Not Giving Up on a Book You Love with Abigail Hing Wen - Loveboat, Taipei

Marissa chats with Abigail Hing Wen about her debut novel LOVEBOAT, TAIPEI, as well as how being vulnerable can bring us closer to other people, and sticking with a book you love even after 26(!) drafts.

Books discussed in this episode can be purchased from your local independent bookstore or buy them online from the Happy Writer bookshop.org store (that benefits indie bookstores) at https://bookshop.org/shop/marissameyer

Order The Happy Writer: Get More Ideas, Write More Words, and Find More Joy from First Draft to Publication and Beyond https://bookshop.org/a/11756/9781250362377

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Transcript

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Marissa Meyer:   0:07
Hi, everyone. And welcome to the happy writer. This is a podcast that aims to bring readers more books to enjoy and help authors find more joy in their writing. I am your host, Marisa Meyer. Thank you so much for joining me today. I truly hope you guys are staying healthy and safe in this season of Corona virus. Um and I hope you're you're doing your best. Practice your self care and reach out to come your community. As I know we continue to be stuck in our own personal quarantines. One thing that is making me happy today is watercolor postcards. My kids received a couple sets of watercolor postcards in their stockings from stand to this year. Turns out Mom likes them even more than they dio. I've found water coloring to be something I'd for gotten about. I used to love it is a kid, and I hadn't done in years and years. Ah, And now I've kind of started to pick it up again and have found it really relaxing. And then I can send postcards to friends and family. So it's been kind of a nice way to stay in touch, eh? So if you can get your hands on some highly highly recommended. Of course, I am also very happy to be recording another episode of this podcast and talking to today's guest. She is the author of Love Boat Taipei, which came out earlier this year and debuted on The New York Times best seller list. And I am super excited to talk to her. Please welcome Abigail King win.

Abigail Hing Wen:   1:39
Hello. Thank you so much for having me. We're so I'm excited to be here.

Marissa Meyer:   1:42
Thank you for deciding to come on. I'm very, very excited to talk to you. How is life in your bunker?

Abigail Hing Wen:   1:49
It's great. We live in Silicon Valley, so we've been in shelter for about 37 days now. We started early, and I think, you know, I actually really love being with my family. You know, as a writer, I would often just be home on my own. And so now we've got, you know, snack breaks in the kitchen, and instead of like going to the water cooler with your co workers, your like going to the water cooler with your kids and your husband and just trading notes about what's going on So I've enjoyed that part of it, but definitely itching to travel. I want to go somewhere.

Marissa Meyer:   2:18
I know I'm feeling the same. It's nice to get the home time in the family time, but it's been long enough now where the cabin fever for me is just kind of starting to set in. How old are your kids

Abigail Hing Wen:   2:30
hating 12 year olds? Sorry, 13 year old now 13 year old and a 17 year old.

Marissa Meyer:   2:34
Okay, so they're older. How are they taking all this? So I think they're enjoying time

Abigail Hing Wen:   2:39
with them. Some with each other, especially my older ones about to go to college. So he's appreciate that you've got a little extra time together. You know, we are, too. Wait, We actually had a funeral right at the start of the shelter in place. It's my one of our extended family members. And so I think that just kind of reminded us it was very sobering Reminder how short life is. Um, you know, with their loved ones. And I think that just kind of has set the tone for our entire time at home together.

Marissa Meyer:   3:05
Yeah. No, that's a good reminder, Teoh. Be appreciative and I think it could be hard to be appreciative when the world is so uncertain right now. But it's nice toe, get a step back and think, OK, what are the good things that are happening here? And what can I be enjoying rather than just what can I be stressed out about? All right, um, so I thought it was funny. Just this morning I received an email from audible dot com. The said Marisa, There's a debut book that we think that you would really love and I opened it and it was promotion for Love Boat Taipei anyway, wow, audible, you know me so well. That's also, um, in the fact I did love Love Boat Taipei. I thought it was fantastic, but I won't talk about it. You tell us travel of people who are not familiar with love Boat Taipei. What is it about?

