Meta Performance: How to Transcend in the Aesthetic Industry - with Dr. Brittany Eidson

We sit down with Dr. Brittany Eidson, board certified facial cosmetic surgeon from and owner of TruForm Surgery out of Michigan, to unpack the biggest myths patients hear about cosmetic surgery and why “quick and easy” often leads to disappointment. We talk candidly about trust, psychology, leadership, and the mindset shifts that help surgeons deliver better care without burning out.
• why aesthetic results take time and why instant gratification misleads patients 
• how AI and social media change patient expectations and weaken medical authority 
• using goal-based questions to guide consultations and reset expectations 
• spotting red flags like perfection chasing and chronic dissatisfaction 
• handling unhappy patients emotionally while owning complications and learning 
• when outside influence from family can flip a patient’s perception 
• humility and empathy as core clinical skills and trust builders 
• military lessons on discipline teamwork and leadership in the OR 
• high performance vs meta performance and why delegation scales a practice 
• business coaching as a lever for team buy-in and burnout prevention 
• why rhinoplasty is so hard and why millimeters matter 
• dropping the imposter syndrome label and building confidence through reps and passion 

Her story can be used as a guide and blueprint on how to utilize "meta performance" in order to transcend your business in a competitive aesthetic and cosmetic surgery industry. 

Dr. Brittany Eidson Instagram: @dr.brittany_cosmeticsurgery

 Resources:
Beyond High Performance (Book)
Five Dysfunctions of a Team (Book)
Alex Hormozi (Podcast)

Tweet me @realdrhamrah
IG @drhamrah

Transcript

elcome And Guest Backstory

SPEAKER_00 0:01

Alright everyone, welcome to another episode. Today's episode is a special one for me because I'm not just interviewing a colleague, I'm also sitting down with someone whose journey I've had the privilege to witness firsthand. Dr. Brittany Aitson is a board-certified facial cosmetic surgeon and a board-certified oral and maxilofacial surgeon, as well as a fellow of the American College of Surgeons. She's also the co-founder of True Form Surgery in Michigan, where she and her husband are building a thriving, patient-centered practice focused on both facial aesthetics and oral maxilofacial surgery. Her path is anything but ordinary. Dr. Aitson trained at the University of Michigan, went on to complete her residency training in oral maxillofacial surgery in the United States Army at Walter Reed, and served our country for 13 years, rising to the rank of major. During her time in the military, she performed complex procedures ranging from rhinoplasty to orthodonatic and reconstructive surgery on hundreds of active duty soldiers. After her military service, she pursued an advanced fellowship training in facial cosmetic surgery through the American Academy of Cosmetic Surgery, right here in McLean, Virginia, where I had the opportunity to train her. What stood out to me then is exactly what defines her today: discipline, precision, humility, and an unwavering commitment to excellence. Fast forward today, she's not only built a successful surgical practice, but she's also teaching alongside leaders in the field, most recently as a faculty at the AACS annual scientific meeting on one of the most prestigious stages in cosmetic surgery. In this conversation, we're going to dive into everything from the truth behind cosmetic surgery trends to the psychology of patients and to what it really takes to build a career and a practice in this field. Brittany, so great to have you on. Thanks for having me. Of course. Honestly, I have to be honest with you, I'm very surprised, given just the nature of things, how soon you have risen and surpassed uh expectations, at least my personal expectations. Not that I didn't believe in you. I believe in all my fellows and anyone the train. You know yourself. I I was always cheering for you, motivating you, especially when it came to uh just taking things head on and getting onto social media, putting yourself out there, telling people who you are, what you can do for them. And you just literally took my advice the next day and started just putting in the reps. And it does take an amount of discipline to do that, but also self-belief. Now, before we get into your journey, you've been in practice for how long now?

SPEAKER_02 3:01

Uh it's been four years. Yeah, coming up on four years.

he Myth Of Quick Results

SPEAKER_00 3:04

Four years. So, what is the biggest lie in your opinion? Patients are told about cosmetic surgery or aesthetic medicine that when patients come to you, you uh have to unpack and demystify.

SPEAKER_02 3:22

Oh man, there's so many lies now that are floating around. That's why we're out here on you know social media and trying to write everything. But I think the biggest lie would have to be that this aesthetic journey is quick. Everybody, we're in this world of instant gratification where everybody wants their Amazon package the next day. And I feel like so many people come to me and say, you know, I want minimal downtime. I I can't do that. And, you know, they they push and push and push for something that's quick and easy. And it's not always the case, you know, but they could go to the med spa down the street and somebody else might tell them, Oh, yeah, I can do that, and you'll be back to work the next day. I just think that, you know, this world of instant gratification is is actually not acting in our favor here. So there's really, you know, you got to break that down and really let them understand that this is a journey that we're on, and it's not quick to get these results that you want and to still look natural.

SPEAKER_00 4:15

So, in your opinion, what are some of the risks that are associated with these types of mixed messages that our field is sending to the patients or the community out there?

ebuilding Trust In The Consultation

SPEAKER_02 4:26

I think it's a loss of authority. I mean, you you used to go to the doctor to to find out what you need, what's wrong. And now I feel like people are coming to me. They've already thrown it into AI. They already, you know, seem to know everything. They have the list of this is what's wrong, this is what I want, and I need to be back to work in two days. And it's just, it's about really reframing that and bringing the trust back to us. And, you know, we went through all this training and and the board certification to have the authority to be able to tell you what's in your best interest. And we kind of it it's almost backwards. It feels like, you know, we're taking their diagnosis and saying, okay, sure, here, here's what you want. And I feel like it's hard to step away from that and really reframe that for the patient and keep the trust.

SPEAKER_00 5:08

I think, I think that is a huge problem. And I think today, more so than ever, because of what you just said, and that's some something that I've noticed that you have, that you possess, it's just this uh talent and ability, which is to communicate, the ability to communicate. And I love your Instagram post because you articulate and communicate complex things very simply and very clearly and for the layman, and I think that is one of the must-haves for any cosmetic surgeon today, because a lot of what we do now, more so than ever, has to do with communication. Because you have to, in order to demystify a lot of these things, you have to be able to, first of all, get the patient's ear, because they, like you said, they're set on a procedure, they're set on an outcome, and they're just here to shop for it. They're not here to ask us questions. And if you don't have the ability to communicate, if you don't have great bedside manners, it's going to be very, very difficult to get uh someone's attention. And when I encourage you to get on social media, I wasn't I didn't even know how you communicate because you know when you train someone, they're usually usually I'm talking, they're listening. And when I so when when when I saw you on your post, I don't know if you remember, I immediately gave you feedback. I said, You're doing a great job, just keep doing it. And some people have it and some people don't. And so I think communication is key more so than ever. But if someone walks you in uh walks in your office asking for a procedure, you know, it won't make them happier. How do you handle that conversation? Like they're convinced that this is what they need in their life, and you know that's completely the wrong thing.

