How to Become a Traveling Journalist and Get Your Big Break With Whitney Saldava| TNE061

Have you ever met anyone that's been to North Korea? Well, I've got a pretty awesome guest on today who's done just that, along with gone to other war torn countries, places of magic and international conventions.

We're joined by Whitney Saldava, a world renowned journalist who's worked for BBC and the associated press, and now works for NATO as a press officer, being a journalist was one of those jobs I always wanted to do as a kid but never knew exactly how to go about it.

Show Notes:

[7:12] How to get a journalism career right after high school

[31:11] Aspiring to become a journalist? Here’s what you should know.

[33:38] Where to find journalism opportunities as a freelancer

[36:38] How to build a portfolio for starting journalists

[39:50] How to get in North Korea and what to expect

[51: 21] Precautions to keep in mind when going to North Korea

Whitney Saldava's links:
Tiktok @vitnija ,  IG @vitnijas

Omar's (Host) Social Media:
Instagram - @nomadables
TikTok - @nomadables
Facebook Group - NOMADABLES - Accountability & Growth Community for Remote Workers- Perfect to meet fellow online entrepreneurs, remote workers, and digital nomads.
YouTube - Omar Mo
LinkedIn - Omar Mo Nomads Cast
Twitter - @nomadables
Pintrest - @nomadables
Clubhouse - @pods
WEBSITE: https://www.nomadables.com/

Transcript

Introduction

Have you ever met anyone that's been to North Korea? Well, I've got a pretty awesome guest on today who's done just that, along with gone to other war torn countries, places of magic and international conventions. We're joined by Whitney Saldava, a world renowned journalist who's worked for BBC and the associated press, and now works for NATO as a press officer, being a journalist was one of those jobs I always wanted to do as a kid but never knew exactly how to go about it.

Some of you listening to this might also be in the same boat and whether you want to learn how to be a journalist yourself or just want to listen to some pretty gnarly travel stories. Make sure to tune into today's episode of the nomadic executive.

Remember Nomad fan, we've got some incredibly value filled episodes planned out for you. So please hit that subscribe button and leave a review. Your review helps us podcast become more visible and ultimately inspire more people just like you. My name is Omar mo and this is the nomadic executive.

TNE- Introduction

You're listening to the nomadic executive posted by Omar from Nomadables.com. Join Omar as he sits down and speaks with leading online entrepreneurs, remote workers and digital nomads about everything from business strategy to travel and lifestyle design. together. We're here to help you achieve a life of happiness, health and freedom. And now here's your host, Omar Mo.

Omar  

All right, Whitney, welcome to the nomadic executive. I am absolutely thrilled to have you on met. I actually heard about you from Drea, another one of our podcast guests, and she’s spoken very highly of you. And something that really, really caught my interest when I heard about you was the fact that you went to North Korea, which is something we'll dive into later on in this episode. But why don't we just get started here? How are you doing today?

Whitney  

I'm doing really well. I just took a pic from my Instagram to let everybody know what's going on today.

Omar 

Awesome. Thanks.

Whitney  

Thanks for having me. Thanks for having me on this podcast and super excited. I think it's actually-- it's quite a good day. I've just chilled, now getting ready for this adventure.

Omar  

I like the way that you framed that, adventure. Because that was that's really what everything is right at the end of the day. I realized throughout my life, I don't even know why I'm bouncing into such a deep direction here for a minute. But just because you said that I'm gonna and I think it's a good lesson to kind of pass on to my listeners before we kick this episode off.

So throughout my life, I've realized like good and bad happens to people, right? But if you're able to reframe the bad situations, the awkward situations, the nasty situations, and the good situations, and the happy situation and everything as an adventure and just an experience and something that’s needed to happen, then life becomes so good.

Instead of trying to compartmentalize it into like, “Oh, this was bad. I wish it didn't happen to me,” and “This was good. I wish it did happen to me.” If everything becomes an adventure and something that you learn from, then life becomes so damn good. I mean, I'm so happy that you compartmentalize that as an adventure. So why don't you go ahead, tell us a little bit about yourself, Whitney. Tell us a bit about what you do... I know it's a super vague question to start with. But give us a small intro about who Whitney is.

Whitney  

Okay, so Whitney, actually my real name or my birth and given name is Vitnijas and that's a Latvian version of the name Whitney, because I had I was named after Whitney Houston. My mom was a big MTV fan. And she's like a teen. And she was watching TV. And she was like, oh, Whitney, I mean, that's a cool name, Whitney Houston. So let's call her Whitney. Unfortunately, I can't sing. Yeah.

However, I do many other things, I travel. I've been to 64 countries at this stage. I was supposed to get to 70 last year. That didn't happen. But soon, hopefully that will. So now I've kind of pushed the 70 back to this year. Well, who knows? Right? UK is completely locked in right now. So there's still no chance for me to escape and I'm my feet already itching to get away.

Omar

Right.

Whitney 

So, like I said, originally, I'm from Latvia. Then I kind of took an adventurous turn after I finished high school and I became a journalist and I traveled a lot, most places in Europe and as far as Kazakhstan, etc, with my journalism career. one day I'd be filming some Santa Claus meeting, Russian and Finnish Santa Claus meeting in a cold village in the middle of winter in Finland, and the next day, I'd be flying to cover the death of a Russian ambassador in Ankara in Turkey.

So, very interesting career, very dynamic. And I've kind of now calmed down a little bit. I wanted to calm down a little bit. So I chose a more of a nine to five, but still super cool and interesting in calm. So I work at NATO, that's a, like a, one of the big international organizations. And that's also what really allows me to continue traveling, they have generous policies with leave, they have opportunities to travel with work and good pay. So, I'm kind of happy with where I am now.

Omar  

Interesting. That's a little bit of Whitney right there in a nutshell. With NATO, and I've heard of NATO quite a bit, is that a digital job or are you actually going into office?

Whitney  

Well, it's hard to say with COVID. Normally, I would be going into the office all the time. Now I go into the office once a week, or whenever there's something that you can do from home, obviously, there's sometimes classified information that you're dealing with that you can't access from home. But majority of my work can be done from anywhere really, from home or from abroad or if I manage it, from writing a social media post, or preparing a press release, I can do it from anywhere.

