From Reacting to Regulating: Leadership That Holds Under Pressure

Pressure doesn’t just test leaders—it reveals the habits you’ve been running on for years.

When deadlines tighten and emotions spike, do you get sharper and more connected… or do you slip into control, avoidance, or resistance?

In this episode, Cindy Wentland sits down with Eric Thompson, founder of Lift Leadership, to unpack what really happens to leaders and teams under pressure—and how to stay grounded, clear, and effective when it matters most.

Eric draws on his background in baseball and coaching to challenge the idea that high performance is about hype. Instead, it’s about regulation. We explore why “executive presence” often falls apart under stress, how blind spots grow when we play small, and why workplace conflict is often a signal of missing self-awareness and missing voice.

You’ll also get practical language to build psychological safety—so your team feels seen, heard, and valued, especially those who don’t naturally self-advocate.

Plus, we break down Eric’s Lift framework:
✔️ Self-awareness
✔️ Self-compassion
✔️ Gratitude
✔️ Self-care
✔️ Connect with your power base

If you want real tools for emotional intelligence, leadership development, and leading under pressure—this episode is for you.

🎧 Listen now, subscribe, and share with a leader who needs this.

🔗 Connect with Eric Thompson: https://www.liftleadership.com
🔗 Learn more about Intentional Leaders: https://www.intentionalleaders.com

#Leadership #EmotionalIntelligence #ExecutivePresence #LeadershipDevelopment #PsychologicalSafety #HighPerformance #Mindset #SelfAwareness #WorkplaceCulture #BurnoutPrevention #TeamLeadership #PersonalGrowth #IntentionalLeaders

Ambitious leaders know that real leadership goes far beyond titles—it’s about developing the clarity and mindset to guide others with confidence. In this podcast, you’ll explore what today’s leaders truly need, from navigating everyday problem solving to handling tough moments of workplace conflict with steadiness and respect. Episodes dive into setting healthy workplace boundaries, strengthening workplace collaboration, and building the emotional intelligence and emotional agility that make leadership sustainable. Whether you’re managing a growing team or refining your voice as a decision-maker, you’ll find insights that help you cultivate a resilient growth mindset and elevate your impact.

Transcript

Welcome And What You’ll Learn

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Welcome to the Intentional Leaders Podcast, the show for leaders who are ready to move beyond managing and start leading with emotional intelligence, confidence, and purpose. I'm your host, Cindy Wentland, and today I'm super excited to welcome Eric Thompson to our podcast episode. He is the founder of Lift Leadership, and he believes that pressure doesn't break teams, it actually reveals them. Ooh, so very interesting. Couple things you will take away from this podcast episode is that there are some practical tools to lead when you're under pressure. And he's going to give you a little bit of insight when your team is operating from a place of fear or stress and how to shift back into a strong performance mode. He's also going to talk about simple strategies for leadership growth, including a little bit of insight about his lift model. And his lift model is super awesome. It's about self-awareness, gratitude, self-compassion, things that keep us grounded in the face of burnout or when we're really being challenged to show up as our best self. I know you're going to love this interview. Let's go. All right. Well, today I'm super excited to welcome Eric Thompson to Intentional Leaders Podcast. Welcome, Eric.

SPEAKER_01 1:17

Thanks, Cindy. I just wanted to first honor you for creating this space. I uh um knowing the work that you do and the intention in which you do it is meaningful. And I'm just thankful to be able to show up and learn something, hopefully add a little bit of value along the way.

Baseball Lessons On Pressure

SPEAKER_00 1:31

You absolutely will. And I've already learned from you. So I'm looking forward to learning more. And um what we're gonna talk about today, I think the timing of it is super cool because, of course, we just got through with the Olympics and got to see all these amazing, amazing athletes perform. And, you know, they always talk about the thrill of victory and the agony of defeat and um and all of that. And the reason I mention it is because I think about athletics and even leaders being uh athletes in a way, to prepare to do their job, you know, make sure they're focused and um healthy. So you began your career in baseball and coaching before you moved into corporate leadership. So I I would love you to share a little bit about what that journey taught you about um performance under pressure and even emotional regulation. What are some things, lessons learned?

SPEAKER_01 2:25

Yeah, I, you know, I'm so thankful. I I think baseball chose me more than I chose baseball. And and understanding when I was a kid, I remember my first practice because I for years we lived in rural Arizona, like middle of nowhere, and I tried to play on a team and there wasn't enough players. So I was never able to play until we moved into Tucson, which is more of an established community and then had you know a larger population. I was able to uh uh be on my first baseball team in fourth grade. And I just remember there was a period in my life where my parents went through a divorce, there was just a lot of change, right, going on. And so you're you're trying to find out who you are, what life is like without two parents at home, all those things. And I remember my first practice uh being on the field and having a moment where my system, my mind, body, everything it was like you know, if you believe in God, God whispered to me. If you believe in universal energy, there was just this space in this moment that said, You're gonna be okay. This is where you belong. And so, and I can't explain it. I don't know that I've had those feelings or emotions many other times in my life, but I just remember it being very profound and something that captured my attention. I was emotionally attached to the game. Yeah, it gave me a voice, it gave me a way to express myself. I was not a great student, I just couldn't focus and I didn't love I was a I was a I love humans and I love relationships. Yeah, but getting down and and being asked to do something that I'm not emotionally connected to is challenging, like for me, but for others. So I think that sent me on a way of just approaching the game of really having a sense of identity to the game and feeling safe in the game and and all the challenges outside of that world growing up in southern Arizona during really high gang activity period of time and and being so close to uh um right in the path of drugs running through the United States, right? And so wow, um strong ties to Los Angeles street gangs, Tucson had, and I went to a school that was uh uh very diverse, had underserved student populations, had um, you know, a lot of families going through difficult times, right? All those things. And and I just learned in that space, I could, I just started to learn how to pay attention and read the room, right? Like I had this expression of this game that I could show up and be authentic, but I also had who's out there to hurt me, who's gonna take advantage of me, who do I feel safe with. So at a very young age, because of divorce and because my both parents went to go had to figure out their life, right? And in the era of latchkey kids, I was a latch key kid.

