In the first official episode of Creatives Going Viral, Sarah Berger interviews Victoria McDonald of Channel 4 News, to explore the facts behind the current COVID-19 Pandemic, and offer some hope in how things could start to get back to normal during this crisis.
Hosted by Jack Bowman, this series if an emergency podcast series for Creative Freelancers affected by current global events.
In the first official episode of Creatives Going Viral, Sarah Berger interviews Victoria McDonald of Channel 4 News, to explore the facts behind the current COVID-19 Pandemic, and offer some hope in how things could start to get back to normal during this crisis.
Hosted by Jack Bowman, this series if an emergency podcast series for Creative Freelancers affected by current global events.
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creatives going viral on emergency podcast Siri's for creative freelances during the covert 19 pandemic here to offer creative freelances, Help and hope. Creatives Going Viral Episode one Cove in 19. The fax Welcome to Creative's Going Viral on emergency. Pocar, Siri's, designed to help create a freelance, is doing the most extraordinary times known in modern history here to help you here to offer hope. My name is Jack Bowman, and I'm working with Sarah Burger of the Sorcerer's Club on Adam Morley, a theatre director and producer, to set up this emergency. Pocar Siri's to bring you all the information you need. This is our first official episode after the introduction of creatives going viral in Episode zero. If you've not heard that absurd, please cheque it out. It will tell you more about what we are doing and why we are doing this on DH. More importantly, how you condone this podcast? This episode is about looking into what Cove in 19 is, how it affects everyone, what the best course of action is, particularly for those of us who are more customer facing or client facing the most people in the world. For this episode, Sara reached out to Victoria McDonald Channel for Muses health and social care correspondent. In addition, she's a highly decorated medical journalist, having begun her career's health correspondent for The Sunday Telegraph. Just
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tell us a little bit about yourself, Victoria. I
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have beena health correspondent for more than 30 years, and I work Channel four news, as you say, and this is both an ex citing in a scary storey to be working on.
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She was kind enough to give Sarah some time to talk about CO 19 and give us the facts behind events. Indeed, the interview begins with Victoria clarifying for Sarah, who currently has Cody 19 something she wasn't aware
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ofthe. How are you, by the way? I'm fine,
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but you don't need to isolate from 14 days. You know that, don't you? If you have been symptomatic that unless Unless some and this somebody else in the house is a swell,
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how long do I have to isolate for? If I think I got it, which I do
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seven days 70. And even though you've got a cough, that cough will probably last for quite a long time. You just got official. The fever's gone down
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our thinking is that for us to start solving these problems, we need to understand what's causing them and how it is impacting our world as such. This is the first of three pre edited and record instalments where we offer that background. Victoria is one of the most respected medical journalists of our time, and we're honoured to have her here to sit down and talk to Sarah about the fax myths and misinformation around the current crisis. What's
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happening? This is all very useful, actually. What's happening is that I I feel okay and then suddenly it's as if I'm standing in a shower on. Then it goes away again. It's really kind of up and down. It's not consistent. So every time I think Oh, I've definitely turned a corner. Then it comes back again, and I actually think I have had this on and off for about three weeks. I think I had it quite badly before I knew what it wass as it were, and I was out about. At that point, we'll watch that day, so yeah, it's really because it's not because you can't get tested. Ah, you don't know. Do you have it. You don't know how long you might have had it for. You don't know if you're safe to go back out because you might get it. You might still have it. You know, I mean this the lack of testing is not actually, um, because how can we map it? How can we as individuals behave responsibly when you're that uncertain about what's actually
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going on? Yeah. I mean, it is a proper testing is a huge issue. And they have I received une email this morning, actually from public health, England's asking for test manufacturers to send in applications to have their test assessed. So there are a lot of people out there who have self testing kits, but what they don't know is what their reliability is. So I've been tested with the self testing kids, and it said, but I didn't have coronavirus, but also showed that I hadn't had it on that. The critical, but is what we need to know is how many people There are quite a few people who they think who are asymptomatic yl, who have such mild symptoms that they don't know. And so the self testing kits they hope will be able to show that you have had it. So therefore, if you're a doctor or whatever, you don't have to self isolate because you know that you're now safe because there's no evidence that you get re infected. But the self testing kits I think we will have
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the self testing kits within the next couple of weeks. Fantastic, because also, I think that would be very reassuring for people because then you could behave responsibly because you know what your status is on. Do you know whether, for example, I can go and seeing my 91 year old mother or not? You know who she has? A carer. But what happens if the carrot gets sick? And how will the cara I know if they're sick? If there's no testing, you know, that's so I That's actually good news, and I quite happily fork out for a self testing kit. If it could tell me if I've had it or if I've got it, and it will be if I've had it by that time, you can't
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do that now. Yeah, there are places in Harley Street that charging to hug between two and £300. Yeah, I wait if I was you Thie n hs bonds. But, um I mean, the test that I heads, I'm they that the manufacturers said that they think it's pretty reliable, but I'm not quite sure how reliable the you have Corona virus right now, parts of it wass, but certainly the second part of it to say that you've had us and that you have an immune response to you from that
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you're not a bet. What are any? Well, presumably because you've had it. How does that work if you're immune to it doesn't mean you can't pass it on to anybody else. Do we know that?
