Moving Arizona
Moving Arizona
Interview with Mike Washkowiak on Traffic Management for the Broadway Curve
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
Have you ever wondered what the heck is happening on the Broadway Curve? Well, me too. So in this episode I spoke with MOT subject matter expert, Mike Washkowiak. Mike is an Associate Vice President for Iteris and professional engineer. He shares information about building a practice in Arizona for his company, the incredible work they're doing across the country, how his career started right here in Arizona, and the role he’s playing on this major reconstruction project. Mike explains the Broadway Curve team’s plan for completing this project. They'll be adding capacity while never reducing lanes and to help make that a possibility, Iteris has deployed its leading edge ClearGuide software for traffic management.
Hi, I'm Melissa Boyles. Welcome to Moving Arizona, the podcast for transportation geeks like me who want to hear from the people who are shaping our industry. Have you ever wondered what the heck is happening out on the Broadway curve? Well, me too. So in this episode, I spoke with Mike Wachkoviak. He shared with me a little bit about his company, ITERIT, the incredible work they're doing across the country, his career, which started right here in Arizona, and the role he's playing on this major reconstruction project. Mike's responsible for the MOT or maintenance of traffic and shares with us the team's plan for completing this project, adding capacity while never reducing lanes. It was fascinating to learn how they're going to pull off that magic trick. So without further ado, let's talk to Mike. Welcome, Mike. Thank you so much for doing this interview. I'm so excited to talk to you about your role in transportation and the work that you guys are doing on the Broadway Curve.
SPEAKER_01Well, thank you for having me here today, Melissa. Excited to talk about the Broadway Curve Project and everything that I've been working on in transportation in my career.
SPEAKER_00So you are Mike Washkovia and you work with ITERS. Can you tell us a little bit about your background and your role in transportation here in Arizona?
SPEAKER_01Yeah. So as you said, Mike Washkoviac with ITERS. I've been in the transportation industry since 99 when I graduated from Arizona State University and uh, you know, grew up in this area and Arizona is my home. I did spend the first nine years of my career working with Phoenix, ADOT, Gilbert, a number of agencies as a consultant with a local company here in Arizona. Ended up getting transferred for a period of time, spent about 10 years in uh San Diego area in Southern California, worked on a bunch of interesting projects over there, I-15 integrated corridor management project, you know, next generation type transportation projects, and then got an opportunity with ITERS to uh come back to Arizona and build uh consulting and transportation company here locally, uh a local outfit uh supporting transportation needs here in the valley. So been with ITERS now four years in April and moved back to Arizona 2018 with my family, my wife, and three kids. So it's been good to get back to our roots where where our family started and glad to be here helping agencies manage transportation locally.
SPEAKER_00And iTerrais isn't a new company though, but your practice here in Arizona is relatively new.
SPEAKER_01So yeah, iTaris has been around for a number of years. There's a couple different divisions to iteris. Um, one division is our roadway sensors division, which sells a lot of the video detection equipment. And that has been a unit of our company that's been working in Arizona for many, many years. When I was coming out of school, I dealt with itereas uh on specing their cameras on traffic signal installations. But from the consulting and the operations and traffic design side of things, that's something that we had not historically done in Arizona until uh making the move out here in 2018.
SPEAKER_00So the projects that you were doing in California, you were saying kind of larger scale, more leading edge approach to design. Can you talk a little bit about those projects and how that is maybe influencing your approach to the projects here in Arizona?