SPEAKER_02 5:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:10

And so you just had to pick things up pretty quickly. And so I've always been very in um paid a lot of attention to understanding data and dynamics, trying to read situations and circumstances. And if you think about baseball and athletics, it's a little bit of both, right? It's okay, there's a team dynamic that influences the performance of the team. And then there's individual responsibility and data pieces that you need to understand what's going on. And when you figure out how all those things work together, you can show up and add value to your team or your community, right? So on and so forth. And then there's like this this cycle that people go through of all these of energies, right? The human experience are four energies. It's mental, physical, emotional, and spiritual or aspirational. And when you can align those things and show up authentically, really good things happen. So I figured that all that stuff out through the game of baseball. And then when I was done playing, I coached and I leveraged some of those same things and realized, okay, I think I can influence the collective group. I'm learning how to, you know, influence those around me and and help them level up. And then when I went into the corporate space, I just did everything I learned as an athlete and it translated really well. And I had a lot of success and momentum. So, so yeah, I always tell people everything I do now is tied back to what I learned as an athlete.

SPEAKER_00 6:28

Yeah. Yeah. What a cool story, though, when you think about at a young age going through that much pain and chaos and confusion and uncertainty. And I think, you know, there's a lot of different paths that kids could take at that point, as you said, especially when you're surrounded by a lot of um, you know, things where it could take you away from positivity and the energy and and connection. And for you to be able to see like what those choices were and make those choices, what a great, you know, life lesson at a very early age. And I think it's really, it's really, I think fascinating that you experienced it that way and that you realized like, hey, um paid attention to it and how that felt at the time.

SPEAKER_01 7:14

No, I appreciate that. And I I oftentimes like I think one of my strengths in the in the world that I live, right, as uh whether you refer to me as an executive coach, an entrepreneur, a business leader, a community leader, a family leader, whatever, in those spaces, you know, I think the way that I'm able to show up and authentically connect with others is because I've had to work through my own stuff, right? I I don't come from a place of judgment, like because I know I've seen you know, struggle. I understand struggle. And but that's my strength is always on the other side of that struggle. And so when people, I think, connect with me and kind of the the my perspective of the world, I think they there's there's a humanity in that to be like, okay, I trust this person. He's been through some things and he's not judging me, he's really actually trying to show up and and support me. And I think that's something that's always worked really well. I think now, you know, getting ready to dance with 50, being 50, I can I can sit there and say, like, um I really I really like who I am and I really I can find you know I can find peace in that. And so yes, I wouldn't be able to have the impact that I'm you know fortunate enough to have if it weren't without those struggles. And and obviously I think you know that you don't go and have the impact, you know, in your world as a executive coach, as a small business owner, as you know, creating this space for to amplify intentional leaders, you don't bet on yourself or choose you without seeing some things and powering through some things, right? So and I think that's why people resonate with you as well, and that's why you are able to, you know, engage people in these conversations that add value to your community. So yeah, it's all tied together.

SPEAKER_00 9:10

Yeah, it absolutely is. And you're you're right, I I definitely uh share a lot of the um the mistakes and the missteps um because you know that's part of being human, and I think is getting through those difficult times and and how we come out the other side, as you said, and what we learn from them. I think that does create a lot of strength and a lot of a foundation of that um, I guess confidence and as you said, non-judgment in working with others, right? It's all okay and it's all gonna be okay, right? And um I love the you're dancing with the 50s.

SPEAKER_01 9:44

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Right.

SPEAKER_00 9:46

I love that. It's a great thought.

SPEAKER_01 9:49

I do think on that though, I think to re uh to go back to the athletic, I I'm I'm fortunate I played baseball though, because baseball's a failure sport. Yes, you you can be in the hall of fame failing seven out of ten times, right? And so I think that gave me permission real quick that and and again you can do everything right in that game and still be out, right? Like you, so there's just those things that I I I'm less I don't get too high, I don't get too low, and I think that that kind of perspective or disposition has really helped me a lot.

Why Pressure Breaks Communication

SPEAKER_00 10:25

Yeah, for sure. Well, and let's talk a little bit about that because what that means is when you're able to stay in that zone, kind of that emotionally regulating yourself. It isn't too high, it isn't too low. And boy, if you could, if you could sell a pill for doing that. Not that we want to over medicate, but you know, a lot of people struggle with that. And when you think about, you know, emotional energy and regulation, um, why do you think that's so critical as as you work with leaders in in the business space or entrepreneurs? Why do you think that is so important for leaders, uh, especially as they're dealing with stress or burnout or change?

SPEAKER_01 11:04

Yeah, there's a lot there. And um I'll apologize up front for the passion in which of it I'll share this information.

SPEAKER_00 11:11

But oh please, passion. Never apologize for passion.

SPEAKER_01 11:14

Yeah. Um, so I think you know, a lot of times in team environments, and so when executives reach out to me or to you and they say, Hey, we have this problem, or can you help? It's usually tied to interpersonal relationships in some way, shape, or form. And then it's tied to I wish that person was a little more polished or they had executive presence, right? They're gonna, there's very specific things in their mind they're trying to communicate to us.

SPEAKER_02 11:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:40

And when I hear that, what I understand is there's there's something happening when the pressure's high that is creating misunderstanding and frustration and pain within the organization, right? Executive presence is always like, man, they're great until like I love them here, but as soon as this hits, they they fold. We in in the world of baseball, we talk about um batting practice all Americans. Like when you're taking batting practice and and the hitters just spraying the ball all over the field, they're crushing it, they look amazing. You throw them in the game, and they couldn't hit water if they fell outside a boat, right? They just are they just they they the pressure just shrinks them. And and I've and I for years in my background, not only as an executive coach, but the work I did in schools, you know, I would show up, I I found out I was just I was not, I was really comfortable with going in really messy conversations. I was like, I, you know, for instance, in social and emotional learning, we built a uh um a curriculum called civil schools. It was implemented in you know uh hundreds of schools across the country in multiple countries, and it was really it was teaching cultural responsive teaching practices to educators, it was teaching um keeping kids safe in the digital space to parents, and it was teaching students student upstander intervention training, right? So this is an umbrella with with the what we were trying to create is a culture of civility and respect, like bullying prevention, like psychologically and emotionally safe environments, not only on campus, but in the digital social space. And and in that work, that was a proactive preventative initiative. Our phone would call after school shootings, hate crimes, rapes, suicides, the really terrible things that would happen in humanity that usually are tied to some aspect of a person's identity, right?

