Love the Idea of Health and Freedom? From Yoga Instructor to Marketing Genius, Meet Abigail | TNE018

In this weeks episode, we’re joined by Abigail, a yoga teacher turned full time marketing genius in the wellness space. What started off as some freelance work for her employer at a yoga studio, blossomed in to helping tons of clients achieve results in their own businesses. She creates dreams and inspires others to see that anything is possible. If you’re thinking about starting your own business, are curious about getting clients effortlessly, or just interested in hearing about the freedom that comes with creating your own online business, tune in to today’s episode.

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Today's Guest

Abigail Schippers
Abigail was a yoga teacher, highly trained and passionate about her craft yet no matter how hard she worked, she just barely paid the bills. So, she founded Bad Marketing Company.

Today Bad Marketing Company is a fast growing and well loved marketing company for people that don't like marketing, but are ready to try out AUTHENTIC, CONNECTION-BASED marketing.

Come find us at:
The Nomadic Executive - Nomadables

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Transcript

It's not a journey, every journey ends, but we go on twirled turns. When we turn with him, plans, disappear, dreams, takeover, wherever I go. There you are. My love my fate, my fortune.

Thanks for tuning in to the nomadic spirit podcast, hosted by Omar of www.nomadables.com Join Omar while he speaks with leading digital entrepreneurs here to help you transition into the age of remote work and digital nomadism all while helping you design your life to be happier, healthier, and full of freedom. And now here's your host, Omar Mo

Welcome back. Hope you're doing well. That quote in the intro that was narrated by Brad Pitt cologne commercial nearly seven years ago. I script it cause it sounds that quote really nails down the essence of a journey. Today's guest has a journey of her own to share with us. We're joined by Sophie, from Switzerland, a talented author. Who's deep into writing her second book. So come join us while we dive deep into her stories of adventure and heartbreak. Trust me, you're not gonna want to miss this episode of the nomadic spirit podcast. Here we go. I see that you wrote your first book.

Yeah, I did. Um, well I've I published the first one a couple of years ago. Um, I didn't do too much marketing for it to be honest because it's marketing is not really my thing. I'm good. I'm going to try to do that better for the second one.

It was about getting your message out in the first place, right? I mean, of course the money is important and whatnot, like whatever you're going to be making from it, but you didn't write it for that reason. Oh yeah, no, of course. What was that first story about?

Um, so after high school, I didn't really know what to do with my life and I didn't want to start studying, um, right away. I felt like I wanted to know myself and the world a bit more first. So I went traveling for five months by myself. Um,

So you get a bit wait before you continue to hear you're going to get onto the full story because that story is amazing.

Yeah, yeah, no, that that's actually the story I told you. He was actually another trip. So that was my very first trip. It was four, it was five months. Okay. Um, in eight countries and, and yeah, it completely changed. That was my very first trip that I'm actually not writing another book about, about another that happened after that.

Right. So that first book was about the first five month trip that you had.

Yeah, exactly. Um, uh, so it was eight countries in Africa, Asia and Australia, and yeah, it was basically the first time I was confronted two very different realities than mine. Cause you know, I, I grew up in a very privileged world in Switzerland. Um, so yeah, that changed a lot in my life to see how different life can be lived, you know?

Yeah. It always does. Right. The first moment that you get out of that bubble that you were born and raised in and you start seeing how different people live and how different things are out there, it really opens up your mind. I bet doesn't it.

Yeah. Crazy.

Let's talk a little bit about where you're from. So you're Swiss.

I am, yeah, I'm actually half British because my mother's English, but I've always lived in Switzerland.

I see. And is it like a small town in Switzerland?

Um, yeah, I'd say me Jim town. It's a ski resort. So it gets really busy in the winter, but the rest of the year it's really quiet.

Um, it must be in one of those very beautiful mountainous spots that you see really nice images on Google love

It is. Yeah. And seeing the beautiful,

I know whenever, uh, like you searched beautiful places in the world on Google, then anyone who's traveled probably can relate to this or anyone. Whoever wants to travel can relate to this. But if you search like beautiful places around the world, Switzerland will probably be like number one or number two on that

For sure. Yeah.

Describe the scene around you a little bit to me. Just so I can like visualize it in my head

Mountains. Basically. I have a nice view on it on a big open Valley. Yeah. Colorful and green.

Oh my God. That's like countryside porn in my head.

Yeah. And it's still a bit of snow on top of some mountain.

Oh my God. That sounds like something out of storybook. That's amazing. I've always wanted to go to Switzerland. I'm going to make it out there one day for sure.

Oh yeah. You should come visit me.

Absolutely. How so? Whenever you left high school and you actually decided to go out there and travel, um, was that your first time ever doing like a solo trip like that? Or was that your first time ever even stepping out of the country?

Um, no. I actually traveled quite a bit, um, growing up with, but always with my parents and always within Europe. So yeah, it was the first time I left Europe and the first time I went away alone

Back to that, like, how'd you feel before you were getting on that solo trip? Especially as a girl, you know, like as a dude, I was nervous, you know, and I know girls have that extra layer of nervousness that can come along with that. So how'd it go?

Oh yeah. It was terrifying, especially that my very first destination was, um, Ghana. It was going to be a village in the middle of nowhere. So yeah. Yeah. It was, I was okay until about a week before I left where it hit me that I was actually doing this and yeah, it was insane. I was, I was freaking out. I was like, what the fuck am I doing

When reality starts setting in? And it starts becoming more real.

