Middle Grade Horror and Illustrated Novels with Remy Lai - Read At Your Own Risk

Marissa chats with Remy Lai about her new illustrated sketch diary, READ AT YOUR OWN RISK. Also discussed in this episode: why kids relate to horror, the importance of capturing the tone of the book on the cover and determining appropriate content for a young audience, making important design choices like font and color, deciding on a story’s format, Ouija boards, and so much more!

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Transcript

[00:09] Marissa: Hello and welcome to the Happy writer. This is a podcast that aims to bring readers more books to enjoy and to help authors find more joy in their writing. I am your host, Marissa Meyer. Thank you so much for joining me. One thing making me happy this week, I am leaving on a writing retreat tomorrow. I am so excited just going with some of my very close beloved writing friends. Local writing group. We're going to go spend two days, one of them owns, or, I don't know, has a timeshare or something at this condo up in the mountains. We'll spend a couple days there and then after that we have an Airbnb rented out in the middle of nowhere and we're just going to hunker down and get some writing done. And I can't wait because I have big, big goals. A lot that I want to try to accomplish over the next six days and hoping to make some really, really great progress on the bluebeard novel in particular while we are there, because this book is taking so much longer to write than I initially thought it would. Some books are just like that. This is one of them. But I feel like I'm in a good place with it right now and I'm ready to crank out some words. So I'm bringing my noise canceling headphones and I'm going to be very, very antisocial and hopefully get so much writing done and I'm really looking forward to it. I am also so happy to be talking to today's guest. She studied fine arts with a major in painting and drawing and is the author of the critically acclaimed books for young readers, high in the sky, fly on the wall, Haw Caso, the surviving the Wild series, ghost book, and chicken Pox. Her newest illustrated middle grade novel, read at your own risk, comes out next week on August 13. Please welcome Remy Lai.

[02:10] Remy: Hi, Marissa. How are you?

[02:11] Marissa: I am fantastic. How are you doing?

[02:14] Remy: I'm doing great.

[02:16] Marissa: So here we are. As of when you and I are recording this, it's a couple of weeks still until your book comes out. How are you feeling about, are you excited? Are you nervous?

[02:27] Remy: I'm really excited and nervous, but I am just trying not to think too much about it.

[02:33] Marissa: Okay. And you're in Australia. Are you going to do like, are you able to do any book touring? Are you going to come to the States? Like, what are your, some of your promotion plans?

[02:46] Remy: We had plans to do in person tour later this year, but I had to drop out because health reasons.

[02:56] Marissa: Oh, I'm sorry to hear that.

[02:58] Remy: Yeah, it's a bummer.

[02:59] Marissa: It is a bummer, but it's good to do what's best for our health. That has to be priority number one, I guess.

[03:06] Remy: Yeah, I think that's one of the things that I recently learned the hard way.

[03:11] Marissa: It can be a hard thing to learn sometimes. Take care of yourself. Well, I'm so excited to talk to you. I had the best time reading this book. Read it in one sitting. It's not a very long book, but it's totally engrossing and has such a great twist at the end, which, of course, we won't say what it is. We won't spoil anything, but I just thought it was so brilliant and clever. So I'm really excited to talk to you about it. But before we get to talking about the book, I would first like to know about your origin story. As a writer, as an artist, did you always know you wanted to be this, or how did you get here?

[03:53] Remy: Yeah, I had no idea that I wanted to be an artist or a writer. When I was a kid, I read a lot of comic books and I drew a lot, and I continued drawing as I grew up, but I didn't know that I wanted to become, like, an artist or a writer just because when I was in school, I did not have, like, author visits or anything like that. So it just did not occur to me that it was an actual job. And also because I was really good with my academics, so I guess nobody thought that that would be a career that, you know, that was, for me, it was only when in university, then I had to think really hard about what I wanted to do. And then I thought, I really love, like, drawing and writing and telling stories, and I thought maybe I could try that. So that was. And I started taking it seriously.

[04:41] Marissa: And so what was kind of the path? Did you start in on books and graphic novels immediately, or did you do online comics or. I mean, what was, what were some of the steps you took to become a professional?