SPEAKER_02 13:37

Yes, yes.

SPEAKER_01 13:38

And so when I found myself like, and I'm not professionally trained, I'm not clinical in any of that sense, like to be a crisis therapist or to be a therapist or a counselor, but I worked really closely with them and I figured out how to organize and align initiatives to help people reclaim some sense of safe safety and activate healing. But what I learned through that, Cindy, was when people are calling and asking for um, you know, support or guidance through that, they first of all just need to know that what they're experiencing is is part of the lived experience, right? That they're not broken, they're not, this is just this is life in some way, shape, or form. There's some sort of shared humanity and connection that what you what's bad for you is bad for me, and we're in this together, and let's let's move through this uncomfortable time and space to get to the other side because we know there's a more uh there's there's more peace and more safety and comfort on the other side of this moment. But let's let's learn through this movement. The only way through it is movement, right? Let's let's move through this moment and and get through it together. So I think we're where leaders and um you know folks think about how how does pressure show up? How does there's all these misconnections and misunderstandings because what most leaders lack is self-awareness. That's one of the they they just they lack self-awareness and they lack other awareness. What happens is pressure tends to take, okay, I got a broad perspective and I'm open to possibility and I'm trying to learn and a growth mindset. And pressure usually shrinks people down to play small. And when they're playing small, they miss, they have more blind spots all over around them. And then what happens is if I'm a leader and I have blind spots, then my somebody on my team may feel neglected, right? Another person on my team may be solving the wrong problem. Another person on my team may be completely disengaged and just kind of you know quiet quitting. And I'm not seeing that or recognizing that, and I'm trying to advance my initiative because this is so important to me. So we start moving, we start accelerating pace, which speeds up the game for everybody. And now there's more things missed, performance gets sloppy, and frustration and and um, you know, despair kind of grow, whether it's in a team environment or a corporate environment. So where I found kind of like with my eclectic background in athletics, my eclectic background in activating healing in in these, you know, uh educational spaces and my time as an executive leader, I would go into okay, I'm gonna solve it from top down. It's let me give me the best executives, I'm gonna figure it out. But I would go work with them, and as soon as I'm gone, change wouldn't really like they would go back to who they are, and you're like, well, that's not changing the environment.

SPEAKER_02 16:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 16:27

And then I would go down and like try and advocate for frontline folks, and then it was like, okay, well, you know, no, I need to hold them accountable, right? And this is this is good for them. Where I found the big gap was voice. Is are people are you creating this say the space where people can feel seen, heard, and valued? But what does that actually mean? That means I can show up authentically, I can advocate and communicate um my thoughts, my beliefs, my perspectives without judgment. And but that's an inside-out game. Like there's some people that and you've worked with that have no problem communicating their thoughts and advocating for themselves. That's just that's who they are. And it's not those people you're too worried about, it's the people who haven't learned how to advocate for themselves or how to speak up because they're these really incredible humans. And a lot of times they're women, right? There's these incredible leaders that are shouldering and burdening so much and working so hard, but are not getting the visibility and the credibility they deserve. And and and people can't always name it, but they feel it. So they feel this kind of this invisible force that's deteriorating trust and and you know, uh transparency and celebration, all the things we're in business for. And then there's like this invisible force that everybody doesn't navigate, but they don't even understand what it is. So the reason I zeroed in on pressure, and I learned this through my time working with high-performing athletes, is like there's a lot of people in the right moment are gonna say the right thing because you know, the mic's on or whatever. But when pressure hits, you learn about somebody very quickly. Like when I play a game with somebody, like as an athlete, I knew the teammates I could trust, and I knew the teammates that were doing the work and and could meet a moment of pressure, and I knew the ones that couldn't. And so I know now, 30 years, 20 years later from playing the game, my teammates our lives may have gone this way, but once we get back together, there's core beliefs we understand and know about each other that even people in my life don't know, people in their life don't know because they didn't compete next to each other.

SPEAKER_02 18:38

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:39

So creating the environment, understanding how pressure shows up in business, and then teaching people that's a central nervous system, like teaching you can learn these skills how to access your wisdom and your talents and your creative thinking and problem-solving skills when pressure is high. We haven't done a good enough job doing that. And then I can tie dysfunction, I can tie high performance, I can tie everything back to that moment. And so that's where I really, you know, built an organization that focuses on organizational pattern under pressure.

SPEAKER_00 19:08

Yeah, yeah. And and because you've experienced that in so many aspects of your life in sports, right? And then you think about in academics and the school situation and in businesses, and you've seen the pattern repeated regardless of the set setting that you're in and what that pressure point does to people. And as you said, it is biology, but because we lack self-awareness, we don't know that that's our central nervous system freaking out about it. You know, I think people don't know what to call that. They don't know how to label it, they don't know how to frame it, and so what do they do with it? Right. And um, and I think that's a really it's a really fascinating way to help support people's journey.

SPEAKER_02 19:54

Yeah, I appreciate that.

The Lift Framework Explained

SPEAKER_00 19:55

Yeah, for all that you've learned. Thank you. Um so you've created the Lyft program and Lyft framework, and this was um something that was really fun for me to explore a little bit about the work you've done. But your lift program, um, if you could describe what it is, but I know you have some pillars um that represent what Lyft means and the things that you want to help people share. So tell us a little bit about how you created that and what do you, you know, what what is the framework and and why is that so important?

