289,"body":"listening."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":20.98,"endTime":23.08,"body":"Hi there"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":20.98,"endTime":23.08,"body":"synergises and welcome back to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":23.08,"endTime":26.53,"body":"another episode of The creating"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":23.08,"endTime":26.53,"body":"synergy podcast. My name is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":26.53,"endTime":32.11,"body":"Daniel Franco. And today I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":26.53,"endTime":32.11,"body":"chatted to man who just has the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":32.11,"endTime":36.19,"body":"ability to make me smile. He's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":32.11,"endTime":36.19,"body":"one of the most humble human"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":36.19,"endTime":39.61,"body":"beings I've had the pleasure of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":36.19,"endTime":39.61,"body":"being around and his name is Mr."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":39.61,"endTime":44.8,"body":"Francesco Vassallo. Frank is the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":39.61,"endTime":44.8,"body":"founder of effective people,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":44.83,"endTime":48.1,"body":"which stands for more effective"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":44.83,"endTime":48.1,"body":"people, where he works together"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":48.1,"endTime":51.91,"body":"with his clients providing them"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":48.1,"endTime":51.91,"body":"with bespoke consulting services"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":51.91,"endTime":55.54,"body":"in Agile coaching, training,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":51.91,"endTime":55.54,"body":"mentoring and facilitation and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":55.54,"endTime":60.25,"body":"workshops. Frank is a highly"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":55.54,"endTime":60.25,"body":"qualified agile coaching it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":60.25,"endTime":64.15,"body":"delivery leader with extensive"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":60.25,"endTime":64.15,"body":"experience of 25 years in both"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":64.15,"endTime":67.57,"body":"private and public sectors in"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":64.15,"endTime":67.57,"body":"Australia and the United Kingdom"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":67.9,"endTime":71.8,"body":"across many industries, such as"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":67.9,"endTime":71.8,"body":"utilities, natural resource"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":71.8,"endTime":75.37,"body":"management, land administration,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":71.8,"endTime":75.37,"body":"taxation, insurance,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":75.4,"endTime":81.31,"body":"agribusiness, criminal justice,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":75.4,"endTime":81.31,"body":"health, retail and education is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":81.31,"endTime":85.45,"body":"a self confessed agile gauge, a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":81.31,"endTime":85.45,"body":"connector, a collaborator, and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":85.45,"endTime":88.06,"body":"he's constantly seeking to bring"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":85.45,"endTime":88.06,"body":"the best out of people and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":88.06,"endTime":91.69,"body":"himself through his commitment"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":88.06,"endTime":91.69,"body":"to lifelong learning and the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":91.69,"endTime":96.22,"body":"connection that he has with the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":91.69,"endTime":96.22,"body":"community. In today's podcast,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":96.22,"endTime":99.94,"body":"Frank's pearls of wisdom did not"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":96.22,"endTime":99.94,"body":"disappoint. We were talking all"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":99.94,"endTime":103.36,"body":"things that Joe from the origins"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":99.94,"endTime":103.36,"body":"of Agile to how to effectively"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":103.36,"endTime":107.32,"body":"implement edge agile, to the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":103.36,"endTime":107.32,"body":"difference between agile with a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":107.32,"endTime":112.06,"body":"big A to agile with a little a."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":107.32,"endTime":112.06,"body":"It was a lot of fun chatting"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":112.06,"endTime":114.52,"body":"with Frank, if you're interested"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":112.06,"endTime":114.52,"body":"in learning more about agile,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":114.52,"endTime":119.08,"body":"you should definitely check out"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":114.52,"endTime":119.08,"body":"this podcast. Remember, if you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":119.08,"endTime":122.23,"body":"liked the episode, hit subscribe"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":119.08,"endTime":122.23,"body":"and check us out on Synergy."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":122.26,"endTime":130.93,"body":"iq.com.au Cheers. Welcome back"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":122.26,"endTime":130.93,"body":"to The creating synergy podcast."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":130.93,"endTime":135.85,"body":"My name is Daniel Franco, your"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":130.93,"endTime":135.85,"body":"host and today we have one of my"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":135.85,"endTime":140.17,"body":"favorite human beings. Mr. Frank"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":135.85,"endTime":140.17,"body":"of a silo, welcome to the show."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":141.04,"endTime":141.4,"body":"Thanks."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":143.32,"endTime":144.25,"body":"I'm happy to be"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":143.32,"endTime":144.25,"body":"here"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":145.66,"endTime":148.12,"body":"see sitting over"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":145.66,"endTime":148.12,"body":"there with a little bit of a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":148.12,"endTime":150.76,"body":"head wobble man, you've got a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":148.12,"endTime":150.76,"body":"little bit of a cult following"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":151.3,"endTime":159.28,"body":"in, in the Agile space. Can you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":151.3,"endTime":159.28,"body":"explain to us how you became the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":159.31,"endTime":160.51,"body":"master of Agile?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":160.57,"endTime":164.08,"body":"Oh, gosh, Master"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":160.57,"endTime":164.08,"body":"of agile, that's not my"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":164.08,"endTime":169.24,"body":"shoulders. Look, I have to be"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":164.08,"endTime":169.24,"body":"really humbled that I, I think"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":170.14,"endTime":174.7,"body":"in in Adelaide, in my circles in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":170.14,"endTime":174.7,"body":"Adelaide, where I've lived in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":175.09,"endTime":177.46,"body":"and worked most of my life,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":175.09,"endTime":177.46,"body":"apart from a few stints"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":177.49,"endTime":181.42,"body":"Interstate and overseas have"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":177.49,"endTime":181.42,"body":"definitely got a taste of the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":181.42,"endTime":186.43,"body":"Agile ways of working and appeal"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":181.42,"endTime":186.43,"body":"to me, you know, particularly"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":187.72,"endTime":190.87,"body":"that humanistic people side of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":187.72,"endTime":190.87,"body":"it. Yeah. And it just seemed"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":190.87,"endTime":195.61,"body":"like the right way to work, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":190.87,"endTime":195.61,"body":"know, in the past today and in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":195.61,"endTime":198.88,"body":"the future. So it's something"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":195.61,"endTime":198.88,"body":"that I just became very"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":199.6,"endTime":203.11,"body":"enthusiastic about. And I think"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":199.6,"endTime":203.11,"body":"probably one of the big"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":203.11,"endTime":208.18,"body":"opportunities I've had, in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":203.11,"endTime":208.18,"body":"recent times to participate and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":208.18,"endTime":212.83,"body":"be involved with the Agile"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":208.18,"endTime":212.83,"body":"community in Adelaide and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":212.89,"endTime":217.0,"body":"outside of Adelaide, and even"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":212.89,"endTime":217.0,"body":"through, you know, opportunities"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":217.0,"endTime":220.45,"body":"that came out through COVID last"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":217.0,"endTime":220.45,"body":"year was sort of broadening"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":221.56,"endTime":225.67,"body":"connections outside of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":221.56,"endTime":225.67,"body":"Australia, globally, is that I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":225.67,"endTime":229.54,"body":"just started seeing the value in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":225.67,"endTime":229.54,"body":"connecting with people. So I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":229.54,"endTime":232.3,"body":"think that's the main main"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":229.54,"endTime":232.3,"body":"thing. It's connecting and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":232.45,"endTime":238.36,"body":"having an appetite for wanting"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":232.45,"endTime":238.36,"body":"to share knowledge and learn"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":238.51,"endTime":243.64,"body":"from others and also bring"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":238.51,"endTime":243.64,"body":"people together so they can"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":243.64,"endTime":247.36,"body":"connect and learn. So it's sort"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":243.64,"endTime":247.36,"body":"of this whole multi faceted"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":247.36,"endTime":250.99,"body":"approach. As a result of that. I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":247.36,"endTime":250.99,"body":"think the whole you know, Frank,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":251.32,"endTime":256.09,"body":"Frank Vassallo there, you know,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":251.32,"endTime":256.09,"body":"one of the Agile guys in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":256.09,"endTime":258.4,"body":"Adelaide, maybe I'll just sort"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":256.09,"endTime":258.4,"body":"of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":258.43,"endTime":262.54,"body":"even out of that,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":258.43,"endTime":262.54,"body":"yeah. Now you, you are like,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":262.54,"endTime":265.48,"body":"you're known in the circles,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":262.54,"endTime":265.48,"body":"you've got a large following"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":265.48,"endTime":270.37,"body":"Meetup group in that sort of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":265.48,"endTime":270.37,"body":"Agile space. But realistically,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":270.4,"endTime":274.96,"body":"I think what you're saying is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":270.4,"endTime":274.96,"body":"that following has come from you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":274.96,"endTime":278.32,"body":"actually just being a half"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":274.96,"endTime":278.32,"body":"decent person care and caring"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":278.32,"endTime":282.25,"body":"about people and caring about"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":278.32,"endTime":282.25,"body":"sharing and giving."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":282.87,"endTime":287.01,"body":"Yeah, I think I,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":282.87,"endTime":287.01,"body":"you know, I enjoy the things. If"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":287.01,"endTime":290.01,"body":"I think about things I've really"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":287.01,"endTime":290.01,"body":"enjoyed over the last few years"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":290.01,"endTime":293.46,"body":"in particular, as I got more"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":290.01,"endTime":293.46,"body":"involved with the Agile"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":293.46,"endTime":300.24,"body":"community was just nice seeing"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":293.46,"endTime":300.24,"body":"even just a little bit of You"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":300.24,"endTime":301.89,"body":"know, a little bit of joy, a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":300.24,"endTime":301.89,"body":"little bit of learning that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":301.89,"endTime":304.89,"body":"someone can get or connection,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":301.89,"endTime":304.89,"body":"if I think about things that are"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":304.89,"endTime":309.3,"body":"really put a smile, you know, on"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":304.89,"endTime":309.3,"body":"my dial, and uhm smile, I smile"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":309.3,"endTime":312.09,"body":"quite a lot. And that's what a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":309.3,"endTime":312.09,"body":"trademark is when we're small,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":312.09,"endTime":315.78,"body":"but I think about just just a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":312.09,"endTime":315.78,"body":"small thing, connecting someone"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":315.78,"endTime":320.43,"body":"or just just bringing that bring"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":315.78,"endTime":320.43,"body":"people together and seeing that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":320.43,"endTime":325.95,"body":"happen for no other. No other"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":320.43,"endTime":325.95,"body":"reason, actually, I think also,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":326.67,"endTime":329.79,"body":"as I've got to a point where,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":326.67,"endTime":329.79,"body":"you know, I've been around for a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":329.79,"endTime":333.66,"body":"while I've been working in IT"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":329.79,"endTime":333.66,"body":"for a few decades, but I just"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":333.66,"endTime":338.22,"body":"got to a point where I just had"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":333.66,"endTime":338.22,"body":"no fear, to even put myself out"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":338.22,"endTime":342.84,"body":"there or be that person in the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":338.22,"endTime":342.84,"body":"room. And you know, sometimes it"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":342.84,"endTime":347.01,"body":"wouldn't work. And sometimes it"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":342.84,"endTime":347.01,"body":"would be happy, or just happy"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":347.01,"endTime":350.31,"body":"that I got to a point where I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":347.01,"endTime":350.31,"body":"had just no fear to try"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":350.31,"endTime":350.97,"body":"something out."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":351.389,"endTime":353.669,"body":"Yeah, yeah, I've"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":351.389,"endTime":353.669,"body":"seen you in a couple of those"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":353.669,"endTime":357.299,"body":"events. And I've often thought"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":353.669,"endTime":357.299,"body":"to myself, I don't know, he"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":357.299,"endTime":362.459,"body":"doesn't just rooms, the rooms,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":357.299,"endTime":362.459,"body":"the rooms, the room and owns the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":362.459,"endTime":368.069,"body":"room in the same token. So I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":362.459,"endTime":368.069,"body":"want to ask, before we go"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":368.069,"endTime":373.259,"body":"deeper, you just give us your"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":368.069,"endTime":373.259,"body":"version of what agile is."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":373.78,"endTime":379.12,"body":"Okay? Yes, my"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":373.78,"endTime":379.12,"body":"version, it really touched on"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":379.12,"endTime":382.81,"body":"what I was saying before about"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":379.12,"endTime":382.81,"body":"this. What attracted me to this"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":382.81,"endTime":387.7,"body":"whole sort of Agile ways of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":382.81,"endTime":387.7,"body":"working is that it's very much"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":387.7,"endTime":392.98,"body":"about people. So for me,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":387.7,"endTime":392.98,"body":"particularly over the last, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":392.98,"endTime":398.38,"body":"know, 1015 years, and feel like"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":392.98,"endTime":398.38,"body":"the whole work, working"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":398.38,"endTime":400.6,"body":"environment, a whole world,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":398.38,"endTime":400.6,"body":"we're going through this massive"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":400.6,"endTime":403.21,"body":"transition, and we're sort of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":400.6,"endTime":403.21,"body":"probably in the midst of it at"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":403.21,"endTime":406.36,"body":"the moment where we're going"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":403.21,"endTime":406.36,"body":"from this, what was and what"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":406.36,"endTime":409.6,"body":"worked well, you know, many"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":406.36,"endTime":409.6,"body":"years ago, industrial age into"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":409.6,"endTime":414.76,"body":"this knowledge, knowledge sort"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":409.6,"endTime":414.76,"body":"of base world and complex, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":414.76,"endTime":418.78,"body":"know, complex world and, and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":414.76,"endTime":418.78,"body":"work can be, you know, it can be"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":418.78,"endTime":421.84,"body":"a horrible place, right? And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":418.78,"endTime":421.84,"body":"I've probably had my experiences"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":421.84,"endTime":425.14,"body":"over 30 ideas where it can be,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":421.84,"endTime":425.14,"body":"you know, so so."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":426.55,"endTime":428.71,"body":"I mean, to back"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":426.55,"endTime":428.71,"body":"that up. Yeah, the gallops"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":428.71,"endTime":432.37,"body":"statistics at the moment"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":428.71,"endTime":432.37,"body":"suggests that 85% of people are"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":432.37,"endTime":434.56,"body":"disengaged in the workplace. So"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":432.37,"endTime":434.56,"body":"yes,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":434.59,"endTime":437.29,"body":"yeah, that's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":434.59,"endTime":437.29,"body":"right. So I'm not alone. And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":437.29,"endTime":441.64,"body":"then you have that. So what are"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":437.29,"endTime":441.64,"body":"the 15%? are engaged? And maybe"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":441.67,"endTime":445.09,"body":"15% of your time even? Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":441.67,"endTime":445.09,"body":"when you and that group, you're"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":445.09,"endTime":448.72,"body":"engaged? Yeah, there's time. So"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":445.09,"endTime":448.72,"body":"it's not uncommon, why is that?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":448.99,"endTime":453.58,"body":"A lot of it is probably around?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":448.99,"endTime":453.58,"body":"Well, I think a big part of it"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":453.58,"endTime":457.15,"body":"is around the way, the way that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":453.58,"endTime":457.15,"body":"we work, the way that works"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":457.15,"endTime":461.38,"body":"organized, and the way people"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":457.15,"endTime":461.38,"body":"are organized to do work and the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":461.38,"endTime":466.84,"body":"way that they're treated or"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":461.38,"endTime":466.84,"body":"managed. So when I started"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":466.84,"endTime":471.91,"body":"learning about agile, I started"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":466.84,"endTime":471.91,"body":"learning about, as a lot of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":471.91,"endTime":475.51,"body":"people do, they start learning"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":471.91,"endTime":475.51,"body":"about frameworks and processes,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":475.51,"endTime":478.51,"body":"but then quickly, you know, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":475.51,"endTime":478.51,"body":"start to understand that it's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":478.51,"endTime":481.48,"body":"really a mindset. So it's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":478.51,"endTime":481.48,"body":"really, you know, it's a way of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":481.72,"endTime":483.43,"body":"thinking a way of interacting"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":483.69,"endTime":485.46,"body":"values and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":483.69,"endTime":485.46,"body":"principles, isn't it? That's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":485.46,"endTime":487.47,"body":"right. Yes. purist."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":487.53,"endTime":492.33,"body":"Yeah. So and I,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":487.53,"endTime":492.33,"body":"and I know, a lot of people use"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":492.33,"endTime":496.02,"body":"that term, and I do as well, but"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":492.33,"endTime":496.02,"body":"you've got the difference of, of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":496.02,"endTime":500.94,"body":"being agile versus doing agile,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":496.02,"endTime":500.94,"body":"you know, maybe even use a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":500.94,"endTime":504.15,"body":"capital a wrong guy. And the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":500.94,"endTime":504.15,"body":"little guy on the left says that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":504.15,"endTime":508.17,"body":"doing agile, which is really"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":504.15,"endTime":508.17,"body":"vital, that's, that's where it"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":508.17,"endTime":511.92,"body":"just resonated with me and over,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":508.17,"endTime":511.92,"body":"over, particularly the last 10"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":511.92,"endTime":515.88,"body":"years become a bigger and bigger"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":511.92,"endTime":515.88,"body":"part about the way I think about"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":516.42,"endTime":520.95,"body":"agility, or the way that we"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":516.42,"endTime":520.95,"body":"work. And I guess ultimately, he"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":520.95,"endTime":524.88,"body":"was talking about, you know,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":520.95,"endTime":524.88,"body":"employee engagement, 15%. You"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":524.88,"endTime":529.41,"body":"know, whatever we do in our work"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":524.88,"endTime":529.41,"body":"life, we're doing it with other"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":529.41,"endTime":531.87,"body":"people, our colleagues, other"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":529.41,"endTime":531.87,"body":"employees, and we're doing it"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":531.87,"endTime":536.1,"body":"for customers. So agile for me"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":531.87,"endTime":536.1,"body":"is that humanistic way of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":536.1,"endTime":541.59,"body":"working in a in in the best way"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":536.1,"endTime":541.59,"body":"possible, to keep improving"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":541.92,"endTime":546.51,"body":"yourself, your team, what you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":541.92,"endTime":546.51,"body":"what you do as a company, your"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":546.54,"endTime":550.2,"body":"products and services, and then"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":546.54,"endTime":550.2,"body":"also providing that great"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":550.2,"endTime":553.92,"body":"experience for your customers."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":550.2,"endTime":553.92,"body":"So it's a great way to deliver"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":553.92,"endTime":558.03,"body":"on those outcomes. Yep. And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":553.92,"endTime":558.03,"body":"it's, it's a great way to do it"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":558.18,"endTime":562.44,"body":"in what, what is, effectively a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":558.18,"endTime":562.44,"body":"very complex world at the moment"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":562.44,"endTime":565.62,"body":"and certainly can become more"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":562.44,"endTime":565.62,"body":"complex. Yeah, yeah."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":566.88,"endTime":570.81,"body":"You're a little"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":566.88,"endTime":570.81,"body":"bit of a self proclaimed geek,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":570.81,"endTime":573.72,"body":"when it comes to the head job,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":570.81,"endTime":573.72,"body":"and you even know, the whole"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":573.72,"endTime":578.7,"body":"backstory. You've gone and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":573.72,"endTime":578.7,"body":"actually,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":579.39,"endTime":583.2,"body":"probably gone a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":579.39,"endTime":583.2,"body":"bit too far ahead, sometimes"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":583.5,"endTime":587.94,"body":"these days, like training and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":583.5,"endTime":587.94,"body":"when you get opportunities to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":587.94,"endTime":591.09,"body":"work with teams or organizations"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":587.94,"endTime":591.09,"body":"just and they might just want an"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":591.09,"endTime":595.32,"body":"introduction or starting a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":591.09,"endTime":595.32,"body":"kickoff around agile. Some of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":595.32,"endTime":598.47,"body":"the feedback I've got recently"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":595.32,"endTime":598.47,"body":"was great session could have"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":598.47,"endTime":602.94,"body":"probably done a little bit less"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":598.47,"endTime":602.94,"body":"on the history. So the point"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":602.94,"endTime":603.3,"body":"taken,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":605.13,"endTime":605.67,"body":"lessons"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":605.909,"endTime":608.159,"body":"I got, I got"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":605.909,"endTime":608.159,"body":"pretty excited that was early"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":608.159,"endTime":612.509,"body":"this year because it was"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":608.159,"endTime":612.509,"body":"February, February 2001. So just"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":612.539,"endTime":616.409,"body":"just over 20 years ago that says"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":612.539,"endTime":616.409,"body":"the 20 year anniversary was the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":616.409,"endTime":619.079,"body":"20 year anniversary in February,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":616.409,"endTime":619.079,"body":"and there's a lot there's a lot"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":619.079,"endTime":624.089,"body":"going on globally, there was an"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":619.079,"endTime":624.089,"body":"agile 20 reflect festival that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":624.089,"endTime":625.829,"body":"was created. So it was basically"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":625.86,"endTime":627.54,"body":"I'm so surprised,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":625.86,"endTime":627.54,"body":"you know, this, I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":627.539,"endTime":630.899,"body":"know, got sort"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":627.539,"endTime":630.899,"body":"of caught immersed in that. And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":631.679,"endTime":636.239,"body":"it's 20 years since these, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":631.679,"endTime":636.239,"body":"know, 17 can I say middle aged"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":636.239,"endTime":641.729,"body":"white men, descended on a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":636.239,"endTime":641.729,"body":"mountain up in Utah to ski and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":641.729,"endTime":645.779,"body":"eat and drink and basically went"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":641.729,"endTime":645.779,"body":"there to try to solve, solve a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":645.779,"endTime":648.089,"body":"problem that was bothering them"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":645.779,"endTime":648.089,"body":"and a lot of people around that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":648.089,"endTime":653.789,"body":"time around how to how we could"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":648.089,"endTime":653.789,"body":"develop software better, and was"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":653.789,"endTime":657.419,"body":"so that the Agile movement, if"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":653.789,"endTime":657.419,"body":"you like the, the Agile"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":657.419,"endTime":661.199,"body":"Manifesto, as it's known, which"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":657.419,"endTime":661.199,"body":"is based around, you know, four"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":661.199,"endTime":666.269,"body":"values and 12 principles, it was"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":661.199,"endTime":666.269,"body":"actually the, the manifesto for"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":666.269,"endTime":669.749,"body":"Agile software development."