{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":5.37,"endTime":7.65,"body":"Welcome to questions"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":5.37,"endTime":7.65,"body":"from the closet. I'm Charlie"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":7.65,"endTime":8.07,"body":"Bird."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":8.13,"endTime":9.27,"body":"And I'm Ben Schilaty."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":9.78,"endTime":12.6,"body":"Each episode we discuss"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":9.78,"endTime":12.6,"body":"a question we commonly get asked"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":12.63,"endTime":14.31,"body":"as LGBTQ Latter-day Saints."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":14.79,"endTime":16.98,"body":"We're not trying to answer"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":14.79,"endTime":16.98,"body":"this question or come to a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":16.98,"endTime":20.88,"body":"consensus, but simply share our"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":16.98,"endTime":20.88,"body":"perspectives. Today's question"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":20.88,"endTime":21.36,"body":"is,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":21.9,"endTime":22.86,"body":"Am I gay?"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":24.12,"endTime":26.19,"body":"Charlie and I are not"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":24.12,"endTime":26.19,"body":"terribly diverse and we share"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":26.19,"endTime":29.04,"body":"many opinions and life"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":26.19,"endTime":29.04,"body":"experiences. For example,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":29.28,"endTime":30.75,"body":"Do you still wear your"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":29.28,"endTime":30.75,"body":"retainers?"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":30.78,"endTime":32.31,"body":"Yes, I wear my retainers"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":30.78,"endTime":32.31,"body":"every night."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":32.31,"endTime":33.27,"body":"So do I. There we go."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":33.33,"endTime":34.41,"body":"You got to keep something"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":33.33,"endTime":34.41,"body":"straight."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":34.44,"endTime":39.33,"body":"Oh, yeah. However,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":34.44,"endTime":39.33,"body":"there are some pretty big"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":39.33,"endTime":40.02,"body":"differences."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":40.05,"endTime":42.63,"body":"Yeah, for example,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":40.05,"endTime":42.63,"body":"Charlie's spends 20 minutes on"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":42.63,"endTime":43.35,"body":"his hair every day..."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":43.62,"endTime":44.79,"body":"No, not every day!"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":44.87,"endTime":45.5,"body":"Oh, sorry, many days."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":45.5,"endTime":46.52,"body":"But I have been known"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":45.5,"endTime":46.52,"body":"to."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":46.58,"endTime":46.91,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":46.91,"endTime":48.92,"body":"If I got to look good,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":46.91,"endTime":48.92,"body":"I will. I'll put in the time."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":48.96,"endTime":51.45,"body":"And I spend about a minute"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":48.96,"endTime":51.45,"body":"and 20 seconds on my hair. Well,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":51.81,"endTime":52.92,"body":"three minutes and 20 seconds."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":52.95,"endTime":54.81,"body":"How long did you spend"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":52.95,"endTime":54.81,"body":"this morning?"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":54.87,"endTime":56.88,"body":"I don't know less than a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":54.87,"endTime":56.88,"body":"song."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":57.83,"endTime":63.35,"body":"It shows. That's all I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":57.83,"endTime":63.35,"body":"can say, folks. Anyway, it's"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":63.35,"endTime":65.75,"body":"really important to us to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":63.35,"endTime":65.75,"body":"provide a variety of voices and"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":65.75,"endTime":68.93,"body":"perspectives on our show. So"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":65.75,"endTime":68.93,"body":"today, we are joined by Daniel."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":69.2,"endTime":69.59,"body":"Hi."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":70.17,"endTime":70.92,"body":"How's it going?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":71.16,"endTime":71.67,"body":"Good, good."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":72.33,"endTime":74.88,"body":"So Daniel, tell us a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":72.33,"endTime":74.88,"body":"little bit about yourself and"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":74.94,"endTime":77.01,"body":"what's something that you're"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":74.94,"endTime":77.01,"body":"passionate about?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":77.9,"endTime":80.21,"body":"Uh, something"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":77.9,"endTime":80.21,"body":"I'm really passionate about. I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":80.21,"endTime":83.51,"body":"just do comedy. A lot of people"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":80.21,"endTime":83.51,"body":"know me for that in the area"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":83.51,"endTime":87.47,"body":"and, I guess nationally now,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":83.51,"endTime":87.47,"body":"which is super weird, but I'm"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":87.47,"endTime":90.5,"body":"about to hit a million followers"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":87.47,"endTime":90.5,"body":"on Tik Tok. That's where I have"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":90.5,"endTime":94.7,"body":"most of my fan base. And I do"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":90.5,"endTime":94.7,"body":"stand up [comedy] here at BYU. I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":94.7,"endTime":98.78,"body":"do \"Humor U.\" It's really fun."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":94.7,"endTime":98.78,"body":"So I think comedy just in"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":98.78,"endTime":100.97,"body":"general, like that's what"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":98.78,"endTime":100.97,"body":"appeals to me is just like,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":101.36,"endTime":102.62,"body":"anything funny. I like .."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":102.68,"endTime":105.17,"body":"So have you done any"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":102.68,"endTime":105.17,"body":"Tik Tok dance challenges?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":105.2,"endTime":108.08,"body":"I have. But"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":105.2,"endTime":108.08,"body":"that's not what I got popular..."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":109.1,"endTime":111.02,"body":"People are trying to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":109.1,"endTime":111.02,"body":"get me to do that. And I'm very"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":111.02,"endTime":111.83,"body":"hesitant."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":112.13,"endTime":113.6,"body":"Well, you'll be"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":112.13,"endTime":113.6,"body":"good at it. Right? Because"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":113.6,"endTime":116.81,"body":"you're actually like a dancer."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":113.6,"endTime":116.81,"body":"Llike me, it's like a chubby"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":116.81,"endTime":119.9,"body":"guy. Like it's not the same"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":116.81,"endTime":119.9,"body":"effect"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":120.14,"endTime":121.04,"body":"It has its appeal."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":121.16,"endTime":123.38,"body":"Well, no one has invited me"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":121.16,"endTime":123.38,"body":"to do anything with Tik Tok, and"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":123.38,"endTime":124.76,"body":"I'm not terribly sure what it"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":123.38,"endTime":124.76,"body":"is."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":126.989,"endTime":129.659,"body":"That's good stuff. So"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":126.989,"endTime":129.659,"body":"yeah, we're really we're"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":129.659,"endTime":131.639,"body":"grateful to have you here. And"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":129.659,"endTime":131.639,"body":"we're excited to talk about"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":131.639,"endTime":136.859,"body":"this. Am I gay? So I'm gonna,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":131.639,"endTime":136.859,"body":"you want to start Ben, are you"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":136.859,"endTime":137.189,"body":"gay?"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":138.83,"endTime":140.81,"body":"Well, the purpose of this"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":138.83,"endTime":140.81,"body":"question is to talk about, you"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":140.81,"endTime":144.71,"body":"know, how did we come to this"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":140.81,"endTime":144.71,"body":"realization that we were gay? So"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":144.74,"endTime":146.84,"body":"for example, I first started"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":144.74,"endTime":146.84,"body":"realized realizing that I was"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":146.84,"endTime":149.75,"body":"attracted to other guys when I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":146.84,"endTime":149.75,"body":"was about 11. But I was a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":149.75,"endTime":153.89,"body":"scrawny kid, and not very"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":149.75,"endTime":153.89,"body":"athletic. So I spent a lot of"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":153.89,"endTime":159.26,"body":"years just saying, \"Well, I am"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":153.89,"endTime":159.26,"body":"scrawny and small. And here's"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":159.26,"endTime":162.05,"body":"this athletic person who's"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":159.26,"endTime":162.05,"body":"attractive and I just wish I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":162.05,"endTime":166.52,"body":"looked like them.\" So I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":162.05,"endTime":166.52,"body":"justified or explained away what"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":166.52,"endTime":169.04,"body":"I was experiencing by just"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":166.52,"endTime":169.04,"body":"saying, \"Oh, this isn't"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":169.04,"endTime":172.16,"body":"attraction. It's it's jealousy"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":169.04,"endTime":172.16,"body":"or envy or...\""},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":172.4,"endTime":173.99,"body":"Or even maybe"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":172.4,"endTime":173.99,"body":"admiration."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":174.02,"endTime":178.04,"body":"Yes, exactly. Hey Dan, what"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":174.02,"endTime":178.04,"body":"what was the experience like for"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":178.04,"endTime":180.65,"body":"you starting to realize that you"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":178.04,"endTime":180.65,"body":"were attracted to men?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":182.04,"endTime":183.42,"body":"It was an"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":182.04,"endTime":183.42,"body":"interesting one. It's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":183.42,"endTime":185.73,"body":"interesting that you say that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":183.42,"endTime":185.73,"body":"because I think I had a similar"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":185.73,"endTime":188.64,"body":"situation where like, you start"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":185.73,"endTime":188.64,"body":"to realize it, but you kind of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":188.64,"endTime":191.64,"body":"go into a state of denial a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":188.64,"endTime":191.64,"body":"little bit, you don't want to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":191.67,"endTime":195.66,"body":"like address it. So you're just"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":191.67,"endTime":195.66,"body":"like, it's fine. It's okay. I'll"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":195.66,"endTime":199.02,"body":"grow into liking girls"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":195.66,"endTime":199.02,"body":"eventually. Like, that's what'll"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":199.02,"endTime":202.77,"body":"happen eventually. And so it's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":199.02,"endTime":202.77,"body":"always funny, because every time"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":202.77,"endTime":206.34,"body":"I look back, like I really did"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":202.77,"endTime":206.34,"body":"try to like girls for the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":206.34,"endTime":210.51,"body":"longest time, like I tried to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":206.34,"endTime":210.51,"body":"make myself and I think the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":210.51,"endTime":213.51,"body":"moment that I truly knew that it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":210.51,"endTime":213.51,"body":"was just like, it wasn't"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":213.51,"endTime":218.46,"body":"possible for me was I--was the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":213.51,"endTime":218.46,"body":"senior dance is was our last"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":218.49,"endTime":220.98,"body":"prom is what you guys call it, I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":218.49,"endTime":220.98,"body":"guess. And..."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":221.19,"endTime":222.51,"body":"What do you call it where"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":221.19,"endTime":222.51,"body":"you're from in Idaho?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":226.98,"endTime":230.52,"body":"So we call it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":226.98,"endTime":230.52,"body":"\"dances\" in Zimbabwe--it's where"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":230.52,"endTime":234.42,"body":"I'm from--but they, the weird"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":230.52,"endTime":234.42,"body":"thing was that I was always like"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":234.42,"endTime":238.89,"body":"a chubby kid, right? And then I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":234.42,"endTime":238.89,"body":"started doing rugby, in the last"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":238.89,"endTime":242.73,"body":"year, started losing weight. And"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":238.89,"endTime":242.73,"body":"all of a sudden, girls liked me"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":242.73,"endTime":246.93,"body":"because I became like a more"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":242.73,"endTime":246.93,"body":"athletic, but also funny guy."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":247.11,"endTime":249.75,"body":"And so they were like, \"Oh, this"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":247.11,"endTime":249.75,"body":"is so attractive.\""},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":249.78,"endTime":251.19,"body":"He has looks AND a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":249.78,"endTime":251.19,"body":"personality."