SPEAKER_01 20:31

Yeah, so there are five pillars. So really what lift is is preparing, it's it's helping people be in relationship with self, right? And who they are, understanding why they do what they do, what do they really value, how can they be intentional in the way that they show up personally and professionally. Um, and then how can they work with personal and professional boundaries and alignment of this North Star or these aspirations that they have? And I think when a lot of times, especially now in the digital space, right, we're all tethered to our cell phones or technology, which can be really great in some ways. It helps us connect with others more so than connecting with ourselves. If anything, it's it's allowing more connection um within our communities and building a business and all these really wonderful things that are in our social spaces, but but really it's stifling our ability to connect with who we are and why we exist, right? And and I think that I truly believe, I mean, we're all made out of stardust, right? From we're all the same stuff, and we look up at the stars and what's inside of us the same stuff. Yeah, that's profound to me. And then you got to think about okay, well, what's in a star? Well, it's just stored energy. What's in me? It's stored energy, it's just a mechanism to exchange energy. So this the the human experience is whittled down to understanding this energy. And and I think, yeah, I I'm really not trying to get metaphysical. What I'm trying to get is more engineered mine. So If if we can understand the human experience through something we can actually measure, which is energy, physical energy is really easy for us to understand. I can eat, I can move, I can sleep, I can do all those things, and I understand how to what logically what physical energy is and how to measure it. Mental energy, for the most part, we understand focus and you know learning versus playing and kind of those type of things and rumination or reflection, we understand those things. Um spiritual or aspirational, we get because we feel connection to others, we feel connection to purpose. Like we we understand that's a real energy. We understand that we're pulled towards something, right? And and that is very logical. The emotional energy is complicated, yes, and so one of the biggest challenges for people to understand who they are and why they do what they do is having a language to understand what they're feeling. And so we we have to think of uh emotions is the language of the body, and thoughts are the language of the mind. And when you just think about that for a second, okay, who's informing who? Is the body informing the mind, or is the mind informing the body? Do they even know how to talk to each other? Right, a lot of times they don't, and that's where lift lives is okay, the body communicates through feelings and expression of emotions, and the mind communicates through thoughts. So, and and here's what I find incredibly fascinating when I was building this program because I had to for years I'm teaching young people how to deliver emotional first aid, right? Like that's what I'm teaching young people is how do you show up if you fall and scrape your knee, we know to clean it and put a band-aid on it. What happens if something there's a social situation where somebody fell and scraped their knee, right? Metaphorically. They're embarrassed, they're hurt, they're neglected. How do I show up and clean them up and put a band-aid on them? So, and and when we don't do that, we deteriorate safety. We send a message to our community that you don't matter. So that was doing that for a long time. I started looking around, okay, how does that how is that show up in athletics? How does that show up in the corporate space? And it's the same energy. So what I've had to do is teach people now, to really teach people to understand what emotions are of other people, I start within. And here's this research that I find fascinating. All emotions are emotions are messages from a younger self to a future self that our present self doesn't often understand. So if you think about that, a younger self, we get that. When we're younger, something happened, that energy stored, and now it's an emotion or it's a part of me. Cool. That that makes sense to most of us, right? The future self are our values and our sense of purpose. That's our future self. So that's that's our North Star. So this message is coming from here, trying to yell to this, but my my present self needs to interpret it and send the message there. That misunderstanding here is where a lot of pain, frustration, and despair live. Because we start paying attention to now outward forces and pressure to please, to impress, to want connection to, and we stifle the voice coming within, which only when I neglect these younger voices or these younger messages, they only grow and get more pissed off at us, right? So that energy builds within us, and then at some point they show up and they kind of like overreact in a lot of different ways. They can ruin a career, they can ruin a marriage, they can ruin relationships with children, they can ruin business deals, right? Because we we don't know how to, we don't understand what they're trying to communicate. They may be saying that person over there is bad because they look like so-and-so. Well, great. They were eight, they have they're the mindset of an eight-year-old. They don't know this person, but it's a red flag, and I need to be curious and open to it. So, present Eric needs to say, Yeah, there's something there with that person, but let me explore it. I trust you, I'm gonna go work because this person, if this goes well, we can get closer to our shared goals, which is X, Y, and Z, right? Yeah, so I think that process of self-knowledge is where most self-awareness is goes wrong because we don't even understand what emotions and what they do in our life, and they don't know is the mind driving right now, or is it the body, or is this this is it this frustrated energy that's got the steering wheel versus higher self, right? Or the best version of ourself. I think that is where um I've spent a lot of time over the past five years getting really fascinated with and having enough conversation with athletes and executive leaders and and learning this myself. Um I'm convinced that uh this framework is the key to helping people be in relationship with self. And when they can be in relationship with self and extend themselves compassion, it puts them in a better position to be in relationship with others and extend others self-compassion. And when we can do that, we can really remove a lot of the barriers for misunderstanding and misconnections, and then we can advocate for ourselves, we can, you know, um, we can, you know, bet on ourselves, all those things that we've learned um as we move through life. I'm just trying to advance those lessons more quickly because technology is advancing a lot of lessons more quickly to emerging leaders, right? So up so yeah, this is kind of a unique space that I I've I've found myself in, but I'm I'm I'm loving it. There's incredible results and impact and momentum. And so yeah, I get really excited talking about it.

Values As The Real North Star

SPEAKER_00 27:52

Yeah, as well as you should. And I I think you're you're getting at certain things, and that's why I I think I love talking to you and meeting you initially, is because I think we're aligned in that disconnect of self-awareness to people and and recognizing that when it doesn't exist, how painful it is, regardless of where you are in your life or what you're doing, sports, academics, um, the real world or business, whatever it is. Um, and I I truly believe that is at the heart of so much uh frustration, stress, angst, all the things. Um my my question is as you were describing kind of the the current, you know, or the past um emotional history and the things that you store and then where we exist today, and then the North Star of where we want to be. I'm curious from your perspective, that North Star, um, how clear do you think that is for leaders that you've worked with? Like, is there a North Star, or did they just feel the disconnect, discontent and disconnect of history and current? Or do you do are they able to see the the North Star? I'm just curious.

