THRIVING NEURODIVERGENT ADULT: Finding Connection Through Art and Neurodiversity with Alexis Brygider

In this Thriving Neurodivergent Adults episode, hosts Jessica Patay and Susanna Peace Lovell sit down with artist, advocate, and neurodivergent creative Alexis Brygider for a deeply personal and unforgettable conversation about communication, creativity, disability justice, and finding belonging. On this episode, Alexis is joined on this episode by Anthony Rivello, a personal mentor on her support staff and a founding board member of We Are Brave Together.

Alexis shares memories from early childhood, including growing up nonverbal and experiencing the world through intense sensory and emotional awareness. She reflects on how art became her first language and how watching expressive performers and comedians helped her learn communication and human connection. 

Throughout the conversation, Alexis speaks candidly about frustration, emotional overwhelm, and the internal experience of being misunderstood while desperately wanting connection. She offers compassionate insight into emotional dysregulation and explains how patience, support, and understanding can help neurodivergent individuals build communication skills and self-awareness over time.

Alexis also honors the people who shaped her life, especially her mother Barbara, whose steady love and belief in her became a foundation for growth and resilience. The episode explores the importance of support staff, community, disability advocacy, and creating environments where disabled adults can thrive authentically.

Listeners will also hear Alexis discuss her artistic work, disability justice communities, and her dream of creating meaningful art and animation that helps others feel understood and connected.

This conversation is equal parts insightful, emotional, philosophical, and joyful—and serves as a beautiful reminder that every person deserves to be seen, heard, supported, and valued exactly as they are.

Find more information about Alexis Brygider here. 

Find more information about Life Coach, Susanna Peace Lovell here.

Find Susanna’s book, Your True Self is Enough here.

Find our first book from We Are Brave Together, Becoming Brave Together here.

Find our second book from We Are Brave Together, Suddenly Brave Together here. 

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Brave Together is the podcast for We are Brave Together, a not-for-profit organization based in the USA. The heart of We Are Brave Together is to strengthen, encourage, inspire and validate all moms of children with disabilities and other needs in their unique journeys. 

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Transcript

SPEAKER_06 0:00

Welcome to Brave Together Podcast, an empowering resource for the parents of children with disabilities, neurodivergence, and all unique needs.

SPEAKER_00 0:13

In my experience, like when people talk about somebody being great at something, it's not so much that everybody doesn't have something they're great at, they do. The matter of fact is that like we don't always value what those people are great at, and it's not always supported. And that's what makes the difference. What you do with the most ease, that's supported the most, and that people value the most, that's what becomes great.

SPEAKER_06 0:44

Hi, brave friends. Welcome back to Brave Together Podcast. It's Jessica Pate here, founder and CEO of We Are Brave Together. And I am joined by Susanna Peace Lavelle, my lovely co-host, and we are honored to share a very special thriving, neurodivergent adult conversation with artist and advocate Alexis Brigadier. Alexis shares their extraordinary story of growing up autistic and nonverbal, discovering art as a form of communication, and learning to navigate a world that often misunderstood them. In this conversation, Alexis reflects on the profound impact of being truly seen and supported, especially by their mother Barbara, who treated Alexis with such dignity, patience, and deep respect from a very young age. Together we explore sensory overwhelm, emotional regulation, communication, disability, justice, friendship, independence, creativity, and the importance of nurturing a person's passions and strengths. Alexis also shares how art, animation, and community became lifelines that helped shape their identity and purpose. This episode is so honest, funny, insightful, and deeply moving. Alexis offers such a powerful perspective on neurodivergence, connection, and what it means to thrive as a disabled adult. We're so grateful that you're here with us today. If this episode encourages you, teaches you something new, or helps you feel less alone, please share it with a friend or fellow parent. Be sure to follow Brave Together on social media and subscribe to our YouTube channel for more conversations, resources, and support for caregiving families. Now, here is our enlightening, wonderful conversation with Alexis Brigadier. All right, well, Alexis, welcome to Brave Together Podcast. We're so happy to have you with us today.

SPEAKER_00 2:45

I'm very excited to be here.

SPEAKER_06 2:47

And we welcome you, Anthony, who happens to be our board president and has a fantastic career working with neurodivergent teens and adults. And so he has been working with Alexis for almost 10 years. We invited him to be a part of this episode as well. We are extremely grateful to Anthony and how he has served We Are Brave Together from the beginning, pretty much. So welcome to this show.

