Marissa chats with Emery Lee about their debut YA novel - MEET CUTE DIARY - as well as crafting a heartwarming romance that does not rely on traditional romantic tropes; knocking out those fast first drafts (in Emery's case - REALLY fast first drafts!) in order to quiet your inner perfectionist and maintain that initial burst of inspiration; writing the story of your heart, even if it goes against editorial feedback or market trends; and an idea for pre-order campaigns that Marissa finds absolutely genius.
Books discussed in this episode can be purchased from your local independent bookstore or buy them online from the Happy Writer bookshop.org store (that benefits indie bookstores) at https://bookshop.org/shop/marissameyer
Find out more and follow The Happy Writer on social media: https://www.marissameyer.com/podcast/
Marissa chats with Emery Lee about their debut YA novel - MEET CUTE DIARY - as well as crafting a heartwarming romance that does not rely on traditional romantic tropes; knocking out those fast first drafts (in Emery's case - REALLY fast first drafts!) in order to quiet your inner perfectionist and maintain that initial burst of inspiration; writing the story of your heart, even if it goes against editorial feedback or market trends; and an idea for pre-order campaigns that Marissa finds absolutely genius.
Books discussed in this episode can be purchased from your local independent bookstore or buy them online from the Happy Writer bookshop.org store (that benefits indie bookstores) at https://bookshop.org/shop/marissameyer
Find out more and follow The Happy Writer on social media: https://www.marissameyer.com/podcast/
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Speaker 2:Hello and welcome to the happy writer. This is a podcast that aims to bring readers, more books to enjoy and to help authors find more joy in their writing. I'm your host ware. Samira. Thanks for joining me today. One thing that has been making me happy this week is we have caterpillars that are going to turn into butterflies. I'm just kidding. I realized that I used that happy thing the last two weeks in a row. So I won't use it again, even though I'm really excited about the Caterpillar's about to turn into butterflies. They haven't yet, but any day now, now the thing that's actually making me really happy this week, uh, is that we have decided we are going to continue homeschooling through first grade next year. And last week we received the like timber doodle homeschool curriculum catalog. And I don't know something about sitting in with this catalog and flipping through the pages with my Sharpie and circling all of the books and the science experiments and games and all of these like really nerdy things that I'm so excited to get to next school year. It kind of gave me the same feeling that I used to get from those Scholastic book catalogs in elementary school, which were pretty much some of my happiest memories of all times. So I loved it. And even though it's all supposed to be for the girls, I pretty much think that I might be more excited than anybody. And that has been making me very, very happy this week. And of course I am so happy to be talking to today's guest, use an author, artist and YouTube whose debut novel meet cute diary comes out tomorrow on May 4th, please. Welcome Emory Lee. Hi, thank you for having me. Thank you so much for being here. I'm so excited to talk to you.
Speaker 3:I was really excited to hear that you wanted
Speaker 2:To have me as a guest. I was like, Oh, it's amazing.
Speaker 3:Like so excited. And I know that, um, I'm obviously a debut. So a lot of the publishing stuff is like really new to me. So to hear that you were like, you know, excited.
Speaker 2:I was like, Oh my God, yay. This was going to be a great time. Yes. I remember reading about this book. I don't know, months ago, it's been a while now and thinking, Oh, this sounds so cute. So you were on my radar for weeks and weeks and I'm so glad we could do this. How are you feeling about your launch? I'm really excited.
Speaker 3:I did. I, I had originally, um, kind of like thought about like, Oh, like what should I do that week? How should I like prepare for it? Cause I know a lot of people are like, it's the most nerve-wracking time or like it's super exciting. Um, so like getting all of that together was just like, I was trying to make more of like a fun thing, like a stressful thing. Like how can I go about this? So it basically ended up being like a week of me doing events with like author friends and like having a friend over and we're just basically gonna like celebrate the book and everything. So I think it's gonna be a great time.
Speaker 2:That sounds like a perfect plan because I know that it is really stressful and there's a lot of to do's like, I know whenever I have a book coming out, my to-do list is like 8 billion things long and a lot of things to tackle and try to stay on top of, but it's also such a good time and so worthy of celebration. So I'm happy to hear that.