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":252.41,"endTime":254.63,"body":"I can say yeah,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":252.41,"endTime":254.63,"body":"they were like \"Double whammy in"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":254.63,"endTime":259.46,"body":"Zimbabwe!\" That never happens."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":254.63,"endTime":259.46,"body":"And so what we were doing what"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":259.46,"endTime":262.25,"body":"what ended up happening was that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":259.46,"endTime":262.25,"body":"one of the, you know, most"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":262.25,"endTime":267.41,"body":"beautiful girls in the grade, I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":262.25,"endTime":267.41,"body":"guess, wanted to go to the dance"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":267.41,"endTime":269.81,"body":"with me. And she made it very"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":267.41,"endTime":269.81,"body":"clear to all my friends made me"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":269.81,"endTime":272.69,"body":"like ask her. It was very"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":269.81,"endTime":272.69,"body":"straightforward. And I think"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":272.69,"endTime":275.3,"body":"that's also kind of why I got"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":272.69,"endTime":275.3,"body":"scared of girls. I was like,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":275.42,"endTime":280.22,"body":"they're very blunt. But yeah,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":275.42,"endTime":280.22,"body":"that was kind of like the the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":280.22,"endTime":283.82,"body":"lead into it. And then the night"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":280.22,"endTime":283.82,"body":"of the, I guess the prom came."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":284.36,"endTime":287.6,"body":"And, you know, she obviously"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":284.36,"endTime":287.6,"body":"wanted to get more--like she"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":287.6,"endTime":291.41,"body":"just wanted to kiss me and I was"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":287.6,"endTime":291.41,"body":"very scared. Because I was like,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":291.68,"endTime":294.08,"body":"obviously I had kissed girls,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":291.68,"endTime":294.08,"body":"but it had never been like"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":294.29,"endTime":295.16,"body":"An actual kiss..."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":295.19,"endTime":297.38,"body":"Meaningful like"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":295.19,"endTime":297.38,"body":"she was like, \"someone was in"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":297.38,"endTime":300.38,"body":"love with me kiss,\" right? And"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":297.38,"endTime":300.38,"body":"so they were like she was"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":300.44,"endTime":304.7,"body":"obviously trying to get my"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":300.44,"endTime":304.7,"body":"attention and I just, I couldn't"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":304.7,"endTime":307.19,"body":"reciprocate. No, I, I was so"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":304.7,"endTime":307.19,"body":"scared."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":307.0,"endTime":309.64,"body":"You found out you were"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":307.0,"endTime":309.64,"body":"gay when you didn't kiss the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":309.64,"endTime":310.12,"body":"prom queen."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":310.15,"endTime":314.83,"body":"No, I didn't. No"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":310.15,"endTime":314.83,"body":"it was so scary man. It was I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":314.83,"endTime":317.8,"body":"felt like garbage kind of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":314.83,"endTime":317.8,"body":"afterwards, but it just happened"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":317.8,"endTime":318.43,"body":"that way. So..."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":318.46,"endTime":319.81,"body":"Where was that feeling"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":318.46,"endTime":319.81,"body":"coming from?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":320.74,"endTime":324.04,"body":"Um, I think it's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":320.74,"endTime":324.04,"body":"just denial, it's denial, right?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":324.04,"endTime":329.44,"body":"Like you always want to, you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":324.04,"endTime":329.44,"body":"just want to be like, you want"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":329.44,"endTime":332.14,"body":"to live the right kind of life"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":329.44,"endTime":332.14,"body":"that you're taught to live,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":332.35,"endTime":334.78,"body":"growing up. And so at the end of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":332.35,"endTime":334.78,"body":"the day, what you're trying to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":334.78,"endTime":339.43,"body":"do is you're trying to live"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":334.78,"endTime":339.43,"body":"exactly within the lines that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":339.43,"endTime":341.47,"body":"you're given, basically. And"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":339.43,"endTime":341.47,"body":"that's what happened all"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":341.47,"endTime":343.78,"body":"throughout life. But then I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":341.47,"endTime":343.78,"body":"started to realize that like,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":343.81,"endTime":347.02,"body":"you know, I can still live"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":343.81,"endTime":347.02,"body":"within the gospel context"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":347.02,"endTime":350.95,"body":"without having to force myself"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":347.02,"endTime":350.95,"body":"into situations where I wasn't"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":351.25,"endTime":352.9,"body":"comfortable, basically, you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":351.25,"endTime":352.9,"body":"know,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":353.05,"endTime":356.26,"body":"That's interesting,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":353.05,"endTime":356.26,"body":"because, you know, you said you,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":356.32,"endTime":358.78,"body":"you felt like garbage, after not"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":356.32,"endTime":358.78,"body":"kissing this girl. What I would"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":358.78,"endTime":361.12,"body":"tell myself, if a girl was"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":358.78,"endTime":361.12,"body":"interested in me, which was not"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":361.12,"endTime":364.9,"body":"very often as a teenager, but"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":361.12,"endTime":364.9,"body":"after my mission, I would say,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":364.93,"endTime":368.74,"body":"I'm not gonna kiss them because"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":364.93,"endTime":368.74,"body":"I am so righteous. Like, I am"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":368.74,"endTime":371.32,"body":"not one of those people who just"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":368.74,"endTime":371.32,"body":"goes out and has a non-committal"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":371.32,"endTime":374.14,"body":"makeout. Like, I am going to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":371.32,"endTime":374.14,"body":"wait till this is a serious,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":374.14,"endTime":375.1,"body":"committed relationship."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":375.0,"endTime":379.17,"body":"Like a handshake and"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":375.0,"endTime":379.17,"body":"good night. And it's also"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":379.17,"endTime":383.07,"body":"interesting, I think, a lot of"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":379.17,"endTime":383.07,"body":"people have asked me, like, how"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":383.07,"endTime":385.89,"body":"did you not know you were gay?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":383.07,"endTime":385.89,"body":"Like, how could you possibly not"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":385.89,"endTime":388.74,"body":"know if you were attracted to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":385.89,"endTime":388.74,"body":"men, you just know. And"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":388.74,"endTime":392.49,"body":"something you said Ben about"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":388.74,"endTime":392.49,"body":"explaining it away. Was was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":392.49,"endTime":396.51,"body":"really big in my experience. So"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":392.49,"endTime":396.51,"body":"ever since I can remember, like,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":396.51,"endTime":400.26,"body":"my earliest memories, I knew I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":396.51,"endTime":400.26,"body":"was different from other guys."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":400.32,"endTime":403.47,"body":"And I didn't know why or what"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":400.32,"endTime":403.47,"body":"that meant. I just thought I was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":403.47,"endTime":408.84,"body":"kind of weird. And then, I guess"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":403.47,"endTime":408.84,"body":"during like, adolescent years,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":408.84,"endTime":412.68,"body":"when I was 13 or 14, I had"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":408.84,"endTime":412.68,"body":"experience where I realized what"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":412.68,"endTime":416.82,"body":"it was. And I like felt pulled"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":412.68,"endTime":416.82,"body":"and emotionally and physically"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":416.82,"endTime":423.66,"body":"drawn to a guy. And it scared"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":416.82,"endTime":423.66,"body":"me. It scared me so so much. And"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":423.99,"endTime":427.38,"body":"like the feelings that came with"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":423.99,"endTime":427.38,"body":"it were, I think normal feelings"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":427.38,"endTime":431.37,"body":"of attraction of like excitement"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":427.38,"endTime":431.37,"body":"and kind of thrilling, and"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":431.4,"endTime":435.39,"body":"curiosity but at the same time,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":431.4,"endTime":435.39,"body":"this weight of like, shame and"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":435.39,"endTime":439.41,"body":"runaway, runaway runaway. And so"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":435.39,"endTime":439.41,"body":"I kind of trained my mind to do"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":439.41,"endTime":443.13,"body":"anything I could, to to run away"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":439.41,"endTime":443.13,"body":"from those feelings, even though"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":443.13,"endTime":446.64,"body":"they were like very obvious,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":443.13,"endTime":446.64,"body":"like looking back, it was very"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":446.64,"endTime":451.8,"body":"obvious. I have funny stories"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":446.64,"endTime":451.8,"body":"about that. But I don't know."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":452.16,"endTime":453.12,"body":"Please, please do."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":453.0,"endTime":457.2,"body":"So. One of the funniest"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":453.0,"endTime":457.2,"body":"funniest ones to me is, it was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":457.2,"endTime":461.04,"body":"Christmas. I was 14 years old."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":457.2,"endTime":461.04,"body":"And I got some Hollister"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":461.04,"endTime":464.31,"body":"Cologne, like my parents gave me"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":461.04,"endTime":464.31,"body":"a Hollister Cologne, which was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":464.31,"endTime":467.73,"body":"like Hollister was  THE THING"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":464.31,"endTime":467.73,"body":"like middle school and freshman"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":467.73,"endTime":469.26,"body":"year, like if you weren't"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":467.73,"endTime":469.26,"body":"wearing Hollister, you were"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":469.26,"endTime":469.83,"body":"nobody."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":469.86,"endTime":470.79,"body":"It was the 2000's."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":470.81,"endTime":473.0,"body":"Oh, yeah. So I was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":470.81,"endTime":473.0,"body":"like, Oh my gosh, I'm gonna put"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":473.0,"endTime":475.46,"body":"this Hollister cologne on my"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":473.0,"endTime":475.46,"body":"Hollister shirt, and I have a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":475.46,"endTime":479.69,"body":"Hollister hoodie. And like,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":475.46,"endTime":479.69,"body":"everything's... so I get this"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":479.69,"endTime":482.54,"body":"perfume. And it has like a model"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":479.69,"endTime":482.54,"body":"on the box. And his name was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":482.54,"endTime":488.36,"body":"Jake. It's the Jake cologne. And"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":482.54,"endTime":488.36,"body":"he was like this beautiful"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":488.39,"endTime":493.7,"body":"beachy California guy. And I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":488.39,"endTime":493.7,"body":"didn't want to throw the box"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":493.7,"endTime":498.59,"body":"away, because I was so attracted"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":493.7,"endTime":498.59,"body":"to this Jake guy. And so I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":498.59,"endTime":501.83,"body":"convinced my little sister to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":498.59,"endTime":501.83,"body":"fall in love with Jake. And she"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":501.83,"endTime":504.98,"body":"put Jake up on her wall. Because"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":501.83,"endTime":504.98,"body":"for her it was okay. And she was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":504.98,"endTime":509.9,"body":"like a sweet little kid. And I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":504.98,"endTime":509.9,"body":"remember just feeling so weird"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":509.9,"endTime":512.93,"body":"about that. And so guilty, but I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":509.9,"endTime":512.93,"body":"couldn't let it go because I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":512.93,"endTime":516.23,"body":"didn't really have anything. I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":512.93,"endTime":516.23,"body":"mean, I grew up on a ranch in"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":516.23,"endTime":519.8,"body":"Missouri. And I don't know, I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":516.23,"endTime":519.8,"body":"just I was so confused. Because"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":519.83,"endTime":524.03,"body":"what is gay when you're"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":519.83,"endTime":524.03,"body":"shoveling cow manure? You know,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":524.03,"endTime":528.2,"body":"like, I just this everything was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":524.03,"endTime":528.2,"body":"so confusing, but I just knew I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":528.2,"endTime":531.47,"body":"didn't want to get rid of this,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":528.2,"endTime":531.47,"body":"Jake, because I wanted to smell"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":531.47,"endTime":534.26,"body":"good and like Hollister, is what"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":531.47,"endTime":534.26,"body":"I told myself, I don't know."