SPEAKER_08 3:15

Thank you, Jessica and Susanna. Appreciate the opportunity to be here and as always to be part of We Are Brave Together all these years. So thank you.

SPEAKER_06 3:24

Thank you. Well, Alexis, we're gonna start with you. Tell us about your growing up experience.

SPEAKER_00 3:31

Well, I was born in Mineola, New York. I uh from a very early age, I um was uh I I have memories that go back very long ways. Quite frankly, like when I was little, I remember um always being confused by like communication and like how to like best approach just interacting with people, just the feeling of a need to express myself either through like art in order to be able to facilitate that communication more effectively, and or also learning how to like actually interact with people. One of the tips I would give for uh being able to do so in a more fluid way is to like this is what I did at least, is to like study like the great like comedic actors of history. Like, for instance, like for instance when I was growing up, I would watch like Buster Keaton, Charlie Chaplin, even Robin Williams and and Jim Carrey. And like, because of those people, I've been able I've been able to communicate now and actually gesture and like speak, quite frankly. But it's the minutia of like the subtleties and the exaggeratedness, like that's the whole full spectrum of like human expression that is really like important, and that was that was enough for me to like be able to grok and really handle what that means in a way that like other people can really mesh with. From there, I was I was non-verbal for a long period of time, like fully um only speaking sentences when I was six. There was a long period of time where like there's all the frustration they're trying to get me to talk, and at the meantime, I could I could read and I and I I knew I could read like very early on, and like very like they would later find out when I was very young that I like a college-level reading and very early, but like it you couldn't tell if you were like trying to like talk to me or see if I'm in there, but I I was in there, and and I can credit that very much with my mom because she would when I was an infant. Again, my memory goes back a very long way. I remember being it being like I was trapped in a body that was like like that was like stuck in a crib or something, and uh my mom would still treat me like I was just another one of her friends, a person that she would like just talk to about her day and like give a beat to for if I want to respond, I can, but I wouldn't, obviously, at that point. And uh she would talk to me in a way that was like a person, which is I would say one of the biggest gifts that I was ever given was that she would just communicate with me in a way that was like facilitating actual human interaction. And you'd I don't see that nearly enough in a lot of like the commentary or like conversations I've seen about a lot of this in my life because I remember like when like people are still trying to figure out like what are the rules? Like, how do we do this? Like, what does it mean for somebody to have a sensory like explosion or of like over sensory stimulation, or why are they stimming? We should stop them from stimming, and they would literally do that, and it would like be like, Well, that's why your child is having a dysregulated outburst, is because they need to self-soothe. Like, no, no, it's not okay. You need to stop them from stimming, or else they'll be perseverating on forever. And like, no, that's not how that works. And so from there, I was able to um build uh brick by brick my mind up with my mom's help. But uh honestly, like art has been like the key linchpin for me that's really like carried me through the entirety of like my life, even more so than science, I would say, because like art is like the key thing that really communicates and it transcends all language, is that you're able to actually have something that is transcendent and human, and not only human, because you know animals can make art too, but like especially like very much of a lived experience, and that's always been just fundamental to me to be able to do any of that, even like pre-language and all of that.

SPEAKER_06 7:16

How old were you when you discovered art and being able to express yourself through art?

SPEAKER_00 7:22

I was about one and a half.

SPEAKER_06 7:24

Okay, that's so remarkable to me that you have that sharp memory. You seem so incredibly in tune with yourself.

SPEAKER_00 7:32

I can tell you what it was too. I can tell you the exact book I was reading. It was a history of the 20th century of memory surge and like a picture of like Marilyn Monroe where Warhol's like gold, Marilyn Monroe on the cover, maybe Teddy Roosevelt too, and like I think it was Tyne or something that published or something like that. And it was a specific entry on Guernica because I was looking through it to try and find something about the world that like made some level of sense because my I didn't have the best childhood growing up, but my mom did everything she could, but there's only so much you can do at a certain point. And there was this one piece, it was Guernica by Pablo Picasso that just made sense, and in that like this in that sort of like vestigial state of my mind, I I something clicked where I said, somebody not only understood what on some level what I'm going through, but they chose to make something to communicate that feeling in such a way that I myself could reflect on it and say whether or not I wanted to do that as well. If I wanted to, in that essence, make art as well and continue this tradition. And that meant that meant the whole world to me, quite frankly, and it still does. To make that a breakthrough and like that connection with somebody even like beyond time and space, it's everything for me.

SPEAKER_07 8:48

Alexis, I am I am curious if you feel comfortable sharing how old you are now.