Speaker 3:Yeah. Like I think, um, I think I kind of got the jump on all of it early cause I was like, I feel like you hear so many people telling their stories of how they went about like launching their first book. And so I was like, how do I actually keep all of this like under control? Um, and so I ended up kind of jumping on everything like months before I probably even really needed to, but so I think I reached now where I can actually kind of chill and just kind of like right into the end of it. And I'm really looking forward to that.
Speaker 2:Oh my gosh. Good for you. I feel like I'm going to have to take notes mastered that yet. I think you've just got like so eager and I just got to
Speaker 3:Into it and I really love like organizing things and planning things. Like I originally wanted to be an event planner. So I think that really worked in my favor as far as all of this, like launch goes, it was just very like get it all done super early. Cause I was so excited. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Well good. Good. No, and I'm, I'm the same way. I'm a total planner and uh, yeah, I like having a very set schedule and trying to stay on top of things, but yet somehow I always feel like falling behind. Like I have this idea in my head that, Oh yeah, I'm so organized and so responsible and I'm not sure how much that actually plays out. I think,
Speaker 3:I think for me they helped because I'm actually not that organized. So I think it was that for a while there I was procrastinating working on like edits. And so I was like, I should plan my lunch.
Speaker 2:I should do these things that are totally about the things I'm supposed to be doing now. But now I can actually do that. That's true. No, I can be kind of nice to be able to switch back and forth when, you know, you're kind of struggling with the writing or you're stressed about something in your current work in progress to be able to be like, Oh, I'm going to go answer some interview questions or I'm going to put a video together, something like that. It can be nice to be able to switch back and forth. Yeah, definitely. Okay. So on that note, why don't you tell listeners what is meet cute diary about? Oh cool. So yeah, we keep a diary,
Speaker 3:A Y a romcom. Um, it's all about this trans boy named Noah, who in order to live out his romantic fantasies kind of composes this entire blog of trans eight QCs. Um, and basically as he's spending the summer with his brother in Denver, uh, troll on the internet is basically like this blog is fake. Everything is made up. And so in order to salvage his reputation and save the blog, he decides to stage the perfect fake relationship with a fan of the blog that he runs into in Denver.
Speaker 2:So I love that you like immediately bring up the troll. Cause I kind of feel like one of the biggest things that I took away from this book was trolls really suck that's to do with prominent for everybody. I feel like it's like,
Speaker 3:That's like the ultimate lesson of being on the internet. I feel like, especially like in like, I don't know, around like 2010s time, it was just like every time anything happened, he'd be like, Oh look another troll on the internet. Great. Like
Speaker 2:I know it can be really bad. Try to ignore it. Don't don't let the haters hate. I don't know. Okay. There's a message in there, but I really got nothing. I just trolls go away. Be nice. Nobody,
Speaker 3:Nobody likes you when all you do is, is be mean to people.
Speaker 2:I know it's like seriously put your energy somewhere else. Um, but no. Okay. I'm obviously being flippant. That's not actually the biggest thing I got from this book that I did get from it. Um, obviously this is a rom-com is it spoiler-y to talk about how there's kind of two, uh, parallel love stories happening in this book? Are we alone about that? I think, I think we can.
