Ishan Shivanand: How Yoga Rewires the Mind & Heals Modern Mental Health

Ishan Shivanand is a revered Acharya in the Shiv Yog lineage, born and raised in an ashram under the guidance of Avadut Shivanand. He spent over two decades immersed in traditional yogic practices, focusing on enlightenment through the Shiv Yog parampara. Ishan is now an influential global speaker and mental health researcher, advocating for integrative wellness modalities like yoga and meditation. His work focuses on cognitive development, yoga's role in mental health, and resilience training, contributing significantly through published peer-reviewed studies and public speaking.

Visit Ishan here: https://ishanshivanand.com/

Key Takeaways:

• Ishan Shivanand's journey from an ashram upbringing to a leader in global wellness highlights the transformative power of traditional yoga practices, focusing on enlightenment and mental health.
• Yoga, as envisioned by ancient practitioners, is rooted deeply in cognitive and consciousness enhancement rather than mere physical exercise.
• Ishan's large-scale meditation research provides scientific evidence of yoga's positive impact on stress, anxiety, depression, and the overall quality of life, advocating for its integration into more Western health and educational systems.
• Resilience training, as introduced by Ishan, offers children and vulnerable populations tools for emotional regulation and stress management through meditation and breathwork.

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Chapters

• 0:00 Integrating Eastern Yogic Concepts to Address Western Mental Health
• 9:30 Integrative Yoga Modalities Revolutionizing Mental Health Care
• 21:38 Resilience Training's Impact on Stress and Mental Health
• 29:02 Mastering Stress Through Basic Awareness and Breath Techniques
• 33:10 The Transformative Power of Yoga Beyond Commercialization
• 42:21 The Eternal Struggle Between Good and Evil in Humanity
• 47:20 Uniting Spirituality, Education, and Leadership for Societal Transformation
• 58:27 The Power of One Person to Inspire Global Change

Transcript

Todd McLaughlin: 0:33

Welcome to Native Yoga Toddcast. So happy you are here. My goal with this channel is to bring inspirational speakers to the mic in the field of yoga, massage, body work and beyond. Follow us at @nativeyoga and check us out at nativeyogacenter.com. All right, let's begin. Hello and welcome to Native Yoga Toddcast. I am Todd McLaughlin here at Native yoga center in Juno Beach, Florida. Today, I'm honored to sit down with Dr Ishan Shivanand. He is a global thought leader in the wellness, spirituality and performance space. Through his flagship offering, yoga of immortals, he's bridging ancient wisdom and modern science, helping individuals, teams and organizations rise through stress, burnout and distraction. In this episode, we'll dive into his journey, explore how yogic principles translate into high performance life, and discuss how we in the yoga community can embody deeper meaning and offer greater service. So whether you're a seasoned yoga practitioner, a teacher in training, or simply someone looking for more clarity in your life, you are in the right place. Oh my gosh, I really enjoyed Ishan shivanan so much. And definitely please go follow him at his website, which is Ishan shivanan.com and you can follow him on Instagram. He's on YouTube. He's on all the different social channels. You'll see the link in the description below. Click follow, send a message and listen closely. And I think what Ishan is speaking of here is of the

Ishan Shivanand: 2:47

I'm feeling very well. How are you

Todd McLaughlin: 2:49

I'm doing really well. Thank you. I'm greatest importance of our time. All right, let's begin. I'm so excited to have this opportunity to dig into some of the deeper excited to have this opportunity to both meet and speak with aspects of yoga and yoga practice. Can you fill me in on Ishan Shivanand, Ishan, thank you so much for joining me a little bit of your history and how and why you are where you today. How are you feeling? are now.

Ishan Shivanand: 3:11

Yes, so my history is very traditional when it comes to yoga practice. I was born in an ashram under the guidance of avadh Shivanand. He is from the Shiv Yogi lineage, and under his tutelage, I didn't just practice yoga. I lived it, the yoga philosophies, the yoga way of living, the yoga way of dight relationships. And the whole objective of the Shiv parampara is

Unknown: 3:53

that we are born, we are given this chance so that there can be enlightenment. Shiva yoga means union with the infinite. And to make that union happen, to make that enlightenment happen, we have the practice of yoga. So for about 20 years, I was in that environment, and then after reaching a stage after being told that now I'm an Acharya, I'm ready to teach, is when I came out of the ashram and I started helping people around the world to be connected to their inner self through the pathway of yoga.

Todd McLaughlin: 4:40

Amazing, amazing. I'm guessing your parents also were part of the guiding light that led you toward being in an ashram your entire childhood.

Unknown: 4:55

My father was the main head of the ashram, so he. Is avadhyavan, so I was born under it was good, and it was tough as well, because when your father is the headmaster, you are expected to be a very good student.

