I left St James's Place for an IFA and Instantly Regretted it!

Should technical professionals go freelance immediately or start as employed advisers? Alwyn Van Staden's journey offers a fresh perspective on entering financial planning from a technical background.

In this episode of Financial Planner Life, we chat to Alwyn about his strategic career path from investment management to financial advice. Despite having deep technical knowledge and years of experience at major firms, Alwyn made a choice to join St. James's Place as an employed adviser instead of going independent immediately.

The result? He's now managing over £150 million in client assets as an independent adviser with Pinnacle Wealth Management.

Alwyn shares his perspective on why employment first worked better than jumping straight into freelance life, how technical skills transfer to client success, and why building confidence matters more than rushing into independence.

Sam and Alwyn discuss the real pressures of starting a financial planning career, the benefits of structured training programmes, and how employment can actually be more liberating than restrictive for career changers.

The episode’s key takeaways 🔥

• Why technical professionals often fear client-facing roles and the strategic benefits of being employed
• How St. James's Place's training programme builds real confidence and removes business pressure
• Why are technical skills becoming a competitive advantage in client relationships
• The power of life planning through Voyant software to create visual client stories
• Building a referral based practice through exceptional client delivery
• The transition from employed adviser to successful independent practice
• Why employment and independence are complementary career phases, not competing paths

If you're considering a move into financial planning, especially from a technical background, this episode offers a practical blueprint for making the transition successfully.

⏱️Timestamps:

0:00 - Introduction and Alwyn's background 

5:15 - The decision to leave technical roles for financial planning 

12:30 - Why he chose St. James's Place over going independent 

18:45 - The power of structured training programmes 

25:10 - How technical skills translate to client success 

32:20 - Building confidence through the employed route 

40:15 - The transition to independence with Pinnacle Wealth 

47:30 - Life planning and the Voyant software approach 

55:45 - Building a referral-based practice 

62:10 - Future plans and inheritance tax focus

Financial Planner Life is sponsored by Redmill Advance

Whether you're starting out, already qualified, or building a training academy, Redmill Advance delivers expert-led learning, exam support and CPD from Level 4 to Chartered.

✅ Trusted by top UK firms

👉 www.redmilladvance.com/fpl

Be sure to follow Financial Planner Life on YouTube for extra content about  career development within Financial Planning. 

Reach out to sam@financialplannerlife.com in regards to sponsorship, partnerships, videography or podcast production. 

Want to appear on the Financial Planner Life podcast? Drop Sam a message.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:02

So, does technical advice make you a better financial planner? Today I'm joined by Alwin from Pinnacle Wealth Management. He spent time in investment management and also building and managing power planning teams. Today he tells us about his journey in financial planning, his journey that St. James's place to becoming a self-employed advisor, and why starting out employed for him was the right choice. He now manages up to 80 million of high net worth assets. And today he also talks about the Pinnacle Life Plan and how this is absolutely supercharging its client relationships and generating huge referrals. Gonna love this episode. Alwyn, thank you so much for joining me today on the Financial Planel Life Podcast. How are you? Hello, Sam, and hello listeners. I'm very good, thank you. Hello listeners, don't you? The first person who's ever said hello listeners. I love that fair play. Excellent stuff. Um well listen, thanks so much for joining me today. It's a special episode. It's our partnership episodes with St. James's Place, where we talk about all things St. James's Place, whether someone started in an academy role or gone straight in as a partner or work underneath a partner practice. Lots of different people, lots of different walks of life, end up becoming St. James Place financial planners. And um, we're gonna find out about your story, if that's okay.

SPEAKER_01 1:16

Yeah, of course. Happy to share my uh journey before, during, and store with St. James's Place.

SPEAKER_00 1:22

Yeah. Amazing stuff. Right, but let's just go back to the beginning of your career within financial services, within financial planning. Where did you start?

SPEAKER_01 1:31

So um my degree was in investment management, right? So uh um, you know, uh it was studying everything around investments and understanding investment markets and and so on. Um, and so when I left a university, it was only natural to to apply to uh uh various investment houses um uh back then. And uh and so my first career was being the mouthpiece, as it were, the communication channel for a sizable uh investment firm and communicate the investment management strategy to various financial advisors.

SPEAKER_00 2:08

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 2:09

And so that was my first, I guess, um um uh experience with with financial advisors. So I was communicating complex investment markets uh to financial advisors and and sometimes to to clients as well, uh, to and and to these different financial advisors.

Early Career In Investment Management

SPEAKER_00 2:28

Lovely. In that role itself, then, because a lot of people um sit in kind of business developer roles for investment houses or product providers, service providers, and they like me, and my background was recruitment for financial planners, so I understood the market as a whole. Did you find that that job gave you a really good insight into the differences between different advisors and different advice firms?

