Marissa chats with Shveta Thakrar about her debut YA fantasy - STAR DAUGHTER - as well as how revising can be a fun part of the writing process; a few different ways to inspire yourself when the muse is being quiet; how to avoid some potential pitfalls of artistic ambition; and - most important - crafting truly magical libraries and night markets!
Books discussed in this episode can be purchased from your local independent bookstore or buy them online from the Happy Writer bookshop.org store (that benefits indie bookstores) at https://bookshop.org/shop/marissameyer
Find out more and follow The Happy Writer on social media: https://www.marissameyer.com/podcast/
Marissa chats with Shveta Thakrar about her debut YA fantasy - STAR DAUGHTER - as well as how revising can be a fun part of the writing process; a few different ways to inspire yourself when the muse is being quiet; how to avoid some potential pitfalls of artistic ambition; and - most important - crafting truly magical libraries and night markets!
Books discussed in this episode can be purchased from your local independent bookstore or buy them online from the Happy Writer bookshop.org store (that benefits indie bookstores) at https://bookshop.org/shop/marissameyer
Find out more and follow The Happy Writer on social media: https://www.marissameyer.com/podcast/
[inaudible]
Speaker 2:Hello and welcome to the happy writer. This is a podcast that aims to bring readers, more books, to enjoy and to help authors find more joy in their writing. I'm your host, Marissa Meyer. Thanks so much for joining me. One thing that's been making me happy this week. I'm actually not entirely sure what they're called, but I got these like wine frappe, a mix things at a craft fair last year. Uh, and I don't know where you are, but where I am, it's been over a hundred degrees lately. And so I've been making these things. It's like, you take a bottle of wine and this like almost Koolaid powder and you mix it together and you freeze it. And it turns slushy and sweet and delicious. Um, and that's pretty much all that I want in life is a nice shade umbrella and a frosty beverage and a good book, of course. And that's pretty much how I've been spending these hot, hot afternoons lately. Uh, I hope all of you guys out there are also finding some fun ways to stay. Cool. Speaking of good books, I am so excited to talk to today's guest. Her poetry and short stories have appeared in a number of publications, including the anthologies, toil and trouble and a thousand beginnings and endings. Her debut white fantasy novel star daughter comes out this week on August 11th. Please. Welcome. Shake that to cry. Hi, how are you? I'm doing well, just, you know. Yeah. That's really excited. Really excited. You sound a little flustered coming up on your launch week. How are you feeling? It is, it is pretty flustered is a good word for it. It's been a lot of things to juggle all good things, but still a lot of things to juggle. It's hard to believe that this is actually finally here. Yeah, I know you said, um, when we were talking before we started recording, uh, that you've been writing this book since 2013. Yeah. Yep. That is a long, long time. It must feel like that was forever ago. It does. It's it's so funny because it went through many drafts. The first draft, I think the only thing that hung around from that was the sheets, those journal entry from the beginning and everything else. So now I know how that goes. My books tend to have bridged basically nothing left over from the first drafts. So I know exactly what you mean. Um, why don't we start with you telling listeners what is star daughter about? Okay, let me try to do my elevator pitch when she still, who is on the she's a few days out from her 17th birthday and she is half human and half to start. And as she gets closer
Speaker 3:To her birthday, the star part of her heritage, which she's shoved down ever since her mom went back to the sky for starting mom starts to come out and she accidentally burns her human father. And the only way to heal a wound like that is a drop of healing starts blood, but her blood is diluted. So she has to go on a quest to the heavens to find her mom, but then she discovers when she's there that in order to win this drop of blood, she has to also win a competition that she had no intention of ever signing up for
Speaker 2:Kind of like, like what's that what's that show American idol, is that the coverage like American idol, but like in celestial speak. Yes, exactly. So I am, as a writer, I am fascinated by the idea of muses and divine inspiration. And that's something that you play with a lot in this book. And of course, for me, like my idea of muses generally comes from Greek mythology and the, the nine Greek muses. Uh, but you've changed it to where it's the stars, literally the stars personified that are giving these, these wonderful divine inspiration, his ideas to humans. Is that something that you created or is that based in Hindu mythology somewhere?
Speaker 3:That's a really good question. No, it's something I created. Um, if you were going to look to Hindu mythology for that, then it would be the goddess to Sophie. She is the goddess of the arts and speech and knowledge, but I just really took my inspiration from that from just imagining how beautiful the, if, if the stars could sing how beautiful that would be. And then it just felt like the next natural step that of course that singing would inspire humans.