Omar  

That still allows you to travel them, basically,

Whitney  

if the UK would let me out.

Omar  

It's funny, like the other day, I was talking to a friend that actually managed to get the hell out of the UK. I don't know what he did. But he got out, and he ended up going to Puerto Rico. So maybe I should get you two in touch.

Whitney  

No, no, I think right now, it's pretty straight. They said they're going to throw people in jail for 10 years, if they lie at the border of why they're traveling and where they're coming from.

Omar  

Jeez, that sounds rough, man. It sounds like a third world country out there. 

Whitney  

Well, The other day, I was talking to somebody else about North Korea. And they said, Oh, so what is it like? And I said, Well, the borders are locked,can't you can't go anywhere without the government permission. You don't have any entertainment opportunities, kind of like in the UK right now.

Omar  

Jeez, North Korea, I never thought I'd hear the UK in North Korea in the same sentence. But there you are. Yeah, right. So let's reverse back here a bit. Let's start off with you, right out of high school, you get this journalism career. And right away, you start traveling the world? How the hell did you manage to get a journalism career right out of high school? What was your process behind that? And what were you feeling when you actually got a job like this?

Whitney  

Well, okay, I did kind of miss the whole step of university. I actually, well, I moved to the UK to study journalism. And, and that gave me the confidence that I can actually do it because I had a degree which was so hands on. wW would learn to film, we will learn to write, we will learn to make webpages. We will learn to do radio shows.

Omar  

What degree is this?

Whitney 

This was University of Leeds

Omar  

In Leeds, I see. And before this, you came from Latvia, is that right?

Whitney  

Yes. I was a normal average Latvian girl with interest in journalism but no real experience.

Omar  

Right, and comes to the big city and Leeds. I get it.

Whitney  

Exactly, it comes to the big to a big country to a foreign country. And it gave me the skills and coupled with my language knowledge, because I was born in Russian I was fluent, I was educated in the UK, I managed to get an internship in Associated Press, which is world's largest news agency in Moscow, they're one of their flagship offices.

And this is what I really wanted, I was always going for an agency job, because I knew that only agencies, realistically, nowadays, in journalism agencies are the only ones that go out in the field. Or if you're a super high profile presenter for like, BBC, or CNN, or the major stations, but the only other ones that go out in the field, cover the Real News are the agencies, so I have them.

Omar  

And the rest of them, aside from the agencies, are just stuck in office writing articles all day.

Whitney  

Right, and they use and they only they're stuck in the office writing or reusing the material of the agencies. because the agency, that's their business, they're making videos so that then you can watch them. For example, if you watch your local TV station, let's say, Connecticut news, or whatever, if they show an earthquake in Nepal, or if they show some strike in Spain, they don't have their own crews there of course. They use AP Reuters. So they use this agency material for their TV stations. This is why agencies are in the field. That's purely their business.

Omar  

I see. So carry on them to join the agency. You got to Associated Press what happened after that?

Whitney  

Right. And actually, it was such a brilliant time to join because it was 2013. The Olympic Games were kicking off in Russia. Navalny was running for office, then Ukraine started in just nearby so I got actually sent to Kiev to cover the clashes on the mytown Square and the independence on the independent square. And that was fascinating. It was also very scary.

It was really scary. Because one morning, you wake up and there are bullet holes in your windows and your hotel’s suddenly burning. It's wild, right? It's really crazy, you would walk out and there's people like falling down being shut down by snipers.

Omar  

Geez, you walked into a nightmare. That sounds insane.

Whitney  

I didn't really have a lot of pride. I had no prior experience in conflict related issues, but they needed somebody and I was keen to prove myself. So I went out. And what came out of it is actually, I got kind of not promoted, but I got opportunities to lead that operation there to actually make a real impact. And that was my break, that was my big break in journalism.

Some people don't get that until they've been in the job for 20 years. I got that in the job in the first year. And that was lucky. But also it was because I had a really, really great boss. She was an excellent mentor and she really believed in me. Actually, first she offered these opportunities to more senior colleagues. Everybody said, No, no, no, no, no. And then she came to me, and she offered it to me. And I was like, “Okay, I'm going, I'm doing.”

Omar  

How’d you handle that? Like, what were you feeling when all that was happening around you?

Whitney  

I had extreme anxiety and I've had anxiety issues in the past. And I remember, I was so anxious. Once I had to call my producer, she was a lovely Ukrainian girl. And I was like, just come, just keep me company, in the middle of the night. I'm like, “Can we sleep in the same room? Can you just be like, somewhere nearby? Because I'm feeling so anxious?” Yeah, it was really scary. Sometimes you'd only get to sleep two hours a day. And then you wake up when instantly you have heart palpitations. And that's how your day starts.

Omar  

Right. You were there for quite some time, too. And then all that was happening?

Whitney  

Well, luckily, they don't keep you for months in a row, do you get to go back and do some more mundane stuff, etc, etc. So you do get to go out, away, for a bit.

Omar  

I mean, I can totally get that anxiety, but not to that degree. Like I've never been in a situation where their buildings are on fire, and people are getting shot, that's for sure. So I bet you that was an anxiety on another level. How did you manage? You were a reporter, right? So I would think, at least that no one would want to shoot you because they know your reporting, you're on neutral ground, essentially. Right? And you're there to just tell the news, and both sides know this whoever's fighting. But still at the same time, like there's always that risk, right?

So how would you manage, going out there actually doing the news and putting yourself in these situations where you're surrounded by danger at all times? And did it feel exhilarating at points or you're in a constant state of anxiety? I mean, there's something that probably had to keep you coming back and doing that, right?

Whitney  

Well, you would be surprised, but a lot of young graduates or… I hadn't even graduated, I was doing it. I took a year out to do this, because my summer internship between year two and three turned into this. But a lot of young graduates have this kind of idealized, romanticized version of covering wars, being the real war correspondent. So I had a bit of that, too, I was really dreaming of going to Afghanistan, places like that. I don't wish that now, particularly unless for the money. But back then, it was exhilarating at times, but not when you were in real danger.