[04:56] Remy: I think I did maybe online comics, but nothing that I. Nothing that I continued. I wasn't really consistent with it. I was just having fun, I suppose. And then I moved on to graphic novels. So I would write scripts and draw the books, I suppose. And of course, I got many rejections. And then somewhere along the way, I thought I should try with prose, too, because I love reading, too. And I've always really enjoyed writing essays, fiction essays in school. So then I started doing that also. And, yeah, it just happened that the first book to be published was like an illustrated book, pie in the sky. And so that continued.

[05:45] Marissa: Yeah. How many books do you think you. Books or graphic novels do you think that you wrote before getting your first one published?

[05:57] Remy: I stopped counting somewhere because it's a lot, but I would estimate that maybe it's 20, but I have. I'm a pretty fast writer.

[06:08] Marissa: Okay. That's so much.

[06:11] Remy: Yeah. It took me years.

[06:13] Marissa: Did you find yourself getting discouraged at any point?

[06:17] Remy: Yeah, definitely. I would have maybe stopped and writing or drawing, but maybe only for a few weeks, and then I would get back to it.

[06:25] Marissa: So why do you think you kept going back to it?

[06:29] Remy: I want to say that I have nothing else, but in a way that is true, because that is really the thing that, I mean, I've had many hobbies over the years that I've always given up on. I just lost interest. But writing and drawing is really the only thing that I never lost interest in.

[06:46] Marissa: Yeah. I am curious, and I have no idea what the market is like trying to break into with illustrated novels or with graphic novels as opposed to prose novels. Do you feel like it's harder to break into, or do you think it's kind of equivalent?

[07:06] Remy: This is hard because, I mean, if I look at the prose novels that of mine that were rejected previously, I can't really say that it's because of the market. I would say it's because my skill then wasn't really up there yet. So it's hard to say.

[07:24] Marissa: Yeah, sure. Yeah. And I don't know. I don't have any statistics to offer. Just curious. Okay, so you do. You finally get your first book published, and now we're on book number. What is this, eight or nine? I should have counted. Do you know?

[07:44] Remy: Uh, hold on. Two if we count. Um, this, I have a series of three books that I'll just count them individually. So that counts are three books. Um, and then. So this would be my 8th book. Read at your own risk will be my 8th book.

[08:01] Marissa: All right, so we are now eight books into your career. Uh, would you tell listeners what is this book read at your own risk about?

[08:11] Remy: Yeah, I'm so excited. It's about a girl who plays a game to summon a spirit. She plays this game with her friends. It's called spirit of the coin. And so she's trying to summon a spirit, but she ends up summoning up some sort of evil that curses her and starts talking to her in the pages of her diary. And so she. A lot of really unfortunate things happen to her, and she has to break the curse before she dies, I suppose. And so it's an illustrated prose book. It's kind of like diary of a wimpy kid, but horror, but.

[08:53] Marissa: And yet completely different from Diary of a wimpy kid. I so enjoyed this book. The moment that I finished reading it, I immediately went to one of my daughters and handed it to her and was like, you have to read this. I know you're going to love it. She has not started yet because we've reached an age where my recommendations aren't as cool as they used to be. But I know that if she does get started on it, that she will just totally dig this. Because she's nine years old and she loves creepy, weird, dark horror gore. Like, she's just in that phase. Why do you think that kids relate so strongly to horror?

[09:40] Remy: I think it's just a really. A way for them to experience really extreme emotions, but in a really safe way. I remember as a kid, I also love to do things like crazy roller coasters and everything. That's that now I really wouldn't do. Yeah, something like that.

[10:00] Marissa: Did you like horror when you were a kid?

[10:03] Remy: Yeah, definitely. I read a lot of R l. Stine and I think Christopher pike.

[10:09] Marissa: Okay. I never read Christopher Pike. I loved R l Stine, though. He was my go to for a long time.

[10:17] Remy: So many books. It's great.

[10:18] Marissa: Yeah, no, it's like, once you get into him, like, there's just so much to take in. You could read r l sign forever and ever. How is he so prolific?

[10:27] Remy: And also, my parents didn't. They didn't really care what I read. So I also read quite a number of adult horror books. Like Stephen King.

[10:37] Marissa: Yeah, it's funny. I mean, like, I was definitely into R l. Stine, but to me, r l stine, he was like horror. But it was never so scary that.

[10:48] Remy: I always knew that it was going to be fine at the end, I suppose.