Speaker 3:She does not spoil the happily ever after. Okay. I really want to talk
Speaker 2:Fine. All right. Well, I want to talk about on a craft level, you've got these two parallel romance lines happening and one of them on the surface, I mean, you've got, you're hitting all the high notes. You've got the meet cute. You've got the fake dating relationship, which is, you know, obviously the pathway to happily ever after, as we all know. Um, and you know, this guy is just like super suave and everything's perfect. Um, and on the other relationship, it's not all sparkly and straight out of a rom-com movie and there's like this the least huge meeting of all time. Just talk to me about how you kind of approached these two very storylines and how you, you know, how you crafted them and how you wanted to develop these, these characters in these romances. Well, I, I feel like,
Speaker 3:I feel like every time I talk about this book, I ended up diving into like the embarrassing moments of my own like life and like love life. But, um, I feel like as I was, you know, thinking about like, how can I craft like this really cute romance, um, that kind of like plays on a lot of these tropes and could have like a, like a really like fun, like aesthetic like summary good time. Um, I was thinking about like what to me makes like a really good romance. And I was thinking about how in my own personal life, I've never really done the flashy romance thing. Like every person that I've ever had, like a relationship with have been people who I knew kind of like as a friend or people who like I knew, like from somebody else. And there was always not very splashy and there was none of that, like, you know, the meet cute and like all of the, like the social media, like, you know, personality kind of thing. And I think I was thinking about it and I was like, I feel like in a lot of books and movies, there's this really romanticized idea of like, what if we met in the cutest, like play possible? What if we could have like all these like photographic moments and like these beautiful dates and like all these things. And I was like, you know, as a kid, I think that was what I thought the perfect romance would be. And only as I got older was I like, I mean, if you get along and like, you know, stuff's good, you can talk to each other. Like, I feel like that works practical
Speaker 2:Approach to romance. Yeah,
Speaker 3:Exactly. And so I think it ended up being kind of like striking that balance between what if I have like this one relationship, but on the surface has everything you could ever ask for that has like, you know, that could hit every single one of this, you know, hopeless romantics desires in a perfect relationship. Whereas on the other hand, what if there was another relationship that was the exact opposite where like it's an absolute nightmare and you're like, God, this person is a mess and this is not cute. And this is like, like, how do we like, like how do we talk to people and tell them about like our meeting, when like the meeting was like that, like how do we make this something that we can be like proud of and excited about? Um, and so just basically drawing the balance between, you know, the idea of a perfect romance and what actually works for two people. Um, and basically showing the contrast between something that on paper sounds like the greatest romance of all time and something that on paper sounds absolutely terrible, but it's actually pretty good when you look at it.
Speaker 2:Mm no. And I love them and obviously I love romances. I love all of these tropes, you know, there's a reason that they're popular. Um, but I really enjoyed reading the, you know, the, the less than shiny sparkly line. And it was so fun to see how you were almost, you know, intentionally pushing back against these tropes. Like what, how can we take this and make it as unappealing as possible, this wonderful relationship grow out of it?
Speaker 3:I think that a lot of what it comes down to is just kind of like, kind of like defining what media convinces you as, like the best part of our relationship. Like, I feel like, you know, the people talk about like, Valentine's day and like, what is the best part of relationship? Like, Oh, like, you know, having chocolates and like the perfect date and like a dozen roses and like all these things. And it's like, yeah, those things are cute. Don't get me wrong. Like I'm here for it. But like at the end of the day, what is the cutest thing? And I'm like, for me, I feel like the cutest thing is just having someone who supports you, who understands you, who likes to talk about the same things. Like somebody who can like really be there for you when you need them. Even if like, you know, the meet cute was not on me.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Right. Right. And in real life, it is, it's about,
Speaker 3:You know, what is true love. It's somebody
Speaker 2:That you can just spend all day with and be comfortable with and like, feel like you can be yourself around. And that is so much more important than you say, the Instagram photos, the, the apparently perfect yet very kind of surface level romance. I loved it. I loved this very unique twist on it. Thank you. I am curious. So Noah you're, our protagonist has made this, uh, kind of like bullet point plan, the steps to falling in love and having that perfect relationship. And I don't think it's a spoiler to say things don't exactly. Go according to plan. Um, did the, the inspiration for that come from and did you kind of create the plan first and then let that dictate the plot or vice versa? Or how did you work that in?
Speaker 3:So the plan basically from, from this was back, um, around nano of 29th,
Speaker 2:28,
Speaker 3:I am a nano writer. I actually I'm. I, the first time I actually wrote a book in a reasonable amount of time, it was a nano book, um, back in like 2016 and so full, like how to get myself to sit down and write for like years now. But, um, yeah, I actually wrote two books that nano. And so that was the first book that I wrote a second book after that. Um, as part of like a, how to like motivate myself to just get as much writing done as I can. And the one month that I'm actually good at writing,
Speaker 2:I love it. No, I am also a nano writer, always excited to hear how it's led to so many good books in the world.
Speaker 3:I was talking to some of my best friends, um, and we all actually wrote our debut novels, the same nano. And so he's like, that's so funny. Yeah. We're all over. Like books are coming out, like they're all written the exact same of the year. Like that month changed the
Speaker 2:World publishing do before there was NaNoWriMo. I honestly,
Speaker 3:The prize that people like have the ability to like motivate themselves to write a whole book when it's not like a nano challenge. Like, I feel like that's the only thing that convinced me to like finish. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, I hear you. And having that community and just like the support. It's so good.