SPEAKER_01Yes. So there's a number of different projects I've done out there with uh Sandag, a San Diego Association of Governments in San Diego. And the larger of those, and about six years of my life out there in San Diego, was the I-15 Integrated Corridor Management Project. And as part of the program management team on that project, we worked with Caltrans, Sandag, City of San Diego, Powway, Escondido, and MTS as well, the transit agency out there. What we were implementing was basically trying to break down those barriers between agencies working together, pulled together the back office operating systems for MTS, Caltrans, and each of the traffic signal control software for each of the companies, and pulled that into a what was called an integrated corridor management system, an ICMS. And we sat together with each of the agencies to come up with planning and response plans that if certain events happened in I-15, how could each agency react to better manage traffic and all work together towards a common goal? So, really breaking down the silos that tend to exist between agencies. Notifications from the ICMS would let Caltrans and each of the local partners know when something happened. We could let MTS know that maybe their bus express route was going to be impacted and the additional delay. We'd have predefined corridors where we could change signal timing based upon where people would redirect. And that was all based upon a real-time model that was bringing back detector data from the field so that we knew what the status was in the field. Basically, that project really, I guess, showed that everyone working together can better manage the operations of the system and knowing what your partner's doing can really help influence what you're doing. Coming here to Arizona and on the I-10 Broadway Curve project that we're currently working on, we're employing a kind of a similar strategy in that ICM strategy to how we're trying to better manage operations in the I-10 corridor. So there's been a number of closures that we've had to do for setting up the work zone over the last year. From a conceptual standpoint, we're working with City of Tempe, City of Phoenix, Chandler, ADOT, and everyone's familiar with Google Maps and being able to see what traffic is happening on the roadway when you're on your trip. We actually have a system that looks similar to that, but what we're doing is capturing real-time data 24-7, 365 days a year as to how operations is working throughout the I-10 Broadway Curve corridor. So when we go and change traffic conditions, we are able to go back and see, all right, what happened? Maybe where do we need to change signal timing next time this closure goes into place? How do we work to get better together with all the agencies, all the partners on this project to keep everyone in this corridor moving as we continue through construction? So that concept that we worked on in in San Diego has been very applicable in working with each of the agencies here and understanding, you know, kind of their pain points as what can they do, what can't they do, and um trying to just better manage traffic and operations in the corridor for everyone because people don't care whether I'm on City of Tempe or City of Phoenix Street. I care where how I got from my home to my work or to pick up my kids.
SPEAKER_00As is typical of the larger projects here in the valley, it's definitely like a multi-jurisdictional effort. And I think that in Arizona, especially, we have kind of a reputation and ability to just collaborate. So I think we're used to being very communicative with each other across the different jurisdictions, focusing mostly on the needs of the traveling public, especially when it comes to transportation. But it sounds like, if I understood that correctly, which there's entirely possible that I did not, because I am not a traffic engineer, but it sounds like as you are sort of setting the stage for the larger scale construction, you're doing a bit of sort of trial and error and adjusting of your approach so that you can keep traffic moving. Or is it just that as you're embarking on bits of this early phase, you're making adjustments as you go?
SPEAKER_01So I wouldn't say it's trial and error because we're doing pre-planning to try to manage the conditions before they happen as well. But for one instance, maybe Google Maps has directed people to take an alternate route that wasn't the planned detour route that we had identified working with each of the partners. And we see an increase in uh traffic taking 24th Street at the 202, one location. So we saw that that was happening based upon monitoring what was happening during a closure that we had in place, and was able to talk to ADOT and say, hey, we we're seeing this congestion happening at at this location. Can we get signal timing changed at that location to resolve it? And they jumped on it and things were resolved at that point in time. Next time we do that closure, we know that. So next time 24th Street will have a different timing plan in place already before the closure even is completely set up.
SPEAKER_00So fascinating technology.
SPEAKER_01We we have an idea of where people are gonna go, right, based upon patterns. But you know, with Google Maps, Apple Maps, um, any of the other number of uh ways systems out there, there can be third-party influencing decisions that happen in the network that maybe wouldn't be the most commonplace choices that people would make. So it's trying to be able to handle those situations when they occur and then just do the best we can to make sure that we're keeping people moving, avoiding calls.
SPEAKER_00Taking a step back just a little bit. Um, so I terrorists being in the valley and and you helping to establish the practice here over the last four years. Yes. Being a part of the Broadway curve is a pretty big accomplishment as a company because it is the first major reconstruction project that we've had as a region and it's the busiest corridor in in the region and lots of pressure, a lot of competition for that project. So, can you tell me how you came to be a part of the team? Like what strengths did you bring to that team and how has that worked for you?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so what we're doing on I-10 Broadway Curve isn't something that's entirely new to iTerrace. So we're actually also working on the design build of the 405 project in Orange County. And that project is an even larger scale freeway reconstruction project with 16 bridges being demolished and replaced on that corridor. We employed a very similar strategy on that project. And I worked on that when I first started with ITERS, doing MOT and maintenance of traffic and um temporary traffic signal designs on that project, and then also assisting with some of our operations support as well. And taking that, the lessons learned from that project and applying that on Broadway Curve. Also, in my prior experience, I had a lot of ADOT traffic design experience early on in my career, but worked with a number of the agencies. I'm currently on the ITS Arizona board as a member at large. So I know a lot of the agencies who are involved in this project, just being able to have the ability to sit down and talk to them about what's happening in their environment and working with them to make sure that their traffic needs are met. I think it's kind of the combination of design operations, next generation operations using real-time data, and then relationships of working with those in the valley, that all kind of ties together to find us a place on the team to work with the joint venture on this project.
