Kahurangi Carter: 0:02

Have you ever wondered whether the problems in the world today would exist? If we had deeper connection to ourselves, others and the environment and acted from that place. Welcome

Brian Berneman: 0:11

to the conscious action podcast with your host, Brian Berneman and Kayla Greenville, who believe that connection is the. Key to taking conscious action as individuals and creating a better world.

Kahurangi Carter: 0:21

We're here to raise awareness and inspire meaningful action by sharing stories, knowledge and conversations with thought leaders and change makers

Brian Berneman: 0:29

from sustainability to wellbeing and everything related to conscious living. Our mission is to empower you to be the change that you want to see in the world. Welcome everyone to a new episode of the conscious action podcast. I am Brian Berneman and your. And for this I have for this episode, the pleasure of being joined by the Kahurangi Carter all the way down in Christ church, in New Zealand. And first of all, thank you so much for taking the time for being here. and as I always do with all of our guests, I'm going to ask you to please introduce yourself. Yeah,

Kahurangi Carter: 1:07

I K Brian, thank you for having me, you know, I love, uh, talking about, about, uh, sustainability and our environment. So, um, any chance to talk about it? I jump. For sure. Um, Soo called, called, called, called white, called call PO hockey. Talk capital and I KA, so I just, um, I. My, so, um, when I say KA TA, that means Kawa is my Mo and, um, that is where I'm from and where I fuck to. So, um, yeah, from Ragland, um, FDO in the north island as well, and, um, white. And the north island as well and NA HARDI. So yes, now I'm living in to, and the south island and I work, um, at a beautiful organization called pat. Um, uh, P Cordier literally translates, um, into PTA means waste and Cordier is zero. So it literally translates to zero waste and our values, our mission, um, is to. Educate and advocate for a world without waste from a Maori worldview. Yeah. So, um, that's how we met. I was speaking on a panel and, um, you were there, Brian, we was speaking must have been earlier this month, um, in Auckland about, um, plastic free July. And that coup and how, um, has been helping, um, with that conversation and, and trying to spread the message of, um, going plastic free for July and every month come and going forward. yeah. Yeah.

Brian Berneman: 3:44

So beautiful. Um, once again, thank you for being here and thank you for sharing. And before we get a little bit into the zero waste aspect and what. URA does. And your work, I, I wanted to ask you about your, your upbringing, your childhood, uh, being Maori mm-hmm um, what does the Maori worldview look like for you?

Kahurangi Carter: 4:11

Yeah. Um, so I was very lucky. I grew up in the country, so I grew up in a rural town called tiqui and. We grew up just down the road from the Madai. So we were really connected to our Mara in our formative years. Um, we also lived on a river, so we were very connected to our hour and we have a saying, um, that goes Koo to OA, which means I am the river and the river is me and I. I didn't learn that saying when I was younger, but when I heard it, when I was older, it just made sense to me. You know, we were swimming in the river. We were eating out of the river. The river was a life source for us. So my mom, um, raised me and my three siblings. Uh, she was a school teacher and we lived in a local farming community basically. And I guess you could say my mom's park yard, and I guess you could say that she, um, She just taught us about growing our own food and, um, being good to the land. So she, I guess she just. We were, we were really poor. So we, we had, there was like necessity that we had to eat from the land that we had to grow our own food, that we, when someone had the local Fiji trees, like we would share food with each other. So we knew, um, where to go to, to harvest food. And my mom, um, Was a Herba is, is a herbalist. So she, um, was very into healing with plants. So anytime you got sick, you kind of went, don't tell mom, don't tell mom, cause she'd make a concoction of Inia and a snare and all these things that were so gross, like no bug was gonna survive. It. But I guess that, that passed on to me, um, this understanding of how, if we look after nature, nature will look after us. Um, and so she, she is an avid learner, my mom, and she always. Was had this thirst for knowledge, which I think I took on board. Um, absolutely always wanting to know more. And so she learned about herbal medicine and did a degree in herbal medicine and homeopathy, and then she also went into or Maori. So, um, and she still, and, and I still learn about Maori, um, from wonderful people like, um, , um, Robert McGowan who, um, teaches about Aldi and also Donna Kittridge and, and just other people. We come across in the world and we share knowledge with them. So going through the, uh, Bush walk with her and my children is looking at, um, it's a very slow , it's not like a, like an expression where you are getting your heart rate up. It is. Looking at the plants, touching them really, rather than it being an academic thing where you're looking at books, which it is part of it actually living the experience. And that is, I think TA Maori is. It's not academic. It, it is in its own way, but you it's a lived experience. And we live through our, um, we, our knowledge, um, is gained through the experience and actually physically touching and, um, smelling and using, using, um, Papa Toku, and then Papa Toku, who is we see as the world, um, the, the earth mother. When I say using, I just went, oh, I didn't mean using, you know, it already like made me kind of feel uncomfortable. It's it's a given a take. It's a, um, It's a balance, which we, and Maori called Modi. And that's where these, the circle comes into it. Where if I care for you, you care for me. And then we will both be well. So, you know, car