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":535.44,"endTime":538.35,"body":"It's interesting. When I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":535.44,"endTime":538.35,"body":"was a kid, you know, you said"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":538.53,"endTime":540.78,"body":"people ask you, \"How could you"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":538.53,"endTime":540.78,"body":"not know that you were gay?\""},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":540.81,"endTime":543.57,"body":"Like to me that that wasn't an"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":540.81,"endTime":543.57,"body":"option, right? Being gay wasn't"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":543.57,"endTime":547.26,"body":"an option. It had to be a phase"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":543.57,"endTime":547.26,"body":"that was gonna go away. I didn't"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":547.26,"endTime":550.74,"body":"really confront those feelings"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":547.26,"endTime":550.74,"body":"in a real way until after my"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":550.74,"endTime":553.74,"body":"mission because there was that"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":550.74,"endTime":553.74,"body":"was wasn't an option. I couldn't"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":553.74,"endTime":557.58,"body":"be gay that just didn't fit."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":553.74,"endTime":557.58,"body":"Right. And similar experience in"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":557.58,"endTime":558.18,"body":"Zimbabwe?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":558.3,"endTime":560.43,"body":"Oh, yeah, for"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":558.3,"endTime":560.43,"body":"sure. Yeah, very conservative."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":560.43,"endTime":565.14,"body":"Very, you know, yeah. Again, it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":560.43,"endTime":565.14,"body":"wasn't an option. Like I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":565.14,"endTime":569.4,"body":"remember the first time that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":565.14,"endTime":569.4,"body":"like, similarly--like I always"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":569.4,"endTime":572.28,"body":"knew low key-- you explained it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":569.4,"endTime":572.28,"body":"the way you keep trying to tell"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":572.28,"endTime":576.33,"body":"yourself like, \"This is not how"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":572.28,"endTime":576.33,"body":"I feel. I AM into girls. I know"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":576.33,"endTime":580.2,"body":"I am. I can feel it.\" And over"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":576.33,"endTime":580.2,"body":"time, you eventually just like"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":580.2,"endTime":583.32,"body":"start to forget about it. And"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":580.2,"endTime":583.32,"body":"then for me, the realization"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":583.32,"endTime":589.62,"body":"came back much later when I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":583.32,"endTime":589.62,"body":"guess I was confronted with the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":589.62,"endTime":592.77,"body":"situation of the girl liking me,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":589.62,"endTime":592.77,"body":"rather than anything else."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":592.83,"endTime":595.23,"body":"Because I never had to I never"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":592.83,"endTime":595.23,"body":"had to look at it that way."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":595.23,"endTime":596.58,"body":"Right? Like I never had to be"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":595.23,"endTime":596.58,"body":"like, Oh..."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":596.97,"endTime":599.73,"body":"Well, I think I was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":596.97,"endTime":599.73,"body":"always hoping it was a phase or"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":599.73,"endTime":602.22,"body":"trying to convince myself that"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":599.73,"endTime":602.22,"body":"was a phase or there's something"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":602.22,"endTime":607.71,"body":"I could do, to be better to, to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":602.22,"endTime":607.71,"body":"get out of that mindset, you"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":607.71,"endTime":610.59,"body":"know, which, which I what I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":607.71,"endTime":610.59,"body":"thought was a mindset."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":611.62,"endTime":614.11,"body":"Well, I went to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":611.62,"endTime":614.11,"body":"like, after the mission,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":614.11,"endTime":617.08,"body":"actually, I went to a therapist"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":614.11,"endTime":617.08,"body":"who told me that for the longest"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":617.08,"endTime":621.13,"body":"time, he was like, \"You can get"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":617.08,"endTime":621.13,"body":"over it.\" So it was conversion"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":621.13,"endTime":623.47,"body":"therapy, but it wasn't like"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":621.13,"endTime":623.47,"body":"severe conversion therapy that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":623.47,"endTime":624.58,"body":"people talk about."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":625.0,"endTime":626.35,"body":"Kind of shame-based"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":625.0,"endTime":626.35,"body":"therapy."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":626.35,"endTime":629.59,"body":"Well yeah, I was"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":626.35,"endTime":629.59,"body":"just, I just one sticks out of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":629.59,"endTime":633.01,"body":"my mind. And I only realized"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":629.59,"endTime":633.01,"body":"this the other day, but uh, that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":633.01,"endTime":636.52,"body":"same therapist, I went to him,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":633.01,"endTime":636.52,"body":"and he told me like, \"The reason"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":636.88,"endTime":640.03,"body":"that you're gay is because you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":636.88,"endTime":640.03,"body":"know, you're, you're not looking"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":640.03,"endTime":643.15,"body":"after yourself.\" He's like,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":640.03,"endTime":643.15,"body":"\"You're not exercising or eating"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":643.15,"endTime":649.12,"body":"right.\" Yeah, that's so true!"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":643.15,"endTime":649.12,"body":"Yeah, I feel that. And so I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":649.12,"endTime":651.73,"body":"believed for the longest time"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":649.12,"endTime":651.73,"body":"that I was like, it's because"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":651.73,"endTime":654.49,"body":"I'm eating fast food. Yeah, at"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":651.73,"endTime":654.49,"body":"least for like, a few months."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":654.49,"endTime":657.49,"body":"Like, I went into that phase."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":654.49,"endTime":657.49,"body":"But then I found out..."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":657.49,"endTime":658.66,"body":"Did you stop eating fast"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":657.49,"endTime":658.66,"body":"food?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":658.0,"endTime":662.35,"body":"I tried. I like"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":658.0,"endTime":662.35,"body":"fast food, honestly. But like,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":662.35,"endTime":665.56,"body":"that's the thing is, like--I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":662.35,"endTime":665.56,"body":"think was two months after"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":665.77,"endTime":667.6,"body":"that--I was just talking to my"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":665.77,"endTime":667.6,"body":"sister and I was just like, it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":667.6,"endTime":671.11,"body":"just doesn't feel right. Like"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":667.6,"endTime":671.11,"body":"going to these therapy sessions"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":671.11,"endTime":673.6,"body":"or anything like that, like"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":671.11,"endTime":673.6,"body":"something is off. And I don't"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":673.6,"endTime":676.57,"body":"think that's the actual answer."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":673.6,"endTime":676.57,"body":"And my sister was like, \"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":676.57,"endTime":679.45,"body":"for sure. You'll probably...\""},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":676.57,"endTime":679.45,"body":"And then it was funny, because"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":679.45,"endTime":681.94,"body":"my sister had to kind of sit me"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":679.45,"endTime":681.94,"body":"down and be just like, \"You're"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":681.94,"endTime":686.65,"body":"gay, Daniel.\" I was like, \"Oh,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":681.94,"endTime":686.65,"body":"my gosh!\" Like, hit me, you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":686.65,"endTime":689.92,"body":"know. And I was like, \"Oh, my"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":686.65,"endTime":689.92,"body":"gosh!\" This sudden realization,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":689.92,"endTime":692.86,"body":"but like, it is something that I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":689.92,"endTime":692.86,"body":"had to like, try and like push"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":692.86,"endTime":696.01,"body":"through consistently where I was"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":692.86,"endTime":696.01,"body":"just like, it's just a phase."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":696.04,"endTime":699.25,"body":"You know, I'll get over it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":696.04,"endTime":699.25,"body":"eventually. And then took my"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":699.25,"endTime":702.46,"body":"sister just like screaming at me"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":699.25,"endTime":702.46,"body":"basically one night to really"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":702.46,"endTime":705.76,"body":"just be like, okay, I will just"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":702.46,"endTime":705.76,"body":"accept it for what it is at this"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":705.76,"endTime":706.12,"body":"point."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":706.3,"endTime":708.46,"body":"Yeah. What were some of"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":706.3,"endTime":708.46,"body":"those moments as you guys were"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":708.46,"endTime":712.57,"body":"confronting your orientation"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":708.46,"endTime":712.57,"body":"later in life after after your"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":712.57,"endTime":714.94,"body":"teens that kind of hinted that"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":712.57,"endTime":714.94,"body":"you were gay?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":715.2,"endTime":717.33,"body":"Yeah. For me, a lot of"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":715.2,"endTime":717.33,"body":"it was dating. I came back after"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":717.33,"endTime":720.09,"body":"my mission to BYU and I had like"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":717.33,"endTime":720.09,"body":"a \"glow up\" on my mission. I was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":720.09,"endTime":724.8,"body":"a very scrawny tiny kid in high"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":720.09,"endTime":724.8,"body":"school. And then I kind of grew"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":724.8,"endTime":729.3,"body":"into myself. And I was like, on"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":724.8,"endTime":729.3,"body":"an athletic team, and I had"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":729.3,"endTime":732.51,"body":"like, the cool swag and the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":729.3,"endTime":732.51,"body":"gear. And I was pulling, like"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":732.51,"endTime":735.27,"body":"some of the most beautiful"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":732.51,"endTime":735.27,"body":"popular girls on campus and"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":735.27,"endTime":738.48,"body":"going on dates and, and like,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":735.27,"endTime":738.48,"body":"all my friends, were convinced"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":738.48,"endTime":741.57,"body":"that I was a player. And were,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":738.48,"endTime":741.57,"body":"like, in love with the girls"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":741.57,"endTime":744.81,"body":"that I was going on dates with."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":741.57,"endTime":744.81,"body":"And I was like, \"I really liked"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":744.81,"endTime":748.59,"body":"what she wore. And she was fun.\""},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":744.81,"endTime":748.59,"body":"You know, and just hearing my"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":748.59,"endTime":751.26,"body":"friends talk about their dating"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":748.59,"endTime":751.26,"body":"experiences versus what was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":751.26,"endTime":756.39,"body":"happening with me. It was very,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":751.26,"endTime":756.39,"body":"very, very different. And..."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":757.23,"endTime":759.36,"body":"So Charlie, the answer to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":757.23,"endTime":759.36,"body":"the question is, how did you"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":759.36,"endTime":761.67,"body":"know you're gay? It was,\"I went"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":759.36,"endTime":761.67,"body":"out with the hottest woman on"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":761.67,"endTime":762.15,"body":"campus.\""},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":763.95,"endTime":767.58,"body":"I was just so"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":763.95,"endTime":767.58,"body":"popular. likeable, that I just"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":767.58,"endTime":768.9,"body":"came to the realization."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":769.17,"endTime":772.05,"body":"Yeah, it worked for me,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":769.17,"endTime":772.05,"body":"and it helped me figure it out."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":773.47,"endTime":775.78,"body":"I think for me"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":773.47,"endTime":775.78,"body":"as well, like, it was like the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":775.78,"endTime":780.46,"body":"representations in media, not"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":775.78,"endTime":780.46,"body":"necessarily and that's that is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":780.46,"endTime":782.62,"body":"kind of problematic, because a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":780.46,"endTime":782.62,"body":"lot of people like to argue that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":782.62,"endTime":784.87,"body":"like, \"Oh, well, like watching,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":782.62,"endTime":784.87,"body":"it will make you gay.