Yeah. It was really scary.

W what'd you do to like prepare and how was it like you got on your airplane and then like, when did it hit you? Like, Hey, I'm almost there.

Yeah. I think the first airplane I stepped in, I was like, yes, there's no going back now. And then yeah, you just don't, you don't have any other choice, but to go for it, despite the fear.

Absolutely. You got to fight through the fear right now. That's, that's the main thing. I mean, life is full of suffering. Life is full of misery. You gotta find someone that you can chase after happiness and pass through and push through the fear to actually do anything fulfilling and meaningful in life. Now, when you landed in Ghana, what was your first reaction?

Um, well, some people were supposed to come pick me up and at first they weren't there. So yeah, that was pretty scary. I had like all the worst scenarios going through my mind, but I was going to get kidnapped or something. Um, yeah, I actually, I was really quite shocked by the difference of just the infrastructure of the airports was already a big change for me, you know? Um, uh, it was just a lot less, you know, fancy and curious and in Switzerland I'd say, and I think it's, at that time, I understood just how different everything was going to feel from that point. Like, I wouldn't have any, anything familiar around me, you know,

Would you call it culture shock?

Yeah. Yeah, totally.

So this is something that I personally have never experienced, but that's because I don't think I've been into enough of a, um, I guess, different country to actually experience it. But in terms of like someone who's coming from Switzerland, a K like the middle of Europe in the most beautiful place go into like Ghana, Africa, like how big of a culture shock was it? And did you feel any repercussions from that?

Yeah. Yeah. It was like night and day. Um, it was very overwhelming at first. Um, but I actually surprisingly, I, I got used to it pretty fast actually, because I felt, you know, I wasn't that happy as a teenager. And suddenly there was a lot less things to think about, um, to care about whether it's material things or just, you know, usual worries of everyday life and not having all of that, I think was the biggest change for me. And it was incredibly liberating.

I absolutely know that feeling. Trust me, it's just kind of, all of it kind of melts away. You know, you're not the here anymore. Like you don't have to worry about pleasing somebody else or someone else's expectations of you or, I mean anything really, and you're in this different country and you're able to carve your own path and do whatever, but it's all up to you. Right. You can make it what bad or you can make it good. But you realize just how much of that responsibility just lies on you instead of someone else at that point.

Yeah. And I think that's why so many travelers fall in love with traveling, right? Like your blank page.

I had this discussion actually with one of my other guests, actually. I think it was the last that I spoke to a couple of days ago and her and I, we were talking about different reasons why people start their journey in the first place. Right. And some people might have more than one reason. Some people might have reasons that combined with others, but it's usually reasons like one they're trying to get away from all the things that are holding them back, back home. So sort of escape. Uh, another reason could be that their incense they're chasing adventure and they're just really bored at home. Another reason could be maybe they fear day, another kind of person that they, that run after fear. So they just naturally go run after that. And maybe they want more reference points. Maybe they want to find themselves in the most cliche way. There's always a bunch of different reasons that people come up with. Right. I mean, for me it was a Mesher reasons. What was it for you? Was it simply the escapism? What was it more than that?

Um, yeah, no, I think escapism was definitely a part of it always, but, um, one of my main motivations for traveling, I actually was to go see the world for what it really is, you know, and not what I been told about it or my life. I really had that curiosity, curiosity. Yeah. The truth.

I can always appreciate when someone chases after that, I really can, because especially coming from America right now and you see what's going on here, most people, I wouldn't say most, but at least some people, a good handful of people are stuck in their own bubble. And they have the views that they have because their entire environment, all they've ever known their entire life, uh, points towards hatred and negativity and racism, whatever else, negative traits that you can find in this world. And I, I honestly thoroughly believe if those people actually went out and did a trip like you did, they would see the world completely differently and they would come back and be much happier and open people.

Yeah. I completely agree. Yeah.

So you stayed there for eight months, you said Sophie. Okay.

Um, no, that trip was fine.

Five months kind of walk me through it. Like how was it, what was your, what was your favorite time when you were out there? Any memories that off the top of your head that you remember?

Oh yeah. I had loads of nice memories in, in West Africa. I, I volunteered. Um, so yeah, it was my first time teaching and I found myself like in front of 50 kids, it was, it was quite crazy that, um, it's like completely improvising. Like now years later I realized that there are some problematic things with that, you know, to go volunteer in a country where you know nothing about, and you have no, you know, no skills to really offer, but on a very personal level, it was, it was super fun too. It was like exploring, you know, my hidden potential. And I just, yeah, I think a lot of my best memories relate to the fact that, you know, I'd already, I don't always see myself as quite weak and Sydney. I proved to myself that I could do all these things by myself and I had it in me. You know

What you mean? So you felt a bit meek when you were younger a bit more, not independent, I guess. And then when you finally got out there, you were able to prove your own strength to yourself. Yeah. That must've been a great feeling.

It was amazing. It, yeah.

So did you build off that feeling? Did you feel stronger and stronger as time went by?

Uh, while that was traveling yet. And then when I went home, that was a different story.

Get there in just a second. So after you got back home, you wrote this book, what kind of push you towards to write a book? And this is for my audience, anyone that's ever thought of writing a book or someone that wants to write their own story or even fictional stories, what kind of pushy towards that?