Speaker 2:No, I love it. I love the idea. I mean, the idea of muse is in general, but what you've done with the stars and one of my favorite scenes in the book is so shuttle is in this star palace. She's in this palace in the sky and they have these jars filled with star dust. And at one point in the book, she's able to kind of dump the star dust over the edge of the balcony and it falls down to earth and there's this beautiful vision of this star dust going down and inspiring all of the humans below. And I love that and it gave me chills.
Speaker 3:Thank you.
Speaker 2:Oh, what I mean, what are some of your feelings about inspiration? Is it, do you see it as something that comes from within us? Do you picture it as some sort of outside influence? Like what are, what are your personal thoughts on inspiration?
Speaker 3:Well, as a practicing Hindu, I would say both. And let me, let me explain if I do think that we are connected to and the, and the universe itself or go out or whatever you want to call it. So that creative force is also it's outside of us, but it's also inside of us and it shows up when it wants to do not necessarily when we want it to. But yeah. So in that way it would be both outside and inside. Yeah. Ain't that the truth. It does not always show up when we want it to, as a writer. I mean, you talk about that. You're talking about that some more, but sometimes inspiration doesn't always come when we want it to, what do you do as a writer when inspiration is not coming well, that's, that's actually really funny because right now I am desperately trying to redraft my second book so I can turn it in and it doesn't that kind of deadlines don't wait for inspiration, you know this. Yeah, I think, I mean, yes, I think there are days when you just have to pack it in and say, it's not happening today. But what I try to do otherwise is I'm a very visual writer, as you could probably tell from the descriptions in the book. And I have just very, a very, very rich imagination. I see things in my mind. And so I, if I'm really stuck, I will put on music that, for example, I read a red, sorry, I've listened to a lot of dead can dance. And a lot of let them engage, go to who's a, uh, like she's known as the queen of Bollywood of classic Hollywood to get in the mood of what I was trying to create the ambiance. And then I would also, I have a Pinterest board. I would go and look at the pictures I had put there and just try to evoke that feeling and, and just imagine what for started out or, you know, what would, what would be, what would make me happy to write? And I'm trying to do the same thing now, just, and then also, also remember that art happens in layers. I think we have this wrong idea that somebody makes something the first time out and it's perfect, but that's not how art of any kind works really. I mean, I usually once in a while that happens, it's like a short story or something, but for the most part, it takes layers of, of sculpting, figuring out what the right thing is and what the wrong thing is. And maybe the bones are there, but they're in the wrong order. Or you have too many ligaments and not enough muscle tissue. I should probably leave that analogy to the rest of my family there, the doctors, not me, but yeah, just that it, I think part of, part of writing part of inspiration is allowing yourself to go down the wrong path so that you can eventually find the right one. So you don't have a star trapped in a cage somewhere. Yes, yes. No. I mean, I agree with you 100%. I think that there are times in which, you know, it feels like you've been inspired. It feels like there's this power moving through you and the words are just coming and it's so strong and they feel right in that moment. But the vast majority of the time, it's really just a lot of work. Yeah. It's less romantic than people like to make it out to be by far.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Do you, have you ever, um, felt like, like had a moment or a day maybe a story idea or something that almost felt like it did come from some divine outside source that was like just planted into your brain at just the right moment?
Speaker 3:Yes. Uh, that happened many times during the revision of star daughter. I think the idea for star daughter itself, and I should probably give a little, so I back in 2001, I found a copy of the first edition copy of Neil Gaiman's and Charles Best illustrated novel Stardust. And I bought it not knowing anything about it. I just liked the title and the cover and it, and I took it home and I read it and I loved it. And it was about a star who had fallen from the sky and was a person and a human boy who had to go on a quest to find the star. And they fell in love. And I thought, I really love this idea of stars as people. And then when movie version came out in 2017 or 2017, sorry, 2007, when it came out in 2007, I watched it and I started to think, Hmm, it starts where people wouldn't, they look like all of us wouldn't they have different skin tones. And all of a sudden I felt this, if you will divine inspiration. And I thought, Oh, I know I'll write a story, a short story about a girl whose mother is from Hindu constellation. And then I started to think about it and I realized, Oh, but she's going to have to go on a quest. I didn't know what the quest was yet except, or why she was going up to the sky, but I knew she would have to go out to the sky and find her mother, and that wouldn't really fit into a short story. So then I realized, Oh no, this is going to have to be a novel.
