00:05

Hi, everyone. I'm Tara.

Michelle D'costa  00:07

Hi, I'm Michele.

Tara Khandelwal  00:09

Welcome Back to Our Podcast Books and Beyond with bound season four, where we speak to some of the finest writers in India to find out what makes them tick.

Michelle D'costa  00:20

Yes, and we are editors, podcasters and storytellers. And through bound, we help you create stories and put them out into the world. I'm so excited because

Tara Khandelwal  00:30

on today's episode, we speak to the big hearted Sudha Murthy, whose love for children is so contagious. I love reading her children's books because they make us so close to our childhood. And some of the books make us feel very close to nature, especially her latest book how mother earth goddess up.

Michelle D'costa  00:48

Yeah, and actually since we announced this episode, Tara, we have received so many questions from children, parents, fans from outside India, as well. So we have crowd sourced all of the questions with pick the most interesting questions and included them in our special section on this episode. So on

Tara Khandelwal  01:06

the episode, we also unpack her writing for children and for adults. She's 71 years old, and she is keeping on managing to writing which she talks about in the episode. She writes in Canada, she writes in English, she's one of Padmashree award. And she also does a lot of charity. So we actually learned a lot about not only her process, but also from her wisdom. She's opened up libraries throughout India. And she spoke to us about how she uses those programs to reach more readers. And that's something that, you know, we are really, really interested in because a lot of people come to us and they ask us, you know, how do we make our books reach more people? How do we increase readership. And it's such a big problem, you know, speaking to readers is another ballgame altogether. And that's why podcasts like this are so, so important. And that's why we started a book marketing services to help writers reach the right audience. So if you want your book to have a wider audience, you want your book to reach the relevant readers to reach out to us on our social media platforms at bound India. And we will get in touch with you and he will tell you a little bit more about this.

Michelle D'costa  02:20

Yes, but for now, I can't wait to speak to sukawati. Let's dive in.

Tara Khandelwal  02:27

We're so excited to have you here today. Ma'am. Thank you for your time.

Sudha Murty  02:31

Nice, nice talking to Tara and Michelle.

Michelle D'costa  02:34

And we have actually divided this episode into four sections. So the first one will include you know, your experiences as a teacher your experiences, writing children's books, and how your philosophies came about. And the second very special section has all the crowdsource questions from all your friends, the moment we announced that we will be recording with you, we got so many questions. So we picked out the best from them. And the section three will be a rapid fire round, where you will just be expected to answer in one word. So it will be a fun section,

Tara Khandelwal  03:10

we loved your most recent book, how the earth got its beauty. And the book talks about the origin of life on Earth and how it came about. So could you tell us a little bit more about how you created this world through these three young girls. So each girl has a very unique gift. So why did you choose to tell the story through these three young girls? And could you tell us a bit more about the book?

Sudha Murty  03:35

Yes. Someone asked me that, you know the earth did not begin the way you have written. But he was so different. I said this is a story book. It is not a history book. It is not anthropology book, it is a story book. And it is with the children. So it has to be with God. It has to build to water it has to be something very nice and smooth. Thinking about Earth. When I travel on my work, I always wonder the beauty of the Earth, how it changes 100 Kilometer 150 kilometers traveled, that desert the forest there the dense forest, there is a waterfall you know and the crowded city and sometimes there are valleys if you go into northern snow clad mountains, etc. So if you look at the whole canvas of the picture, then you feel who is that person who has done such a beautiful painting and what is the reason behind that? And particularly in pandemic I realized the more we abuse nature, one or the other day nature will get upset with us and show her real nature that she did not withstand all this cruelty on her. That came into my mind that I thought about writing a story book for children where we're to share. We should not abuse nature. We must use things as much as we want not more than that. And this book book came out the book is so beautiful. I really like that kind of picture, which I don't but brilliant carpets, Pandey

Michelle D'costa  05:14

actually, even though the book is for children, you know, Tara and I loved it because it made us feel closer to nature, actually, because of the pandemic, you know, we are all indoors. And it's really difficult for us to really envision that, but your book took us closer to that. So it was it was a wonderful experience. So before we get into more writing questions, ma'am, one thing that we really want to know is how do you manage to stay so positive, you have been through so much in life you've achieved so much, and there's so much warmth in your smile like that comes across, even in your writing, there's so much of empathy. So like, what's your secret to staying so positive?