Perhaps when I first arrived, but they, I would say, “Look, you have part of the pressure is that what's going on? Like, seriously, what's going on around you, you need to man up, you need to cut out.” The second is the pressure of having to prove yourself, this was the first time I read them not the first time but this was the second time in my life where I experienced imposter syndrome.

And I really identified it as such, the first time being when I was at university in the UK, and everybody was so much smarter than me, at least so I thought, and I really felt like wow, everybody speaks perfect English. Everybody has done some journalism before. I mean, how did I even get selected for this program? It’s a very selective program. There's only 38 of us, or 40 of us doing that course and you really get one on one tutoring. You even get your private computer as a bachelor student, I mean, it's incredible. But I remember when I arrived to Ukraine to cover this first conflict, and I felt the same next to me. They were cameramen who won several Emmys. I had Pulitzer Winning journalists, I have people who have all the possible awards you can imagine around me with 30 years of experience. Bosnian War every or every single war, that you can name they've been there. And here I am, this girl, this girl who's not even finished uni, right.

But I identified this imposter syndrome and I stopped myself before I started to seriously harm my ability to perform. So I [was] like, “Stop it, Whitney. You're here for a reason.” My colleagues reassured me like you're here for a reason you have a part to play. Look, I didn't come in and I wasn't a reporter, I was a producer. So what I have to do, my role was setting up interviews, was chasing leads, was editing a video from a card that someone brings back to the office, which was a hotel. But actually for the first weeks, I didn't leave the hotel. I wasn't allowed because it was too dangerous to leave the hotel. 

So I was supposed to just stay in the hotel room doing all the kind of manual editing, glazing the office in London, etc, etc. Only with time, I got more out into the field. So, they weren't completely crazy by sending me out and then immediately throwing me in.

Omar  

Right, for the frying pan to the fire. I get it.

Whitney  

Yeah. And so some of the scarier things, of course, were done by people who have 30 years of experience, but then if they come back and their leg is full of shrapnel, which did happen... Well, then we have to deal with that, me and my fellow producers.

Omar  

That's insane. What a crazy story. What a crazy start. But hey, that at least got you into your break. Right? I mean, they knew you could handle the pressure after going out there. And actually, even though you weren't reporting you were producing. So you were around the action, they knew that you could handle it. So at that point, and your employees had, I would think, or your employers had, I would think, okay, Whitney can handle this. Let's send Whitney out on other projects.

Whitney  

Exactly.

Omar  

Right. So what happened after that after you got your big break, like where did that lead?

Whitney  

So basically, how it works in journalism is, at least on agencies, and I know, also some broadcasting companies. Once you kind of proven yourself in the field, it'd be very easy to get stuck in the office. Trust me, they say that there are a lot of women in journalism, but most of them are stuck in offices. Because not a lot of them can take this kind of risk. A lot of them have families, would they ever agree to go out to a conflict zone? No.

Omar  

But why should I bet adventure that you wanted to chase?

Whitney  

Right. Even if you want adventure, they won't necessarily take it because of their responsibilities back at home. Or, they feel kind of, they are responsible for somebody else. But what I'm what the thing is, once you've proven yourself in the field in a tough situation, all sorts of situations can start coming your way. And what you start being called as a firefighter, so if they for example, somebody gets shot, or, they need someone to go to Geneva.

There's some urgent talks or urgent Syrian peace talks being carried out, you will be the one called and this person who has previously been in the office, said no to immediate dangerous assignment, they would not be called even for a non dangerous assignment. So actually, from that point onwards, I was traveling quite a lot. But I wasn't covering wars, neither did I want to cover nor not want to cover wars. But I got all the nice places, I got to go to Iceland. I got to go to Kazakhstan. I got to go all over Europe. It was really quite fun.

Omar  

Huh. That's, that's awesome. But at that point, like if they asked you to cover a war, after that, you'd probably end up going, but it's awesome that you were able to go to all these different places, even just because you're proving yourself in that Ukraine situation. Right. So going from there, like I mean, you traveled so much. And places like Geneva places like Iceland.

I mean, all these different amazing places that you've been to throughout that time, just reporting the news. Do you have any ones that really stuck out to you some of the ones that were your favorite?

Whitney  

Well, I know which I didn’t like, Geneva, for example, is my least favorite city. Because normally, in any job, they pay you per diem, right sort of me for you to spend on every day, it normally is around between 50 and $100 a day, right?

In Geneva, I don't remember how much they were giving us probably the maximum, but there was never enough. It was never enough to actually get through your day parking cost 60 euros an hour. There were no public transport. I was absolutely miserable. I kind of was my least favorite place to go because there's no way you can survive with the money they give.

Omar  

incredibly

Whitney  

And on the news are always so mundane, they're so boring. You stand it like you sit around for hours. And then something happens in 30 seconds and it's boring. But more on do... you probably don't want to hear my bad stories, you probably want to hear the good stories. 

Omar  

Well, it's like think back, right, just in that period, I guess the next three to five years, I would guess, somewhere around that time after the Ukraine incident, what are some ones that, it doesn't even have to be a particular story but rather countries that you really enjoyed. Because you did extensively travel and you traveled to multiple countries, and a lot of those countries come from the journalism job.

So just something that really stood out to you, a country that you really, really enjoyed. And it may not be because of the parking situation, or how expensive it was, but really just an experience or adventure that you had in a country. And it's funny because I say this, because like you came from the journalism's perspective, right? Like you were there. And something that made you not like a country was something as simple as they weren't paying me enough to actually even be able to survive in that country.

Whereas if someone else's perspective, like someone, let's say, who's incredibly wealthy goes to Geneva might say, “Oh, yeah, this was a fantastic city. because it was just so beautiful, and I really loved it.” And money doesn't even cross your mind. Right. So it's interesting to see this journalism's perspective of it. So what really stood out to you that way.

Whitney  

And it's also of course, I was based, with journalism, actually, I was also based in three different countries. I started off in Moscow, and I would travel around that sort of sphere of influence. Then I moved to London, and I was working in their video headquarters. So that's when I would go to more kind of European destinations. 