Speaker 2:Oh man has to be a novel. Oh, I love it. I love hearing inspiration stories, um, from other authors, because there is a magical element to those moments when that, that first initial idea drops into your head and just sends you off on this creative path. A part of, one of my favorite things about being a writer. And I think something that all writers can relate to and a lot of in a lot of different ways.
Speaker 3:Yes. For me, that's actually so much of the fun of it is the discovery
Speaker 2:[inaudible] do you prefer the first draft or revisions?
Speaker 3:Oh my goodness. Revisions revisions. Because for me, I think, you know, first drafts are making something out of nothing. And that's really hard for me. Maybe it's not for other writers, but it is for me. And once I have stuff on the page, then I can look at it and think, okay, well this worked or wow, that really didn't work. And let me try again, but then it's like, I have clay to start molding
Speaker 2:[inaudible] I prefer revisions as well. I feel like the first draft is so messy and I'm constantly doubting myself, but by the time I get to revisions, I have a lot more confidence in the book.
Speaker 3:Yes. And for me, I feel like I have, when, when I'm going back to revisions, I have a better idea of what the story actually wants to be. And that's not at all often. That's not what I thought when I started.
Speaker 2:So another thing that I thought was so interesting about star daughter and the story is playing with this idea of inspiration and ideas and creativity. And for the most part, it's treated as, you know, the beautiful, powerful thing that it is creation and art. It's good, but you also, you know, show us some of the darker sides of, of creativity and how art does have, you know, it can become an obsession for people and how some creators, like the burning desire that we can feel to have, uh, to receive recognition for our art. Like it can kind of take over your life in a way that can be really unhealthy. And so as much as the book, I felt inspired and wanted to be creative, just reading the book at the same time, I felt like there was this kind of subtle warning in it that, yes, it's good to create, but it can come with some costs. Was that intentional? Was that something that you were thinking about as you were writing?
Speaker 3:That's a really good question because then I have to ask myself, what was I thinking over,
Speaker 2:Over the last seven years? If you just break down your thoughts, that would be great.
Speaker 3:Uh, but I mean, that does, that does, that does ring true for me? And I think if I, if there is that subtle learning, it would be that you have to think about why you're creating and what you hope to get out of it, because it's so easy to, to look for external rewards and make art for, for the, as a, as a means of achieving something else, whether it's fame and fortune or making it, making it. So people like you, or think that you're talented. So you do this too, to get accolades or whatever it is. And rather than making art for art's sake or because you have something to say,
Speaker 2:So why do you create art?
Speaker 3:Because I went into, I mean, I very specifically, right. Hindu care, they see characters. So that is why, right. I went into having the stories that I did not get growing up where Brown people were celebrated. They got to be no pun intended, but they got to be the star of their story. They got to have magical fun adventures. And there's no question that they have that in my stories, that being Brown is something oppressive. They have to deal with. Those were the stories I needed. And so that's what I'm writing them now for other people.
Speaker 2:[inaudible] no, I think that's really powerful. I think the idea of writing, especially writing young adult fiction, um, obviously a lot of our readers are teenagers and there's something powerful about writing for your younger self and what was the book that I needed at that age.
Speaker 3:Yes. And I, my hope is that one day there will be plenty of books for everyone, no matter what their background, their orientation, their ability or disability, whatever it is, that there are plenty of wonderful books that represent everybody in every way. So everybody feels seen to me, that's what literature should be for.
Speaker 2:I agree, 100%. And I think it's a really exciting time that we're writing in right now, um, with the, the explosion of the own voices movement and the diversity movement. And, uh, I've just loved seeing, you know, how many new points of view we have coming into the market.
Speaker 3:Me too. It's so exciting. And I, and yeah, we need diverse books. It was not long ago. That was in 2014, not in six years.
Speaker 2:I know. And it's changed things drastically in a fairly short amount of time.
Speaker 3:Yes. I can tell you right now, my book would never have sold before that.