Tara Khandelwal  05:51

This is one of the questions that our listeners wanted to know the most. Yes,

Sudha Murty  05:55

it is very simple. You know, it is a mindset actually saying, you know, half a glass of water, there is it I don't have what I only have, right right from the beginning, I want to look life in a positive angle, because it gives you strength, and it also helps you to go further. And if anything negative, then you stop there only. And second thing is, you know, when you look back in life, like what Buddha says there is nothing permanent. What exists today does not exist tomorrow. So the thing is permanent, for wise, wasting negativity negative. The best mantra I have, this too shall pass. Oh, wow. That gives me a lot of strength in life.

Tara Khandelwal  06:41

Yeah, ma'am. I think I'll also sort of try and incorporate that my nanny also always tells me this too shall pass. And speaking about, you know, grandmother's one of the things that Michelle and I noticed when we were reading, so we read, obviously, you know, there's your latest book, but we've been reading books for quite a while. And even your children's books, you know, are very Beloved to us. And we noticed that in all of your in a lot of your books, there is a grandmother character that shows up a lot. Right from your book, you know, how I taught my grandmother to read to your latest book. So what about the nature of grandmother grandchild relationship influences your writing?

Sudha Murty  07:25

Life lighter side, they have a common enemy? No, because I grew up with my grandmother. And she and I learned a lot from her. And there is a reason for me, grand mother symbolizes affection, unconditional love low, you know, you make a little bit in discipline, okay? A little bit, okay? Then, you know when to hook your eyes to get that warm feeling okay, from her. And I'm a grandmother now and I all my grandchildren say the same thing. You know, so to be a grandmother is you have a lot of experience. And you can teach someone unconditional love. And you can always preach in the form of a story that giving a moral essence, that is what I consider other grandmother.

Michelle D'costa  08:16

Right? I think that that relationship is really special. And, and I think only through your creativity, you can really I think distill that love or distill that warmth and create such interesting stories for children throughout. So can you tell us that one moment from your childhood when you knew you wanted to be a storyteller?

Sudha Murty  08:36

When I was a child, we did not have any entertainment. We didn't have a forget about TV, we did not have electricity. I am 70 years old or 71 talking about 65 years back in my village, there's no electricity there. And we'll work between 7am to 8pm. And the evening, you know, I will say 10 grandmother some stories. The stories actually helped me a lot to imagine. Imagine. And when I was in school, the teachers whenever they're upset either on a maternity leave, or they're on leave, then as a class monitor, I have to hold the class when I was to hold the class, the best way I thought was holding the classes you know when you're about 1012 years old kid you want to show you all that because your class monitor. So the best way other other monitors is to say, no, no talking keep quiet, but I never did that. Okay, tell your story. So I started telling stories in school only, which I read from book or I heard or I created little smaller stories, etc. So that became my habit of telling stories. And I realized that their attention I can hold for 45 minutes of my fellow classmates. Not Don't Don't make noise, keep quiet. None of them I used to I realized the power of story at any age is very attractive for business. But if you tell a story in a right way, depends On Who are you, and that develop me later part of the storyteller.

Tara Khandelwal  10:05

I just remember, you know, there is so much power in storytelling because even when you know, your kid or your grandma is always, you know, narrate these stories to you, and that's how you learn so many things. But you know, nowadays children are so influenced by social media, digital platforms, it's a different context. So for you, Ma'am, you know, you've been writing for so long, what is it? Right? Right, like writing stories for children in today's age, when they're so influenced by time platforms?