\" But"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":784.87,"endTime":787.54,"body":"that's not the case. Right? Like"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":784.87,"endTime":787.54,"body":"you just know, deep down, but I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":787.54,"endTime":791.32,"body":"think it was just like seeing"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":787.54,"endTime":791.32,"body":"people that were gay on TV act"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":791.32,"endTime":795.43,"body":"out exactly what I felt like. I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":791.32,"endTime":795.43,"body":"remember watching a video, I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":795.43,"endTime":797.65,"body":"can't remember where it was, it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":795.43,"endTime":797.65,"body":"was I think it was like on"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":797.65,"endTime":801.52,"body":"Facebook of this guy like"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":797.65,"endTime":801.52,"body":"voguing to Lady Gaga and I was"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":801.52,"endTime":807.37,"body":"like that is cool. Like, this is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":801.52,"endTime":807.37,"body":"awesome. I wish I could do that."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":807.4,"endTime":810.37,"body":"But I felt like kind of like"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":807.4,"endTime":810.37,"body":"weird about it. Because I was"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":810.37,"endTime":813.43,"body":"like, that would be so fun. Just"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":810.37,"endTime":813.43,"body":"to go and like dance like that."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":813.43,"endTime":815.92,"body":"That's just something that it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":813.43,"endTime":815.92,"body":"would--it was just it just"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":815.92,"endTime":820.18,"body":"looked fun. Right? Like, and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":815.92,"endTime":820.18,"body":"that was where I I had to kind"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":820.18,"endTime":823.09,"body":"of like confront it more often."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":820.18,"endTime":823.09,"body":"It's just like, when I saw it on"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":823.09,"endTime":823.63,"body":"TV."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":823.84,"endTime":827.74,"body":"Yeah. What was it like for"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":823.84,"endTime":827.74,"body":"you in your process of learning"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":827.74,"endTime":829.42,"body":"who you were when your aunt came"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":827.74,"endTime":829.42,"body":"out?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":830.2,"endTime":833.26,"body":"Ooh, I think"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":830.2,"endTime":833.26,"body":"that was also kind of a again,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":833.29,"endTime":837.97,"body":"you try to put it away. Cuz I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":833.29,"endTime":837.97,"body":"did see how hard it was at first"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":838.0,"endTime":841.54,"body":"for my dad to kind of accept it."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":838.0,"endTime":841.54,"body":"And that scared me because I was"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":841.54,"endTime":844.33,"body":"like, \"Oh, I can't tell my"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":841.54,"endTime":844.33,"body":"parents.\" I remember one night"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":845.23,"endTime":850.99,"body":"asking my mom--during that time,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":845.23,"endTime":850.99,"body":"I was like, \"What would you do"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":850.99,"endTime":855.37,"body":"if one of us like, was gay?\" And"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":850.99,"endTime":855.37,"body":"my mom, I remember her being"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":855.37,"endTime":858.61,"body":"like, \"I would love you guys no"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":855.37,"endTime":858.61,"body":"matter what.\" And then I was"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":858.61,"endTime":862.33,"body":"like, Okay, good. I shut up,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":858.61,"endTime":862.33,"body":"didn't say anything after"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":864.61,"endTime":864.79,"body":"that...basically it..."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":865.84,"endTime":866.62,"body":"Did you fool her?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":867.11,"endTime":869.57,"body":"I don't think"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":867.11,"endTime":869.57,"body":"Well, I think my mom always had"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":869.57,"endTime":873.17,"body":"like, hoped that I was straight"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":869.57,"endTime":873.17,"body":"because I was the eldest son."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":873.59,"endTime":877.01,"body":"You know, I'm carrying on the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":873.59,"endTime":877.01,"body":"legacy. I'm the oldest Spencer"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":877.01,"endTime":880.58,"body":"boy. And I but I think they"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":877.01,"endTime":880.58,"body":"always knew that I was different"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":880.58,"endTime":883.64,"body":"for sure. Because like, all the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":880.58,"endTime":883.64,"body":"other dudes in my family were"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":883.64,"endTime":886.61,"body":"like rugby players. And I was"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":883.64,"endTime":886.61,"body":"like, I wanted to do theater and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":886.61,"endTime":890.27,"body":"dance! They forced me to do"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":886.61,"endTime":890.27,"body":"rugby still, but like, and I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":890.27,"endTime":893.51,"body":"enjoyed it, but it was just"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":890.27,"endTime":893.51,"body":"like, I think they knew deep"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":893.51,"endTime":896.81,"body":"down that it was like--I think"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":893.51,"endTime":896.81,"body":"my dad told me like he kind of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":897.2,"endTime":901.49,"body":"was expecting it at a certain"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":897.2,"endTime":901.49,"body":"point. Just because I--when ever"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":901.49,"endTime":902.84,"body":"he would come back from business"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":901.49,"endTime":902.84,"body":"trips..."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":902.84,"endTime":903.41,"body":"Lady Gaga."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":904.07,"endTime":906.41,"body":"Like, he'd"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":904.07,"endTime":906.41,"body":"always come home from like"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":906.41,"endTime":908.63,"body":"business trips when I was super"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":906.41,"endTime":908.63,"body":"young and I'd like be wearing"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":908.63,"endTime":911.51,"body":"like dresses and my sister's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":908.63,"endTime":911.51,"body":"closets and be like, ahh! Well,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":911.51,"endTime":914.93,"body":"they will be playing dress up"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":911.51,"endTime":914.93,"body":"with me. But like, my dad was"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":914.93,"endTime":919.16,"body":"like, \"Sharon, what is going"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":914.93,"endTime":919.16,"body":"on?\" And she was like, \"He's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":919.16,"endTime":922.31,"body":"playing dress up, it's fine.\" So"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":919.16,"endTime":922.31,"body":"it's funny."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":922.33,"endTime":924.16,"body":"Well, I think it's"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":922.33,"endTime":924.16,"body":"interesting. We've talked a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":924.16,"endTime":927.1,"body":"little bit about like, physical"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":924.16,"endTime":927.1,"body":"attraction. But for me, I can"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":927.16,"endTime":933.04,"body":"looking back in retrospect, I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":927.16,"endTime":933.04,"body":"can see, like, more proof when I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":933.04,"endTime":935.26,"body":"was younger, that that I was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":933.04,"endTime":935.26,"body":"gay, or that there was something"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":935.26,"endTime":937.78,"body":"different about me, in regards"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":935.26,"endTime":937.78,"body":"to my relationships with other"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":937.78,"endTime":942.28,"body":"people, specifically with girls."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":937.78,"endTime":942.28,"body":"It was very easy for me growing"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":942.28,"endTime":945.52,"body":"up to have strong relationships"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":942.28,"endTime":945.52,"body":"with girls, and not so much with"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":945.52,"endTime":948.22,"body":"guys. I felt kind of like a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":945.52,"endTime":948.22,"body":"disconnect. And I think some of"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":948.22,"endTime":950.53,"body":"that is because I was scared"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":948.22,"endTime":950.53,"body":"because deep down, I knew I was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":950.53,"endTime":954.64,"body":"attracted to guys, and I didn't"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":950.53,"endTime":954.64,"body":"want to like, open a jar, like a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":954.64,"endTime":959.62,"body":"can that I couldn't close. But"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":954.64,"endTime":959.62,"body":"but I've just always been so"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":959.62,"endTime":962.65,"body":"good at connecting with women."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":959.62,"endTime":962.65,"body":"And I think it's because I I am"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":962.65,"endTime":967.45,"body":"incapable of objectifying them"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":962.65,"endTime":967.45,"body":"like there is no sexual tension"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":967.45,"endTime":972.13,"body":"ever. And so it because that,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":967.45,"endTime":972.13,"body":"that barrier and that all of"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":972.13,"endTime":974.86,"body":"that's gone, I can connect with"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":972.13,"endTime":974.86,"body":"them. And in many ways, I feel"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":974.86,"endTime":978.46,"body":"like women can can kind of sense"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":974.86,"endTime":978.46,"body":"that about me. And it. it's kind"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":978.46,"endTime":983.05,"body":"of like a symbiotic"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":978.46,"endTime":983.05,"body":"relationship. I've actually"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":983.05,"endTime":986.47,"body":"never really shared this only to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":983.05,"endTime":986.47,"body":"a couple people, but I had an"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":986.47,"endTime":989.38,"body":"experience when I was young, I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":986.47,"endTime":989.38,"body":"think I was probably around"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":989.38,"endTime":995.38,"body":"seven or eight. And an"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":989.38,"endTime":995.38,"body":"experience that kind of like"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":996.28,"endTime":1000.42,"body":"looking back shows, there's more"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":996.28,"endTime":1000.42,"body":"to romantic attraction than than"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1000.42,"endTime":1003.54,"body":"physical, right? There's"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1000.42,"endTime":1003.54,"body":"compatibility, there's emotional"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1003.54,"endTime":1006.78,"body":"attraction, and there's like the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1003.54,"endTime":1006.78,"body":"way you connect with people. I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1006.78,"endTime":1009.57,"body":"remember I had a dream when I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1006.78,"endTime":1009.57,"body":"was a child, it was a very vivid"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1009.57,"endTime":1014.61,"body":"dream. And I um, I in my dream,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1009.57,"endTime":1014.61,"body":"I spent the day with this boy."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1015.06,"endTime":1019.65,"body":"And we like, we're in a city"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1015.06,"endTime":1019.65,"body":"next to the ocean. And we just"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1019.65,"endTime":1022.86,"body":"spent the whole day like hanging"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1019.65,"endTime":1022.86,"body":"out together. And then I went to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1022.86,"endTime":1026.31,"body":"his his family's home, and had"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1022.86,"endTime":1026.31,"body":"dinner with his whole family."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1026.61,"endTime":1029.04,"body":"And they accepted me. And I just"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1026.61,"endTime":1029.04,"body":"remember, it was like the best"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1029.04,"endTime":1033.24,"body":"dinner ever in this dream. And"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1029.04,"endTime":1033.24,"body":"then we went to the pier, and we"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1033.24,"endTime":1038.19,"body":"were holding hands, and watching"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1033.24,"endTime":1038.19,"body":"the sunset on the pier. And then"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1038.19,"endTime":1043.23,"body":"I woke up, and I was young, I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1038.19,"endTime":1043.23,"body":"was so young, and I started"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1043.23,"endTime":1047.25,"body":"crying because I was so sad that"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1043.23,"endTime":1047.25,"body":"that dream was over. Because I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1047.25,"endTime":1052.41,"body":"was so happy. And I wanted that"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1047.25,"endTime":1052.41,"body":"to be my life. And I just think"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1052.41,"endTime":1055.02,"body":"that's so interesting, because"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1052.41,"endTime":1055.02,"body":"this is before I had any outside"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1055.02,"endTime":1062.25,"body":"influence from anywhere. My"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1055.02,"endTime":1062.25,"body":"young self was was seeking like"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1062.25,"endTime":1065.94,"body":"what I wanted most what, what"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1062.25,"endTime":1065.94,"body":"made me so happy in my"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1065.94,"endTime":1069.72,"body":"subconscious was, was an"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1065.94,"endTime":1069.72,"body":"emotional relationship with"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1069.72,"endTime":1070.41,"body":"another male."