SPEAKER_00 8:54

32.

SPEAKER_07 8:55

32. So I'm having this um, it's almost like a scene from a movie, a visual of you at one and a half. And I can I can sense this energy, this curiosity, and this wonder. It feels so palpable coming, emanating from you, Alexis. It's like it's really hard to it's it's it's hard to ignore, right? Because it's it's just there.

SPEAKER_08 9:24

So Alexis, what about some of the other people that were in your life growing up? Because I know that's a ton. It's who would the if you had to go like halo-wise, they were the core people, and then there were some of the support people, and Mrs. Molinero was a big one. Okay, so who's Mrs. Molinero? And and explain, you know, maybe some perspective on how these people influenced you because you've talked about these things all out your life, and these are important individuals.

SPEAKER_00 9:48

Huh.

unknown 9:48

Mrs.

SPEAKER_00 9:49

Molinero put up with me when nobody else should have had to put up with me when I was like about age six or like a little later, it might have been yeah, I was a little later too. She was my support staff back then, and I was a demon child. I'm not gonna even lie. I I'm I'm like metacognitive enough to know I was a demon child. Fortunately, I caught myself at age six, so I didn't end up in like prison or something, but like I can I can attest for like for the record that if your child is having like stuff like that going on, it can get better. Just it sucks for now. It will get better though if you if you like give yourself patience and like just do the do the next right thing, as my mom would put it. That's all you really can do at a certain point. She made it so that I was able to really like see that there are people out there who cared about people. And she helped me get through a period of time that was really rough for me when I was transitioning between schools.

SPEAKER_06 10:44

Besides your mom sounds like steady, that she was so communicative, that she had insight when you were little before you were using language to to narrate and to comment and to have a conversation with you and just invite you into her day and what was going on. That's just so beautiful. What else would you say? What stands out to you about your mom? And and was she the most supportive person in your life growing up?

SPEAKER_00 11:14

100%. 100%. She up until like up until like the third illness took her in a way that we couldn't really help. Um she was she was my Batman, so to speak, if you you know what I mean, like the superhero. Like to this day, I I I do not know a single person who's as tenacious or as much of a survivor as that woman. I hope if I ever am a parent, I am one millionth as good a parent as she is.

SPEAKER_08 11:44

Or she was, or she is rather. And she was kind and caring, but she was tenacious. Oh, yeah, that's important. You need that. When you said something about being rhino, I remember using no, not rhino. She was she was a dynamo. A dynamo?

unknown 11:59

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 12:05

Right that matters. It was positive. I was good. So yes, yes.

SPEAKER_06 12:10

What was your mom's name?

SPEAKER_00 12:12

Barbara.

SPEAKER_06 12:13

Barbara.

SPEAKER_00 12:15

Barbara uh Fagan. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 12:17

No, I'm just I'm sorry that she's gone. It's we're never ready to lose our parents ever, ever, ever. Alexis, I'm so sorry. We are so sorry.

SPEAKER_07 12:28

One of the things that I think is so beautiful about your consciousness, um, Alexis, and your memory is that it seems like you have such specific memories to hold on to and to sort of be your support and guide throughout. Um, I was chuckling a little bit when you mentioned that you were a demon child. Um because I, you know, as we were talking right before we started recording this conversation, I actually um and am a single mom and I have raised my daughter. Her name is Arizona. Um she she loves a name that starts with the letter A, by the way. So do we? Yeah. I mean, listen, Anthony and Alexis, right? So, so I would love to ask you this question from the perspective of a parent uh raising a child who is has a differently wired brain. And and uh, you know, sometimes I would offer to call her a demon child, and not because, not because I think she's a demon child, but because her way of communicating with me was one where she found me to be very, very safe. You know, I'm her safe space. And so in order to express and release uh and self-regulate and self-soothe, she would use words to describe the different ways she could envision my demise. Okay. Yeah. And so sometimes there would be, you know, talk about my head coming off and turning into a basketball. So she could bounce at Anthony. Why are you laughing?

SPEAKER_08 14:24

Um, Alexis and I have had conversations like this.

SPEAKER_00 14:29

I'm a very darkly morbid person, but I mean that's a joke.

SPEAKER_08 14:32

Yeah, but you we yeah, I can completely understand.

