{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":5.67,"endTime":7.95,"body":"Welcome to questions"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":5.67,"endTime":7.95,"body":"from the closet. I'm Charlie"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":7.95,"endTime":8.25,"body":"Bird."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":8.55,"endTime":11.67,"body":"And I'm Ben Schilaty. Each"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":8.55,"endTime":11.67,"body":"episode we discuss a question"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":11.67,"endTime":14.58,"body":"that we commonly get asked as"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":11.67,"endTime":14.58,"body":"LGBTQ Latter-day Saints."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":15.12,"endTime":17.13,"body":"We're not trying to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":15.12,"endTime":17.13,"body":"answer this question or come to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":17.13,"endTime":19.59,"body":"a consensus but simply sharing"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":17.13,"endTime":19.59,"body":"our perspectives."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":20.25,"endTime":22.74,"body":"The question we're"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":20.25,"endTime":22.74,"body":"discussing today is, what does"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":22.74,"endTime":24.03,"body":"it mean to be bisexual?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":24.78,"endTime":26.82,"body":"Ben and I are not"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":24.78,"endTime":26.82,"body":"terribly diverse and we share"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":26.82,"endTime":29.49,"body":"many of the same opinions and"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":26.82,"endTime":29.49,"body":"life experiences."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":30.03,"endTime":32.64,"body":"For example, Charlie and I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":30.03,"endTime":32.64,"body":"both grew up in white middle"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":32.64,"endTime":33.39,"body":"class America."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":33.72,"endTime":36.45,"body":"However, there are some"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":33.72,"endTime":36.45,"body":"pretty big differences. For"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":36.45,"endTime":39.6,"body":"example, I was raised on a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":36.45,"endTime":39.6,"body":"ranch, and Ben was raised in a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":39.6,"endTime":40.68,"body":"ranch style house."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":41.02,"endTime":45.64,"body":"Also commonly known as a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":41.02,"endTime":45.64,"body":"\"the ranches.\" Typically, we"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":45.64,"endTime":50.56,"body":"record this podcast from a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":45.64,"endTime":50.56,"body":"studio, but because of the"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":50.56,"endTime":54.79,"body":"Coronavirus, we are actually in"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":50.56,"endTime":54.79,"body":"different states. And we have"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":54.79,"endTime":58.54,"body":"heard that it's better to record"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":54.79,"endTime":58.54,"body":"podcasts in a closet because"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":58.54,"endTime":61.72,"body":"that way the sound doesn't"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":58.54,"endTime":61.72,"body":"vibrate as much because the"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":61.72,"endTime":64.24,"body":"clothes absorb the sound. So I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":61.72,"endTime":64.24,"body":"actually I don't have there's"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":64.24,"endTime":66.91,"body":"not a closet in the house I'm in"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":64.24,"endTime":66.91,"body":"that's big enough for me. I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":67.72,"endTime":69.91,"body":"actually made a blanket a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":67.72,"endTime":69.91,"body":"blanket fort I'm sitting in"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":69.91,"endTime":70.36,"body":"right now."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":70.51,"endTime":72.37,"body":"Is it the ranch style"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":70.51,"endTime":72.37,"body":"house that you grew up in?"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":72.46,"endTime":74.56,"body":"Yes, I am in the ranch"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":72.46,"endTime":74.56,"body":"style house I grew up in with my"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":74.56,"endTime":75.25,"body":"parents."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":75.55,"endTime":77.35,"body":"That's great. I'm"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":75.55,"endTime":77.35,"body":"coming at you from my actual"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":77.35,"endTime":81.1,"body":"closet here in Missouri. And"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":77.35,"endTime":81.1,"body":"today, we have Vinnie with us."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":81.28,"endTime":82.78,"body":"And Vinnie, where are you coming"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":81.28,"endTime":82.78,"body":"from?"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":83.4,"endTime":87.87,"body":"I am also in a closet"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":83.4,"endTime":87.87,"body":"near San Francisco, California."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":88.47,"endTime":90.48,"body":"Perfect. We're so"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":88.47,"endTime":90.48,"body":"excited to have you on."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":90.599,"endTime":92.039,"body":"And we're sorry to put you"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":90.599,"endTime":92.039,"body":"back in a closet."