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1073.28,"endTime":1074.57,"body":"What's kept you from"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1073.28,"endTime":1074.57,"body":"sharing that?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1074.9,"endTime":1078.05,"body":"I don't know. I think"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1074.9,"endTime":1078.05,"body":"part of it is because it's such"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1078.05,"endTime":1081.89,"body":"a sacred memory. And I think for"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1078.05,"endTime":1081.89,"body":"a lot of years, it scared me"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1081.89,"endTime":1087.8,"body":"because, again, like I've I've"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1081.89,"endTime":1087.8,"body":"never forgotten that dream. But"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1087.8,"endTime":1091.37,"body":"for so much time that that that"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1087.8,"endTime":1091.37,"body":"dream was scary, because it"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1091.37,"endTime":1095.06,"body":"meant that, that my"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1091.37,"endTime":1095.06,"body":"subconscious, like something"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1095.06,"endTime":1099.44,"body":"beyond what I can control was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1095.06,"endTime":1099.44,"body":"gay. And and that was used to be"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1099.44,"endTime":1100.19,"body":"scary to me."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1100.36,"endTime":1103.15,"body":"Yeah, I would say like this"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1100.36,"endTime":1103.15,"body":"idea that something in my"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1103.15,"endTime":1107.74,"body":"subconscious was, was oriented"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1103.15,"endTime":1107.74,"body":"towards men was super scary. And"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1107.74,"endTime":1110.05,"body":"it was a question--am I gay? I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1107.74,"endTime":1110.05,"body":"think it was a question I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1110.05,"endTime":1115.0,"body":"answered for many, many, many"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1110.05,"endTime":1115.0,"body":"years, as I dated women, and"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1115.0,"endTime":1116.98,"body":"then kissed one of them and"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1115.0,"endTime":1116.98,"body":"realized that that was not"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1116.98,"endTime":1120.46,"body":"something that I enjoyed, but"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1116.98,"endTime":1120.46,"body":"that she did, and that we were"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1120.46,"endTime":1124.84,"body":"having a different experience."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1120.46,"endTime":1124.84,"body":"And then just how much I just so"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1124.84,"endTime":1127.6,"body":"didn't want to be gay in"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1124.84,"endTime":1127.6,"body":"everything I would do to try to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1127.6,"endTime":1130.18,"body":"not be gay, like like praying"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1127.6,"endTime":1130.18,"body":"and fasting and going to the"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1130.18,"endTime":1133.45,"body":"temple and reading my"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1130.18,"endTime":1133.45,"body":"scriptures. And all the things I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1133.45,"endTime":1136.6,"body":"tried to do that just wouldn't"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1133.45,"endTime":1136.6,"body":"change it. And then when I was"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1136.6,"endTime":1140.02,"body":"30, and fell in love with a guy,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1136.6,"endTime":1140.02,"body":"I was like, \"Oh, this is what"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1140.02,"endTime":1144.31,"body":"it's supposed to feel like.\""},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1140.02,"endTime":1144.31,"body":"Like this this is what this is"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1144.31,"endTime":1147.13,"body":"what I've been trying to get"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1144.31,"endTime":1147.13,"body":"with these women for all these"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1147.13,"endTime":1149.68,"body":"years. Like we would--when I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1147.13,"endTime":1149.68,"body":"would date women, we would have"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1149.68,"endTime":1152.41,"body":"these, this really strong"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1149.68,"endTime":1152.41,"body":"emotional connection and a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1152.41,"endTime":1155.98,"body":"really strong friendship. And"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1152.41,"endTime":1155.98,"body":"then as I got to, \"Let's hold"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1155.98,"endTime":1159.4,"body":"hands and cuddle,\" it just felt"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1155.98,"endTime":1159.4,"body":"so unnatural and uncomfortable"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1159.4,"endTime":1163.03,"body":"for me. But then when I briefly"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1159.4,"endTime":1163.03,"body":"dated this guy, and \"dating\""},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1163.03,"endTime":1164.8,"body":"isn't even the right word,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1163.03,"endTime":1164.8,"body":"because we never went on \"a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1164.8,"endTime":1168.13,"body":"date.\" And we even lived in"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1164.8,"endTime":1168.13,"body":"different states. We would talk"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1168.13,"endTime":1170.77,"body":"every day, it was just so"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1168.13,"endTime":1170.77,"body":"wonderful and just made me just"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1171.31,"endTime":1174.37,"body":"feel so good and happy. And I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1171.31,"endTime":1174.37,"body":"thought, \"Oh, this is this is"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1174.37,"endTime":1176.53,"body":"what I've been trying to find"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1174.37,"endTime":1176.53,"body":"for for all those years.\""},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1178.28,"endTime":1181.82,"body":"I feel the exact"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1178.28,"endTime":1181.82,"body":"same. I'm just kind of like--to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1181.82,"endTime":1187.34,"body":"be honest with you this--right"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1181.82,"endTime":1187.34,"body":"after high school was the first"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1187.34,"endTime":1189.8,"body":"experience where I had something"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1187.34,"endTime":1189.8,"body":"similar to that. And that's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1189.8,"endTime":1194.45,"body":"happened like three times"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1189.8,"endTime":1194.45,"body":"maybe--twice here at BYU and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1194.45,"endTime":1197.33,"body":"then like once before high"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1194.45,"endTime":1197.33,"body":"school--where you just kind of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1197.33,"endTime":1202.34,"body":"know and then you have like a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1197.33,"endTime":1202.34,"body":"weird--it's not even necessarily"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1202.34,"endTime":1205.91,"body":"just an attraction. It's just"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1202.34,"endTime":1205.91,"body":"like, you know, like, you know,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1206.36,"endTime":1208.7,"body":"something about them. You're"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1206.36,"endTime":1208.7,"body":"like, I feel like I know this"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1208.7,"endTime":1211.22,"body":"person, like, I feel like I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1208.7,"endTime":1211.22,"body":"know. And then you start talking"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1211.22,"endTime":1214.04,"body":"to them. And you see how many"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1211.22,"endTime":1214.04,"body":"like similar experiences you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1214.04,"endTime":1216.71,"body":"have. And you're like, \"Oh, my"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1214.04,"endTime":1216.71,"body":"goodness, like this is, is this"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1216.71,"endTime":1219.68,"body":"what it's like supposed to feel"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1216.71,"endTime":1219.68,"body":"like?\" And you go deeper and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1219.68,"endTime":1223.85,"body":"deeper. And similarly, I think"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1219.68,"endTime":1223.85,"body":"it's just, it's a little bit"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1223.85,"endTime":1227.21,"body":"weird when you have to start"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1223.85,"endTime":1227.21,"body":"addressing those questions,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1227.21,"endTime":1230.0,"body":"because in your mind, you're"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1227.21,"endTime":1230.0,"body":"like, \"I've never even had to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1230.0,"endTime":1233.9,"body":"even think about it.\" And when"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1230.0,"endTime":1233.9,"body":"I'm 26, like, I've never had to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1233.9,"endTime":1235.94,"body":"deal with that sort of stuff,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1233.9,"endTime":1235.94,"body":"because I've never been"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1235.94,"endTime":1238.49,"body":"attracted to the girls that I've"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1235.94,"endTime":1238.49,"body":"gone on dates with, right?Like,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1238.85,"endTime":1243.59,"body":"and as a 26 year old, you've"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1238.85,"endTime":1243.59,"body":"watched your friends--from 13 up"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1243.59,"endTime":1247.85,"body":"to where they're 26--all learn"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1243.59,"endTime":1247.85,"body":"and understand that stuff and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1247.85,"endTime":1252.08,"body":"you have to learn it so quick."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1247.85,"endTime":1252.08,"body":"And address it in a way that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1252.08,"endTime":1254.96,"body":"gets you through that, like"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1252.08,"endTime":1254.96,"body":"little bit of turmoil where you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1254.96,"endTime":1258.65,"body":"have to, like, try to learn to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1254.96,"endTime":1258.65,"body":"understand yourself as well. So"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1258.65,"endTime":1260.99,"body":"that's, I think, also like kind"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1258.65,"endTime":1260.99,"body":"of an intimidating thing to go"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1260.99,"endTime":1264.77,"body":"through. It's like, I have to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1260.99,"endTime":1264.77,"body":"learn so much in such a short"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1264.77,"endTime":1269.06,"body":"period of time, just to try and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1264.77,"endTime":1269.06,"body":"get through questioning this"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1269.06,"endTime":1269.87,"body":"sort of stuff. You know,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1270.2,"endTime":1271.61,"body":"There's actually a term for"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1270.2,"endTime":1271.61,"body":"that's called the \"Gay"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1271.61,"endTime":1274.61,"body":"Adolescence.\" Because you don't"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1271.61,"endTime":1274.61,"body":"get to develop those"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1274.61,"endTime":1277.73,"body":"relationship skills and talk"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1274.61,"endTime":1277.73,"body":"openly about crushes. Like,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1277.79,"endTime":1282.56,"body":"like, like kids and adolescents"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1277.79,"endTime":1282.56,"body":"do. And so when you come out and"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1282.56,"endTime":1286.4,"body":"try to have those experiences"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1282.56,"endTime":1286.4,"body":"older, it's like, you're 26 but"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1286.4,"endTime":1287.51,"body":"you're acting like you're for"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1286.4,"endTime":1287.51,"body":"14."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1287.51,"endTime":1290.0,"body":"Trial by fire, like"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1287.51,"endTime":1290.0,"body":"learning how to set boundaries."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1290.0,"endTime":1293.99,"body":"And yeah, everything. Yeah, it's"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1290.0,"endTime":1293.99,"body":"interesting. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1294.68,"endTime":1297.77,"body":"Daniel, would you talk to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1294.68,"endTime":1297.77,"body":"us about your experience on a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1297.8,"endTime":1299.54,"body":"reality TV dating show?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1300.38,"endTime":1300.95,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1301.31,"endTime":1302.72,"body":"Yeah, that's good"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1301.31,"endTime":1302.72,"body":"stuff."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1302.81,"endTime":1306.17,"body":"It's funny. Um,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1302.81,"endTime":1306.17,"body":"so I've told this story multiple"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1306.17,"endTime":1309.08,"body":"times. But basically, what ended"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1306.17,"endTime":1309.08,"body":"up happening was that because I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1309.08,"endTime":1313.64,"body":"run the main page and a big main"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1309.08,"endTime":1313.64,"body":"page here in Provo, I kind of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1313.64,"endTime":1316.85,"body":"just tossed it out there on the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1313.64,"endTime":1316.85,"body":"page of like, \"Should I try out"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1316.85,"endTime":1320.81,"body":"for this dating show?\" Haha,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1316.85,"endTime":1320.81,"body":"joke joke joke, not expecting"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1320.81,"endTime":1322.7,"body":"it. I mean, like, obviously, I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1320.81,"endTime":1322.7,"body":"expected it to be like a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1322.7,"endTime":1325.16,"body":"positive response. But I wasn't"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1322.7,"endTime":1325.16,"body":"expecting it to be like,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1325.52,"endTime":1328.91,"body":"exponentially so. I like, to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1325.52,"endTime":1328.91,"body":"lots of people being like,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1328.94,"endTime":1331.58,"body":"\"Please do it. I will watch the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1328.94,"endTime":1331.58,"body":"show for you.