Brian Berneman: 8:44

and so interesting, you know, that, um, for. with all of the work that I do. One of the biggest things is always tackling this disconnection, this disconnection from ourself, this connection to each other, this connection to our mother earth. Um, and then a lot of the. The issues that we have in the world, both from, uh, climate change perspective or the environment perspective, as well as the theses and the mental health issues that we have, uh, both here in New Zealand, but everywhere in the world are symptoms of that disconnection. Um, absolutely. And I think, you know, Having perspectives and having worldviews like the Maori worldview that I've been learning through the last few years, uh, that have that we are not separate from her. We are cared and we are each other. And how we, as I still just mentioned how we treat each other and how we create this balance of that giving and receiving. um, that makes things to be what the world sustainable meant. What is now the world sustainable has changed a little bit, its meaning. Uh, so I would go a little bit to that narrative, um, perspective, but it's so interesting, you know, that, uh, you just mentioned Don courage that, uh, I had a wonderful conversation with her, with the podcast as well. And. And one of the things that she said was we, in general, we are so disconnected from nature that sometimes we, we will prefer for them not to be rained because you know, it's going to, it's going to make me wet. Or we, we talk about insects, ASIC colors, as something, you know, that, and, and it's not understanding. How everything is interrelated and the importance of everyth.

Kahurangi Carter: 10:54

Oh a hundred percent. It's just so wise. And when we talk about that connection and the, and the disconnect that we have inherited, um, because of a system that is literally created to make waste and to use and abuse, um, the natural resources and live with outside of a balance outside of the limits of the natural world, we. You know, from a TA Maori perspective, we are all intrinsically connected and you can't talk about the health of, um, ano the physical health of people without talking about the health of the earth. And, um, I guess that collectiveness that, um, and, and in TA Maori, it's about fuck puppet. So the beginning is our fuck puppet. So, um, We have, um, beautiful stories and, um, Maori law about Papa, who is the earth mother and the sky father. So the story goes that in the beginning there was the nothingness. And then there was, um, Within qui there was, um, Papai and they were locked in a loving embrace. So AUI the sky father and Papa Oki, the mother, and between them, they had their children. Um, and it was a time of darkness. And. Maui wanted to see the light. So some of him and his brothers got together and they pushed their, the, um, Papa apart and then came to Madama the time of light now. Um, all of, all of their children became the, a, the gods of different domains. So Tando, um, the God of the ocean of the Moana, um, Tanya Mahu, the God of the forest. And, um, sorry. I said Mau pulled them apart. It wast. And so, um, tan went to OAA and he fashioned the first woman out of the rocks and the dirt. And. From that. So the first woman came from the rocks and the earth. And so from that story, from that law, what we can say from that is that we are all related to every living and non-living thing, including the rocks, the ocean. And, um, and so if we think of. Papa as our family, then we will care for them in a different way. Um, it's about fuck Papa. It's about where, where we come from and understanding that the health of, of the earth of the, of the world is, um, going to benefit our own health. So sometimes I get like really overwhelmed with, um, with. The amount of, um, the problems that come from, you know, looking at climate change, looking at just the systems that we've inherited of, um, this linear system of take things. So extract things, make things out of them. So produce. Use it consume it and then just throw it away, which is a linear model. And so it's just this, it seems overwhelming. You know, when you're in this industry, you just hear about the statistics, the science and the stories that come along with it. And sometimes you think as an individual, what can I do? Like it's not me. That's out there. Um, You know, dredging our oils and from the ocean, and then having like fires raging in the ocean it's but then, um, that's a very, like it's catastrophizing things. And actually when you take it back and just speak grounded and, and think about your own connection. That's what's going to like collectively, if we all think that way the world, we can literally change the world so individually we can make a difference, but together we can actually change the world. And so holding on to those things at our own connection with, um, with the F at our own wellbeing, um, You know, flows onto our Faro, our community, our country, and then the world at large. So, yeah, it's the big things we're talking about this morning, Brian.