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":666.269,"endTime":669.749,"body":"Yeah. Because it was,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":669.959,"endTime":674.129,"body":"effectively the 17 people"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":669.959,"endTime":674.129,"body":"thought leaders and experts and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":674.129,"endTime":676.979,"body":"proponents of all these"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":674.129,"endTime":676.979,"body":"lightweight software development"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":677.339,"endTime":682.469,"body":"frameworks and techniques that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":677.339,"endTime":682.469,"body":"came together in that time and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":682.499,"endTime":685.559,"body":"came down from the mountain with"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":682.499,"endTime":685.559,"body":"the with the manifesto. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":685.649,"endTime":688.409,"body":"And and over the 20 years, it's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":685.649,"endTime":688.409,"body":"it's, it's, it's become"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":688.409,"endTime":694.199,"body":"something that's, and rightly"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":688.409,"endTime":694.199,"body":"so, and in a good way into sort"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":694.199,"endTime":700.499,"body":"of more outside of software, so"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":694.199,"endTime":700.499,"body":"agile beyond it's grown it. And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":700.859,"endTime":703.559,"body":"so yeah, so there's a there's a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":700.859,"endTime":703.559,"body":"lot of history there. So you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":703.559,"endTime":707.819,"body":"know, the one the one thing that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":703.559,"endTime":707.819,"body":"came to mind that I just learned"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":707.819,"endTime":713.129,"body":"recently, because of this agile"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":707.819,"endTime":713.129,"body":"20 reflect festival, a lot of a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":713.129,"endTime":716.159,"body":"lot of the people there a lot of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":713.129,"endTime":716.159,"body":"events that were run, and I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":716.159,"endTime":719.429,"body":"tapped into a few of them. And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":716.159,"endTime":719.429,"body":"one in particular, from one of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":719.429,"endTime":724.529,"body":"the 17 chaps that were up on up"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":719.429,"endTime":724.529,"body":"on that mountain was Alastair"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":724.529,"endTime":729.599,"body":"Coburn, and he did a he did a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":724.529,"endTime":729.599,"body":"really nice talk. So just point"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":729.599,"endTime":733.769,"body":"people to it. Around the history"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":729.599,"endTime":733.769,"body":"TED Talk, yeah, well, it was"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":733.769,"endTime":736.859,"body":"just a webinar that he did a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":733.769,"endTime":736.859,"body":"number for. Download it. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":736.889,"endTime":741.239,"body":"yeah. So what's the way I just"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":736.889,"endTime":741.239,"body":"if you sort of Google agile 20"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":741.239,"endTime":746.699,"body":"reflect Alistair Coburn okay."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":741.239,"endTime":746.699,"body":"You'll find it. I did a few"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":746.699,"endTime":752.549,"body":"talks. I might even share it"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":746.699,"endTime":752.549,"body":"when I yeah. Show knows that."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":753.179,"endTime":756.539,"body":"Yeah. And he talked about"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":753.179,"endTime":756.539,"body":"something because because one of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":756.539,"endTime":760.289,"body":"the one of the issues I've had"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":756.539,"endTime":760.289,"body":"sometimes is that your agile has"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":760.319,"endTime":764.609,"body":"just become this? In a way,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":760.319,"endTime":764.609,"body":"horrible word, you know, massive"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":764.609,"endTime":765.749,"body":"word. And what does it mean?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":764.609,"endTime":765.749,"body":"Remember,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":765.75,"endTime":767.25,"body":"we had a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":765.75,"endTime":767.25,"body":"different baby once in use, like"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":767.28,"endTime":769.65,"body":"sometimes I don't even like"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":767.28,"endTime":769.65,"body":"bringing up the word agile."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":769.68,"endTime":770.67,"body":"Yeah, I've"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":772.05,"endTime":774.39,"body":"did say that."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":772.05,"endTime":774.39,"body":"And I say it often just wish"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":774.39,"endTime":777.45,"body":"that sometimes we would just"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":774.39,"endTime":777.45,"body":"take that that word out of the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":777.45,"endTime":780.66,"body":"equation, and have the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":777.45,"endTime":780.66,"body":"conversation about, you know,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":780.72,"endTime":783.87,"body":"the way we're working, what"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":780.72,"endTime":783.87,"body":"outcomes we want to achieve. And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":783.87,"endTime":789.72,"body":"then because it just becomes,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":783.87,"endTime":789.72,"body":"can be can be misused, or can be"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":789.72,"endTime":793.56,"body":"a lot of anti patterns that come"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":789.72,"endTime":793.56,"body":"out. Yeah. And agile has, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":793.56,"endTime":795.51,"body":"know, so one of the, for"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":793.56,"endTime":795.51,"body":"example, one of the things I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":795.51,"endTime":799.08,"body":"like to do, initially with with"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":795.51,"endTime":799.08,"body":"people is start to really"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":799.08,"endTime":801.24,"body":"understand what are we talking"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":799.08,"endTime":801.24,"body":"about when we're saying agile,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":801.24,"endTime":803.19,"body":"what does it mean? It might mean"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":801.24,"endTime":803.19,"body":"a lot of different things"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":803.19,"endTime":803.85,"body":"differently."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":803.94,"endTime":806.76,"body":"So communication"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":803.94,"endTime":806.76,"body":"within these. Yes, that's right."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":806.76,"endTime":807.0,"body":"So"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":807.419,"endTime":810.539,"body":"that so that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":807.419,"endTime":810.539,"body":"Alistair Coburn thing that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":810.539,"endTime":813.389,"body":"struck me, which I didn't know"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":810.539,"endTime":813.389,"body":"until just recently was that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":813.779,"endTime":819.059,"body":"they were trying to determine"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":813.779,"endTime":819.059,"body":"what to call this Manifesto. And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":819.089,"endTime":822.389,"body":"they distill the last two words"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":819.089,"endTime":822.389,"body":"that were shortlisted were"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":822.449,"endTime":827.159,"body":"agile, or adaptive. And that to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":822.449,"endTime":827.159,"body":"me, I don't know. That's the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":827.159,"endTime":833.519,"body":"geek for all. That's wonderful."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":827.159,"endTime":833.519,"body":"They just go Well, yeah, I see"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":833.519,"endTime":836.999,"body":"the, I have a preference as"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":833.519,"endTime":836.999,"body":"such, because it's a word but I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":836.999,"endTime":837.689,"body":"under jerkin, you'd"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":837.689,"endTime":840.209,"body":"have a big adapt"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":837.689,"endTime":840.209,"body":"even a little of that. But you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":840.209,"endTime":841.979,"body":"know, the same way you would"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":840.209,"endTime":841.979,"body":"have a job?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":842.789,"endTime":845.339,"body":"Yeah, that's a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":842.789,"endTime":845.339,"body":"hard question. I don't know it,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":845.399,"endTime":849.599,"body":"probably. Because ultimately,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":845.399,"endTime":849.599,"body":"that only that happens, because"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":850.919,"endTime":853.799,"body":"the change or that that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":850.919,"endTime":853.799,"body":"transition to that way of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":853.799,"endTime":858.359,"body":"working is maybe Miss"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":853.799,"endTime":858.359,"body":"misunderstood or misled. And it"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":858.359,"endTime":861.209,"body":"doesn't mean it's easy, it's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":858.359,"endTime":861.209,"body":"easy, right? So it's easier to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":861.209,"endTime":865.829,"body":"do do do something rather than"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":861.209,"endTime":865.829,"body":"be something that's very Yeah."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":866.58,"endTime":871.68,"body":"There's a lot of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":866.58,"endTime":871.68,"body":"that. People take a process or a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":871.68,"endTime":874.86,"body":"framework or a system and run"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":871.68,"endTime":874.86,"body":"with it and and almost believe"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":874.86,"endTime":879.42,"body":"it to be gospel. And yeah, when"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":874.86,"endTime":879.42,"body":"actually, if Look, if there's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":879.42,"endTime":882.84,"body":"anything I know about agile is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":879.42,"endTime":882.84,"body":"that they say these are the four"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":882.84,"endTime":887.67,"body":"values. And these are the 12"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":882.84,"endTime":887.67,"body":"principles, however, do what's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":887.67,"endTime":890.52,"body":"best for your company. Right?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":887.67,"endTime":890.52,"body":"Yeah, it doesn't need to be"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":891.3,"endTime":896.4,"body":"within those parameters. To say,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":891.3,"endTime":896.4,"body":"is that correct?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":896.49,"endTime":898.89,"body":"Yeah, I think"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":896.49,"endTime":898.89,"body":"it's like it's like everything"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":898.89,"endTime":901.74,"body":"right? It's always connected."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":898.89,"endTime":901.74,"body":"And then you can see the good"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":901.74,"endTime":908.31,"body":"and bad of both sides. So one on"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":901.74,"endTime":908.31,"body":"one side. You know, and I and I,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":908.31,"endTime":911.43,"body":"and people like smarter people"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":908.31,"endTime":911.43,"body":"than me or Alistair Coburn and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":911.43,"endTime":915.03,"body":"others, were actually saying, if"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":911.43,"endTime":915.03,"body":"you're if you're going to adopt"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":915.18,"endTime":919.47,"body":"an agile way of working, let's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":915.18,"endTime":919.47,"body":"say adopting, you know, brand a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":919.47,"endTime":924.0,"body":"framework and yeah, that when"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":919.47,"endTime":924.0,"body":"you start, you should follow it"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":924.39,"endTime":928.68,"body":"to the letter right out of the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":924.39,"endTime":928.68,"body":"box vanilla. And, and there's a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":928.68,"endTime":932.37,"body":"reason for that. Right? Right."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":928.68,"endTime":932.37,"body":"So if you're looking at that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":932.37,"endTime":935.67,"body":"particular framework that's been"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":932.37,"endTime":935.67,"body":"developed a news cell, or some"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":935.67,"endTime":938.94,"body":"of these frameworks are in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":935.67,"endTime":938.94,"body":"place, well before 2001, so"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":938.94,"endTime":941.19,"body":"we're, you know, maybe 3040"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":938.94,"endTime":941.19,"body":"minutes for software"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":941.19,"endTime":941.82,"body":"development. Now"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":941.82,"endTime":943.05,"body":"you're saying"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":941.82,"endTime":943.05,"body":"software"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":943.049,"endTime":945.299,"body":"development, or,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":943.049,"endTime":945.299,"body":"you know, this could apply to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":945.299,"endTime":947.699,"body":"anything that you're doing so so"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":945.299,"endTime":947.699,"body":"they"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":947.7,"endTime":950.01,"body":"built it for"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":947.7,"endTime":950.01,"body":"software development? Yeah. And"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":950.01,"endTime":953.94,"body":"you're saying that they're even"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":950.01,"endTime":953.94,"body":"saying it works the same way if"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":953.94,"endTime":955.74,"body":"you keep within those parameters"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":953.94,"endTime":955.74,"body":"for everything?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":956.52,"endTime":961.5,"body":"Well, let's just"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":956.52,"endTime":961.5,"body":"say specifically, for probably"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":961.5,"endTime":964.17,"body":"have to actually talk about a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":961.5,"endTime":964.17,"body":"frame rate to make sense of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":964.17,"endTime":968.82,"body":"this. But and the most common"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":964.17,"endTime":968.82,"body":"one that's used and known and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":968.85,"endTime":972.12,"body":"probably misused is, is Scrum."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":968.85,"endTime":972.12,"body":"Yeah. So and a lot of people"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":972.12,"endTime":976.44,"body":"associate Scrum with agile and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":972.12,"endTime":976.44,"body":"vice versa, which is a nother"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":976.44,"endTime":979.11,"body":"topic might come back to that in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":976.44,"endTime":979.11,"body":"a minute. But Scrum, Scrum is a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":979.11,"endTime":984.24,"body":"product delivery framework. So"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":979.11,"endTime":984.24,"body":"it's effectively a very simple"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":984.24,"endTime":987.78,"body":"process, like combat as well,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":984.24,"endTime":987.78,"body":"combat is another medicine."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":987.96,"endTime":992.94,"body":"Right? So under that whole agile"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":987.96,"endTime":992.94,"body":"approach umbrella, if you like"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":992.97,"endTime":998.76,"body":"umbrella of working in a certain"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":992.97,"endTime":998.76,"body":"way, this mindset underpinned by"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":998.76,"endTime":1003.47,"body":"these values and principles,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":998.76,"endTime":1003.47,"body":"there's probably 4015 framework."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1003.47,"endTime":1005.48,"body":"Yeah, right. And then there's,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1003.47,"endTime":1005.48,"body":"then there's a whole lot of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1005.48,"endTime":1010.37,"body":"practices. So these are the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1005.48,"endTime":1010.37,"body":"things that we that we do. When"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1010.37,"endTime":1014.93,"body":"when you're adopting those."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1010.37,"endTime":1014.93,"body":"It's, you know, my my standpoint"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1014.93,"endTime":1017.42,"body":"has always be if once you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1014.93,"endTime":1017.42,"body":"determine that, that's the best"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1017.42,"endTime":1021.17,"body":"thing to try, is that when you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1017.42,"endTime":1021.17,"body":"start out, particularly if"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1021.17,"endTime":1026.75,"body":"you're, it's new is taken out of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1021.17,"endTime":1026.75,"body":"the box, vanilla and apply. But"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1026.75,"endTime":1029.21,"body":"what we tend to do is we may"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1026.75,"endTime":1029.21,"body":"quickly start to bend it and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1029.21,"endTime":1031.58,"body":"break the rules, and then it"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1029.21,"endTime":1031.58,"body":"doesn't it doesn't work the way"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1031.58,"endTime":1034.07,"body":"intended Yeah, and we do that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1031.58,"endTime":1034.07,"body":"because we haven't done the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1034.07,"endTime":1038.51,"body":"other work. Okay to change our"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1034.07,"endTime":1038.51,"body":"mindset culture."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1038.75,"endTime":1040.61,"body":"Bring away that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1038.75,"endTime":1040.61,"body":"on work leaders. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1040.61,"endTime":1043.82,"body":"it's a big, big"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1040.61,"endTime":1043.82,"body":"part of it. I think what I've"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1043.82,"endTime":1047.36,"body":"learned over the last 10 or so"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1043.82,"endTime":1047.36,"body":"years of applying these agile"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1047.42,"endTime":1051.26,"body":"frameworks is Yeah, I'd rather"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1047.42,"endTime":1051.26,"body":"go in and not talk about agile,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1052.76,"endTime":1056.96,"body":"understand the what's what's the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1052.76,"endTime":1056.96,"body":"what's the culture? What's the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1056.96,"endTime":1059.57,"body":"outcomes? What's the leadership?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1056.96,"endTime":1059.57,"body":"What are the what's the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1059.57,"endTime":1062.57,"body":"capability in the team, and then"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1059.57,"endTime":1062.57,"body":"start working through you know,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1062.57,"endTime":1065.45,"body":"starting from where we are and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1062.57,"endTime":1065.45,"body":"having some sort of evolution"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1065.45,"endTime":1069.32,"body":"about we want to get to, and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1065.45,"endTime":1069.32,"body":"then part of that might be okay,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1069.32,"endTime":1072.2,"body":"we're going to bring in some"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1069.32,"endTime":1072.2,"body":"agile ways of working, we're"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1072.2,"endTime":1075.68,"body":"going to look at Yeah, this"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1072.2,"endTime":1075.68,"body":"framework, these practices Yes,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1075.71,"endTime":1078.35,"body":"start from and then as you start"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1075.71,"endTime":1078.35,"body":"using them and get better at"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1078.35,"endTime":1082.82,"body":"them, then you can sort of adapt"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1078.35,"endTime":1082.82,"body":"them a little bit. Yeah. So"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1083.21,"endTime":1086.9,"body":"again, better person, I'd"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1083.21,"endTime":1086.9,"body":"definitely written books and all"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1086.9,"endTime":1091.01,"body":"sorts. Alistair Coburn talks"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1086.9,"endTime":1091.01,"body":"about Shu Hari right which is"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1091.07,"endTime":1100.85,"body":"shoe follow the rule ha This is"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1091.07,"endTime":1100.85,"body":"the next stage of mastery be the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1100.85,"endTime":1105.89,"body":"rule and then the re is like"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1100.85,"endTime":1105.89,"body":"follow the rule bend the rule"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1105.89,"endTime":1109.61,"body":"make the rule so when you get to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1105.89,"endTime":1109.61,"body":"that level, then you so when you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1109.61,"endTime":1111.11,"body":"start you should start just"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1109.61,"endTime":1111.11,"body":"settling"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1111.11,"endTime":1112.91,"body":"in karate move"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1111.11,"endTime":1112.91,"body":"you know yeah."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1114.08,"endTime":1120.83,"body":"And I cost me"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1114.08,"endTime":1120.83,"body":"lasagna. I used I use whatever I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1120.83,"endTime":1125.78,"body":"use this Xu Hari when I work"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1120.83,"endTime":1125.78,"body":"with teams and I say for"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1125.78,"endTime":1129.56,"body":"example, if I'm going to make a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1125.78,"endTime":1129.56,"body":"lasagna Yeah, I have to follow"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1129.56,"endTime":1133.01,"body":"the recipe right it's almost"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1129.56,"endTime":1133.01,"body":"shoe design and it will come out"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1133.01,"endTime":1136.67,"body":"or follow the recipe Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1133.01,"endTime":1136.67,"body":"exactly to the letter if my wife"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1136.97,"endTime":1139.7,"body":"Yeah, Michael is Anya she can"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1136.97,"endTime":1139.7,"body":"look in the pantry look in the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1139.7,"endTime":1143.36,"body":"fridge. She can be wrong she can"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1139.7,"endTime":1143.36,"body":"just adapt a little bit just"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1143.36,"endTime":1148.19,"body":"break the rule. Yeah. Whereas my"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1143.36,"endTime":1148.19,"body":"my lovely Mum, she's a ri right"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1148.19,"endTime":1151.34,"body":"she she is the rule. She just"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1148.19,"endTime":1151.34,"body":"makes the lasagna. She says"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1151.34,"endTime":1155.48,"body":"she's at that mastery, live"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1151.34,"endTime":1155.48,"body":"experience. Yeah. So yeah,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1155.51,"endTime":1158.21,"body":"from someone who"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1155.51,"endTime":1158.21,"body":"else he's sitting here he's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1158.21,"endTime":1161.03,"body":"Italian I completely appreciate"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1158.21,"endTime":1161.03,"body":"that. But now you're making me"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1161.03,"endTime":1161.87,"body":"hungry."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1164.39,"endTime":1166.88,"body":"I am hungry and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1164.39,"endTime":1166.88,"body":"I for weeks I kept asking me"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1166.88,"endTime":1170.63,"body":"when I was bringing the lasagna"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1166.88,"endTime":1170.63,"body":"to travel and we did we did"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1170.75,"endTime":1171.44,"body":"that's brilliant."