SPEAKER_00So you mentioned your approach to MOT. It was funny. My idea for interviewing you, which I didn't know who I was going to be interviewing, but I was determined to find the right person. I was driving along with some friends and I was talking about how the striping has changed from you know where you you hit Broadway curve coming up into Awatuki where I live. And I'm like, I don't understand what's going on here. And I'm like, I know so many people in this industry. I have to know someone who knows the person who is designing this approach to traffic. And I tried to explain to them what MOT was. And then I realized that I was being a total transportation geek. And I thought, hmm, I'm gonna start with my friend James Barr. And James immediately pointed me to you. And I just cannot thank you enough for having this conversation because it's not every day that someone randomly contacts you and says, Hey, how would you feel about doing a podcast?
SPEAKER_01No, I appreciate you reaching out and uh glad to talk about it. In pursuing this project, we did quite a bit of work with the joint venture. Exactly what you're talking about. Um, how are we gonna build the I-10? How are we gonna set up the work zones? How are we gonna break this project into pieces to really efficiently keep traffic moving? One, but we're not removing any lanes on I-10 throughout this project. The same number of lanes that were there beforehand are there now, just where they're at had to be moved around. So one of the first steps and what we did over this past summer is over six weekends, have to remove the rubberized asphalt from the surface of the roadway of I-10 and establish a work zone. A lot of the work that needs to be done initially is in the median. There's three segments to this project. Um, I'll kind of break them up. From the segment one is starts at 24th Street and extends to between 40th and 48th Street. Segment two is from about 44th Street, let's say, to just beyond Broadway. And then segment three is from Broadway south to past Ray Road. Uh, segments one and two had a lot of that median work zone that had to be done early on in the project to get the right barrier height uh in place, get our foundations in for new sign structures for the bridges at 48th Penn Broadway. And then as you go south of 60, really what we need to do in that area is mostly just widening on the outside of I-10. So our work zone in that area pushes everyone to the middle. We do have some pedestrian bridges that will be going in in the southern uh segment, and that will require events to move people back to the outside, but most of the work is on the outside. So we need to make room for people to work safely on the outside of the work zone, south of 60. Over the course of the project, we will need to move traffic from where it's at today back into the middle in segments one and two and out to the outside in segment three. But we had to remove that rubberized asphalt early because of all those striping changes. Um, we don't want to have a whole lot of scarring on a final surface. We needed to find out what's going on underneath the rubberized asphalt so we could do concrete repair before we put a final surface on there. So, really, that was the focus of summer of 2021.
SPEAKER_00As someone who drives that corridor a lot, I was super impressed. Just the improvement from removing that rubberized asphalt, it's already a vast improvement from what it was before. I think as far as being, you know, the drive being smooth and whatnot. Is the plan to put rubberized asphalt or is that a contentious question?
SPEAKER_01No, it's not a contentious question. I'm just trying to remember the exact limits of there is a new surface going on from south of the 60. I don't recall exactly which surface it is, but I believe it is rubberized asphalt that is going back on in the south. I would need to double check and confirm.
SPEAKER_00No worries. I know that we have been kind of testing out different areas with the white asphalt.
SPEAKER_01Yep.
SPEAKER_00And it's actually a very smooth ride and a lot more cost effective long term than the rubberized asphalt. So I was just curious if that's the plan.
SPEAKER_01So there will be a new overlay that will go on uh the exact surface. I wouldn't need confirmation.
SPEAKER_00It's a question for another guest. Don't worry about it. So help me understand how the traffic flow is intended to work. And I know that's probably hard to describe without having any visuals that you can share, but the striping is very different than it was. So, what is the approach to MOT?