Um, at first it was mainly because, um, I had all these crazy stories inside of me, all these, yeah. This life changing experience, um, that I, I felt I can just express in a, in a normal conversation, like when people asked me how so, how was it? I didn't feel like answering that question could just really explain it. So I really had that desire to keep a trace of what happened and, and to be able to explore it deeply, because that's my way of expressing myself. I've always loved writing

Expression and reflecting for you

And reflecting. Yeah.

So you pretty much wrote your journey or an account of it face to face between a book and that's the way you kind of understood it better.

Yep. Interesting. Awesome.

How'd you publish it? I saw it was a hard cover.

Yeah. Um, well that, that happens years later actually. Um, that I could maybe tell you more about with more contexts. Yeah. I published it.

So let's start off with this incredible story that you've told me something that kept me, the words themselves kept me on the edge of my seat the entire time I was reading it. Uh, so just for my audience here, a little bit of context, uh, I reached out to this Facebook group to see what kind of nomads and interesting stories as they usually do to find interesting guests and Sophie comments saying, Hey, yeah, I try, I studied a bit and I traveled and I'm like, ah, that doesn't sound too. That doesn't sound too interesting. And then like someone comments on there saying, yeah, you should listen to Sophie story. It's amazing. So my, Hey Sophie, like I I'm, I'm interested, like what's, what's your story about? And she writes out this beautiful story you're about to hear and it's just, it's heartbreaking. It's exciting. It's amazing. And it was just expressed so beautifully. And I don't want to put any expectations on Sophie right now. Just here. Just hear what she has to say. I think it's incredible.

Alright. Thank you. Um, so yeah. W where do you want me to start,

Start from after those five months of travel, you came back home, that's it?

Okay. Yeah. So I came back home and so I was ready to start university in Switzerland. Um, and yeah, so I, I did that. I studied for six months and it was a hard time, you know, because I, I felt so different than before, but I had a really hard time expressing it with people around me and I felt just

More shy or,

Um, I just felt like I was on another level than everybody else. Like I was preoccupied. Yeah. Cause like suddenly I'd been confronted to, you know, all the inequalities in the world and I could see everything that was wrong with our society and our individualism and you know, all these things. Yeah. And yeah. Um, I was going a bit crazy over it, you know, and I was unhappy again. And I was thinking, this is horrible. This is going to be the, the next, at least the next five years of my life. Right. And, you know, I I've had a glimpse of what it felt like to be really happy and free. Um, and now I have to give that up. So yeah, it was a bit chatting, challenging. And then I had a break for Christmas for three weeks and I went on loud, online and I found these really cheap plane tickets to Marco. I was like, you know what, fuck it. I'm just going to go. I need to see something else. I need to go somewhere else. Um, and I went and I, I found those feelings again of being free and being myself, um,

You rediscovered the adventure. Yeah.

And, um, while I was there, I met a guy who was studying long distance. He was traveling and studying at the same time. And I was like, yeah, okay. I was like, wow, that's possible. You can do that. It's like, why am I studying in Switzerland if she can, if I could be traveling instead. Um, yeah. And, and, and there was on the door of the hostel where I met that guy. There was a little sentence written. It said, why not? And that sentence just stuck with me. I came back to Switzerland and I, and it kept going through my mind, like, why not? Why, why wouldn't I do it

Crazy how life works like that. I, you see one small thing and it sticks with you.

Yeah. Yeah. It's pretty crazy. Um, and it turned out that that guy I had met was actually some kind of, um, I dunno, sociopath or something like that. He was a pathological liar. So he wasn't actually studying and traveling at the same time that, yeah, that was all bullshit. But I thought, you know, if he didn't do it, that doesn't mean I can't go ahead and create that. Yeah. Um, so yeah, it took, it took a while. It took few months of a lot of confusion and old, but I, I decided I would do it. So I tattooed the sentence. Why not? On my wrist in Moroccan, Arabic and the next day. Yeah.

Sick.

Yep.

So how'd you walk me through that process there, where how'd you find them how to do school online? Like, was there a school that you joined or, yeah, so I could have done it with

A Swiss school, but they didn't have a lot of options. So I, I looked further and I found a, uh, a university from the UK called the open university and they've been doing that for a really long time. And yeah, I just, it's just by looking online that I found it,

Do they accept international students everywhere, all over the world?

Um, well for my program, the only requirement was that I'd be in Europe for the start of it. Yeah. But I think some courses you can, you can follow from abroad too.

So for anyone of my European listeners check out open university, if you want to study and travel right before you carry on with your story. I remember when he told me about that risk tattoo, that reminded me of something that I did to, I w it's on my leg right here, it's on my ankle, but I, uh, there was a moment where I was traveling and, um, it was just sort of moment where I felt, I was kind of forgetting the reason why I was traveling, you know, I was just traveling and it was, uh, it was one of those moments where six months in. And I think it happens to a lot of people when you start missing your family and stuff. And, uh, just so happened. Like around that time, there was a guy, a friend of mine that I knew who bought like a tattoo machine from eBay.