Speaker 3:It's amazing. I love it so much.
Speaker 2:But we got a little off track. You were talking about the steps. Oh yes, yes. The steps. Oh, so, um,
Speaker 3:The steps basically I was that nano. I was like, okay, I'm going to write two books and I want to have one, that's going to be like a romance and a contemporary romance and wants to get like a fantasy. So I was like, okay, if I'm going to get into this whole like romantic comedy thing, like, you know, what are the key elements that make like, that make that genre so good. Um, and so I ended up doing some research, pulling up, like, you know, all these like romantic comedies, like, you know, like movies and like books and just kind of like comparing the elements around them. And essentially what I came up with was these key points that like, you know, every story kind of had in common. Um, and so those are kind of what I ended up being the 12 steps. It was just basically my way of taking, um, the most important elements of the genre. And it kind of turning them into the super formulaic, like set up that I could use to kind of drive the main characters thinking as far as like what should happen in the story. Um, but I don't really, I don't really plot books and I don't really think about the plot a whole lot, um, before I start writing. So I basically sat down and I had these 12 steps I had, um, like Noah's personality. I had the blog. Um, and I basically knew that I wanted to kind of subvert, um, some of the elements of like first love and like the field, like a perfect romance. So that was kind of it. And so I just kind of like sat down and was like, okay, let me use the steps and kind of like, see where it goes. So I would just start with like, okay, the first step, let me cute. And like write up, like, you know, this is the BQ and like kind of like go from there. And then as I would kind of hit like roadblocks throughout, it would just kind of be like, Oh, well, according to this step blank should happen next. Here's how I'm going to do it. And then I'm just kinda like, kinda continue that way.
Speaker 2:That's a really clever way to do it. It's almost like you created your own plot structure. Like, you know, something you'd just see in like, save the cat, writes a novel or like a writing guide, but instead of plot structure, it's romance structure. Yeah.
Speaker 3:I thought it was funny. Cause the whole thing was, you know, essentially a joke, but at the same time it was also like very accurate. Like you could honestly take those steps and like apply them to like an action to like, you know, popular romcoms and you'll find most of them there. And so it's kind of like, even though it was a joke, it's also almost like a re like a romance writing guide.
Speaker 2:Right. I wonder. And this just occurred to me as you were talking in actual life and real world relationships. I mean, there's gotta be studies done about like the psychology of falling in love. And I wonder now how many of these steps might have applications to like actual relationships? Honestly, that's a great question. No idea. I have no idea, but it'd be interesting to look up now. I'm curious.
Speaker 3:I would love to see if the trip AK the fall part one is actually a real,
Speaker 2:There's some things where it's like you bust go through this terrible traumatic mere breakup in order to survive. And I'm like, well, my husband and I haven't gotten there, so it must still be coming. I'm looking forward to that part. That sounds like a lot of fun. Okay. So obviously the, the story revolves a lot around this blog. Noah's blog, the meet cute diary. And it's talked about throughout the book that Noah very much sees this blog as like, you know, it's this beacon of hope for the trans community and it carries this message that, you know, you are deserving of love and it's out there for you don't give up, which is obviously such a powerful message. And we see that coming across in the book. And it just made me wonder when you were writing this book, were you thinking about the parallels between the blog and this story and what this book might come to mean for your readers? It's like funny,
Speaker 3:Because I think on the one hand I was thinking about what the story would mean to me. If I had read it, like when I was younger, it just kind of like, um, it was kind of like, because there've been so many times that I had been told as a writer that, that if I wanted to write a trans book, it needed to have a lot of trauma in it and needed to like educate SIS readers that needed to be all about learning what it means to be trans. And so for me to write a story that was just, this is a trans happily ever after. This is just about trans happiness. And just about being about finding that true love for yourself. Like, as I was writing it, I was kinda thinking like, you know, this is my statement that we can write that, that we can have it's okay. If we just want to be like happy, we don't have to be educational or like traumatic or anything like that. Um, and so I think for me, it was kind of like a message to myself, like as a writer that like, yes, you're allowed to write this. Like, you don't have to feel like you have to curate your writing for somebody else. And then I think it never really occurred to me like, Oh, but like readers are gonna look at this and think, Oh my God, I can have a happily ever after it was more dislike as a writer can write a happily ever after. And then I think only after like arc started going out and when people,