SPEAKER_02 7:07

Well, I try education is so important, but I think I for a little while I tried to just I'm just gonna educate you and just you know, tell them everything I know. And and it I felt like it wasn't getting through to patients, they weren't getting it because I'm trying to educate them. Kind of like, you know, if you're in a political debate and somebody's trying to educate you, you're like, I'm good. I already have my mind made up, but thanks for your opinion. And that's how it felt. There was just kind of a wall that was up. So instead, you know, I hear what they can, you know, I'm here for this that I saw on online or whatever. And so I like to say, you know, what's your goal? You know, if if we're sitting back here and we've gone through this journey, it's six weeks, it's 12 weeks later. How do you want to feel? What do you want to look like? And I hear that. And then I do a physical exam. And then I'm able to say, you know what, to get you to that place that you just told me about, this is this is the way and this is why. And it really reframes that because they told me what is going to make them happy. And now I will tell you what I can do to get you to that place. And so that seems to work way better than when I was just trying to preach or educate and say, no, that's wrong because of this. I think it's been really transformative in my practice and how I'm able to communicate with patients that come in with this preconceived notion or this, you know, this is what I want. This is all I'm getting.

SPEAKER_00 8:24

I think I I love that approach because from personal experience, oftentimes when you approach it this way, they feel like you're working together with them on their goal and there are, then they will become receptive. It's kind of leading the horse to the water.

SPEAKER_02 8:40

Exactly.

ed Flags And Unfixable Unhappiness

SPEAKER_00 8:41

Now, what's the difference between someone that wants to look better, like you just mentioned, but then um someone else who will never be satisfied? Have you ever encountered that? Have you ever did you ever fall into that trap?

SPEAKER_02 8:55

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 8:56

And so tell tell us a little about it.

SPEAKER_02 9:00

Yeah, I think that you know, we kind of call those red flags that, you know, somebody comes in and they've had this, this, and this, and they're not happy with this because of this, and they but and they're upset with this surgeon or this person because of this. The person that you see that's been on this journey that that is never satisfied. I am not gonna, I am okay saying maybe we can't get there, but maybe these are some more realistic goals for you. But I think that that one is a big one. And then people that come in that that really want perfection that say, you know, I have two millimeters of asymmetry on this jaw versus this jaw, and it's just they want absolute perfection. It's not always something that's achievable or possible. So those are the kind of the red flags that we're like, we have to kind of roll it back and and reset expectations to really make sure they understand what I can do and what I can't do. And I'm okay sometimes saying, I can't do that for you, I can't achieve that. Um, and I think that's better for them in the long run than just trying to say, oh sure, we'll do this and this, that'll that'll make you perfect. Doesn't always work that way.

SPEAKER_00 10:02

Did you have you ever encountered a patient or can you think of a story where that diagnosis unfortunately didn't occur before you did the procedure and then afterwards it unveal or revealed itself? And then how did you manage that and what what what happened?

SPEAKER_02 10:25

Yeah, I I had a case where uh I did a surgery and there was you know a minor complication of something on the scar that that didn't look great, and we were managing it, doing some injections of some PRF and things like that, and and it was looking great. I mean, I had the all the you know, every two weeks we had photos, things were looking so great, but this person was just deeply unsatisfied. She could not see past this one area that you couldn't even see on a photo anymore. But she said, Oh, my family tells me that it looks horrible and this, and you know, she could not get past that. And for me, you know, I had to come to a point where I had to say, I wish I would have said this in the first place, but I had to say, I really can't do anything else. This I showed every photo and it just didn't hit with her. And that was really hard to help her through, you know, and ultimately we just kind of, you know, did some maintenance treatments and she was never happy. And that that hurts as a surgeon to know that you did your best and and objectively, it really looked great, but she was never gonna get past it. I don't think I could have ever made her happy, and I really wish somehow that would have come up a little bit earlier, you know, before undergoing this journey together. But, you know, you do what everything you possibly can to the best of your ability to do the best for the patient, and sometimes there are other factors that you can't get past that.

SPEAKER_00 11:49

How how do you how do you handle that emotionally? Because I could tell you from personal experience, I remember every one of those patients of the past 20 years. I remember them by name, by case, by face, everything. And you're talking that about them not being able to see past that. Emotionally, I myself as a surgeon, when that happens, I can't see past that myself, thinking that yeah, I probably should have never operated on that person because I I don't think I helped her or him. And emotionally it really affects me, and I always think about it, and I personally I can't see past those cases. And I always wonder what my colleagues do, how my colleagues emotionally deal with these things. Now, so you're still early in your career, but you don't need to be in practicing for 20 years to have an experience that just like you mentioned. How do you how do you deal with it emotionally? Do you do you dwell on it yourself or do you just turn it off and move on and don't look back in the rearview mirror? How do you handle it? Because that's just a personal thing.

SPEAKER_02 13:02

Right. I mean, I would love to say that I turn it off and just keep moving, but there's no way. I mean, you think like you said, you think about it every time. Every time I do that same procedure, I'm thinking, I'm never gonna let that happen again. And I think, you know, unfortunately it happens, but that's the journey of being a good surgeon is owning complications, mistakes, and realizing that you can make these things better. But in the end, it's about prevention every single time. No, I mean, we just can't be perfect. So I just I try to reframe it as a learning experience, but you're right, it still weighs on you every single time you do that procedure again. That's in the back of your mind. I can't let that happen, you know. Don't let that happen again.

SPEAKER_00 13:44

I know it's it's tough. You know, one of the things that I do now, I make a more of a conscious effort to point out these possibilities before I operate on patients. So at least these conversations have taken place. And that's also a good thing for my own sanity. Oh, that hey, because we all have a conscience. I know some patients think we're just out there to get their money or we just look at them as objects. But sometimes I wish they knew how uh empathetic we are towards their feelings, towards their, you know, emotions. And but again, there are a there is a percentage, you know, statistically, about twelve to seventeen percent of anyone walking in our offices has uh some degree of body dysmorphia. There are different there's a s it's a spectrum, right? So it's sometimes very difficult to identify those patients in the beginning. Some can really mask it, they can hide it. So one of the things I just actually implemented just this year, I've created a questionnaire. It's a two-page questionnaire where they just check boxes so they can go through it pretty quickly. I'll be happy to share it with you. That when they come in for consultation and when they decide they want to do a procedure, I have them fill that out. And that screens, that screens for the the various spectrums of body dysmorphia. At least, you know, if I am concerned, I can have a conversation with them before I take them to the operating room, and I have the opportunity to say then maybe I do not want to operate on that patient, or make the patient aware that they have a problem because maybe they're not aware. Most of them are not aware, and then offer them help because there are there is professional help, there are psychologists that can help with body dysmorphia or image, body image problems, which is I think more significant now with social media.

aying No And Handling Blowback

SPEAKER_02 15:53

Well, I was really surprised. I mean, you know, in training and as you go through, you always learn, oh, just just avoid, you know, that like the plague don't ever operate on those people. And I've actually been surprised where you, like you said, those conversations ahead of time have actually really helped reset expectations and and help them. And I've had two patients that I can think of very discreetly that I think I noticed that ahead of time. We had a good conversation, and I was shocked afterwards that their confidence level just went through the roof. And I didn't expect it. I thought, oh no, here's another one where I'm gonna be, you know, walking them through day by day this emotional train wreck for them. But then they came out on the other side and were absolutely thrilled in their confidence level. I had family members of theirs emailing me and calling me saying, I can't believe, you know, they they their mood has totally changed. So not that we're out here trying to cure that, but I think, like you said, identifying and addressing it, don't be afraid of it and just say, no, I can't operate on you. Address it and you might be surprised.

SPEAKER_00 16:54

Yeah, I think that is the hard part to say no. I think the for me, the longer I went into my career, I acquired the ability to say no more often. Yeah. Because you don't want to offend someone. You don't want I actually as a matter of fact, once I said that to a patient and I refused to do the surgery, and she immediately, I think even from her car, as soon as she left my office, left me the most horrendous review, like completely flipped the script.