SPEAKER_06 14:37

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SPEAKER_07 16:34

I mean, there is just a lot of conversation about how because she's upset about something, right? She's upset, she's frustrated, she can't communicate exactly how she's feeling. And so her first line of defense, her like sort of you know, impulsive reaction is to you know, take a stab at me literally, figuratively. I'm curious what you would say to me because sometimes it's hard for me to not take that personally. So if there's a way that you can sort of understand her behaviors and actions that seem almost punitive in a sense toward me, although I know deep down she's just trying to express herself. How can you how can you help me get past these moments of pain for me so that I can better support her, but also support myself?

SPEAKER_00 17:35

Let me ask you something. Have you ever had something under your fingernail?

SPEAKER_07 17:40

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 17:47

Horribleness. Okay, now imagine that. Now imagine that you can never remove it. It can never or you can you can't remove it. But there are ways you can adapt to it, but it's not it's right now it's sounding like it's not really like it's it sounds like it's hurting right now. Imagine that, but it's like this a state of being and it's like not quite like focus. I was in this situation like this, so that's why I'm like speaking from an experiencer. I don't know, I can't speak for directly for your daughter. Everyone's different, everyone has different minds, it's like literally like neurotypes and everything. I will say, in my experience, like there are there is a state you get into where literally you're so raw. There's like a psychedelic trip for me, can like a constant one, it still is to an extent, like like, and it's like for because of the neurology I have, not necessarily, and also like synesthesia, among other things, like it gets to a point where you become so raw that you need to lash out in order to be able to even be able to function. That doesn't mean that you want to hurt somebody, it means that you need to process and you need to be able to direct that process. And if you don't have the proper tools to like help manage the direction of that process, that becomes that can be very easily become violent. And it doesn't mean that it's impossible to like you know get like assistance to get the help of that process, it is completely possible. It means that you need to it just means that there's gonna be like the need to be able to ask for help, but also be able to get that help. I would say to your daughter, like I I I'm imagining that Arizona wants to get better, that she doesn't want to be independent. Yes, yes, and so like at that point, to the extent that she can like verbalize it or even like communicate it in whatever way she does, it doesn't have to be verbally focused. That's necessary to be able to want to do the work or to be able to want to have that help and be able to accept that help. If that's facilitated, that's impossible. I think at that point you need to just find the right people at a certain point and the right like tools. This is my experience, at least. I I can't speak for everyone.

SPEAKER_07 20:11

That was very insightful. I I do feel like, and she will apologize later. Mommy, I just I I don't mean to be fill in the blank. I just can't stop myself.

SPEAKER_00 20:25

Yeah, that tracks, completely tracks.

SPEAKER_02 20:28

Right.

SPEAKER_06 20:29

I know when Ryan is so I have a twenty 20, I wouldn't say 23, but pretty close to 23-year-old son with a rare genetic disorder and intellectual disability and autism. And there are times that he lashes out verbally, his his anxiety gets really, really high. And I know it's just there's something that's bothering him, but he just doesn't have the ability to communicate what's really, really making him sad or what's really making him upset. And I have to remind myself what he's talking about, what he's complaining about, what he's whining about is not really usually what it's about, but it's just his form of getting it out. He he can't say, you know, the deeper thoughts or feelings. And so he'll focus on something else. And and your illustration of, you know, a thorn or something under the nail that just lives there indefinitely and painfully is helpful, I think, for us as parents to remember our kids are carrying things that we have no idea. We have no idea because we are not, you know, I mean, some of our parents and we are brave are definitely neurodiverse. Um, but I don't have Parterilly syndrome. I don't have Ryan's level of anxiety. I definitely run anxious, but I don't run his level of anxious. And it's just a reminder for us to have so much compassion. All of us would communicate effectively if we. had those tools available to us at all times.

SPEAKER_00 22:03

And we don't, we don't always, we don't always in my experience uh growing up, especially non-verbal, it was the frustration was the most maddening part. I hadn't made the connection quite that people wanted me to verbally ward the um the things I was reading for for a while longer than I than I am I am willing to admit it was that connection that uh that that click that actually was important. It wasn't so much that I was incapable of doing something it was that I just needed to have that slot be like aligned in just the right way for it to like click. That being said that frustration is necessary to be able to give you given the space for that in my experience when I was when it's like being able to be allowed to like be frustrated but also like to be able to how how can we like I would imagine this my mom my mom did to an extent was like how do we express that frustration in a way that's like not destructive and then if anything is constructive being able to express yourself in a way that communicates that's necessary. I was I I tell Anthony a lot of the time that like in my experience like one of the best things you can do when somebody has like for instance for example a topic limited interest and like doesn't want to do something is use the topic limited interest to teach them about the thing that either they need to do or that you know gives them the skills that they would want to do the thing. One way I put it to him was like Pokemon like have it so that like have it so that a poke battle is taking a test or something like that. And like balancing the stats be like the math for the Pokemon for being able to tell the attack versus defensers is special effect and all that stuff and and like the effects of different moves and stuff or or trains or trains could be like planes trains automobiles all of that all of that do you like trains is that why this is coming up no I like I like airports but that's besides the point don't change the subject my Arizona would call that a topic changer. You're a topic changer pivoting in like regular parlance it's but she's right you're changing the subject and unfair to a large extent for a lot of people she yeah she called me a TC for the longest time I was like I don't know what a TC is that's right I know but I how was I supposed to know oh my gosh um by the way so how did you two meet Alexis and Anthony?