Sudha Murty  10:36

I agree. I agree. Again, today's grammars are also very different. Okay. They will someone told me, Martha, you wrote a grandmother telling stories, but my grandmother, she told me, Molly in my grandma's so between seeing the TV series, okay, one is listening to Ramona or someone telling you most attractive is seeing it on electronic media, less is seeing it now or reading it through cartoons. Third one is reading picture books without your picture. Fourth one is listening from somebody, but it is an art if you make it better than the electronic media, then you will be able to create an interest but you have to work hard for example, you know, I used to describe, you know, how are we drama? How is Krishna? How is our India? How was Chandragupta Maurya, you know, all that you can see on TV also, you can also talk, but TV, your lot more romantic things, and we can eliminate all those things and tell children who has Chanakya and our Ashoka, in your own words, you can create that atmosphere and their children, then they will listen. But you have to work very hard for that. Then you have to tell your children look, your imagination increases when you listen to someone who tells because my grandfather described how was wisdom, Lord wisdom. Now okay, how was the God I mean, Indian talking, he has his bluish color, he's very tall. So that made me to imagine a lord in my mind of so huge structure in my mind. But when asked my daughter describe her around, she described her movie, who was around in foggers, Rama, but she has seen Rama on the screen, whereas I never saw Rama on the screen I read. So you if you create a character with lot more imagination, it helps children a lot more than just merely telling telling a story. Now in today's electronic media, you can always tell them look, you have to say we can't escape this reality. If you want to the electronic media, anything it is a once a week, two hours, you will get it not more than you should exercise you should do you know bleed, you should cajole, you should tell that is not acceptable. And first, you should not see electronic. And big TV, my child was small, until he was 12. Plus he passed out I did not take I said no, I would also not see which were other together readable. You know, you have to go an extra mile to interest them for some time later, they could get up. You

Michelle D'costa  13:16

know, I totally agree that, you know, if the writing is descriptive, it makes a child imagine so actually, after I read your story, how I taught my grandmother to read, I actually went on YouTube and saw the adaptation and it just made it, it made me relive that whole experience again, and I think they have really done justice to your story because it was descriptive in the first place. So that's why it was very easy for them to adapt it. So I really wanted to know, ma'am, I've noticed that all your children's books begin with how, from you know how the earth got its beauty to you know, how I taught my grandmother to read or how the sea became salty. So what about this really attracts children?

Sudha Murty  13:57

Yeah, because I'm basically an engineer and I have an analytical mind. And I look at it, how it happened, why it happened. And children minds are very curious. Why? Because these are the tell me why questions. Okay. And children will ask such questions. Tell me why. Tell me how. And there's a reason the titles have come

Tara Khandelwal  14:17

like, and I think even as adults, you know how the sea became salty that they know more about it? I think it's, it really makes you connect to the inner child as well. So ma'am, a couple of years ago had attended one of your book launches for the serpent's revenge. And in that time, you said that if you tell children models directly, they don't like it, but you can hide the meaning in the story. So I wanted to know you know, how you choose with how do you choose which models to give? Do you choose the model first, or do you think of the story first and then see what can you teach in the story,

Sudha Murty  14:56

neither of them the story comes to me He comes to me and I write, and then I will not write. And you know, I have to tell them to tell truth, I have to make a story not the story chooses me to write. And when I'm writing, I realize what the story is. And then I mixed on adoption, some corrections, etc. But the story comes on.

Michelle D'costa  15:19

Right, I think that's the best way to approach any story. And we'll definitely keep that in mind. So I was wondering, man, you, I mean, I consider teaching as one of the most noble professions in the world, and you believe in the power of stories, or in education, and you've been a teacher for most of your life. So what makes a good teacher according to

Sudha Murty  15:39

you, as a teacher, patience, patience makes you a good teacher. Because in my class of 60, let us assume that 50 will understand 10 will not understand. So I will repeat it. The people who understood that 50 people, they get bored, people who are not understood, if you don't repeat, they will get bored. My aim is to see those 10 people should understand. So I repeat many times, or if the person comes after a class or worse, and asked me the question, I will sit and reply patiently, you know, whatever the answer to patients and low for children low for teaching low for children, that makes you a good teacher.