Todd McLaughlin: 5:17

Yes, I would imagine, I would imagine, yeah, I'm sure he held you to a fairly strict standard. Can you give us a little insight into what it was like? I mean, I know an entire childhood is a long span of time to condense it into a single anecdote, but is there a story you can share of what it was like being a child in that in that setting,

Unknown: 5:46

if you ask me, it was beautiful, because now, when my own children are going to Western schools, I find children today are very alienated and isolated, and there is a cookie cutter approach towards education, whereas every child has to edit, alter and delete parts of his personality to suit the education system. Whereas in an ashram, there was camaraderie, there was a sense of belonging. The teachers were enlightened. They understood you. It was their sole life purpose to be your guide and to help you reach to a certain level. And it's very amazing. It's amazing. That's how I would like to say because, you know, today when I see children, and that's how I couldn't, I couldn't tell you, because if 20 years ago, you would ask me to explain how living in an ashram is, I had no frame of reference to tell you. But today, I know, because now I work in the Western education system as well, and I try to help children when it comes to their mental health, because I'm a mental health researcher, we need an army to help a child. We need psychologists. We need teachers, we need therapists, and still we have a mental health crisis. Still the children are suffering, whereas in the ashram, the guru is so powerful, so enlightened at a level because of his own practice of yoga, that he has this compassion and empathy to understand the child, and then he can direct the child based upon his strengths, based upon his attitude, to the best version of what that child can be. Because you need that motivation. You need that joy in the practice. If I just take yoga as discipline and I say, Okay, I have to do these many asans to get enlightened, the person will never be able to practice that yoga. Because it is not transactional. It is evolutionary. It is only when you start to derive joy from the practice of meditation and yoga. Can there be a state of enlightenment? And to reach that state of joy, you must be happy in life. You must be happy in the lessons that you derive. And when my guru looked at me, then he knew that I was different other than the children. So whereas other children had a certain poetic approach to life, I was a bit more physical in nature. So he looked at those qualities, and he made me work hard in those and that's what I'm hoping that eventually, if we can learn those lessons from the east and somehow bring this yog yogic concepts to Western education, then maybe we can even somehow overcome The mental health crisis plaguing the west. It would be really good for the children.

Todd McLaughlin: 9:24

Yes, yes. Well, said I when I was trying to formulate questions prior to our conversation, Ishaan, I thought maybe I'm just going to come in right away and ask him what his mission in life is. But I feel like you just said that you kind of gave me your mission right there. I appreciate that. That's an incredible mission. What do you see as the greatest challenge to us achieving the vision that you have laid out, if we condense it along? The lines of helping to solve mental health crisis and our educational experience growing up here in the West. What do you think is the biggest kind of hurdle right now, or biggest stumbling block or biggest obstacle?

Unknown: 10:21

I think, more than the obstacle it is, we don't have a head start when it comes to integrative modalities, and a lot of research has to go into it. A lot of understanding has to go into it. So if I talk about research right now when it comes to mental health, we are using standardized scales, which are subjective in nature, so that we find the baseline mental health of an individual. I think even these standardized scales need more research, because in my own personal practice and experience, I have seen that certain cultures perceive stress differently. Certain cultures have a different understanding of anxiety. And again, if we have that cookie cutter approach, it would be very tough, and there can be misdiagnostics. And then if there is a misdiagnostic, there can be a misprescription of a therapy which may not be required, and that is why in United States we have this unnecessary over prescription that is leading to further exasperate the mental health crisis. So until and unless we fund research, we motivate universities to look at integrative therapies as well integrative modality towards mental health care, where we can take the pharmaceutical interventions as a acute model of care that, let us say we have a Very serious case, then we can provide those acute care modalities as well. But when we are looking at long term care, that is when we have to look at wellness modalities like yoga, meditation, Ayurveda, where we can actually focus upon inner healing, and that can be the chronic care module. The problem occurs when we take the acute care modules and we start to promote them as a chronic care which is not the case, and that is when there is a severe impact on healthcare economics, because these are not sustainable models of care. And presently, the state of politics is such that all these important governmental, governmental branches do not have that correct funding to keep on pushing such expensive care modalities. And when we look at yoga as a system of care, it is easy, it is scalable, it is low cost to no cost, and it has long term health impacts. But then the trouble that comes is the bottleneck that comes is when we go to institutions, they say, show us the data. Show us where in a clinical setting, Yoga has helped X, Y, Z patients. So if I am talking about hospice care, where has yoga helped in a hospice setting, or if I am talking about Cancer Rehabilitation, chronic care, Cancer Survivorship programs, so they will say, show us the data, where has yoga helped such and such patients, then only we are going to invest in such a project and bring it into our systems, and that is where I think the yoga community really has to buck up and start working. And when I am talking about research, I mean rigorous scientific research with the highest standards. We can't just depend upon yoga journals to say that. Okay, look, this is what we did as a community. No, we should aim for the top scientific journals, New England Journal or other top journals, that that is where our research should go, and that is where we will be able to make these modalities mainstream, and I think that is what the need of the hour is.