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1171.86,"endTime":1173.69,"body":"I like that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1171.86,"endTime":1173.69,"body":"analogy though. I want to go"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1173.69,"endTime":1177.2,"body":"back to the 17 guys sitting"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1173.69,"endTime":1177.2,"body":"around people sitting in a room"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1177.38,"endTime":1184.16,"body":"who trying to solve a problem So"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1177.38,"endTime":1184.16,"body":"traditionally it's boss says I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1184.16,"endTime":1186.92,"body":"want to create this team goes"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1184.16,"endTime":1186.92,"body":"off and creates it and then"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1186.92,"endTime":1190.61,"body":"customer gets it right is that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1186.92,"endTime":1190.61,"body":"sort of in in its most basic"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1190.61,"endTime":1195.29,"body":"Yeah. What what what's the what"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1190.61,"endTime":1195.29,"body":"why did they see that as a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1195.29,"endTime":1195.92,"body":"problem?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1196.43,"endTime":1198.95,"body":"Well, I think"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1196.43,"endTime":1198.95,"body":"that the sort of problems and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1198.98,"endTime":1202.49,"body":"and I was a developer I was"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1198.98,"endTime":1202.49,"body":"cutting code or just sort of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1203.09,"endTime":1206.96,"body":"going into project management"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1203.09,"endTime":1206.96,"body":"around that time. And you still"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1206.99,"endTime":1209.84,"body":"you still see it today,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1206.99,"endTime":1209.84,"body":"particularly in that sort of, in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1209.84,"endTime":1214.16,"body":"that it, delivery world. So you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1209.84,"endTime":1214.16,"body":"think you're dealing with stuff"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1214.16,"endTime":1218.33,"body":"that's quite ambiguous. And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1214.16,"endTime":1218.33,"body":"anyone that's been involved in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1218.33,"endTime":1221.81,"body":"any sort of software or products"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1218.33,"endTime":1221.81,"body":"that are being that are"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1221.81,"endTime":1225.26,"body":"emerging, you know, the worst"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1221.81,"endTime":1225.26,"body":"thing you can have is that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1225.26,"endTime":1228.32,"body":"traditional approach sort of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1225.26,"endTime":1228.32,"body":"engineering approach where we"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1228.32,"endTime":1231.89,"body":"try to capture a whole lot of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1228.32,"endTime":1231.89,"body":"requirements, and then people go"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1231.89,"endTime":1234.95,"body":"off into a room and build it,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1231.89,"endTime":1234.95,"body":"then come back, months later,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1234.95,"endTime":1238.34,"body":"and then show the customer. And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1234.95,"endTime":1238.34,"body":"invariably, a couple of things"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1238.34,"endTime":1242.57,"body":"happen. The world's changed,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1238.34,"endTime":1242.57,"body":"your views have changed, I seen"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1242.57,"endTime":1244.85,"body":"something and then something"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1242.57,"endTime":1244.85,"body":"else, basically, if it takes"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1244.88,"endTime":1247.55,"body":"longer than a month, right,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1244.88,"endTime":1247.55,"body":"yeah. And then so well, so"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1247.55,"endTime":1251.84,"body":"there's all sorts of angles that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1247.55,"endTime":1251.84,"body":"the time around proach, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1251.84,"endTime":1256.91,"body":"know, things taking too long,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1251.84,"endTime":1256.91,"body":"costing too much money. And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1256.91,"endTime":1259.55,"body":"we're not getting what we want"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1256.91,"endTime":1259.55,"body":"at one end, right. And then on"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1259.55,"endTime":1262.1,"body":"the other end, you've got these"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1259.55,"endTime":1262.1,"body":"people like myself that were"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1262.1,"endTime":1265.73,"body":"cutting code and developing, and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1262.1,"endTime":1265.73,"body":"we weren't, we couldn't get"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1265.73,"endTime":1269.42,"body":"access to people, we couldn't"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1265.73,"endTime":1269.42,"body":"get feedback. And then, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1269.42,"endTime":1272.63,"body":"know, you're sort of working."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1269.42,"endTime":1272.63,"body":"You know, sometimes you felt"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1272.63,"endTime":1274.73,"body":"like you were like mushrooms"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1272.63,"endTime":1274.73,"body":"working in the dark. And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1274.73,"endTime":1278.87,"body":"eventually, you're in sort of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1274.73,"endTime":1278.87,"body":"the tail on the dog, right? And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1278.87,"endTime":1280.7,"body":"you're getting, you're getting,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1278.87,"endTime":1280.7,"body":"you're getting the gig and we"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1280.7,"endTime":1285.44,"body":"walked, right, so not not a good"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1280.7,"endTime":1285.44,"body":"environment. And that's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1285.62,"endTime":1290.21,"body":"effectively in 2001. Like I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1285.62,"endTime":1290.21,"body":"said, a lot of those frameworks,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1290.21,"endTime":1293.66,"body":"those lightweight methods are"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1290.21,"endTime":1293.66,"body":"already in play. So they're"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1293.66,"endTime":1296.3,"body":"actually coming together. I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1293.66,"endTime":1296.3,"body":"think they're meeting quite"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1296.33,"endTime":1300.08,"body":"often around that time, and some"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1296.33,"endTime":1300.08,"body":"others, on that particular time,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1300.08,"endTime":1303.35,"body":"they thought they need to come"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1300.08,"endTime":1303.35,"body":"out, come up with some ideas to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1303.41,"endTime":1306.14,"body":"develop this Manifesto, which"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1303.41,"endTime":1306.14,"body":"has been something then that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1306.14,"endTime":1311.06,"body":"spawned out this agile movement."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1306.14,"endTime":1311.06,"body":"And in the last 20 years, it's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1311.06,"endTime":1315.56,"body":"it's it's definitely moved"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1311.06,"endTime":1315.56,"body":"beyond it. And for a lot of a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1315.56,"endTime":1320.45,"body":"lot of reasons that that way of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1315.56,"endTime":1320.45,"body":"working, just suits really well"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1320.45,"endTime":1324.92,"body":"with our complex world. And the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1320.45,"endTime":1324.92,"body":"type of work that we do. I mean,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1325.28,"endTime":1328.31,"body":"there aren't many companies now"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1325.28,"endTime":1328.31,"body":"that haven't got the can call"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1328.31,"endTime":1331.52,"body":"themselves some sort of it or"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1328.31,"endTime":1331.52,"body":"software company in some shape"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1331.52,"endTime":1332.06,"body":"or form."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1332.09,"endTime":1335.87,"body":"Yeah, this is a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1332.09,"endTime":1335.87,"body":"talk that all companies and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1335.87,"endTime":1339.95,"body":"software companies these, yes,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1335.87,"endTime":1339.95,"body":"some sort of software in their"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1339.95,"endTime":1342.47,"body":"business, whether it be"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1339.95,"endTime":1342.47,"body":"Microsoft 365, or Google,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1342.47,"endTime":1348.14,"body":"whatever it might be. What, you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1342.47,"endTime":1348.14,"body":"know, you've gone off on I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1348.14,"endTime":1351.77,"body":"recently went through COVID, you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1348.14,"endTime":1351.77,"body":"went off and started your own"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1351.77,"endTime":1355.34,"body":"business, you're working for"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1351.77,"endTime":1355.34,"body":"businesses throughout your whole"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1355.34,"endTime":1359.63,"body":"life. But recently, in the past"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1355.34,"endTime":1359.63,"body":"12 months, you started your own"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1359.66,"endTime":1363.17,"body":"effective. So congratulations."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1359.66,"endTime":1363.17,"body":"Thank you. Thank you very much"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1363.2,"endTime":1367.7,"body":"great work. When you walk into"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1363.2,"endTime":1367.7,"body":"an organization now to help them"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1367.7,"endTime":1370.64,"body":"or you speak to a leader to help"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1367.7,"endTime":1370.64,"body":"them they've called you and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1370.64,"endTime":1375.47,"body":"said, We need help. What is what"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1370.64,"endTime":1375.47,"body":"does that look like? How does a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1375.74,"endTime":1381.11,"body":"How does a business decide? Rado"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1375.74,"endTime":1381.11,"body":"need help with Project"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1381.11,"endTime":1383.81,"body":"Management methodologies? or"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1381.11,"endTime":1383.81,"body":"whatever it might be?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1383.84,"endTime":1386.63,"body":"Yeah, there's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1383.84,"endTime":1386.63,"body":"probably some recognition that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1387.62,"endTime":1392.81,"body":"either they want to uplift"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1387.62,"endTime":1392.81,"body":"existing capability in Agile"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1392.81,"endTime":1395.27,"body":"ways of working and wait, maybe"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1392.81,"endTime":1395.27,"body":"the way they're delivering"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1395.69,"endTime":1399.02,"body":"projects or products or the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1395.69,"endTime":1399.02,"body":"services they provide, or"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1399.26,"endTime":1402.77,"body":"there's some sources of, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1399.26,"endTime":1402.77,"body":"know, dissatisfaction and pain"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1402.77,"endTime":1405.83,"body":"points or some opportunities I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1402.77,"endTime":1405.83,"body":"want to explore. I thought I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1405.83,"endTime":1413.03,"body":"find it interesting still, that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1405.83,"endTime":1413.03,"body":"I've still meet organizations"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1413.03,"endTime":1417.65,"body":"that it's relatively new to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1413.03,"endTime":1417.65,"body":"them, I find that I always find"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1417.65,"endTime":1418.1,"body":"that a little"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1418.3,"endTime":1421.09,"body":"the hot. So they"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1418.3,"endTime":1421.09,"body":"have not been aware of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1421.12,"endTime":1424.87,"body":"Yeah, well, just"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1421.12,"endTime":1424.87,"body":"not not. Yeah, maybe have some"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1424.87,"endTime":1429.13,"body":"awareness. But yeah, probably at"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1424.87,"endTime":1429.13,"body":"the end of the spectrum, that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1429.16,"endTime":1435.55,"body":"just still surprises me. So and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1429.16,"endTime":1435.55,"body":"maybe, you know, and that's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1435.55,"endTime":1438.7,"body":"maybe judgmental, just thinking"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1435.55,"endTime":1438.7,"body":"about that. But you know, the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1438.7,"endTime":1443.68,"body":"most common common reason that I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1438.7,"endTime":1443.68,"body":"would go into help, or, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1443.68,"endTime":1447.79,"body":"know, support or coach or train"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1443.68,"endTime":1447.79,"body":"would be to live some capability"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1447.79,"endTime":1451.3,"body":"within a team. And their"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1447.79,"endTime":1451.3,"body":"understanding of it, their"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1451.3,"endTime":1453.73,"body":"understanding is and are you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1451.3,"endTime":1453.73,"body":"surprised?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1455.06,"endTime":1457.85,"body":"Not just just that, okay, I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1455.06,"endTime":1457.85,"body":"guess it's only because I've"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1457.85,"endTime":1460.07,"body":"been exposed to it for a long"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1457.85,"endTime":1460.07,"body":"time. And you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1460.07,"endTime":1462.2,"body":"know, and these"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1460.07,"endTime":1462.2,"body":"people that you don't know what"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1462.2,"endTime":1464.66,"body":"you don't know, right? Yeah."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1462.2,"endTime":1464.66,"body":"Yeah. And while they're calling"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1464.66,"endTime":1464.9,"body":"you,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1464.93,"endTime":1470.81,"body":"yeah, yeah, I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1464.93,"endTime":1470.81,"body":"guess. But I think it's in some"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1470.81,"endTime":1473.96,"body":"cases, but everyone's at a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1470.81,"endTime":1473.96,"body":"different state. Yeah. Right."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1473.96,"endTime":1479.54,"body":"And, and to be fair, most most"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1473.96,"endTime":1479.54,"body":"of the time, I meet with people"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1479.54,"endTime":1482.3,"body":"and they they've, there's a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1479.54,"endTime":1482.3,"body":"knowledge gap, right, or"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1482.3,"endTime":1485.09,"body":"knowledge doing sort of gap. I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1482.3,"endTime":1485.09,"body":"would actually say that you're"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1485.09,"endTime":1487.85,"body":"probably more agile than you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1485.09,"endTime":1487.85,"body":"think. Right? And generally they"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1487.85,"endTime":1492.98,"body":"are. It's just shifting the way"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1487.85,"endTime":1492.98,"body":"they think about the way they"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1492.98,"endTime":1496.85,"body":"work. And then maybe being"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1492.98,"endTime":1496.85,"body":"prepared to try different"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1496.85,"endTime":1497.57,"body":"practices."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1497.6,"endTime":1500.69,"body":"Yeah, just yeah."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1497.6,"endTime":1500.69,"body":"questioning their everyday And"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1500.69,"endTime":1503.45,"body":"actually just putting it within"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1500.69,"endTime":1503.45,"body":"a framework? Yes, they might"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1503.45,"endTime":1506.12,"body":"just feel like they're out there"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1503.45,"endTime":1506.12,"body":"airy fairy? Or actually, no, I'm"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1506.15,"endTime":1510.56,"body":"probably doing three or four of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1506.15,"endTime":1510.56,"body":"these points, right? So bring it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1510.56,"endTime":1512.66,"body":"on your head or bring it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1510.56,"endTime":1512.66,"body":"together, how do I add these"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1512.66,"endTime":1515.57,"body":"extra ones to become more"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1512.66,"endTime":1515.57,"body":"efficient? Yeah, we see the same"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1515.6,"endTime":1519.11,"body":"thing with leadership. And the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1515.6,"endTime":1519.11,"body":"coaching that we do within"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1519.11,"endTime":1523.79,"body":"Synergy IQ, it's where, you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1519.11,"endTime":1523.79,"body":"know, we go and do a workshop"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1523.79,"endTime":1528.2,"body":"for, you know, a team building a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1523.79,"endTime":1528.2,"body":"leadership team building web"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1528.2,"endTime":1531.29,"body":"program, or something like that,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1528.2,"endTime":1531.29,"body":"where we've got, you know, 30"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1531.29,"endTime":1535.91,"body":"different leaders moving the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1531.29,"endTime":1535.91,"body":"business in one room. And it's,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1535.94,"endTime":1539.99,"body":"it's really, a can be quite"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1535.94,"endTime":1539.99,"body":"difficult because you do have"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1539.99,"endTime":1543.62,"body":"different levels of leadership."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1539.99,"endTime":1543.62,"body":"Yeah, you got those who are so"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1543.62,"endTime":1547.28,"body":"much more self aware, than those"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1543.62,"endTime":1547.28,"body":"who have been promoted into a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1547.28,"endTime":1549.65,"body":"role because of their technical"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1547.28,"endTime":1549.65,"body":"ability, you don't really"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1549.65,"endTime":1553.25,"body":"haven't really led people"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1549.65,"endTime":1553.25,"body":"before. So you I mean, you would"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1553.25,"endTime":1556.79,"body":"see the same thing with your,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1553.25,"endTime":1556.79,"body":"with your work."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1556.82,"endTime":1559.55,"body":"That's right."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1556.82,"endTime":1559.55,"body":"Yeah. And, and a lot of cases,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1560.06,"endTime":1562.46,"body":"people have come together from"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1560.06,"endTime":1562.46,"body":"different teams or different"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1562.46,"endTime":1566.36,"body":"organizations and maybe have had"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1562.46,"endTime":1566.36,"body":"a flavor of this way of working"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1566.36,"endTime":1569.57,"body":"or, you know, where they work"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1566.36,"endTime":1569.57,"body":"before they had a, you know, a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1569.57,"endTime":1571.85,"body":"certain type of culture or a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1569.57,"endTime":1571.85,"body":"certain type of way they were"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1571.85,"endTime":1575.15,"body":"led or a certain team"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1571.85,"endTime":1575.15,"body":"environment. And, and they would"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1575.15,"endTime":1579.56,"body":"apply different frameworks in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1575.15,"endTime":1579.56,"body":"different ways. So then coming,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1579.62,"endTime":1583.22,"body":"bring them together for a new"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1579.62,"endTime":1583.22,"body":"project, or a new product or a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1583.22,"endTime":1587.6,"body":"new team. It's really about"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1583.22,"endTime":1587.6,"body":"creating, and co creating a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1587.6,"endTime":1591.05,"body":"common agreed way of working,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1587.6,"endTime":1591.05,"body":"and then and then helping them"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1591.05,"endTime":1594.41,"body":"work through that, you know, in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1591.05,"endTime":1594.41,"body":"making those work, you know,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1594.44,"endTime":1597.56,"body":"incremental change, I have to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1594.44,"endTime":1597.56,"body":"admit that years ago was I had"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1597.56,"endTime":1600.74,"body":"no patience about this stuff. I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1597.56,"endTime":1600.74,"body":"had, you know, if I was working"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1600.74,"endTime":1602.6,"body":"somewhere, and we're going to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1600.74,"endTime":1602.6,"body":"adopt this way of working, I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1602.6,"endTime":1606.77,"body":"wanted it to be Yeah, Big Bang,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1602.6,"endTime":1606.77,"body":"overnight, but now, it's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1606.77,"endTime":1610.85,"body":"definitely, you know, because we"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1606.77,"endTime":1610.85,"body":"don't have that luxury also, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1610.85,"endTime":1614.42,"body":"know, a lot of times working"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1610.85,"endTime":1614.42,"body":"with teams, and they still have"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1614.42,"endTime":1616.82,"body":"to deliver, you know, their"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1614.42,"endTime":1616.82,"body":"business as usual, or whatever"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1616.82,"endTime":1619.61,"body":"they've been doing up until that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1616.82,"endTime":1619.61,"body":"point. So it's not like you can"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1619.61,"endTime":1621.8,"body":"just you don't want to throw"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1619.61,"endTime":1621.8,"body":"everything out. Yeah, it would"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1621.8,"endTime":1626.57,"body":"be completely wrong, is need to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1621.8,"endTime":1626.57,"body":"start having more Yeah, it's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1626.57,"endTime":1630.11,"body":"just a bit more of a patient"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1626.57,"endTime":1630.11,"body":"approach from you know, start"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1630.11,"endTime":1634.34,"body":"from where you are, really,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1630.11,"endTime":1634.34,"body":"really observe what's going on"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1634.34,"endTime":1636.17,"body":"and start working through more"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1636.17,"endTime":1637.46,"body":"substantial"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1636.17,"endTime":1637.46,"body":"change."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1637.55,"endTime":1641.03,"body":"Yeah. Over time."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1637.55,"endTime":1641.03,"body":"Yeah. It's there's no real end"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1641.03,"endTime":1644.45,"body":"point, either. It's not like you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1641.03,"endTime":1644.45,"body":"get to a point where we were,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1644.48,"endTime":1649.01,"body":"we're agile now. You know, we're"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1644.48,"endTime":1649.01,"body":"adaptive. Yeah. It's on Joe."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1649.01,"endTime":1651.59,"body":"Your lasagna"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1649.01,"endTime":1651.59,"body":"example is a great one. That's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1651.59,"endTime":1653.63,"body":"right. Stop making lasagna is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1651.59,"endTime":1653.63,"body":"not at"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1653.66,"endTime":1659.27,"body":"all. That's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1653.66,"endTime":1659.27,"body":"right. And sorry, I'm sure. This"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1659.27,"endTime":1660.95,"body":"is the wrong time of day to be"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1659.27,"endTime":1660.95,"body":"talking about."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1661.62,"endTime":1666.66,"body":"There's a pizza"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1661.62,"endTime":1666.66,"body":"shop down. Yeah. I think there"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1667.83,"endTime":1674.52,"body":"we go on there after this. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1667.83,"endTime":1674.52,"body":"How? How would this fail when"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1674.52,"endTime":1678.12,"body":"you go into work, when you go"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1674.52,"endTime":1678.12,"body":"into work with the company, and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1678.12,"endTime":1685.44,"body":"they say to you, Frank, we want"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1678.12,"endTime":1685.44,"body":"to become more agile? What's the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1685.44,"endTime":1686.01,"body":"caveat?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1687.68,"endTime":1690.38,"body":"Yeah, well,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1687.68,"endTime":1690.38,"body":"it's, it's, it's, it's, it's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1690.38,"endTime":1694.97,"body":"easy for for this to fail."