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Sorry. The words not immune. It's It'll come to me that once you've had it and once your symptoms have gone, they don't They think after seven days, you don't shed any more viral load, Which is why they're saying you could go back out after seven days.
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So with this in mind, Sarah asked again, Why this idea of 14 days being a standard isolation period?
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The only way the only reason you have Teo stay in for 14 days is if you live with somebody who has symptoms, So you need to stay at home 14 days from that because then they so that person goes for seven days. But then you have to go to seven days, thus the 14 days to make sure you haven't caught it. So that's the 14 day things come in.
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Seven
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days is usually fine.
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That is what I am about to rush out, get my tracksuit bottoms on and go out for some fresh. Yeah, you know, busy out
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there I went for a walk this morning.
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Physical health, while incredibly important, is just one part of this. But Sarah then turned to something, will be exploring in more depth in the next episode, asking about mental health.
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The other thing that I think is very interesting to is what it's going to do to people's mental health, people who have to stay inside for a long period of time because they have, Let's say, Children who have immunodeficiency on DH, so they've got to basically stay holed up for as long as humanly possible, as it were not to risk communicating with other people on DH. You know, the only thing that I could do on is the fact that I was in isolation for seven weeks in Bishkek with pneumonia with no drinkable tap water on. No way of communicating with anybody on Guy learned a huge amount from that. So I've got some idea of what this is going to feel like. Um, if you're one of the people who has to hunker down for considerably longer,
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how did you get through it mentally? I mean, what did you when Which Where did you get to on your debts of buying your depths to make it. All right.
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Well, the thing was, that part of it wass I was so unwell for a great part of it that I couldn't I could barely walk. So I watched the detector wrists on DH. I watched things that reminded me of home on DH kind of funny things online because because I was in a different time zone as well to everybody who I knew. And towards the end of it, I would sweat swaddle myself up and just go for walks. Um, not going. I mean, it was pneumonia. It wasn't contagious in this kind of way, but But I found that they need to exercise and get fresh air once you turned the corner. I mean, for a lot of it. I was sort of delirious, actually, on DH. So what I think it did do for me? Is it on? I'm not a person who is good on their own is it taught me to accept my own company. It I did do things. I sort of did some sewing and things. But I also learned that you don't have to be achieving things. When you're sick, you're allowed to just be sick on DH. That's quite crucial, actually, Teo hoist in. I think to forgive yourself for not being able to be an active part of society in the way that you're accustomed to and that you're still kinda valid. And I listen to a lot of podcasts because watching things was harder than just listening Two things. I
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think that I think a lot of people are very worried about the mental health aspect of this because, you know, if you live alone anyway and then you know you can't go out. I mean, it could be really debilitating. Yes, I I thinkit's I've bean. I've bean going through my list of friends you live alone? I think I'm just gonna make sure I bring them. Robin, you're texting, you know, So that so that you get a hair. A voice?
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Totally. One of the things I'm trying to set up alongside this is doing something that can be sent into care homes on DH, particularly old and isolated people or maybe refugees with Children. Sort of like a little entertainment package, but also something where we can buddy up where we could have a conversation with those people. So I'm sort of in the process of trying to get hold ofthe different organisations to say OK, practically, how do we do this? And I've got some people lined up who are actors and so on who old people specifically will know so that it will be somebody they've seen or on the telly all their lives, reaching out to them and saying hello and seeing them a song or reading them a poem or just asking them about their life. No making life. Well, the social communication is one of the things that we're going to have to keep going to sustain us through the fear of this on the fact that our lives quite possibly changed for other?