SPEAKER_08 24:35

I'm curious because you have this 10 year journey at this point right so so um it's it's it's really been magical the entire time Alexis and I have been working together every day for the last 10 years we worked through the the pandemic we worked virtually it's been a it's been a thing as Alexa says um yes we did so I was I I I work with um other families I have one family that I work with who uh lives between New York and Vienna Austria and uh I was actually in Vienna Austria working with that family and I get a call uh it was the middle of the night because of the time difference and so uh somebody from New York contacted me through one of the organizations here and they asked me if uh they got my name through a uh a mutual colleague we went through the channels and I said all right and they told me that there was um there was a uh a young child that lived in uh Brooklyn or in New York City and they said that they you know they need somebody who has experience working with younger children a little girl and I said oh this you know this could work out and so I met with the representative from the organization and we both laugh about this now because we call this the old bait and switch I got there and then they said oh by the way yeah that family has somebody else but you know what we have somebody else that lives in Brooklyn would you be interested in working with a 20 something year old who you know is a college student I said wait a minute this is not what you guys saw and told me and so um the two the two of us met and um Alexis we diabolical as as part of the support staff our first meeting we actually met where I met with Alexis and I handled it like a professional business interview. And so I showed up with a suit on and we Alice didn't hire him because of that. Yeah and and Alexis was intimidated. Oh my god I wasn't intimidated I was like this is a culture clash right here right right we we you know we we just didn't have the same I you know the ideas of what this was going to be about um then it turned out we actually do have the exact same ideas which yeah which might not be a good thing on different levels but and and as we started working together uh we started to you know realize that we definitely had common ground uh Alexis was at the point now she had how many years were you living alone? You were living in about a year or two? I'd say a year or two yeah yeah so Alexis had just started having full independence um had support before that living support was living at school you know was was uh living before that yeah before that at Brooklyn yeah so um lived in a dorm setting you know um you know in various schools uh Alexis had the and I I don't know you you you can cut this out if you don't want it included had the joy of going through doing high school twice because my credits didn't transfer.

SPEAKER_00 27:19

So Alexis went through high went from almost going to college at eight or nine to having to do high school twice.

SPEAKER_08 27:25

I got both ends of the humiliation spectrum so Alexis at the institution that she was enrolled in and then when went to transfer the credits over at the age of what was it I guess 18 uh the school said these are not whatever was accredited or whatever they were and so Alexis had to take every course over again and did it again separately at another school out on Long Island and wound up doing high school twice. I got honored society both times but screw those people regardless so wow wow I didn't even know that that was a thing that well because the first time wasn't recorded as a legitimate program and I don't have the details sure so so Alexis has a lot of you know like the you know it it's a calm quiet happy story about you know growing up and but it wasn't as far as I understand the opposite of that it was the complete polar freaking opposite of that and so when Alexis and I met Alexis was living all of a sudden finished that got into was uh was accepted into um a Parsons yeah Parsons New School for design into their uh fine arts program directly from the fire directly from the uh frying pan into the fire basically and that was given this opportunity for independence and freedom and independent living and now you're going to be a college student in you know in Manhattan you're living in Williamsburg Brooklyn with all the hip stick it was a lot you know the funniest part was that let sorry for interrupting oh go ahead go ahead the funniest part yeah let's see what the funniest part was was that it actually that was like the least of it like oh yes it was I think like more so it was like like getting adjusted to being like independent that was the part that's tricky I still have trouble with that I'm working on it still like knowing not to like wander around at 4 a.m in the morning to like just explore my neighborhood that's that's what I needed to learn sooner I think yeah during a blizzard the biggest blizzard we had in shorts in shorts I wasn't even in shorts there's something like a top hat and a cloak so I looked like Gotham by gaslighter with bell it was like it was like not a great not a great time. So this was when I first started I was first started with Alexis and so we we finally this there was there was this movie series before you because I was like I was in the apartment before this one which was also in Williamsburg okay so no no no so when I started with Alexis and this is kind of the segue it gives you a little context because how you know Susanna you brought it up like how how did you guys meet you know we laugh because it was we we we we equate it to this movie series that was created at the time by Johnny Knoxville and Co. It was called what was it called Alexis? What was it called? Jackass Jackass the movie was jackass I know yeah so the team had jackass t-shirts and everything because every day was chaos and we had no idea what we were going to be dealing with. For a period of time not anymore no no it was a period of time Alexis I I we all outgrew that phase but it was it was a definite experience and so there's a growth period for this and we all used each other's personal and interpersonal you know relationships to to grow and and it was important and communication was one of the most important parts of that's true understanding how each one of us were thinking because one we were all strangers we all got to meet each other and then Alexis is going through a version of life the early 20s you're coming into you know that moment in your life where you have you know it's glorious you you know it's the world is you know is yours and you're living in Brooklyn and you're you know with everybody around your age and it's exciting it's an art scene and you know and then you have you know support staff like that's not it was it a buzz kill so then the having a support staff when you're living your best life was it a buzz kill or was it like thank goodness it's funny good funny because like like for dating and stuff you'd think it would be like a bigger hindrance than it is yeah if anything if you meet the right people they're like I want one of those I'm like I know you do mine.