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1690.38,"endTime":1694.97,"body":"Because even though a lot of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1694.97,"endTime":1698.93,"body":"this is quite simple, like, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1694.97,"endTime":1698.93,"body":"know, you read the four values"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1698.93,"endTime":1701.6,"body":"that make sense with the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1698.93,"endTime":1701.6,"body":"principles, you look at these"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1701.6,"endTime":1708.86,"body":"frameworks, they're just simple,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1701.6,"endTime":1708.86,"body":"but it's incredibly hard to, to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1708.86,"endTime":1712.19,"body":"implement execute, because it's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1708.86,"endTime":1712.19,"body":"disciplined enough to Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1712.19,"endTime":1715.07,"body":"well, it's because of the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1712.19,"endTime":1715.07,"body":"change. It's just it's a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1715.07,"endTime":1719.69,"body":"significant change in and always"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1715.07,"endTime":1719.69,"body":"look at it in, in in a few"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1719.69,"endTime":1723.5,"body":"levels, right? So you've got"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1719.69,"endTime":1723.5,"body":"individuals, right, particularly"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1723.5,"endTime":1726.77,"body":"cuz I do a lot of work with"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1723.5,"endTime":1726.77,"body":"teams. So there's individuals,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1727.28,"endTime":1730.01,"body":"right across the organization,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1727.28,"endTime":1730.01,"body":"but in the teams, and even"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1730.01,"endTime":1735.38,"body":"though everyone is an individual"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1730.01,"endTime":1735.38,"body":"person, then you've got teams,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1735.89,"endTime":1741.35,"body":"maybe, whatever, 579 people in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1735.89,"endTime":1741.35,"body":"the multiple teams. So you've"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1741.35,"endTime":1743.9,"body":"got all these teams, and you got"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1741.35,"endTime":1743.9,"body":"all these leaders, and you've"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1743.9,"endTime":1747.44,"body":"got the whole organization. So"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1743.9,"endTime":1747.44,"body":"you've got culture, leadership,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1747.71,"endTime":1750.89,"body":"the way people work as teams and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1747.71,"endTime":1750.89,"body":"the individuals very, really"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1750.89,"endTime":1755.24,"body":"complex, right? So there's lots"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1750.89,"endTime":1755.24,"body":"of ways for it, not to work,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1755.24,"endTime":1761.27,"body":"because trying to get everyone"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1755.24,"endTime":1761.27,"body":"to shift and work in a new way,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1761.42,"endTime":1763.97,"body":"especially from"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1761.42,"endTime":1763.97,"body":"an organizational level. That's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1763.97,"endTime":1767.0,"body":"right. Yeah. So it's working"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1763.97,"endTime":1767.0,"body":"with the IT team, for example, a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1767.69,"endTime":1769.01,"body":"bit easier. But when you have"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1767.69,"endTime":1769.01,"body":"to,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1769.25,"endTime":1771.59,"body":"even that even,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1769.25,"endTime":1771.59,"body":"that's difficult, because this"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1771.59,"endTime":1776.96,"body":"is a common thing that happens."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1771.59,"endTime":1776.96,"body":"And it's happened even when I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1776.96,"endTime":1780.65,"body":"was working within organizations"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1776.96,"endTime":1780.65,"body":"as an agile practitioner, in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1780.65,"endTime":1785.78,"body":"project management or leading"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1780.65,"endTime":1785.78,"body":"teams, Frank, we've got this new"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1785.84,"endTime":1789.62,"body":"project and we can't do it the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1785.84,"endTime":1789.62,"body":"old fashioned way. We've got to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1789.62,"endTime":1793.43,"body":"take this agile approach. So go"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1789.62,"endTime":1793.43,"body":"in there and create a scrum team"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1793.43,"endTime":1797.09,"body":"and, you know, get things done"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1793.43,"endTime":1797.09,"body":"faster and quicker and cheaper."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1797.33,"endTime":1802.01,"body":"And it's like, you know, this"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1797.33,"endTime":1802.01,"body":"Thought earlier? Yeah, great get"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1802.01,"endTime":1804.74,"body":"a chance to do this yeah, when"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1802.01,"endTime":1804.74,"body":"you go and do it is what you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1804.74,"endTime":1807.83,"body":"find is that you just got this"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1804.74,"endTime":1807.83,"body":"little, little pocket down deep"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1807.83,"endTime":1809.96,"body":"in the organization that's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1807.83,"endTime":1809.96,"body":"trying to work this way. But it"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1809.96,"endTime":1813.74,"body":"keeps butting up against. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1809.96,"endTime":1813.74,"body":"the bigger beast. So that's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1813.74,"endTime":1817.7,"body":"where the whole thing falls"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1813.74,"endTime":1817.7,"body":"apart. And that in itself, is"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1817.7,"endTime":1821.99,"body":"probably one of the most common"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1817.7,"endTime":1821.99,"body":"starting points which I see with"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1823.1,"endTime":1828.44,"body":"organizations get wrong, or is"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1823.1,"endTime":1828.44,"body":"when the decisions made, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1828.44,"endTime":1831.08,"body":"know, that want to use this"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1828.44,"endTime":1831.08,"body":"particular framework. So and I'm"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1831.08,"endTime":1834.65,"body":"not picking on Scrum. I love"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1831.08,"endTime":1834.65,"body":"Scrum. It's a great product,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1834.65,"endTime":1838.07,"body":"every framework is simple, but"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1834.65,"endTime":1838.07,"body":"it's hard to implement, and is"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1838.07,"endTime":1841.67,"body":"the right thing to use in a lot"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1838.07,"endTime":1841.67,"body":"of cases. But it's also not the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1841.67,"endTime":1847.73,"body":"right thing to use in certain"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1841.67,"endTime":1847.73,"body":"cases, or it can be used in a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1847.73,"endTime":1851.69,"body":"positive way all the time. I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1847.73,"endTime":1851.69,"body":"really believe that. But I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1851.69,"endTime":1854.0,"body":"believe the same thing about a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1851.69,"endTime":1854.0,"body":"lot of the other frameworks, but"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1854.0,"endTime":1857.15,"body":"Scrum is the one that most"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1854.0,"endTime":1857.15,"body":"people know about, it's the most"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1857.15,"endTime":1861.23,"body":"commonly used. So the starting"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1857.15,"endTime":1861.23,"body":"point is always coming, we want"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1861.23,"endTime":1865.85,"body":"to get this team operating using"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1861.23,"endTime":1865.85,"body":"this agile framework. But the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1865.85,"endTime":1868.73,"body":"whole thing will fall apart if"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1865.85,"endTime":1868.73,"body":"we don't have everything else in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1868.73,"endTime":1872.93,"body":"place, which is we don't have"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1868.73,"endTime":1872.93,"body":"the culture, the organization,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1872.93,"endTime":1876.56,"body":"the leadership that's required."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1872.93,"endTime":1876.56,"body":"You guys that mindset values and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1876.56,"endTime":1881.63,"body":"principles. So a good example,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1876.56,"endTime":1881.63,"body":"looking at a glass of water here"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1881.93,"endTime":1886.43,"body":"is if you think about water,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1881.93,"endTime":1886.43,"body":"right water, you think that's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1886.43,"endTime":1889.58,"body":"the value, the value is the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1886.43,"endTime":1889.58,"body":"water, what we drink what we"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1889.58,"endTime":1894.26,"body":"need. And that if you think of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1889.58,"endTime":1894.26,"body":"that as agile, agile is the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1894.26,"endTime":1900.08,"body":"water. Yep. Right? But a water"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1894.26,"endTime":1900.08,"body":"bottle is is like the framework"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1900.08,"endTime":1903.89,"body":"it holds. It's a container for"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1900.08,"endTime":1903.89,"body":"the water. So Scrum can be the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1903.89,"endTime":1908.57,"body":"water bottle. And the water,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1903.89,"endTime":1908.57,"body":"right? So you put the water into"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1908.57,"endTime":1913.43,"body":"the bottle. And you've got the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1908.57,"endTime":1913.43,"body":"value there Scrum holding the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1913.43,"endTime":1915.86,"body":"water, which is valuable. But if"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1913.43,"endTime":1915.86,"body":"you don't have water, you've"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1915.86,"endTime":1919.28,"body":"just got the bottle. There's no"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1915.86,"endTime":1919.28,"body":"there's there's no value there."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1919.34,"endTime":1922.88,"body":"Or sometimes. The sounds a bit"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1919.34,"endTime":1922.88,"body":"weird, as I'm saying. But"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1922.91,"endTime":1925.34,"body":"sometimes you don't need a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1922.91,"endTime":1925.34,"body":"bottle, you might just need a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1925.34,"endTime":1929.09,"body":"glass. A different a different"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1925.34,"endTime":1929.09,"body":"container, a different frame a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1929.09,"endTime":1932.99,"body":"different frame."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1929.09,"endTime":1932.99,"body":"Yeah. So and that's the other 70"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1933.02,"endTime":1935.45,"body":"might be or"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1933.02,"endTime":1935.45,"body":"other otherwise. So Scrum. Scrum"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1935.45,"endTime":1940.07,"body":"is a great framework, but on its"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1935.45,"endTime":1940.07,"body":"own. Without that agile mindset."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1940.28,"endTime":1940.82,"body":"You know,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1941.15,"endTime":1943.7,"body":"Scrum to me just"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1941.15,"endTime":1943.7,"body":"seems like a bunch, just like"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1943.7,"endTime":1947.3,"body":"and this is a very naive and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1943.7,"endTime":1947.3,"body":"naive or ignorant whatever the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1947.3,"endTime":1952.04,"body":"word is. statement, but it just"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1947.3,"endTime":1952.04,"body":"seems to me a simple goal"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1952.04,"endTime":1956.84,"body":"setting. We want to achieve"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1952.04,"endTime":1956.84,"body":"certain goals in a certain"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1956.84,"endTime":1957.38,"body":"amount of time."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1957.41,"endTime":1961.85,"body":"It's Scrum"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1957.41,"endTime":1961.85,"body":"scrums made up around. It's a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1961.85,"endTime":1966.53,"body":"product level framework, which"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1961.85,"endTime":1966.53,"body":"helps teams collaborate in short"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1966.53,"endTime":1969.02,"body":"feedback loops with their"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1966.53,"endTime":1969.02,"body":"customer. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1969.5,"endTime":1971.78,"body":"From a snap"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1969.5,"endTime":1971.78,"body":"perspective. Yeah. So I guess"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1971.81,"endTime":1974.78,"body":"this is what we want to achieve"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1971.81,"endTime":1974.78,"body":"in the next month and two weeks"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1974.78,"endTime":1978.59,"body":"a week, whatever. Yeah. And then"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1974.78,"endTime":1978.59,"body":"once we've done that, we go to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1978.59,"endTime":1981.02,"body":"the backlog and bringing in you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1978.59,"endTime":1981.02,"body":"Well, that's kind of why am I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":1981.65,"endTime":1982.37,"body":"right? Yeah. It's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1982.43,"endTime":1985.85,"body":"It is a very"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1982.43,"endTime":1985.85,"body":"simple effect. They talk about"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1985.85,"endTime":1990.5,"body":"you know, 343 Scrum is three"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1985.85,"endTime":1990.5,"body":"roles. You know, the, the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1990.5,"endTime":1994.55,"body":"product owner decides what we're"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1990.5,"endTime":1994.55,"body":"gonna do the team who decide how"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1994.55,"endTime":1998.93,"body":"we're gonna do it. Yeah. And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1994.55,"endTime":1998.93,"body":"then they have to the Scrum"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1998.93,"endTime":2002.53,"body":"Master, who is like a servant"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":1998.93,"endTime":2002.53,"body":"leader. Yep. to the to the team"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2002.53,"endTime":2006.52,"body":"and the product owner. And then"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2002.53,"endTime":2006.52,"body":"there's four ceremonies. Yep,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2006.55,"endTime":2009.7,"body":"daily Scrum. And then there's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2006.55,"endTime":2009.7,"body":"the planning what we're going to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2009.7,"endTime":2012.7,"body":"do the next two weeks, at the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2009.7,"endTime":2012.7,"body":"end of the two weeks, review it,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2013.06,"endTime":2015.76,"body":"and then have a retrospective,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2013.06,"endTime":2015.76,"body":"which is a big part of agile and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2015.76,"endTime":2018.79,"body":"then basically three products."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2015.76,"endTime":2018.79,"body":"You just talked about one, the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2018.79,"endTime":2021.43,"body":"backlog. Yeah. What's the next"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2018.79,"endTime":2021.43,"body":"stuff we're gonna take in?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2021.82,"endTime":2025.81,"body":"What's our plan for the next two"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2021.82,"endTime":2025.81,"body":"weeks or whatever? And then the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2025.81,"endTime":2028.09,"body":"actual, the important thing is"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2025.81,"endTime":2028.09,"body":"the product you're delivering?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2028.48,"endTime":2033.37,"body":"Yeah. Yeah, it's simple. That's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2028.48,"endTime":2033.37,"body":"actually a scrum Alliance."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2033.37,"endTime":2036.97,"body":"That's there. I had I used to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2033.37,"endTime":2036.97,"body":"have the T shirt on. So Scrum is"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2036.97,"endTime":2040.66,"body":"still in. Scrum is simple, but"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2036.97,"endTime":2040.66,"body":"it's not easy. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2040.78,"endTime":2043.36,"body":"Yeah, that's most"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2040.78,"endTime":2043.36,"body":"things, isn't it? Really? Yeah."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2043.42,"endTime":2047.26,"body":"It's the concept of most things"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2043.42,"endTime":2047.26,"body":"are fairly simple. It's just the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2047.26,"endTime":2050.8,"body":"discipline to be able to deliver"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2047.26,"endTime":2050.8,"body":"properly. Yeah. So"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2051.01,"endTime":2053.44,"body":"I mean, so for"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2051.01,"endTime":2053.44,"body":"people new to agile are wanting"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2053.44,"endTime":2056.83,"body":"to adopt an agile way of working"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2053.44,"endTime":2056.83,"body":"that will be my number one tip."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2057.13,"endTime":2061.18,"body":"Don't just start you know, don't"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2057.13,"endTime":2061.18,"body":"go to Bunnings and buy a hammer"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2061.33,"endTime":2065.65,"body":"and then come around and start"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2061.33,"endTime":2065.65,"body":"looking fingernails always start"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2065.65,"endTime":2070.06,"body":"with thinking about looking at"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2065.65,"endTime":2070.06,"body":"you know, what your what it is"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2070.06,"endTime":2073.09,"body":"you're trying to achieve, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2070.06,"endTime":2073.09,"body":"know, look at look around the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2073.09,"endTime":2076.18,"body":"environment where's where's the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2073.09,"endTime":2076.18,"body":"pain? Where's the opportunities,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2076.51,"endTime":2079.96,"body":"and then start exploring little"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2076.51,"endTime":2079.96,"body":"things you can change sometimes"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2079.96,"endTime":2084.52,"body":"you can become more, you can"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2079.96,"endTime":2084.52,"body":"definitely become more agile"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2084.52,"endTime":2087.61,"body":"just by starting to remove"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2084.52,"endTime":2087.61,"body":"something. Yeah. So even that is"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2087.61,"endTime":2090.01,"body":"a simple starting point. What"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2087.61,"endTime":2090.01,"body":"can we start to remove?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2090.22,"endTime":2093.88,"body":"So let's just"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2090.22,"endTime":2093.88,"body":"let's use an example then. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2093.97,"endTime":2098.38,"body":"I'm a senior leader that's just"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2093.97,"endTime":2098.38,"body":"been recruited into this new"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2098.38,"endTime":2106.45,"body":"camp into this company. And I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2098.38,"endTime":2106.45,"body":"have worked with agile, what,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2106.48,"endTime":2111.76,"body":"you know, 10 years. And I want"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2106.48,"endTime":2111.76,"body":"to introduce this methodology"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2111.76,"endTime":2117.76,"body":"into this new company. But I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2111.76,"endTime":2117.76,"body":"understand that I need to look"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2117.76,"endTime":2121.03,"body":"at the organization, the culture"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2117.76,"endTime":2121.03,"body":"and where it currently sits."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2121.12,"endTime":2125.05,"body":"Yep. And I pitch this to the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2121.12,"endTime":2125.05,"body":"leadership team. And they're"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2125.05,"endTime":2129.52,"body":"happy with the way we're"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2125.05,"endTime":2129.52,"body":"currently working. Then what"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2129.52,"endTime":2131.14,"body":"happens? Yeah."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2132.43,"endTime":2135.94,"body":"Yeah, that's a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2132.43,"endTime":2135.94,"body":"common uncommon thing. A lot of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2135.94,"endTime":2139.63,"body":"level work because we've done"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2135.94,"endTime":2139.63,"body":"this for 17 years. You know,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2139.66,"endTime":2140.71,"body":"sorry, I heard that the other"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2139.66,"endTime":2140.71,"body":"day."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2140.71,"endTime":2144.34,"body":"Yeah. Why do we"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2140.71,"endTime":2144.34,"body":"need to change were successful?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2144.64,"endTime":2151.12,"body":"Yeah. I start"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2144.64,"endTime":2151.12,"body":"this mantra of definitely what I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2151.12,"endTime":2154.42,"body":"love the most about what I'm"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2151.12,"endTime":2154.42,"body":"doing at the moment is is"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2156.82,"endTime":2163.75,"body":"facilitating co creation amongst"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2156.82,"endTime":2163.75,"body":"people where you know, okay, in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2163.75,"endTime":2165.7,"body":"that case, you've got some"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2163.75,"endTime":2165.7,"body":"people that are thinking one"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2165.7,"endTime":2169.66,"body":"thing this this one person has"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2165.7,"endTime":2169.66,"body":"come in maybe maybe he or she's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2169.66,"endTime":2173.32,"body":"got the most influence so maybe"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2169.66,"endTime":2173.32,"body":"he or she gets her way. Right,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2173.38,"endTime":2175.99,"body":"that can happen too. But"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2173.38,"endTime":2175.99,"body":"ultimately, what's great is"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2176.65,"endTime":2181.15,"body":"being able to take people"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2176.65,"endTime":2181.15,"body":"through and there's lots of lots"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2181.15,"endTime":2184.39,"body":"of great techniques in order to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2181.15,"endTime":2184.39,"body":"do this around understanding"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2184.39,"endTime":2186.97,"body":"what could be possible or what"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2184.39,"endTime":2186.97,"body":"you know, there's always"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2186.97,"endTime":2190.27,"body":"something right unless you've"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2186.97,"endTime":2190.27,"body":"got completely you know, a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2190.27,"endTime":2193.66,"body":"completely closed fixed mindset"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2190.27,"endTime":2193.66,"body":"across the board and everyone"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2193.66,"endTime":2196.42,"body":"just wants things to stay the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2193.66,"endTime":2196.42,"body":"same that's it then good luck"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2196.45,"endTime":2201.46,"body":"right? Yeah, but yeah, so if I'm"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2196.45,"endTime":2201.46,"body":"having that sort of challenge I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2201.46,"endTime":2205.21,"body":"would start to frame it or let's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2201.46,"endTime":2205.21,"body":"let's try an experiment or you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2205.21,"endTime":2209.08,"body":"know like and this is where I've"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2205.21,"endTime":2209.08,"body":"got personally am I've got"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2209.08,"endTime":2213.34,"body":"better over the years I had a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2209.08,"endTime":2213.34,"body":"lot of emotion in the past but I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2213.34,"endTime":2217.72,"body":"will try to still do but you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2213.34,"endTime":2217.72,"body":"know, try to frame things around"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2217.72,"endTime":2222.07,"body":"experiments or actually getting"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2217.72,"endTime":2222.07,"body":"more better at looking at data"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2222.13,"endTime":2226.03,"body":"right and some of that data can"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2222.13,"endTime":2226.03,"body":"be just by going back to what I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2226.03,"endTime":2229.54,"body":"was saying what I'm really"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2226.03,"endTime":2229.54,"body":"enjoying is engaging groups of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2229.54,"endTime":2234.88,"body":"people and giving them to co"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2229.54,"endTime":2234.88,"body":"create by generating ideas and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2234.88,"endTime":2238.15,"body":"insights from from a lot from a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2234.88,"endTime":2238.15,"body":"large from a group of people who"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2238.15,"endTime":2241.81,"body":"will small or large but"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2238.15,"endTime":2241.81,"body":"ultimately then shift to getting"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2241.81,"endTime":2244.6,"body":"them to shift the dial on where"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2241.81,"endTime":2244.6,"body":"they where they want to go and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2244.6,"endTime":2245.8,"body":"what they want to try next."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2247.67,"endTime":2253.28,"body":"So yeah, ladies,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2247.67,"endTime":2253.28,"body":"what it does I think we're I'm I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2253.28,"endTime":2258.89,"body":"guess what I'm trying to dissect"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2253.28,"endTime":2258.89,"body":"is how important is leadership"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2258.89,"endTime":2265.28,"body":"to the success of bringing agile"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2258.89,"endTime":2265.28,"body":"into organization if they're not"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2265.28,"endTime":2269.45,"body":"on board is going to fail"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2265.28,"endTime":2269.45,"body":"straightaway so there's no point"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2269.45,"endTime":2269.51,"body":"yeah,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2270.37,"endTime":2273.37,"body":"forget it. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2270.37,"endTime":2273.37,"body":"yeah, it's it's critical I mean,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2273.37,"endTime":2277.93,"body":"it is never just one thing right"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2273.37,"endTime":2277.93,"body":"so but but that's a unique piece"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2277.93,"endTime":2282.52,"body":"of Yeah, yeah. If you haven't"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2277.93,"endTime":2282.52,"body":"got that then it's it's done"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2282.58,"endTime":2287.05,"body":"defy I'm, I've got a big sort of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2282.58,"endTime":2287.05,"body":"passion was around, you know,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2288.34,"endTime":2292.84,"body":"the future of work. And these"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2288.34,"endTime":2292.84,"body":"very, really progressive, sort"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2292.84,"endTime":2297.19,"body":"of self managing organizations"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2292.84,"endTime":2297.19,"body":"and I'm sort of big, big on that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2297.19,"endTime":2302.5,"body":"read a lot about it and plug in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2297.19,"endTime":2302.5,"body":"my other meetup reinventing"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2302.5,"endTime":2307.15,"body":"work. evelo is really cool. We"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2302.5,"endTime":2307.15,"body":"look at these organizations and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2307.93,"endTime":2311.17,"body":"one of the books that got me"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2307.93,"endTime":2311.17,"body":"into that was Frederick lilou,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2311.56,"endTime":2318.22,"body":"reinventing organizations. And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2311.56,"endTime":2318.22,"body":"they had just I remember reading"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2318.22,"endTime":2320.35,"body":"that book and and getting"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2318.22,"endTime":2320.35,"body":"lighten lighten to the book. And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2320.35,"endTime":2323.11,"body":"then it said, it almost just"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2320.35,"endTime":2323.11,"body":"said, I'm, by the way, if you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2323.11,"endTime":2326.59,"body":"don't have a CEO, or a board"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2323.11,"endTime":2326.59,"body":"that are on board or system,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2326.59,"endTime":2328.15,"body":"Forget it, forget it, okay,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2328.15,"endTime":2329.14,"body":"I should have put"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2328.15,"endTime":2329.14,"body":"that already."