Karen Bathanti & Deanna Willmarth talk Oak Mac SHRM chapter.

Karen and Deanna talk about getting approval for the first new SHRM Chapter in 5 years!!!!!!!

Transcript

spk_0:   0:00
so welcome to another Wine on Wednesday. It's been a while, James. Since we've done one of these, it's all on me. We've been terribly lazy

spk_1:   0:07
Starting to feel lonely over here,

spk_0:   0:09
right? Social distancing. Well, what about what, 70 miles apart? That's enough distance. Probably you're not catch its toll gets taken Its toll. So again, Calum Maclean from Paylocity and James read from From Dinsmore. You guys know him very well. And today for for Wine On Wednesday we're doing an interview with two very lovely ladies. We've got Karen Bathanti and we've got Deanna Willmarth. And I'm just gonna let these two introduce themselves, tell a little bit about themselves before I repeat myself again and we're gonna talk. Talk about Oak, Mac. So, Deanna, please give us our, ah, little, little high level view of who you are and what you do please

spk_2:   0:49
Sure. Thanks, Calum. Hello, everybody. My name's Deanna Willmarth. I'm the owner of B w h r Consulting & hr Tech Solutions. So human resource consulting firm and I, basically HR technology consulting firm. So we've been in business now for about five years. We're going on our fifth year and the consulting side in two years and the HR tech side and we service all small to medium sized businesses as their HR department and then also projects for larger sized businesses. So that's me. I'll pass you over to Karen.

spk_3:   1:24
Hi, everyone. Thank you again for having up this is so exciting. I'm Karen bathanti the Vice chancellor for human resources at Oakland Community College. And I've been with the college going on two years. Prior to that, I was, uh, worked for Macomb County government, which was really kind of fun. Um, have been in hr professional going on, uh, almost 25 years. So started super young and really excited to talk about Oak Mac SHRM today with everyone big shout out to all of our hr, uh, Oak Mac HR associates that have join the association a lot in this way. So we want to thank them for following us and sticking by us as we went down this journey to form the 19th chapter of SHRM here in Michigan.

spk_1:   2:14
Well, super exciting to have you part of this video, and I'm really interested in learning a lot more. I'm shocked giving your responsibilities at work. And you also ran the annual educational conference for all of the colleges in Mackinaw Island last year, and you decided to create not only a specific city chapter you combined Oakland and Macomb County that I guess the most business centric county in the state. And you're the first brand new official SHRM chapter in the last five years in the entire country. So how did you decide to even take on these additional responsibilities?

spk_3:   3:02
I have no idea. Um, yeah, We were talking the other day, and Deanna and I were at lunch and I was looking for Resources in a way to kind of get involved with SHRM again. And I I was active young in my career and early in my career and really wanted to get involved again and needed something closer to home and closer to my work and how we thought out a name for Oakland and McComb. And we started actually with McComb, I think, Deanna, correct me if I'm wrong because of the time I'm working for McComb county government and then when I switched over to Oakland County and I'm like, that's combined that you know, two largest counties and active HR professionals kind of north northern end of those counties It really didn't have a lot of resource um, so I think that's kind of where we landed on. I think we had McComb Oakland. And then when I went to Oakland Community College, we switched it to OakMac. So, um, it was just a idea. And when you started down the path, just trying to do something and get HR professionals together and offer some lunch& learns before, um, the official news came out in January that that we were approved and in a really James, thanks to you and your leadership and really pushing this along for us, we were stuck for about a minute until you got

spk_1:   4:23
involved We're so excited to have you part of this new chapter. And I really love how you were so proactive and doing almost a year of educational content before you even became official. So it's too bad we weren't able to get all 19 chapters together to brainstorm given the pandemic right now. So, speaking of the pandemic, how are you coping with it right now? What are you doing? Uh, keep your sanity.