SPEAKER_01 2:52

Absolutely, yes. Uh I mean um so so the first thing is I mean, uh all of the I mean I've I've come across hundreds of financial advisors, and I and I think that that's a privilege. So um, but it also gives you the different personalities. So just like the world and everybody around us had got different personalities, our financial advisors have got different personalities. And and the way that uh they do things, even even within a confined space of uh, you know, uh legislation and so on, they all do things differently.

SPEAKER_00 3:26

Absolutely, yes. Okay. And what was it about financial planning at that point then that got you interested?

SPEAKER_01 3:32

Well, at that stage, I mean, though this was still uh in my early 20s, uh mid-20s. Um I didn't I I mean I I I saw financial advisor and I thought you know, maybe this is something I could do. Um I was still, I guess, very young still then. So at that stage, I I didn't fully think that I could do that yet, uh, if I if I'm only honest with you. Um, it's only uh uh a bit later when I joined another firm when um when I thought, you know, m maybe I should consider being being a financial advisor.

SPEAKER_00 4:05

Okay, well, tell us about that then. What was the beginnings of you having that thought and what job role were you doing at the time? What was your first entry point into financial planning?

SPEAKER_01 4:12

Yeah, sure. So like any young person, uh I did a bit of traveling um and uh and and uh yeah, lived abroad for a bit, and uh yeah, and and um got married and and then settled down a bit. And so at that stage, uh I joined a firm in Bristol. Uh it was an was an IFA practice, it was a it was an up-and-coming uh uh practice, a very successful one. Um and um and and and that gave me uh a lot of opportunities. So I I joined, I think, uh on the back of being a a uh compliance checker.

SPEAKER_00 4:51

Okay, like a file checker too.

Head Of Investments And Paraplanning

SPEAKER_01 4:52

Yeah, um, but never checked one file because uh because um when when the managing director returned, um he he said, you know, tell me about your background and investments, and and we started having a conversation. It ended up being a few hours about their investment proposition and so on. Um so long story short, uh ended up being head of investments of the firm, uh overseeing probably around 600 million. Um and um and this firm had uh I think about 40 financial advisors across the country. Um, and so you had a whole ecosystem of what you referred to the centralized investment proposition, how you manage that. So that was a central role. Um, and and then also, of course, uh how uh how the advisors present that to the clients and just everything, the ecosystem that runs around that. Um and then uh later that developed uh to to say, you know, where else can I be needed? Uh and and one thing that there was um that I thought that could be improved was the power planning side of the business. Um so uh so yes, so I I I put put my head up, hand up and said, you know, I I can help with this. And I know you know that there wasn't because there was so much business coming in and it wasn't running smoothly, and I said, look, I've got a strategy. Uh and so I headed up a power planning team as well, um, and just put put that in motion. So um so really cut my teeth into every aspect of financial services, you know, everything around being a financial advisor, just not being a financial advisor, uh, from the investment management, uh, from the risk uh uh process, um, from uh the power planning and outputing of that. Uh, but also I think which is relevant for for our later conversation, is doing due diligence as well. So if you're an IFA, uh of course, uh you now have to understand the market. And if I mean with a market, uh it is uh understanding, yes, of course, investment management and the funds, uh, and there's loads of them, but also the different platforms, um, you know, because people's money is kept on a platform where the funds are, and then also understanding your competition. Um so uh so so yeah, so so so uh a broad spectrum, uh it was a busy office, uh, you know, a lot of hats on, um, but but that definitely gave me a lot more insight, deeper insight into financial service and financial advisors.

SPEAKER_00 7:27

I love it. So have you got quite an analytical brain brain because it tends to, by the sounds of it, the types of roles that you were doing at the time that you um found yourself moving into after the conversation that you had were quite technical focused. They're technical building teams that are technical people, and then the research element around investment, even doing due diligence across the markets and understanding how financial planning works as a whole, but also what your competitors are up to. So it's a lot of research, a lot of data, a lot of comparison. You know, does that excite you, that type of thing?

SPEAKER_01 7:57

Yeah, so I mean, and and again, maybe this is to the to to anybody listening here as well. I mean, uh, I think if you if you go back 10, 20 years, I probably wouldn't be a financial advisor because that would have been seen a sales role. Um, but financial services have evolved uh and uh the complexities around the background that goes on do need technical people. It's it's full of us, you know, all the way from investment management, um, you know, the understanding with with trusts, um, you know, uh uh uh you know just the IT, uh you know, it's a whole ecosystem that supports financial advisors. I'm just one of those individuals.

SPEAKER_00 8:36

Um let's talk about power planners. I mean, there's there's roughly around about nine and a half thousand and then tons and loads of administrators. We've got an advice gap. We've got an advisor gap. But uh do you think that we can plug that gap with some of those skilled individuals in those technical roles?