SPEAKER_01 17:25

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 17:26

Described it as if I was pushing to do surgery and telling her all the things that she doesn't need and completely turning things around out of anger that she didn't get what she wanted. And there's nothing I could do about it. I contacted Google, they're like first of all, it was impossible to get someone that contact anyone there. So it's just sitting there. I figured, and that was very early in my career, and I was very distraught. I was so upset because I I thought I helped the patient by saying no. And here it is, uh, she is uh just lashing back. And so, but ultimately the one advice I could give you having been in this for now two decades, is that you have to just you can't look in the rearview mirror, you have to look past that as long as you're in peace knowing that you did the right thing, uh otherwise it will chew you up. And that's why a lot of our colleagues they stop actually performing cosmetic surgery, they just go back to the reconstructors and like, you know what, I can't deal with this. It's too much, it's uh mentally it's too big of a strain. So, in your opinion, now staying on the subject, what's the difference between someone that now is not happy with the results, not because of body image or body dysmorphia problems, but they're just nitpicking on something because someone they trust, like their sister, their mother, or their best friend or their brother, made a comment that is kind of malicious, maybe out of jealousy, out of ignorance, and because that person has a lot of influence on that patient, now that patient comes back and says, I don't like my results. And until uh you dig further and you realize someone else put that idea in their head and initially they loved it. Now a year later they come back and say they hate it because of people around them. Do you ever address that? Have you ever, by the way, experienced that? And then how did you address that?

SPEAKER_02 19:36

Yeah, I had one very specific one that it was, I mean, she raved for a whole year, sent multiple, I think probably six patients that year to me. I mean, over the moon. And then all of a sudden, I think it was 15 months, flipped a switch and just called. And my office said, I don't know what's going on. She's like, this is, you know, your biggest fan. And all of a sudden she's calling saying she's so unhappy with her results. And it's like, where did this all come from? So of course I'm gonna bring her in. We're gonna talk about it, but I you have to really understand, because some patients, there's something that doesn't look great. And I would say, if something doesn't look great and I could fix it if it's a minor revision, I'm gonna say that. I'm not just gonna say, nope, my work is perfect. We can't do anything. I absolutely address that because that in the end, that's my work walking around and I want people to be happy. But sometimes you get that person in, and it turns out her husband had said something and pointed something and then showed her in a picture of this thing that, like, oh wow, I can't believe that looks like that. You had all that work done and it looks like that. And that's somebody close to her. And and so I saw her that first time, and then the second time she came in again to talk about the treatment plan that I recommended. And her husband was there and and we talked about it together. But that's when it came out that this is the person that's driving this. And for me, that's a sensitive situation. But we kind of went back to the beginning and talked about, you know, these are the things that you're saying now are bothering you a year and a half, almost a year and a half later. And do you remember when I recommended that other procedure that would have, you know, helped this and given you those really long-term results? And she said, Yeah, I just, you know, I didn't want to do it. And, you know, it was too much money or whatever it was. So she told me, you know, we went back, I went back in the notes and realized I recommended something else that she declined. And that was something that also just flipped the script in my mind where, you know, this shouldn't be an a la carte menu. You know, if I'm gonna give you my best, it's gotta be my best. It's not to upsell you, it's not to add more things to your treatment plan. But if I recommend all of these things, it's because these are the things you need, and this is how I accomplish it. Just like I talked about before. If I want to get you to that journey that we talked about, your six months later happiness, how do we do that? And so that was the thing that clicked in my mind after that scenario of it felt horrible for me. But I thought, you know. What? I should have just been a little bit more assertive and helped her understand these are the things we need to do to get you there and not compromise my surgery because the patient was driving it based on you know finances or fear or whatever it may be.

onfidence Beauty And Patient Story

SPEAKER_00 22:16

Interesting. That brings me to the next question, you know, because a lot of what people think, at least when I was in training, I thought cosmetic surgery is all about learning technical things. I couldn't wait to get to the operating room. But a lot of these, what what what we're talking about right now, you actually what I personally learned it is being in a consultation with my mentors in the room as they're talking to the patient, just being a fly in the wall and seeing all these things unfold, the good, the bad, and the ugly. So it is deeply psychological, right? You know what we do. I think a lot of what we do is uh psychological. So what what have patients, you know, since we're talking about this stuff, taught you about self-esteem, identity, and self-confidence that surprised you, or is nothing really surprised you kind of were have had become aware of that prior to your training or your experience?

SPEAKER_02 23:18

Yeah, so I think uh beauty, self-confidence, aesthetics, all that is so deeply personal. And when you're in training, thinking back to board exams and studying, it's you know, you look at this, this, this, this is the normal, this is the angle, the measurement, all of these things are the you know, ideal perception of beauty or perfection or symmetry. And sometimes it's not about that. And that's not, you know, I'm I would say this is where I want to put your nose in relation to your upper lip and your chin, and that's the sign of the normal range. And that may be way off from the patient or what gives them confidence, you know. If I think something looks not so great, but they, you know, really like having volume in their cheeks right here, it's just so deeply personal what each person feels is beautiful and what is going to make them confident. And so I think that getting to the root of that and and realizing that there is a person and human interaction that needs to happen, not just scientifically diagnosing something on a photo.

SPEAKER_00 24:24

Yeah, I mean, it's also a lot of that has to do, I think, with what's going on in their life. I try to always find out to get more context as to their self-confidence or self-esteem problem. You know, trying to find out what stage of their lives are. Is it is it is it like a teenager that's about to go to college and has a big hump on their nose that was that had maybe a sibling that constantly made fun of them all their lives and they're so self-confident, you know aware about that, and and they they lack this self-esteem and self-confidence, or is it someone that's middle-aged, maybe just recently got divorced, and now wants to and all their lives they take took care of the children and never took care of themselves, and now they realize they have to take care of themselves. So it's I think once we understand the story behind the patient, because every patient has a story, no one just wakes up and starts nitpicking their faces, right? I mean, that doesn't happen. And then I try to invest more time in identifying these nuances and the story behind the patient. And I think when you approach the patient within that context, I think we're better able to help them and understand their concerns, and then we therefore then will address them differently, whether we reframe things or uh stage things or even talk them out of something, or maybe present them something that they hadn't thought of that, like you initially said at the beginning, that might solve their problem. I think for understanding the story behind the patient is so key, and that's something I learned I would say it took me 10 years at least to understand. I gotta ask questions about that. I never asked patients a question about that. At first I thought I might be overstepping boundaries or it's like it's personal, but every little detail matters because if you don't address it prior to or during the consultation, it will come up at some point when they're most vulnerable, which is post-operatively. Who's your support group, who's going to be taking care of you, who comes with you to the consultation. And all of those things I feel are integral parts and it it it's it's it's it makes it even more complicated, especially for the uh no-fi surgeons getting into practice. But uh one of the things that strikes me with you is you don't appear to me as someone that is you you appear to me as an old soul, almost like you've been in this profession for so long. Like you have to explain to me why.

SPEAKER_02 27:28

I don't understand that way.

SPEAKER_00 27:30

Yeah, I I don't understand it. It because of course I compare you to the norm, and I want to know did you have an epiphany, did you do independent research, do you just have that naturally God given social emotional intelligence and self-awareness? What is it? I mean, I I you need to tell us a little bit about yourself and and and I want you to be honest. Yeah, I I'm don't don't don't don't be humble. I I really because I want this will bring a lot of value to surgeons that are currently doing their fellowship or pursuing a fellowship, or ones that have recently graduated, as well as surgeons that have been in practice for a decade and are still struggling.