Tara Khandelwal  16:20

Yeah, you know, some of my friends are teachers. And that's, you know, I keep asking them how you do it. The children are so naughty, and they all reply patients. So that's such an interesting answer. We really feel your love for children when we read these stories, because they are so heartwarming, but we really wanted to know, you know, you're a teacher, you've been a teacher. You know, all of these books, I'm sure they've taught kids so much. But one of the stories that I really liked in the book I taught my grandmother to read was the story of how your daughter told you about giving back. And then that's how you became the chairperson of Infosys foundation. So we wanted to know, you know, what are the things that you have learned from children,

Sudha Murty  17:04

but not a lot? Actually, what is their unbiased, it doesn't matter who I am and who I was in Calcutta, I always tell the story, doesn't school gang came for listening to the stories or the book opening. And they told me to read a book one lesson in that and I was reading one valueless by get caught up and said, Man, eg you write very well, but you can't read well, as it may be better, how come he says, I go for dramatics and I know how to modulate your voice and they say you should not just to to modulate your voice I said, Okay. Then you read this and hear it very well. That time and this results in LuLaRoe please don't please and said no. Oh, no, because teachers felt how can they tell the author like this? For them? I am a storyteller for me, he is my teacher. And that they are not said I would write a story but somebody should read. Okay, particularly children should read. So children are open minded, not biased. Frank and polled. They enjoy small things. Like like a kite. Flying a kite aboard in the rainy season. Children happinesses in small things. Oak, Agassi, Cristero parish copani small droplets, small things actually make them so happy. That unbiased happiness

Michelle D'costa  18:21

when you're a child, you think there is no limit to anything right? So when you think what would you be when you grow up? There are endless possibilities. And we know that Ma'am, you were the first female engineer hired by Tata right? And now women are slowly getting into the field even though there are quite I will say there's a very big disparity, but I will say things are changing right? Earlier, women were anonymous authors, but now they are getting exposure. So I want to know, what would you like to tell girls, you know, young girls who are wishing to explore science and the arts

Sudha Murty  18:49

know this a new era, that nothing is a boy or a girl? Actually, you know? My both parents became old. And actually me and my sister. We looked after them, actually. So my mother and she would always tell me what a myth that only boys look after it is always on the contrary, is that daughters actually who look after their parents better because they want conditional love with their parents. I always believe women have a lot more managerial capacity, a lot more patience a lot more. She'd like to call the guy 16 hands. Each handle the one weapon that she represents, like a woman represents to God that she can read and write. She can run the family, she can work to look after children. She will serve her parents. Okay. She will look you know, she will read right? She will go to the war like the military have. She's courageous. She's compassionate, to look at her. She has enormous capacity. We don't we do not know how to tap. Please tap your own personality. Because it's a hidden jump. There are many key nodes inside you. Don't worry about the one coil which is an intellect you have You know, just in your heart, please untap and joy,

Tara Khandelwal  20:03

what a nice metaphor. Thank you for expressing it in that way. So you know, coming back to your writing, you write for such different age groups you write for adults, and even within the Children's groups, you've written for five to eight year olds, 10 onwards, seven to 10. Each of these age groups are so different. So how do you switch that hat? And how do you write for these different age

Michelle D'costa  20:27

groups?

Sudha Murty  20:28

If I do right, five to seven, then I will become 37 first. Okay? How do I look like when I'm between five and seven? Okay. So I think in their mind, I put my feet in their shoes and think that way. And then it becomes very easy for me to write. If I am 70, and write for seven, then it don't, then everything is like, you know, it's okay. What is the left in life, etc. But if I'm seven, there's so much in life.