SPEAKER_01 28:59

So it depends. So, yeah, I visionary leaders are really great at seeing things that don't exist, right? And and being emotionally attached to it. But visionary leaders aren't always well-intended, and it's not, it's because they don't know themselves, they don't know where that energy is coming from, right? So you get a lot of charismatic leaders. This is one of the most researched topics of introvert versus extrovert. What's a better leader, all that kind of stuff. Yes, core values are most people don't know their core values, they just don't. They haven't spent time to realize what they value and who they are, and emotions get stronger around the values you suppress. So, like you have if if you're let's say you're you have a really strong value around justice, and we're living in a time of ice, right? And let's just say that you're struggling, that the emotions around that are gonna be really, really high.

SPEAKER_00 29:48

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 29:49

But but it's what's important to understand is what's the value? Why am I getting so frustrated with with ice and this policy and all that kind of stuff? If I can tie it to my value, then I can act in alignment of my values. If I don't know I have a really strong justice value, yeah, and I and it just that information can come in and change our system. And now we're living in this heightened, stressful state, and I can't disconnect from the news and the challenge and all those things. So values and leaders, back to leaders, a lot of leaders are running away from something, they're not running towards something. And this is always my metric for who am I gonna try and partner with. And I've not batten a thousand, I've made mistakes and I've learned. Leaders who are running away from something haven't found peace within, right? They need they they're gonna they need they're gonna use people, they're gonna use money, they're gonna do whatever they're gonna use to satiate what they haven't figured out who they are and why they're on this earth. There's no amount of success that's gonna validate and feel loneliness and despair and all these emotions that need we all need to deal with, right?

SPEAKER_00 30:54

Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_01 30:55

But when you can get a well-aligned leader that's clear on their values and they can articulate who they are as a human and they have behaviors that match that, and then they're trying to paint people into their vision and their values, yeah, those leaders know how to create an environment for people to show up authentically within themselves and then contribute to the mission. So leaders that are running away from something are very intentionally trying to sell a dream, manipulate people into that dream, right? And then always tying back to what's in it for me, not what's in it for you. And what we should all know is that biologically we want to be in community, but we want our contributions to matter. So ultimately it's what's in it for me. I got to think every conversation right here is it's not what's in it for me, it's what's in it for you. How can I, how can I, you know, get what you want, right? And help you attach with that. And if I approach a relationship from that, knowing that you want to be loved and you want your life to matter, and then if what you want out of a relationship and what I want out of a relationship intersect, that intersection of influence, then really good things can happen. But if you find yourself in relationships with leaders who are always like, well, this is what I need and this is why it should be important to you, and they haven't taken the time to understand what's important to you, they're probably running from something, not running towards something.

SPEAKER_00 32:16

Yeah, yeah, that's a really it's a really interesting way to think about it. I um I mentioned to you before we started recording that I've been with uh four groups this week, but three of these four groups um I've done values assessments with, you know, in in the spirit of trying to anchor them in self-awareness. And, you know, most people say I want to lead by example, and I'm like, okay, what example are you setting? You know, but if you don't know your values and you don't know where you're leading from, but also as you said, the dark side of the values is are the things that tend to irritate us in life and the things that can tend to trigger us and take us off course that we get mad about, but we don't realize that it's a dark side of our values that are being compromised. And I think you're making a really important connection that causes people cause people a lot of uh anxiety, frustration, anger when they don't even realize that that is what occur is occurring, much less, as you said, how do I align and understand your values and the direction you're going that I can connect and and have that shared experience with you? Yeah, you don't have to dishonor my values by honoring yours. We can coexist, right? And and go in a great direction together and and partner around that. And I I think a lot of people don't understand that.

SPEAKER_01 33:33

I love it. Well, I mean, you you have a background with disc, you have a you have, I think, um, another performance index you use, right? You have tools in your belt. Yeah, all those tools are helping to give somebody a language, right? And when we have a language, then we can influence our beliefs. And when we can influence people's beliefs, we can influence their behaviors. And the behaviors become contagious, and that's what we call culture, right?

SPEAKER_02 33:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 33:59

But I think what you're what you're doing so well when you're when you're and let me ask you on that, when you're doing the values assessment or walking them through, are are you're I'm guessing you're giving them a bunch of different values to kind of choose from, and then they identify the language that okay.

SPEAKER_02 34:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 34:14

And so when and we I do something very similar in Lyft, right? And I do it through social scenarios and try and help them identify what's coming up so they associate the energy behind it.

SPEAKER_02 34:23

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 34:23

But I'm curious when you when you do that in with these leaders from a value perspective, what how when somebody's on the flip side of understanding their values and having their language, how how critical do you think it is in your work?

SPEAKER_00 34:41

Um, I think it's hugely critical in my work because I think self-awareness is something that I tend to lead with, regardless of what I'm facilitating or training or teaching or coaching, right? Um you mentioned that there's that gap in self-awareness, and I see it, I've experienced it, I understand it, I've researched it. Um so when I look at something like values, to me it creates a lens in which we see the world that we may not understand. And then it's it's I I think it brings to the surface um the standards, the beliefs. And for all the people who say, I want to lead by example and don't know how they're don't know what example they're setting, values gives a language to that, a framework. And then I can work with them on emotional regulation around triggers and around the dark side of values is what bothers you at work, what tends to create that um that irritation or anger or annoyance with people that you work with that you need to partner with and collaborate with. So, how do you uh honor someone else's values and your own and understand the connection between those two things? So that's how I try to work with people around it. And I try to weave it into so many different it doesn't matter. I mean, the topic. Um, I try to weave that in because I just think it's so important. And and a lot of people haven't done that or taken the time.