Speaker 2:Oh my God, like this gave me hope for like, you know, true love and the kind of stuff. And I was like, Oh yeah. Oh, right, right. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Well that brings up another really interesting question because I agree, I think that historically, um, and not just trans voices, but a lot of marginalized voices, you know, there is this kind of historical assumption that if you're going to write a book, it has to be X, Y, or Z, otherwise it won't fit the market or it's not publishable publishable for whatever reason. When you started submitting this, did you get any pushback from agents and editors or what was that process like for you? Um, it's like, and I feel, so this was the second book
Speaker 3:I wrote that was supposed to be like, uh, like comedy kind of like romance, um, featuring marginalized characters. And I think I got way more pushback on the first one. Um, in that the first one was about a black main character and an Asian main character. And, um, they each had like their own little romances. Um, but there was a little bit of like exploration of like, um, racism and that kind of stuff in the book. Um, and I got a lot of responses to that one that was kind of like, you know, why aren't we exploring like more of like the struggle? Why, why aren't we like getting more of that? Why is there like, kind of like this happiness just kind of thrown it? Um, yeah. And then I did get on this one as well. I think I didn't query, um, meet your diary as long as I queried the first book. So I do also wonder, like, if I would've gotten way more pushback if I had been like in the query trenches for longer. Um, but with that one, I kind of got a few different responses that were kind of along the lines of like, you know, this doesn't really balance out the serious stuff well enough with like boppy stuff. Um, and so it was kind of like one of those things where it was like, um, you know, I don't really know how to bring those things in, in a way that doesn't take away from what the ultimate goal of the book was. Um, and I did get a couple of comments that were kind of like, you know, essentially saying like, can we get more of like the struggle of being trans and like a little more of like, why this is so hard for him? And like, you know, why it's so for trans people to have a happily ever after. And I was kind of like, is it not just enough that they want one? Like, you know, so I do think, yeah, there was, I do feel like ultimately the pushback was not nearly as bad as it could have been and as bad as I've heard from some other people. Um, but there was some kind of like, so is this all like, where's, where's the rest of it? And I'm like, that's all
Speaker 2:Did that. I mean, did you go back and make any changes or were you just like, no, this is my happy love story and you still publish it
Speaker 3:Because it's perfect and awesome. I mean, so I got really lucky, I think initially, because when I first queried the book, um, I had done it off of like a pitch contest. I got Twitter pitch contest, so there had been a lot of hype around it. So I got the first offer really fast. Um, and so when I got like some of the negative feedback, it was really easy to just kind of ignore it because I was like, well, I already have an offer. So I don't really care if you hate it. Like, it doesn't matter. Right. Um, and I think, I think even going on sub it ended up being similar to where, um, ultimately before I got, I had only gotten one rejection before I got my first offer. So even though I had a few people being like, why isn't there more of this and everything? I was like, well, I mean, there's not sorry by like, I didn't have to worry about it. Cause I already had somebody who was, you know, willing to work with the story of the way it was. Um, but I think, I think ultimately like I did, I did get some suggestions throughout like both from like beta readers and like editorial comments and stuff where it was kind of like, can we explore, you know, more of Noah's like, concerns about being trans? Like why isn't there more, like, concerned about him getting mis-gendered or like why, um, or what about like, you know, especially cause it mentioned at the beginning that he's not passing, um, it was like, you know, why are there more moments like where people have to ask him his gender or where he's not sure about like whether or not people will perceive as gender appropriately and like all these kinds of things. And I was just kind of like, no, I'm not doing that. Like I was like, I I'm good with, um, people respecting him as it is. I don't feel like we need to change that.
Speaker 2:Right. Right. And it is, I mean, those are as a writer. I mean, there's always these difficult decisions you have to make, but it's, and it can be hard to kind of stay true to your vision of the book. And like, this is the story that I want to tell, this is the story that's in my heart when you have, you know, editors and, and critique partners or other people coming in and making all these suggestions. And so I think it's awesome that you were able to kind of stand your ground there.