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2330.79,"endTime":2334.3,"body":"But, and even"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2330.79,"endTime":2334.3,"body":"even in even in our group, where"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2334.3,"endTime":2337.6,"body":"we come together and talk about"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2334.3,"endTime":2337.6,"body":"frustrations of, you know, we"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2337.63,"endTime":2341.68,"body":"feel it's not about pointing a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2337.63,"endTime":2341.68,"body":"mirror at leader saying you're"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2341.68,"endTime":2344.65,"body":"doing a bad job, it's just that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2341.68,"endTime":2344.65,"body":"things are changing, and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2344.65,"endTime":2347.2,"body":"everything's gonna be different."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2344.65,"endTime":2347.2,"body":"We want distributed decision"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2347.2,"endTime":2349.81,"body":"making one different, you know,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2347.2,"endTime":2349.81,"body":"what's the latest"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2349.84,"endTime":2352.18,"body":"job to remove the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2349.84,"endTime":2352.18,"body":"bollards in the way that they"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2352.18,"endTime":2353.32,"body":"can enable? Yes,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2353.38,"endTime":2355.84,"body":"yeah, to work."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2353.38,"endTime":2355.84,"body":"So if you don't have that, and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2355.84,"endTime":2358.99,"body":"you're trying to adopt agile"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2355.84,"endTime":2358.99,"body":"ways of working or you know, new"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2358.99,"endTime":2364.24,"body":"ways of working, that aligned"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2358.99,"endTime":2364.24,"body":"better to the way we need to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2364.24,"endTime":2369.37,"body":"work to do the work we do, which"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2364.24,"endTime":2369.37,"body":"is knowledge based work. It's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2369.37,"endTime":2372.82,"body":"complex, you know, it's that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2369.37,"endTime":2372.82,"body":"whole vuca, right, volatile,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2373.0,"endTime":2375.94,"body":"uncertain, complex, ambiguous."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2373.0,"endTime":2375.94,"body":"If you don't have that style of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2375.94,"endTime":2379.24,"body":"leadership, then you're going to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2375.94,"endTime":2379.24,"body":"have an which is what we do have"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2379.24,"endTime":2382.99,"body":"84% of people disengaged. But"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2379.24,"endTime":2382.99,"body":"you know, it doesn't mean you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2382.99,"endTime":2386.41,"body":"can introduce an agile if you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2382.99,"endTime":2386.41,"body":"don't introduce agile, poorly,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2386.95,"endTime":2389.5,"body":"you probably still have 85% of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2386.95,"endTime":2389.5,"body":"people disengaged, because you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2389.5,"endTime":2392.38,"body":"need the leadership. You need"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2389.5,"endTime":2392.38,"body":"those. You need all those"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2392.41,"endTime":2395.92,"body":"leaders working together, right,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2392.41,"endTime":2395.92,"body":"the organization, the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2395.92,"endTime":2398.89,"body":"leadership, even the teams right"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2395.92,"endTime":2398.89,"body":"there, this you know, I work"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2398.89,"endTime":2402.49,"body":"with a lot of teams. Some people"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2398.89,"endTime":2402.49,"body":"don't want it, but they still"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2402.49,"endTime":2406.39,"body":"just want to come in and be told"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2402.49,"endTime":2406.39,"body":"what to do and want to work in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2406.39,"endTime":2409.51,"body":"the way they've been working for"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2406.39,"endTime":2409.51,"body":"a long time. They don't see the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2409.51,"endTime":2413.23,"body":"benefit and change in that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2409.51,"endTime":2413.23,"body":"change. They liked the silos"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2413.26,"endTime":2417.4,"body":"where they go, they don't want"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2413.26,"endTime":2417.4,"body":"to collaborate this you know,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2417.46,"endTime":2420.88,"body":"it's it's everyone's got a part"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2417.46,"endTime":2420.88,"body":"to play in it. But, you know,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2421.06,"endTime":2424.18,"body":"intrinsically, I think"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2421.06,"endTime":2424.18,"body":"leadership's got a bigger stake"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2424.18,"endTime":2427.9,"body":"in the game, because they're the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2424.18,"endTime":2427.9,"body":"ones ultimately creating that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2427.9,"endTime":2429.25,"body":"environment. Alright, so"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2429.25,"endTime":2431.68,"body":"I'm that leader"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2429.25,"endTime":2431.68,"body":"that I discussed before this"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2431.68,"endTime":2435.61,"body":"Yeah, that person that comes in"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2431.68,"endTime":2435.61,"body":"and says, We want to move to an"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2435.61,"endTime":2440.47,"body":"agile way of working? How do I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2435.61,"endTime":2440.47,"body":"sell it to the business? How do"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2440.47,"endTime":2443.2,"body":"I paint the picture? What does"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2440.47,"endTime":2443.2,"body":"great look like? What's an"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2443.2,"endTime":2448.21,"body":"organization that is doing? You"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2443.2,"endTime":2448.21,"body":"know, you're working looking at?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2449.41,"endTime":2452.26,"body":"What is an organization? And"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2449.41,"endTime":2452.26,"body":"what does it look like? What"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2452.26,"endTime":2455.59,"body":"does it look like? Yeah, that is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2452.26,"endTime":2455.59,"body":"successful using the Agile"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2455.59,"endTime":2457.0,"body":"methodology? Yeah."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2458.29,"endTime":2461.98,"body":"Yeah, wish Okay,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2458.29,"endTime":2461.98,"body":"I think the first one that comes"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2461.98,"endTime":2469.6,"body":"to mind is Rei group, credit"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2461.98,"endTime":2469.6,"body":"realestate.com. And I haven't"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2469.6,"endTime":2473.8,"body":"worked or been inside that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2469.6,"endTime":2473.8,"body":"organization, but have heard"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2475.33,"endTime":2478.63,"body":"Nigel Dalton, who is no longer"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2475.33,"endTime":2478.63,"body":"with them, but he is he was the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2478.63,"endTime":2483.13,"body":"chief inventor. That was his"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2478.63,"endTime":2483.13,"body":"role chief inventor at the Rei"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2483.13,"endTime":2486.76,"body":"group, pretty cool job and a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2483.13,"endTime":2486.76,"body":"great speaker. He's actually the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2486.76,"endTime":2490.09,"body":"godfather of Agile in Australia."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2486.76,"endTime":2490.09,"body":"And I've heard him speak couple"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2490.09,"endTime":2496.69,"body":"of times. And it's a pretty cool"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2490.09,"endTime":2496.69,"body":"guy, actually, because he"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2496.69,"endTime":2499.87,"body":"actually does not he is one of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2496.69,"endTime":2499.87,"body":"the few people I know, in that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2499.9,"endTime":2502.18,"body":"in that sort of sphere that will"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2499.9,"endTime":2502.18,"body":"he does not have a LinkedIn"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2502.18,"endTime":2506.02,"body":"profile. He's very big on"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2502.18,"endTime":2506.02,"body":"Twitter. Yeah. But Nigel spoke"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2506.02,"endTime":2511.27,"body":"spoke about Rei group. And, and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2506.02,"endTime":2511.27,"body":"I think, for me, this just hit"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2511.27,"endTime":2515.23,"body":"the nail on the head, because he"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2511.27,"endTime":2515.23,"body":"was saying, you know, we are a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2515.23,"endTime":2520.48,"body":"very, you know, agile company."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2515.23,"endTime":2520.48,"body":"And probably, they're probably"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2520.48,"endTime":2523.81,"body":"one of the leaders and agility"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2520.48,"endTime":2523.81,"body":"in Australia for a long time."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2524.26,"endTime":2527.98,"body":"But they don't talk about"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2524.26,"endTime":2527.98,"body":"agility as such, they they sort"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2527.98,"endTime":2531.76,"body":"of get teams to also one of the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2527.98,"endTime":2531.76,"body":"things he talks about as the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2531.76,"endTime":2535.18,"body":"team's self assess themselves on"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2531.76,"endTime":2535.18,"body":"how they're going, okay? And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2535.18,"endTime":2541.36,"body":"they just, they look at five"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2535.18,"endTime":2541.36,"body":"things. Are we visualizing our"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2541.36,"endTime":2545.86,"body":"work? So and when NASA"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2541.36,"endTime":2545.86,"body":"visualizing the meaning is"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2545.86,"endTime":2549.13,"body":"everything that we're doing"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2545.86,"endTime":2549.13,"body":"known to us and everyone else?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2549.73,"endTime":2554.89,"body":"transparency? Is the work"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2549.73,"endTime":2554.89,"body":"prioritize. So everyone knows"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2554.89,"endTime":2558.25,"body":"what's important. We're all"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2554.89,"endTime":2558.25,"body":"focused. That's a big part of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2558.25,"endTime":2560.74,"body":"agility, right? You know, like,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2558.25,"endTime":2560.74,"body":"if you really want to get shit"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2560.74,"endTime":2563.95,"body":"done really was he got a limit?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2560.74,"endTime":2563.95,"body":"limit when it comes with? Yes,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2564.25,"endTime":2567.19,"body":"limit the work in progress. So"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2564.25,"endTime":2567.19,"body":"let's approach so we visualize"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2567.19,"endTime":2571.21,"body":"work, prioritize what we own the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2567.19,"endTime":2571.21,"body":"work. So we own it. So we're not"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2571.21,"endTime":2574.69,"body":"waiting for someone to push"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2571.21,"endTime":2574.69,"body":"something onto us. Now, it's a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2574.69,"endTime":2577.99,"body":"pool system, as a rule, combat"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2574.69,"endTime":2577.99,"body":"principle, we made all the work,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2578.38,"endTime":2581.02,"body":"you're going to own it, if you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2578.38,"endTime":2581.02,"body":"need help, I'm gonna help you."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2582.13,"endTime":2586.39,"body":"So visualized, prioritize, and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2582.13,"endTime":2586.39,"body":"we have daily conversations,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2586.39,"endTime":2589.3,"body":"whatever that means, right? We"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2586.39,"endTime":2589.3,"body":"just were having conversations"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2589.33,"endTime":2591.07,"body":"when I wouldn't behind process,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2591.1,"endTime":2592.63,"body":"we don't"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2591.1,"endTime":2592.63,"body":"necessarily need to stand up, we"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2592.63,"endTime":2594.31,"body":"can sit down, you can sit there,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2594.43,"endTime":2595.81,"body":"you can sit"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2594.43,"endTime":2595.81,"body":"there, I think there's a point"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2595.81,"endTime":2600.16,"body":"to sit down. However you do it."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2595.81,"endTime":2600.16,"body":"Right. Yeah, that's very good"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2600.16,"endTime":2602.86,"body":"point. And then the third and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2600.16,"endTime":2602.86,"body":"final one, which is a really big"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2602.86,"endTime":2607.36,"body":"thing is that you're stopping at"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2602.86,"endTime":2607.36,"body":"regular times to reflect and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2607.36,"endTime":2610.09,"body":"improve. Right, right. And I'm"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2607.36,"endTime":2610.09,"body":"looking at the system and work."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2610.51,"endTime":2615.58,"body":"And so it's really common sense,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2610.51,"endTime":2615.58,"body":"right? Yeah. And, you know,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2616.06,"endTime":2619.57,"body":"again, I'm not I'm not on the,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2616.06,"endTime":2619.57,"body":"on his payroll, but Alistair"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2619.57,"endTime":2624.01,"body":"Coburn, he got frustrated, he"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2619.57,"endTime":2624.01,"body":"got frustrated with the whole"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2624.07,"endTime":2627.73,"body":"agile, you know, industrial"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2624.07,"endTime":2627.73,"body":"complex, and all this stuff that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2627.73,"endTime":2631.69,"body":"was coming out. And I 10 or so"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2627.73,"endTime":2631.69,"body":"years ago, came up with his"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2632.17,"endTime":2634.69,"body":"heart of agile, right? And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2632.17,"endTime":2634.69,"body":"there's a really simple, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2634.69,"endTime":2640.57,"body":"know, collaborate, deliver,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2634.69,"endTime":2640.57,"body":"reflect, improve. And there's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2640.57,"endTime":2643.69,"body":"things but below that, you know,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2640.57,"endTime":2643.69,"body":"it's deeper than just that. But"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2643.72,"endTime":2647.35,"body":"ultimately, this stuff's really"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2643.72,"endTime":2647.35,"body":"simple. And the heart of it is,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2647.41,"endTime":2651.07,"body":"is around the way we do those"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2647.41,"endTime":2651.07,"body":"things. So back to your example"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2651.07,"endTime":2654.52,"body":"before, like, when we're"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2651.07,"endTime":2654.52,"body":"developing software back in the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2654.52,"endTime":2657.16,"body":"day, there was no, it was all"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2654.52,"endTime":2657.16,"body":"thrown over the fence stuff."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2657.34,"endTime":2659.83,"body":"Yeah, throw it over to the next"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2657.34,"endTime":2659.83,"body":"guys. And then the next group"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2659.83,"endTime":2662.02,"body":"and the next group, and yeah,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2659.83,"endTime":2662.02,"body":"yeah,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2662.02,"endTime":2664.99,"body":"so but I think"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2662.02,"endTime":2664.99,"body":"where I'm going this and I'm"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2664.99,"endTime":2669.79,"body":"sorry for putting you on the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2664.99,"endTime":2669.79,"body":"spot. If we can't rattle off 20"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2669.79,"endTime":2672.67,"body":"companies right now, which"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2669.79,"endTime":2672.67,"body":"companies are all doing, how do"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2672.67,"endTime":2676.99,"body":"we measure success there? How do"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2672.67,"endTime":2676.99,"body":"we actually measure the Agile is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2677.02,"endTime":2678.4,"body":"the wrong methodology?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2679.03,"endTime":2683.08,"body":"Yes, yeah. I see"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2679.03,"endTime":2683.08,"body":"your point. And I think, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2683.08,"endTime":2685.6,"body":"know, could I rattle off"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2683.08,"endTime":2685.6,"body":"companies in Adelaide that I've"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2685.6,"endTime":2691.93,"body":"seen that are doing really,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2685.6,"endTime":2691.93,"body":"really well? sort of feel like I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2691.93,"endTime":2698.44,"body":"can't, I could probably say"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2691.93,"endTime":2698.44,"body":"companies I think that are doing"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2698.47,"endTime":2704.14,"body":"a good job of it. I think that's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2698.47,"endTime":2704.14,"body":"part of my utopian reading."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2704.14,"endTime":2706.96,"body":"Yeah, we all look at companies"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2704.14,"endTime":2706.96,"body":"around the world. And I say, oh,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2706.96,"endTime":2709.48,"body":"wow, look at those guys. Well,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2706.96,"endTime":2709.48,"body":"yeah, I've never seen anything"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2709.48,"endTime":2713.2,"body":"like that. And Natalie, so for"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2709.48,"endTime":2713.2,"body":"example, you know, if you really"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2713.2,"endTime":2716.95,"body":"look around, I'll just stick"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2713.2,"endTime":2716.95,"body":"with Adelaide, right? Like,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2717.25,"endTime":2723.64,"body":"there's, there's lots of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2717.25,"endTime":2723.64,"body":"innovative ways to run and lead"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2723.64,"endTime":2726.91,"body":"and manage organizations, with"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2723.64,"endTime":2726.91,"body":"your staff and for your"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2726.91,"endTime":2730.51,"body":"customers that we don't even I'd"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2726.91,"endTime":2730.51,"body":"find it really hard to find"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2730.51,"endTime":2733.75,"body":"anyone practicing some"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2730.51,"endTime":2733.75,"body":"techniques. So we have very"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2733.75,"endTime":2736.93,"body":"traditional budgeting, very"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2733.75,"endTime":2736.93,"body":"traditional ways of managing"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2736.93,"endTime":2741.4,"body":"performance in our staff."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2736.93,"endTime":2741.4,"body":"There's lots of things that are,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2741.52,"endTime":2744.94,"body":"you know, it's part of what"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2741.52,"endTime":2744.94,"body":"we're trying to uncover with"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2744.94,"endTime":2747.73,"body":"reinventing work. You know,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2744.94,"endTime":2747.73,"body":"earlier this year, we had"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2747.73,"endTime":2751.15,"body":"someone come in and talk to us"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2747.73,"endTime":2751.15,"body":"about beyond budgeting, which is"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2751.15,"endTime":2754.45,"body":"a complete, different way of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2751.15,"endTime":2754.45,"body":"looking at the way you do"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2754.45,"endTime":2758.32,"body":"budgets, right. And a lot of it"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2754.45,"endTime":2758.32,"body":"goes back is actually based"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2758.32,"endTime":2762.16,"body":"around principles and mindset. I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2758.32,"endTime":2762.16,"body":"don't see organizations in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2762.16,"endTime":2765.82,"body":"Adelaide doing that. And in our"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2762.16,"endTime":2765.82,"body":"little group, the people that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2765.82,"endTime":2768.88,"body":"are coming, are frustrated with"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2765.82,"endTime":2768.88,"body":"the environment we're in, but"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2768.88,"endTime":2771.13,"body":"there isn't anyone in the room"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2768.88,"endTime":2771.13,"body":"that could actually make a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2771.13,"endTime":2779.59,"body":"significant change. So all we"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2771.13,"endTime":2779.59,"body":"can do is, is try to make that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2779.59,"endTime":2784.06,"body":"little incremental changes from"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2779.59,"endTime":2784.06,"body":"wherever we are. Yeah. And try"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2784.06,"endTime":2784.66,"body":"to try to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2784.66,"endTime":2786.85,"body":"it's an"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2784.66,"endTime":2786.85,"body":"interesting, it's one that I've"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2786.85,"endTime":2793.63,"body":"always thought about. At the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2786.85,"endTime":2793.63,"body":"Agile we had to win, how do you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2793.63,"endTime":2797.74,"body":"measure it and measure the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2793.63,"endTime":2797.74,"body":"benefit of following this"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2797.74,"endTime":2801.31,"body":"particular methodology compared"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2797.74,"endTime":2801.31,"body":"to any other methodologies?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2801.34,"endTime":2805.51,"body":"Well, one of the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2801.34,"endTime":2805.51,"body":"measures, so I'm pretty big on"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2805.51,"endTime":2808.69,"body":"that was starting, say, a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2805.51,"endTime":2808.69,"body":"coaching program. Yeah, these"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2808.69,"endTime":2811.6,"body":"are words that we identify how"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2808.69,"endTime":2811.6,"body":"we're going to measure"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2811.6,"endTime":2815.65,"body":"something, even if it's just an"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2811.6,"endTime":2815.65,"body":"experiment. So something simple,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2815.65,"endTime":2819.55,"body":"tangible, intangible, so a good"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2815.65,"endTime":2819.55,"body":"one to measure would be staff"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2819.55,"endTime":2823.42,"body":"engagement. Most organizations"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2819.55,"endTime":2823.42,"body":"do surveys, yeah. So you know,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2823.42,"endTime":2827.14,"body":"get a baseline, you know, with"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2823.42,"endTime":2827.14,"body":"this team, or this unit, or the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2827.14,"endTime":2831.52,"body":"whole organization? And seeing"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2827.14,"endTime":2831.52,"body":"seeing if that shifts the dark,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2831.58,"endTime":2835.42,"body":"probably the critical one is"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2831.58,"endTime":2835.42,"body":"looking at the outcomes you're"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2835.42,"endTime":2838.99,"body":"trying to achieve. with us."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2835.42,"endTime":2838.99,"body":"Yeah, most of the throttle. So"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2838.99,"endTime":2842.23,"body":"even even that question about if"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2838.99,"endTime":2842.23,"body":"I think back to what you just"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2842.23,"endTime":2848.11,"body":"asked me about companies doing,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2842.23,"endTime":2848.11,"body":"you know, great agile, probably"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2848.11,"endTime":2850.84,"body":"the, the the answer should be"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2848.11,"endTime":2850.84,"body":"who's who's getting great"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2850.84,"endTime":2854.53,"body":"outcomes? And who get you know,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2850.84,"endTime":2854.53,"body":"who cares if they Yeah, using"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2854.53,"endTime":2859.39,"body":"agile or call agile or whatever"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2854.53,"endTime":2859.39,"body":"they're doing? So that's a good"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2859.39,"endTime":2860.74,"body":"bit of advice I got from"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2861.73,"endTime":2865.42,"body":"so basically all"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2861.73,"endTime":2865.42,"body":"worldleading companies doing it,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2865.6,"endTime":2866.83,"body":"doing well, yeah, yeah."