And, uh, he just sat in the hostel downstairs, like after like four shots of ARCA and started tattooing tattooing himself and other people. And I was like, there's no way, hell, I'm gonna let this guy talk to me. He's drunk. But I was like, give it to me, give me the machine. So I take it from him and I, I first I practiced on a banana peel and then I was like, okay, this doesn't look too hard. You know? So I wrote on my ankle and I wrote the letters now just N O w. And, uh, it was just because I'd seen it somewhere on a YouTube video years ago. Absolutely. Like we're talking like five, six years ago. I'd watched some dude with a tattoo there. I'm like, you know what? I think that's super cool just to like, remind you to live in the precedent. And ever since then that stuck with me and I wrote it then, so

That's cool. I like that story. So you actually Ted tattooed it yourself

That it was in a good spot. I felt like it wasn't painful at all. Um, I mean, mind you, I had like four drinks by that time. Yeah. But, uh, yeah, it turned out decent, you know, and it's still there. It hasn't faded or anything, so I'm pretty happy about it. Nice. Uh, funny story, actually that the girl that I ended up staying with for a year after that, that I met literally like a week after that she was there in the same room while to watch me tattoo myself. And she was like, when I saw you tattoo yourself and this was before even her and I had met, she said, I thought you were so fucking dumb. Did she change her mind? Apparently funny how life

Works. Huh? Yeah. Alright. So let's carry on with your story here. So you tattooed those letters or those words on your wrist and joined the university and you set out where'd you go?

I actually didn't join it right away. Cause by then it was the summer holidays. Right. So at first, so my first, um, goal was to go to Russia and take the transsiberian. Um, yeah, there was a lunch.

So that like for an American, what is the trans Siberian? Exactly. What is it like?

Um, so it's, it's basically a train that goes from one in the Russia to the other end. Yeah.

Okay. Interesting.

I think about 8,000 kilometers in total or something like that, it just cross all of Russia and it, if you do it in one go, it takes a week. And so you speak on the train and yeah.

Is it like a nice train or is it one of those trains that you kind of just hop on and hop off? Like you see on the movies where you're kind of living in this cargo box where like one of those things on your, on your shoulder?

Yeah. No, it's actually not that bad, but there's different classes. You can keep in the room. I took the third class and you, you share with 54 other people, 53 people. That's quite an interesting experience. Most people who are in that, this train are Russians, you know? So you get, you get a nice glimpse into there. Did you talk to him? Yeah. I printed some pictures before going and I I'd show them pictures because a lot of them didn't speak English and I can, but we always found ways to communicate. It was fun.

So you were on the trans Siberian for how long?

Um, that I did it in one month and I stopped in several places. Okay. Yeah. Uh, there was, uh, I took some time to get to Russia to, I worked in a farm in Lithuania for a month then I hitchhiked the Baltic countries.

Oh, tell me a little bit more about that. What were you doing in a farm on Lithuania? So did you left Switzerland, right? Did you fly to Lithuania first? Did you drive?

Yeah. No, actually I, I, I feel first to London to see my brother cause he was living there then from LA, from London. I flew to Vilnius in Lithuania. Interesting. Yeah. And there, yeah, I wanted to do a, uh, where experience, you know, is volunteering experiences. I'd never done that. And I was really curious, so yeah. That's why I worked in a farm there for months.

It's kinda like woofing, right? Like you work on a farm and they give you like commendation

In food. Yeah, exactly interesting. Okay.

And yeah, and then I had to go to Russia. So I had, I just had to cross the Baltic countries and I thought it would be more fun to take that.

Did you have any weird experiences trying to hitchhike?

Yeah. Always. They can always be a bit weird, but also you meet really nice people. I think the most annoying is when people take you and then they leave you in the middle of nowhere on the side of a highway or something, or really dangerous spots.

Peter had actually had people do that. Yeah.

Yeah. That's fine. One weird experience I had too was, um, this, this guy who was an ex cop and he used to be alcoholic and um, he found Jesus and, and now he, you know, he's Turkey different and like, so the whole way for like over an hour, he was telling me about Jesus and it was quite, yeah,

It was always one of those always. Yeah. That's funny. I remember I was at a beach one time in New Zealand and there was a guy who came up and they always get you so like innocently, right. They'll come up to you and they'll be like, Hey, like how you doing? How's your day? You know, I'm like, Oh look, this is a nice guy coming to talk to me. I'm going to have a nice conversation with them, you know? And he has, he's like a surfer guy and was a surfboard. And I was like, yeah, like how are the waves? And all of a sudden he's like, yeah, the waves are great. Cause it's Jesus. And I'm like, what do you mean? Of course he goes out and he has a little booklet in his pocket too. Of course. And he brings that out. And next thing I know, I'm in a conversation about Jesus for the next 30 minutes kind of how it goes.

Yeah. Those conversations are always really long to get out of them.

It's like, it's like, they're going to try to change your mind. And do you think they're going to finally change it after 30 or 40 minutes instead of the first five? It's interesting.

[inaudible]

Jesus cop pick you up and then he dropped you off. And what else? Like you hitched her.

It was the same guy by the way, who dropped me off in the middle of nowhere.

It was huh. Interesting.

But yeah. Anyways, so, um, so yeah, after that, uh, so I, I crossed Russia. Uh, I ended up in Mongolia. Um, I did a horse strike there, which, which was one of my dreams. It was really special. Yeah. Crosscheck.

He rode a horse for the first time.

Uh, no, no. I used to ride horses as a kid. Um, and yeah, we found, I met some French girls there and, and we, we found a guide and went around the Lake for five days, just riding horses and camping. Oh, that sounds amazing. Oh yeah. Yeah. It was, I think it was really one of the best times in my entire life. It was really special. That's awesome. Um, yeah. And I felt, I remember feeling really at peace at that time in my life, you know, really happy with my life choices and yeah, no regrets. It was really cool.