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":94.53,"endTime":96.63,"body":"It's been a while since"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":94.53,"endTime":96.63,"body":"I've been here, but happy to be"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":96.63,"endTime":96.93,"body":"here."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":98.01,"endTime":99.57,"body":"So can you tell us"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":98.01,"endTime":99.57,"body":"something that you're passionate"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":99.57,"endTime":99.9,"body":"about?"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":100.47,"endTime":104.04,"body":"I'm passionate about"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":100.47,"endTime":104.04,"body":"creating and creating art and"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":104.04,"endTime":108.51,"body":"creating, creating a world that"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":104.04,"endTime":108.51,"body":"is better and different than the"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":108.51,"endTime":112.05,"body":"world that we started with. I'm"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":108.51,"endTime":112.05,"body":"a choreographer and a dancer. So"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":112.86,"endTime":115.5,"body":"I use human bodies to create"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":112.86,"endTime":115.5,"body":"things."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":116.19,"endTime":117.78,"body":"Y'all should see me"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":116.19,"endTime":117.78,"body":"smiling."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":119.52,"endTime":122.34,"body":"I mean, I don't have"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":119.52,"endTime":122.34,"body":"Charlie's dance moves. But I do"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":122.34,"endTime":123.18,"body":"have some of my own."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":123.479,"endTime":125.129,"body":"I mean, you're much"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":123.479,"endTime":125.129,"body":"better than me."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":125.49,"endTime":127.62,"body":"I'm different styles,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":125.49,"endTime":127.62,"body":"different styles. Hard to"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":127.62,"endTime":128.07,"body":"compare."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":128.429,"endTime":129.929,"body":"What style do you"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":128.429,"endTime":129.929,"body":"typically dance?"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":129.03,"endTime":133.08,"body":"Ballet--contemporary"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":129.03,"endTime":133.08,"body":"ballet, the one I do, like"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":133.08,"endTime":134.76,"body":"professionally as my art."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":135.09,"endTime":135.84,"body":"Beautiful."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":136.71,"endTime":138.84,"body":"Vinnie can I tell story"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":136.71,"endTime":138.84,"body":"when you and I were roommates?"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":139.11,"endTime":141.45,"body":"Oh, absolutely. Ab"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":139.11,"endTime":141.45,"body":"story?"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":141.51,"endTime":147.78,"body":"Of course. Vinnie and I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":141.51,"endTime":147.78,"body":"were roommates for just like two"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":147.78,"endTime":150.87,"body":"months. Over one summer, you"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":147.78,"endTime":150.87,"body":"were like transitioning houses."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":151.11,"endTime":155.22,"body":"And so you stayed in an extra"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":151.11,"endTime":155.22,"body":"room in my house. And one"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":155.22,"endTime":157.71,"body":"morning, I was doing ab"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":155.22,"endTime":157.71,"body":"exercises in the living room."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":157.86,"endTime":159.84,"body":"And just to be polite. I was"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":157.86,"endTime":159.84,"body":"like, \"Hey, do you want to join"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":159.84,"endTime":161.73,"body":"me?\" And I thought you would say"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":159.84,"endTime":161.73,"body":"no. And you're like, \"Of"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":161.73,"endTime":164.79,"body":"course.\" So you sat down and we"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":161.73,"endTime":164.79,"body":"did these ab exercises. And by"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":164.79,"endTime":167.1,"body":"the end, I was just laying on"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":164.79,"endTime":167.1,"body":"the floor panting and you just"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":167.1,"endTime":169.44,"body":"got up or like, \"Okay, I'm off"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":167.1,"endTime":169.44,"body":"to run my errands.\" Like you"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":169.44,"endTime":171.12,"body":"hadn't done anything because you"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":169.44,"endTime":171.12,"body":"were so fit."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":172.56,"endTime":175.59,"body":"Yes, it's really just"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":172.56,"endTime":175.59,"body":"like, Yeah, I don't know, it's a"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":175.59,"endTime":177.84,"body":"dancer thing. Like, we don't"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":175.59,"endTime":177.84,"body":"like to be physically beat by"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":177.84,"endTime":181.05,"body":"anything. Even if we are beat,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":177.84,"endTime":181.05,"body":"we still have to like walk away"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":181.05,"endTime":184.05,"body":"and smile. So rest assured, I"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":181.05,"endTime":184.05,"body":"felt it."