Abigail Hing Wen:   3:55
So it's billed as a young adult crazy rich Asians meets a Jane Austen comedy of manners, and it's la la Land, and it's the story of Ah Girl named Ever Wong, who is he loves to dance but is going into this intensive seven year medical program where she feels like she's really going to have to give up for dancing. Um, and over the summer, her parents shipped her off to Taiwan to learn language and culture, and she goes kicking and screaming. What she finds instead is this summer free for all, whether the kids are seeking out clubbing and taking glamour shots and drinking snake blood sake. And it becomes this wild, crazy party where she has an opportunity to really explore who she is. Um, and you know what it means to follow her dreams while honoring her parents. And it's actually based on are inspired by a real program in Taiwan that I attended as a teenager myself and its notorious in Asian American circles but for some reason has not just not been that well known outside the community. And so it was kind of an opportunity for me to share some of the, uh, the story. But you know, in a dramatized, fictionalized way,

Marissa Meyer:   4:57
I remember reading cause you have an author's note in the book that talks about how it's based on a real program and that you attended and your husband attended. Um, and I thought it was it was so interesting because in reading the book like it does, it feels so surreal, Like this amazing, magical place where teenagers congee Oh, and like under the guise of education and cultural learning. But really, it's just like a huge fun party. How much of it was fictionalized versus, like with their things from your real experience that you were able to bring into the story? Or was it a lot of it, um, kind of exaggerated, right? So I would say

Abigail Hing Wen:   5:36
the internal journeys are mine. So ever his journey of, you know, tryingto what is me to perceive her dancing when she is on this other track to go to med school, and she's quite good at it. But it's not what she loves and needed. The weight of expectations from her immigrant parents have sacrificed so much to give her the opportunity she has. And so that is very much my journey. Um, but you know, a lot of the story is dramatised by their kind of based on quintessential love boat experiences like taking glamour shot. So I did glamour shots. I didn't take naked ones, but I I saw other people taking glamour shots, and, um, this snake bloodstock? A. My husband actually went on Love Boat a couple of summers before me and we with trade stories over the years. So he and his friends, um, actually snuck over the blue pipe that ever in her friend's sneak over. But myself, my girlfriends and I, we just went out the front door, and there were other people who would climb over the wall and some simple broke their legs. And there's a story I think of someone flinging a pair of shoes over the wall that broke someone's classes on the other side. And so so, you know, over the years have just been a lot of, like folklore that have come from the program, and I drew on. Some of that was, well, a stories from just my friends and community.

Marissa Meyer:   6:45
Well, I want to go. I would be. But it is something like this. Um, it's just the way it's written in the way the story is told. I mean, I'll be so there's a lot of drama and a lot of conflict that makes it a really great compelling story, but just kind of the the atmosphere that you you bring to it in the social quality, Uh, that you highlight in this story, just it felt like being there with the characters. Uh, I really, really enjoyed reading it. Also, I How may readers have been surprised that it does not actually take place on a boat?

Abigail Hing Wen:   7:19
A lot of readers, there was even an advertising very early on for love it that was on a

Marissa Meyer:   7:23
boat. I don't know. This is a vote. Everybody is

Abigail Hing Wen:   7:27
confused by that of even in the Asian American community. So, in fact, I just picked up my old version. Um, there's ah, a couple deleted scenes that made it into the Barnes and Noble Special Edition. And I think Sophie clarifies for everybody is no boat because, you know, it's very common mistake.

Marissa Meyer:   7:45
Well, I'm glad that I'm not alone in that cause I totally expected it to take breaks down a giant crispy right, right in the seventies show. But yeah, it's confusing. Yeah, it would be harder to sneak off of a cruise boat, though. Yeah, about that. A lot of complications, right? To go clubbing. Yes. Eso The book has very much taken the way world by storm. Um, it debuted on The New York Times. You've sold movie rights. Um, how are you feeling? Like Were you kind of expecting it? Teoh Be a sensation or is it all been ist surprised to you?