Speaker 3:Yeah, definitely. And I think, I think it helped, um, to a certain extent just writing within the genre that I was writing because I had a few people say like, well, it's really realistic how like blank. And I'm like, okay, but it's, it's a romance. Like it's a romcom like, like look at like a hallmark movie and come back here and tell me, this is an excellent point. Yeah. Like I just feel like, you know, and I do think like, I think to a certain extent when you're writing more literary and more realistic fiction, like there is kind of an expectation that you're gonna balance out like the realism, but I'm like in a wrong column, like everyone, everyone shows up for the happy ending. Like we're here for the funny and the cute. And like, we don't necessarily need to be reminded of things that, you know, make it more realistic by making it more traumatic. Like the fact of the matter is like certain genres that just isn't a necessity. And so I feel like that kind of helped being like, but it's a wrong column, so don't yell at me
Speaker 2:And I love that. And I think that's totally fair. Um, and I think that people who are fans of the genre, I love that too. Like you're here for the romance. You're here for the love story. Yeah, exactly. Um, one of my favorite characters was Becca any hope for a Becca book in the future. Okay. So
Speaker 3:I love that you asked me that question because I've been thinking a lot, um, the past couple weeks about potential spinoffs, potential sequels. Like what do I have in mind for all of the characters? Um, and I think so if I'm being honest, I do feel like every character in that book has a story to be told and like we got Noah's story. Um, so we didn't get everyone else's. So I feel like there's definitely room for these stories in the future. Um, I think my biggest issue right now, um, in regards to a Becca book, because I feel like Becca is honestly one of the most readily to explore like characters. Like she has so much going on and so much like of her own personality that we haven't really gotten to touch on yet. Um, but I think my thing is I feel a little out of my lane writing, you know, a Cuban lesbian story. Um, just because I feel like there are so many, or I should say there are so few Cuban lesbians, like books published at the moment. And like, I would rather, um, you know, let an author whose lane that is write a story like that, but I have considered playing around with the idea of potentially co-writing maybe a Becca book. Um, and yeah, just maybe getting somebody on board who could better understand like her identity and could write her, um, stories. So that's definitely not like an out of the question idea. I just haven't quite played around with how I would actually make that happen.
Speaker 2:Yeah, fair enough. No, I understand that 100% always asking me, can we have a book about this person or this couple or this character? And I'm like, I would love to, I don't know if I'm qualified for that. Um, I want you kind of switched gears and we earlier talked a little bit about, you know, promotion getting ready to launch your debut novel.
Speaker 3:Um, and I
Speaker 2:Saw on your Instagram, your pre-order campaign, um, which I think is so clever because you've kind of set it up as like a Kickstarter where there's like, you know, you tell you talk about the pre-order campaign. That was really genius and I'm probably going to steal it. Oh, thank you. I feel, feel free to steal it. I, I, for me, it was almost like a social experiment, um, because
Speaker 3:I feel like there's a lot of talk about pre-order campaigns, but nobody knows what works. Like everyone will be like, I read a pre-order
Speaker 2:Yeah, babe, but I don't even know if it actually did much. I don't know, like all publicity, like it's just one of those like mysteries of publishing where like
Speaker 3:Everyone's running a campaign, but nobody knows why we're doing it the way we're in or what actually works or if it's actually like, you know, helping anything. And so I feel like for me, I was kind of like, okay, I just want to make it fun and like interactive so that people have like, you know, an investment in like the book and, and an investment and like the book coming out and like what's going on with the book. So, um, I ended up doing, basically it started off with three rewards automatically out the gate. Anyone who pre-orders or submits a library receipt gets, um, a double-sided postcard, a sticker sheet, um, an assigned book plate. And then I was like, well, how do I, so I had the idea for the s'mores kit really early on, but I was like, I can't ship out 300 s'mores kids. I don't have that kind of money or the time or the energy. Um, so I was like, okay, what if I did a giveaway? Um, and so I thought that would be fun, but I didn't like the idea of a giveaway, like being the only thing, because I know that people like there's so many people are not to be able to get it. And I feel like, no, I want everyone to get something. So I ended up doing the three, like base tier, like, um, rewards. And then I was like, okay, what if every time we hit a certain number of receipts submitted, I add another reward. So now I've added like a double-sided bookmark. Um, I think we unlocked a bonus scene, like an after credit scene. Um, there's a tote bag giveaway. There's a s'mores kit giveaway. Um, and got it basically just ended up being like, what are some fun things that I can like make myself and like, um, send out because I do graphic design and illustration, um, myself. So the postcard and the sticker sheet and like all that kind of stuff was designed by me. Um, and then there's like, the bookmark was designed by the cover artist. I used the cover sketches cause I have, um, I partnered with them to use those cover sketches to like design the bookmark. Um, but yeah, so it was basically just kind of a, a combination of me being like, how can I keep everybody involved by like giving them something to look forward to and like, to make it worth their while to kind of like ask the front the pre-order and like talk to other people about pre-ordering. Um, and so I ended up going to tear incentive route, and that was because I've done, um, Kickstarters before. Um, I used to self-publish like way back and I ended up doing a Kickstarter for, um, one of those books that I had I had written in. So I feel like it was kind of like saw the hype that kind of goes into it the way that people get really invested when they know that, like, what they're doing essentially is like actually contributing something to the overall like reward and like what comes out of this project. Um, so I felt like it kind of gave people, um, more involvement in it than just being like, okay, well, if you pre-order, it I'll send you a like a sticker or something. Like, it was like now in their benefit to kind of like, you know, boost it and talk about it and like get excited for it because there are so many, like, hidden features that you can still unlock if you kind of like keep participating.