spk_0:   4:52
I lost my sanity

spk_2:   4:55
I don't know it we have sanity anymore, James. I don't know that it's no use, you know that. We are saying, uh, you know, I think, personally, we're trying to get out and walk and not be in the house and have a nice routine. So it's getting up and getting dressed and going to the office and whether that be upstairs or be downstairs or whatever that may be and taking a great break and getting outside, I think those things are really important and keep your routines. So definitely, for I think both of us has been really crazy. As we know HR is just, you know, there's such a need for it right now with ever changing daily, monthly weekly, you know, pieces. And so I think, um, I feel like we're working 24 7 and Calum and I were just talking earlier as like What happen, like what happened today, right? Did we get anything done? And, um, I feel more tired than ever, but I think it's important to keep routine, and that's what we're trying to do. So

spk_0:   5:54
yep. Have you seen ground Hog Day?

spk_2:   5:56
I have. It totally feels that way, doesn't it? Someone

spk_0:   5:59
play that someone set a little link today about ground Hog Day. Was Bill Murray waking up every morning to the Sonny and Cher song I Got You, Babe and just his reaction every morning. So when one day he finally just destroys his alarm clock? Yes, kind of. It's not quite like that, but it's getting to the point where it's like this has to be over soon. It's been 2, two and a half

spk_2:   6:18
weeks. What? Yeah, What day of the week is that right?

spk_0:   6:21
You know two more to go, I'm a donkey on the edge. We're getting close

spk_1:   6:25
you feel like, during is there any downtime to Get caught up on things that you were neglecting or find a new routine that you haven't done before.

spk_3:   6:36
I don't feel that way at all. I don't I I feel it's been all employees, all state and federal guidelines. All questions all the time. Whoa. It's all about the employees right now and, you know, giving them what they need and getting the organization what they need. I think this has taught me during this time is just the value of the relationships that you have with your vendors and the people that you rely on most because when I needed information on you know, what does this mean? I reach out to James. I need Deanna's help in streamlining getting messaging out to all of our employees. And she was able to use our technology that that we have and email blast, everyone the essential critical infrastructure worker letters I was able to reach out to our Benefit consultants say flip a switch so people could make changes to their F S. A. If I didn't have those relationships those really good relationships with outstanding partners. I don't know where I would be because I didn't have the time to get into the weeds and say, Hey, this is how I want it to look. Maybe you could do this. It was like Move Now. People need to make choices on their F S. A. People need to make choices on their health care, whatever it may be, so that I and I've always been a big relationship person. I think that's so important. But I can count on all the partners that we have, especially at the college. and say Let's get this done, So I think it's just another message to. HR professionals out there. I mean, rely on your partners to help you during this time because it's really overwhelming. It is. My organization is unionized, so we have to deal with all the labor contracts and, ah, staffing requirements have been. We have absent flows and and so and that. It's really what I've learned through this. Hopefully will be over soon, But that's one of the the key points that that I'll take away from this for sure.

spk_1:   8:35
What advice do you have to the listeners that aren't quite at your level yet and having relationships or even having, you know, on elevated level and voice at a company? Is this an opportunity where they can, you know, grow within a company or, you know, build those relationships?

spk_3:   8:54
Sure, I mean, reach out, use the people, know what you don't know and ask for help because they're experts out there who are willing to help you and who want to get involved. And they are there for you and those. And if you reach out to somebody in one of your vendors, your health care, your broker, whoever it may be and the're not responsive reach out to your network and ask. Hey, who are you working with? Understand the new laws on, uh, you know, they expanded f m l a or the emergency sick leave. Who are you working with? And then, you know, ask them for an introduction and start working with their partners. I think this is just a really good time, too. And clean up your your vendors and your partners and see who's really helping you.

spk_1:   9:38
Great. Great point. How did you elevate, though? To your level? Like was there any tricks other than just hard work over 25 years?

spk_3:   9:46
Yes. Hard work, yes there's no trick. I don't. I I had some great people in the beginning of my career who were wonderful mentors and who guided me in particular. And I I always took their advice to heart and their critical, their criticism, constructive criticism and and did something with that information. So I think it was a lot of hard work over the years,

spk_1:   10:10
and I said, You're not afraid to give back. I see you've mentored a lot of people. I see as. Well, yes, Deanna, How did you have the opportunity or the courage to create your own company.