\" And I'll say,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1332.24,"endTime":1336.14,"body":"\"Okay.\" And so I sent in an"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1332.24,"endTime":1336.14,"body":"application just being like,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1336.14,"endTime":1340.13,"body":"okay, here's the application."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1336.14,"endTime":1340.13,"body":"And then basically, what ended"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1340.13,"endTime":1344.93,"body":"up happening was Remington, the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1340.13,"endTime":1344.93,"body":"guy who runs it, messaged me and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1344.93,"endTime":1347.81,"body":"was like, \"Hey, come in for the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1344.93,"endTime":1347.81,"body":"first interview.\" And at that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1347.81,"endTime":1350.99,"body":"point, I was like, I'm gonna"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1347.81,"endTime":1350.99,"body":"come out in the next year,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1351.05,"endTime":1353.72,"body":"because I knew at that point, I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1351.05,"endTime":1353.72,"body":"was like, I'm gonna come out"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1353.72,"endTime":1356.48,"body":"soon. I don't know when, but I'm"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1353.72,"endTime":1356.48,"body":"gonna come out. And and that I,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1356.48,"endTime":1359.03,"body":"you know, at that point, I had"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1356.48,"endTime":1359.03,"body":"accepted who I was, I wasn't"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1359.03,"endTime":1361.25,"body":"dating girls anymore. I was just"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1359.03,"endTime":1361.25,"body":"like, I'm just gonna live my"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1361.25,"endTime":1367.13,"body":"life and not care about all this"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1361.25,"endTime":1367.13,"body":"mess. Right? So at that point, I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1367.13,"endTime":1370.64,"body":"was in denial. So I missed the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1367.13,"endTime":1370.64,"body":"first appointment. And then I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1370.64,"endTime":1372.62,"body":"was talking to my sister, and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1370.64,"endTime":1372.62,"body":"she was just like, \"Look, it's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1372.62,"endTime":1376.79,"body":"gonna be a fun experience."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1372.62,"endTime":1376.79,"body":"Obviously, people like you. Just"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1376.79,"endTime":1380.09,"body":"do it. It'll be fun. If worse"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1376.79,"endTime":1380.09,"body":"comes to worse, you stay on for"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1380.09,"endTime":1383.12,"body":"a couple weeks, and then she"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1380.09,"endTime":1383.12,"body":"doesn't want you. Right?\" And I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1383.12,"endTime":1384.59,"body":"was like, \"Yeah, that's true."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1383.12,"endTime":1384.59,"body":"Okay. Yeah.\""},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1385.31,"endTime":1386.09,"body":"That always happens."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1386.09,"endTime":1387.56,"body":"She won't like"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1386.09,"endTime":1387.56,"body":"me, I'm a terrible person."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1388.46,"endTime":1390.23,"body":"\"The worse\" could have"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1388.46,"endTime":1390.23,"body":"actually been that she picked"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1390.23,"endTime":1390.38,"body":"you."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1391.14,"endTime":1394.47,"body":"Scary. So Well,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1391.14,"endTime":1394.47,"body":"that was the thing. So I go in"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1394.47,"endTime":1396.84,"body":"for the second interview, and I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1394.47,"endTime":1396.84,"body":"was like, Okay, this is dope."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1397.14,"endTime":1400.35,"body":"Because I also went into the,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1397.14,"endTime":1400.35,"body":"with the mentality of like, even"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1400.35,"endTime":1403.56,"body":"if I do come out, at least I'll"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1400.35,"endTime":1403.56,"body":"have the positive. If I show"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1403.56,"endTime":1406.47,"body":"myself in a positive light, that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1403.56,"endTime":1406.47,"body":"maybe when I do come out, it'll"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1406.47,"endTime":1411.18,"body":"be like a more positive thing,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1406.47,"endTime":1411.18,"body":"you know? And so I was like,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1411.18,"endTime":1414.78,"body":"yeah, we'll just do this. Go in"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1411.18,"endTime":1414.78,"body":"for the second interview, get"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1414.78,"endTime":1418.89,"body":"in, and we start filming. And it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1414.78,"endTime":1418.89,"body":"goes from like, one week, and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1418.89,"endTime":1421.11,"body":"I'm like, \"Okay, they're gonna"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1418.89,"endTime":1421.11,"body":"keep me for another week,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1421.11,"endTime":1423.96,"body":"because I'm the funny fat guy.\""},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1421.11,"endTime":1423.96,"body":"You know, like, oh, I'm the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1424.02,"endTime":1427.71,"body":"social media guy. And they have"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1424.02,"endTime":1427.71,"body":"multiple of us. So I was like,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1427.74,"endTime":1431.31,"body":"\"They have enough. They don't"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1427.74,"endTime":1431.31,"body":"need me,\" right? And then second"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1431.31,"endTime":1434.67,"body":"week came, then the third week"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1431.31,"endTime":1434.67,"body":"came and the fourth week."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1434.7,"endTime":1435.48,"body":"Ooh, I'm still in this."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1436.71,"endTime":1437.76,"body":"Well, that was"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1436.71,"endTime":1437.76,"body":"the thing..."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1440.07,"endTime":1441.54,"body":"You're like, why am I so"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1440.07,"endTime":1441.54,"body":"lovable?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1440.6,"endTime":1442.67,"body":"And I honestly"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1440.6,"endTime":1442.67,"body":"look back at it. I was like, I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1442.67,"endTime":1447.35,"body":"think I was just like, the gay"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1442.67,"endTime":1447.35,"body":"best friend to be, the girl just"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1447.35,"endTime":1451.04,"body":"because, yeah. All throughout"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1447.35,"endTime":1451.04,"body":"that experience. She was like,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1451.1,"endTime":1453.89,"body":"coming to me for advice and just"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1451.1,"endTime":1453.89,"body":"being like, \"What do you think?\""},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1453.89,"endTime":1455.84,"body":"Like, I don't know. Like, she"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1453.89,"endTime":1455.84,"body":"wasn't coming to me because she"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1455.84,"endTime":1459.14,"body":"was like--I think at a certain"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1455.84,"endTime":1459.14,"body":"point, she wanted to kind of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1459.14,"endTime":1462.11,"body":"maybe try and develop a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1459.14,"endTime":1462.11,"body":"relationship. But at that point,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1462.14,"endTime":1465.89,"body":"I was like, \"I'm done with th"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1462.14,"endTime":1465.89,"body":"show. I don't want to fil"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1465.89,"endTime":1469.7,"body":"anymore. I'm busy. Like, this i"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1465.89,"endTime":1469.7,"body":"spring/summer, you know?\" You"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1469.7,"endTime":1471.53,"body":"o, you want to tell her because"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1469.7,"endTime":1471.53,"body":"you're like."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1475.05,"endTime":1476.25,"body":"So she didn't know the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1475.05,"endTime":1476.25,"body":"whole time?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1476.0,"endTime":1478.58,"body":"No, she"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1476.0,"endTime":1478.58,"body":"didn't...Yeah, I've talked to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1478.58,"endTime":1481.19,"body":"her. She said she didn't know at"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1478.58,"endTime":1481.19,"body":"all. And so I was like, okay,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1481.46,"endTime":1483.89,"body":"and that was the thing at the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1481.46,"endTime":1483.89,"body":"karaoke date, which is like the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1483.89,"endTime":1486.02,"body":"signature date where everyone"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1483.89,"endTime":1486.02,"body":"thought that we were like..."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1486.11,"endTime":1486.86,"body":"I remember that."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1486.86,"endTime":1487.7,"body":"Falling in love."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1487.82,"endTime":1488.21,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1489.53,"endTime":1492.5,"body":"At that point, I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1489.53,"endTime":1492.5,"body":"was like, \"Hey, I really want to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1492.5,"endTime":1495.23,"body":"leave the show. Like I'm just"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1492.5,"endTime":1495.23,"body":"getting super hectically busy."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1495.23,"endTime":1497.36,"body":"And I don't want to tell the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1495.23,"endTime":1497.36,"body":"producers can you just eliminate"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1497.36,"endTime":1500.33,"body":"me this week?\" She was like,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1497.36,"endTime":1500.33,"body":"\"Yeah, I can do that.\" Good"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1500.33,"endTime":1503.57,"body":"friend, convo, you know, just"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1500.33,"endTime":1503.57,"body":"like get it out of the way. And"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1503.57,"endTime":1508.1,"body":"then we had some drama go down"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1503.57,"endTime":1508.1,"body":"where this guy betrayed that...."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1508.37,"endTime":1509.54,"body":"On a reality show?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1509.57,"endTime":1510.44,"body":"Can you even imagine?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1511.14,"endTime":1514.17,"body":"Well betrayed as"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1511.14,"endTime":1514.17,"body":"well, like, it was, it was super"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1514.17,"endTime":1517.68,"body":"weird. But, uh, so they had to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1514.17,"endTime":1517.68,"body":"keep me on for an extra week."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1517.68,"endTime":1521.55,"body":"And I'd remember just dreading"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1517.68,"endTime":1521.55,"body":"it. Like, I have to talk, talk"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1521.55,"endTime":1524.76,"body":"again with all these people. Not"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1521.55,"endTime":1524.76,"body":"that I hated them or didn't like"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1524.76,"endTime":1527.37,"body":"it, it just was, it became like,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1524.76,"endTime":1527.37,"body":"tiring, because at that same"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1527.37,"endTime":1531.48,"body":"point, like, I was like, I'm"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1527.37,"endTime":1531.48,"body":"just over this--like this is so"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1531.48,"endTime":1534.51,"body":"it's hard to fake as well."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1531.48,"endTime":1534.51,"body":"Right? Like, and that was the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1534.51,"endTime":1537.09,"body":"thing, like watching it back"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1534.51,"endTime":1537.09,"body":"too--is like, you could see"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1537.42,"endTime":1540.54,"body":"parts of me that were gay"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1537.42,"endTime":1540.54,"body":"throughout. Like all the people"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1540.54,"endTime":1542.88,"body":"that are like, my non-member"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1540.54,"endTime":1542.88,"body":"friends have watched it back."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1542.88,"endTime":1548.94,"body":"And they're like, \"Dog, it's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1542.88,"endTime":1548.94,"body":"like, pretty obvious.\" But, uh,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1549.45,"endTime":1553.62,"body":"yeah, and that and on that last"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1549.45,"endTime":1553.62,"body":"day, when I got eliminated, I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1553.62,"endTime":1555.84,"body":"told her, I was like, \"This is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1553.62,"endTime":1555.84,"body":"who I think you should pick.\""},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1556.47,"endTime":1560.55,"body":"And I remember going home that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1556.47,"endTime":1560.55,"body":"night and for the first time, I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1560.55,"endTime":1563.94,"body":"was like, \"I need to come out"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1560.55,"endTime":1563.94,"body":"like NOW.\" Like, that was the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1563.94,"endTime":1567.48,"body":"first time I'd ever been like,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1563.94,"endTime":1567.48,"body":"I'm done with lying. I'm done"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1567.48,"endTime":1570.03,"body":"doing all this sort of stuff."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1567.48,"endTime":1570.03,"body":"And I messaged my aunt who's a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1570.03,"endTime":1573.9,"body":"lesbian. And I was like, \"Hey,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1570.03,"endTime":1573.9,"body":"I'm thinking of coming out.\" And"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1573.9,"endTime":1576.93,"body":"she doesn't know at this point."