And Iceland really stuck out to me, because I got to go inside a Glazier, got to cover like a Viking festival. There were a lot of quirky, cool stories, and it was just so fun getting to see the place as well, because when you film feature stories, and this is why I love feature stories, especially nowadays, you get to go somewhere and spend proper time with it.

Then I moved to Estonia, and I kind of became a firefighter, again, mostly in the Nordics and, and I was going back to Russia quite a lot. And what, I love Russia, I think it's honestly, people are so lovely. And Ukrainian people are so lovely, too.

I remember a story that we were doing in Ukraine, where we kind of followed a convoy of aid into a recently kind of fought over area. And, there were a lot of destroyed buildings, every second or third building was completely knocked down by all this kind of shelling from two sides, because they got caught right in the crossfire. But I remember, we were kind of filming a story about this town rebuilding after the conflict.

And it was just amazing, because we found this local family and they were, it was clear that one of their houses got knocked down by the shells or whatever. And then they invited us in are like, “Of course you can film. Here's some borscht, here's some vodka, just enjoy your time with us. And they have nothing, you can see that, these people, they have nothing, they live in very simple surroundings. And, but they were still giving us anything, they had to kind of invite, and they were so, it was like, wow, from Latvia, and from, they were so friendly. And, and I remember, they were telling me a lot of the stories were super, super sad.

A lot of the stories really, it was just so, they telling you that they because the government can't access Syria the moment, and they're not, they're not coming to help anyone with aid, even though they've been caught up in this conflict. No one's giving them any grants to rebuild their houses, they don't have a home to live in. And they, they are only survival because their jobs, no love, no more jobs, they're everything's closed, the only source of their survival is this, this disability pension of their son, when when like, and you sit there, when they give you like, their last t-shirt has, like an expression, on their backs, and you just feel so humble about what you have.

Omar  

It's funny, like I realized throughout this, like the poorest people, or the people that don't have to have the least tend to give the most like gratitude. And it's interesting to see, to see that you're saying that that's happening in Russia as well, because I've seen that in so many different countries, especially Third World ones, whether it was Nicaragua, or an Asian country, or Egypt or any of these different places, like people with the least always give the most. And I love that you're saying that because that's not something you see so readily in such way more westernized countries, like for example, I'm sure being in the UK, you could probably agree with me there. And me being an American, I'm sure. I've seen that too, you know, so it kind of restores your faith in humanity in a way to not be too dramatic.

Whitney  

Yeah, but I mean, definitely, you need to have a very strong kind of, what is it called, emotional endurance and also like an ethical and kind of moral compass to be able to do this kind of work. And, for example, we were filming a queue.

So the ATMs had recently opened in this town, and they were filming a queue. And there was this one old lady, who was just, at the ATM, she was about to withdraw her pension. This ATM has been closed for three months, she hasn't had any money for three months. She is alone, she doesn't have any relatives, she's living alone in this countryside house in a village, she's traveled. So she's like, withdrawing money, like filming, and then she turns towards us, and she's crying, this old lady.

And we like, “Oh, what happened,” she's like, “Oh, the pension has not come through, I can't withdraw it. And I've spent my last pound on the bus to get here. I don't know what to do.” And then stories like that, or you, you're walking past the house, and there's someone waving from you from the top floor. And it's like someone who's paralyzed, and they haven't had water, or haven't had bread for weeks. And you just kind of need to, you need to help these people. Because a lot of journalists, or a lot of people who go before they go into journalism, they think, “Oh, my gosh, my first responsibilities to be impartial.” Whatever, no. Your first responsibility is to be a human. So that's how I see it.

Omar  

Empathy. I'm sure your empathy will go incredibly high. After being a journalist for so long. When you're constantly surrounded in situations like that, and you run into situations where people are in need, or they're hurting, or they're paralyzed, or whatever they're going through, that really pulls on the heartstrings for anybody that's out there. And unless you're a complete psychopath, or a sociopath, and you're out there being a journalist, I mean, you're always going to be in situations when we want to help.

Does that ever, I mean, seeing that constantly though, the constant pain. Like you're not constantly a firefighter, so that's a good thing. But for people that say, journalists, that's a firefighter for five years in a row, and just constantly around conflict, and, and people that are in pain and people that are hurt, I'm sure they would get absolutely, they'd run dry. They'd give everything that they could possibly give, and it just messes with their head in a way.

Whitney  

Yeah, a lot of my a lot of my journalist friends, especially those who I met in Ukraine, a lot of them have PTSD. If you spend months and years doing that, I've seen journalists come to London to receive an award and they feel guilty that they're away. They feel guilty, that they are enjoying the pleasures of life, when some people are suffering. All they can think of is the suffering of the people back where they've just come from, or they can't even comprehend that. They are now out there without them telling the stories.

Omar  

It's good that we're talking about this, because journalism is an all glitz and glamour. And that's something good that you're released. But at the same side, you've covered a lot of great stories, right? Like, you've been to a lot of cool places, and you've been able to feature stories where something really cool is happening. And you'd be able to cover that too, right? But it's a healthy mix.

Whitney  

Actually, the story that has done the best for me, and I actually, not everyone I think in the world can claim that they have made a viral video, and I have made a viral video. And what I mean viral mean, 40, 50, 60 million views.

Omar  

Amazing. What was the video about?

Whitney  

So you've probably seen it too, but actually, it's been a few years, so maybe you haven't. But a couple years ago, it was one of my last stories for journalism. And I thought how timely, how great. So I was in Finland covering a hobby horse festival. And this is  like a competition where girls, kind of school girls, they pretend that these stick horses are real horses, and then they kind of bounce around a feel to have to like jump over obstacles as if they're doing real horse rides. And it just went viral that video. I mean, it's such a fun story.

Omar  

That's a random video to go viral.

Whitney  

I mean, everyone loved it. Everybody was on all channels like

Omar  

You have to send me the link.

Whitney  

Everyone's seen it.

Omar

Nice. Please, please, if you can find the link, send it to me. I'm gonna put it in the show notes for my audience to watch as well. That's amazing. So you're telling me if these horses jumping over some stuff, what was the story behind it?