Abigail Hing Wen:   8:24
Yeah, well, you know, I've been writing for 12 years, so it's been a really long journey. I wrote five novels on the way here and had come closer to them at major publishing houses and couldn't get the marketing. So for this one of all my novels, it's the one that felt like closest to home, like, deeply grounded in my my life and my stories and my my cultural heritage and like the main characters and Asian American girl. So I think there are a lot of reasons why I thought it was going to be a niche story. Um, on And you know, when I went out to to get an agent, I think that's when I first got inkling that Whoa, you know, there's something here because I had had agents reading overnight and huge like I was talking to so many different agents. One agent offered to fly me down to the set on in Los Angeles that she was on for a movie. And, um, you know, I ended up going out to New York and meeting with a bunch agents, and so that was like, I guess the first since I got that There was a lot of buzz around it on. The same thing happened when we went out to the publishing houses ahead a bidding war in auction had not between to speak with a ton of editors, and, um, and then just like even after right after it sold, I started talking with producers, so there was definitely a, um, kind of a crazy amount of interest that I wasn't expecting at all. But by the time it came out in the world, like I knew that, it was a lot of momentum behind it. So I guess there was definitely some hope that it would hit the New York Times list at that point. But you never know. So I was really excited when it did, and also that it hit it for subsequent weeks. That was That's when I really lost it. I'm like, Oh, my

Marissa Meyer:   9:57
God, No, It sounds like such a whirlwind. Um, you seem like you're very grounded that, like you're taking it all in stride just from the way you talk about it. You know, I think

Abigail Hing Wen:   10:08
it's because there's so many ups and downs in a writer's life, and I probably least I would joked at my launch party that had been rejected more than anyone in literary history. But

Marissa Meyer:   10:16
like someone

Abigail Hing Wen:   10:16
contradicted me and they pointed out, Somebody's beaten me. So I just you know, there's just so many ups and downs and, like, you know, you could have flicked Ah ha. I

Marissa Meyer:   10:27
think part of

Abigail Hing Wen:   10:28
it's like coming out of the Vermont College of Fine Arts program, where we had an opportunity here from very successful authors, and they would say things like that. You know, their authors. They'll just make more money than they could imagine for two years. And then it's gone right? It's like being a rock star, and you just never know really how public opinion goes or like, you know, what fads go in and out. And so I think it's just all part of, like, the adventure of life. And maybe that's kind of how I try to look at it. Yeah, when

Marissa Meyer:   10:55
you were going through, you know, those first did You see, there were five novels for this one. Onda. All of those rejections were piling up. What kept you writing?

Abigail Hing Wen:   11:06
My critique partners. They have been so incredibly supportive. You know, at some point they were all published except for me. And then they were publishing their second dolls and some of that four novels out. And I'm like, Why

Marissa Meyer:   11:18
are you still

Abigail Hing Wen:   11:18
reading my stuff? Guys? And they're here stuffs really good. There's just weird reasons why you're not getting beauty Gates. And I think part of that was I had really you know, I was lucky to have really big agents. But the downside, I think that was the only shop to the biggest houses of big predators, and it was always like such a high bar to get my work out. Um, and you know, I don't have people on the flip sizing when I just self published, and I just was ready to do that, even though I do think so. Publishing has a role, and there's a really amazing books that have come out that process like that don't make it through the traditional gates, but yeah, it really was just encouragement of people around me. Um, who they just They believed in me. And I'm so grateful to them, um, you know, like knowing that they had my back at the worst times that there was. There was definitely period of my life that I talked about it. So my other interviews of just hitting the bottom of both my career and my writing life, they were there to pick me up and put me back on my feet, and they set me going again.