Todd McLaughlin: 14:56

Thank you, Sean, that's a great answer. I love the fact that. That you're also bringing to the table, the idea that maybe the economic challenge is will be solved in the process of making therapies or modalities that actually work, that is fascinating to think about the perhaps the current therapeutic therapies and modalities don't work, and that's just a huge burden on the economic side. So that's fascinating to think and like you said, with yoga, yoga technology or yogic approach, it could be done little to no cost. What type of strides have you made? Can you talk a little bit about your research and the research that you've done in cognitive development, and the role that understanding cognitive science plays in yoga?

Unknown: 15:55

So if we look at yoga, the traditional approach to yoga, it is more to do with cognition. Sometimes we confuse yoga. When I talk to a general American going to gym whose only exposure to yoga is the cardio room and Planet Fitness, they will think yoga has to be a stretching activity where you just have to flex your muscles. They don't understand the mind body connection, and more than that, we are using the body to have a much deeper understanding of our own awareness and the objective of Hatha Yoga is to raise our consciousness. And the deeper we go into yoga, it is not then the physical aspect. It is the mental aspect that we are focusing upon. So yoga is much more an exercise of the mind than it is exercise of the body. And that is what is said. If we look deeper into the yoga text, if you look at Patanjali Yoga Sutras, there is no yoga exercise in it. It is all philosophy consciousness. If we look at hatha yoga, pradiptika, if we look at the work of Gorakhnath, even if we go back to abhinav Gupta when they are talking about yoga, the real practitioners, the philosophers that gave us yoga, it is more about taking a deep dive into consciousness, and that is what I wanted to bring to The table, because what I saw in the West was they have so wholeheartedly accepted the concepts of yoga that have been presented to them, and so diligently and with discipline practice them, that I felt, if we give them the next level, how beautiful it would be. So in 2020, in January, we were planning to do a research, proper scientific research, where we took multidisciplinary doctors and we partnered with various universities, and we wanted to see what could be the impact of these traditional yogic modalities. So not Asana based, but more meditation based on a human psyche. And at that time, unfortunately, the covid era started, which was a blessing in disguise, because suddenly everybody became aware of their mental health. And whereas we were planning for a few 100 participants, we ended up with 10,000 participants around the globe. This is one of the biggest studies on meditation that has ever been done in recent history. And what we found out, and this study was done over a period of years, of one year that we had a very high compliance rate, even though we were not given giving any monetary incentive. Many times when we do studies like this, then the participants, you give them some incentive to come back. We were giving no incentive because we had designed the study for few 100 participants, and we have 10,000 definitely we don't have the money to give everybody a $50 Starbuck gift card. So we said, you want to come, you come. And we had almost a 98% compliance rate, which is unheard of. People were getting hooked onto the modalities, and they were getting hooked on the feeling that comes after practicing the modalities and when the result came in. We studied four parameters. We studied stress, anxiety, so we use the GAD seven scales for anxiety. We studied insomnia, which is extremely important in today's world. A. Major population group suffers from insomnia, and insomnia is one of the biggest precursors to burn out, and even when we look at substance abuse, because a lot of people who are suffering from substance abuse, they say that, you know, when we have insomnia or when we cannot rest, we rely upon the substance as a form of self medication. So we studied insomnia, we studied depression, and we were studying the quality of life index, and we found in every single aspect that we were studying, there was almost a 70 to 80% change benefit, positive impact. And everybody was stunned that without a pharmaceutical intervention, how can we get rid of severe insomnia by 80% and all these are published in peer reviewed journals. You can just Google yoga of immortal studies, and you will find in the top psychiatric journals these studies have been published and and even the doctors that I was working with, they were surprised, because they are always looking because when we think of doctors, they are human beings like us, and a lot of them actually want their patient to succeed in their health journey. And sometimes even these doctors don't know where to point the patients. And they said that they are so very happy that now they can. They can tell their patient that okay. Rather than just saying, Get rid of your stress, they can show them the way that Okay. These are the modalities. This is the research. Explore these modalities, and if you do that, it can really help you, because when we are thinking of a disease, rarely do we think of the mental cost of the disease. If somebody is diagnosed with cancer, it's not just him that suffers, it's his mental health, his family's mental health, the whole ecosystem, it breaks down, and at that time, if there is no form of resilience training, then the cost of healthcare just keep rising up and up and up. And that is where we have seen that there is great synergy between what we are doing and all these healthcare providers.

Todd McLaughlin: 22:15

Nice, amazing. Can you speak a little bit about how the when you say resilience training, that made me think right away, in relation to the storyline that you said, if, if a man has cancer, and then we look at the way that this has this profound effect on the entire family, the entire ecosystem, and without resilience training. Can you talk a little bit about what you mean regarding resilience training? My first thought when you said that was teaching a way of being able to view suffering as an opportunity for growth, and therefore, if I am diagnosed with cancer and I don't have a solution that's offering a cure for the cancer, that I could still find joy in life, even with the disease, and have a certain mind frame to enable me to get from here to the time of my passing with some still, still feeling like I have something to offer the world, or I still have something to learn from the world, because when I've witnessed people that have terminal illness and the type of depression and or journey that that can put someone through, I love hearing that you brought up having resilience as a part of the training. Can you speak a little bit about what your resilience training looks like and or sounds like.