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2867.31,"endTime":2870.28,"body":"Yeah. But even"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2867.31,"endTime":2870.28,"body":"then, they, it'd be interesting"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2870.28,"endTime":2871.54,"body":"to look under the covers this is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2871.63,"endTime":2875.14,"body":"this is wrong."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2871.63,"endTime":2875.14,"body":"Yeah. Are they? Well, those"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2875.17,"endTime":2879.43,"body":"companies turn around and say,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2875.17,"endTime":2879.43,"body":"are we are we stalled at our"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2879.43,"endTime":2880.99,"body":"agile methodology? Like,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2881.679,"endTime":2885.789,"body":"or they might"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2881.679,"endTime":2885.789,"body":"say, a puzzle, frankly, we're"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2885.789,"endTime":2888.519,"body":"using scientific management and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2885.789,"endTime":2888.519,"body":"it works just fine. Yeah. Well,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2888.909,"endTime":2891.309,"body":"I'm not trying to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2888.909,"endTime":2891.309,"body":"Yeah, I'm not trying to, you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2891.309,"endTime":2894.909,"body":"know, downplay the importance of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2891.309,"endTime":2894.909,"body":"it. I think it's just from a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2894.909,"endTime":2898.149,"body":"selling point of view you're"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2894.909,"endTime":2898.149,"body":"trying to work with leaders who"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2898.149,"endTime":2901.629,"body":"aren't agreeing to take this on"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2898.149,"endTime":2901.629,"body":"it's it's it's an influencing"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2901.779,"endTime":2904.569,"body":"This is the companies that are"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2901.779,"endTime":2904.569,"body":"using it, and this is the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2904.569,"endTime":2908.379,"body":"benefit This is how quickly they"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2904.569,"endTime":2908.379,"body":"move this through the line. If"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2908.379,"endTime":2912.039,"body":"we can show those examples."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2908.379,"endTime":2912.039,"body":"Yeah, then we can get leaders on"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2912.039,"endTime":2914.709,"body":"board quicker because it's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2912.039,"endTime":2914.709,"body":"helped me you know, talking you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2914.709,"endTime":2917.559,"body":"talking, especially be going to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2914.709,"endTime":2917.559,"body":"the CFO and trying to get these"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2917.559,"endTime":2921.489,"body":"people that's exactly how I tell"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2917.559,"endTime":2921.489,"body":"you about the return on"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2921.489,"endTime":2924.609,"body":"investment of using this"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2921.489,"endTime":2924.609,"body":"methodology. We can see things"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2924.609,"endTime":2929.109,"body":"go through quicker 30% This"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2924.609,"endTime":2929.109,"body":"means it's less what Yeah, and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2929.109,"endTime":2932.349,"body":"we save millions or Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2929.109,"endTime":2932.349,"body":"whatever, it might reduce risk,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2932.349,"endTime":2935.079,"body":"or it's all about building a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2932.349,"endTime":2935.079,"body":"business case. Right? Yeah. So I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2935.079,"endTime":2938.199,"body":"think that's what I'm trying to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2935.079,"endTime":2938.199,"body":"get to is how do we help people"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2938.409,"endTime":2941.379,"body":"understand that Yeah, sell to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2938.409,"endTime":2941.379,"body":"the business if they're trying"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2941.379,"endTime":2943.659,"body":"to bring it in that I know"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2944.619,"endTime":2947.139,"body":"you know, if the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2944.619,"endTime":2947.139,"body":"conversation if I was talking to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2947.139,"endTime":2951.579,"body":"a CFO or CEO or CIO, and said I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2947.139,"endTime":2951.579,"body":"can come in and you know, you're"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2951.579,"endTime":2953.739,"body":"gonna you're gonna create this I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2951.579,"endTime":2953.739,"body":"can help you create this"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2953.739,"endTime":2957.039,"body":"wonderful agile team and it's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2953.739,"endTime":2957.039,"body":"just gonna be the best agilus in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2957.039,"endTime":2960.099,"body":"the world is probably just look"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2957.039,"endTime":2960.099,"body":"at me, his eyes will glaze over"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2960.099,"endTime":2963.249,"body":"and go away. Yeah, but if I came"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2960.099,"endTime":2963.249,"body":"in and said, Can I help you save"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2963.249,"endTime":2968.499,"body":"money or deliver faster and have"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2963.249,"endTime":2968.499,"body":"a happy workforce, you know, my,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2968.589,"endTime":2971.169,"body":"you know, the folks that Okay,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2968.589,"endTime":2971.169,"body":"now now I want to have a chat"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2971.199,"endTime":2971.769,"body":"the previous"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2971.77,"endTime":2974.5,"body":"project, we ran"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2971.77,"endTime":2974.5,"body":"two projects simultaneously, one"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2974.5,"endTime":2977.38,"body":"with an fo agile methodology,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2974.5,"endTime":2977.38,"body":"the other one with that one, and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2977.38,"endTime":2981.76,"body":"we saw 30%, or whatever it might"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2977.38,"endTime":2981.76,"body":"be, if you can show some data"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2981.91,"endTime":2983.53,"body":"that what you've done"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":2981.91,"endTime":2983.53,"body":"previously,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2983.56,"endTime":2988.51,"body":"it's it's it's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2983.56,"endTime":2988.51,"body":"definitely an area that I know"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2988.51,"endTime":2992.92,"body":"from, again, personal view that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2988.51,"endTime":2992.92,"body":"it's a big, big part to build"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2992.92,"endTime":2996.79,"body":"on, because it's, it's, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2992.92,"endTime":2996.79,"body":"know, where's that, where's that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2996.79,"endTime":3000.99,"body":"value? I know from my coaching,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":2996.79,"endTime":3000.99,"body":"and I'm one With a simple I'm"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3000.99,"endTime":3004.68,"body":"not gonna know from a coaching,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3000.99,"endTime":3004.68,"body":"coaching perspective,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3004.71,"endTime":3010.89,"body":"particularly with individuals or"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3004.71,"endTime":3010.89,"body":"small teams, you just look for a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3010.89,"endTime":3015.3,"body":"new, what I hope for, you know,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3010.89,"endTime":3015.3,"body":"a new thought, a new action,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3015.6,"endTime":3017.55,"body":"something that comes out of it,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3015.6,"endTime":3017.55,"body":"and then something you can look"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3017.55,"endTime":3021.15,"body":"at later like, Okay, how did"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3017.55,"endTime":3021.15,"body":"that go? So you can sort of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3021.15,"endTime":3024.9,"body":"measure it. But at that level,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3021.15,"endTime":3024.9,"body":"is that more? Let's see they"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3024.93,"endTime":3027.6,"body":"call it out C suite level, it's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3024.93,"endTime":3027.6,"body":"a different Yeah, different set"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3027.6,"endTime":3029.91,"body":"of thinking. It is. Yeah. And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3027.6,"endTime":3029.91,"body":"that's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3029.94,"endTime":3032.88,"body":"really if we're"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3029.94,"endTime":3032.88,"body":"talking about implementing"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3032.88,"endTime":3036.78,"body":"change within an organization,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3032.88,"endTime":3036.78,"body":"we need to be able to convince"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3036.78,"endTime":3042.36,"body":"those who sit in the, you know,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3036.78,"endTime":3042.36,"body":"decision making room that why"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3042.36,"endTime":3045.06,"body":"this is important. We need and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3042.36,"endTime":3045.06,"body":"we need to get these guys on"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3045.06,"endTime":3047.82,"body":"board to deliver because we know"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3045.06,"endTime":3047.82,"body":"it works, right. Like I'm not"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3047.85,"endTime":3048.6,"body":"I'm not Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3048.6,"endTime":3051.96,"body":"no, it's about"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3048.6,"endTime":3051.96,"body":"what how you can have that. Or"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3052.05,"endTime":3059.04,"body":"co-created correct with people"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3052.05,"endTime":3059.04,"body":"as well. I know from the my down"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3059.04,"endTime":3061.41,"body":"the line project management,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3059.04,"endTime":3061.41,"body":"though. So I did that for a long"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3061.41,"endTime":3064.98,"body":"time that that's what I started"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3061.41,"endTime":3064.98,"body":"getting exposed to agile ways of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3064.98,"endTime":3067.95,"body":"working for you. This makes a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3064.98,"endTime":3067.95,"body":"lot more sense to me. Yeah. Is"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3067.95,"endTime":3073.59,"body":"that, you know, you generally"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3067.95,"endTime":3073.59,"body":"would create a plan, and costs"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3073.59,"endTime":3077.1,"body":"and time what you need to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3073.59,"endTime":3077.1,"body":"deliver something when you knew"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3077.1,"endTime":3080.46,"body":"the least about it. Yeah. And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3077.1,"endTime":3080.46,"body":"then you just, you know, hang on"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3080.46,"endTime":3083.58,"body":"to it for dear life for the next"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3080.46,"endTime":3083.58,"body":"18 months. Because you got to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3083.58,"endTime":3084.66,"body":"get measured, and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3084.689,"endTime":3087.209,"body":"there's no,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3084.689,"endTime":3087.209,"body":"there's no golden area is there"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3087.209,"endTime":3091.469,"body":"like, every every situation is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3087.209,"endTime":3091.469,"body":"different. I do I am interested"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3091.469,"endTime":3098.309,"body":"in how x or no one of the values"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3091.469,"endTime":3098.309,"body":"and the Agile values is enable"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3098.309,"endTime":3102.299,"body":"face to face interactions,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3098.309,"endTime":3102.299,"body":"right? It's one of the 12 not"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3102.539,"endTime":3104.459,"body":"one of these principles. One of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3102.539,"endTime":3104.459,"body":"the one of the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3104.46,"endTime":3106.35,"body":"tools. Yeah, one"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3104.46,"endTime":3106.35,"body":"of the one of the one of the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3106.35,"endTime":3109.92,"body":"values is individuals, and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3106.35,"endTime":3109.92,"body":"interactions or processes."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3109.949,"endTime":3112.289,"body":"Yeah. So But then"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3109.949,"endTime":3112.289,"body":"one of the principal principal"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3112.289,"endTime":3116.099,"body":"is face to face. Yeah. How's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3112.289,"endTime":3116.099,"body":"that gone over? The pandemic,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3116.099,"endTime":3118.709,"body":"when we've moved to teams is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3116.099,"endTime":3118.709,"body":"that there's, you know, we"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3118.709,"endTime":3121.169,"body":"talked about sticking within the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3118.709,"endTime":3121.169,"body":"parameters, all of a sudden"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3121.169,"endTime":3121.829,"body":"that's playing out."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3121.83,"endTime":3125.22,"body":"Yeah, yeah."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3121.83,"endTime":3125.22,"body":"Yeah, I think it's, there's lots"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3125.22,"endTime":3130.8,"body":"of I, there's, there's ideal,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3125.22,"endTime":3130.8,"body":"ideal scenario, ideal"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3130.8,"endTime":3134.34,"body":"environment like so the, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3130.8,"endTime":3134.34,"body":"know, the best environment you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3134.34,"endTime":3136.98,"body":"can have with with, say, a team"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3134.34,"endTime":3136.98,"body":"working in Agile ways that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3136.98,"endTime":3140.34,"body":"they're all co located, and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3136.98,"endTime":3140.34,"body":"they're all cross functional."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3140.34,"endTime":3142.53,"body":"And, you know, all the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3140.34,"endTime":3142.53,"body":"conversation happening, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3142.53,"endTime":3146.1,"body":"know, face to face or in the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3142.53,"endTime":3146.1,"body":"same room, you know, even that,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3146.13,"endTime":3148.56,"body":"because you can hear"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3146.13,"endTime":3148.56,"body":"conversations, all this"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3148.56,"endTime":3151.83,"body":"intrinsic knowledge that you get"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3148.56,"endTime":3151.83,"body":"thinking, you know, I can hear"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3151.83,"endTime":3154.62,"body":"Yeah, you're talking to Gary the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3151.83,"endTime":3154.62,"body":"other in the room about"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3154.62,"endTime":3158.16,"body":"something. Yeah. But when you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3154.62,"endTime":3158.16,"body":"don't have that, then you just"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3158.16,"endTime":3164.28,"body":"have to create environments, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3158.16,"endTime":3164.28,"body":"know, create Grebner a way of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3164.28,"endTime":3167.73,"body":"working to deal with that. So"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3164.28,"endTime":3167.73,"body":"yes, was the pandemic, you've"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3167.73,"endTime":3171.78,"body":"sort of lost that? So we're on?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3167.73,"endTime":3171.78,"body":"We're on zoom or, or whatever."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3171.81,"endTime":3172.05,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3172.08,"endTime":3174.06,"body":"has it affected"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3172.08,"endTime":3174.06,"body":"the way it's,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3174.6,"endTime":3176.91,"body":"I think, I think"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3174.6,"endTime":3176.91,"body":"it has to uprising, there's I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3176.91,"endTime":3182.73,"body":"know, when I've gone back into"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3176.91,"endTime":3182.73,"body":"face to face, it's better. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3182.91,"endTime":3189.03,"body":"How do you do a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3182.91,"endTime":3189.03,"body":"stand up? So I just like it, I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3189.03,"endTime":3191.16,"body":"get so cross with the stand up"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3189.03,"endTime":3191.16,"body":"stuff. But anyway,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3191.189,"endTime":3193.859,"body":"yeah, that's a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3191.189,"endTime":3193.859,"body":"good point. I mean, and you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3193.859,"endTime":3197.099,"body":"know, what I always tend to ask,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3193.859,"endTime":3197.099,"body":"you know, I say that, you know,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3197.099,"endTime":3200.369,"body":"the mantra is, take it to the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3197.099,"endTime":3200.369,"body":"team. Yeah, head head, head, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3200.369,"endTime":3205.109,"body":"want to be exactly the team want"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3200.369,"endTime":3205.109,"body":"everyone to stand, you know? Or"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3205.109,"endTime":3207.629,"body":"if the team want to, you know, I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3205.109,"endTime":3207.629,"body":"think that's, I think that's a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3207.689,"endTime":3210.959,"body":"it's a, it's a bad example,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3207.689,"endTime":3210.959,"body":"because there's actually there's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3210.959,"endTime":3216.059,"body":"actually another side to it,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3210.959,"endTime":3216.059,"body":"where, you know, people may not"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3216.119,"endTime":3222.269,"body":"be able to do so. But the other"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3216.119,"endTime":3222.269,"body":"face to face, I think there's,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3222.599,"endTime":3225.059,"body":"there's definitely it's it's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3222.599,"endTime":3225.059,"body":"better, like you mentioned we're"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3225.059,"endTime":3228.209,"body":"doing this remotely would be a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3225.059,"endTime":3228.209,"body":"lot that we wouldn't this"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3228.21,"endTime":3233.67,"body":"is a big part of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3228.21,"endTime":3233.67,"body":"the reason. Early on, we started"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3233.67,"endTime":3237.72,"body":"the podcast, and then the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3233.67,"endTime":3237.72,"body":"pandemic here. And we will try"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3237.72,"endTime":3240.6,"body":"to figure out if we could do it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3237.72,"endTime":3240.6,"body":"over zoom. And yes, you can, but"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3240.6,"endTime":3240.93,"body":"it's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3240.93,"endTime":3244.08,"body":"not it's not the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3240.93,"endTime":3244.08,"body":"same. But that example that that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3244.08,"endTime":3248.67,"body":"principle, a common thing I like"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3244.08,"endTime":3248.67,"body":"to do with teams is, is look at"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3248.67,"endTime":3251.64,"body":"the principles as a group"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3248.67,"endTime":3251.64,"body":"language. And I start out and,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3251.7,"endTime":3254.88,"body":"and agreed and what you know,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3251.7,"endTime":3254.88,"body":"which of these things that we're"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3254.88,"endTime":3257.52,"body":"doing well, or what what, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3254.88,"endTime":3257.52,"body":"know, what does that mean to us,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3257.52,"endTime":3262.02,"body":"right? in our context, and that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3257.52,"endTime":3262.02,"body":"context changes all the time. So"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3262.02,"endTime":3265.17,"body":"we know if the agreements are"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3262.02,"endTime":3265.17,"body":"that we're going to have face to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3265.17,"endTime":3271.5,"body":"face conversations about certain"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3265.17,"endTime":3271.5,"body":"types of work or items and not"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3271.5,"endTime":3274.44,"body":"do it on email or not do it on"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3271.5,"endTime":3274.44,"body":"phone or whatever, and then"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3274.5,"endTime":3279.57,"body":"things changed and re reevaluate"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3274.5,"endTime":3279.57,"body":"that right. So you know, for me,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3279.57,"endTime":3284.1,"body":"the key one, there would be you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3279.57,"endTime":3284.1,"body":"know, how, how do we make those"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3284.13,"endTime":3286.02,"body":"interactions work? Yeah."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3286.59,"endTime":3288.96,"body":"And then there"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3286.59,"endTime":3288.96,"body":"would being adaptive, never"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3288.96,"endTime":3289.59,"body":"being adaptive."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3289.98,"endTime":3295.05,"body":"Maybe there's a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3289.98,"endTime":3295.05,"body":"better way. Yeah, probably"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3295.05,"endTime":3295.53,"body":"maximum."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3298.409,"endTime":3301.049,"body":"So do you insane"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3298.409,"endTime":3301.049,"body":"We're also talking about the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3301.049,"endTime":3303.719,"body":"pandemic in the way we've worked"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3301.049,"endTime":3303.719,"body":"in the past 12 months. Do you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3303.719,"endTime":3306.389,"body":"believe that the Agile"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3303.719,"endTime":3306.389,"body":"methodology will survive through"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3306.389,"endTime":3309.119,"body":"this hybrid way of working? Or"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3306.389,"endTime":3309.119,"body":"what are you?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3309.149,"endTime":3312.149,"body":"Yeah, I think I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3309.149,"endTime":3312.149,"body":"think so. I think Yeah, I don't,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3312.869,"endTime":3315.929,"body":"I don't see. Yeah, I think"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3315.959,"endTime":3318.149,"body":"I think if you're"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3315.959,"endTime":3318.149,"body":"looking at a little AI or the BA"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3318.959,"endTime":3323.249,"body":"Yeah, well, I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3318.959,"endTime":3323.249,"body":"said my, my, my starting point,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3323.279,"endTime":3326.309,"body":"always fall back to the middle."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3323.279,"endTime":3326.309,"body":"Right. So that's the important"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3326.399,"endTime":3330.659,"body":"part about how people work"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3326.399,"endTime":3330.659,"body":"together. And even pre pandemic"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3330.659,"endTime":3332.879,"body":"there's a lot and I'm"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3330.659,"endTime":3332.879,"body":"particularly in my world was"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3332.969,"endTime":3336.239,"body":"working a lot with distributed"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3332.969,"endTime":3336.239,"body":"teams anyway. We had people"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3336.239,"endTime":3341.879,"body":"offshore and yeah, different"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3336.239,"endTime":3341.879,"body":"timezones. I, you know, I think,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3342.719,"endTime":3347.309,"body":"you know, the future, I'm seeing"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3342.719,"endTime":3347.309,"body":"teams coming back together or in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3347.399,"endTime":3350.849,"body":"Yeah, in, in an office"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3347.399,"endTime":3350.849,"body":"environment, and it's good that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3350.849,"endTime":3353.279,"body":"they come to some agreements"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3350.849,"endTime":3353.279,"body":"where maybe during their"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3353.279,"endTime":3357.719,"body":"uncertain days or times when"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3353.279,"endTime":3357.719,"body":"they are together, but I think"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3357.719,"endTime":3362.309,"body":"from a you know, this whatever"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3357.719,"endTime":3362.309,"body":"the future holds, sort of a bit"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3362.309,"endTime":3366.269,"body":"of a guess isn't really but I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3362.309,"endTime":3366.269,"body":"think agile as a as a way of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3366.269,"endTime":3370.289,"body":"working the mindset, values and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3366.269,"endTime":3370.289,"body":"principles and how that's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3370.319,"endTime":3374.579,"body":"translated and yet still holds"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3370.319,"endTime":3374.579,"body":"up. There there are some people"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3374.579,"endTime":3377.189,"body":"in that 17 that went up in the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3374.579,"endTime":3377.189,"body":"mountain they don't want to have"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3377.189,"endTime":3380.039,"body":"anything to do Oh, really? Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3377.189,"endTime":3380.039,"body":"cuz it for them, it got twisted"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3380.039,"endTime":3383.849,"body":"and, and got taken down a road."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3380.039,"endTime":3383.849,"body":"That was never their intention."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3383.849,"endTime":3389.639,"body":"So they completely for the image"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3383.849,"endTime":3389.639,"body":"all is dead. Which is, it's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3389.639,"endTime":3392.549,"body":"always a nice way to start an"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3389.639,"endTime":3392.549,"body":"agile conference of its myself."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3393.119,"endTime":3394.139,"body":"The agile is dead. Well,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3394.14,"endTime":3397.5,"body":"yeah. Yeah. That"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3394.14,"endTime":3397.5,"body":"was gonna be one of my right."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3397.53,"endTime":3403.32,"body":"Yeah. Is it? Do you think that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3397.53,"endTime":3403.32,"body":"the big a agile is dead?