Marissa Meyer:   12:18
No, I think having that that writer community is such a huge part of this business, it really makes a huge difference in being ableto whether some of those storms have you been able to stay in touch with them during all of this Corona virus stuff?

Abigail Hing Wen:   12:35
Yeah. Yeah, for sure. We've been doing some sodium calls, and and we're looking at each other on the screens. Like, why

Marissa Meyer:   12:40
don't you

Abigail Hing Wen:   12:40
do this sooner? Because most of us don't get together because we're in other cities and like And so, in some ways, that spend the silver lining of this is that we can pull together communities. Um, that, you know, we always got time, So just didn't across the country.

Marissa Meyer:   12:56
Yeah, it's funny that in a lot of ways, e I mean, I'm like writing so many more cards and letters than I have in the past on by feel like since we've taken out meeting in person as an option. Like, of course, we still have phones and we can still face time an email. But I feel like that doesn't quite fill the void. So we're like, finding other ways. How can I still establish those connections?

Abigail Hing Wen:   13:22
Yes, exactly. We have to work a little harder at it. But there's so much creativity, and it's exciting to see that

Marissa Meyer:   13:27
true and in such a good time to be living in with all the technology. Um, so I want to talk about my personal favorite character in the book is Xavier. I, um, who I loved him largely in part because when you first meet his character, you feel like, OK, I have got this guy figured out. I know he's the playboy. He's the bad boy. Um, I know exactly who this stereotype is on. And then as the story goes on, you just break down every one of those stereotypes and he becomes such a fascinating and just fully fledged character. Um, and I absolutely loved him. Eso I want to know. Like what? When you're building a character like, how much do you did you know about Xavier and how much was revealed over the course of it.

Abigail Hing Wen:   14:19
So, you know, I think what happened with my characters in this book and I write about this with a on an article that I did for sensations, which is Ah, Cynthia Athletic Smith's blawg. Um, I wrote this whole book originally from four points of view so ever Rick, Sophie and Xavier and I wrote 26 drafts like that, um, alternating viewpoints. And within each of those traps, 26 draft. Yes, it was crazy. Um, I just couldn't get it right. And so even within those individual viewpoint chapters, I did this exercise that I learned in my M if a program of making sure that I write each scene from each key person's point of view. So at the end of this 26 drops what I essentially did it. I wrote the book four or five times from each person's point of view, and so that's I think, why my characters have turned out the way they have because it was just all that extra work that I did on accident. Even though, you know, like in retrospect late, I actually should be doing this with my second book to, um But, you know, it's so much work. And in that process, I did learn everything there was to know about all my characters and Xavier. Um, e think I always knew he was six x click on and, um, that, you know, he'd had serious struggles of this family who for cultural reasons or just, you know, personal family quirks. They weren't accepting that he had this learning difference and not give me him the help he needed. Um, and I also I think it for me. He always stuck out in this particular story because it's such a high performing, high achieving community of kids. And he is completely at the opposite extreme where he can barely read. Um and so I think I really just loved that natural, like contrast with the rest of the community.

Marissa Meyer:   15:57
It works so well. I mean, he really stands out as a character. I think largely because what you're talking about, that he just doesn't fit in in this this world that he's in. Um, but by the end of it, um, he obviously does, and I really love him. Are we gonna have a sequel about eso? I am working on the sequel, and it is Ah, do a point of view. And he is one of them. Oh, good to know. I will be the first in line. I'm excited to hear it. I'm curious to hear what

Abigail Hing Wen:   16:34
you want, Teoh. Find out about him in the next time.