[10:51] Marissa: Right, right. No, for sure. It didn't. Like, they weren't books that would give me nightmares. But I never got into adult horror as a kid because I was too scared. I was such a scaredy cat and I hated scary movies. And I had a threshold like, okay, R l. Stein, he's safe, but beyond that, I'm not sure.

[11:11] Remy: Yeah, I think it's important for kid readers to have options and they can choose for themselves so that they know their own limits.

[11:22] Marissa: Yeah, no, absolutely. And I think kids are smart enough that they do know, like, if they start reading something that they're not ready for, I think most kids are like, okay, I'm gonna set this down. I don't know.

[11:35] Remy: That's one of the reasons. That's one of the, like, the factors that we think about. When we were designing the COVID for the book. We wanted to make sure that it captures the horror inside the book so that, you know, the kids who read the book are not, like, surprised by the heart. Yeah.

[11:53] Marissa: No, that's a really, really great point, because it's a great cover. It's so dark.

[11:58] Remy: I was surprised that my editor let me put all the blood on there.

[12:02] Marissa: That's so much blood. No. And that's another thing I love about the design inside of this book. So it very much looks like a journal. Like, with the. It's got the lines on the pages, and it's even got, like, this, the spiral bound, like, going through the middle of it. And the first. I don't know, the first third of the book, maybe is all black and white, and then suddenly there's these red splotches of blood on the page, and it's so striking, and I just love that. Was that your idea? Like, were you, like, can we please have a third color in here?

[12:36] Remy: Yeah, actually, that I insisted on the red color because my. My editor, he did say that, you know, if we do this, like, just a black and white or gray scale, it would be a lot cheaper to print, and so you would have more money, I said, but the book would read so differently without the red. And so I sacrificed money.

[12:56] Marissa: Well, I think you made the right choice. I hope it pays off and sells a gazillion more books in the end, because it's so cool and it's so unique. You just don't see it that often.

[13:08] Remy: Yeah. I'm really thankful that my editor is on board, because when I first, when I was writing it, I was thinking I wrote it in a frenzy. Like, maybe I sketched out the dummy in, like, a week. I just didn't sleep or anything because I didn't know whether it would work. So I had to make sure. I had to sketch it out to see if it would work. And then when I finished it, I thought, this is a little bit demented. And I don't know if anyone would go for it. I sent it to my agent, and luckily he was on board, and so was my editor.

[13:41] Marissa: That actually brings up a really great point, because it is horror, but it is also for children. I'm not sure. What are we thinking? Like, eight to twelve, maybe age?

[13:52] Remy: Yeah, I think it's marked eight plus.

[13:54] Marissa: Okay. But it gets pretty dark. And again, like, I know one of my nine year olds is gonna love it. Did you feel like you got any pushback from. From anyone in the publishing world worried about the market for it?

[14:09] Remy: Um, I mean, the book is not out yet, so I have no idea.

[14:15] Marissa: From the. Your team, though. Your publishing team.

[14:18] Remy: From my team, yeah. So obviously, when my editor and I were working on this, we didn't think about, oh, is this too much? He is. I would say that he has a very good head on him, but I tend to go a little bit to the extreme. So if I go extreme, he would say, maybe think about this, and then, because I value his opinion, so then I would really think about it. We did tone down some of the violence, I would say.

[14:44] Marissa: I was actually. I was going to ask if you feel like, when it comes to horror, if you're one of those where you, like. Right. Safe and then have to push yourself, or do you sometimes go overboard and then have to pull yourself back?

[14:56] Remy: I mostly go overboard and then my editor pulls me back.

[15:01] Marissa: That makes me so curious to know what, like, where it went that you had to pull back.

[15:07] Remy: I would say it's probably sometimes I am a little, I guess, lazy in a way, think about it. To say that you go for more, like, physical violence, but then my editor would say maybe, like, a psychological thing would be even scarier. And so those were sort of things that we talked about.

[15:27] Marissa: Yeah. So you talked about, like, working with. We've talked a little bit about the design elements, of course, having these wonderful splashes of red throughout the book. I was also curious because even though there's illustrations throughout the book, there's points also, at which the text itself almost becomes a part of the illustration. Did you do your own typesetting and typography? Did you submit it to your publisher kind of, like, fully with the text all laid out, or what was the process there? What did they do? What did you do?