Speaker 2:You feel that way. I mean, I can't disagree with you. I honestly have no idea, but I guess I've never really thought of that before. Like how many books just would not have existed. Um, and that's kind of sad to think about. And, but also at the same time, you know, wonderful to think that now these books are coming out and, you know, clearly there's a demand for them
Speaker 3:100%.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Okay. I want to talk about dev. Okay. I loved this character. Dev is the love interest of your main character. Um, I didn't know how much I wanted a guy to bake cookies for me until I read this book like that who knew, who knew that's just simple act or it could just be so unbelievably charming.
Speaker 3:Both my, my agent and my editor absolutely love that scene. But, and the thing is I, I wrote the boyfriend I would have loved to have had been in high school. And I also really consciously wanted to write someone who wasn't a bad boy, because I feel like we don't give kindness and people who are caring enough, we don't, we don't regard that as sexy in general. And I don't. And personally, I think that's the opposite is true. So I wanted to write a dreamy boy who is kind and who, whatever mistakes he makes because he does, but he's not. Yeah. But at the end he does the right thing. He's a good person. And for, you know, and I, and also honestly, I would have absolutely loved if somebody baked me cookies like that, I was lovely today. My husband were like, Oh, I just picked you cookies, which will never happen.
Speaker 2:Maybe he can listen to this podcast and then he'll know, honey, you should hear this. No, I, with you. I mean, I love a bad boy in fiction, but there is definitely something that can be very sexy about a guy who was just genuinely good and thoughtful, compassionate. I love that too. And dev hits all of those notes in a really wonderful way. And one of the things that I felt especially interesting about dev is that like so many characters in the book, there's a lot of artists, there's a lot of creators and creative types in your cast of characters and dev he's a singer, he's a songwriter. He is very talented, but he has no interest whatsoever in the fame and the fortune. Um, and I thought that made for a really neat foil against some of your other characters who are the opposite, they're craving the spotlight. They want the recognition. I mean, we already kind of talked about, of course, how, you know, there are pros and cons to creativity, but specifically in writing devs character, like, were you trying to kind of have him as someone to set apart? Like there are other ways to be creative. There are other ways to think about your talent.
Speaker 3:Yeah. And honestly, I was going with the old adage of be really mean to your characters because I knew it was going to happen, which obviously won't spoil here, but I knew what was gonna happen to him. So, so I had to, you know, basically he, I did want to play with the idea too, because we have this expectation that if you are good at something, you have to take it as far as you possibly can and can, it's never okay that maybe you don't do that and you just enjoy it for yourself or, you know, who knows if they've, if everybody hadn't been pushing they've maybe at some point he would have felt interested in pursuing fame, but it was basically like, it had already been decided for him. And so he didn't want it.
Speaker 2:Hmm. I hadn't really thought of that, but it's true that there is this idea of how you must live up to your potential. And if you don't, you're somehow failing, which completely discounts, like all of the other wonderful things that can come from just being creative and just doing what you love to do.
Speaker 3:Yes. It's almost like it's a very capitalist idea actually that you have to be able to make money off of what you're good at.
Speaker 2:How do you feel high? I guess I don't want to say, I don't want to spoil anything either. And I also love that you said, like, I know it happens to dev at the end, which sounds so ominous for readers. So I was going to ask something, but it's spoilery so I'll, I'll skip that. Tell me about one thing that I loved in this book is that there is a magical library up in your magical sky palette, just like the ultimate fantasy. I'm sure of everyone who is listening to this, how much fun did you have creating that library
Speaker 3:So much fun? I mean, I wrote all the places in this book are I wrote the places I would want to go. So a magical library, of course. And of course it would be one where my husband actually, it's funny because I'm the VC in this marriage. Who's the white person, but he's the one who plays Indian instruments and studies with it with the new style of a master teacher. And he, the songs that he learns are called it. And so in a star, dotter in that magical library. If you want to find something, you have to know whether it's a morning and afternoon and evening and night, and, uh, and you sing for it. And then that section of the library will light up for you. And I just thought, how much fun would it be if you could do that
Speaker 2:So much fun, except for what about us who can't sing?
Speaker 3:I don't know, I guess, and try it and find out.
Speaker 2:I think they would just constantly be giving me the wrong books.
Speaker 3:Oh my gosh. I love that. That would be so funny.
Speaker 2:Do you have plans on returning to this world? Is there going to be a sequel?
Speaker 3:It is a standalone. It is a standalone.
Speaker 2:Cause it does. It has a very nice ending. It feels very resolved, but at the same time I felt like there's places she could take this. So I wasn't sure.