Unknown: 23:45

So this is what I saw in my own research. So I was working with these top tech institutes in India. They are known as the CEO factories of the world because these it's like we have MIT in the US. We have IIT in India. And IIT, if you look at they, have given us CEOs of Google and various top tech companies, such brilliant minds go there. And a lot of these times, the children that are studying there they are, they suffer from burnout. And it is not just this institute, when we work with different medical institutes as well that were training children to be doctors, some children behave differently when exposed to a high stress environment, and some react differently. Some can have a positive, in fact, positive reaction to adversity, and some breakdown. And that is where. I started to look at the training that was given to me in the ashram as a form of resilience training, because even if we look at sports, we do certain exercises for injury prevention, because we know that these muscle groups will go towards severe stress, so we have to strengthen these muscle groups so that there is no injury. Boxer will do 1000 crunches to strengthen his core, because he will be punched so hard on his stomach. And now we know that there are these institutes where children are prone to burn out. There are these situations where we know that there is a high stress environment, what are we doing to help that child? So that is where we started to develop modalities in which we focused on the breath, because the breath has a great impact on the autonomous nervous system. And in yoga, we put so much emphasis on the breath, and we started to teach children how to regulate their breath, how to regulate their mind, how to regulate their emotions. We use various ancient yogic meditation techniques in which we could teach children, because what stress does is it makes you doom. Prophesize anxiety. It makes you go from one thought to another thought to the past, to the present to the future and and we need these children to stay in the present and focus at the task at hand. And meditation can help you learn that. And we created these, this, this whole protocol, and now we are researching upon it as well. And why we called it resilient training was because many times we called it anti stress yoga or something like that. And a lot of these children who were training to be physicians. Nobody wanted to accept that they are stressed. It's like an ego thing. So when we said anti stress thing, maybe a cultural thing, I don't know, nobody came. And the moment we started calling it resilience training, everybody came. Oh yes, I think I can do with more resilience, I think I can be stronger. I can be better. So right now, we are imparting our resilience training modules in in engineering institutions and healthcare institutions. We are even helping veterans who have seen combat benefit from such modalities and and the best thing about resilience training is it can be non theological, because it focuses upon concepts. And that is, that is yoga. Yoga is it is non theological. It understands the anatomy and physiology of the body as well. It understands the working of consciousness in ways that it will take hundreds of years for mental health researcher to reach where yoga has reached 1000s of years ago. So it's very important that we take that expertise and we start to apply it in different sections of society, especially the vulnerable ones and and I've seen that a lot of people benefit greatly from resilience training.

Todd McLaughlin: 28:28

Yes, nice. Amazing Sean. Amazing. What type of in your own practice, if when you when you encounter stressful situation. What is the first thing that you notice? Is it something that Do you feel it in your body? Do you have an automatic kind of default mode that you've trained yourself to go toward very easily? Do do you feel like when you're teaching people that are just starting to learn to regulate their own nervous system, that there is, it sounds to me like you treat each person individually, you know, like I'm curious, is there? Is there? Like a cookie cutter or a one size fits all. Entry Level technique that you find seems to work really well for the majority.

Unknown: 29:31

So basics, yes, a person has to learn the basics. It's like even in the army, there is basic training, then the specialization happens. The same is with healthcare, there is always the basic training. We cannot expect a person to jump in the deep end without knowing how to swim. So the basic things that we teach every single person that can help them and the crazy thing. Is many times just with the basic a person finds himself where he needs to be. So imagine, imagine, that's the beauty of these modalities. So we teach awareness, breath, thought and emotion. So when it comes to thought, there has to be selective awareness. There has to be direction. So there are various processes that can be used to regulate the thought. There are various processes that can be taught to master the breath, extremely important, because in yoga, we break the breath to pura precha kumbhaka, inhalation, retention, exhalation. There should be mastery of all three, then awareness, awareness of the body, awareness of the emotions. So we teach different processes, so a person can not master but at least learn awareness, because many times when I'll be working with young children, they'll be having lots of anxiety and something as simple as, Are you safe? Can you can you feel where you are right now? Just ground yourself and where you are. Are you safe? Is your belly full? Are you hungry or content? Just simple questions grounds them and they become aware. Okay, yes, yes, I'm well fed. I'm safe. I'm not feeling hot and cold. I am dressed well. So just that awareness sort of changes their thought and the ability of the mind to latch on to some thought, and then we help bring them back into the present moment. So awareness is very important, and when it comes to emotional regulation, that is when the meditation starts to get deeper, and we have to do an exploration of various emotions through breath. Work practices is when a person starts to feel that they are much more in control of themselves, because people think anxiety will go away when I will start to control the outer world. And what we don't understand is that rarely we have control on on the outer world. We don't have any control on on how people react, on how the world is spinning. But what we have a control on is how we react to everything that is around us. And then when we teach people that emotional regulation through certain yogic breath works, is when they start to master that phenomena, and they can be in a state of happiness.