[16:03] Remy: Oh, I'm happy to let you know that it's actually my handwriting. It is. It is. I wrote everything. We didn't create a font for it, so I'm glad it came across really neat.

[16:16] Marissa: This is your handwriting. I'm sorry, I'm looking at the book. This is handwriting? Yeah.

[16:21] Remy: Because there were some. There were some portions where the handwriting would go a little. A little erratic because she's feeling a certain way. And I thought that was really hard to do on the computer, I suppose, for me, like, if I had, like, a font or something. So I thought it's a lot easier for me to convey the emotions of at those points if I'm just doing handwriting.

[16:44] Marissa: I am blown away. I have terrible handwriting. I couldn't write this neatly if I.

[16:55] Remy: It's not my regular handwriting, is it?

[16:57] Marissa: I did not do it. I'm impressed. I'm impressed. I never, ever, ever would have guessed that this was handwritten.

[17:03] Remy: Then I will tell you one more thing that might impress you even more. Please do a handwriting for the evil. The ones in red?

[17:12] Marissa: Yeah. Yeah.

[17:13] Remy: That's actually my editor's handwriting.

[17:15] Marissa: Is it really?

[17:17] Remy: Well, it's actually a font. A font created from his handwriting because I couldn't ask him to write everything. That's not fair. So I said, could you, could we make a font with your handwriting? Because your handwriting is so terrible, it really suits the evil handwriting.

[17:32] Marissa: That is awesome. So your editor, they didn't create handwriting. This is just their handwriting.

[17:39] Remy: Oh, no, that's. We created a font from his handwriting.

[17:43] Marissa: That's so funny because it's such a creepy handwriting.

[17:47] Remy: It's like when I saw it, I was like, that is great.

[17:53] Marissa: What a cool little detail. Okay. I love that. I love that. I love knowing the backstory. So interesting.

[18:00] Remy: I had so much fun making this book.

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Marissa: So. Okay, so let's talk more, like general process. You mentioned I that you spent about a week creating a dummy of the book. What does that mean? What is a dummy?

[19:03] Remy: I guess because it's prose and illustrations in such a way that you cannot. So the illustrations are not spot illustrations. That means that if you move the illustration somewhere else, then it doesn't make sense anymore. They are integrated into the prose, so they have to be there for specific locations relative to the pros. So I have to make sure. And, but most importantly, I guess I have to make sure that the twist worked.

[19:32] Marissa: Yeah.

[19:33] Remy: Because I had this idea about a girl talking to some kind of evil in her diary for years. But I couldn't figure out how to make it work because usually the antagonist would lose at the end right. Especially in a middle grade book. But I just felt that it wasn't right. I wanted. Well, maybe this is a spoiler, but I wanted both of them to win. And so for years, I couldn't figure out how, how that could be. And it was only when suddenly, when I wasn't thinking about the book. And then I realized, oh, that's it.

[20:06] Marissa: I love those moments. The best. The best thing a writer can ask for.

[20:11] Remy: Yeah. But I also knew that it, it couldn't. The. The twist at the end couldn't come as a, I want to say, as a shock. Like, it's a twist, but then when you look back on it, you saw, you would, you should see that I have laid, like, clues into it that would lead to that. So I wasn't sure whether I could get that. So then that's why I did the dummy.

[20:34] Marissa: So how much did the story change from that initial dummy?

[20:40] Remy: Ah, the story didn't really change, as in the twist didn't change, but I think my editor gave me really good notes so that I could make the clues clearer and I suppose to make the protagonist more active.

[21:01] Marissa: So before making that dummy, did you know it, like, did you have this story kind of plotted out, outlined, or did it just kind of all come rushing out of you in this week of inspiration?

[21:14] Remy: Yeah. This book was an anomaly. So my other books, usually I have to write, like, outlines and then revise, revise the outlines a million times. But this one wasn't. This one just poured out on me in that week.

[21:28] Marissa: Oh, how cool. I feel like we all get one or two of those in our career, and it's just, like, the best feeling. Like, why can't they all be like this?

[21:36] Remy: No, I know. It's a high that I keep chasing.