SPEAKER_02 28:19

Yeah. Well, I have to be humble because I think that's what has got me to have that that affect or that way about me. I am a very, I guess, introspective person. I really study emotional changes on people's face and I listen to what they have to say instead of interrupting because being humble, especially when we do the cosmetic fellowships, I had already been through residency years in the military as being my own surgeon. I was a staff surgeon, I was teaching other people, and now I'm back in this place where I have to say, I don't know anything, I'm learning. And I was okay stepping back and saying, even if I think I do, I'm not gonna what does that get me? I'm here for a year to soak in everything I possibly can and I can form my opinions later, but I do that in my practice now. I take advice from other people, I listen to my patients. If I could say anything to somebody that's trying to really, you know, understand what's going on and have a better relationship with their patients and be that authority, it's it's be humble. Even, you know, from training to seeing my patients, I let my patients talk. I barely say anything until the very end of the consultation when I'm giving my recommendations. There is so much beauty in allowing the silence and letting that person talk to you in its entirety and not interrupting and saying, oh yeah, yeah, yeah, I understand that. This is what I do. I just sit back and let it happen. And I have always been that person, whether it looked shy or it looked like I was just, you know, being a jerk and, you know, don't want to talk to anybody. No, it's sitting back and listening and watching the emotion on the face and watching what people are telling you. And I was, you know, humble enough to do that in res or in fellowship. And I know a lot of people have struggle with just learning and not thinking you know everything. And I've taken that through to consultations with my patients and even with my team, building a team in my practice. I mean, you have to let other people talk and appreciate the beauty and the silences because they will talk and they'll reveal those things like you're talking about where they are in their life. Other things come up without you having to ask. And sometimes if you ask or you interject, you miss it. They're done. They they've moved on, they're never gonna tell you those things.

umility Empathy And Military Lessons

SPEAKER_00 30:40

So I don't know if that's that is that is what you asked, but absolutely. I'm not surprised by answer. So I think it to me it's not just humility, but it's also empathy. I think the the the one of the other second key word here is empathy in addition to humility. If you don't possess empathy, like you said, you're not gonna listen. Because if you have empathy, there's a genuine interest in helping the patient. And when you're generally uh genuinely interested helping someone, that's when you listen. And on the flip side, the opposite is if you want to sell, you never listen, you constantly talk. That's why salespeople are so obnoxious and annoying. Because you feel like they're not uh here for you, they're here for them. And I think that trust, that empathy and that humility makes patients comfortable enough to talk to you about their most vulnerable uh uh uh aspect of their lives, the m things they fear, things they wish they had, or things they want. And I think empathy is uh the biggest, the most important trait of anyone in healthcare, not just cosmetic surgery, that you need to possess to be able to help patients at a complete different level that some people might not even understand, and only the ones that do it will understand, and only the patients that feel it will will be able to tell you who those ones are. And I I loved your answer. And my curiosity is did you uh you were mentioning you were staff surgeon in the at the US Army, which is a very different environment than private practice. Any lessons uh from the military that still guide you not just with with patients, but also in the operating room?

SPEAKER_02 32:48

Yeah, I mean the military is all about it's it's all about discipline, it's all about being on a team. So that's really helped me quite a bit, both in the operating room and building my team that helps me. I mean, I can't do all of this all by myself. There's so much that my team goes into, but that that discipline in the army and kind of the whole goal of the army is to create these high performers. And so I learned very early in my training and afterwards that being a high performer in the army is how you get ahead. That's how you excel. And it was only after spending that time in the army as a high performer when I got out, I started kind of studying these things and discovered this theory of meta-performance, which is which is above high performance. It's not what more can I do? It's not about working harder, it's about what else is possible and just kind of rising above and watching everything that's going on beneath you and not working harder and just putting your head down and saying, I can do it all, I can do it all myself. It's what more can we achieve? And that brought in teamwork as well. And so understanding how to manage a team, how to be on a team, and how to lead a team was super important. And so all of those things, I kind of got my baseline experiences at high performer in the army, and it allowed me to open up to new things and this idea of meta-performance and really just stepping back and looking at what more is possible. And that's really, I think it kind of set the baseline for me to excel now that I'm out.

SPEAKER_00 34:17

Can you explain that a little more? The high performers and meta performers that the you know, in maybe real life examples that you had, because I wasn't familiar with those things and I'm very interested. It's it's very interesting what you just said. I think you can apply to any, I know, I think you can apply to anything. If you can kind of maybe for for the layman, just uh with an example explain that.

SPEAKER_02 34:45

Yeah. So I I guess I can really distinctly think in residency, we we would have clinic in the afternoons. Everybody hated clinic because it meant you were once you finish clinic, you see, you know, 20 patients and then you have three hours of notes to do, and you leave at eight o'clock at night. And I remember I knew we could get faster through the clinic if I just did all of them. So I remember going through the hall and grabbing all the papers, seeing all the patients, presenting all of it to the staff and just getting through. And it's like, I can do it fast, I'm just gonna do it myself. It'll get done faster. And that's being a high performer. You can do it and you're a task manager, you can do these things really well and really fast. And it's the mindset of I can do it faster, I can do it better. So, what's the point in trying to teach other people or delegate things to other people? And so instead of the mindset of I'm the only one that can do it, how about I'm the best one to train and think about what else is possible if I took, you know, three hours tonight and sat down with my team of residents and said, these are the steps that we're gonna take and we're gonna move forward, you know, together as a team, and that's how it's all gonna work together. It's more about a mindset of elevating yourself and thinking what is possible and and what's the mindset that gets us there to get us running together as a team rather than I'm the best, I know everything, I'm a high performer, I'm gonna get it all done all by myself and work harder and work harder and work harder. There's a max to that that you can't psychologically surpass. You can't be a high performer all the time. It's just it gets exhausting. So this meta performance frees you up. It's just a mindset shift that really frees you up to be, you know, that person that looks at how we can get this done, what else can we get done without putting more work and more sweat equity in.

SPEAKER_00 36:28

And how are you applying it to your private practice? I know you we just talked uh a couple of weeks ago, and I was surprised to hear that. And you just uh less than four years ago, you went into private practice. I know your husband already had started that practice, and already you're building your second location after less than four years. Can you explain what you feel what what was the the one X factor that led to that type of success and within the context of what we just talked about?

SPEAKER_02 37:06

Well, we actually hired a business coach, and it's it's having somebody else that can call you on your bullshit sometimes and just say, you know, you're doing that thing where you feel like you have to control everything in this practice. And as soon as I was able to have somebody call me out on that and really let go and realize I have to build a strong team around me that we we delegate up front, we have meetings, we have, you know, pods of leadership within the office and allowing or just that release of allowing others to help and to really build them up has been beneficial as well. So we have this coach that's been then coaching me, and it's just that release of somebody calling you out and saying, Why are you doing that? What what more could you do if if we shifted our mindset to, you know, building a team? So now my team actually gets coaching too. And so it's about developing every layer of this practice, not just me. You come out of training thinking, I gotta be the best. What can I do? All of these things of what can I do? And it's like, you can't do it together like all by yourself. You need somebody else, you need a team that's moving and rowing in the same direction. And so that was really it opened up my eyes quite a bit to to business coaching, whereas that mindset I had before was always, I gotta learn surgery, you know, how many CEs can I go to? Things like that. And this was more, you know, a for me about me as a leader, and you you kind of need that to build a successful practice.