Todd McLaughlin: 32:56

Yes, nice do.

Unknown: 32:59

But then these are the basics. All this I am saying to you, it's very basic. And sometimes this is the most powerful thing that can be taught to a person. And I see this sometimes, when I'm traveling that somebody goes to the east, picks up one small aspect of this, and that sort of makes it so big as if that's the best thing since size bread, I'm thinking to myself, fine, whatever works for what. But then again, if it was as good as sliced bread, then we would not have a mental health crisis. So sometimes, you know, we should not cheapen these ancient approaches towards healthcare, because these are deep divine processes that need to be seen as what they are. And that's what sometimes, you know, I get a bit irritated with the yoga community that you know, 1000s and 1000s of years. And then somebody comes and they have not mastered their ego. And then they say that, okay, you know, if you do this tweak here little bit, then that yoga is the best. And I'm sure that enlightened saint is scratching their head that, you know, like, seriously, we spend lifetimes mastering and giving you this, this, and rather than understanding what We have given you, you are tweaking it on a physical aspect, exploring and is important, I think,

Todd McLaughlin: 34:35

yeah, great point. I I agree. Recently, I was thinking about how someone had told me his guru in India really didn't want a lot of attention. They wanted to document him, and he just felt like he wanted to not bring a lot of attention to him. Then another point being made that in the West, here in the Western this culture, this idea of trademarking and like, I have to, like, lay ownership and claim to it, to now stake my claim in the world. And what a very different cultural like, kind of precedent that's set in both of those do you feel that we have the potential here in the West to maybe soften up a little bit on our needing to like, lay claim, trademark, own and dominate and just start to live a little bit and appreciate the simplicity of of of I can breathe today. I have have a mind. I can think. I can communicate. Do do you see a little hope for us? Do you do? Obviously you do, because you're working hard at it, but I'm curious. Um, well, yeah,

Unknown: 36:06

a child sees me on a laptop, coding, creating beautiful software, and then the child takes away the laptop. Yes, he has that laptop, but he doesn't have that beautiful mind with which the softwares can be done. That is the power of the spiritual practice. People who have dedicated their generations, not even lifetime, generations, to mastering a spiritual practice. It says generation, because the father took the grandfather's work and worked more upon it, and then the son took the father's work. So it's generational. They will continue to have an insight, any wall innocent, if we just take something not really understanding it, then in our hands, it becomes dead, and then we can trademark it and do what with it. It won't change the world. And that's why you'll see in the West, because of that culture, we have fads. You know, bullet coffee will come. Somebody will go take something from some person in Himalayas, and then bring it back. This is it. I am Prometheus, and I stole fire. And it's a fad, and then it goes away. And somebody will come and say, doing yoga in a hot room is a fad, and it goes away, whereas in the east, when they hold on something, it gives you enlightenment. It gives you the aspect to create worlds. It changes the world. We are not making any Buddhas in the West, if we have so much of this, you know, what we claim that we have when we pick up, you know, things like turmeric or this or that from the east, and then, as I said, is dead. So that's why we have some benefit. But we are not making Buddhas, and that's where we have to change. We have to look at the practice as a whole. We have to respect that practice. We have to respect where the practice comes from, and we have to approach it with humility it is only then can that practice really benefit me. If you are thinking that this practice will only make me gold. What is gold? Gold is nothing. Gold today is yours. Tomorrow, it will be someone else's. Today, you have the ability to spend gold. What will you spend it on? You will enjoy it. After some time, the same thing will start to feel shackles. Gold is not valuable, compassion and legacy is valuable. Can you change the human consciousness to a direction where it's not gone before? Yes, right now the human consciousness is crazy about gold, crazy about Instagram, crazy about self promotion, so even the person who learns yoga wants to sit on the beach with six pack abs and show I'm the greatest yogi. But that is not what yoga is about. It's about changing the collective consciousness towards something better. That is what the great Siddhas were able to do. And until and unless the West can't realize this, then they will do what they do with yoga. They'll make a few billions. That's it. But you guys are already good at making billions. You don't need yoga to make. Billions. You can make billions with software. You can make billions with industry. With Yoga, you make something that is priceless, and that is how the world changes. That's what I try to do when I teach in the West. Also I want enlightenment, but I want a Buddha in a board room, because we have these old, senile people leading companies and economies and countries, and they are leading us to the ground. We need enlightened leaders, leaders who care more about consciousness, leaders who care more about humanity as a species, rather than lining their own pockets. And what? What do these senile leaders care about they will die in the next 10 years, giving us a burning world, and then they have shown us that this is the ideal, so that the next young generation will also strive to be like them, and we can change this toxic cycle that has been continuing since World War Two. We never healed from the world the wounds of World War Two, and yoga can give us that healing, and we have seen that on a microcosm. People change through yoga on a macrocosm. With our research, we have seen societies change through yoga, and maybe if we can expand people like you and me, we can show that countries can change through the practice of yoga, and that can only happen if we have enlightened leaders. And I hope I am able to do that because that is what my ancestors did. The great gurus were not sitting in the Himalayas under a banyan tree. You will see when you look at my ancestors, the greatest yogis would sit next to a king because they knew, if the king is an idiot, the Empire will burn. So the greatest yogis, they would crawl down from the Himalayas. They would sit with the king and make sure that, hey, you your consciousness. If nobody else's consciousness in the empire reaches to its it's fine, but your consciousness should be at a high level, and that's my hope from the West that stop looking at yoga as something with which you can make money, you know, look at yoga as a tool to enlightenment. And that would be so amazing.