SPEAKER_01 8:55

Yeah. Um I mean, I think the last stat I saw I think was uh I think it was 28,000 registered financial advisors, uh average age 57 or 58. Um, and yet the need for financial advisors has never been more. Um and so and it's not not just our industry, but who's gonna fill those gaps? And um and so the reason I started uh tilting towards uh being a financial advisor is saying is uh you know, where's the opportunities going to be in the future? Uh it's clear that that that there's gonna be a shortage of financial advisors. Um so even with myself, maybe with not you know the best sales skills, there's a space, you know, and there's an opportunity.

SPEAKER_00 9:42

Let's bring that in because you have said that a couple of times, the sales skills and you know, financial planning is considered a not a sales job, but you need sales skills. Uh would you agree?

SPEAKER_01 9:53

Yeah, absolutely. Um, and uh but but I think um you know that there's two sides to it. What what are we ultimately doing? What is it, what is it that's in that's important? It's always the end client. You know, there's a lot of responsibility on taking on being a financial advisor. You are helping people for the rest of their lives, potentially. If you think you know the journey that they're gonna go on with you is yes, their working career, but at some stage their uh salary is gonna stop or their income and they're gonna live off what you've done and created potentially for another 40 years. And so, you know, again, you know, the the you know that that that creates the technical side, but but then also you know, understanding that that that you need to to take these people on a journey and take those complex, detailed information and simplify that. And that is a bit of a trick, of course. You know, I'm not saying uh I I got that right at the start, and that's something I had to learn. Um, but I always say is you know, you know, anybody interested, uh, have you got friends? You know, have you got friends? Have you got a partner? If the answer is yes, you're a salesperson, you know, you've sold yourself. So, you know, have the confidence of what you've got in the background in in terms of technical skills, uh and and going g go and share that with with real life clients and make a difference.

SPEAKER_00 11:16

Well, you did it, you moved from a technical position, deep research. Um, you said you obviously had some learnings along the way of how to adapt into a financial planner and how to build the relationships and maybe tone down some of the technical knowledge, so you're not bamboozling somebody who has no clue about how an investment works and probably doesn't need to know, right? Exactly. So when you decided to move on from the more technical roles and become a financial planner, tell me about that point. Why you made that decision, how you made that decision, what did you do to do some research on what the best firm was to join in your eyes?

Advisor Gap And Sales Skills

SPEAKER_01 11:47

Yeah, so I so um it's not perfect, of course it's not. So this firm I worked for, it had all my hats on. Um even though I was doing all of that, I was have to ask myself, is this really one I wanted to do? Um, and then it was one day that that I came to the realization actually, you know what I want to be? I want to be a financial advisor. You know, that's the kind of thing I I want to do and and then stick to. Um, and uh and and also what also helped is it was a successful firm. The writing was on the wall that that this firm is going to be taken over. That often happens with smaller IFAs, you know, that's maybe something to consider. Um and and so I just one day approached the managing director and said, I want to be a financial advisor. I've now got my qualifications and I want you to to support me on that journey. And so there was a bit of pushback because of course I'm useful in all the other roles and and and what you know, why do you want to change? And I said, Look, I appreciate you know what what you need, but at the end of the day, I have to think about what I need as well. I'm not saying is I'm gonna go all of a sudden, you know, let's take me on this journey. And and kudos to them is they then put me through their little academy, as it were, you know, and and and and got me to um CF 30 status. Um and perhaps I I still would still be there today. It was it was okay for a good firm, um, you know, as an IFA, but they got taken over. And so I had to reflect on myself, where do I go next? Um, and so um the new takeover firm, I didn't quite feel quite that they were right for me. Um, and so uh I came across St. James's Place, and so just the normal recruitment process, and um, and that's where my journey with with St. James's Place started.

SPEAKER_00 13:35

Okay, so just tell me a little bit about how you came across St. James's Place, a man who uh prides himself on his research and due diligence. Did you conduct any?