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3403.77,"endTime":3405.24,"body":"No, I don't"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3403.77,"endTime":3405.24,"body":"think that's dead. Or I think"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3405.24,"endTime":3408.87,"body":"you I think, yeah, I think you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3405.24,"endTime":3408.87,"body":"got to do that well, as well."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3409.95,"endTime":3412.92,"body":"But you can't look. So you can't"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3409.95,"endTime":3412.92,"body":"do that in isolation is no point"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3412.92,"endTime":3415.65,"body":"having a water bottle with"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3412.92,"endTime":3415.65,"body":"nothing in it. So yeah, you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3415.65,"endTime":3417.72,"body":"can so you need"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3415.65,"endTime":3417.72,"body":"some sort of framework. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3417.75,"endTime":3424.62,"body":"But you're not omega omega."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3417.75,"endTime":3424.62,"body":"agnostic. Yeah, I am actually"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3424.65,"endTime":3427.41,"body":"looking, you actually train and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3424.65,"endTime":3427.41,"body":"coach people on how to just"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3427.41,"endTime":3429.54,"body":"deliver a project? Well, yeah,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3429.54,"endTime":3431.43,"body":"I might take"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3429.54,"endTime":3431.43,"body":"them through particular"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3431.43,"endTime":3434.58,"body":"frameworks or practices or, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3431.43,"endTime":3434.58,"body":"know, mindset or different"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3434.58,"endTime":3440.34,"body":"techniques. And I think there's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3434.58,"endTime":3440.34,"body":"a lot in, in combining certain"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3440.46,"endTime":3445.29,"body":"frameworks, a lot of it will"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3440.46,"endTime":3445.29,"body":"depend, it's a horrible thing to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3445.29,"endTime":3449.04,"body":"have to sales depends a lot on"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3445.29,"endTime":3449.04,"body":"the context been that I don't"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3449.04,"endTime":3452.43,"body":"know all the frameworks, but you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3449.04,"endTime":3452.43,"body":"know, I know some of them. So"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3452.73,"endTime":3456.27,"body":"what I find useful is actually"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3452.73,"endTime":3456.27,"body":"the partner up with other people"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3456.66,"endTime":3459.54,"body":"that have the skills and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3456.66,"endTime":3459.54,"body":"specific skills in certain"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3459.54,"endTime":3464.46,"body":"areas. So my, I really have more"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3459.54,"endTime":3464.46,"body":"of a, I guess, passion for that,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3464.67,"endTime":3469.41,"body":"that the little a, the the being"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3464.67,"endTime":3469.41,"body":"agile side and helping people"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3470.04,"endTime":3475.89,"body":"through that. And then when I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3470.04,"endTime":3475.89,"body":"reach a point where I need other"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3475.89,"endTime":3478.98,"body":"expertise, and that's when I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3475.89,"endTime":3478.98,"body":"would help people find that that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3478.98,"endTime":3482.94,"body":"expertise or, or work with them,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3478.98,"endTime":3482.94,"body":"because there's lots of aside"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3482.94,"endTime":3486.96,"body":"from the frameworks, there's a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3482.94,"endTime":3486.96,"body":"myriad of tools, and then also"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3486.96,"endTime":3490.29,"body":"techniques, right? So if you get"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3486.96,"endTime":3490.29,"body":"really deep into that technical"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3490.29,"endTime":3494.49,"body":"site, technical agility, that's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3490.29,"endTime":3494.49,"body":"another error in itself. And I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3494.49,"endTime":3497.4,"body":"think so I think you need both."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3494.49,"endTime":3497.4,"body":"Yeah. It's a little bit like the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3497.4,"endTime":3502.2,"body":"values the values are. That's a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3497.4,"endTime":3502.2,"body":"good one that's misunderstood"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3502.2,"endTime":3506.31,"body":"working software, or working"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3502.2,"endTime":3506.31,"body":"product, whatever is over"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3506.58,"endTime":3509.79,"body":"comprehensive documentation"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3506.58,"endTime":3509.79,"body":"doesn't mean we don't document"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3509.82,"endTime":3513.87,"body":"Yeah, it just means we value we"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3509.82,"endTime":3513.87,"body":"value the working software"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3513.87,"endTime":3517.11,"body":"working for like more. Yeah, and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3513.87,"endTime":3517.11,"body":"it's the same thing with this"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3517.11,"endTime":3521.73,"body":"sort of being agile over doing"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3517.11,"endTime":3521.73,"body":"agile, they're both important,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3522.0,"endTime":3525.36,"body":"but there's more value in being"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3522.0,"endTime":3525.36,"body":"agile. And you need that. So"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3525.389,"endTime":3533.159,"body":"yeah, absolutely."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3525.389,"endTime":3533.159,"body":"Where does, where does change"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3533.159,"endTime":3538.319,"body":"management come into play by in"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3533.159,"endTime":3538.319,"body":"this whole space?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3538.38,"endTime":3542.13,"body":"It's all it's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3538.38,"endTime":3542.13,"body":"all. It's like, it's completely"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3542.13,"endTime":3546.93,"body":"integrate. I'm looking my, my"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3542.13,"endTime":3546.93,"body":"head. Yes, it's a big part and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3546.93,"endTime":3552.99,"body":"my experience with agile"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3546.93,"endTime":3552.99,"body":"initiatives, you know, adopting"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3552.99,"endTime":3558.51,"body":"agile ways of working is that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3552.99,"endTime":3558.51,"body":"the change effort is generally"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3558.51,"endTime":3562.77,"body":"underestimated. Oh, no, we see"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3558.51,"endTime":3562.77,"body":"that you see that all the time."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3562.77,"endTime":3566.94,"body":"Yeah, that's just underestimate"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3562.77,"endTime":3566.94,"body":"it's a big part. So the simple"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3566.94,"endTime":3573.09,"body":"the simple part about this is if"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3566.94,"endTime":3573.09,"body":"you're looking to uplift or make"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3573.12,"endTime":3576.15,"body":"make significant change, and in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3573.12,"endTime":3576.15,"body":"that in this this type of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3576.15,"endTime":3580.38,"body":"working, and you know, I've"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3576.15,"endTime":3580.38,"body":"drank the Kool Aid, so that's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3580.38,"endTime":3584.79,"body":"it, I'm done wrong there. But"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3580.38,"endTime":3584.79,"body":"there will be people that you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3584.79,"endTime":3588.42,"body":"know, it's like with any, any"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3584.79,"endTime":3588.42,"body":"change that are already there"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3588.42,"endTime":3590.37,"body":"that are championing it but"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3588.42,"endTime":3590.37,"body":"there's there'll be a lot of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3590.37,"endTime":3593.37,"body":"resistance and there'll be a lot"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3590.37,"endTime":3593.37,"body":"of fear, there'll be a lot of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3593.4,"endTime":3599.19,"body":"things that are difficult for"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3593.4,"endTime":3599.19,"body":"people to adapt to. Because it"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3599.19,"endTime":3602.97,"body":"is completely different. So, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3599.19,"endTime":3602.97,"body":"know, a person and team that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3603.27,"endTime":3608.07,"body":"used to be told what to do, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3603.27,"endTime":3608.07,"body":"know, and then all of a sudden"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3608.07,"endTime":3611.7,"body":"they're told to self organize"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3608.07,"endTime":3611.7,"body":"with their colleagues. And they"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3611.7,"endTime":3615.72,"body":"just, you know, that's a big"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3611.7,"endTime":3615.72,"body":"change. Yeah. And so it's a big"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3615.72,"endTime":3616.11,"body":"part of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3616.11,"endTime":3618.24,"body":"it within an"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3616.11,"endTime":3618.24,"body":"education pace into how to do"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3618.24,"endTime":3619.11,"body":"that isn't Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3619.11,"endTime":3623.52,"body":"there's that and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3619.11,"endTime":3623.52,"body":"also getting there is that that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3623.52,"endTime":3629.22,"body":"mindset shift, mindset shift is"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3623.52,"endTime":3629.22,"body":"big. And I think, you know,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3629.7,"endTime":3632.97,"body":"change management has a big role"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3629.7,"endTime":3632.97,"body":"to play in that and helping"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3632.97,"endTime":3635.82,"body":"people navigate that. Make that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3632.97,"endTime":3635.82,"body":"bridge,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3636.51,"endTime":3638.19,"body":"making the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3636.51,"endTime":3638.19,"body":"journey. Yeah, a much more"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3638.19,"endTime":3640.35,"body":"enjoyable. Yeah, along the way,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3638.19,"endTime":3640.35,"body":"isn't it?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3640.409,"endTime":3643.469,"body":"Yeah. So you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3640.409,"endTime":3643.469,"body":"start with this is, this is our"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3643.469,"endTime":3647.879,"body":"culture's our organization, our"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3643.469,"endTime":3647.879,"body":"leadership, our teams, and then"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3647.879,"endTime":3652.379,"body":"to move to a, you know, whatever"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3647.879,"endTime":3652.379,"body":"that next iteration is? that's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3652.409,"endTime":3655.109,"body":"ongoing. I think that's the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3652.409,"endTime":3655.109,"body":"thing. It's an ongoing, it's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3655.109,"endTime":3656.519,"body":"ongoing fluid. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3656.55,"endTime":3662.22,"body":"yeah. 100%. I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3656.55,"endTime":3662.22,"body":"think we're coming up to we're"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3662.22,"endTime":3666.45,"body":"pretty much past that our My"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3662.22,"endTime":3666.45,"body":"gosh, we've gone, we find"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3666.45,"endTime":3673.2,"body":"through that went fast. It does."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3666.45,"endTime":3673.2,"body":"What is your future outlook for?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3673.92,"endTime":3674.85,"body":"This community?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3676.26,"endTime":3680.73,"body":"Yes, that's a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3676.26,"endTime":3680.73,"body":"really good question. I think"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3682.23,"endTime":3688.74,"body":"from from my perspective, it's,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3682.23,"endTime":3688.74,"body":"it's really gone back to our"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3688.74,"endTime":3694.56,"body":"starting that that community"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3688.74,"endTime":3694.56,"body":"collaborating and like I was"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3694.56,"endTime":3697.23,"body":"just touching on this, that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3694.56,"endTime":3697.23,"body":"there's, you know, um, there's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3697.23,"endTime":3701.46,"body":"only certain aspects that, that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3697.23,"endTime":3701.46,"body":"I or that we can do"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3701.46,"endTime":3705.21,"body":"individually, or even as small"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3701.46,"endTime":3705.21,"body":"groups. So it's about the way we"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3705.21,"endTime":3710.43,"body":"can come together and do work"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3705.21,"endTime":3710.43,"body":"collectively and solve problems"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3710.43,"endTime":3713.13,"body":"and make might make the world a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3710.43,"endTime":3713.13,"body":"better place. I mean, I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3713.22,"endTime":3718.68,"body":"definitely business agility,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3713.22,"endTime":3718.68,"body":"like, agility outside of it."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3719.19,"endTime":3721.74,"body":"It's not something new. But I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3719.19,"endTime":3721.74,"body":"think there's still there's a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3721.74,"endTime":3725.28,"body":"long way to go there and and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3721.74,"endTime":3725.28,"body":"that's a lot of opportunities"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3725.28,"endTime":3727.89,"body":"there. And that's, that's where"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3725.28,"endTime":3727.89,"body":"I'm on quite passionate about"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3727.89,"endTime":3732.99,"body":"that. Absolutely. Yeah, I think"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3727.89,"endTime":3732.99,"body":"it's, it's, it's an ongoing,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3733.11,"endTime":3736.59,"body":"someone said to me recently,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3733.11,"endTime":3736.59,"body":"which I quite like that that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3736.62,"endTime":3739.71,"body":"analogy, because the I hate that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3736.62,"endTime":3739.71,"body":"word. It's a journey. Yeah, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3739.71,"endTime":3742.44,"body":"know, it's like it's a dance,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3739.71,"endTime":3742.44,"body":"right? So we're having, we're"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3742.44,"endTime":3745.89,"body":"having an end the dance will"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3742.44,"endTime":3745.89,"body":"continue, as lawful and more"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3745.92,"endTime":3750.93,"body":"even itself will shift and adapt"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3745.92,"endTime":3750.93,"body":"a little bit, but it will"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3750.93,"endTime":3754.47,"body":"continue, we just need to be,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3750.93,"endTime":3754.47,"body":"you know, ready, ready for"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3754.47,"endTime":3755.1,"body":"what's ahead,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3755.1,"endTime":3757.59,"body":"and a new song"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3755.1,"endTime":3757.59,"body":"will come on, you just need a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3757.77,"endTime":3762.15,"body":"new moves when you create some"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3757.77,"endTime":3762.15,"body":"new. Next one, you're gonna grab"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3762.15,"endTime":3765.27,"body":"seven, eight of your closest"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3762.15,"endTime":3765.27,"body":"mates, and go up to the ski"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3765.27,"endTime":3770.79,"body":"resort and come up with a code"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3765.27,"endTime":3770.79,"body":"where you could come up with a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3770.79,"endTime":3774.18,"body":"new methodology based on the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3770.79,"endTime":3774.18,"body":"hybrid model."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3777.03,"endTime":3780.75,"body":"Seriously,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3777.03,"endTime":3780.75,"body":"today, I saw a post this is"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3780.75,"endTime":3784.29,"body":"another I think it's called"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3780.75,"endTime":3784.29,"body":"actually goes back to your"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3784.29,"endTime":3789.45,"body":"question. It's called coma I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3784.29,"endTime":3789.45,"body":"because it was remote, if yet,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3789.54,"endTime":3791.79,"body":"which had a bit of a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3789.54,"endTime":3791.79,"body":"connotation, but yeah, then I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3791.79,"endTime":3796.5,"body":"click the link. Yeah, I click"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3791.79,"endTime":3796.5,"body":"the link, and it's that it's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3796.5,"endTime":3801.18,"body":"basically remote, agile, remote"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3796.5,"endTime":3801.18,"body":"agility framework. Okay. And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3801.18,"endTime":3804.51,"body":"there's a whole lot of if"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3801.18,"endTime":3804.51,"body":"references. Okay, here's another"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3804.51,"endTime":3807.9,"body":"one. Yeah, right. There's,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3804.51,"endTime":3807.9,"body":"there's also there's a few"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3807.93,"endTime":3811.92,"body":"different, you know, blends and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3807.93,"endTime":3811.92,"body":"flavors. Yeah. agility"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3811.92,"endTime":3815.4,"body":"framework, requisite agility. So"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3811.92,"endTime":3815.4,"body":"yeah, there's Yeah, there's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3815.4,"endTime":3818.82,"body":"another group that came out. We"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3815.4,"endTime":3818.82,"body":"don't need more. I don't think"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3818.82,"endTime":3820.83,"body":"so. No. outcomes. Yeah, that's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3822.119,"endTime":3825.149,"body":"beautiful. Frank,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3822.119,"endTime":3825.149,"body":"we are at the end of the show."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3825.209,"endTime":3828.659,"body":"We really like to ask you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3825.209,"endTime":3828.659,"body":"quickfire questions to kind of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3828.659,"endTime":3831.389,"body":"put you on the spot a little"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3828.659,"endTime":3831.389,"body":"bit. Okay. You've listened to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3831.389,"endTime":3834.419,"body":"any of the other podcasts you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3831.389,"endTime":3834.419,"body":"probably come prepared. If not"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3834.419,"endTime":3841.769,"body":"then so be it. My fault. The"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3834.419,"endTime":3841.769,"body":"were big Listen, be Raiders"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3841.799,"endTime":3845.429,"body":"here. So I'm really interested"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3841.799,"endTime":3845.429,"body":"in books and you may have"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3845.879,"endTime":3849.929,"body":"mentioned this throughout the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3845.879,"endTime":3849.929,"body":"way so can you recommend someone"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3850.199,"endTime":3853.949,"body":"recommend one of the books that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3850.199,"endTime":3853.949,"body":"have the biggest impact on you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3853.949,"endTime":3854.819,"body":"in your career?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3854.0,"endTime":3861.92,"body":"Yeah, just just"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3854.0,"endTime":3861.92,"body":"of light. The strong toilet"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3861.92,"endTime":3866.66,"body":"between two one is leading"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3861.92,"endTime":3866.66,"body":"together leading Susan best to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3866.66,"endTime":3871.7,"body":"field they've actually done I've"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3866.66,"endTime":3871.7,"body":"done some liberating structures"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3871.97,"endTime":3876.23,"body":"at work with her. She's one of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3871.97,"endTime":3876.23,"body":"the authors. I've just actually"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3876.23,"endTime":3878.99,"body":"read that late last year. I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3876.23,"endTime":3878.99,"body":"really liked that book because"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3878.99,"endTime":3882.62,"body":"it's, it takes that book from"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3878.99,"endTime":3882.62,"body":"Frederick laloux, reinventing"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3882.62,"endTime":3886.61,"body":"organizations and actually"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3882.62,"endTime":3886.61,"body":"starts to show you how to apply"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3886.61,"endTime":3889.46,"body":"it. Okay. So as I said in that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3886.61,"endTime":3889.46,"body":"book, he sort of gets to the end"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3889.46,"endTime":3893.48,"body":"and says, you haven't got to see"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3889.46,"endTime":3893.48,"body":"our board. You know, thinking"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3893.48,"endTime":3896.72,"body":"like this thing, good luck, but"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3893.48,"endTime":3896.72,"body":"there are things that you can"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3896.81,"endTime":3901.61,"body":"yet practically do to introduce"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3896.81,"endTime":3901.61,"body":"This new ways of working so"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3901.61,"endTime":3906.2,"body":"Susan and the group that she"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3901.61,"endTime":3906.2,"body":"sort of works with they they're"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3906.2,"endTime":3910.22,"body":"really big on this, you know,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3906.2,"endTime":3910.22,"body":"self managing self organizing"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3910.49,"endTime":3912.23,"body":"organization. So leading"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3910.49,"endTime":3912.23,"body":"together"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3912.29,"endTime":3914.36,"body":"learning"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3912.29,"endTime":3914.36,"body":"together, yeah. He says number"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3914.36,"endTime":3915.35,"body":"one, number two,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3915.62,"endTime":3917.9,"body":"yeah, the other"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3915.62,"endTime":3917.9,"body":"one would be from the ready,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3917.93,"endTime":3922.01,"body":"which is brave new work from"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3917.93,"endTime":3922.01,"body":"Aaron Dickman, I, yeah, that's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3923.9,"endTime":3926.0,"body":"that one. There was also"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3923.9,"endTime":3926.0,"body":"something I read. I probably"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3926.0,"endTime":3930.38,"body":"read that a few years ago. And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3926.0,"endTime":3930.38,"body":"that's what really got me in I'm"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3930.38,"endTime":3933.53,"body":"really looking at this the way"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3930.38,"endTime":3933.53,"body":"we need to work in the future."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3933.59,"endTime":3940.19,"body":"So to that step from, I guess,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3933.59,"endTime":3940.19,"body":"Mark, where I started out in my"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3940.31,"endTime":3943.52,"body":"project delivery, agile"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3940.31,"endTime":3943.52,"body":"delivery, to really start to get"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3943.52,"endTime":3946.88,"body":"that focus about how we should"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3943.52,"endTime":3946.88,"body":"be treating each other and how,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3946.94,"endTime":3950.63,"body":"yeah, we need to work. So yeah,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3946.94,"endTime":3950.63,"body":"Aaron Dickman, the ready, not"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3950.63,"endTime":3954.35,"body":"from the ready for revenue work."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3950.63,"endTime":3954.35,"body":"Yeah. Number two, yeah."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3955.37,"endTime":3959.63,"body":"If you had, if"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3955.37,"endTime":3959.63,"body":"you could visit your 10 year old"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3959.63,"endTime":3962.15,"body":"self, what advice would you give"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":3959.63,"endTime":3962.15,"body":"yourself?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3965.93,"endTime":3972.14,"body":"Listen to dad."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3965.93,"endTime":3972.14,"body":"Listen to your dad. No, no, I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3972.14,"endTime":3976.76,"body":"think I think it would be just"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3972.14,"endTime":3976.76,"body":"to to take some more risks."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3976.76,"endTime":3982.52,"body":"Don't be afraid. Yeah. And. And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3976.76,"endTime":3982.52,"body":"don't stop. Don't stop learning."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3982.55,"endTime":3987.05,"body":"Be true to yourself. Yeah. 10"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3982.55,"endTime":3987.05,"body":"years old or something? Or I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3987.05,"endTime":3992.69,"body":"wasn't Yeah. No. Probably was"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3987.05,"endTime":3992.69,"body":"getting taught was nuns. Got a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3992.69,"endTime":3996.47,"body":"lot to answer. Well, it was a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3992.69,"endTime":3996.47,"body":"different time. Yeah, we're"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3996.47,"endTime":3999.71,"body":"talking about long time ago."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3996.47,"endTime":3999.71,"body":"Yeah. Yeah. A lot of people in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":3999.71,"endTime":4000.88,"body":"this room weren't born then."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4002.36,"endTime":4005.75,"body":"No, I I reason"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4002.36,"endTime":4005.75,"body":"why I asked that is because you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4005.75,"endTime":4009.92,"body":"know, I've got two young kids,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4005.75,"endTime":4009.92,"body":"and I like to hear advice that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4009.92,"endTime":4013.49,"body":"you would give. I could phrase"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4009.92,"endTime":4013.49,"body":"it into what would you give?