Speaker 2:I think it is absolutely genius. Um, I love it. I can't, I don't know that I've heard of anyone doing anything quite like it and yeah, like I'm totally going to steal it. I think it's brilliant.
Speaker 3:Yeah. Thank you. And I will say, I will say it is, it is a lot of work. Yeah. At first I thought, okay, well, if I get like, these prizes, like planned out in advance, like, it won't be a big deal. And then they unlocked like two prizes. And like the first day that I announced it, it was amazing. I was so excited, but I was also like, Holy crap. Okay. I was not expecting that. And then like, and then just kind of like keeping up with like the graphics with updating my website, every time something new was like announced and like keeping track of like exactly what rewards have to go out to like who and everything, but it is a lot of fun. And I think, I think people were just really excited about it. And I think especially like, as a debut, like I don't have, um, I don't have a fan base. I don't have people who are going to be like, Oh, I read your last book. So let me pre-order this one. So it ended up kind of being like, how can I get people invested in just the process itself? And so I think that's kind of what I went that route.
Speaker 2:Yeah. No. And I mean, it's the sort of thing that really kind of starts to kick up that initial buzz and it is so hard to get that initial buzz, especially like you say, being a debut it's it's the challenge. Um, so yeah. Good. Good. Thank you.
Speaker 3:Okay.
Speaker 2:We're going to now wrap this up with our happy writer bonus round. First question. What book makes you happy
Speaker 3:Cemetery boys by and Thomas? I almost, I almost said by eight inch maiden, I always, like I told them, I was like, why would you supposed to do now that your handles, I'm just going to keep messing up your name. Great handling.
Speaker 2:Oh, no. I love that book. What is your personal mantra?
Speaker 3:The only things I ever regret are the things that I never try.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's a good one. You laugh. What is one small thing that brings you a lot of joy? My dog. What kind of dog do you have?
Speaker 3:He's a mini Australian shepherd. Um, and so he's quite small, but he's very cute and very soft and I very much appreciate him.
Speaker 2:Oh, I think we, maybe I think I may have heard him earlier. You probably did. How do you celebrate an accomplishment?
Speaker 3:Boba tea usually. Um, and sometimes watching anime.
Speaker 2:What's your favorite anime? I loved all the anime references in this book, by the way. Thank you for mentioned sailor moon, which is my personal favorite. I feel like, you know, it's funny because I also love to,
Speaker 3:But I feel like it's been like, it's been like taken, like, I, I feel like it's already, so like,
Speaker 2:Has it become a cliche? It's like a cliche.