spk_2:   10:26
Yeah, so, uh, that's a good question. I, uh I a long time in my career. I fell in hr. It was not something I had originally planned on doing anything for me throughout the years. I just saw a way where I could help people. There was a big void for me, for a lot of companies. A lot of people were just generalists within their company. There wasn't the money to hire all these different specialists, right? Um and so I just kept seeing the same things in HR A lot of in the box things that was, I'm really out of the box, trying to figure out different solutions and be creative. It was hard for me to do that sometimes within the constraints of the companies that I was at. So I also worked for Macomb County. Uh, and loved it and I learned so much throughout my time there with labor and things like that, and it took a minute to make the decision to pull the trigger. But it was something I was so passionate about doing because I so believed in the fact that there was a gap to fill within HR and to go out there and to service companies. And so I was very lucky at the beginning. Before I left Macomb County, I ended up getting my first client. And so that transition helped a little bit right to be able to have a safety net and, I have to say, in general it has been harder than I ever expected the first couple of years. Specifically, you know, you take 15 steps, forward and 14 steps backwards constantly. There are things that you don't know, right. Like I I wasn't a sales person. I was in a marketing person. That's just not stuff that I did. And so having to learn that iand really work through that curve had been very challenging. I think you know I can piggyback on what Karen says hard work is really important. Perseverance, is super important. You have to get up every single day and wipe away the Day before and continue on your path and keep your angle on mind. But I also think resourcefulness is like huge, right? Know What You don't know, reach out to whoever can help you. I think that was really helpful for me too, and just kind of keeping me standing upright through this journey. And I feel like we're finally over a hump. But we're I mean we're going into your five. So I tell people, if you know, you're somebody that, like, just wants to go to work and we even do your thing Fine. But if you want to work 24 7 really work hard to get this done, and you can persevere. I think it works for people. It's certainly not for everybody. Um, and it definitely took me some time to learn some hard lessons, but I'm happy I did it. I mean, I think the biggest thing is just getting up every day and keeping on with the mission. So

spk_0:   13:09
I got a question for you. Your an HR consultant. You see a lot of instances where HR departments are just kind of stuck. Yeah, but then sometimes you can't see the trees for the forest. It takes an outside person to come in and just go. Hey, why are you doing it this way? What are some of the things that you're seeing where you could make an immediate impact that have been successful

spk_2:   13:29
for you. You think a couple things. I'm big on efficiency and don't love redundancy. So I looked at lot of technology. So technology for me, is super important. I think that's the way that we need to move forward. We need to push HR departments forward, and so I tend to look there, like, how are they looking at using technology where they synched up there, right, so that we can make sure that we're leveraging the tools that they have today for the processes that they have. We're not doing things 16 times over, so you see a lot of gaps. I think in organizations, even organizations that have really big HRIS systems they're just not using them to their capacity. So can we use those to some great leverage. Those things, too, maybe minimize a lot of the workload then maybe we could focus Horan strategy. So how much can we automate right within the department? Um, with that HRIS system, or with that technology? And then I think subsequently be able to then roll into things like strategic development. Combining HR with with CEO's and company calls and bottom lines, which is so important. I think we're missing a lot because we're focusing on the redundancy of compliance, right? And the redundancy of process. And I think if we could leverage, those tools we're able to focus on the other, which is super important to. So I'm seeing, we see a lot of that we focus on

spk_1:   14:54
our favorite part of having an HR consultant around. Is that I'm sure you have stories to tell where a lot of HR you know, directors are afraid to tell them. Don;t want to reveal their own employer. Do you have any stories without revealing client names that you're willing to to share any land mines from those people to learn from? Seriously, James really this is called wine on Wednesday. So maybe we can have some of those stories in person someday,

spk_2:   15:26
right? I'm missing my wine. Um, go ahead.