SPEAKER_01 13:44

Yeah, so uh if you rewind back a bit, um, and um uh earlier I told you about that that we had to understand the market, and one of the things, of course, that financial advisors do and come across it is um is clients having um existing holdings with other firms and including financial advisors as well. Um, that those kinds of um clients would would often land on my desk, and then um we need to to do the research on those companies to understand, you know, is it in the client's interest to make a recommendation for something better and what we can offer? So you have to understand, of course, where those companies invest, what their charges are, um, you know, what the kind of service they do, and so on and so forth. Um and so um so so of course I did research in in many, many IFAs and and and leading financial advisor firms, and and of course St. James's Place as well. Um and and at the time um there were three things that that that that that that struck me from St. James's place. Um the the first thing is even though they were already the uh the sizable and leader in the market in terms of just declined numbers, um not many landed on my desk. Um and and and that and that that signaled to me that that it was a bit of loyalty. So it went you know that they had their financial advisor and they were happy, uh right. And if and then a few that did let land on my desk gave me the opportunity to to really go into detail. Uh so the first thing, even back then, is that there was this notion that that SJP's charges were expensive. Now that's subjective to to to who you know who who anybody views it. Um but I took took took the the effort to to look at all the charges. And um if you understand the financial uh services industry, there are broadly three charges, whether it's independent, IFA or St. James's Place, it's the financial advisor that you pay for, it's the platform and the fund manager. Now you can add uh uh um transaction fees to that as well, but in terms of a service that you're paying, it's those three for. And um what St. James's Place did is they they bundled it all three together and it was an all-inclusive price. And I thought that was really good because uh IFAs don't always do that, and and I wasn't I was in that industry. So I think any listeners here and IFAs listening, and you have to be really honest with yourself, if you show fund performances, are you only showing fund performances, or are you including your platform and your financial advisor were that? Because only then are you comparing like for like. And so when I did that with with St. James's Place, and we ignored the early withdrawal charge because you know that exit penalty, because most people didn't pay it, their fees were either the same or slightly cheaper. So so so uh we couldn't say that we were cheaper, and then performance. Um and then so performance, you know, for a similar risk, the performance was on par. But of course, our system that we compared it with didn't deduct ongoing and the platform uh uh any advisor charge. So when you did that, it we were there and thereabouts. So I I didn't see that that that that St. James's place was anything other than as good as us.

SPEAKER_00 17:14

That's interesting. You had a good understanding also of the IFA world anyway. So that's good that you made that comparison. I don't I wonder how many people do you know. I I really do. I wonder how many people do go into that deep level. So that's good to hear that you did. So you ended up in St. James's Place. What was the journey there? How did you enter in? Did you go in as a partner at the academy? What was what what was your entry point into St. James's Place and how long were you there for? And what did you do?

Due Diligence On St James’s Place

SPEAKER_01 17:40

Yeah, so uh I um yeah, uh look my my CD was out looking for a new financial advisor role. I wasn't um, you know, honestly specifically looking for St. James's Place because I I mean I knew about St. James's Place and but but then of course went uh came across their recruit recruitment, um, and I thought they were incredibly professional, right? That they took me for for a day um to understand what they are and who they are and how it works and the background and and the and the tools that they have got to offer to me as a financial advisor. I was incredibly impressed. Um, and uh, but I I wanted the security blanket, you know, being mid-career, well quite mid-career, but having a family, I couldn't just start from fresh. And and and knowing as well that somebody with you know with a technical background, maybe a bit later in career, can make the jump, but have the safety net of a salary. Um, so um, but because of the shortage of financial advisors, there is a need for for for somebody like myself to say, can you look after some existing clients where there's no longer a financial advisor? So that was my journey in into St. James's place, um in a in a uh um senior partner practice, as they call it, in in Bristol. And uh um and and and and that giving uh gave me the um yeah, I guess the the benefit of an existing client bank and and and and and and working with that.

SPEAKER_00 19:09

Oh, sorry for interrupting the Financial Planner Life podcast. I hope you're enjoying it. Now, if you think that you would like to be a guest on the podcast because you have a product, a service, or a business that you would like to promote, maybe you want to attract some new talent to your business, there is a link in the comments where you can actually apply to come on the Financial Planner Life podcast. You get that full end-to-end experience that you're so used to from the Financial Planner Life Studios. And if you feel like you've got a podcast that you'd like to start, or maybe a video project, again, click the link in the comment section and book a meeting, and let's discuss that project and get it going in 2026. Now, back to the show. Okay, great. At that point, though, did you think about running your own partner practice? Did you have an entrepreneurial mind at that stage, or were you somebody that enjoyed the security, say, of being an employee as opposed to wearing multiple hats and having the pressure of running a business?

SPEAKER_01 20:02

So um I wanted to be a financial advisor. Okay. I I don't necessarily um want to do well, I don't want to do invoices and uh hiring staff and and and all of that. I mean, I you know, I've I've done a lot of hats on, like I said before. Um, you know, you know, you know, if you want to give advice and focus on that, um, that's the kind of environment that suits me. So uh I am self-employed now, and and we get on to that uh with a bit of journey. Uh, but but anybody that that wants to make the jump and not quite sure, there's an opportunity for that. Of course, it it doesn't come with quite the financial incentives, um, but but that's okay. You know, that's okay for that.

SPEAKER_00 20:45

That that how long were you in an employed role then as a financial planner? How long in your in your career did you spend in that space?

SPEAKER_01 20:51

Yeah, so it's about five years. Okay. About five years uh um in in total, I would say, yeah, as a financial advisor, yeah. Okay, great stuff.

SPEAKER_00 21:00

What did it teach you though the most being employed then? You talked about not having to think about all the things like invoicing and all these extra responsibilities, but what do you think you took the most from being in an employed role for so long?