Brian Berneman: 15:45

I know. And you know, it's, it's so interesting because all of these things, um, I usually, you know, as part of my work, I talk with a lot of people and a lot of. There's this different camps, depending on what is everyone's experience. Of course, that is that, you know, I'm just an individual. It doesn't matter what I'm doing because out of these corporations and the government, you know, and out of that, and then there's a lot of people that. Are under well, everything that I do matters and the people in business, the people in government, they are people. And the more that we start to raise awareness, the more that the consciousness keeps on rising. And the more that we open the eyes to what's happening, then the easier that this changes might happen. And no, we, we had a talk with Maria Kamo, uh, and one of the things that she was saying that was really interesting was how she actually saw that through COVID and through the response. Mm, with that, she realize actually everything else, climate change in equality, um, all of the, the poverty issues that we have, the mental health issues that we have. Mm-hmm , they are not emergencies. They are not priority because when needed, the government can decide, this is what we do. And, and I think that this is really interesting. And when she mentioned that for me, what's really interesting because I was. Yes actually, that is true. And how, how is this not as much of a, of an issue as what some of us believe that it.

Kahurangi Carter: 17:33

Absolutely. And this is right. Like we, it was such an interesting point and so poignant because she's so right when, when governments need to mobilize, they can. And how is the future? Like, how are we so shortsighted that we are only thinking about value in terms of capitalist, the capitalist model. So we are only looking at value. In terms of monetary values. So we hear about GDP. We hear about this is what the government, um, and policy makers and regulators use as their benchmark, and then not looking at the value or in any other term. They're just looking through this very small, um, spotlight of what value is. So, yes, when will we stop? Just looking through this little, um, Little spotlight and start looking into the future and seeing what legacy we are gonna be leaving for our future generations. And to me, this like really quickly segues into speaking about TT and, um, and our obligation to TTT like TT, D T the treaty of Yung is like a sacred document that. Given to us, um, by amazing . So the chiefs of, of, um, that time have all this amazing ancestral knowledge, that's been handed to them over thousands of years. And that document is for the betterment of everybody in, in New Zealand. So. If we had adhered to te we would not be having the climate issues, the social justice issues that we are having now, because it is, um, a document that talks about Manar. These are values of, um, where I guess where our man comes from. So man is like your. It's like your prestige. It's like the sacred, innate knowledge of who you are and manner from a Maori, um, perspective comes from how much you give. So if you have visitors to your house, what are you feeding them? The. Best food from your garden that you have, um, cultivated and, um, you and grown with love and then prepared with love. Man comes from caring for Papa to NACU. And, um, so just talking about, um, The manner of people and where that comes from, and so caring, caring for everybody. And if we, if we have just lost my train of thought a little bit there, um, so. I guess that comes back to fuck Papa L looking after Papa to knocker and, and each other. Yeah.

Brian Berneman: 20:38

And, you know, I think that it's really interesting this because, and, and I wanted to, to explore with you how from the Maori worldview and the importance of final and, and the mono, how is that? Different than what most of us that live in the city we have that is we are individuals and we live a very individualized, uh, separate life from everyone else. Mm. How the importance of fun and community. Can create this change.