spk_0:   15:32
No, I was just saying I was that I was an HR nightmare. My earlier days. Absolutely awful. I'm just I'm just happy there wasn't anything like a cell phone around when I was in my late teens, early twenties, I would be unemployable, but thankfully, it's all in the past. It's all in the past. So it's so I'm looking forward to some of these stories, Deanna, but I want to go back to some of the HR software real quick. Do you think? Do you think the systems are getting to the point Right now where there exceeding the capacity, and they're getting so hard to use it that people are kind of getting overwhelmed by the systems.

spk_2:   16:10
Yeah, I think so. I think it depends on the system, right? I think there are some that are easier to use and others. I think some are really complicated and make it more difficult. So it's almost a job within itself to be a system expert within a company so that you could train and help other people. I mean a lot of the things that we do for some larger HR systems they can't do internally because it's just too complicated for them  um, and it does a lot more than what they could do. So, yeah, I mean, I would say yes, that's probably pushing in that direction. To some extent, there's some companies that do a really good job, though of making sure it's somewhat simplistic and it's easier for the HR user. Um, but there are others that are a little. A little crazy. So I think it just depends too. You were using and how you're using it.

spk_0:   16:54
Good deal.

spk_3:   16:56
Extra cheese. Oh, sorry, James. Go ahead. Go ahead. Now, this is This is where this is why I love working with Deanna and her team in particular. So Something as simple as recruiting using an applicant tracking system. All I have to say to Deanna get rid of the paper. And instead of 165 steps, can me maybe get it down to 80 And can we automate it all? And can we be compliant and can it feed them to payroll and can it do all those things? And she says yes. The problem with that is, people who have been doing that the old way forever are freaking out because, you know, now you're showing me where I probably could have been more efficient or you're showing me my you know, my faults and my lack of technology, my lack of efficiency, and it's kind of a job security concerned for employees. But what it does, it allows us as HR professionals, more time with our employees if you can automate and use technology to become more efficient, I mean, why wouldn't you? And that way it gives you more trying to do you other things. So I think, like for us at the college, the work that Deanna, um, has provided us has just really streamlined it. And we have an old applicant tracking system. It's not, is't not great by any means, it's fine. I mean, it does what it needs to do, but, um Deanna is shaking their head not that great. It has a lot of bells and whistles, but for us, we don't hire a lot. I mean, maybe about 400 people a year or so, give or take it. It was fine. And so let's use it to its capacity. Let's get every capability out of it and make a couple phone calls to the organization. I think we upgraded one small feature for just a nominal fee, and the thing is working so really we went from paper and just paper everywhere. To really no paper within. It took us a minute, but we got there, so that's if you can. If you can stress as HR professionals to get rid of all that redundancy and that manual processing. You'll spend more time with your employees, and that's what people want. They don't. I don't care about all the other things that they want you to respond to an email or even pick up the phone and say, Hey, get your email and I'd rather just give you a call to talk about this.

spk_0:   19:22
So they want? They want human resources to be more human, right? So I think when we've had people on I mean and even talking to people on the HR superhero thing. All we're hearing about is get rid of paper. That's probably the biggest thing people are talking about right now. Just just find a way to streamline it so you can spend more time. So when something does happen, like the coronavirus, you've got the ability and the bandwidth to be able to handle the request that come through from 1000 employees that are kind of losing it. Like what do I do? How easy has it been assimilating the information that was sent out for the F f R CA and the Cares Act and the PPP? I mean, that's what James is here for, right? Yeah, You still

spk_2:   20:14
James tells us all the ins and outs.

spk_0:   20:17
You still have the best infographic I have seen to date. No, that was I said everybody loved him.

spk_2:   20:25
Yeah, it was great.

spk_1:   20:26
Keeping it simple, is what we need right now. Things were complex enough.

spk_0:   20:31
What's So what's next up? I mean, so for Karen, and Deanna what are you seeing next for? What's happening? We're obviously we're going to slowly try and get things started back up again. Hopefully in May. I mean, from your standpoint, where's the bottleneck for you guys to try and get everything to where it's supposed to be again?