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4013.49,"endTime":4017.33,"body":"What advice would you give it to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4013.49,"endTime":4017.33,"body":"the young generation today? It's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4017.33,"endTime":4017.96,"body":"the same thing."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4017.99,"endTime":4020.09,"body":"It's a beautiful"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4017.99,"endTime":4020.09,"body":"questions. I've got an 11 year"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4020.09,"endTime":4023.45,"body":"old at home, so I'm gonna go see"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4020.09,"endTime":4023.45,"body":"him after this. So"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4023.84,"endTime":4025.94,"body":"yeah, I think it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4023.84,"endTime":4025.94,"body":"is one lucky you because what"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4025.94,"endTime":4029.24,"body":"you said Don't be afraid to take"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4025.94,"endTime":4029.24,"body":"some risks, make some mistakes."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4029.24,"endTime":4032.36,"body":"It's the growth mindset. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4029.24,"endTime":4032.36,"body":"Yeah, man, I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4032.36,"endTime":4034.49,"body":"know. And that's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4032.36,"endTime":4034.49,"body":"what I like, right? I wouldn't I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4034.49,"endTime":4038.69,"body":"know, with my son, when I went"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4034.49,"endTime":4038.69,"body":"to his school, one day, when he"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4038.69,"endTime":4041.93,"body":"was in year two or three, I was"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4038.69,"endTime":4041.93,"body":"in the classroom looking around,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4041.93,"endTime":4044.6,"body":"and there's all these little"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4041.93,"endTime":4044.6,"body":"pictures, I use those pictures"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4044.6,"endTime":4050.15,"body":"in my workshops around growth"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4044.6,"endTime":4050.15,"body":"mindset. And I just hope that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4050.66,"endTime":4054.53,"body":"the organization's institutions"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4050.66,"endTime":4054.53,"body":"that we create, in the future"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4055.16,"endTime":4058.25,"body":"that he's going to go into, and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4055.16,"endTime":4058.25,"body":"all our kids are going to go"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4058.25,"endTime":4063.62,"body":"into have actually adopted the"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4058.25,"endTime":4063.62,"body":"thing. This right, what you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4063.62,"endTime":4066.05,"body":"know, I believe it's the right"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4063.62,"endTime":4066.05,"body":"way of working Yeah, the future"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4066.05,"endTime":4069.2,"body":"and not that they then get, they"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4066.05,"endTime":4069.2,"body":"go through all this and then get"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4069.2,"endTime":4073.46,"body":"lumped into institutions and"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4069.2,"endTime":4073.46,"body":"organizations that are managed"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4073.55,"endTime":4076.46,"body":"the way that they you know, have"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4073.55,"endTime":4076.46,"body":"have been for hundreds of years."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4077.0,"endTime":4080.81,"body":"You know, that's that, that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4077.0,"endTime":4080.81,"body":"whole utopian thing, which we"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4080.81,"endTime":4081.86,"body":"need to have a better way,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4081.949,"endTime":4084.649,"body":"I got a I got a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4081.949,"endTime":4084.649,"body":"theory about this study, unless"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4084.649,"endTime":4088.189,"body":"you're a business that it's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4084.649,"endTime":4088.189,"body":"adopting an innovative culture"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4088.189,"endTime":4091.519,"body":"and in that growth mindset"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4088.189,"endTime":4091.519,"body":"mentality, you're going to get"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4091.519,"endTime":4095.899,"body":"left behind because essentially,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4091.519,"endTime":4095.899,"body":"you're going to have our kids"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4095.899,"endTime":4098.389,"body":"Generation Y, I've got a nine"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4095.899,"endTime":4098.389,"body":"year old and a seven year old,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4098.809,"endTime":4103.639,"body":"they, they were gonna be very"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4098.809,"endTime":4103.639,"body":"self aware from the sense of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4103.639,"endTime":4106.219,"body":"what what they're actually"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4103.639,"endTime":4106.219,"body":"trying to achieve here. And if"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4106.219,"endTime":4109.819,"body":"they move into a business, and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4106.219,"endTime":4109.819,"body":"they're not allowed to try"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4109.819,"endTime":4111.979,"body":"something new, they're gonna"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4109.819,"endTime":4111.979,"body":"walk out"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4112.009,"endTime":4115.519,"body":"yeah. So we're"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4112.009,"endTime":4115.519,"body":"in the midst of this we're part"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4115.519,"endTime":4116.359,"body":"of this transition. Here"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4116.36,"endTime":4120.53,"body":"we are. Yes."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4116.36,"endTime":4120.53,"body":"Well, I hope Ben I yeah."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4120.53,"endTime":4123.83,"body":"Hopefully Kate my children"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4120.53,"endTime":4123.83,"body":"enough to understand that they"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4124.07,"endTime":4127.91,"body":"may, you know, they're in"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4124.07,"endTime":4127.91,"body":"rallies and whatnot. So what's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4127.91,"endTime":4130.94,"body":"the one item on your bucket list"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4127.91,"endTime":4130.94,"body":"other than learning how to make"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4130.94,"endTime":4132.38,"body":"lasagna? Yeah."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4133.61,"endTime":4138.2,"body":"And well, I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4133.61,"endTime":4138.2,"body":"think from from apart from golf,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4138.23,"endTime":4141.98,"body":"that's my big passion outside of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4138.23,"endTime":4141.98,"body":"my family and work. I think I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4141.98,"endTime":4145.79,"body":"think if I my bucket list in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4141.98,"endTime":4145.79,"body":"terms of my professional work"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4145.79,"endTime":4148.67,"body":"would be I've just started you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4145.79,"endTime":4148.67,"body":"know, effect diva, you know,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4148.67,"endTime":4153.2,"body":"more effective Yep. And I'd love"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4148.67,"endTime":4153.2,"body":"to be able to just keep doing it"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4153.2,"endTime":4158.36,"body":"till I till I you know, retire"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4153.2,"endTime":4158.36,"body":"whatever that means, you know,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4158.36,"endTime":4160.94,"body":"so like, that would be a nice"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4158.36,"endTime":4160.94,"body":"thing. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4160.94,"endTime":4164.69,"body":"so build a nice"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4160.94,"endTime":4164.69,"body":"yeah, I need to grow the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4164.69,"endTime":4165.2,"body":"business."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4165.44,"endTime":4169.01,"body":"Yeah, to a point"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4165.44,"endTime":4169.01,"body":"Yeah, I like the idea of that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4169.16,"endTime":4173.93,"body":"building network collaborating"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4169.16,"endTime":4173.93,"body":"so I like the sense of being"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4175.07,"endTime":4180.26,"body":"independent but that small bit a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4175.07,"endTime":4180.26,"body":"lot here and then but also like"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4180.26,"endTime":4184.34,"body":"the idea of building up that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4180.26,"endTime":4184.34,"body":"network of collaboration and I'm"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4184.37,"endTime":4187.55,"body":"you know that that's done a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4184.37,"endTime":4187.55,"body":"little bit of that really doing"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4187.55,"endTime":4193.31,"body":"very well. So, but yeah, be nice"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4187.55,"endTime":4193.31,"body":"to travel again. Yes, overseas,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4193.31,"endTime":4196.76,"body":"want my family, but like"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4193.31,"endTime":4196.76,"body":"overseas, my wife's family are"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4196.76,"endTime":4200.72,"body":"all in Germany. So that's, that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4196.76,"endTime":4200.72,"body":"would be nice to do. regularly"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4200.75,"endTime":4203.57,"body":"Fingers crossed"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4200.75,"endTime":4203.57,"body":"2022 is the yearly"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4204.32,"endTime":4207.32,"body":"and true power"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4204.32,"endTime":4207.32,"body":"at Mount compass Yeah, alright"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4207.35,"endTime":4210.14,"body":"yeah that'd be nice um so I have"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4210.14,"endTime":4212.84,"body":"that you know I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4210.14,"endTime":4212.84,"body":"thought playing golf for a while"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4212.84,"endTime":4220.01,"body":"you shouldn't be at that level"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4212.84,"endTime":4220.01,"body":"now if you had access to a time"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4220.01,"endTime":4225.83,"body":"machine and you had a return"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4220.01,"endTime":4225.83,"body":"trip photo back where would you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4225.83,"endTime":4226.19,"body":"go"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4228.05,"endTime":4235.46,"body":"oh wow I got"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4228.05,"endTime":4235.46,"body":"this. I got this media full hour"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4235.46,"endTime":4239.99,"body":"to go back to someone want to"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4235.46,"endTime":4239.99,"body":"see some of my ancestors know"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4239.99,"endTime":4243.23,"body":"where I came from? Yeah, I'm"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4239.99,"endTime":4243.23,"body":"named after my grandfather."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4243.26,"endTime":4247.67,"body":"Yeah, never met him or really,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4243.26,"endTime":4247.67,"body":"father. My father probably"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4247.67,"endTime":4250.79,"body":"didn't even know him that well."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4247.67,"endTime":4250.79,"body":"I think my father was six or"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4250.79,"endTime":4254.48,"body":"seven when he passed away. So"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4250.79,"endTime":4254.48,"body":"I'd love to go back and see"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4254.48,"endTime":4258.17,"body":"where I came from. Because I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4254.48,"endTime":4258.17,"body":"think I think there's a big part"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4258.17,"endTime":4264.62,"body":"of me is there yeah that's from"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4258.17,"endTime":4264.62,"body":"pretty yeah that's a very"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4264.62,"endTime":4265.28,"body":"personal"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4265.31,"endTime":4267.23,"body":"Yeah, no, that's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4265.31,"endTime":4267.23,"body":"your point. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4267.26,"endTime":4269.51,"body":"I think I like"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4267.26,"endTime":4269.51,"body":"to go back to my grandfather."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4269.93,"endTime":4273.05,"body":"The one I never met Yeah, and my"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4269.93,"endTime":4273.05,"body":"grandmother said let's see my"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4273.05,"endTime":4274.88,"body":"dad yeah in Italy Yeah, yeah,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4274.91,"endTime":4276.47,"body":"they were they"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4274.91,"endTime":4276.47,"body":"never made the trip out here."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4276.5,"endTime":4279.08,"body":"They never did"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4276.5,"endTime":4279.08,"body":"because he Yeah, well, dad my"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4279.08,"endTime":4283.25,"body":"father came as a 20 year old"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4279.08,"endTime":4283.25,"body":"Okay, and I think the Euro was"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4283.25,"endTime":4289.28,"body":"born. My Mr. His mum. My"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4283.25,"endTime":4289.28,"body":"grandmother passed away in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4289.28,"endTime":4293.6,"body":"Italy, so yeah, I'd go back"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4289.28,"endTime":4293.6,"body":"there a lot to see what it was"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4293.6,"endTime":4298.04,"body":"like used before. Yeah, but"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4293.6,"endTime":4298.04,"body":"probably before we"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4298.4,"endTime":4303.23,"body":"would be great."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4298.4,"endTime":4303.23,"body":"If you had one superhero power,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4303.44,"endTime":4307.52,"body":"or could have one superpower"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4303.44,"endTime":4307.52,"body":"what would it be? superheroes?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4308.36,"endTime":4309.8,"body":"I'm a big Marvel fan. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4310.64,"endTime":4313.73,"body":"I'm scared of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4310.64,"endTime":4313.73,"body":"heights. Be nice to deal with"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4313.73,"endTime":4315.26,"body":"that one. Yeah, yeah, so"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4315.26,"endTime":4317.6,"body":"it's your"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4315.26,"endTime":4317.6,"body":"superhero passive fly Yeah."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4318.71,"endTime":4320.63,"body":"That's one of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4318.71,"endTime":4320.63,"body":"the Is it like Superman is a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4320.63,"endTime":4323.6,"body":"spider man is he was informed of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4320.63,"endTime":4323.6,"body":"that category. Well, spider man"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4323.6,"endTime":4323.81,"body":"got"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4323.81,"endTime":4327.14,"body":"bitten by a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4323.81,"endTime":4327.14,"body":"spider they gave me a very"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4327.14,"endTime":4330.74,"body":"realistic scenario. Some of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4327.14,"endTime":4330.74,"body":"these fighters are saying"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4332.9,"endTime":4335.51,"body":"is there a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4332.9,"endTime":4335.51,"body":"superhero that can"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4335.75,"endTime":4338.27,"body":"use your"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4335.75,"endTime":4338.27,"body":"superhero choose whatever you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4338.27,"endTime":4340.49,"body":"want? Yeah to follow another"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4341.87,"endTime":4344.06,"body":"does sound"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4341.87,"endTime":4344.06,"body":"sounds terrible but you know how"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4344.06,"endTime":4345.17,"body":"can change someone's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4347.75,"endTime":4349.28,"body":"not help them see"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4349.28,"endTime":4351.53,"body":"a different way?"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4349.28,"endTime":4351.53,"body":"Or Yeah, maybe not. Maybe I'll"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4351.53,"endTime":4356.45,"body":"flip it won't be so judgmental"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4351.53,"endTime":4356.45,"body":"today. And if I can put myself"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4356.45,"endTime":4362.42,"body":"in someone else's mind for for a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4356.45,"endTime":4362.42,"body":"period of time and then come out"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4362.42,"endTime":4365.63,"body":"of this thing and understand"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4362.42,"endTime":4365.63,"body":"fully what what the what they're"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4365.63,"endTime":4371.36,"body":"really thinking. Yeah. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4365.63,"endTime":4371.36,"body":"that would be interesting. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4373.19,"endTime":4375.77,"body":"Sounds a bit odd when you put it"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4373.19,"endTime":4375.77,"body":"that way."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4377.27,"endTime":4385.01,"body":"Next, you know, I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4377.27,"endTime":4385.01,"body":"know I've thought about the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4385.01,"endTime":4388.07,"body":"monitoring thing I'm having"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4385.01,"endTime":4388.07,"body":"enough trouble dealing with my"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4388.07,"endTime":4390.89,"body":"own thoughts, let alone others"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4388.07,"endTime":4390.89,"body":"but no, I hadn't"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4390.89,"endTime":4392.39,"body":"thought of it."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4390.89,"endTime":4392.39,"body":"That also was more about just"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4392.39,"endTime":4395.84,"body":"for a split second. Yeah. What"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4392.39,"endTime":4395.84,"body":"are you really? Yeah, no, it"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4395.84,"endTime":4398.36,"body":"probably would probably would"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4395.84,"endTime":4398.36,"body":"not be beneficial."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4400.31,"endTime":4403.94,"body":"Especially Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4400.31,"endTime":4403.94,"body":"you're very your man have great"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4403.94,"endTime":4406.1,"body":"empathy towards other people. So"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4406.13,"endTime":4408.71,"body":"it wouldn't they"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4406.13,"endTime":4408.71,"body":"wouldn't do me any Friday night."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4408.74,"endTime":4409.1,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4411.14,"endTime":4413.0,"body":"And last, but not"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4411.14,"endTime":4413.0,"body":"least, you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4414.86,"endTime":4417.62,"body":"have any little"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4414.86,"endTime":4417.62,"body":"ones? Just the one? Boy,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4417.65,"endTime":4420.53,"body":"a boy. 11 years"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4417.65,"endTime":4420.53,"body":"old. 11 years. So you've got a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4420.53,"endTime":4421.88,"body":"few dad jokes. And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4429.47,"endTime":4432.02,"body":"I'll tell you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4429.47,"endTime":4432.02,"body":"what. I felt like I did one"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4432.02,"endTime":4437.06,"body":"today. Okay, but it was more of"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4432.02,"endTime":4437.06,"body":"an incident. So I went to get my"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4437.09,"endTime":4441.62,"body":"GED twice. Every two years. I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4437.09,"endTime":4441.62,"body":"have a hearing test. Yeah. My"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4441.62,"endTime":4446.27,"body":"EMT guy. Yeah, at North"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4441.62,"endTime":4446.27,"body":"Adelaide. And because I've got"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4446.3,"endTime":4449.42,"body":"I've got Yeah, anyway, that's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4446.3,"endTime":4449.42,"body":"another story. But anyway, I'm"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4449.42,"endTime":4454.79,"body":"getting my journey. It's not a"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4449.42,"endTime":4454.79,"body":"joke. This is the person that"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4454.79,"endTime":4457.97,"body":"comes to mind. So anyway, I'm"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4454.79,"endTime":4457.97,"body":"doing the hearing test. And all"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4457.97,"endTime":4461.21,"body":"of a sudden, the lady comes in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4457.97,"endTime":4461.21,"body":"and says, Now I've got to put"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4461.21,"endTime":4465.08,"body":"another headphone on the other"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4461.21,"endTime":4465.08,"body":"side and put play some noise."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4465.14,"endTime":4467.78,"body":"Because something about that you"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4465.14,"endTime":4467.78,"body":"left and right here. Yeah. And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4467.78,"endTime":4469.61,"body":"all of a sudden she's setting me"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4467.78,"endTime":4469.61,"body":"up. So I've got all these"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4469.61,"endTime":4472.97,"body":"headphones in a in one in one in"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4469.61,"endTime":4472.97,"body":"one out the other. And I said,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4473.0,"endTime":4476.84,"body":"Is this an April Fool's some"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4473.0,"endTime":4476.84,"body":"sort of April Fool's joke. And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4476.84,"endTime":4479.21,"body":"she just looked at me sternly"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4476.84,"endTime":4479.21,"body":"and I said, that's just a dad"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4479.21,"endTime":4483.26,"body":"joke. I don't know if it wasn't"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4479.21,"endTime":4483.26,"body":"an April Fool's joke. Yeah, I"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4483.26,"endTime":4484.55,"body":"don't know. That's dead joke."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4483.26,"endTime":4484.55,"body":"Sorry."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4485.06,"endTime":4489.32,"body":"That's fine. It's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4485.06,"endTime":4489.32,"body":"brilliant. Thank you very much"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4489.32,"endTime":4493.91,"body":"for your talk. Today, Frank."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4489.32,"endTime":4493.91,"body":"It's been been great. Great"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4493.91,"endTime":4498.32,"body":"chatting and learning about your"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4493.91,"endTime":4498.32,"body":"love of the Agile methodology."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4498.35,"endTime":4498.86,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4500.0,"endTime":4503.93,"body":"Hopefully one"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4500.0,"endTime":4503.93,"body":"good thought one new idea"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4504.05,"endTime":4506.75,"body":"and yeah that's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4504.05,"endTime":4506.75,"body":"that's basically if you can take"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4506.75,"endTime":4510.62,"body":"something away from it I'm sure"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4506.75,"endTime":4510.62,"body":"people will say thank you very"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4510.62,"endTime":4514.76,"body":"much for your time where can we"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4510.62,"endTime":4514.76,"body":"find you? Like Where? LinkedIn?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4514.88,"endTime":4515.66,"body":"Your website"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4515.69,"endTime":4519.23,"body":"not mount comp"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4515.69,"endTime":4519.23,"body":"ss No. Yeah LinkedIn are easy"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4519.23,"endTime":4526.22,"body":"to find they're frankly solid"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4519.23,"endTime":4526.22,"body":"A. ws Who? Perfect generally Fra"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4526.22,"endTime":4530.66,"body":"co Francesco yeah grande eff"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4526.22,"endTime":4530.66,"body":"ct diva Yep."},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4530.66,"endTime":4537.77,"body":"how do you spell"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4530.66,"endTime":4537.77,"body":"that.com ewfktiv.com? d ppl"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4537.83,"endTime":4541.49,"body":"p.com. PPO? Yeah, okay. I'll be"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4537.83,"endTime":4541.49,"body":"Oh, yes,"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4541.52,"endTime":4546.41,"body":"yes. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4541.52,"endTime":4546.41,"body":"People people yeah, the other"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4546.41,"endTime":4549.11,"body":"site will be my wife's company"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4549.44,"endTime":4550.19,"body":"which is"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4550.34,"endTime":4554.27,"body":"given a blog is"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4550.34,"endTime":4554.27,"body":"hers as effect diva. Okay. And"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4554.27,"endTime":4558.17,"body":"she does. Yes, strategic"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4554.27,"endTime":4558.17,"body":"marketing, tourism. Okay. Tough"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4558.17,"endTime":4560.54,"body":"gig at the moment. But she's"},{"speaker":"Frank Vassallo","startTime":4558.17,"endTime":4560.54,"body":"doing like a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4560.69,"endTime":4562.79,"body":"beautiful thanks"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4560.69,"endTime":4562.79,"body":"for your time again. Thanks,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Franco","startTime":4562.79,"endTime":4564.26,"body":"everyone. Cheers, guys. Cheers."},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":4564.92,"endTime":4567.65,"body":"Thank you once again"},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":4564.92,"endTime":4567.65,"body":"for joining us here at creating"},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":4567.65,"endTime":4570.68,"body":"synergy. It's been great"},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":4567.65,"endTime":4570.68,"body":"spending this time with you."},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":4570.83,"endTime":4575.03,"body":"Please jump on to the Synergy IQ"},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":4570.83,"endTime":4575.03,"body":"Facebook and LinkedIn page where"},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":4575.03,"endTime":4578.63,"body":"the discussion continues after"},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":4575.03,"endTime":4578.63,"body":"the show. join our mailing list"},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":4578.63,"endTime":4583.01,"body":"so you'll know what's happening"},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":4578.63,"endTime":4583.01,"body":"next at Synergy iq.com.au. And"},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":4583.01,"endTime":4586.25,"body":"of course, don't forget to"},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":4583.01,"endTime":4586.25,"body":"subscribe to this podcast. And"},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":4586.25,"endTime":4588.71,"body":"if you really enjoyed it, please"},{"speaker":"Synergy IQ","startTime":4586.25,"endTime":4588.71,"body":"share it with your friends."}]}