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1573.9,"endTime":1576.93,"body":"And so we just got on the phone"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1576.93,"endTime":1580.53,"body":"for a very long time. And she"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1576.93,"endTime":1580.53,"body":"was like, \"Look, I'm not going"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1580.53,"endTime":1583.32,"body":"to give--like, I'm not going to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1580.53,"endTime":1583.32,"body":"give you advice that I don't"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1583.32,"endTime":1586.74,"body":"think I should give you. I think"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1583.32,"endTime":1586.74,"body":"you should wait a little bit."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1586.77,"endTime":1590.67,"body":"You can if you want to. But just"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1586.77,"endTime":1590.67,"body":"remember, you're at BYU. It's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1590.67,"endTime":1595.41,"body":"not exactly like, you can wait a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1590.67,"endTime":1595.41,"body":"little bit, like a little while,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1595.44,"endTime":1598.86,"body":"right?\" And I was like, \"That's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1595.44,"endTime":1598.86,"body":"true.\" I can wait until I come"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1598.86,"endTime":1604.32,"body":"out. That'll be fine. But then,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1598.86,"endTime":1604.32,"body":"as the show started, I guess,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1606.54,"endTime":1610.26,"body":"airing--over time, I was just"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1606.54,"endTime":1610.26,"body":"like, this is kind of like a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1610.26,"endTime":1612.9,"body":"little bit of a crazy situation."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1610.26,"endTime":1612.9,"body":"But people started showing a lot"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1612.9,"endTime":1616.74,"body":"more support for me. I became a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1612.9,"endTime":1616.74,"body":"fan favorite, like immediately."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1617.01,"endTime":1617.88,"body":"Obviously."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1617.93,"endTime":1620.69,"body":"Well, I was just"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1617.93,"endTime":1620.69,"body":"again, like nice, likeable,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1620.69,"endTime":1625.1,"body":"like, it was because I wasn't"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1620.69,"endTime":1625.1,"body":"acting like a regular guy. I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1625.1,"endTime":1629.06,"body":"wasn't being like uncomfortable,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1625.1,"endTime":1629.06,"body":"a weird, I wasn't like pushing"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1629.06,"endTime":1633.02,"body":"boundaries or trying to flirt or"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1629.06,"endTime":1633.02,"body":"touch knees or kiss. Like it was"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1633.02,"endTime":1635.6,"body":"such a weird, like, there was"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1633.02,"endTime":1635.6,"body":"some weird moments with other"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1635.6,"endTime":1638.6,"body":"guys who were straight because"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1635.6,"endTime":1638.6,"body":"they're trying so hard. And with"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1638.6,"endTime":1641.9,"body":"me, I wasn't trying. And so"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1638.6,"endTime":1641.9,"body":"everyone was like, \"He's so kind"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1641.9,"endTime":1645.32,"body":"and gentle and look at him. He's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1641.9,"endTime":1645.32,"body":"really gives her the space to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1645.32,"endTime":1650.99,"body":"live.\" And that was another"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1645.32,"endTime":1650.99,"body":"thing was that everyone was"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1650.99,"endTime":1655.67,"body":"like, \"His jackets are amazing."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1650.99,"endTime":1655.67,"body":"Wow.\" But uh, yeah. And so as it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1655.67,"endTime":1658.19,"body":"started airing, I was like, I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1655.67,"endTime":1658.19,"body":"should come out. I should tell"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1658.19,"endTime":1660.98,"body":"people right now, like now's a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1658.19,"endTime":1660.98,"body":"good time, because everyone"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1660.98,"endTime":1665.96,"body":"likes me. So, you know, at least"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1660.98,"endTime":1665.96,"body":"I'm like at the peak, right? And"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1665.99,"endTime":1668.15,"body":"if something goes wrong, it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1665.99,"endTime":1668.15,"body":"doesn't have to go as wrong as"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1668.15,"endTime":1672.71,"body":"it could at another time. And so"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1668.15,"endTime":1672.71,"body":"I came out. Super positive"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1672.71,"endTime":1676.34,"body":"experience. I actually messaged"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1672.71,"endTime":1676.34,"body":"a lot of the people from the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1676.34,"endTime":1680.15,"body":"show that I was friends with at"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1676.34,"endTime":1680.15,"body":"the time, told them they were"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1680.15,"endTime":1684.35,"body":"super supportive. Bea, the girl,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1680.15,"endTime":1684.35,"body":"was like, \"Oh my gosh, I love"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1684.35,"endTime":1686.93,"body":"you. Like, that's why I wanted"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1684.35,"endTime":1686.93,"body":"to keep you around. You were"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1686.93,"endTime":1691.01,"body":"just so positive.\" So it was"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1686.93,"endTime":1691.01,"body":"really fun. It was like a really"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1691.01,"endTime":1693.65,"body":"good experience. And it kind of,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1691.01,"endTime":1693.65,"body":"I think it really just shows you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1693.65,"endTime":1696.44,"body":"like how accepting people are,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1693.65,"endTime":1696.44,"body":"or more accepting people are"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1697.01,"endTime":1698.93,"body":"becoming--at least in this"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1697.01,"endTime":1698.93,"body":"community. It's like it's really"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1698.93,"endTime":1699.5,"body":"cool to see."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1699.62,"endTime":1704.09,"body":"This night when--so I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1699.62,"endTime":1704.09,"body":"actually, we're friends. I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1704.09,"endTime":1707.12,"body":"don't--I guess we're just"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1704.09,"endTime":1707.12,"body":"friends because we're both BYU"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1707.15,"endTime":1707.72,"body":"gays."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1710.18,"endTime":1712.49,"body":"Well, that's how"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1710.18,"endTime":1712.49,"body":"we connected. Like, we're both"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1712.49,"endTime":1712.55,"body":"gay!"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1712.99,"endTime":1716.98,"body":"Like, like, you're like"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1712.99,"endTime":1716.98,"body":"me! But before you came out, and"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1716.98,"endTime":1719.32,"body":"I like--hope you don't take this"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1716.98,"endTime":1719.32,"body":"the wrong way--but I was like,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1719.32,"endTime":1722.02,"body":"yeah, I figured you were gay."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1719.32,"endTime":1722.02,"body":"Because I can sense you know."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1722.41,"endTime":1726.73,"body":"And I'd watched a couple of"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1722.41,"endTime":1726.73,"body":"episodes. I went to a showing at"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1726.85,"endTime":1729.04,"body":"one of your friend's apartments"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1726.85,"endTime":1729.04,"body":"over there and then Bea came"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1729.04,"endTime":1730.51,"body":"over. Did she know?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1731.26,"endTime":1731.92,"body":"At that point?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1731.92,"endTime":1734.83,"body":"At that point? Because"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1731.92,"endTime":1734.83,"body":"this is this is before you came"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1734.83,"endTime":1734.89,"body":"out."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1734.89,"endTime":1735.97,"body":"Yeah, that was"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1734.89,"endTime":1735.97,"body":"before I came out."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1736.0,"endTime":1738.85,"body":"Yeah. I'm just curious."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1739.03,"endTime":1740.89,"body":"I don't know. To"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1739.03,"endTime":1740.89,"body":"be honest with you, she told me"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1740.89,"endTime":1743.98,"body":"that her \"gaydar\" is completely"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1740.89,"endTime":1743.98,"body":"off. Because some people have it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1743.98,"endTime":1746.29,"body":"too. Like, straight people, or"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1743.98,"endTime":1746.29,"body":"at least they've been around gay"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1746.29,"endTime":1749.41,"body":"people so much. And apparently"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1746.29,"endTime":1749.41,"body":"she has a gay cousin. So you"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1749.41,"endTime":1752.95,"body":"know, she was like, \"I was"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1749.41,"endTime":1752.95,"body":"totally oblivious to it.\" But I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1752.95,"endTime":1755.53,"body":"think that's also because Bea"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1752.95,"endTime":1755.53,"body":"just like, she wanted to give me"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1755.53,"endTime":1757.69,"body":"the benefit of the doubt and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1755.53,"endTime":1757.69,"body":"saying, well...."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1757.51,"endTime":1758.98,"body":"He is on a dating show."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1759.01,"endTime":1761.71,"body":"Yeah, like maybe"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1759.01,"endTime":1761.71,"body":"he's just different. So but"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1761.71,"endTime":1764.8,"body":"again, I had no attraction to"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1761.71,"endTime":1764.8,"body":"her. And I think she sensed that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1764.8,"endTime":1767.74,"body":"the whole time. So she was like,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1764.8,"endTime":1767.74,"body":"\"He's just not attracted.\" So I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1767.74,"endTime":1768.07,"body":"was like..."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1768.16,"endTime":1769.33,"body":"An interesting"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1768.16,"endTime":1769.33,"body":"experience."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1769.0,"endTime":1771.94,"body":"Yeah, one things I just"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1769.0,"endTime":1771.94,"body":"want to add is, you know, when I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1771.94,"endTime":1775.57,"body":"was in when I was on my mission,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1771.94,"endTime":1775.57,"body":"my brother wrote songs for each"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1775.57,"endTime":1778.36,"body":"of the siblings for Christmas"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1775.57,"endTime":1778.36,"body":"one year, and the song he wrote"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1778.36,"endTime":1780.97,"body":"for me was called \"Not Gay.\""},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1778.36,"endTime":1780.97,"body":"Because it's about all the"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1780.97,"endTime":1783.16,"body":"things that I did that would"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1780.97,"endTime":1783.16,"body":"make you think that I was gay,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1783.16,"endTime":1786.52,"body":"but I wasn't. And, you know, as"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1783.16,"endTime":1786.52,"body":"we talk about like \"gaydar,\""},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1786.55,"endTime":1789.52,"body":"gaydar often just like noticing"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1786.55,"endTime":1789.52,"body":"stereotypes. Yeah. And there are"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1789.52,"endTime":1792.04,"body":"a lot of people who who are gay"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1789.52,"endTime":1792.04,"body":"who don't fit into those"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1792.04,"endTime":1795.61,"body":"stereotypes and, and don't"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1792.04,"endTime":1795.61,"body":"exhibit feminine characteristics"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1795.61,"endTime":1799.42,"body":"or don't like Barbies. And so,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1795.61,"endTime":1799.42,"body":"yeah, I think gaydar is just"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1799.42,"endTime":1801.07,"body":"being really good at"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1799.42,"endTime":1801.07,"body":"stereotypes."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1801.22,"endTime":1801.67,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1802.59,"endTime":1805.47,"body":"I am thinking about"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1802.59,"endTime":1805.47,"body":"this this question, \"Am I gay?\""},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1805.47,"endTime":1809.58,"body":"And that's a, something that I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1805.47,"endTime":1809.58,"body":"really wrestled with a lot of"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1809.58,"endTime":1813.9,"body":"the time. And I think, looking"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1809.58,"endTime":1813.9,"body":"back, like I knew the whole"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1813.9,"endTime":1818.64,"body":"time. I think the wrestle was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1813.9,"endTime":1818.64,"body":"that I, it the thought of that"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1818.64,"endTime":1821.67,"body":"filled me with shame, and made"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1818.64,"endTime":1821.67,"body":"me feel broken and not lovable"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1821.67,"endTime":1826.41,"body":"and not good enough. And I think"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1821.67,"endTime":1826.41,"body":"that's why i forcefully got in"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1826.41,"endTime":1830.34,"body":"my head so much, and would"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1826.41,"endTime":1830.34,"body":"constantly question and double"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1830.34,"endTime":1833.64,"body":"check if I was gay or not,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1830.34,"endTime":1833.64,"body":"because I really didn't want to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1833.64,"endTime":1838.14,"body":"be and I was trying so hard not"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1833.64,"endTime":1838.14,"body":"to be. I used to take these"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1838.14,"endTime":1841.8,"body":"little quizzes on like a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1838.14,"endTime":1841.8,"body":"BuzzFeed quiz. Are you gay? And"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1841.8,"endTime":1844.14,"body":"I would take the quiz and it"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1841.8,"endTime":1844.14,"body":"asked just like ridiculous"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1844.17,"endTime":1848.88,"body":"things, like do you--basically"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1844.17,"endTime":1848.88,"body":"stereotypes, right? And then,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1849.36,"endTime":1851.52,"body":"most of the time, the last"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1849.36,"endTime":1851.52,"body":"question is, like, \"Are you"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1851.52,"endTime":1856.32,"body":"attracted to the same sex?