Tara Khandelwal  20:56

Yeah, totally. And I remember had the same experience because I'm an editor. So I was editing a children's book for 12 year olds. And I actually I had to speak to some 12 year olds and I try very hard to become a 12 year old so kudos to you at 17 Getting into the minds of seven

Sudha Murty  21:16

Yeah, my granddaughter was telling me the other day you are 71 So how can you blow so many candies? 71 is a lot as a bit i i Tell him he says solution. You are more intelligent. So tell me the moment that you are more intelligent. She became very happy, okay? Because they're all kids. They require some pat on her back. She said I have a solution a Jeep just interchange your number. It becomes 70 puts me in Kansas and you go sweet.

Michelle D'costa  21:46

Man, we did that. You know, you actually think about your characters when you go on your morning walks. So we were curious, has anything changed for you during the pandemic regarding your writing routine?

Sudha Murty  21:57

Not really. Because, you know, in pandemic I'm extremely busy. I run a foundation Infosys Foundation, and we establish a hospital we we made a dry ration of 100,001 lakh kids, then where to run for the vaccination to talk to people. Then we are vaccination camp just now. I finished 180 People got vaccinated today. So we are preparing for the third way to actually my work has increased a lot in pandemic because I'm working from home. If I were in office, there are many people who do many work. Today I have to have all the time phone calls. So no, it's not changed much except that I don't travel. Otherwise I'm extremely busy. That's infinite pandemic. Actually, I wrote three books one is how the Aquatics duty other one is grandparents pencil stories. Third one is going to come in no but on my tourist.

Tara Khandelwal  22:53

Congrats. I read the I read the grandparents Bagha stories as well transported back to my childhood where my nanny Nana would tell me stories. So we're a man, we also, you know, you're so busy, and you're doing so many things. But we also read that you read a lot every day and you read 100 and 100 250 pages every day. So how do you do that?

Sudha Murty  23:17

I require reading, otherwise I can't sleep. It's okay. And I'm a fast reader, because I'm used to reading would depend on what book I have. Actually, right now. I have Rakesh Omprakash. Mehra autobiography, I'm reading that biographies.

Michelle D'costa  23:34

That's lovely. Okay, so ma'am. Now we come to I within a very special section, which is these are the questions from your fans. So they really so the very first question that everyone wants to know because a lot of parents follow your work because they love to, you know, share it with their children. Most of them want to know how do we get small kids to start reading because it's very difficult for them to concentrate very difficult for them to read a full book. So what is your advice man, what I

Sudha Murty  24:03

have done, I will tell you, when the children are small, I used to read for them, they will run away, they'll bring them back they will run away I'll bring them back. Then the simple stories to them with not great vocabulary, simple vocabulary. And later when they grew up, I said Okay, today is reading time. Every day is reading time, half an hour, one hour that time I'll sit with them and I read my book they will do their when they came to teenagers, they won't listen to me. Then I said okay beta for your sake, I'm telling you, books are never failing friends and their birthdays I always give them their friends birthdays also I gave them so I made it usually the first mother should read first father should read first that you can't reach them you read the book and I will play video game or you tell children Okay, I will do my office work and use it and you know, they won't do we are the role model for children, if they have to read the book where to read Eclair place with a book. And that should we should understand Children will not read on their own until there are certain age you have to do their sacrifice reading a book along with them and you should know the books you should talk about books my grandfather is still the bird you know every book has a life don't keep it on the ground, keep it on the table cover it to your to teach talk about book take somebody's house or go to someone's house new books are the gift and that made a big them to libraries take them to bookshop make them to buy books.