[21:40] Marissa: Right. Maybe. Maybe there'll be more. I hope it's not the only one. What about when it comes to character design? Do you do illustrations and kind of, like, play around with the looks of the characters beforehand, or do they change a lot in revisions? What's your process there?

[22:06] Remy: For this one, the character pretty much remains very similar to how I had her in the dummy, but mainly because it's such a simple design, I can't exactly make it simpler. And because of the style that is so simple and a little sketchy, I just didn't want to bog it down with, like, too much details. But usually for my other books, uh, I would definitely go back and forth refining, um, the character design.

[22:37] Marissa: Okay, so you have written graphic novels and illustrated graphic novels, and you have also done. Uh, these illustrated prose, mixed novels, when a story idea comes to you, how do you decide? How do you figure out, okay, this is going to be a graphic novel, or this is going to have some pros mixed in. How do you know?

[23:06] Remy: It's in my contract. I mean, that is actually a real part of the consideration, what I'm contracted for next. And then, but also my editor and I would want to make sure that it is the right format for the story. And I just think that some stories lend themselves better to certain formats, I would say. I think, like, different formats would have different strengths, and it depends on what you're trying to achieve with the story, I think, and see which format is better for that, in a way.

[23:46] Marissa: Yeah. So what would you say are some of the strengths that illustrated prose novels have over graphic novels?

[23:53] Remy: That's a tough question. For one, I actually think if we are talking about reality, sometimes adults are more resistant to when you say it's a graphic novel, as opposed to it's an illustrated prose novel. So it's a book with pictures. So I think we're getting less of that pushback now. But that would be a plus point for, like, an illustrated prose. And also, I think if, for me, if there is a lot of world building, like fantasy world building, like in my book, my graphic novel, ghost book, I just thought that it would be a lot more inviting and immersive if I have all those pictures on the page than if it were if I only describe it in a few lines, I suppose.

[24:55] Marissa: I love that you bring up this idea of historically there being kind of a stigma sometimes against graphic novels. I love graphic novels, and I have, since I was a teenager, loved them as a reader, loved them as a parent. But it's interesting because actually, the daughter that I gave this book to, she's going through a huge graphic novel phase right now to where she has actually said, like, I only read graphic novels, mom. Like, why would I read anything else? And, like, I've got nothing against her reading graphic novels, but I also love the idea that something like this, that is the mix of prose and illustration, might kind of perform a bridge role to get some reluctant readers, you know, to also maybe try things with more words on the page. Do you find that when you're interacting with readers, do you hear stories about like, oh, this was the gateway drug for me to then reading actual novels?

[25:55] Remy: No. So far I've, the kids I've met, they just say they either read a lot of graphic novels or they prefer text, but mostly they prefer graphic novels just because of the pictures. I've never heard them, but I think when they read, they just. They don't really think about, like, a bridging book. They just read. If the hook of the story catches them, I think they would give it a try. Yeah. And then if they see their friends reading it, I think they would want to try it, too.

[26:27] Marissa: Yeah. No, I think. I think that's true. I think that us parents and teachers think a lot more about the bridge and the gateway and all of this than, you know, kids just want to be entertained. Right. They just want a good story.

[26:42] Remy: Yeah.

[26:43] Marissa: Okay. Speaking of good stories, I did have to ask. So, in the book, there is this game that these kids play, the spirit of the coin, which is kind of what first brings this evil being into Hannah, our protagonist's life. Is this a real game? I was not familiar with spirit of the coin, and I was wondering if you made it up.

[27:11] Remy: No, I think it is a real game. I don't know if somebody made it up. Well, I don't know about that. I've always known about this game since I was a kid, so I don't know, I just thought that it was a real thing. I think I've seen them on asian movies, so I think maybe it's an asian thing.

[27:29] Marissa: Oh, okay. I mean, it's like a DIY Ouija board, right?

[27:33] Remy: Yeah, it is. And I did think of using a Ouija board instead of the spirit of the coin. Now I can't remember why I decided against it.

[27:43] Marissa: Well, I like this. I mean, it's because otherwise, if they're using a Ouija board, then you're like, but where did they get the Ouija board?

[27:50] Remy: Yeah, I think that's it. Yeah, but where is this?

[27:53] Marissa: It's like, no, they just made their own. It works so well.

[27:57] Remy: I think that's it.