SPEAKER_00 38:37

Interesting. What so what do you think the biggest factor or challenging factor or uh different the biggest difference in building your practice successfully was was it that business coach that helped you get to the next level or was it something else that came prior to that?

SPEAKER_02 38:58

I think I mean the business coach, I mean that was a turning point for me for sure because I was starting to get, you know, this feeling of burnout after two years of Adam and I, my husband trying to build this practice, just the two of us, you know, talking about it all the time. We felt like we were banging our heads against the wall because nobody else cared about it as much as we did. But we found ways to open up and actually express these feelings to our team and you know, not feel like we couldn't share things with them. And it it really got a little bit more buy-in. I mean, they they became engaged and this felt like their practice too. So when we win, they win. And that's when the script really flipped. It's not all about us, and it's not, I'm the boss and I am in charge of everything, and I'm the only one responsible for this business moving on. And so we created opportunities for our team to win at the same time that we went, and that was the time that everything switched, and everybody seemed to be working together. So when I we had that meeting, a couple meetings in with our business coach, and we talked about burnout, and he said, Okay, well, what's burnout? And I thought, I don't know. I couldn't, I couldn't describe it. So maybe, maybe it's just something in your head. Everybody has their own idea of burnout, but burnout isn't just this one big concept that, oh, I can diagnose you, you have burnout. It's it's something within you, and and the the way out is different for every single person. And so for me, really holding on to the business aspect of things has helped quite a bit. And I've become really passionate about it. But I would say that it's also helped my practice with my patients and how I care for my patients because now I have this team that is really hands-on in the pre-op appointment. We have people that identify with each and every patient, and they're like, that's their person that this patient calls throughout their journey. And then in the post-op, people are coming in and saying, Oh, you look fabulous. And the amount of confidence that that gives these patients post-op when they're in their post-op blues. I mean, not only has this helped me as a business owner, but this has helped my patients in my practice too, because it everybody wants this patient to feel how I've wanted them to feel the whole time.

SPEAKER_00 41:04

That is probably, gosh, I wish I had talked to you in my first five or ten years of my career, because if I just knew what you just learned with the business coach and everything you just said, gosh, I would probably live another 10 years, 10 years longer than I will. Uh, because everything you just said, I I learned painfully through trial and error and banging my head against the wall. And I think for any young surgeon listening, or any seasoned surgeon that is in practice, has been in practice for a decade and still struggling, I would rewind what we just talked about, what Britney just said the past, I don't know, five minutes, just rewind it and listen to it again and again and again and again until you decide to do it. Because I could tell you what you just said is probably the secret sauce to business success. Because none of us learned these things in residency, fellowship. We didn't learn these things unless you you you learned it from your mentors or they had this conversation with you, which this is something I that conversation I have with my fellows a lot, explaining them exactly what I learned painfully. I wish I had a business coach then. Now, how did you stumble on a business coach? You woke up up some morning and said, I think I need a business coach because I'm burnt out.

SPEAKER_02 42:39

Yeah, I had I have a good friend who has a practice actually. We share that our building together. And so she had been using this coach and more as training her leadership team and doing a lot of sales training and things like that. And so I we just Adam and I just went and had dinner with him, and you know, he did his sales pitch, and that's what he he's doing. He's selling himself. And we thought it's ex it's expensive, you know, but expensive is relative.

SPEAKER_00 43:04

I mean, when you get the value, the value you just got, um, I think it puts it, puts the cost into perspective.

SPEAKER_02 43:11

And I think that's what gives people pause, is like, gosh, I don't know if I can spend thousands of dollars working on myself when I I need to be in the in the clinic seeing patients. And you that's one of those mindset things. And so, you know, we we had dinner with him and we we thought, you know what? We're not doing anything else that feels good right now. Let's try it. And it was so, so worth it. And I mean, he's the one that introduced me to these uh two books that I, you know, read about business that really just got me obsessed with this type of mindset shift and really helped me get out of that self, you know, wallowing of like, I'm burnt out, healthcare providers are burn out. There's nothing I can do to get out of this. I just have to put my head down and grind. That mindset shift has been so just freeing for me. But you didn't get those textbooks in residency and fellowship and Like nobody talks about, you know, reading a book about teamwork or about, you know, beyond high performance. It just doesn't come up in in those types of academic readings. So yeah, I'm still reading my textbooks and I still watch videos and, you know, and developing surgical skill, but I'm also developing this other side that has that has really freed my stress by changing my mindset to be more open and learn more.

SPEAKER_00 44:22

Any any book suggestions you have that you might put into the show notes or uh into the captions?

SPEAKER_02 44:30

Well, these two that really got me obsessed with this type of thing is Beyond High Performance and then Five Dysfunctions of a Team. I mean, they are transformative.

SPEAKER_00 44:38

Love it. Thank you. Thank you for sharing that. Now, any podcasts you listen to on these types of topics or are most podcasts you listen to completely different topics?

SPEAKER_02 44:48

Yeah, well, I I love the business stuff. So I Alex Armozzi is one of my favorites. I just love listening to that guy talk. It's just amazing. Yes. And then I listen to some personal finance things too, just to get you in that mindset of being responsible, you know, throughout all aspects.

SPEAKER_00 45:04

Wow, you you seem to be an entrepreneur through and through. Who would have known someone coming to the city?

SPEAKER_02 45:08

I don't know where it came out, but I just became obsessed with it.

SPEAKER_00 45:11

Yeah, I think I think that's just a natural passion and drive. You know, I had that and when I came out, and a lot of the things that you're saying, it's resonates so well with me because that's not something that I had learned, but I had to educate myself on. And personally, I understand where you come from. I I want to just make sure the audience can hear that, and because this is really the X factor. The the difference between success and failure is not necessarily, of course, you have to be a great surgeon, right? But if you're an average surgeon and you run your business well, you're gonna be successful and you're not gonna burn out. But you know, it and and the other thing is what you just mentioned, you know, getting coaching is essential. And most people look at it like you said, oh, I don't know if I can justify the expense, it's you know very costly. Well, you know, you gotta spend money to make money. And when you built your practice, you didn't pay the entire money, uh entire cost out of your pocket. You got a loan. Uh you borrowed the money from the bank so you can pay it off. I mean, it's the same thing. You just just put it on that tab if you know you want to be successful. I think most people try to do it with the least amount of investment, not realizing that the best investment is what you just did, which is you invested in yourself because no one can take that ability ever away from you, right? Because you could use that ability and scale things. You can build, build, and constantly apply to your next venture, to your next project, whatever you're gonna you're doing. And and I think that's the part that people should have more faith in and look at it from that perspective so they actually are able to move forward.

SPEAKER_02 47:03

Yeah, and I think something important too. I mean, we've we kind of got onto this business and entrepreneurship track, but to make it work, you still do need to still work on mastering your your craft. You need to have the education and you need to develop those skills. You don't have to be, and you should never think you're the best surgeon ever, but you still need to work on it. You still need to have good results. If I was doing all this and, you know, you know, doing surgeries all the time and they were crap and people were unhappy, the business business would be dead in the water. So you still need to work on your skill and your craft, but developing those skills early, using your training, your fellowship, and the next couple of years out of fellowship, that's the time that you really develop that and then say, you know, now I'm ready. I can do this because you still have to produce quality and be a good person.

eta Performance Team Building Coaching

SPEAKER_00 47:51

Love that. What is the most challenging surgery in your mind in cosmetic surgery within the spectrum of practice that you perform?