SPEAKER_06 31:41

Anthony's mine yeah they're like I want a personal assistant who's also a friend I'm like I know you do by the way are we splitting this trick or what oh my gosh oh my gosh Alexis there's so much joy that comes out of you honestly like I'm I'm so in I'm so enjoying you and yeah you know like what lights you up like what what's keeping me sane in these days yes and what lights you up you know both lights you up what makes you happy I have a great spirit and you you kind of you I love indie animation it's one of my favorite things I went to school I got into school for fine art I ended up getting an illustration degree but I still do fine art uh I actually am hoping to get into MOMA someday um that's my life's goal right now is to do that by 35 somehow I'm 32.

SPEAKER_00 32:34

I don't know how the heck I'm gonna do it but I'm gonna give it a shot. Alright indie animation is one of my favorite things like the amazing digital circus shout out to Gooseworks amazing brilliant I just love indie animation and that's one of the things that cheers me up during all rough days. I also um I like to work on impossible like technical and like like um like scientific problems along with art that's one of my favorite things to do. And honestly like uh cooking cooking is nice. I like cooking for people especially when I when I have somebody over who's like a date or something. I love cooking for people. I love like taking care of people being taken care of but more so taking care of people.

SPEAKER_08 33:15

Well socially socially do you find yourself being very closed or do you explore no I I love I love being out and about even if it's like just those small things that matter to me like like a cup of coffee with a friend is is important.

SPEAKER_00 33:29

I mean it means the world to me even with like the psychedelic like experience I have like experiencing like other worlds and stuff it's like that's important. It's brownie regardless of what you're experiencing.

SPEAKER_08 33:39

Build but you built this a nice network of of friends and and um and neighbors here in Williamsburg in Brooklyn so Alexis uses my best friend by the way like genuinely when I was growing up I wish I had a friend like him use the one I wanted in hindsight um I always um when growing up very young I did not have any friends I had nobody there was nobody around at all like even when I tried to make friends like somebody would like bite me and then bite themselves and claim I bit them they were like the person like the person decided my fate of having friends.

SPEAKER_00 34:13

The show isn't over it still can happen I'm glad that my sister stood up for me and that she witnessed what actually happened is that actually like because people are just kids can be cruel to each other and people kids and stuff. Alexis you have a sister do you have how many siblings do you have just my sister Gabrielle but Alexis is close to uh Gabrielle the two of them an hour or so away no but I'm saying like relationship wise oh yes very close very close she's my favorite person no offense no I mean it's just sister I'm not offended.

SPEAKER_07 34:49

I love that uh you have this this goal and this wish and this intention um in terms of your artwork so where can we see some of your artwork now?