[27:58] Marissa: No, I love it, because, I mean, here, just like a few days before I read the book, my other daughter had been asking for a Ouija board because she's convinced that there is a ghost who lives in our house, and she's named him naughty Gerald, and she wants to talk to him. So she was like, mom, can we get a Ouija board? And I was like, well, I don't. Maybe. But then I read this book and was like, oh, as soon as the girls read this book, I know what they will be doing. They will make this game.

[28:30] Remy: Oh, really?

[28:32] Marissa: So I hope naughty Gerald isn't as cruel and evil as the creature in your book.

[28:37] Remy: Oh, that's scary. Whenever kids talk about ghosts that they see, I'm really spooked.

[28:45] Marissa: Yeah. No, I don't know if naughty Gerald is real. He seems nice. I mean, they call him naughty, but he seems pretty harmless.

[28:53] Remy: You know, those names that, like, sound really friendly and upbeat are actually the scariest names I know.

[29:00] Marissa: No, I know. I don't know where she got that name from. Maybe that in itself is kind of creepy, but, yeah, so far, the worst that naughty Gerald has done is thrown a sponge at her or her sister at one point. So I'm like, well, that's not so bad. Oh, another thing that I wanted to ask, kind of going back to your process, because you had mentioned that while you were writing these 20 graphic novels and novels before getting published, that you are a fast writer. So what is the time? Like, these one week bursts of inspiration aside, what is your timeline like, how long does it take you to make a book, generally speaking?

[29:49] Remy: Well, the drawing part is usually the longest. And so when I was for all those books that were rejected, I probably only really wrote the scripts. And then maybe ten sample pages, I didn't really draw the whole book because that would be.

[30:09] Marissa: Oh, that makes so much sense. I was definitely picturing you having drawn, like, 20 full graphical, like, oh, my gosh, that's possible.

[30:17] Remy: That is actually impossible. Yes. But the writing, I don't know, some books just come faster, and then I would say, on average, maybe six months, more or less. I don't know. Depends on. Yeah, yeah.

[30:32] Marissa: So is that so for writers and illustrators who are listening to this, who are aspiring, trying to get published, is that the process? You have a full script written, but then just sample illustrations? Is it typical that you don't create the full book before submitting it?

[30:54] Remy: Yes, because the drawing takes up so much time and you know that there's going to be revision to the story. So if you draw 200 pages of a graphic novel, that's going to be a lot of revision.

[31:07] Marissa: Yeah. No, that makes a lot of sense. And it's funny that, because I've had graphic novel artists on this podcast before, and I'm trying to think back now. A lot of them got their start doing webcomics, and so the publication that finally, eventually came out was just like the webcomic taken from the Internet and now put into book form. And I can't remember if I ever talked to someone about just the submission process, if you didn't already have, you know, a complete product. So. But that. That makes so much more sense now that you've explained that, yeah.

[31:47] Remy: But although I have to say that that's my process. I like to do a full script and then sample pages. But I do know of some graphic novelists who actually, they don't really write scripts. What they do is they write maybe like an outline, and then they work on the sample pages, I guess more sample pages for submission because they just don't do scripts and that works for them. So whatever works for all of us, I guess.

[32:15] Marissa: Sure. Now everybody has a different process that, of course, comes up a lot. No matter writing, illustrating, we all kind of find our own way.

[32:22] Remy: Yeah.

[32:23] Marissa: And then, so you mentioned how when you're trying to decide what your next project is, one of the main factors is like, well, what am I under contract for? What is my editor expecting from me? Do you have a list of ideas? Like, do you keep an idea folder that then you'll go to and pick through and be like, okay, what's going to make a great graphic novel? Or, what's going to make a great prose novel? Or do you, when it's time to figure out your next book, do you just sit and brainstorm until you find something that you're excited about? How does that work?

[32:58] Remy: I'm not really, I'm not very organized, so, so I just think about, oh, what, what story am I excited about right now? So, I mean, whenever I get ideas, I would always jot them down somewhere in my sketchbooks, but very disorganized. Just because I think that if something is really an idea is really interesting, it would keep coming back to me and haunting me. So I don't really care whether, whether I've actually, like, formally written it down. But when it's time to come and pitch ideas, I would just take whatever is most interesting to me at that moment, and then I might think about it for us for a minute to see whether I could actually develop them into, like, a full story. And I would usually send them to my age at first and see what he says, and then I would send it to our editor.