Tara Khandelwal  25:28

I couldn't agree more ma'am I remember when I was a kid my parents would be our had a huge bookshelf full of books my parents would always be reading to me and my nanny always told me don't put a book on the floor don't throw a book you know book had or ultimate respect. So but the next question is from our audience from your fans, they want to know who is your favorite author

Sudha Murty  25:50

when I was young, medium person you know I was really Canada or my education up to 10 plus years in Canada. So Canada writers were my isolate candidate electricity an issue of current and excel BI report. Later I started reading in English. Normally by and large, I like English authors. Their English is very beautiful. I feel that way. And not one person it both on change it without changing year to year. Decatur ticket does not work. But good book is always my greatest weakness. Like I have another book today. I bought it from Amazon. After the session immediately I want to scan through that for 10 minutes, then I'll do my work and preparing for the night reading.

Michelle D'costa  26:36

Which Which book is that book

Sudha Murty  26:38

in Canada? The person who becomes a vice chancellor in the Amar Kentucky University auditor Mata base. And he talks about the beauty of that forest and American taqueria in the difference that I want. I'm reading

Michelle D'costa  26:57

right actually, ma'am, you know, my mother tongue is Canada and I really wish I knew because my father is a fluent speaker. And and I've read one Canada novel, which was a translation which is gotcha butcher by Vivek shanbhag. And I really really liked that story, but I feel I'm missing out on so much more, but maybe one day I want to learn the language and read much more

Sudha Murty  27:18

you have to try better you have to try to learn the language you have to work very hard. For example, I was in Maharashtra I was in Maharashtra and I said okay, I knew Marathi. But I said if I have to be in Maharashtra for some time, then I should understand the nuance. They know the intricacies nuances and other things of that language and culture and the only way to know that to learn to read Marathi and a strategy the idea anyway, alphabets because of the Devanagari script. And I became very fluent reader in Marathi and I enjoyed, if you want to know the culture of if you want to know the culture of that state where you live, then you must know that language, language is not just the communication language is also embedded in our culture. You should want to know Canada culturally preferable you should know the language. So today I can manage five languages because for me learning the language is the learning culture.

Tara Khandelwal  28:15

I love that thing. Ma'am. I will remember it and I will try and always follow it. One of the questions that our listeners had for you is, which do you like better? Do you like writing for adults better? Or do you like writing for children better

Sudha Murty  28:31

for children to think two times three times because their mind is like a red wall. And what you write if they read then it is like etching with a glass piece on the wet wall. If the well dries it remains. So you should not use the wrong words you should not get me wrong messages. So you should be very careful when you write. And I always with a positive attitude, because I don't want children to shoot and go through the negativity and the that I don't personally I won't want I don't want it and I won't like it. So write it for adult is much more easier.

Tara Khandelwal  29:07

Okay, man. So, one of the last questions. So we noticed that, you know, in your books in the introduction, you talk about the story behind the inspiration. So for example, in your book, the magic of the last temple, you wrote about how that story came to you, you know, because of your granddaughter Noni. So, could you tell, could you maybe narrate that story for our listeners

Sudha Murty  29:33

and describe my granddaughter, we'll call her newly and she always tells me Tell me some historical story that she Okay. And, you know, I do tell her some stories like I talked about Pompeii. Then I talked about voyages Daro. Harappa. She wants a story which is real and which is also historical, but which is also a little bit of imagination. Okay, that can then I talked about Because of the Badami of Karnataka to the case, then what I was telling her something in Gujarat, and top doorstep, well, she said, she's in England, so she would understand every step well, then I told her a step further, well, where you were, you're not enormous steps go inside and fetch the water. But it's just not a very it's also artpiece. I've seen what I told her that address the wall in here. I told her that. And then she said, Oh, why can't you read a story for that? Then I really did research for three years. The first step well was building 10,000 Exactly 10,000 41,000 ad in Karnataka at Let's measure at Lockwood and the Genesis, there is a story painted, there is a general Naga Deva and he went to Marwa or Gujarat in a war and he died there. But Karnataka Kingdom Chalukyas the Mother Nature, Kalani Chalukyas, one that kingdom of Malwa. Who, today's Mishra, then they took some of the sculpture from doctors from the Karnataka and the originally is done in lacunae but it's all one step well, and they exaggerated metal 100 times more in, in Gujarat, and from there, the concept of stepmill started, you have charged the body, you have a binary you're running the well. Then you have in Delhi many I said barley no I made and then you're in Karnataka in 13th century Hoysala kingdom, near HERBIE, do they your channel has stepped with toe and dumbbells, you have a set well, so I went on seven different types of people in different states. And then I understood the cause effect of the step well, and then I wrote that. So it took three years for me to make it to understand that continues a story, then, why is the village made and how? No, you have to protect it while to protect, etc. So the movie is a real character, in that the grandmother is me. And the conversation is real. But the story is the best.