SPEAKER_00 35:01

I know you have a website can you share where our listeners can find more of your work uh my Instagram is at Faye Alexis my website is alexis a l-e X I S Eleanor E-L E A N O R Fagan F S and Frank A S and Apple G as and George A S and Apple N S and Nancy dot com and Alexis you're also involved in a a couple of programs right for uh disability justice yes i i i love that that that and i love being part of that maybe you can talk a little bit about that because that's something that you're yeah you've been involved in and you've had shows in in Manhattan yeah I'd love to hear I had a I Crip study is currently what we're doing right now it's like a think tank of different like uh queer crip disabled folks that are also mad mad in a in a non-pejorative sense but more like a neurodiverse like owning that label sort of sense and Crip is short for cripple which is like also owning like disability as like a term that's been used against us. And it's a uh basically a think tank slash emergent sort of like happening sort of thing that we do online virtually where like we like support each other and like maybe like maybe I'm hoping there'll be like a salon that emerges out of this where like rising tides will lift all both so to speak. And it's in the arts and like other ventures that like people are doing and collectively.

SPEAKER_08 36:27

And you had you had a show on with this group or at least an off street of this group.

SPEAKER_00 36:31

And with I Wanna Be With You Everywhere too it was um it was at performance space in lower I think it was east side yeah it was the lower east side of New York and Manhattan. Yeah and I uh I did the second um stem room so as what's called a sensory stem room uh other outside right after the first I went to be with everywhere I was the second one um it was large format installation yeah I I did this pie these pieces I call the solstice series I either oversaw or did everything from the um soundscape to the um interior decorating to the lighting to the um arrangement of the room to like the takeaways to the uh paintings on the wall and everything yeah all the aesthetics that made the theory and frames behind it yeah how did you find these opportunities or these organizations I uh I'm I'm gonna not gonna lie I'm sort of like forrest gump that is the best way I can put it is that I I naturally I have this like philosophy where like you ease into life where like there's a certain current and rhythm to life where like the more you fight it fight against that current the more like life will push you. So how did you find out about this specific how about oh this specific like there's a there's a series of events chain of events that had to happen for it to happen.

SPEAKER_08 37:55

I had to date the right person who introduced me to the right people who were in the right course and Parsons who were it turns out were part of disability justice which turned out was a big enough deal over time that like people like wanted to give us space and performance space thank god I mean I'm glad they did that and then there was a sequel to that same event I I don't know why they chose me but I I I I was able to get it done in two weeks like the entire thing I just described with like the space and everything obviously with assistance I mean I'm not gonna claim that I did the lighting on my own I I did not I I just like gave feedback and that was basically it for the lighting but like that's easy into life you you let you let life show you how that thing happens and a lot of it is like also law of averages like if you if you push enough for long enough eventually something will give a a lot a lot this is just one opportunity that you've come up with through and this one particularly started or originated through your connections I will say generally from the school from from Parsons Parsons so these people that you knew were were connected to the school experience some of them were staff some of them were the uh the teachers some of them were fellow students alumni right um but you also at least in my experience with you you're also very very headstrong on you find things online so you'll I don't want to use the word meetup because that's kind of a uh oversimplifies it yeah but so enter the internet and some of the groups that you've met that turn into real real space uh whether it's in art whether it's in your other interests tech so maybe that's because I think the listeners would want to know for their own children like what are some of the opportunities that I no that's fine. That's why I'm I'm I'm hopefully of course putting it in a way that that helps add some of this so what are some of the other ways that you've been able to to reach out into the areas of interest that turned into something that could turn into performance space.

SPEAKER_00 39:50

So in my experience a lot of it is like network effects like the network that you know like immediately and like who let those people know and those people know. There's a study they did recently that every single person who um on earth has like a it's like three degrees of separation of of of multiple of a multiplier of 150 people right so it's like three million something or something I I didn't do the math properly in my head right off the start I should have but uh you have like at least a million people you directly influence in the state of how you are at any given moment.

SPEAKER_08 40:24

But at the same time you're saying called Dunbar's number where you specifically only are able to interact with 150 but each of those people directly also have their own million or so people of three degrees of separation of 150 multiplied so you take that into consideration and then if you're gonna like think about like well well if you have that reach right which everybody does then it's a matter of like knowing like if you have that set circle of influence around you what is possible to causally affect and be affected by you like can you figure out a way to like have it so that you either like set up things so that by a chain of events something could occur to you and then you let that thing happen and then maybe drive it by law of averages that's how I've been thinking about it at least so some of that comes out of online groups some of that comes yeah absolutely it's a market sport yeah right so you attend uh some some interesting you know they'll call them meetups or or meetings in Manhattan that revolve around your various interests and and and it's usually we'll call it age age uh aligned with your age uh well it's also like people in your 20s and 30s right there's also a lot of people like or like have like technical experience that I either feel like I lack or I because I was an early adopter of something I'm able to like walk into a space because I was an earlier adopter than everyone there is I think personally more tactically sound than me but like some people think otherwise I have no idea why for these folks it's important that you meet them as people and that's the case that's the case across the board like people are people regardless who they are right like the moment you make somebody higher than they are you've already given up the game.