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":184.36,"endTime":188.53,"body":"Well, you pulled it off, I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":184.36,"endTime":188.53,"body":"was very impressed. Well, today,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":188.53,"endTime":191.41,"body":"we're here to talk about what it"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":188.53,"endTime":191.41,"body":"means to be bisexual. And so"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":191.41,"endTime":193.66,"body":"first, I just want to talk a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":191.41,"endTime":193.66,"body":"little bit about the Kinsey"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":193.66,"endTime":198.4,"body":"scale, which is actually decades"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":193.66,"endTime":198.4,"body":"old and a little too reductive."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":198.61,"endTime":202.81,"body":"But the Kinsey scale, labels"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":198.61,"endTime":202.81,"body":"sexuality on a scale of zero to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":202.81,"endTime":207.28,"body":"six. And if you're a zero,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":202.81,"endTime":207.28,"body":"you're exclusively attracted to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":207.28,"endTime":210.4,"body":"the opposite sex. And if you're"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":207.28,"endTime":210.4,"body":"a six, you're exclusively"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":210.4,"endTime":213.79,"body":"attracted to the same sex. And"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":210.4,"endTime":213.79,"body":"if you're a three, you're"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":213.79,"endTime":217.09,"body":"equally attracted to both sexes."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":213.79,"endTime":217.09,"body":"And one of the problems with the"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":217.09,"endTime":219.61,"body":"Kinsey scale is it's just really"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":217.09,"endTime":219.61,"body":"reductive. And it doesn't take"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":219.61,"endTime":222.94,"body":"into account a lot of other"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":219.61,"endTime":222.94,"body":"forms of attraction such as, you"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":222.94,"endTime":226.21,"body":"know, emotional, spiritual, and"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":222.94,"endTime":226.21,"body":"those kinds of things. But it's"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":226.21,"endTime":229.48,"body":"a common way that people used to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":226.21,"endTime":229.48,"body":"talk about sexuality. So"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":229.48,"endTime":231.22,"body":"Charlie, would you say you are"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":229.48,"endTime":231.22,"body":"on the Kinsey scale?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":232.41,"endTime":234.57,"body":"This is actually funny,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":232.41,"endTime":234.57,"body":"because the first time I heard"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":234.57,"endTime":237.15,"body":"about this Kinsey scale, I was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":234.57,"endTime":237.15,"body":"actually in a therapy session."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":237.33,"endTime":240.63,"body":"And my therapist was explaining"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":237.33,"endTime":240.63,"body":"it to me about how there's kind"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":240.63,"endTime":245.07,"body":"of a continuum of attraction."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":240.63,"endTime":245.07,"body":"And I asked him where he would"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":245.07,"endTime":248.52,"body":"place me on the Kinsey scale,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":245.07,"endTime":248.52,"body":"and he was like--he hesitated."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":248.52,"endTime":250.8,"body":"He's like, \"Nah we probably"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":248.52,"endTime":250.8,"body":"shouldn't do that, like that's"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":250.8,"endTime":252.81,"body":"for you to find out.\" And I was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":250.8,"endTime":252.81,"body":"like, \"No, no, no, I'm, I'm"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":252.81,"endTime":256.35,"body":"really interested.\" And he said,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":252.81,"endTime":256.35,"body":"\"How about we do this: I'll"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":256.35,"endTime":260.4,"body":"write down where I think you"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":256.35,"endTime":260.4,"body":"are, and you where think you"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":260.4,"endTime":262.89,"body":"are, and then we'll show each"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":260.4,"endTime":262.89,"body":"other at the same time?\" And I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":262.89,"endTime":265.77,"body":"was like, \"Alright, alright,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":262.89,"endTime":265.77,"body":"alright.