Kahurangi Carter: 21:13

Mm. Um, I guess Faro is also about fuck P when I first started this conversation, we, I talked about where I was from my MOA, my, my Madai, my people. And. In Tama sometimes, um, we, we all have different names, so I've got my last name's Carter and that's my husband's last name. So when, when I'm introducing myself, we are literally representing everyone from our far who've come before us, our ancestors and the, and the manner that that brings with us. It's like a responsibility. Um, so yeah, far no is important. And I guess. This is the thing we do see, uh, we have inherited this world where the individual is so important. So your individual wealth, it's kind of like GRE GRE. Like let's just have as much as I can. And then, you know, I'm just this really super important person because I have all these beautiful things that I keep for myself. Um, and then we have people who have. Not much and who will give and give and give. And so this is what we talk about in terms of man and that collective, um, aha. It's about aha and fuck of caring for each other. But if you don't mind, I'll back to it. Cause I think it's really important. Um, It's just about TDT and how it's a sacred document. And it's an agreement, you know, between Maori and the people of New Zealand, um, for the betterment of all, um, all people living here. So. Where, if you were going to be looking into where you could start, um, looking into climate justice, social justice from a child Maori perspective, like I would say Google. Um, look for, uh, Mo Jackson, you know, look for, um, teen atta look, there's so many beautiful, um, intelligent people out there teaching us about decolonization. Um, I will. Like my dad, I don't, I don't know lots about TTD T but I do follow like some important principles, um, which my dad passed on to me. And so he said, it's simple course, Lord, just follow these three things. It's the three PS. So first it's a partnership. So a true partnership between Maori and all the other people in New Zealand. Um, So between Maori. So it's a partnership, a true partnership what's happened in the past. It was this in assimilation, right. Where we just went like this and Maori kind of was like, okay, you are assimilating into this other society. So true partnership. And what that means is participation. So participation means at the table. Of the decision making process. And then the last piece is about protection. So what is our legacy going forward? I guess, um, we can talk, we can talk about that in our own lives and we can apply that to our, um, everyday individual lives. And then we can talk about it at a, um, local government and an international level as well. Um, should I just give a little example? Yes, please. Yeah. Cool. Okay. Um, Uh, the young people these days are just so inspiring to me. Like when I was 16, I was into fast fashion. If I liked a pair of shoes, I'd buy like, you know, five pairs of them. So that if I, when that one wore out, I'd just go into the next one. I was very disconnected, um, from, because of the world that we inherited and you get caught up in things, shiny sparkly things. Um, And I look at, you know, our gen Z these days, and I'm just so inspired by the, the way that they're so unapologetic in their views. And, uh, um, Uh, out there voicing their, um, their concerns for their future, for their legacy two governments. And so one of the movements that happened internationally of course, was the, um, climate strike climate school strikes. And in Auckland, there was a group of wonderful teenagers who. Who, um, organized a strike now. Um, I'm not taking away from the amazing money that they did. This is where T TDT could have come in handy for them was that they didn't have any Maori or Pacifica people represented. So there was no partnership. Um, and then what happened was, um, there was no participation at the organization table. And then, so what happened was. Organized this much to be on the same day as, um, Pacifica festival. And if you've ever been to our Pacifica festival, that is like this one day a year, that, that there's food and performances from Pacifica nations. Um, usually it's at Western Springs stadium and it's, it's just like, An amazing event where if you are not performing, you are going to support your friends or farmers performing, or just going to get some great fried bread or some T to eat. So it's just this wonderful day. And so the legacy of that, that strike that, um, was that Pacifica Aari weren't actually there because they. They already had another huge event on their calendar there. And so I guess the legacy from that is that they weren't included in the, um, organization. And then on the day, maybe the legacy would be, oh, like, Um, oh, maybe Marty and Pacifica don't care about like climate change because no one's here. Um, and arguably, you know, our Pacifica brothers and sisters are the ones who are going to be the most impacted the soonest with rising sea levels. So I guess that's just a practical application of to, and how, if we all take toity and learn about it and apply it to our everyday lives, how it actually benefit. Everybody, as I saw recently that, um, a, um, an article came out saying that that, um, that they had disbanded, which I thought was, was, um, such a great lesson for everybody who has great intentions is wanting to do something really good. And then unfortunately, um, ends up. Not having the outcome that they wanted, which often leads to people being really defensive and saying no, but no, but no, but what they did was they owned it. They said, you know what, we did some things wrong and we want to do better. So we are gonna disband and. That's all we can ever ask of people, right. Is to learn and, um, and grow from it. Yes, definitely. Like I do things wrong all the time, but I, if I, if we give each other the opportunity to learn and grow, then it just lifts us all up. So that's my little about TOTT and. Go read a book, do some research into it. Um, it's an amazing document. That's there for us to, um, to elevate ourselves.