Whitney  

Basically, girls, so this is kind of like a lot of girls, who feel a little bit down. They don't belong to any kind of traditional hobbies or traditional sports. They would join this kind of supportive group where they would have the horse head on a stick. So another real horse guy. It's like, oh, okay,

Omar  

The fake horse to just play around with it. Right? So it's like a horse head stick and they're riding around on the horse head. Yeah,

Whitney  

Yeah, that's it. And that's all they were doing. But it was such a feel good, funny sport, but they have like an official tournament. Yeah, this is an official tournament, official sport there.

Omar  

So it's like a parody. That's amazing. It's like a parody sport. Whenever, like in America, we have what they call the puppy bowl. So during the Super Bowl, they'll have the same kind of live event. But instead of what human beings it's going to be a bunch of puppies playing around with the football trying to score goals. And it's called the puppy bowl. And they always played on the Animal Channel every single year. So it's kind of like a parody sport, I get what you're saying. Yeah, please send me the link afterwards, I want to put it in my show notes and kind of show it to everybody. It's a good thing to be proud of.

Before we move forward to North Korea, I want to talk about just small applicable advice here if someone wants to be a journalist. So what piece of advice would you give somebody that kind of wants to follow in your footsteps, right. Now that we've established, it's not all glitz and glamour, there's bad sides and good sides to it, just like any job, but just way more intense. If someone really wanted to become a journalist, and even get their big break, like you did, what kind of advice would you give them?

Whitney  

I'd say and look, I mean, I'm actually also a career coach. So a lot of my clients want to go into communications, into journalism, international organizations. Kind of similar to what I've done, they've kind of, want to repeat my successes. So normally what I say, if someone is asking me, “Oh, how do I break into this industry?” Number one tip would be be as multidimensional as possible, be able to write for the for websites, be able to film, be able to edit, if you limit yourself too much, if you're like, “Oh, well, I'm, I'm only a writer, I don't know how to use the cameras.” 

Well, then you will probably not get anywhere. So be as multidimensional as possible, make sure many, many different, maybe writing for apps, keep your eyes open, because there will be an opportunity somewhere in a niche where you can get in. And if you can show that you are really, we can get in, let's say through an internship. And if you can show that you're a, really are an asset, because you can do all these other things, too. Then, you're more likely to be captain. 

And once you're in, it's much easier to move around. It's much easier to see new opportunities because you really, every single time you go and cover a story somewhere let's say you're working for the BBC, even as a freelancer, you go on a corporate story somewhere that BBC is written on your forehead, so they like “Oh, yeah, you become a known name.” And sooner or later, you can get a job or some other opportunity for more networks.

Omar  

So does that mean most journalists are freelancers?

Whitney  

No, it's hard to say, depends where. In war zones? Yes. Because many reasons. Freelancers are mostly, it's because indoor zones because to me, they need locals to know the area. So you're not going to hire someone you always think that this is going to end soon. So you're trying to keep stuff that's temporary. So or, yeah, so then I wouldn't say no, most not are freelancers, but there are many freelance opportunities, very, very many incomes in journalism.

Omar  

Okay, where would someone go to find these opportunities online?

Whitney  

I would say on the spot, so you can't like there's it's very unlikely that you For example, will be selected someone from London will be selected to go and cover a story as a freelancer in wherever Latvia. You have to be in Latvia, you have to be on the spot, you have to be already, you have to be doing the story. Even if it's for your own portfolio, if you for example hear that there is very unique kind of whatever event happening in your hometown go and cover that go and register, make up a name of your media company.

Most of these events they don't double check is this a blog or is this what if you say kind of Connecticut news 111 they're not going to check this new station they just gonna sit or if you even if you put student radio or student TV, they will welcome you in so once you're there, make your contacts network “hey,” “oh,” “You're… Oh, I see you're also with a camera. Where are you working for?” Or, offer your services if you see someone struggling and etc. Oh do you need me to hold the microphone, whatever. Sometimes you can, on the spot is the best way.

Omar  

Interesting. So even someone like me with the podcast, for example, I could come in and say “Hey, I have so and so press media company called the Nomadic Executive,” and then just start networking, see where I can fit into my opportunities and then go from there. So it's kind of like other jobs as well. Make sense.

Whitney  

Yeah. And you can, you can even, if you had, let's say, Nomadic TV, in the name of your company, you can go and cover any event, they will let you in for free if you register in advance. So, if you just want to go for free events do that, if you want to actually get some networking out of that. Perfect.

Omar  

That's super cool. I didn't think it was, like, I didn't think there was like a shortcut that way to kind of slip in and actually do this. So that definitely is going to bring a lot of value to my audience who's ever wanted to become a reporter. And it's funny, like having this conversation with you so far. When I was younger, I used to have dreams of becoming a reporter. So like, it was always a dream of going to travel. Right. And I was trying to see how can I continue long term travel with career opportunities what do I have available to me, and reporting was definitely one of them.

But my college my, my university didn't offer any sort of like, broadcast communication degree. So I ended up doing geology and said, but if I did take broadcast, completely different opposite side, right? I know, because I thought to myself, “Oh, yeah, like, if I get a geology degree, that means I get to travel and see beautiful places on the planet.” And it's not really how it works, by the way. But it didn't have a broadcast communications degree, but it's really almost promising to hear. At this point. 

Now I know what I do, and I love what I do. So maybe if I ever get an opportunity, I might randomly go and say, “Hey, let me just cover this one event and see how it turns out.” But it's really promising to my younger audience, and I do have a pretty big younger audience to where it's like 18, to 20 year olds, just trying to figure out what they want to do.

And that's really promising to know that these people can actually go out there and just kind of network and figure out these opportunities for themselves. And just if they have good enough communication skills to even land a job.

Whitney  

And the thing is, you need to be like, you need to be a go getter, if you just wait around. And unfortunately, let me tell you, there's a lot of different, for me, being from Eastern Europe, I've always had to work for everything, but some other cultures, they're kind of, including here in the UK, they're kind of used to things being delivered to them. So maybe they're not as go getting and as, for example, some other cultures where I come from.