Sounds good.

Um, and so, so yeah, so that, at that moment my studies were going to start, so I had to go back to Europe. I had to be in Europe for the start of my studies. Okay. So, yeah. Sorry, I'm going through a lot of details, but I will, I love the details. We're sure we'll have time to say everything. So I'm giving you the big lines. Um, so yeah, so I, I, I basically kept on traveling like that for a while. Um, first in Europe then I, I went back to Asia to follow a guy I'd met in Mongolia and I kind of had a huge crush on how it,

So you went back to Europe, I've kind of lost you here. So you went back to Europe and then after your study started in Europe, you went to Mongolia after that?

No, sorry. I was in Mongolia before, but while I was in Mongolia, I met a guy there and he continued traveling through Asia. So yeah. Where was he from? Um, England.

England. Interesting. Okay.

Um, yeah, so I traveled in Europe for a while. Did, uh, another few I hitchhiked I worked in a construction site there, like a few experiences like that. And then I, I went back to South Korea to join that guy. Um, he kind of ended up breaking my hearts a little. Um, but I think that made me understand that at that point I was starting to look for more, you know, like traveling solo was really fun, but I, by that point I had been doing that for seven or eight months.

So you wanted to share the experience with someone?

Yeah. And I felt like, yeah, I needed a bit more meaning. So whether it was sharing it with someone or doing something else, I just felt like looking for more. I think that's why you, you know, to South Korea for that, I don't think it was really about that guy.

It was more about chasing something. I get it. Yeah.

Um, so then it was Christmas and I, I went home for a couple of weeks for Christmas and um, yeah, that's when things changed a bit because, because I decided I wanted to give more meaning into what I was doing. That's when I decided I wanted to volunteer, um, for a good cause. And I decided to go to Palestine. Palestine. Yeah. The Westpac. Yeah. Yeah. That's what everybody said this time. Are you crazy? Um, but yeah, it was also part of the whole, you know, looking, um, wanting to discover the world for what it really is.

And you can't see the good without seeing the bad too.

Yeah. And also there's often a lot of goods and places where we think it's all bad. You know, I had a terrible image of Palestine growing up because of what I heard from the media. And by that point, I kind of realized that a lot of things like being told in my life weren't necessarily true. Right. Um, for Russia, Russia is a good example. Everybody told me, yeah, Russians are super called. You're going to have a horrible time there. And I ended up having a great time. People were super generous and

It's weird how the media portrays things. Huh?

Yeah.

I see what you're saying. Yeah. Yeah. It's kind of like one of my other podcasts guests she's you did something similar. She said, uh, she went to, she had like this horrible view of Muslims and the way everything was around that and the stigma around it. So she ended up spending an entire month in Egypt, fasting with a Muslim family and she, it changed her complete outfit look of the entire culture. So it sounds like you did something similar to that.

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, especially at a place like Palestine, you know, like for me, the first word that came to my mind when I heard of that place was terrorists. I know it sounds really bad, but I always pick those two concepts. Yeah. Um, so yeah, I, I, I decided to go there for a few months to, to volunteer. I worked in the city and in refugee camps, teaching kids basically. Um, but I think, you know, what we did, there was a lot more, it was a lot about just talking about what's going on and sharing the stories of the people there. Um, and it did feel really meaningful since that that's what I was looking for, you know? Right. Um, yeah. A of things happened there, there, it was yeah. Talking about life changing experiences that, yeah. That was another level, you know, it's

Well, what do you mean by life changing experiences?

Um, yeah. You know, I was telling you earlier about Ghana, right. For example. Um, so by then I had been confirmed, rented to people who didn't have as much wealth as I did, but I had never been confronted to people who have, um, who, who don't have freedom and who have their, a lot of their basic human rights violated all the time and yeah. Who have to fight to live in dignity. Um, yeah, that was heartbreaking. Yeah, really. Um, especially that I got really emotionally involved there because first of all, because I, I fell in love with the people and the culture and everything, but I also fell in love with someone, with a person with a young man. Um, yeah. So what was his name? Uh, his name was Norman. That's the Arabic way of saying it, but in English it's more like new men. Okay. Um, so yeah. Um, I mean there's a lot I could say about that place. Um, but yeah, so I just, yeah, I can't say anything, but after, after staying there for three or no, actually I stayed there for months. Um, there was a point where I just, I couldn't stay anymore because it was, it was just too hard, you know, all of it was really getting to me and I was starting to be really, really unhappy there. Um,

Constantly seeing pain and misery every single day can do that. Right. Yeah.

I mean, it's a place of extreme things because on one hand, people are read your life there. And, and I had great times. I laughed every day. I met amazing people. Like, it's not this really, it's not only dark. You know, I had loads of friends, I was partying quite a bit. It was, yeah. So there was, there was two sides, there was really amazing side. And then the other was, yeah. Hearing horrible stories.

It's kind of strange, but like, you know how the, I guess this is a famous quote that Moussa dong used as, as horrible of a quote as this is one, death is a tragedy. 1 million deaths is a statistic, like in a way, whenever we're across the world and we're looking at all this stuff happening on the media, we never this emotional, I guess, connection to what's happening to people out there. But when you actually go out there and you live with these people and you care about them and you see how much happiness and joy there is at moments, but then that seemed joy and happiness, same people that you've learned to care about. Bad things happen to them. That's when it can get to a lot more versus like, if you're just watching on the media and then you're just watching it constantly happened to them. You know, even it's like, it's like me watching a movie of a kid smiling and then him getting hurt versus me actually knowing the kid in real life at him smiling and having a good time. And then him getting hurt.