SPEAKER_01So the approach to MOT is to maintain the same number of lanes um at all times on I-10. I mean, that's our number one uh marching order, I guess is the right way to put it. We will not take lanes unless it's nighttime or weekends, or if there's an emergency that were to occur and we had to get out there to fix something, um, obviously that would be a case. But from our normal operations, it would be to maintain traffic on the existing condition. As we move forward into the development of the collector distributor roadway network that will be built, we are going to be adding capacity into the network that we will try to utilize early on before the the roadways uh entirely complete. So as we get into later phases two and three of this project, we're in phase one right now. We will be widening I-10 basically from 60 to about 40th Street pretty significantly, adding in the collector distributor network between 60 and 143 and 10. And with that widening, there will be the capability to utilize those systems to move traffic back to the outside. Trying to describe this, like you said, without a without a picture. But if you can imagine uh I-10 between 60 and 143, adding four new lanes in each direction through there, basically, we would need to also land new HOV lanes coming from 143 into the middle of I-10. So we're going to need to move all the traffic out of the middle of that area as we get into phase three. And with the widening that is uh put into place from 60 to 40th Street, we'll be temporarily utilizing those CD roads to carry traffic from I-10. Basically, we uh trying to use whatever we have available through here. It's a very congested corridor.
SPEAKER_00It feels to me like you're trying to drive traffic into specific patterns, if you will, because there are long segments of solid line versus where it used to be striped. And can you explain the thought process behind that?
SPEAKER_01So, for what we have out there currently, I think maybe one of the things that it's not actually different, but it's more obvious. A new condition is where we have lane drops and lane ads, you see a lot of the short skip lanes that are out there. And those should be visual cues that you have a lane ending ahead of you or or just added and will be dropping. So as we develop the I-10 project, what there will be is a change in where decision points need to occur. So in the future, as we develop the the I-10 Broadway curve and build it out, traffic patterns are going to change. People are gonna need to make some decisions earlier as to where they want to be. For example, uh, as you approach from US 60 to I-10 today, you basically go around the curve from 60 west into 10, 10 west, and then you're dealing with all the traffic merging over to 143 or you know, trying to get over to 10. So a lot of those movements are going to be separated in the future conditions. So as you come from 60, you're gonna be separated from those 143 movements. Those decisions will have been made south of 60. They will be on the CD8 network and they will actually pass underneath the 60 ramp in the future so that we can eliminate a lot of the weaving. So as we get towards the later phases of this project, we are gonna need to start setting up our striping and MOT basically to get people used to that new condition. People who want to be on 143 early on will need to make that decision south of baseline to get into the new CD network. Eastbound I-10 traffic, wanting to get to baseline, will want to get into the CD network back towards 40th Street as opposed to where you would be exiting the roadway today. So there's just a number of changes that will be happening as part of our MOT implementation. It's not just what we're putting on the roadway, but it's also partnering with our public involvement folks to get the word out as to what is changing in the environment, how should people drive this, and what sort of changes are coming in the future. So on a weekly basis, we get together with our public involvement staff here to talk about what is coming up from a closure standpoint or changes in the setup in the near future and try to make sure that they can get the information out to the public so that they're aware because there will be a bit of an education campaign as we move forward to use of the system as it's implemented.
SPEAKER_00I've heard the design approach is being called braided lanes. Is that accurate? And what does that mean?
SPEAKER_01Braided lanes, basically what that means is that concept of from I tend to 60. In in the center portion of the traffic interchange will be freeway traffic. We are going to take all those decision points from for ease of conversation, let's say baseline of 40th Street, all those movements to exit to the 143 to get to Sky Harbor, to get to 60, to exit Broadway Road, all those decisions that currently happen between 60 and Broadway. Sorry, right in the westbound direction, those are going to have people start getting into a parallel collector-distributor network. It'll be two to three lanes that will run in the westbound direction from basically baseline to about 44th Street. And in that segment, that's where the decisions will be made away from the more mainline freeway traffic. So the braiding is the movements from 60, the movements to 143, and to and from Broadway Road will all be braided together in a smaller, relatively slower speed because it won't be 65 miles per hour. The CD network. 55, I believe, is the design speed. The I guess a braid would be the right way to call it. But yeah, CD network is basically the term we tend to use.