spk_3:   20:51
Um, I I think what's gonna happen? I think this gives everybody a real nice opportunity to assess what they have in regards to staffing resources, manpower. And, you know, we're working remotely. I mean, honest to goodness, we went from an office full of people to everyone at home within a day. Um and so what I have found is you're relying on the individuals in your organization and they are stocking up and having you know, giving suggestions and doing what they can and always being available. You're using technology more, and I think a lot of organizations are going to outsource a ton of work. I think they're going to realize during this time you needed experts. You needed people who were really, um resources that were just experts and could get an answer quickly. And you too, James. In photograph with kind of the flow chart of all of these laws and these new provisions. It was great. That's exactly what I needed as as an employer. So I see myself moving into the second quarter of this year. I'm sorry. The third and fourth court. Excuse me. We're almost there of just really looking at a lot of projects outsourcing as much as I can and really getting down to the basics of those essential functions in my office that really need to get done and get done well so And embracing technology, we needed technology. Right now, we left our offices with our paper box full of God knows what was in there. Um, I haven't even taken mine out of the car, everything I packed up from my desk is still in my car. And that was what, Five weeks ago, I pulled out my labor contracts. It's the only thing on my kitchen counter. Our kitchen table right now. So if I didn't have technology and if I didn't have all those other things, um, I would have been in trouble.

spk_1:   22:47
You two definitely are visionaries. I saw a new SHRM prediction that half of the population will be gig workers, you know, in the next couple of years. Really? I do see relying on Human resources being in very high demand. Yes. Uh, So what I wanted to transition to was give a little pitch about oak Mac. Like what New energy Other than the two of you being the most fun to hang out with and network with, um what can a member get out of Oak Mac? Why should they join? What do they have to look forward to? And what else is there to say?

spk_2:   23:24
You want to take that. I'll start you piggyback so. I think a couple of things were super super excited. And yes, we are really fun to hang out with. We don't mind drinking wine? I would definitely, uh, be okay with putting those things at networking events right, but we're really, really excited. I think primarily because there's a presence now in Macomb, in Oakland County. I think Oakland County specifically in Northern McComb. Really. I mean, there was not a servant of an organization that was serving that population. So if you're somebody that's living in Oakland County or you're living in Northern McComb or even Troy, right? Like to drive down somewhere in Detroit. It's hard to do right to make events, maybe during the day, to go on your lunch hour. Whatever it may be, I think that could be very difficult. So that, specifically is really exciting to me. Um as an HR professional to be able to have those local events in that those pieces, Um, I think the other piece is, you know, we're super unique in thinking out of the box and so you can look for programming from us that's going to be unique in out of the box and forward thinking  And I think that that's a really exciting thing for us, and the other pieces that are really going to be exciting to you know let Karen to talk more about this is we really want to do a lot with mentorship, right? So we're both at points in our careers where we've been around the block and we want to be able to give back to people. So we've got a student chapter that we're hooked up with working through that piece we're working with the local colleges to really help young professionals. Really grow within the profession. I mean, I remember getting out of college and I Okay, what do I do next? Right. Like, what's the next step? How do I deal with this? And I think being able to provide a path for them is really important. And then also even mid level professionals, right? Like, how can we mentor them and provide resources or maybe a pair them up with somebody That's a more senior professional locally, that they can meet with and network with as well, outside of the normal things that that we would do.

spk_0:   25:28
So I love that mentorship program. Yeah, again, That's one of the biggest things we hear about people that have gone onto a CHRO and VP level that said early on in their careers, they found a mentor about 10 15 years ahead of them, and they just kind of said, this is what you should be doing right now? I think that's fantastic.

spk_2:   25:50
Yeah, it's important, I think. And I have. Somebody helped all of us, right? So why not do the same

spk_1:   25:56
people watching this That want to support Oak Mac? and they applied to maybe be part of your board or be a volunteer committee or helping in anyway? Are you already found all of your resources?