Yeah. Right. Exactly. Yeah. Every single story suddenly hurts because I could put a face on them, you know? Right. Um, yeah. So I left and it was really hard, you know, because I was with this guy and, um, it was a great left story. It was like kind of my first true love and, you know, we were both still young and

It was four months that you both were there.

Um, yeah. Well he, he wasn't.

Oh, he's Palestinian.

Yeah. Um, yeah. And, and I stayed four months. Yeah. Uh it's. So we always knew that I wasn't going to be able to stay there forever. It was always a reality, which in a way I think made our story even more intense. Yeah. Um, but still it was, yeah. It was really heartbreaking to leave, especially, you know, knowing that I could just leave. It was just so easy for me, you know, to go there and kind of pretend to live their lives for humans, but I could just eat any times just easy. Right. And, and yeah. And he couldn't, and that, yeah, that was, that was hard. I, when I left, I carried a lot of guilt in me for my privilege, even though I know I'm not responsible for it, but I just couldn't get over that fact. Like, why, why am I so lucky?

Why do I get to travel the world the way I do when some people, you know, they, they need a permit to, to go out of their own country. They, many of them won't, we'll never see anything else. So yeah. Yeah. It was hard. Um, and so it took me, so I stayed in Switzerland for a while and then I, I had to move on with my life. So I decided I was going to walk the Camino. Uh, do you know what the Camino gimme me notice? Um, so it's a pilgrimage in Spain. Um, historically it's a Christian pilgrimage, um, that people have been walking it for really, really long time, even if, even before, uh, crisp Christianity actually used to be a pagan thing. So people have been, have been walking it for over, I think, 2000 years. Um, so it's now it's really famous. Now, a lot of people who are not necessarily religious walk, it's just, you, you walk across Spain until you reach that place called Santiago de Compostela. Right. Um, and a lot of it,

How long of a finger image is, it

Depends where you start. But the way I wanted to do was about a month,

A month long. Yeah. And it's all walking. Yeah.

Okay. And because I was really, you know, sad and lost and still, so in love with that guy, I thought something like that could really help me, you know, to deal with everything process the last few months. Um, and I had met a lot of people who did it and really liked it.

Um, but yeah, um,

A week before, a week or two, before I was supposed to leave to do this pilgrimage, I got a phone call from the man saying that he was in the hospital. And, uh, it was all very sudden, he wasn't sick when I was there. And suddenly he had a tumor in his lung and doctors were talking about cancer. Um, yeah, really unexpected. He was only 20 years old. Um, so of course I just, I canceled everything right away and I decided to hop on the plane and, and go see him. Um, so I didn't go to Palestine. I went to Jordan, we organized for him to join me in, in Jordan because I wasn't sure I would be allowed back into Palestine. Cause Israel decides that. And I'd already spent a lot of time there that year. And I didn't want to take the risk of not being allowed in, you know, uh, and in Jordan we could go see better doctors to confirm the diagnosis.

Right. So, yeah. So that's what we did. I suddenly changed all my plans and a few to Jordan and it was actually really nice cause we stayed for 10 months, uh, sorry, for 10 days, sorry. Um, 10 days with him and his cousin and we traveled a bit around the country and um, you know, when I was there in Palestine, it felt like I was living his life kind of like he showed me all about his life and now he could see a bit of mine, you know, it was the first time he could travel that way. So is really exciting. Um, yeah. Um, but yeah, we also went to see doctors and they all said the same thing. They all told him to go back home to get treatments. He couldn't get it. It was, it was all very complicated. Honestly. Also they were all speaking Arabic and I can't speak good Arabic. So I didn't always understood everything, but yeah, no, they all told him to go home. I think it was because they wanted him to be close to his family, you know, I get it. Yeah. Yeah. Um,

But you said you did enjoy those 10 days, right? Krisha.

It was so nice. And seeing him again and yeah. Yeah, it was, but I mean, it was nice and at the same time horrible, because

Cause you had that dreadful feeling yeah, yeah. In the back of your head.

And I could also see him, he was sick and he was getting worse every day. Um, and yeah. And they told him to go home and he wanted me to follow him. And I was, I was honestly just terrified to be banned from the country if I tried to go back. Um, and I, I thought if I waited a bit, I would have more chances to be able to go back. So I decided to stay behind and I said goodbye to him. And so suddenly I was alone in this hotel room in a man thinking, what the hell am I doing with my life? You know? Um, I couldn't stay there, so, but I didn't want to go too far either. So I flew to Beirut instead in Lebanon, which is not too far either. Um, yeah. And then I stayed, I stayed three months too, but yeah, that was a hard time of my life. You know? It was, she was, yeah. Yeah. It's the only thing I could think of and you know, that just the whole situation was, or everything was already so unfair without that. And, and yeah, this tragedy on top of it, it was, it was really hard to, to deal with. And I didn't, I didn't really deal with it actually. I just became really, really depressed and just stop taking care of myself, uh, stop going out, you know, I stopped eating.