Michelle D'costa  32:16

Now. Yes, it's so nice to know, you did so much of research, ma'am. Because I think given this also shows your love of knowing how it came about and how the step where we came about. So I think it was it was very interesting for me to know and and nowadays with the internet, or I think all of us, you know, it's so easy to do research, but I'm sure that your time it would have been, you know, very different and very interesting, like going to libraries and actually picking books and doing the research.

Sudha Murty  32:41

I know apart from that I can still get all stepwells it happened about fire 2015 I wrote Moonies that way okay. Did not fire me 1020 years back, I could have done all this research on Google, or Wikipedia. But going there, the kind of atmosphere you get the kind of lost you feel, the kind of sadness you feel, such a beautiful piece of art has become no abandoned, and sacrifices people made for to save their stepwells all these like, you know, in, in one of the stepwells. It's said that she started building up the three have started building a step well, and they lost the kingdom. And the she was so beautiful. And the sitar wanted to marry her and she said, Okay, I only want conditional completely separate and then you can marry then is a lot of money except well. And that day she dressed for the bride. And she when they see that I'll go around to stepwell and see how beautiful they are. And she did that and she uploaded to the web is so sad. It is sad. But it is also shows what kind of life they had. So I always believe to go historical places stand there and transport myself what it would have been 1000 years back, what would have been 700 years back. And that kind of a kind of experience you get. I never get it.

Tara Khandelwal  34:03

There's nothing like being in a place yourself and letting your imagination take over and you have such a rich imagination. So I can just imagine. So, you know, we were our listeners were also very curious. Does Mr. Narayan Murthy read your stories? Does he give you any

Sudha Murty  34:23

kind of scientific reading the new computing a new age computing computer in different era or such things? And he knows you know, for example, adult book episodes he knows because I do discuss the dining table. This happened that happened. He knows the story. He reads it but he didn't give any feedback. He always says Oh fantastic. And I said no. Tell me where I go wrong. I said no, no, it's very good because he says, I can't reproduce the way you do. So he doesn't give anything but he he knows he knows all my story

Tara Khandelwal  34:54

today and one of our favorite stories was in the book how I taught my Ranma how to read when you told about how you lent lent the money to Mr. Murthy to start Infosys. And I'm sure that is a great lesson for the app show the children would love reading that story. Man also, you know, you said that, listen to your mother, and keep money aside. So that was very nice.

Sudha Murty  35:19

Pretty bad in, in economics, you know, I don't invest any money anywhere, anything. The only investment I made in my life was 10,000 rupees given to me.

Michelle D'costa  35:30

Otherwise, I don't do well. And that was the best decision. Yeah, no actually eating that, ma'am. Like I was reminded of my childhood because my mom said the same thing. She and she used the very same phrase like, you know, saving for a rainy day. So when I saw that in your book, I was so happy. It just brought back those memories, ma'am. And just to add to that, about what you said, you know, when you're, like, physically present in a place and experiencing that is different. Actually, I was just telling Tara, it would have been so nice if we could have recorded this in person and actually sat across you and spoke to you, which would have been awesome. In Bangalore. Yeah. And I actually, you know, ma'am, this, Mr. Narayan had given a speech in Christ university years back, so I had done my MBA there. So I had seen her but I wish that I had also seen you in person, but maybe someday. The last