I remember, in my first year of university, I was already going out for it. I was getting internships and local radio stations, local TV production companies, just because I would ring them up. And I would say, “Hey, do you need somebody for two or three weeks over Easter break as an intern, pay me minimum wage, or don't pay me anything, if I could afford it at that time. Or I would, like, do bartending work in the evenings or something, and I would be good.

I would actually get more internships than my local, kind of local, even the students from the same town, I would be going on the local radio, a Latvian girl and some English kids, from Leeds. They wouldn't be able to get anything in the Leeds, because they're just waiting around.

So you can't be waiting around, go to that event, reach out to, for example, some company and just go and see, maybe you can interview somebody, build your portfolio. So the whether is a company or it doesn't have to be in journalism, but when there's an employer that you're interested in, you have a body of work to show them.

Omar  

How are you building your portfolio Exactly. Like what’s in that portfolio.

Whitney  

For example, go to an event, take photos, okay? Or take a video and then make a YouTube reel or have, for example, your own blog, but maybe try and post it through LinkedIn or Medium or whatever kind of you need to have or even just on paper just make your own. But make sure that you if you go somewhere, like I said, let's say you registered for Geneva Motor Show, you're a motor enthusiast, you have a TV station or not TV station, you have a blog called newest cars, so just, instead of just repurposing what someone else someone else has done, register for this, it's you can get in for free because you are a media representative. 

Even if it is a blog, and sometimes real media hate these bloggers, we see them everywhere. And if they don't know the norms, like they're like jumping in front of the real cameras. Yeah, you would not earn anything. But if you’re respectful and helpful then all’s good.

Omar  

That's some very awesome advice there, Whitney. Thank you for that. Definitely gonna bring a lot of value to my audience. Now, I want to move forward here to the story that I'm incredibly interested to hear. North Korea. First of all, how did you get in? How the hell did you land that story?

Whitney  

Well, I did not go there with my work. I went there, part of the kind of wonderful experience as a journalist is, if you do work, let's say, a month in a row with, work all weekends, all hours, you get to get some extra days added to your holiday leave, or you can then take, a week off or two weeks off or whatever, depending how hard you worked, right. And I mean, that's in most countries, they can't just enslave you, 24 hours a day, 365.

But so this is one thing I did, I actually had worked pretty hard the whole year. And in 2014, just before I left Moscow, I thought, why not go on a very, very cool trip. I had three weeks, between resuming my studies in London and starting there as a freelancer for IP. And I've kind of just finished my contract in Moscow. I thought, “Well, okay, let's do this.” And I went on a trend, Siberian Express. So I started in Moscow, and I went by train all the way through Mongolia, all the way to China to Beijing. But why stop there? Why not go to North Korea.

So I actually went also from Beijing further by train to North Korea. And it's only possible to enter with a tour agency, you can't enter by yourself, you need to be part of a group.

Omar  

Will the Latvian passport let you go in?

Whitney  

Yes, but you have to obviously, with the tour agency, you have to apply for a not a visa, but kind of like an entry permit in advance. But they will sort all that out for you. I mean, it'd be pretty difficult to sort it out by yourself, if not impossible, and even if you managed to sort all that by yourself, you still have to join a group once you get there. So, just easier to go through. I used Lupine Travel, and it was the first budget travel agency that had tours in North Korea.

Omar  

Interesting. Okay, cool. Lupine travels, We'll keep that one in mind. So you got to the border, what happened after that?

Whitney  

So, got to the border and I think this was the first place, first time I've ever experienced culture shock. And I hadn't really thought about what culture shock was before because I know it didn't affect me. I was such a traveler, so experienced, what a culture shock, this will never happen to me. Until I was, I hadn't even properly entered North Korea, I was just on the platform.

So basically, the way it is, you stop at the border between China and North Korea, and they check your passport, they take your devices, they check your devices, like phones and stuff and check your bags if you're not carrying any Bibles or anything like that. And you'd have to kind of wait, for an hour or so. And they've told us “All this might be an extra delay, because we're building an international platform, we're building a platform to connect.” There's like an ad, I was like, “Okay, okay.”

And then, as they're saying it, I see these two people kind of two border guards, with lady in heels, and some border guard man carrying a stretcher, literally from the 17th century, with some very misshapen bricks in it. They're kind of like carrying it past, towards the new platform. And then, sometime later, we see them carrying it back and then carrying it forwards and carrying backwards. And they just carried this terrible stretcher, back and forth in front of us for show. 

Omar

So it was just a facade. 

Whitney

It was a facade, but also it’s a show. I was like, wow, okay, this is culture shock. Yeah, culture where they think they have to put up a show for tourists. It's really...

Omar  

Two guards with a stretcher and bricks. That's amazing.

Whitney  

I mean, who would ever believe that she builds a block off? She's wearing heels. 

Omar  

Yeah, that is hilarious. So that is one of the funniest stories I've ever heard about a country. That's amazing.

Whitney  

I'm glad you appreciate it. It's hard to kind of, to pass it on to someone who didn't experience it right there and then. But, no, it was cool. And then we kind of took the train all the way in and I'm glad I went by train. This is also partly why where they can keep it so economical.

Omar

Right.

Whitney

I think I only paid 500 pounds back in the day to do the five day tour of North Korea, including all the food, all accommodation, everything. That's incredible. Yeah, all the train and training even was included. So then we took the training and we kind of got settled in our hotel for the night. And this hotel in North Korea, it's on a peninsula or like a little island of its own and you can't get off it because they kind of lock your exit. You can't. They're armed guards. So once you’re in the hotel for the night you can't leave.

Omar  

You can't even leave the hotel at night.

Whitney  

No, you can't leave it during the day, night. You’re just locked in.

Omar  

You have to stick with a tourist agency and anything that they're not doing with the agency, you can't go and explore on your own.

Whitney  

No, you can't.

Omar  

Okay. Make sense. So carry on, you stuck at the hotel at the first night, what happened after? So I'm sure at this point, like you explored a country with the tourist agency, right? Like, what did he say?