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I think so. I think so. It feels like that
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some away for the better. Well, you never know. I wondered what? Because we don't have proper sort of tracking off what's happening here. What is your take on? What is, you know, where are we? Actually, in the kind of spectrum of what's going on, How far into it are we? Do you Do you think from what you're you've been able to gather?
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Well, we were told last week that were probably 2 to 3 weeks behind Italy on DH Londoners worse than anywhere else in the country, which is to be expected because we're such an international city. Everything about closing the pub's last night and restaurants and so on is a strategy to try and flatten the epidemiological curve so that we can try and keep as many people out of hospital as possible. I was filming in a hospital yesterday in Kingston, and they've had 18 cases already, but they said Kingston as a bar Oh, for some reason, hasn't had as many as many cases as the rest of London, and they don't know why on the other hand, Northward Park, which is a northwest London, had to declare a critical emergency the day before yesterday because they ran out of beds. So you can see that my understanding is most of the London hospitals are either full or on the edge of being full with covered 19 patients. It's, you know, we're near when their butts, maybe another couple of weeks and then all hell will break loose in terms ofthe the hospital's not. Yeah, I mean, it is quite scary I for the first time this week, a za journalist, you're always looking. You're always looking at the Storey, sort of as if it's over there, you know you're reporting on it, but there's a slight distance. So all these years that I've been doing house reporting, and I've done, you know, lots of storeys on HIV or TB or whatever, but you always felt you have a degree of control over that. You know, not contract HIV, your TV or whatever in this one. You know that it's not over there. It's about everybody around you, including yourself, and that's what makes it so scary. Even though I know I'm a healthy, you know I'm under 60. But you know, I know that the that the odds off me becoming seriously ill are quite low. But the fact is, and this is the problem that they're having and this is why they closed down the bars is because young people with because there's been so much messaging saying, You know, if you're an 80 year old man with coronary heart disease, you know you've got a very high chance of becoming of diet or a higher chance of dying, and they were saying a lot of young people, we're not taking it seriously. So there were still going into bars and restaurants, and whatever. The fact is, if you getters, you might be fine. But you might pass it on to your grandparent's Exactly, you know, and that's what they plan to change the messaging off.
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How long do you think this partials? I think we're not. I personally feel that we're not as far into the shutdown. Is is going to happen in London because it's got two. I figure Teo, as you say, suppress that That rising curb. You know, I wonder how long we think this potentially could go on for on. Of course. This is our podcast for freelance creatives on DH. Everybody, all of us are instantly out of work. All of our buildings and so on posed. We're we're frightened on top of that, because we don't know. And there is no provision for us as yet in any of thie budgetary measures that have been taken or mean no provisions. So we need to We, I suppose, from a point of view of trying to figure out how to move forward on DH survive long enough for when this does finally died down, which, of course, it will eventually. Is there any word is how long realistically that might be.
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So yesterday they released the one thing I'll say about this. I've never known such openness in a way and such transparency in how they're making that decision. So we've had access now to a lot of them modelling the behavioural science, all the advice that the various experts are giving the government and how the government is working out its decisions Now some of these decisions are political, there's no doubt about that. But the modelling that we were shown yesterday said that shut down in this form, it's gonna go on for a year. Christ, that's if different points. They will lift it so there will be severe locked out or they'll be severe isolation and quarantine and so on, and then they'll raise it up again. But because what they don't know about this box and this is the critical point is they don't know. They hope that it will die down in the summer like a flu does. But there's no evidence that that's going to happen. And, of course, if it dies down here because it's summer here, it's still winter in Australia and New Zealand and so on. So you know Andi, with the way of international travel, it can still keep spreading so that this was the advice. It doesn't mean to say that that's what's gonna happen, but they think in order to contain this and get on top of it, they are gonna have to have some pretty strict measures in place for a year. I was quite depressed when I saw that, but
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that's the advice that's
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been given to the government. There was some very there were some very cheerful news in the midst of all that is that they don't think there's gonna be mass rioting.
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Well, that's good.
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And the behavioural model is also said that they expect to see a man increase in altruistic behaviour. Which part? Seeing yet? If I don't know if you've been to the supermarket where you probably haven't you haven't. You haven't.