SPEAKER_02 48:02

I think rhinoplasty for sure. I mean, it's a teeny tiny little area right in the middle of your face. It's where everybody's looking. And the wild thing about rhinoplasty is, you know, it's millimeters. We're we're working in millimeters. And so you change two millimeters on one patient is gonna look different than the same maneuver on a different patient. Every single nose is different. You have your steps that you go through, but this maneuver here is gonna look wildly different on this patient, and it's gonna have functional and cosmetic ramifications and implications for every move you make. And I don't know that people, you know, understand that with rhinoplasty, one suture can change the whole nose. And so that's I think the hardest surgery.

SPEAKER_00 48:43

So can I ask you an honest question?

SPEAKER_02 48:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 48:47

Why is it then, if if you think that's the most difficult surgery, why did you think about it? Why did you take it upon yourself in just doing rhinoplasty and taking on the challenge? You seem to me like someone that likes to torture herself, not just with business, but also with the some one of the most challenging and technically challenging surgeries, not just technically, also I think patients are sometimes difficult to manage emotionally because it is a huge change, you know, so changing the very thing that sticks not only sticks out of your face, but is in the middle, in the center of your face, that has a huge effect on your facial appearance. What made you obtain the courage, because it requires courage to tackle that? And to the point that you were literally sitting next to me on the rhinoplastic cadaver course at the ASCS, not just as a participant, but as a faculty. Which is pretty darn impressive. It's pretty badass, by the way.

SPEAKER_02 49:52

I I mean, I don't know. Like you said, I just we torture ourselves. I'm not sure why we do it. But it's it is satisfying to know, you know, again, you still have to be humble and just not think that you can fix every problem, but the problem solving that goes into it, and I think patients deserve people that are passionate about figuring out what all of these little things and these little nuances of surgery like this, I think our understanding of the implications and what can be done. Patients deserve that because there's so many providers that take shortcuts or or do things that don't serve the patient in their best interest, whether it's out of ignorance or just, you know, a lack of skill. But I think I think we owe it to the patients to offer things, but only when we have all of the knowledge that we can to give them the best result.

SPEAKER_00 50:48

Yeah, but you still haven't answered the question. You you you you you've generalized it a little bit too much. I I want to know what went on actually in your head one day deciding, you know what, I'm in a private practice. So here's my rhinoplasty patient. I think I can do it. And then that moment, and then fast forward four years later, you're teaching others how to do rhinoplasty. Like you, you need to I I want you to walk me through it. I I want to know that genuine, I'm genuinely curious because it's something that I always when I train fellows, because I'm so passionate about it, because of everything you just said, and I like to have that spark light this huge passion in my fellows so that they can kind of take the torch and be the next one to do it and like you teach at the next cadaver course that I didn't expect would happen so early. I want you to walk us through that.

SPEAKER_02 51:51

Well, I mean, there's a little bit of when you first start out, like, can I do this? Should I be doing this? It's it seems too soon. But I got my knowledge through fellowship, and there's no way that I could say that I learned all these things on my own in secret, watching videos and things like that. So going through doing this, I've always put in the work with the thought of how can I return this favor to other people? And maybe I don't know, this is why if I'm still not answering your question, but I really think that when we go through this journey, we do also owe it to other surgeons to be able to help in their development and their training, and especially in our the AACS and the American Board of Facial Cosmetic Surgery, there is a level of service that I want to provide to them. And maybe that comes from, you know, my service in the Army and that just feeling and drive all the time to be able to provide that service to other people. But, you know, if nobody ever wants to share or train or give back, we stop as a specialty. We stop moving forward and we stop being, you know, the premier surgeons in this type of field. So I think always, you know, people say, that's not worth my money, it's not worth my time to spend time training other people or doing that. I think, I think that's a huge disservice to our whole specialty. So I think that was kind of the light bulb for me is wow, I learned so much in training. Let me keep working and then get to the point where I can say, I feel like I can teach somebody and I can actually develop somebody else because I'm gonna be gone someday. And I want people to continue on in this specialty and being the premier specialty for this.

SPEAKER_00 53:31

Yeah, I I love that. And I feel the same way, and uh, it's not something you can really explain because uh it it doesn't make sense other than what you just said. It's basically returning a favor. Um I feel obligated and I don't even have to force myself, and what you just said, I totally understand, and that's the generosity that comes with appreciation to get someone else excited about something you're excited about. It's literally sharing a passion and hoping that you can instill that in someone else, and I think that's what gets us going. And what you just said is absolutely true, and that's why uh education continues. What do you think uh was the single most important reason or one of the reasons that made you the confident I know you're gonna say now you you you're way too humble. You're gonna say no, I'm not that made you the confident surgeon you are because you not only because I see what you do, results speak for themselves, no one has to explain. What most don't understand that as surgeons, we can look at someone's results and c know exactly what their technical ability is, what they did well and what they missed, what they could have done better, you know, if you scrutinize things or critically look at things. And also from how they speak, how they explain, how they present themselves. So you are a confident surgeon, you you do uh amazing work. And of course, you didn't learn all of that in your residency or your training because I always explain people residency fellowship is just like someone just got their driver's license. You still have to go out there and drive. You're not gonna become a race car driver or even win a championship coming out of driving school. What is the what did you do? I mean, obviously, you must have put in some work of whether it is that you went to courses, watched videos, or shadowed other surgeons. What would you recommend or what advice would you give a surgeon that just came out of fellowship to be like you, to be another Britney?

SPEAKER_01 55:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 55:58

Confidence, I think, in surgery, especially being a surgeon, is probably the hardest thing, and it's a lesson that not everybody is ever gonna comprehend or master. But I would I wish people would eliminate the word the phrase imposter syndrome from their mind because I hear so many young surgeons, people on social media that talk about imposter syndrome, and I know how that feels because you come out and you're like, I you know, I've only done 10 of the, you know, I shouldn't be the expert in this. And but what if you were? What if you just I'm the expert in this and I can do amazing things, you know? What if you shift? It's a it's a mindset shift. I know I've said it a million times, but you have to, yeah, you have to you have to believe that, or it's gonna come across to everybody that you talk about that you're unsure. And I've had the cases where I thought, you know, three cases in a row where this one little thing happened, I'm like, okay, I suck. What am I doing? You know, should I even be doing this? Is it worth it? And and you learn and you get past that and you think, no, I should be doing this. I'm doing the right thing. There's something small I could improve on. So I'm gonna do it. And I'm gonna continue to be the expert in this. So it's definitely a mindset shift, mindset shift where you don't, it's not imposter syndrome. Stop thinking that, you know, it is what do you want to be and and go do that? What is the person that is the expert in facelifts? What does that person do? And then go do it. Write it down in a list, put it in chat GPT, who cares? What does an expert in this field do? And then you start doing those things.

SPEAKER_00 57:37

I love that answer. I think that was very valuable for anyone listening right now because imposter syndrome is real. It's I agree with you. I heard it also somewhere else where I don't know who it was, just said exactly what you just said. We should get rid of that term because that creates that is the biggest hurdle that most can't overcome. And getting out of the gate, they don't even get started. And I know a lot of surgeons that completed some of the best fellowships, including some of my own fellows, that decided they're not gonna practice cosmetic surgery, and I think it's because of that.