SPEAKER_01 21:12

Yeah, it depends, right? So I I think I think the benefit of both sides, you you could you could probably say, um, you know, could I have done it earlier? Um, yeah, that this might, you know, and and be more self-employed, yeah, but that there's an element of that. Um, yeah, uh I think again the the key takeaway there is um it is is the benefit of uh of an existing backup, you know, that there that gives you the confidence. And and and as well, I think as well for me the the best benefit is we we talked earlier about okay, I've got all these technical skills. How do you now uh use that in front of clients and make sure that they get a good outcome? And and so without having the um the pressure on Having to bring in business because you're self-employed and there would be nothing else. Uh, you can take what one step back and really uh say, okay, I've got the security blanket of being employed, so I can really deliver a very good outcome for for the client uh and spend more time with them and make sure you know everything is in order rather than just rushing from from from one client to the next. I'm not saying that's always the case with anybody. No, of course. But but but in terms of my experience, I think that that that was the benefit um at least at the start.

SPEAKER_00 22:31

So it gives you some boundaries basically. So for you, like how you think at the time. Maybe this is why you were previously in technical roles, right? Technical is kind of there are boundaries, aren't there? There's kind of facts and structure and all those things. Yeah. Moving from that environment straight into self-employed, for example. I'm trying to get into the mindset, let's say, example, there's somebody in technical roles out there, maybe they've been powerplanner for five years and they want to be an advisor. Like if they've got a similar mindset to you, it might be better just to go employed first.

SPEAKER_01 23:00

I again, the benefit of of seeing many financial advisors from start to late career, don't underestimate this. It's difficult, right? Um, you know, some people make it seem easy, and and there's a reason there's only you know what, 28,000, right? Um, so I don't want to, you know, you you need to be careful. So um if you're young and and you're on a journey and you can do those baby steps, of course that's much easier. But if you've already got a family and if you know and you just make that big jump, um, I I personally that was too big for me, you know. Um, so yeah, makes sense.

SPEAKER_00 23:39

Perfect, great stuff. But it you know, you did you did well in that employed role. You in you you enjoyed that employed role.

SPEAKER_01 23:46

So yeah, so this is my first uh experience with with St. James's place now, being inside as it as it were. Um and um well, you know, like uh you know, like e even from the start, um, you know, you know, we we had a whole training week, even though I was qualified. Um, I mean, I've never had that, just a dedicated uh, you know, um training week at a dedicated place to to St. James's Place, really going into the detail, and then that's where you could see, you know, what toolbox have I really got as a financial advisor at St. James's place? And it's vast. So that I was again being independent, doing some research and stuff, but now I'm now with this restricted place, but it's anything but restricted because there's so many tools available that I definitely didn't have before, from you know, all the options with retirement, uh, all the inheritance tax uh um solutions they've got. And so um so so that that was great.

SPEAKER_00 24:48

Um you felt so you being in that independent world and then stepping into St. James's place, you had more choice in St. James's place in the so-called more restricted proposition than you did in the IFA world.

SPEAKER_01 25:00

My toolbox of what I can advise to clients is vastly improved compared to any of the previous places I worked for.

SPEAKER_00 25:07

Very interesting.

Employed Advisor Lessons And Tooling

SPEAKER_01 25:08

So that that um uh now yeah, of course, HGP is restricted in in a pension that they can provide. But if you look at an IFA, most of them has got one provider with platform that they use 80% of their clients, and they've got this tail end, uh, and then and that's now you know independent. But for the most part, they look and act like it. So, so you know, our pension administration is box standard, but underneath it, I know I have to have the fund managers and investment management. I'm out on the road, I can't do that research. Um, you know, I've got a technical question, I've got access to a team of experts, be that trust experts or you know, law experts or uh pension experts or accountant experts. At my uh you know, at my phone, I can just pick up the phone and I can send an email as well and say, can I just check this with you and and ask some guidance? Uh, you know, we look after millions, and there's a lot of responsibility around this. Um, these are things that that I've only seen at St. James's Place. Now, of course, if you're an IFA, you you can approach a uh uh you know one of the product providers, and I'm sure they've got expertise, but this is all at one place, you know, um and and and uh and tied up within St. James's place. So they have an intimate knowledge of things that that they've recommended, you know, past products, you know, legacy products, uh, you know, just everything is just so much easier. Um and and not even to getting on to the administration as well. You know, if you're an IFA, you've got that platform, this platform, but here I've got everything at once. So again, if we come back to good uh client outcomes, is I've got a grip of what every client needs. So if a client has got you know the same retirement, the same need, the same income, of course, you know, income needs, of course, uh you know, that's very rare because we're all unique. Um, but of course, you you want two clients to have a very similar experience. And I didn't always see that w with an IFA world. Right. Okay. So um so so yeah, I would make that argument that um well interesting.

SPEAKER_00 27:16

We call it the point then, because you were at St. James's Place in Bristol for nearly five years, but I can see from LinkedIn you then went and joined AFH as an independent financial advisor. How come?