spk_3:   26:09
Sure, So um. We assembled the initial board. Last week we had our first meeting. We reached out again. During this past year, we kept our HR Association alive and just through LinkedIn and through networking. We have really almost 300 people respond to us. So all those individuals from the very beginning who are supporting Deanna and I have now kind of stepped up and said, Hey, we want to be part of your board And so we have our first initial meeting. We're working on social media, giving our LinkedIn Page getting our by laws, getting everything that we need done so that we're ready to go to go. But I think Deanna and I kind of talked maybe this week we'll post on LinkedIn that if you're interested, email us and we can get get things rolling. We haven't really complete completed the total structure. But we're very, very close. So it's exciting. And I think I think what you're going to find with this chapter and it like other chapters as well. Deena and I are at the peak of our careers, so we've been in all industries in all levels. We know HR from benefits, too. Labor to engagement to technology. So that's it. That's the messaging. That's the platform. That's what we're going to be telling all of these Oakland McComb HR professionals that you have two really high level experienced professionals really guiding those chapter and and we're gonna look for quality. We're gonna make sure that it's good, all the programming and it's relevant. And it's visionary and all the things that are important to us what we look for in those types of opportunities for professional development.

spk_0:   27:58
Wow, so that could

spk_1:   28:00
I concur? I think that what I've already saw last year you have great attendance, great speakers, great food, and you even have space. And you know, I applaud you because you already know how to run a conference. You run other conferences before So maybe even some of the other chapters can, you know, learn from the two of you on how to enhance their chapter with some fresh ideas.

spk_3:   28:26
We were very fortunate to Oakland Community College. I got to give him a shout out. They sponsored everything for us last year, so they provided the space, they provided the food, and and that was huge, right? We really didn't have any expenses. Um, all of our presenters yourself included James. Thank you. They came and presented them relevant topics for that. Our participants, I think, overall, we did okay for just the two of us for just Deanna and I trying to run this and get it moving. I mean, there were mornings where we were like, Wait, what's happening? Um, we had a couple of snafoos. I think we mixed up a lunch and a breakfast one time, but people still showed up, so it was fine. Uh, considering it was just the two of us. Um, we did okay. And again, I'm very grateful to the college. Our Chanceller P Provenzano was He's just super supportive of anything that we have going on and and was very excited when I shared with him that we finally got the green light, that we were the 19th chapter and it was finally approved. So, um, again, I don't I don't know how we would have done it without their support to

spk_1:   29:39
And for those vendors that are watching, what opportunities are there for vendors to become more involved in supporting for Oak Mac.

spk_2:   29:49
So we're in the process of developing what we call a partnership program or sponsors sponsor program. So we'll have levels right? Just like you see with some of the other chapters. But I think what we're going to o on and talking to some of the other chapters and really having some conversation in our first year is limiting the higher level sponsors to really get some exposure to some of our partners So we've reached out to a lot of ah lot of different companies. We have some people in mind, but we definitely have some opportunity for some companies that would be willing to come in and help us out partner and then in turn, right will receive benefits like a membership with ours. Some advertising type things as we go through our programming. Maybe its logos and programs right? Banners on websites were working through what that looks like right now as far as. What levels will look like we have some things in mind with our sponsor chair. Is far as kind of doing that? I think there's a ton of opportunity now to hit, I think, a membership that really wasn't out there before, right? So we've got a lot of people. We have individuals that maybe are interested from other chapters to, But I would say the vast majority are individuals that are brand new, haven't been in a local chapter either within years, right or they, um, haven't been in a local chapter at all. So I think the opportunity for these local businesses or our sponsors to really hit. Ah, a demographic that they haven't seen before. Maybe out there And they're gonna connect with HR professionals and decision makers in HR. They're gonna connect with maybe business owners of decision makers there. I think there's a great opportunity department, another ground up, and we're looking for partners to help us do that and then help reward them for, you know, helping to do that moving forward. So we're really excited about that

spk_0:   31:41
Wow, you're in the final stretch? Yeah, all the hard work. So from from day one to now how many years has it been? You two been fighting to get this thing up and running? A