SPEAKER_00A CD network and braided lanes are basically the same thing. It's just the collector distributor streets are kind of you're being forced, if you will, to make decisions earlier in your drive, commute, whatever.
SPEAKER_01Separate out where all the decisions occur, right? So that not everything's happening in one smaller area. And a lot of that base design was developed years before we ever got on the project. And so what we're doing is trying to take that design and um the modeling that was done to prove that out as the best case alternative and use what we have available in that system to best deploy it and make sure that it will operate when we get to the end.
SPEAKER_00I think in a lot of ways, when you look at how we did our transportation planning the last 20, 30 years, the growth patterns that we anticipated are not what was actually realized. And I think that, you know, we have an amazing freeway system and very comprehensive, but it's just the needs have evolved. And I don't think anybody anticipated the metro Phoenix area being fastest growing in the country. And so for us to have to make some adjustments 30 years after we originally designed the system, I think is not unreasonable.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, this interchange has actually been something that ADOT's been studying for a while to prove. So it is a definite need. The entire spine corridor 10 to 17 has been identified as you know a heavy need for the region to continue to grow and to continue to support the needs we even have today. There will be changes in the future, I'm sure, uh, in traffic patterns and uses and who knows what autonomous vehicles will bring in the future. But I think that there's obviously a need today to improve the operations through the corridor and everyone in the region has been working towards that goal to make it a reality.
SPEAKER_00So far, just as a person who drives that area quite a bit, it's pretty incredible the amount of work that's been done with very little disruption to people. And I think as you get into phases two and three, that's probably going to become more challenging, but it's been very impressive to see so far.
SPEAKER_01Well, we're hoping it won't be challenging. And that that's the uh the goal is we won't be eliminating capacity as we go through. There will be information that will come out. Phase two should be starting later this year in some segments of the project. And then the project in 2023 will be the moving into phase three and then uh wrapping up the project through 2024. As we wanted to avoid those challenges as much as as much as possible. And so that there will be communication either by our website or um, we also have a mobile application that we run to get the word out. Something ITERS actually had put together for the project. And so we are just continuing to try to get the word out so that people know what's coming, so there's not surprises. I think there'll be changes and we're gonna have signage, we're gonna have information campaigns and all that out there for people, but just know we won't be reducing the number of lanes out there. It's for anyone who's worried, we won't be reducing any lanes on the freeway.
SPEAKER_00I've seen the digital billboards, which are pretty awesome. I mean, information about you know what's ahead, literally and figuratively. And then I've actually received voicemail messages, which is kind of odd. You know, you get the robocall and ah, just ignore and it goes to voicemail, and it's actually Howard Steer's voice. He's like, Hey, this is when our public meeting is, come learn about the project. And if you can't make it, here's the website. So I mean, and there's an app too. So there's an app for that, you know. Exactly. Thank you, Atarias, for developing that.
SPEAKER_01So yeah, we're hope people find it useful. We work with all of our scheduling to try to get the word out as to what's happening, when and where, try to get it information out, you know, as long as once it's approved for us to notify, we'll get the information out to people. So going back to those ICM routes, it's been great working as a partnership with everyone to keep the project moving. The technical piece is the technical piece. We know what we're doing from uh building a roadway or traffic engineering and bridge design and roadway design. And I think the thing that kind of drew me to traffic engineering in the first place is there's kind of that soft side of people and how do people interact with what you put out there. It's not always black and white. I mean, the roadway might be black with white stripes, but it's not always as clear. One person would want everyone to move more quickly and on an extra lane, and another uh contingent will rather have everyone driving very slow. So let's put a bike lane on there. And it's really understanding the needs of a particular area, particular sub-area, even to come up with the right solutions. So I think that's what's always gonna interest me of traffic transportation operations is working with the people. And this project is a lot of that too.
SPEAKER_00Mobility has a direct impact on quality of life and a lot of different interests as far as modes. And it's gotta be rewarding from a technology perspective to think back when you were, you know, at university and early in your career versus now. And like you said, being able to get that real-time data of here's your design plan, you implement it. There's sort of a reaction from the public that maybe wasn't anticipated because of being directed different ways with all these different apps and stuff, and being able to make those adjustments and like that has to feel pretty exciting.