[33:49] Marissa: Have you had times where he'd like, okay, I have this idea, and in my head, it, it would be best as an illustrated prose novel, but I really want to work on it, and I owe a graphic novel next. So I guess I'll figure out how to make it a graphic novel. Does that happen?

[34:09] Remy: So far, it hasn't, I guess just because I knew that the funny thing about read at your own risk is that at that time, I was under contract for another graphic novel that's coming out next year, and I just finished work on it, I think. And then I was thinking, although I do have another contract for a graphic novel, I don't really have to work on it right now. And so I thought what would be fun and read at your own risks came out of that, I think. And because at that time, I didn't really have to think about whether it could sell or not. That's why I think I was able to create such a demented book. Because if I had been thinking about, like, the market and things, I think I would have been a little more careful with how I wrote it in a.

[35:01] Marissa: That's interesting. Now, to not have a contract in place can kind of take away some of those things holding us back sometimes creatively.

[35:12] Remy: Yeah, I think so. Because, I mean, as much as I love exploring, like, the creative things, I also need to pay my bills, so. Yeah, so.

[35:23] Marissa: Yeah, well, I think it's such a fun book. So creepy, so, so horrific at times, but. But as I've already said, I just know that if my kids give it a chance, they are going to absolutely love it. So I think it's going to be really popular. I don't know. I'm excited to see how it goes.

[35:44] Remy: I hope so, because I found. Well, I found out that there is in the book, the main character loses some teeth. And I found out that actually many people have dreams or nightmares about losing teeth, so.

[36:02] Marissa: Oh, interesting.

[36:04] Remy: Yeah.

[36:06] Marissa: Well, there you go. Okay. Are you ready for our bonus round?

[36:12] Remy: Yeah, sure.

[36:14] Marissa: What book makes you happy?

[36:16] Remy: What books make me happy? So I want to say it's a manga, actually, that I read when I was a kid. It's a series. It's called Doraemon. I don't know if you've heard about it. No, no. It's a kid's manga about a robot cat that has a magical pocket where he can take out a lot of really cool gadgets from the pocket.

[36:39] Marissa: Awesome. Do you feel like it was sort of inspirational to you and later becoming a graphic novel artist?

[36:47] Remy: That one is different from the graphic novels that I usually make because that is kind of like a series whereby there is no consist, there's no overarching character arc or anything like that. It's kind of like a tv series, I suppose. Yeah. Yeah. But it would be one of the things that I copied, I learned from when I was learning to draw. I would copy from those, the pictures in those books.

[37:15] Marissa: What are you working on next?

[37:17] Remy: I'm working on my graphic novel that's coming out in either 26 or 27 depending on how fast I work.

[37:27] Marissa: You've established that you're fast.

[37:31] Remy: It's called me and my pet demon, which is about a girl who accidentally summons up a demon. And just as she starts to care for the demon and become the demon's friend, the signs of Apocalypse start appearing all over town. And then she has to make a decision whether she has to return the demon to wherever it came from.

[37:57] Marissa: Oh, fun.

[37:58] Remy: Yeah. But I'm also actually working on I'm revising my adult book that's coming out next year, so that's that.

[38:05] Marissa: Awesome. So lots in the works.

[38:07] Remy: Yes.

[38:08] Marissa: Lastly, where can people find you?

[38:10] Remy: On my website, remielai.com, although I'm also on Instagram, but not that much anymore.

[38:21] Marissa: Awesome. Remy, thank you so much for joining me.

[38:23] Remy: Thank you so much.

[38:25] Marissa: Readers, definitely check out read at your own risk. It comes out next week but can be pre ordered today. Of course, we encourage you to support your local indie bookstore, but if you don't have a local indie, you can check out our affiliate store@bookshop.org, shop. Marissa Meyer next week I am super excited to be talking with Julian Winters about his new contemporary romance, Prince of the Palisades. Please don't forget to leave us a rating or review on your favorite podcast app. Check out our merchandise on etsy, Instagram and teepublic and be sure to follow us on Instagram. Happy writer podcast until next time, stay inspired, keep writing, and whatever life throws at you today. I hope that now you're feeling a little bit happier.