SPEAKER_00 42:18

Like the matter of fact is that like if people think that you're at you're going to approach them only for something you want you'll never get what you need. So really just be a person be the best you can possibly be but also be able to be aware when you need to like cut your losses and not accept unacceptable behavior because you shouldn't anyway because as my mom would say the next right thing and the and the correct next thing are oftentimes the same thing.

SPEAKER_06 42:49

Tell me more about that and your mom saying that because it sounds like it was a very powerful set of guidance for you.

SPEAKER_00 42:59

It's a set of guidance that's like it's ironclad if only well I just think it's a condition for people at home we're saying that's not true and that's not always the case and I'll say like yeah I know it's not always the case but the matter of fact is that most people aren't going to be doing that. Even if they like think that oh that's an interesting idea they're not gonna do it. So you actually already get an edge by being the person who's doing the right thing you already have a a way to actually be a better person and then possibly potentially have a better outcome.

SPEAKER_06 43:36

So if if there were other 20 somethings or 30 somethings you know or young adults teens listening right now because a parent just found you as fascinating as we do what would you say like how would you encourage them this is how to figure out what the next right thing is.

SPEAKER_00 43:58

Okay the next right thing In my experience I'd say like start from where your child is at, start where from where people are in general and let them pursue in a way that like actually is able to help them grow their topic limited interest. I think every child has something they're interested in. I'm not gonna I'm not gonna say that there's like that I know that, but in my experience having met people throughout my life, that's pretty much the case every time. And that if you nurture that the thing that this person already like does with that, regardless of what the reward is, it does easily, and uh if you support them, they're already in a better position than most of the planet. Because quite frankly, in my experience, like when people talk about like somebody being great at something, it's not so much that everybody doesn't have something they're great at, they do. Matter of fact, is that like we don't always value what those people are great at and it's not always supported. That's right, and that's what makes a difference. What you do with the most ease, that's supported the most, and that people value the most, that's what becomes great.

SPEAKER_07 45:10

Thank you for that. That was so helpful for me, Alexis.

SPEAKER_06 45:16

Right now in this moment. Me too. Me too when I think about Ryan and you know, now that he's in a new season of being out of the school district, and what what does he do with ease? What can I support? So thank you for that. Thank you for that. Is there anything before we go? Because we are out of time, but I would love to continue talking and I know Susanna would too. Is there anything that you would just I mean, I think what you just said was really powerful for parents. So I don't really even know if we want to add to that because I don't want to take away from from that. But is there something you haven't said, Alexis, that you would like to? Either about your own life, about your own thriving, or just something that you would really want parents to know.

SPEAKER_00 46:02

Your child is in there. No matter what you think, no matter what the situation is, no matter how dark it is, your child is in there. They want to be able to reach out to you, you want to be able to reach out to them. It might not always seem that way, and but sometimes it's a matter of being still and in the moment, even if it's just babbling, that moment matters more than you might actually imagine. And more than you might ever be able to know. And that's what should matter to you as a parent, quite frankly, at the end of the day.

SPEAKER_06 46:30

And I'm in one of those moments where like, where's the jam kleenex in the podcast closet? Thanks so much for listening today. Do us a favor and leave us a review and a rating so that this podcast can get into the ears and the hearts of more and more moms. Did you know that Brave Together Podcast is an extension of our nonprofit organization, We Are Brave Together? We Are Brave Together serves an international community of caregiving moms, offering support groups that are virtual and in-person, educational resources, and low-cost weekend retreats all over the United States. We've also published two books. Our first anthology of caregiving stories entitled Becoming Brave Together. Heroic, extraordinary caregiving stories from mothers hidden in plain sight, and our newest release, Suddenly Brave Together. Letters to Caregiving Moms at a defining moment in their lives. Both books offer stories of hope and transformation and encouragement and validation for every parent caregiver. To join us today, go to WeARBravetogether.org. Our support and sisterhood awaits you. Brave Together Podcast is for entertainment and education purposes only. It's not a substitute for professional care and should not be relied on for medical or mental health advice. The use of any content on our podcast, links, show notes, or on our website is to be done at your own personal risk. Please seek out a professional to assess your own medical or mental health concerns because we are all beautifully complex and the content of this podcast is for a broad audience.