Todd McLaughlin: 42:32

Yes, Isha, yes. Can I help you?

Unknown: 43:19

Oh, you are helping me, sir, this platform, and you are talking to me, and you are listening to me so kindly. What more can I expect that you have given me such respect?

Todd McLaughlin: 43:31

Well, I agree with you wholeheartedly, Sean, and I feel like when you when you want to see peace in the world, would you agree? I'm curious what sort of stories that you grew up with, but I feel like one of the stories I grew up with was this battle between good and evil and a constant push pull back and forth between good and evil. And then I was told good will always win. And I guess then I went through a phase in life where I started doubt, will good win? And how do I know good's going to win? And so I really just dreams that I dream, I currently dream, the world is going to win, the good is going to win. That that we could be living on a planet where we all support each other. And I feel like, then there's this element with, say, nature. They'll show you a nature show, and they'll say, Well, look, the lion is always going to eat the giraffe or the whatever animal the lion hunts. And there will always be, this is just the nature. This is just the nature of reality, competition, so to speak. And I guess I just still feel like, why couldn't it be collaboration? Do we need to change the entire structure of the natural world from me eating you and you eating somebody? I mean, I mean, I know that the eating thing maybe is a little weird for people to think about, but like, the the hunting thing, the dominance thing, the this power struggle, this crazy ego, this like, senility, that, like, what you're saying that we're seeing right in front of us every day, it's so, like, exhausting. Like, why? Why can't we just fall in with this, like, more peaceful way of being. I guess I just, I always grapple with this myself. I feel like it's my life journey too, and mission to just somehow, little, any little piece I can do to try to foster peace. But I agree 100% with you, Ishaan, I can't. Agree with you more. I'm really grateful for everything you're saying, and I so grateful to meet somebody who is, like, really dedicated to wanting to see this through. And I feel like you want to see it in your lifetime, which I really appreciate. Like, but I also appreciate that that you're coming from the understanding of the generational nature that's going on, like, because you kind of corrected yourself when you said, like, when one lifetime, but not just one lifetime. It's a generational appreciation for wisdom and compassion. So I guess I can see myself in that generational aspect where I'm just a small part of something that might continue on for a certain amount of time, that I can't really see the length of time, how long it's going to go, but I really, I guess I'm just curious. I want to see it too. And I wonder what's holding us back. Like, what are we up against here? Like, truly, truly up against. Then when I look at like, different saints, like, say, we pick somebody like Jesus who says, like, Okay, I died for you, and you don't understand why you're killing me. I can see you don't really see reality. And so I give my life as an offering, and I'm and then when I look at Shiva culture, or in Hinduism, or in the India culture, I see this more of a long term like Shiva, like when you reference it on your website, when I was reading before, in terms of consciousness, and this, like Shiva as consciousness, that that that seems like a much longer, broader, expansive, wider window. I guess I know I'm kind of rambling, and I don't think I got it to any one specific question, but based off of everything I just said, what did that make you think

Unknown: 47:40

if we go to Jesus and Shiva,

Todd McLaughlin: 47:44

yeah, maybe, maybe you could tell me, like, what? How do you see Jesus in Shiva? Yes, please.