Whitney  

So basically, it was like a five day tour. And we went to the demilitarized zone, we went up to the mountains, we even went to the circus, we went down into the metro, we actually got to take some walks, like, from the National Library, walk down the promenade, there were quite a lot of cool activities. So activities, and they, it was a good planning, and we got to see many, many cool aspects of North Korea, but it was, so a lot of people told me before I went off, you're not going to see the real country, you're just going to see the show. And I was afraid of this, I thought, maybe they're right. But actually, the show was so obvious.

Like, for example, we'd be driving past the field. And suddenly, this tour guide stops talking, kind of “Turn stores aside,” and obviously, it's kind of natural. It's like a psychological trick. And everyone also, like turns to the side out of the window. And in a couple seconds, you see, like, there are all these workers in the field, someone's waving a flag, somebody is playing the accordion, and like, they're passing, like, packets of rice to each other in the field, you're smiling. They’re singing. 

Omar  

And so their entire country is a facade.

Whitney  

Well, there are certain facade elements everywhere you go

Omar  

For the tourists, for the tourists are coming in.

Whitney  

They must be like some, “Okay, we're approaching now activate, former union one.” And then...

Omar  

Oh, my God, that is insane. That is, I never knew.

Whitney  

It's so obvious when the show starts and ends that of course, you get to see the real country? Of course you do.

Omar  

Right. It's just like, you know what's going on behind the closed curtains, but they're still doing all of us? Yes. Was there anything, was so, I mean, they're human beings so were there moments where they slipped up, and that you saw something kind of out of the ordinary?

Whitney  

Oh, they were, that's the thing. I mean, during the show, they're actors. But when you actually, obviously, you get to, I mean, we're taking the bus and the train and everything, not the whole country is not a show, they put these some of these show elements dispersed. One on day one, one on day two, etc, etc. But you get to see the real people. So if you'd be driving down the highway, you'd see people just resting on the trees, working lazily in the fields or just, doing nothing, and then suddenly, you see the super hard working farmer union. So, obviously, you see that there was a vibe.

Omar

What was the vibe?

Whitney

The vibe in North Korea was not very good. Like how you said before about those who have the hardest or the poorest, they're always the most welcoming. I have to say North Korea was the first country in the world where the children were not smiling. And places like India, they are so poor, they're smiling, places all over the world. The poorest, the children are always happy, they're smiling, they're happy they're playing. In North Korea, no one is smiling. The children are, not even children are smiling. I mean, that is such a hard thing to see. And it's just so they're so brainwashed.

That a it's really quite disturbing. I mean, serious children kind of sad, serious looking children. That's, they look finely fed, they didn't look like they're starving. I mean, starving ones are far away from tourists. But they were just not happy. They were just also, people were so angry and so scared of foreigners. Actually, I remember when we were boarding for the platform on the train, we kind of like old approach with our suitcases, like there were 10 of us and 10 tourists in the group.

And we just approached like normal people queuing, and five seconds later, I turned around and suddenly, we've been like, everybody's left the platform like to go to different sides, just to be further away from us, the dirty foreigners, whatever. So there's real fear there. It's not a pleasant place. There's a lot of strange vibes.

Omar  

I once heard the story with a tourist company that a group of people went out. And either this was on the news or I heard it from a friend I don't remember exactly, but there's a tourist company that went out and one of the people decided when they were in like a museum or something to take one of the posters hanging on the wall and just kind of roll it up and kind of hide it and they got caught. And what happened was they got sent to their jail or something. And they were stuck there for a few weeks and either they died or they were released but treated completely in humanely the entire time. Did you see

Whitney  

Yeah, it was an American guy

Omar  

So you did see it on the news? It was on the news.

Whitney  

Either he was given death penalty or something, oh, he died in prison. I can't remember that he died.

Omar  

That's insane in the fact that people are still going on these tours to selected, fortunately enough, I'm guessing nothing like that happened to the tourist company that you went with. But was everyone very cautious on this tourism tour as well, like, if you're coming to North Korea the first time and you don't know what to expect, and you're going on this tour, did you see people in your bus or in your group kind of on the edge like is something going to happen to me or just keeping their hands to themselves and not really making sure they go out of line?

Because there's always like, for me, for example, when I'm on a tour, what not in North Korea, but in other places, I'm always going to be a little bit cheeky, maybe go off the beaten path, try to figure out if I can touch this thing or touch that thing. And without any consequences. That's just the way that I do tours. I enjoy them more that way. Was there anyone like that? Or was it just more like fear in your group?

Whitney  

Look, anybody who would even sign up for a tour to North Korea, you have to assume they are very adventurous and they are very, I mean, they are not the ones to maybe just stick to the rules. And so, of course, there was that. However, there's one thing you need to keep in mind, when you go to oppressed places like this. If you go out of line, or if you do something that's not allowed, it's not you who's going to pay, it's your tour guide. It's people who they've assigned to look after you, it will be their fault. If you did something bad to their country, they will get punished, they might get killed, their families, and that's something to really keep in mind.

Of course, we did our kind of all little bit, explore the hotel, I've told I think a million times a story about how we tried to wander to the fifth floor where we believed an intelligence cell was located because we've read something online, etc, etc. But at the end of the day, you also need to be aware of the fact that you are putting them because they are always three or four or two or three or four minders with you at all times. It's their job. So if you manage to escape, you're putting them at risk, not yourself. Yeah, and especially because we were all Europeans.

I mean, the heaviest offenders was, me from Latvia, there were two guys from Iceland. I mean, who even knows where Iceland is, and one guy from Ireland. So, honestly, we're not American. So I'm there. If we were Americans, and we did something that would be bad, but because we were in like, Latvia, who knows what this country is. We’re kind of inoffensive. And this is, also, by the way, greatly helped me in my career.

When I worked in Russia, I could easily, I speak Russian fluently, and without an accent. So if I needed to, I can break into a company of people or a crowd, and speak Russian and say, “Yeah, yeah, they oppressed us. They're in Latvia, they're Russian speakers,” or if I'm in Ukraine, I could be like, “Yes, I understand. The terrible Russians also tried to take over our, east,” or whatever. So I can kind of play all sides. And because I'm in such an inoffensive country, Latvia, it's really worked in my favor over the years.

Omar  

Insane. What an incredibly interesting place. And makes me think, like, if you were actually born there, that sucks. 