SPEAKER_02 58:14

Yeah, and it's a crutch, and I don't think it helps anybody. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 58:18

And and I think a lot of it has to do with perhaps how much I think passion is one of the drivers that helps you overcome it. I can talk for myself, uh, I resonate completely with what you said, all these experiences that you're like, man, the outcome wasn't what you expected, and you're questioning yourself, doubt kicks in, you see other people doing great work, you're thinking maybe I shouldn't be doing this. But personally, for me, and I want to know from you whether that is the case as well, is I was so passionate about it that I just didn't want to take no as an answer. Those things made me constantly improve my skills, and I think the driver of that was passion. I really wanted to learn this, to learn how to be great, like the great ones, and I'm still doing it. I just bought two big textbooks on rhinoplasty, and because I want to learn even further new techniques and and even improve the results and the the little things. I think sometimes the the five or ten percent missing things make 90% of the entire difference in your entire career that could catapult you, get you to the next level or the stratosphere. And it's I think passion is the leading driver of all of that. And if you're not passionate, uh wouldn't wouldn't you agree that it it's really passion? Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 59:45

If you're not passionate about something, you you burn out. You as soon as that's true, burnout, you say it's not worth it anymore. When you have those little things, you're like, why am I doing this? This isn't worth it, and you're done unless you have passion. That's the only thing that keeps you on the horse, I think.

SPEAKER_00 59:58

Yeah, I think what and and I just realized that actually very recently, and so now when I interview for fellows, I don't interview anymore what program they came from, or because I honestly I don't know, everybody's different. I know residents from the programs I graduated, we have complete different abilities and surgical skills. So that is just one small aspect. I now try to screen for passion because I know if someone has the passion, they will succeed. And they obviously they must have had good surgical skills and must have been academically capable if they came this far. So now, what is the X factor to become the next Britney? I think passion is the word because passion will help you first of all overcome the most important hurdle, which is imposter syndrome, which then will enable you to constantly hone in on your craft and improve your skills and constantly learn to become better, learn from your mistakes. And that's how we grew. And what people don't realize every surgeon, even the best in the world, they had their first patient at some point. And they were they're lacking self-confidence, unless they were crazy, they were lacking a good amount of self-confidence until they they obtained the knowledge and the skill to become more confident. But even the most confident, and that's the Dunning Krueger effect, right? Yeah, even the most conf confident, as a matter of fact, the most confident surgeons or people in general, they lack uh they they they possess something called intellectual humility, which is exactly what you possess, which comes through experience. And that intellectual humility makes you constantly wanting to learn more because you know that first of all, you will never know everything, you will never master everything, and it's not about those things, it's not about an outcome, it's about the process to constantly learn and just get better. Then your next surgery should be better than your previous surgery. And that's just step by step and don't worry, don't look in the rearview mirror other than learning from your mistake instead of dwelling or putting fuel on your imposter syndrome.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:18

Yeah. And as you said about your your screening for some of your fellows now, it it reminded me of something as I was applying to uh residency, you know, right out of school. Somebody said to me, This shouldn't be something that you want to be want to do. This shouldn't be something you want to do. This should be something you have to do. So for me, just that that defined passion to me. And that that has stuck in my mind forever. And when people come to me, you know, asking how I got where I am, getting through residency and fellowship and applications, I said, You should really think about this before you even apply. Is this something you just you found and you think you want to do, or is this something you feel like you have to do for yourself? And so that was really powerful for me. And that I think that really instills passion. I love that.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:02

I'm gonna use that now. I call it uh the it's uh Brittany question. So so my my question for you now is did you possess so did you have to do a fellowship or did you want to do a fellowship and then you realize that you're actually passionate about which came first, the chicken or the egg?

hinoplasty Mindset Passion And Mastery

SPEAKER_02 1:03:20

Well, I wanted to do it first, and then I wanted to do it as soon as I was out of residency. I thought, man, I want to do this so bad because I have to do it. I didn't I didn't know if I felt like that. And then I did my a few years in my army service, and then I thought I have to. I went and saw Joe Nyamtu, and he he was talking about the training and things like that. And you know what? I thought I have to get this training to be again. I want to be the expert, I want to be the person that's doing this. What do I have to do to get there? Fellowship is what I had to do, so that that helped me through that. I knew I was passionate, and that's what I had to do to become the person that I had envisioned for myself.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:59

I absolutely love that. And I feel that you have to become a fellowship director pretty soon. And you know, our profession needs people like you, and you're very inspiring, you're very passionate, and I believe if you and it doesn't have to be anytime soon, whenever you're ready for it, because it's also a decision that it's also a business decision because there's a lot of responsibility associated with it, and I know you're just building a second location, a second practice, and there's a lot of work. I don't even know how you do it with a six-year-old daughter, and both you and your husband working. I mean, it it's pretty impressive, but though, how do you manage that challenge, the life work balance, and having a six-year-old daughter and at the same time a thriving practice that you're growing like crazy?

SPEAKER_02 1:05:03

We we make it part of our family. Not that we bring home work or bring work home with us every day, but our daughter knows which office we're going to. She goes into the office, she's got her space where she does her work. She's in the backseat when I'm taking her to school. I turned around and she had my rhinoplasty book open. She's, you know, I came home and she said, I said, What's I fixed a cheekbone today? What's that called? Zygoma, mom. You know, so we bring her into it and make her excited about these are things we're doing, and these are the reasons that, you know, mom and dad are working, and it's it's setting up her mindset for her own success in whatever she wants to do. But I think not, you know, everybody wants to say, this is work, this is home life, and they need to be separate. You got to have this balance. What if you don't need a balance? What if they don't have to be separated? They can just work together. You can have this quality, intentional time with your family, but it can also be learning and guiding our daughter into what success looks like for us and what that could look like for her too. So we don't try to separate it. That gets exhausting. We just, you know, kind of mash it all together and make it this continuum of balance, but but also developing her and teaching her and having really quality relationships. It's so important. You need that support system at home.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:13

I love that. That's such great advice. So, what what what do you guys do for fun when you guys are not working? Is there, do you guys leave yourself? I know you're yeah, you are very health and fitness oriented. You know, I can tell from your post that you take your personal health and wellness very seriously, which is if you don't take care of yourself, you can't take care of others. How do you find time for that? And as well as, you know, like vacations or time off from work. I know it's hard when you're building a practice, but how do you, what advice do you have or what are you struggling with?

SPEAKER_02 1:06:49

Well, I struggle with probably something that everybody that owns a practice does. It's like, you know, every day that it's closed, that's money out the door. And especially now we have two practices, it's it feels like, oh my gosh, we're doubling down. But you, like you said, if you don't take care of yourself, I get up early. I work out every morning, so I don't have to worry about it. It is done, it is a part of my day. So I'm taking care of that. My husband and I schedule vacations for just us. We schedule one with our daughter. We have to plan ahead of time, but we do it and we do things as a family. We all golf together and in Michigan in the winter, it's horrible. So we don't golf, we go skiing instead. So we we find those things that are natural ways to detach. And that's what the balance I'm talking about is you just you go and do things that you're passionate about and are healthy and good for family life, and you just naturally detach and connect while you're out doing those things that are away from home, away from the office.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:42

Interesting. So you just mentioned day not day outside of the office is lost money. How important is it just for perspective, how important is money to you? And is that because oftentimes when we talk to colleagues, you know, they want conversation is that, and there is no context for it. No one under no one can explain the importance of it or how much money is enough, and you lose money or you you lose revenue when you're not in the office. So what? Are you gonna starve? Are you gonna go bankrupt? So to put it in perspective, how important is that to you or both of you and your husband as business owners? I'm just curious because that's something the humble, sobering, I guess, lesson in life I learned a little bit too late. I wish I had learned it earlier and I wouldn't have tortured myself. But I want to hear from you since you're still in your first decade.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:51