Tara Khandelwal  36:18

question, ma'am, you've had so many roles. You're the chairperson of this foundation. You're a writer for children, You're the writer for adults, you've been a teacher, you've been an engineer, wife, mother, grandmother. Which of these roles is the most dear to you, and which of the roles is the most challenging for

Sudha Murty  36:38

you? Every role every time, every role is challenging, for example, when your teenage children, but that's really challenging, challenging, when you're building a company, the financial strength Well, on the family of challenging when I write, I don't have the challenge, because unless I am full of the stories full in my mind, I will not like to be the chairperson of Infosys foundation is challenging, because there are 1000 people who have money, there are 2000 people are sitting on your head. There is enormous pressures on you, on me to give money to the political party reasons etc.

Michelle D'costa  37:20

Ma'am, before before we end this, I have one more question, if you have time. So we saw this quote of yours where you said that relationships or peace of mind is way more important than achievements and degrees. So I wanted to know, ma'am, how do we find that balance? Because you have clearly, you know, you clearly have a balance between both, you know, you've had a very successful life. And plus, you're very close to your family. And I think, you know, Tara and I also aspire to do the same. So what advice would you like to give

Sudha Murty  37:49

us to have a good relationship? Okay, you have to sacrifice a lot. It doesn't come just like that. You should. You should forgive people like how Jesus Christ sent you, somebody will slap on one GQ view? Okay, true. No, it's not possible for us because we are not Jesus Christ. But by and large, you have to have a large heart for review. And forget, then only can keep relations either way that is not possible. Did for tat No, then you can't. Children. No, no, like, you know, unintentional hurt, we should forget, intentionally hurt also, I forgot, I have forgiven people. So but you should also remember, no relation stays forever strong. All relations are fragile, as much as possible. By sacrificing by understanding by forgiving, you can keep it alive. And with all these best intentions, sometimes you can't establish good relations with some people, then they're never meant to be like a message. If it is not mine, then it will not come back. Fenway is not meant for you, though, what you do your level best. Some relationships, you can't improve, okay, there you live it, which you can improve, which you can sustain, like, you know, you should have a relationship, you should sustain some of the relationship, you should sacrifice some of the relationship, you should, you should care for some of the relationship. And you should go out of the way for every relationship vary from person to person, and that you should understand, you can't have the same yardstick for everybody.

Tara Khandelwal  39:26

I think, ma'am, thank you so much for these insights, I think I'm going to come back to what you've said, you know, again, and again, we're still you know, young, we're learning all of these things, and to hear your wisdom. It's just an amazing experience. Thank you so much. So as you know, Michelle, I edit children's books, and it's really challenging because you have to think like a child and that's what I wanted to know from her today, which I'm so happy she answered, because it's so much more difficult than editing for adults. And she does it you know, again and again. And I love the fact that she says that You just become that child.

Michelle D'costa  40:02

Yeah, totally. And I am really excited about our next episode because we will be speaking to Krrish Ashok, the author of masala lab, his book breaks down the concepts of food through science. I mean, how innovative is that?

Tara Khandelwal  40:16

Yeah, so you know it for all you foodies out there you you should not miss this episode because who doesn't like speaking about food, right food writing, and he has a lot of data. He has a lot of adventures in the kitchen. So we'll be speaking about this and I think my stomach is already rumbling. So let's go and let's eat a good fat cow

Michelle D'costa  40:37

yard. Totally, my mouth is watering yours. So please all of you read the book and join us next week. And like we said earlier for any writer who's looking to make their published book reach a wider audience, we offer various book marketing services. So if you want to know more about our services, please reach out to us at bound India on all our social media platforms.

Tara Khandelwal  40:58

We are editors podcasters and storytellers. And through bound we help you create stories and put them out into the world. Thanks a lot for tuning into Books and Beyond with us and we'll be back next Wednesday with Krish