Speaker 3:I'll just say this. Um, I've seen other writers say, never say never. And I think that's probably the best way to go, but yeah, for me right now, the story is fine.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So that's the book that you're working on. That you're on deadline right now. Something totally separate.
Speaker 3:I'm trying to think how I'm not wanting to talk about it very much yet. So I'll say that, but I can give vague details. I've been allowed to do that. So it's in the same universe, it's in the same world. In the sense, if, if swerve look, the heavenly realm is part of mythology, then other places are as well. So that it's in the same universe, so to speak and it will have dreams and it will have nods. And now things are Hindu and Buddhist. Shapeshifters, they're half human and half snake and they can take either full human form, full snake form, or an in between form.
Speaker 2:Hm. Very intriguing. I'm excited for it. Yay. What are the other places? And I liked that you say like every one of the settings in the book is a place that you personally would like to visit. Cause I very much felt the same way in reading this book. You know, you have a lot of really rich, wonderful details, um, throughout your world building and the library, the excuse me, the library really spoke to me for obvious reasons. Um, but so did the night market. I love a good night market.
Speaker 3:The night market is the night market of my heart. I, I wrote that 100% as whiskey fulfillment.
Speaker 2:I couldn't tell it felt that way. Look at a good way.
Speaker 3:In fact, I put so much stuff in it that my agent made me cut some of it and reminded me that note was not okay that she still just wandered around. We went shopping. We had to keep the story moving. So very reluctantly. I listened to her smart advice.
Speaker 2:Maybe you can use it as a cut scene somewhere. Oh, that's funny. There's I have a love hate that when, when editors and agents suggest that we cut things, cause it's always the right decision. Like it's always, yes, you're right. It's too much here. But, but sometimes there's just those scenes of our hearts that it's like, but I just want to go and live in this moment forever.
Speaker 3:And I spent years on this, I, this polishing adding things to it as they came to me and just everything that I would want to be able to go shopping for it.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So how, tell me about that. So I'm curious, do you like, okay, you have the scene, your character has to go to this night market. There's going to be, it's obviously it's going to be magical and whimsical and fantastical. Do you sit down and brainstorm various things that that can be seen there and the, the, you know, what can she see? What does she smell? What does she tastes, et cetera, et cetera, or is it something that kind of builds more organically? Do you just kind of, as you're going about your daily life, here's an idea. I'll jot that down. Here's another idea. I'll jot that down. Like, what's your, what's your method for that?
Speaker 3:I would say a combination because I, for me, ideas, feed ideas and looking at things, or, you know, when we were in COVID times going to tiny stores that were just full of beautiful things, I would go and just wander in there and just look and fill my creative. Well, I felt like I was spiritually eating all this delicious candy, just filling myself up with it. And, and as I taught my imagination over time to start really coming up with ideas, if I came up with something, then it would come up with something else and something else. And then, and I, so I would sit and try to do that, but also I would, I would just be going about my day and then I would see something that would strike me or, or inspire something else. And for me that's just fun. I, because like I said, I, I see things very richly in my mind, very detailed. And I wish that I were better art because I would probably be able to make some amazing paintings or illustrations from what I see. But I figured I'd paint with words, so that'll be good enough. But yeah, I just, I, for me, it's just so much fun that process of creation, of discovery, of making the most fun, whimsical, magical, possibly dangerous things that I can think of. And, you know, Holly black said this one time that if she ever did find the door to ferry, and I see ferry as an all encompassing term for the mythical lands of all traditions, but if she found her way and she would be in trouble within the first five minutes, cause she'd do something silly. And I said that, yeah, that would probably happen to me too. But I think I'd be okay with it if it meant I got to go. So it's the waiting to find the door to my own night market.
Speaker 2:I think it's worth the risk. I'll take it 100%. Um, so speaking of being an artist and, and the night market combined, your website has a night market. Yes, it does. It's just so brilliant. I loved this one. I stumbled onto it when I was researching for this interview. Um, listeners, you should definitely go check out. Uh,[inaudible] website is a link to the actual night market. I love the little story that you have about it. And tell me what, what is this painting and how did it come about?