Unknown: 47:52

Jesus went on the cross for humanity. You know, he took upon himself the burden of humanity. Shiva drank poison that was going to consume humanity. So in both ways, the supreme divinity is represented as someone filled with compassion, unlimited, who is ready to take our suffering so that we can find that light. Also when we look at Jesus and Shiva, Jesus welcomes everyone. There is no good and evil. There is just every single human being has the ability to be saved. Because if we start to say good and evil, good versus evil, who will be the judge? It's these senile old people, who will say, You are good because you vote for me, and then that guy is bad because they look different, or they sound different. And it's so cruel. What is happening in the world today, where every few years, some culture is made the villain, and then we have to chase those people with pitchforks. And there is no good and evil. Humanity is the only person that is not bound by nature. Lion has to do what a lion has to do. A human child can be taught to do anything. A human child wins a genetic lottery if he is born in a developed society where he can learn and grow to be a doctor. And imagine if that same human child is born in some village in Africa, and even though he has the highest IQ, but he will never have the means. We could have 20 Einsteins today in Rwanda, and we will never know, because nobody is giving them the ability to raise their potential. So there is no good anymore. There is failure of society to help the good awaken inside a human being. So when we look at great masters like Christ or Mahadev Shiva, and we look at how a. In theology, they are presented in theology, everyone is welcome in the house of Mahadev. Doesn't matter who you are. You have potential to be good, and the same is with the teachings of Christ. So there is no difference between a person walking the spiritual path. These differences are created by people of lower consciousness. These differences are created by the one who doesn't know Christ and the one who doesn't know Shiva. Because if you know Shiva, then God is God. God has always been God, and it's just as time, change geography, change language, change. Of course you will call them different names, but it is the same. Imagine you and I fighting that I call water pani, and you call water water, and I am saying I am right. You are right. And water is laughing that I am H, 2o, and the scientist is blowing us up with nuclear bombs. That is not pani. It's not water. Is h 2o so these are just lower consciousness people who have not come out of the animal brain. So they are just trying to find reasons to fight. But if we actually do research and more educated people look at theology as what theology is, there are more similarities, then there are differences. Because till the time you find differences, today, you are saying good and evil, but that is where the animal brain will lead us to. It is the animal brain that wants you to be the predator and the other to be the prey. It is the animal brain that is telling you I am good, that person is evil. And how are they evil? Just because they are different. And until and unless we switch from the animal brain to the human consciousness and from the human consciousness to the God consciousness, then this is going to happen, and that is where education plays a very important role, and that's why you will see everyone wants to attack the education system, whomsoever you know, if an evil tyrant comes into power, then he will want to change history. He will want to change the education system, because he wants to shape the whole world in His image, and the easiest way to shape the next generation in your images, you just that's what Hitler did with the Hitler Youth. You just kill the education system and the human child, whatever you give them, they will think that is the reality, and that is where us as yogis. Is we are standing as the barrier between the ultimate evil winning, because eventually, no matter what programming you give to the child, there would be some children who would fight against the program, the rebel, they would say that this is this is not to I don't feel, and their bubble will pop, and that is the time when they will seek, in a thirst, in a quest that what is more to life. Wow. And if at that time we are not there to show them the way

Todd McLaughlin: 54:03

beautiful Isha.

Unknown: 54:06

So that's what we have to do. And as we get more and more awakened people, forget good evil, awakened people and unawakened people. When we will have more awakened people, then maybe we can start working on little children and their journey doesn't need to be that hard and painful. Wow.

Todd McLaughlin: 54:34

Thank you. That was very enlightening. I appreciate that. Even when you just now said the child will seek and maybe that's what we're looking at right now, with children having such a hard time, they know they're getting forced through indoctrination, indoctrination, and it's painful, and they're suffering and they're lashing out, and then all we do is look at them and say, Oh, here's your disease and here's your cure, and we're not listening. Or, I mean, I want to listen, but, I mean, I guess, like, culturally, we're not listening. So I really understand why you are focused the way you are. I get it that makes perfect sense. And coming in with the research side, coming in with the strong sense of we need to have the type of science that people listen to do. You think, though, maybe we're gonna even have to go a little beyond that, because there's, there's still this thing of like, you can provide, like, bringing the horse to water, and that not, then won't they won't drink, you know, like, if we provided all the proof in the world, and maybe there's gonna, I just wonder if there's we

Unknown: 56:04

need, we need we need scholars. We need faith leaders, we need community leaders, and we need elected officials. It has to be a integrative effort if we have the scholars and we don't have community leaders, then we won't have the funding to do the research. If we have the community leaders and we don't have the faith leaders, then no matter what we do in science side, the crazy faith leaders will make faith crazier and crazier on what we are seeing around the world like there was a time when faith leaders had to be enlightened. Now, the crazier you sound, the more likes you get on social media, and the more famous you get. So the people who want to be more liked, they make themselves sound crazy and crazy, which makes you think, who's the guy designing these algorithms? Who's rewarding the crazy? Yeah, not rewarding the wise. And so you find societies are crazier because you are only heard like you and I are talking so nicely, you think the YouTube gods will promote us the way if we were yelling and swearing at each other, they won't. So we need those faith leaders also enlightened. And finally, we can then have the Enlightened elected official as well. Because tomorrow, if you want to do something on a much more broader scale, on a policy level, because we have to heal the society. We have to actually think on every single aspect. We have to promote certain values, promote science, promote good health, promote higher pursuits of consciousness. Then, of course, it has to be an elected official. We can't, we can't, we can't alienate ourselves as scholars. We can't alienate ourselves as faith leaders. We all good people. Have to come together, and it has to be like King Arthur's knights on a table, that everybody from their field is coming and and we are working together as a divine community, as a divine Congress, to make that change. And that is where I think that challenge would be, that what do we want? Do we want fame, or do we want change? Because sometimes for change, you have to work quietly, generationally to see things happen. And if you want fame, then that is the price you have to pay to sell your soul on the internet.