Brian Berneman: 29:18

Mm, thank you for sharing that. And I think, you know, it's, it's so important to be able to understand that we are where we are and there's more. And, and one of the things that I usually share is how can I, and how can we widen our perspective? You know, I have my life experience. I have my worldview and, and how I grew up back in Argentina, within my culture, and then living in different countries and then coming here and it's like, oh, well, like there's different cultures inside of this country. And, and I don't know, and I need to start to learn and I need to start to understand, and I particularly resonate with . So I it's easier for me to be open to that. Yeah. And this, this is one of the things with, with a lot of the topics that I talk about in terms of sustainability, zero waste, uh, regeneration environment, but as well as overall wellbeing, how do I it's it's about understanding how can I open? How can I listen? And how can I, as you said, learn, because there's things that I don't. And the more that I'm able to, to include our perspectives. And this is why for me, I try as much as possible, you know, to have conversations and to, and to bring as we are doing now, bringing some of these topics that are not inherently what I grab with and for me to be able to be open and to listen and to understand like, oh, okay, this is what I've been doing. This is what I know. Who have I been excluding from this and what hasn't been actually, uh, taken care of because I was focusing on this. And at the same time, what I'm talking with people is not, not being, not feeling shame mm-hmm because of what we are, but just being open.

Kahurangi Carter: 31:23

We are who we are, you know, and we should never be ashamed of who we are. We we're out here in the world, which means that we have. A right to be here. And what is important is that we are perpetually growing and, um, and, and sometimes making ourselves a bit uncomfortable. It's being really self-reflective and thinking, whoa, that was not chill. What I just did. And how can I grow from that rather than just blocking it off because it was uncomfortable or it was, you know, I wanna. Normalize, having friends who can call me out on things that I did, or, um, being around, being around people who have different ideas from me and being able to have a dialogue, um, absolutely is so important. And I think, um, surrounding ourselves and being like with your neighbors, you talked about, um, your neighbors and, and. Understanding like that we can, we can put ourselves out there. And if you have a neighbor from a different culture, Imagine learning the greeting in their language and how that hits, how that connects you to those people. You know, that's just, um, about monarchy tongue and it's about respecting their fuck puppet and showing that you are open to, um, to their culture and, and wanting to learn. Definitely. And, you know, and then, you know, when they've got like a peach tree or a pie tree, they might share some of their food with you and you can do the same. It's just about these, um, these connections that we have.