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I want food
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market the other day and it was stripped bare. It was like it was like a plague of Locusts had gone through. I came out with the packets off venison steak and a green pepper. I'm still not sure how that combination is going to go,
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but I'm looking forward to the recipe. Yeah, I think
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I do genuinely think that there is an opportunity for somebody out there to put together, you know, almost like those wartime. But, you know, what can you do with your rations? I actually think there's an opportunity for somebody clear that to put together. You know, you've got a tin of tomatoes and the 10 of chickpeas and you're covered. What are you going to do with it?
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There are quite a lot of their online cocktails for because I've spent a lot of time sitting here, Andi. I belong to quite a lot of groups. There are a lot of incredibly supportive creative groups springing up all over the place with loads of advice on DH. Lots of kind of fun things like Look, you, Khun, tour around all these museums, virtually here's access to loads of free books, his access to free films, you know. But in the midst of all of this is a lot of kind of hands on survival stuff. Particularly, of course, for those people who I'm not going to be able to afford to buy any food. I mean, you know, when you say this will continue in one way or another on and off. I mean, I have to say for us, that's the worst possible scenario because it means we'll never be able to get things up and going because nobody would trust how long that's You can't plan that far ahead, and there'll be no money to do
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it. No, no, that's the worrying thing. Let me go back to the testing. Actually, I finally remembered the word. So what they want to do is they want to develop some home testing kits because they do need to know how many people in the population are infected and what they really want to do is to develop in antibodies test to show that you have already had the infection. And once you determine that, then you're safe to go out and as more and more people could be seen. So that's almost the holy Grail of all this. At the moment, that's what they're working really hard on trying to develop, you know, not just for the likes of you who need to get out there and do some work, but particularly for healthcare staff. You know, if they if they have to keep self isolating because you know, somebody and their families got sick. I mean, I've got I've got some friends were both the doctors at different hospitals, and they're both isolated because one has one has that, and the other one has to has to suffer like that. So that's taken that doctor that who was desperately needed out of the system now. And when I had the test, it showed that I didn't have the antibodies, which meant that I haven't had covered 19 yet
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on Yes, Victoria offered a glimmer of hope for every professional in all of this,
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but that they are working really, really hard on that on that. That will be really helpful for you guys as well. But knowing that you could get out safely, you could have a theatre company made up off covered 19 antibody players.
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Yeah, and then everybody would rush out to get it in order to be able to be part of a company. I mean exactly.
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Inflexibly that. You know, there have been these jokes about, you know, having like measles parties, whatever. That's what. They really don't want people to do that. You know, sometimes there is it. I mean, sometimes I feel like myself. You know, if I could get it now, I'm gonna be sick for seven days. And although this is the storey of my entire life, I want to be well, for when? For the next few weeks, you know? So there is a bit of me that thinks that one going together, and I'm reasonably you know, I'm going on the tube every day because that's the only way I could get to work a CZ filming in the hospital yesterday. You know, it's reasonably risky behaviour don't go to bars or pops anymore, of course. Badly. Oh, my goodness. The the in Sainsbury's, the wine shelves stripped bare.
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Oh, my God, I'm going to go to the local. Now that I know I could go out, the first thing I'm going to do is go to my local off licence. He'll have stuff because they because where I live and some people don't tend to use that very much. So I'll go down and get. I'm just going to stock up basically well. The other thing I did think, actually, in terms of this business of the social isolation, one of the things we're going to do is as soon as we're able, we're going to open up our theatre space, get a camera crew into film alive, as it were, three d. They run a platform where they upload three D shows onto the platform. People could stream it so we will find another way off getting people out there so that they can put it onto a platform for future or Teo, charge of price for people to watch the streaming off it. Or, you know, I think we've got to think outside the box and ours to how we survive. If it's going to be, I mean, you know, Edinburgh will be cancelled without question. You know, there's rumours already that it fundamentally has Bean, you know, So we can't do what we do, or it's very hard to do what we do and eat in the privacy of our own home. So we've got to work up ways to do that. Now I think thank God for the technology, because that makes it possible to do things whether or not like,
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I don't know if you've been watching Channel four news, but some we now have one presenter presenting from home, and we have the technology to do that now and well, we have a ljust had to downloads. Um, the thing called why're you and which means that we can broadcast from home if we have to? Because, of course, you have to try and keep the news going. Yes. So, last night we had Krishnan Guru Murthy in his home and Matt Frei in the studio with me, um, the and then on DH. Then all our guests are not coming in anymore. They're all skyping in or or zooming. Yes, I think you may be using now, Tio doing and really good quality. I mean, we we never used to do Skype interviews because they weren't off come quality. So you couldn't broadcaster, But now they're just fantastic.