Marissa Meyer:   16:36
I just want him to be happy. Yeah, and his artistry. I mean, I'd like to see something happen with artistry, but I don't want to put anything in your head. I think you know, it's I as a writer, I worry when people start telling me their expectations cause, uh, you know, you you know the character more than anyone. And I fully fully trust you. Uh, so I'm excited. I'm happy to hear that. Um, So you mentioned before that Evers path on DSHEA wants to be a dancer, but she feels like that's not an option for her. Because of her family pushing her to be a doctor and kind of her immigrant story that she has. Um And when you were talking about that, it reminded me of something that I came across, Um, online when I was researching for this interview, and he at one point in something, I think maybe I saw it on your website. You talked about how you've been a storyteller your whole life. Um, and you've been writing since you were a little kid, but it took you a long time to develop the courage to actually start calling yourself a writer. Um, how much do you feel like that? Like your story and your growth into becoming a writer. Kind of parallels Evers journey into becoming a dancer.

Abigail Hing Wen:   17:56
Yeah, it's very much. That is the journey. I grew up in a very business family, business oriented and practical one they had to because they were immigrants to this country, for financial reasons. And for my mom, she was fleeing like pressures from her own family. So I, um I didn't know I could be a writer. It didn't seem like something like a serious profession. Andi. Even when I was working simultaneously with pursuing my m f A I always feel very guilty about the amount of money that was going into the program, like money that I'm saving up for my job that could be used for other things. And so, um, I feel like ever gets to make a choice sooner than I did. And but I definitely feel like there was a moment in my life when I was on the phone with my dad crying and saying, I can't do it. I can't do what everyone wants me to dio and I'm gonna let it run down. And that was That was my moment when I realized like I had to, just I didn't It wasn't sustainable to be someone I wasn't. I

Marissa Meyer:   18:54
know. For me in the book, there is incredibly poignant moment, and I don't want, of course, spoil anything but a moment in which Evers dad comes to visit her. Ah, and in kind of that, that crossroads that she finds herself. And it's a beautiful moment in the story, Um, and one that I was really glad that we got to see, um, how does your family feeling now with your your publication in your writing, success as it is

Abigail Hing Wen:   19:22
so they've been incredibly supportive. I wrote an article for Lit Hub called Confessions of an Undercover Novelist about what it was like to share my writing with my family at long last. Like once I got the book deal. I'm like I have to come clean because that could have found out about this book one way or the other. So definitely was easier to share, like with something concrete tangible to bring to them. But there was a funny story where I walk in. They had gotten wind of this, the book deal for my brother and I walked in for our family, um, Christmas dinner and my mom's like, You've

Marissa Meyer:   19:53
got a $1,000,000 like, uh, no, Mom, I didn't I was like, Oh, it's like a little fall of disappointment is sort of laughing like a post, sir. Typical. But you know, But it was

Abigail Hing Wen:   20:06
fine, actually. And my brother, he did an interview with me at Adobe on was part of my tour and he said, You know, let's get real here. It's been really hard of Mama got over the years, but this book has really brought you guys together, and he's so right. It's really opened up more conversation and trust between us on. Do you know my dad? But there was a point of printed out. My novels, redacted the intimate scenes and gave it to my dodgy check the pinion, you know? So, um, they they read it. And, um, there really been out there driving of support for the book and say everybody, all our friends read this book, and, um, that's really been a blessing I wasn't expecting at all. You know, the book is a story about a girl's journey with her own family, and then I didn't know that it was gonna help me reconcile with mine.

Marissa Meyer:   20:53
Oh, that's beautiful to hear. I'm trying to think where to go from that. That's I'm so happy for you. And I mean, I know my parents are such big cheerleaders. Um, And like, I can't go anywhere with my mom without her, like telling the cashier at the store. This is my daughter. The writer s. So it's good as was it? I mean, that must have been so hard. Kind of hiding that site of yourself for so long. Yeah. Um, you know, and I think that's