Yeah. Um, and yeah, in the beginning I had daily contact with him, but then as time went by, he was getting heavy treatment and it was getting more and more difficult to communicate. Um, yeah. Until after three months that that was around Christmas again. And I get, I get a message from his brother one day. Uh, and he tells me that doctors give new men one month to live. Um, something, something changed in me at that moment. It's like, uh, I don't know what light went off or something. I just, I disconnected. It was all too overwhelming to feel. So it's like, I stopped feeling, you know, as a defense mechanism or something. Yeah. Yeah. Um, and after that, just everything went South for the next few months after that, just like, yeah. Um, you were still in Beirut. I was still in Beirut. I had planned to go home again for Christmas.

Cause it's really important for my family that I'm home for Christmas. Um, but I didn't, I didn't want to be there. And so I, I very soon left again and I decided, so I wanted to be far away from the middle East from any kind of conflict. I was really sick and tired of, of, yeah. I, I, I wanted this to be somewhere at peace. I couldn't be, I couldn't be home cause I didn't want to deal with people. Um, so I, yeah, I ran and I decided to go to Southeast Asia. Cause I remember that from my first trip, uh, that it was a really peaceful place and I really enjoyed it. And I thought that, yeah, that I could maybe find some peace there. Um, and I went, I went actually with someone I met in, in bailouts who is kind of like my only friends there and the only person I'd been talking to for the last few months, the only person in the world who kind of knew what was going on with me, um, turns out it wasn't a very good person to end up stuck with in Southeast Asia.

Uh, uh, he took advantage of my vulnerability. He was a very toxic person and he kind of ended up like abusing me psychologically, never physically, but, um, he'd lie and manipulate me and, and, you know, install some money from me. And I kind of just let everything happened because by that point I just hated myself. I hated the world. I was super depressed, you know, I didn't think I deserved any better. I felt really guilty for not going back for new men, but I also just, I just couldn't deal with it. I couldn't get myself to go back and see him that way. And yeah. So it was,

Did you to stay in contact during that time?

Um, yeah, but not at the end because at the end he didn't even recognize his own parents, you know, so yeah, it was really bad. And I actually talked to his dad and his dad told me don't come back. Um, he, he didn't want him to have to see me in that state and for me to have that last memory, you know? Yeah.

I get it both ways too.

Yeah. Um, it's, it's actually really sad. He told me that, uh, in the end, even when he didn't recognize his own family, he would still call my name in his sleep. Um, yeah. So you can imagine, um, the intensity of the sadness and the guilt and the, you know, just all of the kind of emotions you can feel in a situation like, and I was really young too. I was only 22. I was not prepared to be faced to such a situation. Yeah. Um, and on top of that, I was in this horrible place with this guy driving me crazy. Um, yeah, it was really the lowest point of my life. I had lost so much weight. I was dangerously thin. Um, I, by then I, I quit my studies. I just let everything go South in my life, you know? Um, and after three or four months of that, of, of things getting worse and worse every day I woke up one day.

Uh, so yeah. Um, while I was there, new men passed away and yeah. And a couple of months I've so that I woke up one day and I saw myself in a mirror and I really saw myself, you know, and I realized if, if I stayed, I was going to die. It just appeared crystal pier to me. Right. I told myself, Sophie, if you stay, you die. And at that moment, I decided I wanted to live, you know, that maybe no man had died, but that didn't mean I had to die to. And that's not what he would have wanted for me, you know? Right. So it was the hardest thing I ever did in my entire life. I picked myself up and asked my parents for help. Um, but by that point I also cut ties with all my loved ones. Uh, I, yeah, we were mad at him. Yeah. So I reached out to them and asked for their help and they bought a plane ticket for me and yeah. And I decided to go home and yeah, I cried the whole way. I think that at that point I finally let myself feel what I needed to feel, you know?

Yeah. Yeah. I know how you, you repress the emotions for so long and one day just hits.

Yeah. And it hit for a really, really long time. Like for about a year after that, I cried every single day. I cried waking up. I cried going to sleep. I hides during the day from people to go cry in bathrooms and stuff like that. It was, I just had so much sadness inside of me so much, but I was home and I was finally in a safe place where I had food and people who loved me and cared for me and didn't manipulate me anymore. And it was a long process, but, um, little by little, I, I just built myself again. I, I hope you cut tiny manipulative guy. Yeah, I did. I did not right away, but eventually, um, yeah. And you know, I started my studies again. I found a job. I made new friends. It just, it took a really long time. Um, and that's when I decided to finish that first book and to publish it too. And I had no men in mind the whole time. Yeah. Cause we, he was an artist too. And we always talked about, you know, following our dreams and believing in ourselves and yeah. So I felt it would be the best way to honor him to follow my dream, to be a writer. Yeah.

And he did it, you came out with your first book and now you're in the middle of your second.

Exactly. And the second one tells that story, right.

Installations on both that picking yourself up and turning the situation into something that you grew from and, and reflected on and something that was so heartbreaking and beautiful at the end. And now you're using it to, I guess, motivate your life and as you move forward and you'll always have that memory and thought behind you and always will be something that you'll never forget. And, uh,

For sure. Yeah. It's a beautiful memory. Thank you. Yeah. And, and you know, a year after that, I finally walked the Camino. Yeah. And when I, when I get, I, when I got to that cathedral, after a month of walking, it was the proudest moments of my life. I just felt like I was coming from so far, you know, that that path had started long before that was 800 kilometers.

Did you finally feel like a burden was kind of lifted off your shoulders when he landed at the cathedral?