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Yeah, So I mean, there is. I'm looking for the hope here on DH as well as as I mean, the advice is good and you've been so clear, which really helps. I think, you know, you see so much stuff across the Internet and word of mouth and so on. It's very good to get sort of clear a clear opinion from somebody who's actually looking at the reports and talking to the right people and so on. And I think so. My takeaway thing from this is that I understand the kind of herd immunity theory which is the antibody thing, but that we we we've sort of rewritten that slightly in terms of Let's not that everybody get it and a 1,000,000 people die, and then it will be all right. It's it's it's a bit more sophisticated than that now and that that we will hopefully be able to get hold of our own tests on DH. People will have to be repeatedly test if they don't test positive initially, were they? Yeah, the
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test. I did. I mean, this was for T. V. So it wasn't because I thought I had it. It made for very good TV. Actually, it's quite nerve racking, but the Esso, they say you do it round about between day three and five from when you've got if if it doesn't test positive, you do it again on day seven on. If it doesn't test positive, then you probably don't have it. You probably do have a cold. But Mohr importantly is you're looking for the antibody. Um, to say that you have had us on. I mean, you know, like many people, I'm not terribly good at being told what to do. And the thought of self isolating, Um, especially as much as I love her with a 10 year old is you know, But it is. It is so serious. Yeah, there is. No, there are no two ways about it. I mean, when I was filming in the hospital yesterday, there were five people in intense of cow with nurses, you know, behind massive shields and whatever. And you know, you just think those those people two or three weeks ago was wandering around fine, unknowable, intensive care, you know, with an
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atypical pneumonia. Yeah. Good. You
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know, you don't need to be careful because you're because, you know, you get you've had pneumonia already. You know, and and go. I've got some other advice, actually, for people that don't smoke. And I say this is an ex smoker. Don't smoke because because it goes into the lungs on DH, they you know, there will be some questions once this is all over months, they've been out to do the epidemiological studies properly about whether a defective Chinese men mohr because they smiled. I mean, there's no evidence of that right now that you have to say it seems
spk_2: 29:05
I mean, I I gave up smoking when my father had me. Sethi. Leo, just before we got into helium, actually, on DH, if I had ever been inclined to go back onto the fax watching somebody with an oxygen mask and things in their home is enough to stop you permanently. So I haven't smoked for 15 years. But I did smoke on DH. You know, I now look at people at even with the vaping thing. You think? Yes, but you're hiking in alien substances into your lungs. And also you're doing these great big, gulping big breath thing surrounded by other people in red, in relative. You know, people huddle when they smoke, don't they? When the that was the hardest thing about giving up smoking has actually I think I know there was. The more interesting people at the party was crowded on the balcony. Thank you so much, You two. Yes. Don't test it in. Thank you, Tory. Thank you. Bye bye
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again. Our thanks to Victoria McDonald and to Sarah for arranging that into B. We hope you found it helpful in the next episode will talk to Collin Seema about the direct impact on our mental health and how we can cope and any episode after that we'll be looking at the impact on the creative industry as a whole. But then after that, well, it's up to you. We've said this many times before. You want this to be your podcast? Buy up. So, for we want you to be the ones reaching out running interviews. Speaking to the people. You need this podcast to give a voice to. You want voices from all communities big and small. If you have someone you can interview to help your fellow creatives, please reach out to us and we'll help make it happen. You know the content you need on this podcast is here to carry that content. Email us creatives going viral at gmail dot com. Creatives going viral at gmail dot com Tweet us at creatives going and find us on Facebook Creatives Go viral, please subscribe. Spread the word. Spread the hope and not the virus until next time you've been listening to Creative's going viral on emergency podcast. Siri's giving you hope on help. Tell your friends about us. Tell them to subscribe. Tell everyone to email us creatives going viral at gmail dot com. Subscribe to our feet for more episodes. Find us on Twitter creatives going Find us on Facebook. Creatives going viral Spread the word, Not the virus