Self-Care And Boundaries Under Stress

SPEAKER_01 36:10

Yeah, I think, yeah, I think that's the awareness that I appreciate you saying. Two things, right? For you and your program and the work that you do in mine, and and I think we've experienced some things and and have had some success in this space, right? Yeah, the values are a foundation. Like, really for me, the values truly are the North Star. Like when I understand somebody's values, like I can I can understand them on a human level much, much better because I'm I I can put scenarios through those values and be like, oh, that's why they're getting frustrated. Okay, cool, right? So, but I think where so the five pillars of lift is self-awareness, self-compassion, because when we raise awareness, we tend to our inner critic tends to strengthen. So we got to be in relationship with our inner critic for change. So self-compassion, then it's gratitude, then it's self-care, and then it's power base. Grat I always say this the first two pillars is looking kind of backwards in your life. Gratitude is grounding you in what's right in front of you, right? Is it's its way of being present. And then self-care and power base are kind of looking forward in your life. But all self-care is is basically walking them through, teaching them who they are based on their values. So they identify their values, and then they learn boundaries, personal, professional boundaries tied to their values. Because I don't beliefs we can and opinions, we can argue and perspectives all day long. I'm not gonna compromise my values, and I would never ask you to compromise your values. And if we can have conversation around values, we can work a lot of around a lot of difference. And I think that's why the values are are tied to everything that we do. And even from organizational direction, you can say the same thing. Your mission, mission, vision, values, that's your North Star, right? But your values are gonna be when your mission is off site or your visions kind of doesn't align. I can redirect the mission and the vision based on the values.

SPEAKER_00 38:01

Yeah. Right. Yes, yeah, you're bad. Well, and I love that you're connecting. Um that I mean, when you talk about self-care and boundaries and the connections to your values and and how you're showing up in the world, I think again, I don't, I think that's something that we don't get taught at an early age or ever, like around understanding your values. And and as you said, we we aren't we don't tend to be want to compromise them and we shouldn't have to. But I think sometimes people feel like, well, I I have to to keep this job, or I have to to work with this person, or I have to do this, I have to do this. If and even if I value, you know, a balance in my life of family and work, it's like, oh, but I still have to do this thing for work, or you know, and I I think there's a lot of compromising around boundaries, and then we're not caring for ourselves and our needs and those. And that's what I think is so powerful. You know, each of the pieces of lift to me, when I I heard it, I was like each of them just resonates so power powerfully because I see the dark side of people not having that for themselves. Yeah, um, and that self-care is huge. Yeah, right, compromise who we are and the things we care most about, but I think people do that on a regular basis and don't even realize they're doing it.

SPEAKER_01 39:19

For sure. Yeah, I appreciate you connecting with that. I think of you know, specifically women and leaders. There was a great clip from Billie Jin King, and Billie Jin King is such a force within the world of equity and sports and athletics. And she starts off saying, um, girls are raised to be perfect, boys are raised to be brave. And if we just dissect that for a second, yeah. You're talking about the social and cultural forces that like I'm like if I live up to what society expects, I'm supposed to bet on myself, I'm supposed to take chances, I'm supposed to work through difficulty, right? Yeah, but women are challenged to be perfect and please everyone. And that shows up in a lot of different ways, specifically the self-care conversation. Because, you know, how do I advocate for myself or how do I say I need to step back and invest in myself because I'm giving too much to others? That's completely contradictory to what the what the norm that they've grown up in, right? Now, again, everybody has their own journey and everybody has to, you know, navigate these invisible forces uh authentically. But I think what when I get excited about Lyft, and this is whether I'm working with 77-year-old executives or 14-year-old students, yeah, is that helping them realize that listen, there's gonna be resistance along your way. Like you, you are now you get to choose the amount of resistance you want. If your goals are higher, expect more resistance. Sure. If you want an easy life, that's gonna be hard, but you're making that choice. If you want a hard life, you gotta make the easy decisions, right? Like you, you gotta make you gotta be consistent and you gotta be patient and you gotta advocate for yourself, and you gotta wake walk away from opportunities, and you gotta push back and you gotta protect your well-being, which is always uh when you think about impact, because there's trajectory of all our careers, there is a and you had a guest recently that that shared something similar around fear, and we know how much fear shows up. But the idea that that there's a a very clear path when you look at uh people being experience success, when the tr when it really kind of that that you know uh jump up, if we're looking on a graph, is when they stop being ruled by fear. Yeah, when they say, I'm let letting go of it. Forget I I don't, I'm not, I'm doing this for me, I'm not doing this for anybody else. And so, and that's been studied time and time again. So I think us having different conversations around this because you're gonna say it to somebody and they're gonna be like, oh my gosh, that's exactly the way I need to hear it. I'm gonna say it to somebody and they may not get it. They may need to hear it from you versus me. There's different journeys for people to discover it. And I think that's what's so beautiful about how we're showing up and trying to create opportunities or pathways for people to connect with their true self, right? Or be intentional as a leader.

SPEAKER_00 42:15

Yeah, for sure. And I I think it's it's really cool that you just said too, it could be someone at 14 who hasn't learned that yet. And you get to affect people at that young age who like, I didn't learn this till I was dancing with my 50s. You know, as you said, I just started letting go in my late 50s. I was like, why am I so afraid of taking risks and going on my own as an entrepreneur? Like, why am I so afraid of that? And when you you get people at a young age and you can help them see that journey and it resonates with them, or as you said, still someone who's 77 or they're in their 70s and they they still want to take that journey and to change their trajectory, you know, how do you help them to do that? And I just think it's so really just so fun that you get to work with all those different kinds of people and different um keeps me relevant in a lot of different rooms, which is cool because I they're all teaching me something, right?

SPEAKER_01 43:12

Everybody we have a different lived experience. But I think back to your point of when you bet on yourself, right? Yeah, that and that the fear or anxiety or the comfort you were choosing to get to the point of like, okay, I'm making the jump. When you made the jump, I don't even ask you. I know it wasn't easy, I know it wasn't a clean, like, okay, I know how to fly, right? But but here you just talked about how packed this week has been for you. And I know how hard it is to get those type of clients and to get that type of momentum in your business. But what when you do, and all the all the like storylines we told ourselves from our younger self, because those are just messages from our younger self telling you, Cindy, what do you think? You're not good enough. You think you can go do that? You don't have a PhD behind your name, and you're not, you know, Brene Brown or pick a thing, right? Like All those things, right? So, but when you move past all that and really step into that energy and amplify your voice with confidence, like grit, like truly developed confidence, yeah, not fake it till you're make it, but no, just just opening yourself up to sharing who you are, those moments send messages throughout your whole body that your body they they it remembers, right? And then you see another level up, you feel that resistance, and then you're like, okay, this is the next level. And last, you know, when we talked in preparation for this, you were at a very peaceful, prosperous place in your life. Like you get to select who you get to work with, you get to amplify the stories you choose, you get to, you know, uh go take a walk after this and then take a nap. Yeah, you get to do all those things that you would not have been available to you if you didn't bet on yourself, right? And so, how do we that that's a everybody's journeys on their own? I'm helping lift people. I'm trying to shorten that time uh slot in a world where they're emotionally dysregulated. Yes, right, like we are becoming more dysregulated than regulated. So I I love that you're resonating with it, and that's usually the feedback I get, is because it's just it's kind of like you're in the middle of the desert, people are are thirsty and there's no water, and then I show up with some water is kind of and when people get into the course and they get into this work, all I'm doing is a holding the mirror up back to them and reconnecting them with self, right? And I think that's what I get really excited about because I need the same work is you know, I'm still a work in progress, and I know when I go back to these principles and these frameworks that I feel my system kind of like, okay, decompress, I can exhale, I can slow things down a little bit, and then that's where I can capture my wins, learn from my losses, you know, be intentional and show up and and do my best work.