Yeah. I think the whole way was a very healing process. I think it helped me grieve the, did your feet hurt at the end

Curiosity? Oh yeah. But you made it that's good.

Yeah, I did.

And is that where you are now? So you walk the El Camino and then you decided to go back home after that.

Yeah. I mean, that was still, you know, still the beginning of something else because, you know, I had to heal what happened. I had to get closure, but then I still had to keep on living and there's still a lot of things I needed to figure out in my life. And that's pretty much what I've been doing for the past two years now that I don't have this weight of grief and pain, I'm a bit lighter and I can focus on exploring different options for myself

Instead of a way. It's a memory now.

Yeah. And it's actually a, I don't want to say good memory. It's not all good memory, obvious, deep. But, um, whenever I think about him, it's a really positive memory and yeah,

That's a good thing. And that's, that's why, yeah. I'm glad it ended the way that it did, because like it could have ended another way where you would be thinking back to them now to be bad and negative and you don't want that. Right. You want it to be something, a source of strength, the source of it. That's what he would have wanted to I'm sure. Just like any guy would have for the girl that he loved. So, um, yeah, no, I'm glad you're able to go back and draw from that. You know, like, I think it's important for us, for people to have memories like that. I mean, I was able to relate to you in different ways. Definitely not that intensely for sure. I've never had someone pass away that I loved, but I mean, I think I, I, I can definitely relate to you without going into too much details here.

Yeah. For sure. These are all very human experiences. Right. I think that's one of the reasons why I write too, because even though I have this kind of unique life, um, unconventional for sure. Um, the emotions I experience are, are universal, you know,

And that's something you realize when you travel too, right. Or every human being is kind of the same on the inside. Yeah. I'll feel the same or want the same things, all desire, the same things. We're all human black, white, Brown, whatever, honestly, for America, if it was these Americans that, that are just like the entire protest and everything that started around where I am and in my country, like if people would just learn to realize that we wouldn't have so much hatred, but that's a whole other topic. So yeah. So, so you're in Switzerland now, is that right?

Um, yeah. I just kept home. I wasn't Ecuador for the past, uh, for the last eight months before I got back here too.

And he's been taking a random jobs and stuff to fund your travels.

Um, yeah. Well, so I have the, I had the privilege of still being a student for a long time. And when your students in Switzerland, uh, your family gets help from the,

What they pay you to be a student,

Basically. Yeah. It's more like they help your family to take care of you while you study. And it's not a huge amount of money, but it's enough when you travel, you volunteer and, you know, it would, it would have cost me a lot more to live in Switzerland and Doyle study.

No, that's awesome.

So I had that for a long time, which was a great, great privilege.

And you're finishing up your studies now or did you already finish?

Yeah, I just finished them and yeah. Thank you. And yeah, I've had a few jobs here and there and I volunteered a lot, but yeah, I do have, I'm also very lucky to have parents. Who've always supported me and they've always been there for me, you know?

Yeah. That's awesome. It's always nice to have that.

Yeah. It's amazing. It's a privilege.

What's next for you? What do you have any future plans in mind?

I have something I'm not a hundred percent sure I'm going to do it yet, but I might go do a master's degree in international journalism. Yeah. Because I like telling stories, you know?

Yeah. True goes well with who you are. Yeah,

I think so. Thank you that,

I mean, any path, you know, just remember not to rush into anything, always think it thoroughly, there's people that make mistakes all the time, including myself, uh, doing things that they realize in retrospect, uh, you know what I could have spent my time better doing something else, never regret. Just retrospect. For example, I had a degree for four years that I'm probably never going to do anything with again in my life. And I, I guess I'm saying what you, what you're doing because I have a degree with this it's geology. I just, um, yeah, just towards the fourth year, I realized, God, I can not talk about rocks again and again, and again, there's so much you can say, you know, so yeah, at that point I just realized, yeah, geology isn't for me. But I mean, I had its experiences. I met plenty of incredible people. Uh, the degree itself helped me land some really random jobs when I was traveling. I mean, I don't regret the degree at all. It's just that, um, think about what you want to do for sure. Before we dive into it, that's all I'm saying.

Yeah. Yeah. It's actually, if I do it, it would be the first time I studied something. That's really just for me and not to make other others happy. Yeah,

Absolutely. Cool. All right. Let's close this podcast off with one final question here. And this is a question that I ask a lot of my guests that come on here, but I think it'd be incredibly interesting to ask you, seeing what you've been through. So out of the, and you left, what, like two, how long has it been now since you started traveling two, three, four years?

Uh, no. Now it's been like six years.

Two years. Okay. Six years then from the moment that you left six years ago to go on that first trip to Ghana up till now, how do you feel like your perspective of life in people in the world has changed if you had to put that in a few lines,

But we're a lot more similar than we are different wherever we're from. Well,

Beautifully said that's a very common theme too, amongst many digital nomads. Very good thing, but it's so true. It can never be said enough.

Yeah.

Well, awesome. Thank you so much for coming on today. Sophie

Thank you Omar. Really nice. I enjoyed our talk. 

That is all for today. Thanks again for tuning in to the nomadic spirit podcast. If you enjoyed this episode, please take two seconds out of your day to subscribe or leave a review. Your input really helps this podcast grow.

So, yeah. Thanks again for listening. If you'd like to get in touch to get feedback or be featured as a guest or just have a chat, you can reach me at omarmodigital@gmail.com , See you next time.