Speaker 3:So I, so I was thinking, I knew once we sold the book, I knew it was high time that I got a website makeover. And I was trying to think what would be, what would be representative of me in a way that wasn't limited to one book. I didn't want to do something with stars, as beautiful as that would have been because that's not going to be the only thing I ever write. And then I thought, Oh my goodness, what is more representative of me than a magical night market? And I commissioned a wonderful artist and who's my friend in India. My name is[inaudible] and her, her website is Kaleido drama.com. And I told her what I had in mind. I gave her a few. I gave her the night market chapter and we discussed ideas back and forth. And she started to do her sketches and I gave her feedback and she came up with this gorgeous, gorgeous, gorgeous illustration that just left me in awe. And I have a little bit of trivia too. If you look at the website and you go see the illustration, there's a tent that has a purple label on it, a purple band. And it says in good dressy should with any whiteout. So shoot that stories. So it's like a little Easter egg. Yup, yup, yup. Yup.
Speaker 2:That's awesome. But the artwork is breathtaking. It is so cool. And you can actually literally buy merchandise. And my favorite is that there's a shower curtain. I thought this is phenomenal. You could be taking a shower and pretend that you're in the night market. And that's like, all my dreams come true. So my favorite is the shower curtain. What is your favorite thing that you can get the night market put on too?
Speaker 3:I actually really liked the shower curtain too. And if my husband ever gets around to finishing, working on our bathroom upstairs, where we have a clawfoot bathtub, which I am dying to use husband, then I totally went to put the curtain in there, but I'll have I had to get a print for myself. Of course. So I did that and I got a few greeting cards to send to people because how beautiful and I was pretty much, I would want almost anything that I smoke it up there. So
Speaker 2:Yeah, you can decorate your whole house in night market. Okay. We are going to wrap this interview up with our happy writer lightning round. Okay. All right. Question one. What book makes you happy?
Speaker 3:There were so many books. So picking one off the top of my head, I would say the season of passage by Christopher Peck.
Speaker 2:I'm not familiar. What is it about?
Speaker 3:It's one of his adult novels and it involves a, well, I don't want to spoil it, but it's it's horror and science fiction and also fantasy. What artist or creator are you? Absolutely convinced was inspired by the stars. Oh, Laney Taylor. 100% or at Emory Lamar. Either one of them. God. Good. Two good choices. What is your favorite thing to do that has nothing to do with reading or writing? That's a good question because I think we tend to forget. We have to have interests outside. I really like eating. I love good food with flavor and yeah, that would be one of my picks for sure. What's her favorite food or what's I take it back. What is your favorite thing to eat while you're writing? If I have them handy. Chocolate covered almonds. Yum, yum. Yum. Oh, those are one of my favorites too. Yes. So how do you feel the creative? Well, I look at beautiful pictures. I listen to music. I dress up in very fashion. I watch things I read. I wonder what do you do to celebrate an accomplishment depending on what the accomplishment is. Sometimes I'll treat myself to a little thing that I really wanted. Like what let's see when I finished this draft of the book too, maybe I will buy a dress. I saw online. Nice. What advice would you give to help someone become a happier writer? I guess it touches back to what I took. Very touches on what we were talking about earlier. Ask yourself what you were doing this for, because most of publication is out of your control. What happens is out of your control. You can write something and be really proud of it and not get the reaction you want. And there's an, and I don't mean, I'm not saying that to be depressing. I'm just saying if that's something that you can't control and put your attention on what you can control and that's, why are you writing? What is it that you want to say? How can you make that fun for you and leave the rest up to whatever's going to happen? Excellent advice. And lastly, where can people find you on my website?[inaudible] dot com on Twitter at[inaudible] on Instagram at[inaudible]. Awesome. Thanks so much for joining me. Shayda thank you for having me. This is super fun. My pleasure. And congratulations on launching your debut novel. I hope your launch week goes really well. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, readers, and be sure to check out star daughter, which comes out on August 11th. And of course we always encourage you to support your local indie bookstore. If you can, on that note, we have also just become an affiliate@bookshop.org,
Speaker 2:Which is an online bookstore that gives more than 75% of its profits to independent bookstores. So you can now find all of podcast guests in one handy list at bookshop.org/shop/marissa Meyer. Please subscribe to this podcast and leave us a review. If you're enjoying these conversations, you can also find us on Instagram at Marissa Meyer author and at happy writer podcast until next time stay healthy and cozy and your bunkers and whatever life throws at you today. I do hope that now you're feeling good.
Speaker 1:[inaudible].