spk_2:   31:51
year and 1/2 maybe year and a half. Bout year and a half we'd some bumps around there along the way, right, Some tragedy and some other things at the national level with changing of our people, we had somebody, unfortunately, passed away. And so I mean, that slowed the process for sure, right? Just, you know, not controlled. But I think that I think because that SHRM hasn't done this in a while too its them kind of figuring out to like, What do we do? How do we help them? And they've done a really great job. James and his crew have been super supportive. We've been really lucky to do that, but it was just navigating kind of the politics, logistics of how to do all of that. And I think, um, you know, each hurdle we got past and I think it worked out. So

spk_1:   32:37
Again the reason for the only new national chapter in five years was SHRM was hesitant to have new chapters because so many don't succeed. I think they're confident the two of you are creating the program that will succeed. And it's very exciting to, you know, set the bar. This high.

spk_0:   32:56
No pressure, ladies.

spk_2:   32:58
Thanks. I just

spk_0:   33:01
No. I don't

spk_3:   33:03
No pressure Deanna, No pressure

spk_0:   33:05
Yeah. I'm not betting against either of you yet. No, not at all. So is there Is there anything else while we're wrapping this up? And we're just about 40 minutes. Is there anything else you'd like to say to any HR professionals? They're right now that are just struggling a little bit. Or if if anyone's got some ideas and suggestions for you guys were Where do you want to direct them?

spk_3:   33:28
huh? I think I really reach out to your partners. To your resource s to other HR professionals. I this morning alone from someone I had never met, sent to me from a community college in not a community college. I'm sorry. Private college sent me a message on LinKedIn asking me about something. What we were doing in regards to the CARES act, Someone I'd never met so use those. Resource is those networks we're all in it together. Everyone's trying to figure this out, so really, reach out to your partners. You know, you're good lawyers, James, thanks to, um, your consultants, Deanna. Thank you. But really, that's what it's about because it's just you know what you don't know and ask for help. That's and don't be embarrassed and reach out to people you don't know if you find someone on LinkedIn or through networking that works in a similar industry and and maybe has a similar geographic or demographic profile that kind of aligns with your organization. Reach out to their HR folks that I know. I'm happy to help I I know Deanna feels the same way. We've always been that way, but I that would be my friendly advice.

spk_2:   34:41
Do the same. And I'm saying, You know, reach out to us. We can certainly help. I'll give you that the email address for Oak Mad because that's helpful to you. So we're pushing out. Resources all the time, so if we have companies or HR professionals, shoot over something over to us as we're pushing it out to our distribution list. We've done some poll questions for different companies right so they can understand what's going on. So we're info@Oak Mac/hr.org  so we can post that to you right from our Web sites are in Arlington. But just I think if individuals are interested in the chapter, specifically definitely reach out. But also information. If we can help, we have it will give it to you were really trying to do that for our network and provide those resource is

spk_0:   35:27
fastastic and I'll tag both of you and I'll have the info the email up their when we post this on LinkedIn.  So people can send questions the right to tell you. But thanks for coming on. It's so so nice to have tenured professionals here that Karen's pff been there done that. Karen's on mute right now. karen you're on mute. Very sorry. Not zoom professional, obviously. No, it's so  this. People are just It's so nice able to pick up the phone and go, OK, this has happened to me. What do I do? And you guys have pretty much got it covered. That's awesome. Thanks very much for all the hard work, James. Anything else? You want to say there to wrap it up today.

spk_1:   36:07
I'm just gonna vouch for the character of Karen 7 Deanna of being great leaders and someone you can br really comfortable with having a conversation socially. So appreciate all of your hard work and being volunteers and look forward to actually having a glass of wine when we're allowed to get together.

spk_0:   36:26
Yeah, right. Yeah, it will be. We'll be watching you two and all the first meetings coming up, and I'm really looking forward to the content, seeing what you guys were going to be launching. This is this is kind of cool. All right. Thanks again. Everybody like great week. They bye.