SPEAKER_01 27:26

So um yeah, look, uh uh just just for the benefit of of the listeners as well. So with St. James's Place, you uh you work for a partner practice. So all the financial advisors that work there don't work for St. James's Place or or uh you are authorised. So there's an arm's length. So my employment was in Bristol, um, but uh for for personal reasons we wanted to relocate uh to London, and and so I had to look for a new partner practice, as it were, in our new location. Um, and I I couldn't just find one that that was suited to me and and hindsight of regret, and we we can talk about that. Um another opportunity landed on my desk, and um I probably should should have thought about it more, but it it landed on my desk, and and so I I joined Left St. James's place and thought, you know, how bad can it be? Um and so um, so yeah, so we relocated and um you know, still very good friends in Bristol, and you know, they understood the reason why, and they always said, you know, if you want to come back, you know, we we would take you back with open arms. And I thought, okay, well, fine. Um, so so so that's the reason why I I I I left. Yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_00 28:51

So you talked about regret perhaps within that leaving the St. James's Place partnerships, moving into uh an IFA again. Um do you mind just telling us what happened or you know, in br you know, without going into too much detail, but what was it about that leaving SJP, going into an IFA again? Because you jumped from that IFA back into SJP practices, right? So something obviously didn't tick for you. What was it?

Leaving SJP Then Coming Back

SPEAKER_01 29:14

Yeah, look, I mean it's not it's not firm specific, and I and uh and and uh you know many of many of the hurdles, you know, I recognize in in when I did the research in earlier careers and and and everyone else as well. I probably you know you you take things for granted, right? Um, and you know, again, you know, just the the first you know few months of being in an IFA is just chaos. Um, you know, so so now you've got uh, you know, again, an existing client bank that that I looked after, um, uh, you know, because that's where I specialize. But now you've got one is on this platform, one is on that platform, how do you log in? You know, so just practically just getting information from existing clients is a nightmare. So even that is just you know simple. How do you now? Uh I've got a question. Well, where do I go? The resources just you know, like the same caliber wasn't there. Um, but then I think this is this is crucial, absolutely crucial, is the culture, right? And and the culture through the whole firm, you know, of of how it reverberates. Um, you know, when I landed there, the first thing they said to me is, Oh, you're St. James's place advisor, you're expensive and your poor performance. And by that stage, I already knew what their charges were, and I already knew what their performances were. And I simply stated the fact you are more you're more expensive and and you underperform for the same risk. So that's factually not true. And and then they just looked at me. So um, and I said, but but what does that matter? Why are you worried about St. James's place? What have you got to offer? What is your you know, similar strategy, you know, and and and and culture? And and I just didn't see that. Um, you know, St. James's place, everyone carries the ultimate client on their hands. This is everything they want to do from the administration, and uh it's not perfect, of course not, you know, from the investment management team, uh, you know, from the background team in terms of technical side. Um, and and and uh yeah, it it was just wasn't me, right? Okay. Um, so uh so yeah, so I uh picked up the phone and I reached out to St. James's place again. I said, look, can we reconvene and and maybe there's a place now? And was there? Yes. Um you know, there was another partner practice that that that needed someone um called Pinnacle Wealth Management. Um and um yeah, went through the interview process and and and that that's who I'm now uh attached to, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:59

Oh, fantastic. Well, tell us a little bit about your time at Pinnacle then. So going back into Pinnacle, did you go in as an employed advisor? Was there an existing client book for you to work on? Were you involved in investment management at all? Tell us a little bit about that journey, how you got in there, and what you're doing, and where are you now?

SPEAKER_01 32:14

Yeah. So um, so the the the partner practice for wealth management in Bristol was very successful, looking after high net worth clients. Um and um and and Punnycle was very similar, um, but only uh big difference is they do it on a much bigger scale. So so so Punnycle is is one of the largest uh partner practices within St. James's place. They look after uh over two billion across 9,000 clients. Um and uh and so um so so they needed uh someone to to look after um some some existing clients, but but of also of course build a business uh inside that. So uh I'm I'm self-employed, but I've chosen Pinnacle to to partner up with. And and one of the things that that there was a a synergy with is um my process, uh, even in Bristol, was doing uh a program called Voyant and and and using that that program as uh as one of my planning tools. Um but Pinnacle also uses that uh in and incorporates that and takes that to another level in something called a life plan. And so that was really attracted to me and and and um and that's why with them fantastic.

SPEAKER_00 33:33

So Voyant, just explain that, just so somebody who might not understand what that actually is. If you explain that, and then if you can then just tell us what this life plan is on top of that, why you feel like it's taking it to the next level.