SPEAKER_00 45:53

Yeah, yeah, which is wonderful, which is why I think when I first talked to you, I was like, it feels good, the energy feels good. You um have peace with yourself, you know, what you're doing and how you've been able to take all those lessons learned, package it, and you said, All I'm doing, but all you're doing is important work because all you're doing is all your life experience and that you're putting in a framework to help people do what has taken you, um, you know, both through experience, lived experience, but also through a lot of research, science, education, practical experience um of things that you've seen that have worked.

SPEAKER_01 46:33

And I I love your energy too. That's what I heard. I love your energy as well. Thankful for the proximity we have to each other for sure.

Access Mode Versus Protection Mode

SPEAKER_00 46:40

I know, I know, it's brilliant. Um, all right. So last question, I know we're getting uh we're getting close to time here, but you know, most um leaders, I hear a lot from leaders about confidence, and they tend to think of you know performance problems and confidence problems, but you talk about something different with pressure and that they're losing, they lose access to their ability. And can you explain what you call uh and you've kind of referenced it and teed it up for right now, but what is what do you consider access mode versus protection mode and how leaders can recognize that language?

SPEAKER_01 47:17

Yeah, this took me a while. Again, when you build something like Lyft, you're like, okay, what is it? How do I sell it? Who's it searched for? Like, you know, and what I've learned over the past two years of integrating it into corporate spaces, into small startups, into dynamic athletic teams, right? Um, I've learned that people we don't lose our confidence. Confidence, I was in the course, I explained the difference between self-esteem and confidence. Self-esteem is an outside force. Self-esteem is the approval of others, the approval of parents, trying to make you feel good. We talk about the participation trophies that kind of there's a generation that went through. Um, and in in in principle, it was a good idea, right? To make sure everybody gets a trophy and everybody they participate. We appreciate it. Just do your best out there. What we lost was the pressure really does separate humans. Like you think of Nelson Mandela, Martin Luther King, these really incredible leaders. Yeah, they had to navigate so much pressure and have a healthy relationship with it. The pressure actually it leveled them up. They figured, okay, that's a barrier. How am I gonna you know get over this next level of pressure?

SPEAKER_00 48:31

Yes, yes.

SPEAKER_01 48:32

And and that's something that's always been unique about you know youth sports and athletics is like the the longer you play, the the pressure, it doesn't necessarily grow, it's your relationship with that pressure. So whether I'm with Texas and playing in the national championship game, there's pressure there. Absolutely there's pressure. But each player gets to choose how they re the the relationship with that pressure. If I'm gonna be defined and this pressure is the biggest moment ever, I'm gonna lose access to my confidence, which confidence is forged through repetition and experience. Self-esteem is is basically validation from outside in. And so where we had a bunch of kids that got awards and participation, they thought they had confidence. And then the pressure hits and they have none. They just haven't developed confidence, right? They were good at self-esteem, and their decisions were looking for validation from others, right? Where athletics or somebody mastering, you know, an instrument or something like that, they have the calluses, they have the bruises, they've they've been in the arena, right? Yeah and and forge their way through it. You can't cheat them from that. They earned that, that's earned confidence. So where these really incredible performers lose access is when pressure comes on. And if they don't, if they can't be in a healthy relationship with pressure and stress, they're not gonna be able to access their confidence. So I always think of the flow-like state or or access or having confidence is there's an on-ramp. And Daniel Goldman did really incredible research around this in his book, Focus. When we're talking about the uh flow-like state, there's an on-ramp to flow and there's an on-ramp, off-ramp to flow. So think of it as a freeway. I got to get my vehicle up to speed and get up to, and I don't know what those behaviors are, but I got to figure out the behaviors. And then when I hit the inner state, I'm in the flow-like state. I'm not slowing people down, I'm not flying by people. It's a natural, you know, uh focused uh dance between my mind and a relaxation of the body, right? That's what the flow-like state is. Working in tandem, being in relationship with each other, right? Making sure that the communication from the body, the feelings, are influencing and alignment, the focus of the mind, the language, the thoughts, right? So that's the flow-like state. So an on-ramp is the access point. And what happens is I have the flow-like state, I just don't know how to get onto the freeway. And I and if I'm playing small or playing in fear, I'm in protection mode. I will never hit the flow-like state. Sometimes we can do it like runners high. We talk about that. If I'm a runner, yeah, I do not want to go run, I don't want this feeling, and all of a sudden I start running. My mind's telling me you're an idiot, you hurt, look, feel your knee. Why are you doing this? All that for the first you know, mile. And then all of a sudden the body takes over, and it's like you get the you get you start getting that flow, the thoughts change, the feelings change. Now there's locked in, and now you hit that like runner's high and the endorphins release, and uh now like the like time slows down or evaporates, right? You're just kind of in the present moment. That is an intentional act that incredible athletes know how to get to. They know they're on ramp, whether it's breath work, whether it's visualization, prayer, music, movement, stretching. They know the routine. Like incredible athletes know that routine. Executive leaders don't even know what the flow like state is because they're always in protection mode. One meeting after the next. They get they know they've looked at their day in the morning and like, oh shit, I got that meeting. I don't want to have that meeting. It's just gonna suck. Right? So they're just like they're in protection mode all day long. How am I gonna be? What is my on-ramp to when when the pressure's on and the moment matters the most? Like your day, you had this conversation, which is fun, easy for you to show up and emotionally connect with, but you also had a presentation earlier today, and you know there's gonna be 150 people in the room or whatever the case is, and you got to get them you know focused in this space. The energy and the on-ramp to get that audience in this space to be open and learned, you have that skill because you're a professional facilitator. You know that on-ramp for collective flow, right? To be able to influence and inspire the room. I a lot of leaders don't even recognize that they have to that they have to set up the room or they have to change the energy of the room. They have to get the on-ramp for people around them to go from protection mode, which is fear, insecurity, frustration, anger, sadness, right? Or just existing or living in the future to access mode. Hey, let's change, let's slow this room down, let's really connect with our values, what matters most, why are we here? It's so much, it's so much more enjoyable when we show up for one another, right? And create that intentional leadership that you're so passionate about. How do you create that space? Now, if my team is in access mode, I've given them permission to go uh share their confidence, their voice, their authentic expression in this room. And if I've done that for somebody, I've given them a gift to very few people have ever given them. Because if I can create this space like you create here for somebody to fully show up authentically, I don't get people, don't I don't, I'm on the other side of this a lot of times, right? So, so this is a gift. You're curious, you're engaged, you're inquisitive, you're enthusiastic, you're reflecting really kind, thoughtful energy right back to me, right? This this whole experience is a workshop in and of itself of saying, how do I show up in a room and create this environment where people can be themselves, they can access their confidence, their talents, their brilliance, and then bet on themselves in a way that shares every, you know, and enhances our community. That to me is where most leaders, they're just in survival mode or protection mode and running all day long, and they miss these moments. And if you're not intentional about those moments, then when pressure gets really big, everybody they do one or three things. They go to control, like just try and control more. So it's micromanagement, they go to avoidance, they step back and be like, Well, I want that problem to go away and they don't do anything, or they they resist it, right? And and if they resist it, then it's just more friction in the system. And so this is why I'm so like excited about this conversation around pressure because it reveals so much about the organization. If you have a leader that avoids things, well, that's believe me, that's contagious and that's a problem.