\" And"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1851.52,"endTime":1856.32,"body":"I'd be like, \"No,\" and then"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1856.32,"endTime":1862.32,"body":"submit. And then it would say,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1856.32,"endTime":1862.32,"body":"\"You're not gay.\" Yes!"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1862.32,"endTime":1863.28,"body":"And then you're"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1862.32,"endTime":1863.28,"body":"like, yeah."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1864.78,"endTime":1868.92,"body":"And I just did that."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1864.78,"endTime":1868.92,"body":"It's, like, kind of hurt for"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1869.46,"endTime":1872.64,"body":"teenage me who was trying so"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1869.46,"endTime":1872.64,"body":"hard to convince myself that I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1873.03,"endTime":1875.25,"body":"wasn't--when I wish it was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1873.03,"endTime":1875.25,"body":"something that I could have"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1875.25,"endTime":1881.64,"body":"just, you know, like, owned and"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1875.25,"endTime":1881.64,"body":"been okay with and, and started"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1881.64,"endTime":1887.4,"body":"earlier to use who I am at full"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1881.64,"endTime":1887.4,"body":"capacity to create relationships"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1887.43,"endTime":1890.79,"body":"and reach out to people and, and"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1887.43,"endTime":1890.79,"body":"be a source of light."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1891.44,"endTime":1893.3,"body":"And looking back on my"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1891.44,"endTime":1893.3,"body":"life, because it was a long"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1893.3,"endTime":1896.9,"body":"process, I don't think I got rid"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1893.3,"endTime":1896.9,"body":"of the idea that being gay was a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1896.9,"endTime":1901.97,"body":"phase until I was like 29, or"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1896.9,"endTime":1901.97,"body":"30. And that was those years,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1901.97,"endTime":1905.24,"body":"like, they weren't wasted years."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1901.97,"endTime":1905.24,"body":"They were good years. And I had"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1905.24,"endTime":1908.33,"body":"a lot of good experiences,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1905.24,"endTime":1908.33,"body":"dating women. Hopefully, they"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1908.33,"endTime":1912.71,"body":"had good experiences too. And"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1908.33,"endTime":1912.71,"body":"like looking back, I'm not sure"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1913.82,"endTime":1916.19,"body":"what--it feels like, it'd be"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1913.82,"endTime":1916.19,"body":"nice if I just like accepted"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1916.19,"endTime":1919.31,"body":"that fact a lot earlier. But at"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1916.19,"endTime":1919.31,"body":"the same time, my life"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1919.31,"endTime":1921.74,"body":"experience has brought me to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1919.31,"endTime":1921.74,"body":"where I am. And I'm grateful to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1921.74,"endTime":1925.76,"body":"be where I am. And, and this can"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1921.74,"endTime":1925.76,"body":"be like answering the question."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1925.79,"endTime":1929.06,"body":"Am I gay? For a lot for some"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1925.79,"endTime":1929.06,"body":"people could be a really long"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1929.06,"endTime":1930.35,"body":"process, and that's okay."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1930.53,"endTime":1933.86,"body":"Yeah, that's a good"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1930.53,"endTime":1933.86,"body":"insight. Any final thoughts"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1933.86,"endTime":1935.69,"body":"about \"Are you gay?\""},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1937.16,"endTime":1938.21,"body":"So Daniel, are you gay?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1938.75,"endTime":1943.97,"body":"I am gay. I'm"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1938.75,"endTime":1943.97,"body":"gay. Uh, I think I just, I think"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1943.97,"endTime":1947.3,"body":"it's just cool. It's kind of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1943.97,"endTime":1947.3,"body":"cool to see that people are a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1947.3,"endTime":1950.72,"body":"little being a little more open"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1947.3,"endTime":1950.72,"body":"with the idea nowadays, at least"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1950.72,"endTime":1955.4,"body":"that like, you know, people are"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1950.72,"endTime":1955.4,"body":"helping other people who are"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1955.4,"endTime":1961.25,"body":"going through being gay in our"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1955.4,"endTime":1961.25,"body":"community, right? Like, there's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1961.25,"endTime":1965.06,"body":"way more support for it then"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1961.25,"endTime":1965.06,"body":"when I first came here to BYU,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1965.06,"endTime":1968.24,"body":"like it was it was like, scary"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1965.06,"endTime":1968.24,"body":"again, you want to shove it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1968.24,"endTime":1968.87,"body":"down? You I mean..."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1968.87,"endTime":1970.73,"body":"I waited till after I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1968.87,"endTime":1970.73,"body":"graduated to come out."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1970.82,"endTime":1972.56,"body":"Well, that's the"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1970.82,"endTime":1972.56,"body":"thing like now,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1973.16,"endTime":1974.69,"body":"I've graduated twice before"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1973.16,"endTime":1974.69,"body":"I came out."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1976.37,"endTime":1977.27,"body":"He's always gotta one"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1976.37,"endTime":1977.27,"body":"up."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1978.41,"endTime":1981.29,"body":"Well, I think"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1978.41,"endTime":1981.29,"body":"about that, like, this week. I'm"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1981.29,"endTime":1984.35,"body":"having a party where I just"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1981.29,"endTime":1984.35,"body":"invited a bunch of kids who I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1984.35,"endTime":1987.59,"body":"know who have come out now. And"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1984.35,"endTime":1987.59,"body":"I think that's kind of a really"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1987.59,"endTime":1991.34,"body":"cool experience, just because..."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1991.4,"endTime":1992.66,"body":"Is this your way of"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1991.4,"endTime":1992.66,"body":"inviting me?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1992.69,"endTime":1996.08,"body":"Yeah, this is my"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1992.69,"endTime":1996.08,"body":"way of inviting you guys. But it"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1996.08,"endTime":2000.1,"body":"is just like a cool experience"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":1996.08,"endTime":2000.1,"body":"to kind of have, have, at least,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2000.46,"endTime":2001.03,"body":"Community."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2001.0,"endTime":2002.86,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2001.0,"endTime":2002.86,"body":"relatability I remember when we"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2002.86,"endTime":2005.53,"body":"first talked, it was just yeah,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2002.86,"endTime":2005.53,"body":"I mean, it was cool to have"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2005.53,"endTime":2008.29,"body":"someone that like had gone"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2005.53,"endTime":2008.29,"body":"through similar experiences. And"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2008.29,"endTime":2011.65,"body":"so I think that's all it's about"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2008.29,"endTime":2011.65,"body":"is just simply trying to build a"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2011.65,"endTime":2014.68,"body":"community to the point where we"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2011.65,"endTime":2014.68,"body":"can be like, comfortable with"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2014.68,"endTime":2017.59,"body":"it. And we can all like, share"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2014.68,"endTime":2017.59,"body":"those experiences, because they"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2017.59,"endTime":2021.01,"body":"are funny, and they are like"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2017.59,"endTime":2021.01,"body":"weird. It is a weird thing to go"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2021.01,"endTime":2025.0,"body":"through. Right? Like, all of"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2021.01,"endTime":2025.0,"body":"that stuff is weird. And yes, is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2025.0,"endTime":2027.52,"body":"some of it traumatic? Yes. And,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2025.0,"endTime":2027.52,"body":"is some of it like a little like"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2027.52,"endTime":2030.82,"body":"a little negative? Of course."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2027.52,"endTime":2030.82,"body":"But at the end of the day, like"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2030.91,"endTime":2033.19,"body":"you can find the humor in that."},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2030.91,"endTime":2033.19,"body":"And that's why I like comedy,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2033.37,"endTime":2037.03,"body":"because--I did a set at Humor U"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2033.37,"endTime":2037.03,"body":"the other day about the gay"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2037.03,"endTime":2040.27,"body":"agenda, not a winning, right?"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2037.03,"endTime":2040.27,"body":"Like, not actually existing,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2040.27,"endTime":2042.73,"body":"right? Because it's like, it's"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2040.27,"endTime":2042.73,"body":"just a concept that we've"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2042.73,"endTime":2046.21,"body":"created to try and explain that"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2042.73,"endTime":2046.21,"body":"like gay people are just very"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2046.21,"endTime":2048.97,"body":"entertaining, right? Like,"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2046.21,"endTime":2048.97,"body":"that's essentially it. And I"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2048.97,"endTime":2052.21,"body":"think that's the whole point is"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2048.97,"endTime":2052.21,"body":"just like, we need to remove, as"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2052.21,"endTime":2055.18,"body":"you said before stereotypes and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2052.21,"endTime":2055.18,"body":"weird ideas that we have"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2055.51,"endTime":2058.66,"body":"preconceived notions about what"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2055.51,"endTime":2058.66,"body":"it is and just try to build"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2058.96,"endTime":2062.74,"body":"around love and light and"},{"speaker":"Daniel Spencer","startTime":2058.96,"endTime":2062.74,"body":"positive experiences. Now,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2063.11,"endTime":2065.54,"body":"We're glad you took the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2063.11,"endTime":2065.54,"body":"time to try to hopefully"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2066.68,"endTime":2068.45,"body":"this--us being here and having"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2066.68,"endTime":2068.45,"body":"this conversation will lead to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2068.45,"endTime":2069.62,"body":"more community. So thank you."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2070.19,"endTime":2073.28,"body":"We appreciate you, Daniel."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2070.19,"endTime":2073.28,"body":"Thank you for joining us today."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2073.31,"endTime":2075.71,"body":"Please remember that we do not"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2073.31,"endTime":2075.71,"body":"represent the Church of Jesus"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2075.71,"endTime":2078.59,"body":"Christ of Latter-day Saints or"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2075.71,"endTime":2078.59,"body":"Brigham Young University. We are"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2078.59,"endTime":2081.32,"body":"not trying to be prescriptive or"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2078.59,"endTime":2081.32,"body":"tell anyone what to think or"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2081.0,"endTime":2084.39,"body":"Today, you heard three"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2081.0,"endTime":2084.39,"body":"perspectives and there are many,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2081.32,"endTime":2081.86,"body":"what to do."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2084.39,"endTime":2087.09,"body":"many more. We encourage you to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2084.39,"endTime":2087.09,"body":"listen to other voices and hear"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2087.09,"endTime":2089.88,"body":"a wide variety of experiences."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2087.09,"endTime":2089.88,"body":"If you would like to submit a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2089.88,"endTime":2092.61,"body":"question or share a comment"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2089.88,"endTime":2092.61,"body":"about today's episode, you can"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2092.61,"endTime":2095.31,"body":"email us at"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2092.61,"endTime":2095.31,"body":"questionsfromthecloset@gmail.com."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2095.91,"endTime":2096.63,"body":"Until next time..."}]}