SPEAKER_01It's really rewarding to be able to fix something. We're all doing our best to try to manage traffic and a lot of stuff people have no idea is going on in the background, right? Um you drive every day, you don't think about the person who's sitting at the traffic management center who came up with that signal timing who is, you know, worried about making sure that everyone on baseline road or whatever is moving. But being able to work with partners to make those changes feel like you accomplish something at the end of the day when everybody says, I didn't receive a complaint, and I normally hear about complaints on this roadway all the time. And that's really kind of the focus, I think. My passion is traffic operations, utilizing technology how we can, but really trying to help my clients or partners just better manage what they have with what they have available to them. There's a lot of tools in the toolbox, and not every tool fits in every situation. And it's being able to pick and choose the right tools for the right client or the right situation. It's rewarding. And I know my kids got tired of hearing about how big is that sign early on, uh, or you know, being able to predict when the light is going to turn green and act like it's magic. Um, but being able to make an impact is is rewarding.
SPEAKER_00Well, it's a huge comfort to know that there's a whole team of people watching traffic patterns and making sure that those adjustments get made so that the traveling public keeps moving. And you know compared to what you were describing in California and replacing 16 bridges, maybe not so much, but for us in the valley, it's a huge undertaking and a lot of people very nervous about what that impact is going to be. And it's really comforting to know that we've got a team of people like yourself that are watching that every day and making adjustments as needed.
SPEAKER_01Well, everybody's been from each of the local agencies, ADOT, everyone's been a great partner to work with. Like you said, a team is the right way to phrase it in the way everyone's working together. And it's the same similar situation that's happening on the 405 as well. There's a team out there, and one of my partners, Kristen, is working in the same role that I am over there in in uh Orange County. And you know, she works with all the local agencies in in that area and the contractor to keep traffic moving. And um, it's not just us, not Kristen and I. We're just kind of working with everyone to keep people pointing in the same direction, I think, is is the key.
SPEAKER_00That's everybody's got their role and highly qualified, high performing team, very clear objectives, all sort of going in the same direction, but each with their own individual parts. And I mean, you can tell the progress that's been made and all the communication that's out there, you know, very well planned, very well communicated, very well executed to date, and exciting to see this move forward.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I there's another list of people that I want to make sure would have get recognition in all those things happening. Um, you're you're talking to me, but that's just because James pointed my name out to you.
SPEAKER_00It's because you're the MOT guy.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. So yeah. Without everyone else, I'm nothing, right? It's it's that team um working together to make it happen.
SPEAKER_00So I just can't thank you enough for taking the time to do this interview. It has been such a pleasure to talk to you. And I feel like I know what's going on now, where before I was like, I don't know. The surface is better, but I have no idea what they're doing here. Now I I think I have a better idea, and hopefully some others will too, as a result of this conversation.
SPEAKER_01There's still a lot to come, and I know it's hard without graphics to to kind of um describe everything that's happening on this project, but we have gone through and uh put together a plan to to keep people moving through here. And and we know that that plan may change, and we're on the lookout for how do we need to adjust that plan as we continue to move forward and excited to do so. So thank you for having me on the podcast.
SPEAKER_00Well, very exciting to have you on. So I know you're very busy, and I just really appreciate you taking the time. Thank you so much for joining me for this episode of Moving Arizona, the podcast for transportation geeks like me who want to hear from the people who are shaping our industry. The team out on the Broadway Curve is going to be impacting all of our lives for the next few years. And it's a tremendous comfort to know how truly capable they are. Thank you so much, Mike, for sharing your time and expertise. We wish you and the entire Broadway Curve team nothing but the best as you move into this next phase of this exciting project. Next up, Suzanne Lansford with Town Lighting Engineers, who shares her professional journey from nuclear power plants to sea turtles, and how always believing in yourself and your abilities can lead to some pretty incredible opportunities. She's not only the founder of Town Lighting Engineers, but she's also the first vice president with the Sonoran section of Ashley, which covers the Metro Phoenix area, and chairing our very first Southwest Summit. Join us next time to hear all about this exciting event. And until then, let's get moving.