Brian Berneman: 33:02

Mm. And, and I want to use this as a segue, that sharing and that growing food to talk a little bit about yeah. The, the space. Of what para code does. And zero waste understanding, understanding a circular way and understanding as well. The fact that there shouldn't be any waste because there's no waste in nature.. Kahurangi Carter: Exactly like species that like create waste. like we have this system set up of creating waste that every other species has this, um, system of making sure the resources go round for everybody. So we just created this system ourselves. And, um, I know I've talked lots about fuck puppet, but it really is that simple. If we actually look at. Um, the planet, if we look at tu NICU and we think, wow, she's been here a lot longer than we have. So if we think of, um, the existence of, of the world in a calendar year, from the 1st of January to the, um, to the 31st of December, humans have only arrived like right. A few seconds to midnight on new year's Eve. So. Maybe we can look at the fuck puppet of the world and think she has something to teach us. Maybe we can just look at those circular systems. So everything in nature is a circle. I know a really great example of course is like a tree, an apple tree. Um, the apple falls. It decompos. It gives nutrients to the tree and then grows another apple. So that's a beautiful, simple, um, circle that we see in nature and circles are everywhere in nature. So if we look at a day, you know, that's a circle. If we look at. A month. That's a circle. These cycles, just repeat and repeat all through nature. Um, looking at waves, looking at shelves, looking at flowers that E circles are everywhere. And so maybe. Maybe we should just like take those lessons and try to recreate that. Because like I was saying earlier, we live in a linear system, a linear model of take, make, use, throw away, and that system is not working for us. And, um, we put a lot of energy and time and thought. Incredible minds into thinking, well, yes, the water source is running out here. So how am I going to, um, solve this problem just to keep consuming? So imagine if we put those same incredible minds into. Re like we, what we are talking about is like really operational things. We, we are redesigning materials rather than redesigning a system, which is what we need to do to, um, to go back to living within the natural limits of the world. And so yeah, at air, we, um, we advocate for circular systems closed loop living. So, you know, one of the biggest things that I would advocate for is to grow your own food and to buy local food. Um, when we look at the centralized systems that we have of purchasing food, we don't know the fuck pepper of our food. We don't know where that apple, that we're eating is growing. We don't know how, how much has gone into getting it to the shop. And then we are getting in a car to go and then, um, pick that apple up. And then a lot of times it's actually left rotting or it's gone a bit soft. So. Throw it away. Um, if we can go back to looking at the fuck pepper of our food and actually eating the food that is grown near us, I'm so lucky, um, live right by a community garden. So the house I live in does not have a lot of, um, A space for a garden. So I only have a few herbs and some spinach cuz that grows perpetually and I don't have to do much with it, but it's just that connection back to being able to, um, eat some of the food that I've grown and have fresh food on the table. Um, sometimes you might not have inherited these skills from your parents or, um, your grandparents as some of us have. So I would, um, advocate for growing. Some micrograms micrograms are so easy to, to grow and you can be really successful with it. So, um, micrograms, um, you can just grow them on your bench and then you eating fresh food that you have grown you and your children have grown within four to six weeks. And it's just about, um, we've talk a lot about connection in this. Um, but doing that and then like, I. We've got a community garden just down the road. So connecting to other people who can share their knowledge with you. Some of the ladies there have, um, taught me about, um, preserving and about fermenting food. And so then, and then I share my knowledge with them and it's just like this collective understanding. So that's one big tip that I would say is to. Find out where your food's coming from. Um, be more conscious about the food that you're eating and, and ask questions. So when I, um, I go to a farmer's market, or even if I go to the veggie shop, I'll say, where does this grown? And they, they look at you like. Um, I'm not sure. Or then the next one, where was this grown? And they'll go, oh, I know where that was grown. That was grown here. And it seems weird now, but the more we normalize talking about the systems of where our stuff has come, the more it becomes important to, um, Two, the shops and places that we are, we are, you know, um, buying from there's so many great, like, um, such great content out there. Hey, it's like that one. That's every time we buy something, we are voting for the world that we want to have. And so taking those little tidbits with you through your life, um, is, um, It's really important. And, and, you know, I think, uh, a lot of times when I'm talking about zero waste, a lot of times I focus on food as you were just mentioned, because for most people, most of what most people consume is food and where we are getting it from. What's our connection to it, as you just mentioned. Uh, and what do we do with it afterwards? And I see, you know, and I think that there's a lot of statistics on this maturity of people's rubbish is actually organics. It could be actually composing. Um, and so getting to that space of having more connection with our food and, and with what we do with it, in terms of where it comes from, what it's going, understand that circular aspect of it. Mm. Like, I know. Uh, where I live, that we have a vet garden and my housemate, uh, fortunately for me, she spends a lot of time in the garden taking care of it. Uh, which means that now I don't have to, I can be doing other work and still come home. And there's plenty. Of food that I can just go and pick. And I know it's organic, it's been made with love. Aha. Yes. Yes. And you know, and my housemate has been put in the time in the airport and the Roha and, and I know I go, I pick it, I eat it. It's completely fresh. It's completely organic. And I know it's coming from my garden. And whatever else I cannot get from the garden, I go to a farmer's market and it's the same. And, and I, you know, and the more that this is something that we start to do, also it start to change a lot, the mentality of, of our connection, with what we're putting into our bodies, understanding also that how, if something has been traveling for a few. How much nutrition is it going to have for my body mm-hmm and understanding the same, like how was grown? Was it grown with organic methods or was it grown with pesticides and chemicals and different things? Mm-hmm and I think, I, I usually just start with that, like, okay. Let's just be more connected with that and start to see if it's possible to make some of these changes, because as well, I believe at the end of the day, not only is better for the environment and for ourselves. It's also cheaper to grow like food. Totally. And, and as you say, and you have that connection with neighbors and you can learn different things and mm-hmm, how amazing would it be on every single street? There would be trees that are actually like fruit trees. If there's a few patches on the street and stuff, Like grass would be growing food and everybody's welcome, you know, to grab some, and these are not crazy ideas.