Pinnacle Life Plan Using Voyant

SPEAKER_01 33:46

Yeah, so um I again, you know, just for the listeners, and I think that this is this is beneficial, is is you know, um, you know, I I keep telling about financial advisor and responsibility. But if you rewind back to uh to years gone by, um people retired and had a final salary scheme that they could just rely on, didn't have to think about anything. And that was great for them, but but these schemes don't don't longer exist. And and and why? It's because you know the the actuaries couldn't get it right. You know, the the uh the schemes were in in deficit and and and and and these are now all closed. So um so many of our clients come to us and and and and planning for retirement is is a big part of it. So um, so you have to now um, you know, if you don't have a financial advisor, you know, you have to be your own actuary, your own investment specialist, uh, your own accountant, um uh, you know, you have to have be forecasting. You know, that that's really difficult. And and uh and so um so so the life plan at the heart of it is uh is is understanding and and answering four basic questions for for uh a client. You know, when can you retire? Uh how much will you get? How long will the money last for? And what can you do better? Um so um so the the way we do that is we sit in front of a a client and really understand what is it that they want to plan for? What is what are their ambitions? What uh tell us about your your your uh your family, tell us about your your children, um, tell us about your ambitions, tell us about your mortgage, tell us about your career, how would that progress? Tell us about when you want to retire uh and what kind of lifestyle you want to live. You know, where do you want to live? What's that gonna cost? What would you do? And it's only if you understand all of those that we then can take that information and put that in sophisticated software, and and that is called voyant. So it's a visual representation uh for clients to see where they are currently at, and we take uh, you know, various different assumptions, growth assumptions, tax assumptions, and we plan their life out in front of them and they can see where there's a shortfall. Can you are you be able to retire at 60? Will you be able to take 50,000? Actually, where you are now, that would be 40 or 30,000. So you're not there yet. And and what about the risks? What are the risks now? If you lose your job now, let's see what the impact is that in the long term to you and your family. You haven't got a will, let's do this. What about inheritance tax? It's only when you do that that you can really start saying, okay, this is what needs to be done. And that is the life plan where we then take that, it's the architecture plans of your life, and then we match it with a toolbox and and the building material provided by St. James's Place. And that those are the two that come together. And and and that's the life plan.

SPEAKER_00 36:57

I love it. And during that life plan conversation where you are uncovering and discovering where they are in their journey, where they want to get to, what's important to them. How many times by the end of that plan have you blown their mind?

SPEAKER_01 37:16

Uh every time. So um, you know, y so you know, I've been a financial advisor before, and then the tendency is just to talk about investment markets, and of course there's still some of that, and you know, you could go on about you know whatever the the topic is today, it's Iran or COVID or whatever. But uh once you start doing the the the life plan with someone and the forward projections, it it shuts the conversation from okay, let's put that to the side, the investments, but this is just me. You know, I'm on this hamster wheel. I don't know when I'm gonna retire, I don't know what what I'm gonna get, but here's the answer, here's the plan. And you can see people's faces just light up. Um, and and they were like, My wife needs to see this. You know, can we can we do another meeting? Um, and um and so it's just I think that stress relief, um, anxiety, just you know, you know, you've now put a plan in motion, and this is going to work, and and and somebody can relate to that. Uh, and I think that that's really powerful, you know. Um, and and then it's not a one and and and and done exercise. Next year you go like, you know, the client goes, can you just show me those projections again? And and people would phone me and say, I just want to look at the projections again. I was like, oh, you know, not much has changed, but let's view it again. So it is definitely valued, um it's really a useful tool. But but also giving them the confidence to say, um, you know, we we've planned for this. Um, you know, if some if there's an event now, don't worry. We've got, you know, this is our plan in in 20 or 10 years. Um so that helps as well. I love it.

SPEAKER_00 38:55

As a financial planner who's now moved into self-employed, how is important how important is it to have a plan like that in place that you can work um work with the clients on as opposed to just guesswork, I guess?

SPEAKER_01 39:08

Yeah, look, it it's it's multi-beneficial, right? So again, you know, my primary concern, you know, and and responsibility are how you feel uh towards the clients and and them reaching those goals and and tangible goals, you know, measurable goals. Um, and and and and and that life plan helps in that journey, absolutely, and and it sets the scene for us what we can do in the future. But it's for me as a self-employed person, what is helpful as well is um it is it it it generates referrals because they value what they get out of a life plan, and they know that they've got a brother-in-law, a sister-in-law, um, you know, their parents um that would benefit from from the same thing. And so for somebody who's self-employed and you want to generate business as well, it's a very useful tool. It's a secondary to the fact that you're just doing a really good job.

SPEAKER_00 40:05

I love that. And it's something tangible that a client can walk away and talk about. I did a life plan with Darwin, and this is what he went through, and this is what we uncovered and discovered, and this is the impact it's had on me. A great referral generator, I could imagine. Would you say that's the case? Are you generating a lot of referrals? Is that the best sort of source of new client inquiry that you get through having an effective plan?