Todd McLaughlin: 59:05

Wow, Ishaan. Yes, I feel up for the challenge. I really do, but I'm so grateful to to meet you, and I'm appreciative of how focused you are on achieving your goal. And I feel like even me saying achieving your goal, this is bigger than a goal you or I have. Would you agree like this is a Do you sometimes feel like the goal of having humanity grow together and support each other toward higher levels of growth. Is a goal that's beyond just one person. It has to be right, like I feel like consciousness. I

Unknown: 59:56

believe in the power of one person. Yes, if they are more than one people, it will be nice, but one person Jang is Khan, one person what he did. The whole world is still influenced by his decision. One person Gandhi, one person Patanjali, one person Buddha. It's all one people. We have one people on good sides, and we have one people on the crazy sides, one people have so much strength. And I have, I have great belief, because I am an Acharya by by birth, this is my lineage. I'm stuck to it, and Acharya means I'm the guy who has to i. Inspire people. You know, I'm the guy who will never be the protagonist of a story, but he will be, you know, I will be the Gandalf of Lord of the Rings. I am not the Frodo. I will be the Marlin of King Arthur, but I will never be Arthur. So my job will always be to stand behind great people and give them the strength and guidance. And that is what I'm like. That is I have taken a wow, woe, a promise. You know what that word is? That is what I will do. And that's why, when I meet people. I always see the potential in them. I want to see the potential in them, and I try to inspire them. And my hope is, if I can inspire the right people, enough people, then it takes one grain of rice to tip the scale. So I believe in that.

Todd McLaughlin: 1:01:43

Yes, I do too. Ishaan. I believe in that. Wow. Well, I feel grateful. Thank you so much Ishaan for sharing your passion and determination to inspire and and lead through the inspiration. So I'm really, I really, I wish you ultimate success. I believe, if you're successful, this world is going to be a really sweet place to be born into.

Unknown: 1:02:20

We will try you. And I, let's, let's make this world a sweet place to be born into, and thankfully, in this life, hopefully we get enlightened so we are never born again. Well, whosoever else is born, let's make it a sweet deal for them.

Todd McLaughlin: 1:02:39

I agree. I agree. Oh man. Well, I really I'm so honored to have this opportunity, Sean, and thank you so much. I've been following you since I found you on social media and and I appreciate everything you're saying, because you do have good success on social media, but it's very heartwarming to hear that that is not like your intent. I don't get the feeling you're like, Okay, I'm doing this so that I can just grow my social media. Your social media is growing because your message is powerful and honest. And I think it's nice to see when those two cooperate together. So anyway, I know, obviously I'm so excited to share this podcast with you the listener. Thank you so much for joining, and I'm just so I just think, Wow, I feel hope, and I really want to do everything I can to help you and your mission and your journey. So if there is something that comes up in the future, please keep me in mind for helping to share any information that I can to help further your cause.

Unknown: 1:03:47

Thank you, sir. Well to all the listeners, if there can be a takeaway, if you are happy to listen and learn and you want to take a deep dive further the easiest can be, I wrote a book the practice of immortality, and in that, I have shared meditation modalities. And if you want to learn the meditation, cognitive aspects of yoga, you will find that after each chapter, I have that. So I really recommend, if that is something you would like, you can do that. And if you are of a scientific mindset, and if you would like to go through the research papers that we have published, even if you are a yoga practitioner or a yoga teacher, and you are always looking for science to back evidence, to back your practice, then I am very happy that I could do this for the yoga community and show that how yoga based modalities can bring such tangible change in mental health. So you can download my papers. They are free. They are they are public access, peer reviewed journal. Just Google yoga of immortals research papers, and you will have all of them, go through them, study them and utilize them. The next time you have to teach somewhere and people ask, what's the benefit? This research shows the benefits. And I think that is a start. And if you want to find me, then there is social media, yes, but it is run by people, so, but you can look at it and see what my events are going to be, and I would love to meet any of you ever if I get an opportunity. So thank

Todd McLaughlin: 1:05:37

you. Thank you. Ishaan. I really appreciate your generosity. Thank you so much.

Unknown: 1:05:42

Thank you, sir, pleasure and honor. Thank you.

Todd McLaughlin: 1:05:46

Thank you for listening to this conversation with Dr Ishaan Shivanand here on Native yoga Todd cast. I hope his wisdom inspired you as much as it inspired me. If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe, leave a rating or review and share with friends and colleagues who might benefit. It's important if you if you listen to what Dr Ishan spoke of, you can probably get a sense of how critical and important it is that we come together and help share the true lineage of yoga and reach out to those that have been cultivating it through the centuries, through the years and through the generations. So with that being said, I really am grateful for you to be here, and I look forward to connecting with you again in the future. Namaste. You. The native yoga Todd cast is produced by myself. The theme music is dreamed up by Bryce Allen. If you like this show, let me know if there's room for improvement. I want to hear that too. We are curious to know what you think and what you want more of what I can improve. And if you have ideas for future guests or topics, please send us your thoughts to info at Native yoga center. You can find us at Native yoga center.com and hey, if you did like this episode, share it with your friends. Rate it and review and join us next time you.