Kahurangi Carter: 42:43

No things that, and they've before. Yeah. You know that and they're happening now. I think I'm like listening to some of the nannies talking and they will they'll say, oh yeah. Remember you used to grow the potatoes. I used to grow the KU. She used because you were an expert in the food that you grew. So you were like, I'm growing this for the whole street. And then there was just this collective sharing, sharing of food, raising children. Caring for the earth as well. And, um, yeah, it's, I guess that's where we, Papa came along was we are an organization who started by looking at, um, the waste produced in Mara. So at Mara, um, we have big events there. So, um, catering for hundreds of people and. Where does that waste go afterwards? And it used to be, you know, oftentimes it would go into a skip bin and it would go away. And so at particle, we, um, we became an incorporated society in 2010. And what that means was we, our mission was to get every Mariah New Zealand working towards zero waste and it started by actually doing what you're talking. Diverting organic waste from landfill, firstly, so that we are not making that toxic Leche and that methane. So making sure that that process, that, that food waste or was going again into a circular system. So, um, building compost, worm farms, the CASHS, um, which is what we still do today is we go in and we teach people about composting and having those circular systems. And then what happened was working with Mara. Meant that, um, That was our, that was our mission was just to work with every Mah. Then of course, once you start working with Mara, you have and you have, um, authorities and you have people here about the program and want to come on board. So that's when we changed our mission a bit. And now we work with, um, about 500, um, Mah and community organizations. And we prefer to be, um, at the top of the cliff. So we. We used when we are talking about waste, when we're talking about recycling, that is bottom of the cliff, right? So that is, which is an important step. First we need to learn about that. We need to learn about, um, reframing recycling, um, and looking at tins and glass and paper is resources. So it's not rubbish. It's a resource. And then we are putting that into a circular system, but that's still at the bottom of the cliff because recycling still uses a lot of energy, um, and resources to actually turn that tin can into another tin can or, um, it's a big process. So when we at PATCO, we have a hierarchy and at the top of our hierarchy is to. You know, refuse to refuse things and then to reduce things and then to repair things. And recycling's like right down the bottom here. So we have to teach, um, come on in and teach about the fuck pepper of our stuff so that when we have glass, when I look at this glass, I see it as a beautiful resource because it's from white sand. Of he kitty kitty, and that is precious. And that's a gift that we've been given. So just throwing it into the landfill becomes something that's really painful and hurtful to us because we are hurting, hurting the earth. Um, so learning about the fuck above our stuff, and then setting up, um, waste system so that we can divert as much from landfill as possible. Get those organics, um, into circular systems and then actually a really big part of it is designing the waste out. So actually looking at the waste that's being produced and figuring out how that waste can be reduced. And look you can I do this periodically in my own home because I have two teenagers and, um, we, the, the amount of things that we just bring into our house unconsciously. We go through the, our waste. So, um, you know, we've got great recycling and organic set up in our own house. But when you, when we actually go through the waste that we are sending to landfill, I'm looking at it and it's like, um, Ah, what are the rice crackers? You know, like rice cracker, um, containers. And it's like, ah, and so it just becomes much more conscious and you're much more aware of what you are actually sending to landfill. And then when you're aware of it, You can try to make changes. So I did try to make rice crackers, like out of our leftover rice. It didn't work very well, so I'm gonna try it again. but being Contra conscious of it means like, oh, maybe, um, how do we get that? Even out of our system? And that's at ility what we are, um, advocating for is the reduction of the waste that we produce and going and living in harmony with Papa Tuku. Um, Teaching about, um, chow, Maori and, and the way that we used to the, we used to live for many, many years, um, before colonization happened, we lived true part lives, where everything, um, was a process for something else.