SPEAKER_01 40:31

Yeah, absolutely. Um, so so look, again, anybody listening, you know, starting from scratch is hard, right? So having an existing client bank really helps, right? The the tried and tested best way to get any referral is through your existing clients where you've done a good job. And of course you would do that as well. You know, if somebody is uh, you know, if you know, if you're on a chat group uh and somebody says, you know, I need a boiler repair person, or you know, somebody who's done my bathroom, you're gonna say, somebody did this for me. Um and so um so so so yeah, absolutely, it it's a valuable, valuable tool, you know, that that that they can explain to other people as well. You know, so most investments, everybody's got investments through through their workplace. Um, I think many people understand it. You know, yeah, I've got a financial advisor with, you know, with that does investments, okay, great. Or, you know, I've got a financial advisor who uh who's got this projection program who who told me when I'm gonna retire and how much I'm gonna get. You know, that is, you know, you know, we even optimise tax and it is really you know the clear strategy.

SPEAKER_00 41:44

Um you should go and talk to them, giving the client the ability to understand what it is they're actually doing as well, so they can go on and articulate that to other people is powerful because people love to share good news, people love to talk about how they're managing their money because it's such a huge worry and it's such a huge anxiety. I think most people walk around with it in their head, don't they? God, when am I gonna retire? How am I gonna retire? Are we gonna have enough money? And it's just a constant worry. But having a plan that you said you can go back to or an app that you can go into or whatever, or an advisor that you can phone up and have that conversation with, it becomes that lifeline, doesn't it? And just gets you back on track every single time. Well, let's get the plan out, let's see where you are in the plan, how things change.

SPEAKER_01 42:20

Yeah, I mean, um, you know, if you've got a good financial advisor, and and and and this is look, this is not just St. James's place. Like I said, now most of my colleagues ever I've come across, whatever firm, you know, they were all trying to do to do do the right thing. You know, it's just just talking about the toolbox that they've got to hand. Um, but but yeah, you know, it it is a bit a big responsibility of um you know of how you take those people on that journey.

Referrals High Net Worth And IHT Focus

SPEAKER_00 42:46

Uh yeah, absolutely. Love it. Let's give some people some context then in respect of where you are in your personal journey right now, then. So you're a self-employed uh financial planner and you're working underneath a partner practice, pinnacle. Um you're managing high net worth client relationships.

SPEAKER_01 43:02

Yeah, look, it it's the London area. We we're based in Pinnacle. Um I look after it in excess of 80 million, um, you know, across uh around 80 households. Um and um and yeah, of course, the the life plan forms an important um part of our uh of our strategy. Um, but also more complex things now. And I have talked about retirement uh and planning for that, but also now focusing on more inheritance tax. Um so I like to believe I I'm I'm um I've got a good base uh with with inheritance tax. So um, so so again, you know, you have to go back to my earlier career is what do you want to do? Where's this gonna be an opportunity? Okay, being a financial advisor. But now that you're a financial advisor, is how can you progress within being a financial advisor? And and some people do care licenses and and so on. Um But but for me, it it's inheritance tax. So that's my next journey, of course, looking after my existing clients, getting referrals, um, but also understanding the the uh the immense opportunity of the wealth transfer that's gonna come from the current generation to the next, um, and and and and and just the complexities uh around that with inheritance tax, but also protecting a legacy for for the next generation. Um so that's my next journey um uh within being a financial advisor.

SPEAKER_00 44:32

Fantastic. There's somebody I I'd like to introduce you to actually so remind me of some chap called Ben Mason who heads up a company called uh Kinherit, but they have a really great tool called the Kin Vault, okay, uh, which is where you store all over the handover information upon death. You mentioned the great transition of wealth. We're looking at trillions passing hands, but how much of that money is going to be passed down generationally before the financial advisor even finds out about it and the kids have spent it on a Lamborghini? So they've created this fantastic tool called the Kin Vault, how it keeps the financial planner in the loop. So I highly recommend looking at that if you're getting into the IHT space. It's very, very unique, but it will definitely stop the leaky bucket situation with money going out the back door. So do definitely check that out. Owen, listen, thank you so much for your time today. It's been really great to talk to you, really great to hear your journey. I love hearing about people that spend a lot of time in technical roles that end up becoming financial planners because I think that deep knowledge and understanding of what they actually do, what the profession does and how it works, it does transcend into becoming a very good financial planner, especially if you're somebody that can simplify the complicators and work to a simple plan, which is where you've ended up at Pinnacle essentially. It's a plan. And at the end of the day, with a good plan, we know where we're going. It's a roadmap for life, isn't it? So, Alwyn, thank you so much for sharing that journey with us. Congrats on an awesome career, and um, we wish you all the best in yours.

SPEAKER_01 45:55

So thank you very much, and uh all the best of luck for all the listeners. Thank you. Thank you. Cheers.