Abigail Hing Wen:   21:27
like one of the messages that I kind of come back to you on tour is especially, I think, in a culture that really tries to hide things that are vulnerable. It's not a culture that wears the heart, other sleeves, the way I think Americans dio, you know. And obviously we're all American as well. But, um, you know, I remember being in situations where I would cry and things Chinese girl would say to me like, Don't cry, It's so shameful And, um, you know, like even she even the things that I share. In the novel, there was a woman on tour whose officials an older Asian American woman her seventies, she said, Did you feel really embarrassed to share all these things closely? Think it's me, even though it's not, you know, it isn't It isn't, um and I, you know, my answer to that is like has the community I think we needed? We need to be more vulnerable with each other, and we need to share more because that's what I found. And I love that. You know, part of being American is like when you're vulnerable, that you can get the help that you need like Xavier needed to be vulnerable. So you get the help, you need it. And I find that's true for a lot of people who are struggling with anything, Really mental health issues, depression, whatever it is. Um, when we're open about it, we can get the support and love, and people will connect with that, and they will share that. They're also similarly struggling. We're not alone in this, So, um yeah, I think for sure I just feel less alone in here and being able to be be open with my own family.

Marissa Meyer:   22:51
Yeah, And I think you've written a wonderful book to that. Ah, lot of readers are gonna be able to relate to and, you know, see, see that things that these characters are going are going through and be able to relate to them. And And you know what I think when we see characters in books that air willing to show their vulnerabilities on and come out stronger on the other side, I think it can encourage us to do the same. I have to go back to this idea that you wrote 26 dress with, which has been going and round in my head since you mentioned it. I think the most drops I've ever written for something would have been my also made debut novel, which maybe had eight or 10. Um, and that felt like a lot. Um what What was it about this story in particular? That you were compelled Teoh. Keep reworking it and keep working it until you finally got it right. I think

Abigail Hing Wen:   23:55
a story has been a me a long time because I got a trip myself, and it was such a weird, uniquely Asian American experience on I think I film over the characters. Um, I just and I remember I go something I learned from I m f A program from Amanda Jenkins. She's like the two most important things in writing. A novel is one. Would you take a bullet, your characters and, you know, to what would it take to break them? And I think I have gone to that place of that. I really love them. I love the world I love. The struggles with her family is that they were all going through in different ways. Um, and I

Marissa Meyer:   24:28
knew. I think I knew there

Abigail Hing Wen:   24:31
was something there. I just needed to figure out what it was and how to tell it properly. And the 26 drops. Part of the problem was that it was just too many characters for one story. And that's why by eliminating those 14 points of view and just consolidating into every point of view, that actually made a huge difference. And then also switching from third person past tense to first person present tense was, was, had always helped me in the past, and it helps me here. But I actually just did that with my second novel. I just switched from their person past the first person present again. Um, but you know, part of it, too, was that I was writing the wrong story initially, like my first version of a vote in the really 26 persons. They were similar. It was all about rebelling, gone wrong, where they rebelled, rebelled and they ended up going out and facing a typhoon and the ocean and almost drowning. And that actually it happened in real life, went for two me and my friends on Love boat and so, but it wasn't really ending in the right emotional place forever, which is about her family and her dance eso. Once I realized that and we worked us to the end point was actually be, um, the talent show. Then it actually all started to work together. But it took me that many drops to figure that out because I just didn't know the story could have gone in so many different directions.

Marissa Meyer:   25:45
Well, I'm glad you stayed with it. I'm glad you didn't give up on this story, because it really is is a a great story. And I was really glad to get to read it to totally switch gears. You're a huge musical fan.

Abigail Hing Wen:   26:00
I love musicals. What's your favorite musical? I have so many. I

Marissa Meyer:   26:04
think the favorite of

Abigail Hing Wen:   26:04
all time is Lee Moves gets the one I've seen so many times. I like every possible version of permutation and my high school choir would sing the music. I also lovely miss growing up and, um, the layoffs along. It was one of my childhood heroes. I just saw the fan of the offer on it was showing for free this weekend's and that was I love that one. I've seen that in many times, and that was actually a very first musical ever saw. But I love Hamilton and greatest showman have a good one for so many good ones.