Brian Berneman: 48:34

Beautiful. Thank you for sharing that. And you know, there's so many things and I think that it's so important to understand. Uh, and I usually share this. We have to have multiple approaches at the same time because we need to deal with what it is. So we need to educate and to create the systems, to deal with everything that we have already created and preventing from the next time. Like I personally, I there's things that I haven't found an alternative that is zero waste mm-hmm and I personally have decided I'm just not going to eat. Because I cannot find that alternative. So, you know, I'm, I'm not saying that everybody needs to do that for me. I, in, in that case, I know I can survive without that product. Mm-hmm so until the moment that I can find it without any packaging, without anything that is wasteful, I'm just not going to buy it. And I'm going to say to my taste, We're going to it's something else. There's other flavors out there. I love that, but it's challenging

Kahurangi Carter: 49:41

to get to that. Cause we don't like giving things up that's so to just having what we want and um, you know, this idea of giving something up seems like this huge, um, huge thing, but actually. You just get used to it, right. You just, something changes and, um, and, and then you go, oh, that wasn't actually as hard as I like imagined it to be. Yeah.

Brian Berneman: 50:10

But this is, you know, our human nature of trying to yeah. Change our habits. So we, we, we live with habits and a lot of it is unconscious. So it's about reframing how to do that from. Personal standpoint and from a whole civilization standpoint. And I think that the more that, that we have. Conversations like this, the more that we have examples of things like this, it actually makes it easier, uh, and gives everyone more permission to actually see themselves and to open up to different, uh, opportunities.

Kahurangi Carter: 50:47

Totally. And I guess like every psychologist and. Philosopher has always said, you know, to have behavior change, we need to have vision. And so we need to, and I think we, we started our conversation with lots of talk about the vision that we have for a better world and, and that we can actually see that. And, and then you get into the practical application of it and from a community level all the way through to a legislative level. And I know that, um, You know, for me, it's not moving fast enough, but there are great things coming in at the moment. We've got the product stewardship bills coming in, which are looking at how we, from the big, the production all the way through to the end of life, how we are going to have to be responsible for, um, e-waste for, um, different things that, uh, Product stewardship. So that's at a government level and then we talk about it an individual level and a community level as well. So yeah, there's, there's definitely hope I am an eternal optimist and I, um, and I believe with aha and F and, um, community fuck that we can do it.

Brian Berneman: 52:03

Beautiful. Um, I know that I could continue talking hours an hour. We could, I want to honor your time. And I want to, to thank you for, for sharing and for all of the mahi and the work that you're doing, uh, to be able to, to create this because we need optimist. We need the people that are doing things we need to be able to, to share. To be able to, to continue to do the work and to be kind to ourselves as well when it's too much. Absolutely. But to continue to, to do that. So thank you. Thank you. Thank you for being here and for sharing with everyone.

Kahurangi Carter: 52:43

And thank you so much for the, that you are doing to elevate the conversation. And I just appreciate, um, that you giving me the opportunity to talk today. So thank you so much.

Brian Berneman: 52:56

Thank you. And for everyone listening. I would love to know what did you learn? What resonated from this conversation with you and what are you doing to live Pao, to live zero waste, uh, in your life and to be a steward of this land. So leave us a comment on the show when you see it, and until the next time. Thank you. Bye.

Kahurangi Carter: 53:22

To what did you like the most about this episode? Take a moment to think about what change you can make in your life

Brian Berneman: 53:33

today. Share your conscious action on social media using hashtag conscious action and tagging at conscious action and said so we can celebrate your impact on the world and create a ripple. One easy

Kahurangi Carter: 53:45

action. We would love for you to take right now is to share like, and subscribe to this podcast. This will help us get these messages out into the world and inspire more people to take conscious action in their own lives, contributing to the better world we hope for.