Well, it's scary. I mean, you come out of school with so much debt, and then you you go into debt with a practice, and it's like that's scary, you know, to think, oh my gosh, if something happened, uh, how would I pay for all of these things? But when you start to shift and realize that your revenue or things are probably going to be the same, they're just gonna be in a shorter or smaller amount of days, you can take those days apart because you do need to reset your mind. Because if you continue on and you're just that driving is that high performer all the time, you really bog yourself down and then you get in like this cycle in your mind where you're always trying to come up with new things and new problems to fix, and you really need to stop and reset. And that still allows you to go ahead and, you know, get the revenue that you need to to cover your business loan, to cover your school loans. But most of all, like we have a whole team of 20 people that rely on us for their paychecks, and that's that's also important too. So, yes, there's all those stressors, and it's so hard first as you come out of thinking about all of those things. But if you do prioritize health, time, teamwork, all of those things, you will have a thriving business that you can plan ahead and know these are the days we have to take for team development for us as families, and that is going to drive your business forward and your revenue is not going to change. You're still gonna be able to cover those loans. It's just a mindset shift that you have to make that's so scary when you have those huge debts coming out of school or starting your practice.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:26

Absolutely. And I think one of the things I resonate with is that, and I think it really burnt me out the first decade of my career where I felt I had to put a stop on it because I burnt out. And but then only very recently, uh two about two years ago, I'll tell you a little story to that point that you just made. Because I think it's very important for people to listen to this and hear it. And I wish I had heard myself talk 20 years ago, and maybe you find it interesting too. We were coming out of a great weekend with the family, and we had so much fun. And Monday turned, the kids didn't have school, I had to go to work. I know I had a very busy week ahead, and everybody was just chilling, we were having a coffee, and I knew I had to run out, and I just set out my thoughts loudly. I said, Man, I wish I didn't have to work today. I so wish that I could have stayed with you all today. And I didn't realize that anybody was listening. And my wife is like, Well, why don't you? And I said, I thought to myself, Well, because I have patient schedule, I can't just not go to work. She said, No, no, I understand, but why why don't you take m because I said I wish I had Mondays off and I had a long weekend uh every now and then or all the time.

unknown 1:12:02

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:03

Getting too greedy. And she said, Well, and then she said, Well, why don't you? I said, Well, I have to go to work. I mean, I have to pay bills and all of this and that. I have a busy schedule. I I have to, like, what do you mean? She said, Well, you you own your own business. I mean, isn't that something you can I mean, who do you need to talk to? I said, Well, myself, obviously. She said, Well, can you just take Mondays off? And I said, And then all of a sudden, for the first time, I started thinking about it and considering it and calculating in my head whether I could or not. And I was thinking, well, I don't know, I guess I could, I don't know. She said, Well, why don't you? So that stuck in my head as I'm driving that morning to the office, it was a 25-minute commute for me. I couldn't stop thinking about it, and I started to calculate in my head how it would look like, what if, and how I would arrange it. By the time I got to the office, I had decided that I'm just gonna start off by taking every other Monday off. So I have two long weekends per month, because that would be enough for me. And I just could take my son to school and then go have breakfast with my wife and just just do nothing other than just family and no work at all.

unknown 1:13:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:26

Not really checking emails or anything. And I walk in, I talk to Quinn, my coordinator. I said, Quinn, I'm gonna take every other Monday off. This is literally that morning. I walk into the office, she's like, What do you mean? You like I said, Well, can we do that? Can you do that? Do you think it will affect the business? She's like, thinks literally for three seconds, goes like, No, okay, yeah, you can do that. Cool, all right. And I'm like, Oh, that was easy. I thought I'm gonna hit resistance, and they're gonna say, Oh, you're crazy, you can't do that. What are we gonna do with patients? I it was the most liberating thing. It was just this weight was lifted off my shoulders. And I did it myself. No one did it for me. I made that this it was all a decision. You know what happened, Brittany, after that? This was two years ago. My revenue grew 25% that year, and I was more productive than ever, and at the same time more relaxed, subjectively actually feeling I'm working less, but then I made more money.

unknown 1:14:30

That's it.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:31

Everybody's better performance, what you just said. That's amazing.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:35

So that's what happened, and now I'm contemplating taking every Monday off. So, just to your point, is that we think we think if we do something, it will affect us negatively. We always are fixated of what are the negative things that happen from our decisions and never think what are the positives that we could be missing out based on our decisions that we're making. So it's all mindset, it's all in our heads.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:04

And I wish I had heard myself talk 20 years ago. I swear to God, I would have done it from day one.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:10

Yeah. Oh, that's great. I mean, yeah, you said what does it look like to be that guy that can take his kid to school and and have breakfast with your wife? This this is the way. And you did it. You made it happen. I mean, that's amazing. That's it's gotta be so freeing.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:23

So it it's so that's the if I were to give my 35-year-old self an advice, it would be that don't be afraid of making decisions because those decisions sometimes are the best you make. And then worst case scenario, I had thought myself too. Of course, I had thought it through. I said, hey, if it didn't work, I'll just go and work again on every Monday now. If it didn't work or it had a negative effect, I'm not gonna go hungry or bankrupt, I can just test it. So uh sometimes we just have to overcome our own inner resistance, and then everything will be fine. Well, this was really fun conversation. I personally learned a lot from you. I I it you're just so inspiring. You you you your journey is making me as a fellowship director even more so motivated. My fellows already getting annoyed uh hearing your name constantly. I I hope I don't uh pressure them too much, but I always tell them just just look at Britney, just if you do what she did, you'll be fine. Just go on our social media. Uh, she does great work. If if if you have any doubts whether you can do something or not, I like Zig Ziglar's quote that if you know someone that has done something, that means it's possible. And you're the perfect example. And I know you took that, obviously, yourself as well, and that's why you have reached, and I feel like you've only reached the tip of the iceberg. I can't, I'm really excited to just observe your journey. I'm one of your biggest cheerleaders, and at the same time, I'm proud that I had a small part in your journey. But uh, from what I hear, you're everything you've achieved so far just comes from who you are as a person, the humble and empathetic person you are, and the passion you possess for the field. And I think that's the secret sauce to success. It's not something magical, it's who you are and then who you get to be.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:24

Yeah, thank you so much.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:26

Yeah, thank you, Brittany, and uh stay in touch. And I can't wait to see you on further panels uh at the scientific meetings or cadaver courses, and hoping that you uh stay active. And I know you're busy, but you know, I'm counting on you.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:41

Yeah, amazing. Thanks so much.

here To Find Brittany And Reviews

SPEAKER_00 1:17:43

Good, thank you so much, Brittany. All right, everyone, episode's over. Uh, I hope you enjoyed my conversation with Dr. Brittany Aitson as much as I did. Uh, you can find her on Instagram under Dr. Brittany underscore cosmetic surgery, spelled dr. Brittany underscore cosmetic surgery. One word on Instagram. And if you enjoyed this conversation, don't forget to leave me a review on Apple Podcasts or leave comments on Spotify so that more people can view or listen to this podcast and benefit from it just like you did. Again, this is your host, Dr. Daria Hamra, and wishing you a great day, and until next time, bye bye.