SPEAKER_02 55:07

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 55:08

You got a leader that's trying to control things, great, you got a bottleneck, you're never gonna be able to scale. If you got somebody tries to resist things and somebody that's you know, um being you know, sub uh uh subversive, then then you know that there's gonna be a disconnect, and now it's about opinions and you know, discourse, not resolution. So that's why I I get excited about you know pressure and how it shows up, but it's it will go back to you know, it's that thing we talked about playing with each other, right? As an athlete athlete, yeah. I know uh Socrates said this. Um, you learn more in five minutes of play than a lifetime of conversation. And so in that, yeah, in that about somebody else, right? If you're playing with them versus you know having a conversation, but that's what work is. Pressure is it's that's what play is. It's like when the pressure's on now, are you? I'm gonna find out who you really are. Are you somebody who's going to you know bring other people in and give them and transition them from um protection mode to access mode? Or are you gonna come in and trigger everybody into uh protection mode, right? Yeah, and those are very subtle skills that are trainable.

SPEAKER_00 56:16

Yeah. And I feel like you've uncovered the secret ingredients to uh, you know, just better human beings all around, right? Because you it it's true, all of the things that you're saying about um our biology, our wiring, our um how how we show up in those critical moments and what that means and what it represents, and and what choices do we really have when we feel like we don't have any. Um, it's like the all the secret ingredients to life and to have a a happier, more satisfying life and you know, human being all or a leader, you know, in in an organization. And so I uh I just and I know I keep thanking you for the work you're doing, but I I really appreciate um the time that you've taken uh with me to uh share what you've been doing and talking about the Lyft program because I I like I said I think you've got a lot in there that I believe in passionately as well. I've seen those disconnects and I know you have too. And the way that you put it together and make it understandable and your energy around it, um, I and I know you apply it and you've helped people apply it and they've been successful and you've changed people's lives, and that's just a wonderful thing. So I just honor all that you're doing, Eric.

SPEAKER_01 57:41

It means a lot. And I and I think um I didn't necessarily know where we were going when I started this, but um in building out Lyft. But what it is really, I think what you're saying is this emotions influence every aspect of people's life. So the the best, like I think analogy I've been able to figure out what Lyft really is, there's layers to it, but it's it's it's giving people the emotional emotional operating system required for today's, you know, high-demand world we live in, right? So as our phone gets updates, you know, software updates, I think this is the update humanity needs.

SPEAKER_02 58:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 58:18

How do emotions show up in our life? How do we organize and align them in a way that's productive and builds community and and leads people through very difficult, challenging times? And and we can tie everything right back to this. But um, again, the space you've created, not only these conversations, but to bring thought leaders in that can really, you know, amplify the good uh because there's a reason people follow you and it's contagious through the screen. I haven't met you in person. I hope that that happens here in the near future. But you you have an infectious, contagious uh energy about you, and I appreciate you uh sharing that with me very much.

Reset Rituals And Closing CTA

SPEAKER_00 58:53

Oh well, thank you for your time today. It's been an honor, truly. And I'm gonna put um I'm gonna put in the show notes, of course, a link to your website, to your program. Um, and I really encourage uh audience to go out and check it out because I think you you bring a lot of credibility, you bring a lot of lived experience and a variety of lived experience into what you're teaching people to do. Um and it just highlights the um that this is for anyone to access, you know, anyone who's struggling in uh in a variety of settings that you've mentioned uh could benefit from the work that you've done and the program that you've put together. So thank you for that. Yeah. I hope you enjoyed this week's episode. When you think about the upcoming week, pay attention to your state before your strategy. This week, when you feel pressurizing, pause and ask yourself am I in access mode or protection mode? One small step to breathe and reset or reframe can shift us back into becoming our best self. There are all kinds of tools on our website for you to also look to and learn from in terms of managing emotional pressure. So check out www.intentional leaders.com for more tools and resources in our resource tab.