Speaker 3:I feel like it's like, like I want to introduce people to all the animals that nobody knows about. And I feel like I'm like, Oh, say little, everyone knows sailor moon. Like, let me pick something that like is going to be like, Oh, so, but someone might read it and be like, Oh my God, like I may not know that. And maybe I should go watch it. So like,
Speaker 2:That's a good point. Or you might get readers who do know, and if it's a little obscure, they're going to be like, Oh my gosh, my favorite thing got referenced that nobody ever talks about. Yes, exactly. And yeah,
Speaker 3:I feel like that's kind of like a huge thing for me. Um, what was my favorite anime? I don't know that I have one. Um, but I feel like right now I'm really into demons layer and like, that's a really good one. It's relatively, but it's very, I, I should warn everyone that's graphic, but it's cute. If you ignore the graphic parts,
Speaker 2:What is the best writing advice you've ever received? Oops, that's hard. I feel like, I feel like it
Speaker 3:Probably whoever it was, um, who first told them that like your first draft is kind of supposed to suck. Um, and I think it's just because at the time, or I should say always, but I've always been a major perfectionist. Um, and so I, my brain will literally stall if I feel like I can't do something like perfectly. So just to kind of be told, like you can have a zero draft, nobody has to read it. You can come back to it later has like made it so that now I can draft books like super fast, as opposed to like the first book that I wrote to be five years to draft. And like now I drop on average in two weeks. So I think that just really changed the way I write, like entirely.
Speaker 2:Hold on. Do you actually draft a book in two weeks? Yes. I mean, I'm, I'm not that fast. I mean, it varies
Speaker 3:Like the length varies for both, but usually somewhere between like 50 and 65 K is my first draft.
Speaker 2:That is amazing. I'm so jealous. Right. I feel like what it is for me.
Speaker 3:I sit down to start writing. Like I either get it all out at once or I, I just like, forget everything that I was trying to do because I don't like plot. And so I just kind of like the second idea, like hits me and I'm like inspired by it. I basically have to turn it all out or like I'll never finish it. Um, and so now I feel like, I feel like writing in two weeks to a month is actually easier for me than trying to like spread it out over like a couple of months. It's just not like something I can do.
Speaker 2:And then do you feel like you slowed down a lot then for your first revision? Or do you also like kind of try to keep up that momentum? Um, I feel like usually
Speaker 3:The first revision is really fast too. It'll usually be like maybe three weeks, three to four
Speaker 2:Nike's robot. What it is is just that
Speaker 3:My brain has such a short attention span. So once, like if I'm into something, I only have like a couple of weeks before I'm so over it. So like, I just have to do it all then otherwise, like once I lose that momentum, it's just dead and I just can't like, make it happen again. So I think that's why it just kind of happens like so fast. I feel like later revisions tend to take me longer just because, um, once I have to like weigh out, like what other people are thinking of about the book, it ends up slowing me down a little bit, as opposed to like, when it's just me and like me getting in my head, I can kind of just like, turn it out super fast. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Um, let's see. What are you working on next, you know, in the next two weeks, what are you gonna crank out for us
Speaker 3:Right now? I'm technically on a short writing break because I have so many things going on. Um, in regards to like the nature diary launch that I'm like trying not to like get invested in a different project. Um, but my next, um, the next project that I'm working on with my agent is a book. I don't even like, I try to like keep it super vague because it's kind of like wonky and weird. I don't want to like give too much away. Um, but it's basically like this like slow burn romance set against a, um, contemporary fantasy backdrop with a lot of Chinese and Japanese mythological inspirations.
Speaker 2:Ooh, there was a lot in that sentence. That sounded very exciting. Thank you lastly, where can people find you?
Speaker 3:So I am on Twitter and that's a social media platform that I use the most I'm on there at Emory Lee, who, um, I am on
Speaker 2:Instagram. You can find me at Emory Lee books or at Emory Lee, who one is my book account and the other is my art account. And then of course my website is Emory Lee books.com. Um, and then I am also on YouTube at a break from reality and reality is like upon. So it's like reality, but instead of like the actual word, it ends like tea because I have a sick obsession with tea and Boba. So awesome. Emery, thank you so much for joining me today. Thank you for having me as a lot of fun readers. Be sure to check out, meet cute diary, which comes out tomorrow. And if you are listening to this on the third, there is still time to get in your pre-order. Of course, we always encourage you to support your local indie bookstore if you can, but if you don't have a local indie, you can check out our affiliate store at bookshop.org/shop/marissa Meyer. If you're enjoying these conversations, please subscribe and follow us on Instagram at Marissa Meyer author and happy writer podcast until next time stay healthy and cozy in your bunkers and whatever life throws at you today. I do hope that now you're feeling a little bit
Speaker 1:[inaudible].