Whitney

It really sucks, big time.

Omar

It really does. But then what an incredibly interesting place. I don't even think Americans can go there. At least at the moment. I know, there's just really big tensions always so but definitely on my list at some point, if I ever get a double passport or something like that, that's super cool.

Whitney  

You could try. You should try.

Omar  

There's nothing that's gonna stop me from trying. I'll tell you that.

Whitney  

It's easier than people think. You just, I think, you need to read up about it a little bit. Reach out to one of those companies. They have also a national I think it might for Americans, you might need to go through their national tour agency, which is called something like Kyoto, or not Kyoto, Kyoto? Sorry. Come something with a K.

Omar 

If you try to remember let me know.

Whitney  

Koryo tours or something like that. That's their national travel agency. So you might need to go through that. Because back in the day I definitely, I met Americans there was another group at the same time as us. But it wasn't a group, it was like a couple and they were I think American or something like our Canadian.

Omar  

Keep that in mind. So to, I guess, finally wrap things up and get to the last bit of the podcast here. What are you doing today, Whitney? What's floating your boat?

Whitney  

So? Okay, well today I currently work for NATO. But I'm doing many, many different things. Honestly, I'm trying to branch out into as many things as I can, I learned languages, constantly. I was just doing an intensive Mandarin course couple of weeks ago, through Harvard. And I'm doing my master's degree, also through Harvard. And unlike day trading, I have my career consultancy, that's going quite well. I'm on clubhouse, I'm on Tiktok, I'm slightly on Instagram. At least they used to be more. So obviously, I'm still working for NATO. So that takes up the majority of my time. But what, there's so much going on, I've probably forgotten many things, even to mention.

Omar  

Is journalism happening through NATO journalism, or what are you doing for them?

Whitney  

I'm a press officer now. So I kind of help journalists tell the NATO story. So I'm now from the other side, 

Omar

Oh, fancy.

Whitney

The journalists who want to write about NATO, I help them make that happen. And I also really enjoy that part of this industry.

Omar  

Super cool. Super cool. I'm excited to see how that goes for you. I've got a final question for you, right? Oh, yeah. Okay. Yeah. And this is a question that I asked everybody that comes on this podcast. And it's going to be incredibly exciting to see what a journalist has to say about this, right? Because this is the first I've had another journalist on my show before, but we never went nearly as in depth as you did here.

So I'm incredibly excited to advance ropey. And the question is, if you had a billboard, in space, right, and on that billboard, everybody could see it every single day, just by looking up like, you know, the way that you see the sun the same way they would see your billboard, if you could write a few sentences on there, or even one sentence on that billboard, what would you want it to say?

Whitney  

So it could be something so basically, along the lines of the messages that you make your own reality, but I think the way that I would like to because it's such a broad phrase, and a lot of people don't understand what that means. So maybe I could say something like, “You live your truth.” Because what I mean by that, is that, how, and I'm quite interested in all this stuff, like law attraction, manifestation and all of this.

And basically, how is it possible that one person, if they say, all the good things come with hard work is true. And for the other person says, all the things that are meant to be will come easy. How is it that both of those are true for one person, they truly have to work hard for every good opportunity, for other person all the right and good opportunities to come easily. That's because you live your truth. You make your reality.

Omar

You are your thoughts.

Whitney

You see, that's a little bit too broad. And also, you make your realities a little bit too broad, because people are like, “Okay, well, let me just, like, make, give it like a mantra, I am rich, I am rich, blah, blah, blah.” But that's not actually like...

Omar  

See, when you the mantra.

Whitney

What you believe the truth is.

Omar

That's when you say, I am rich, I am rich, I am rich in your own head over and over as an affirmation, you really try to convince yourself of something that you're not. And that's obviously in the back of your head, when you're saying that, in the back of your head, I'm not really rich. But here you are seeing in the front words, saying I am rich, it's like lying to yourself. Right? At that point, when you're making a vocal, you're lying to yourself. And because you're lying to yourself, there's this weird, twisted way that your brain is gonna say, you're lying to yourself.

So these affirmations aren't gonna work for you. It's the difference between a pink elephant thing, right? If I don't think about a pink elephant, if I keep telling myself “Don't think about a pink elephant, don't think about a pink elephant.” I'm gonna think of a pink elephant, right? It's the same thing. But if you truly believe something, and you don't even need to say it out loud. And that's where the law manifests. And there's so many different words for it, right? So many different things.

Whitney  

I think maybe I've come up with that, the line goes only three words would be “You are right.” You're right. No, you're right. I like that. Yeah, that is it. You're right. If you think your boss hates you, right. If you think you're poor, you're right, etc, etc. If you think you're rich, if you truly believe it. Or if you truly believe that your boss loves you, you are also right.

Omar  

That is a very true way of saying like that. It's funny. There's so many different ways to say that exact sentence, but it really does just come down to that. And I don't even want to dive into the psychology behind it or or the ideas behind it. Because really, it can be stemmed down to just those three words.

Whitney  

You're right, Omar.

Omar  

Right. There you go. I love it. Boom. Now where can people find you, Whitney.

Whitney  

Well, I'm quite active on tik tok these days you can find me by searching it my Latvian name it's Vniti Jas V-N-I-T-N-I J-A-S also same on Instagram really or on clubhouse same first name, or on LinkedIn still same first name. So find me everywhere.

Omar  

Fantastic. I'll be sure to put that in the show notes. Do one final thing for me here Whitney. In Russian say thank you for listening to the Nomadic Executive.

Whitney  

Can I say it in Latvian?

Omar  

Say it in Latvian then. Yeah.

Whitney  

Paldies , ka noklausījāties nomadic executive.

Omar  

Boom, love it. Thank you so much for coming on today. Whitney.

Outro

What an awesome episode that was with Whitney, who knew North Korea would be such a real time circus. Tune in next week as always, for more entertaining and value filled episodes. This is Omar signing off.

Remember Nomad fan. We've got some incredibly value filled episodes planned out for you. So please hit that subscribe button and leave a review. Your review helps us podcast become more visible and ultimately inspire more people just like you.

TNE-Outro 

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