Marissa Meyer:   26:37
I also I also made a huge, huge fan. Uh, and I think Liam is actually was the first that I ever saw. It was just completely blown away. I think it's something

Abigail Hing Wen:   26:47
about them because I love stories so much, and then you combine it with the music and the dance, which are also, like two huge parts of my heart. It's like, once it is, I can't I just cannot resist.

Marissa Meyer:   26:58
Yeah, I know, I know. It's a really wonderful form of storytelling.

Abigail Hing Wen:   27:02
Yeah, Actually, the hope is for the film to be kind of year teeter on the edge of musical. So that is the hope Will see. Um, you know, it makes it more complicated for sure.

Marissa Meyer:   27:12
Ah, that would be spectacular. I hope you it. Yeah, me too. What a cool idea. Yeah, it's definitely

Abigail Hing Wen:   27:19
written that way already with, like, the dance sequences. And so it may just be like leading war into those dance sequences of it.

Marissa Meyer:   27:25
Uh, yeah. No, I haven't thought of it that way, but you can absolutely see it working. Cool. Well, I have my fingers crossed. I know. Hollywood could be very, very fickle. Um, but I hope I hope for you. I hope it happens. All right, we're going to wrap this up with a happy writer. Lightning round question. First question. Have you ever had snake blood sucking?

Abigail Hing Wen:   27:50
No, but my husband has. So I stole it from him

Marissa Meyer:   27:53
because it absolutely horrid does he need to do to help you? I don't know. He's He's pretty, uh, game for anything. So e admire that. I think of myself as someone who was also game for anything. I don't know if I'd be game for snake. Yeah, I don't do blood. I'm my serum. Blood is mine. Yeah, that's seen its horrifying, but fascinating. I don't know. I might try it. Maybe. What book makes you happy?

Abigail Hing Wen:   28:22
Oh, lots of them. Um gosh. Great question.

Marissa Meyer:   28:30
Lightning round. Abigail. I read Laura Ingalls religiously growing up. I think he's happy

Abigail Hing Wen:   28:36
Golden Ears romance team. Laura Adam as though it's still, like my favorite romance of all time.

Marissa Meyer:   28:41
I forget about those books, but those were saw my early loves to good choice. Uh, what do you do to celebrate an accomplishment?

Abigail Hing Wen:   28:50
So we go out to eat. We have a favorite Indian restaurant that we It's our excuse. For every little celebration, we find all kinds of excuses to

Marissa Meyer:   28:57
celebrate. Oh, good. That's how you get happy, right there. Any excuse to celebrate. How do you feel the creative? Well,

Abigail Hing Wen:   29:06
I go for runs or, you know, the pre coronavirus world. I used to go to museums. So thanks to stimulate me.

Marissa Meyer:   29:14
What advice would you give to help someone become a happier writer?

Abigail Hing Wen:   29:19
Do it. Do it because you love it. And not because of any extra more reasons.

Marissa Meyer:   29:24
And lastly, where can people find you?

Abigail Hing Wen:   29:27
So my websites, Abigail hang wen dot com and I have a newsletter, so be great. Actually, if folks would sign up there. I also am on Instagram, Twitter and Facebook at Abigail. Hang one. And we'd love to see you there.

Marissa Meyer:   29:40
Excellent. Thank you so much for joining me today. Abigail.

Abigail Hing Wen:   29:43
Marisa. Thank you for having me. This is really fun.

Marissa Meyer:   29:46
My absolute pleasure cannot wait for book to wish you much, much luck with the finishing of the next draft. I hope it doesn't take you 26 dresses me to me to a reader's definitely check out Love boat Taipei. Um, it is out now, of course. Ah, And check out Abigail's newsletter and Social Media on, Of course. Now more than ever, if you can, we always encourage you to support your local indie bookstore. Please also subscribe to this podcast. So you will always be in the know about new episodes. And you can find me on Instagram at Marisa Meyer author and at Happy Writer podcast until next time. I hope you guys air staying healthy, state cozy in your bunkers and whatever life throws at you today, I hope that now you are feeling a little bit.