\" So this is when I was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":265.77,"endTime":268.83,"body":"working through things. And I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":265.77,"endTime":268.83,"body":"mentioned--Vinnie, I hope this"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":268.83,"endTime":273.12,"body":"doesn't come across as mean or"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":268.83,"endTime":273.12,"body":"reductive at all--but I used to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":273.12,"endTime":276.27,"body":"use for a little bit I was using"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":273.12,"endTime":276.27,"body":"bisexual as kind of like a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":276.27,"endTime":279.18,"body":"transition phase for me to be"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":276.27,"endTime":279.18,"body":"okay with the fact that I was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":279.18,"endTime":282.66,"body":"attracted to guys at least to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":279.18,"endTime":282.66,"body":"admit it to myself. And so I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":282.66,"endTime":286.8,"body":"wrote down 3.2--almost equally"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":282.66,"endTime":286.8,"body":"attracted to guys and girls, but"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":286.83,"endTime":291.24,"body":"but a little more on the guy"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":286.83,"endTime":291.24,"body":"side. And I said, \"Okay, 1-2-3,\""},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":291.27,"endTime":298.92,"body":"and we flipped our cards around,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":291.27,"endTime":298.92,"body":"and he wrote 5.9-6. I wrote 3.2"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":298.98,"endTime":304.41,"body":"and I just looking back I laugh."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":298.98,"endTime":304.41,"body":"It's just so funny to me. But"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":304.44,"endTime":307.11,"body":"but these days, I would"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":304.44,"endTime":307.11,"body":"definitely say he was right. I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":307.32,"endTime":311.55,"body":"am somewhere around 5.9-6, full"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":307.32,"endTime":311.55,"body":"fledged gay,"},{"speaker":"Ben: But same, very similar","startTime":312.57,"endTime":317.52,"body":"5.9-6. Vinny, where do you say"},{"speaker":"Ben: But same, very similar","startTime":317.52,"endTime":318.0,"body":"you are?"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":318.9,"endTime":322.71,"body":"I would say I am not on"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":318.9,"endTime":322.71,"body":"the Kinsey scale, it does not at"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":322.71,"endTime":326.88,"body":"all seem to accurately represent"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":322.71,"endTime":326.88,"body":"me and my experience."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":326.97,"endTime":327.57,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":328.83,"endTime":330.9,"body":"Well tell us about you and"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":328.83,"endTime":330.9,"body":"your experience."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":331.35,"endTime":334.65,"body":"Whoo, maybe more"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":331.35,"endTime":334.65,"body":"specific question about me and"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":334.65,"endTime":335.46,"body":"my experience?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":337.25,"endTime":340.43,"body":"I think, at least for"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":337.25,"endTime":340.43,"body":"me, personally, because I am"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":340.64,"endTime":343.73,"body":"exclusively attracted to the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":340.64,"endTime":343.73,"body":"same sex, it's a little bit hard"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":343.73,"endTime":346.28,"body":"for me to understand what it"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":343.73,"endTime":346.28,"body":"means to be bisexual. I've"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":346.28,"endTime":349.52,"body":"actually been really excited for"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":346.28,"endTime":349.52,"body":"this episode. Because I don't"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":349.52,"endTime":351.89,"body":"know. It's just something I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":349.52,"endTime":351.89,"body":"haven't been able to understand."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":352.01,"endTime":354.71,"body":"And I've never really had a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":352.01,"endTime":354.71,"body":"conversation, an in-depth"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":354.71,"endTime":357.35,"body":"conversation with somebody who"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":354.71,"endTime":357.35,"body":"is bisexual and is willing to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":357.56,"endTime":358.52,"body":"share things."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":358.82,"endTime":362.99,"body":"Yeah, so for me, that"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":358.82,"endTime":362.99,"body":"just means I am attracted to two"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":363.02,"endTime":366.95,"body":"or more genders, which really"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":363.02,"endTime":366.95,"body":"for me means any gender, any"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":366.95,"endTime":370.43,"body":"gender identity, I have the"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":366.95,"endTime":370.43,"body":"potential to find interesting,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":370.43,"endTime":374.63,"body":"attractive, romantic, romantic"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":370.43,"endTime":374.63,"body":"attraction, sexual attraction or"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":375.02,"endTime":378.53,"body":"other forms of attraction--just"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":375.02,"endTime":378.53,"body":"like people, they're real nice."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":378.89,"endTime":381.32,"body":"Okay, so it's not, it's not"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":378.89,"endTime":381.32,"body":"someone's gender that you're"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":381.32,"endTime":383.12,"body":"attracted to, it's the person"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":381.32,"endTime":383.12,"body":"that you're attracted to."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":384.32,"endTime":387.02,"body":"Um, I don't really know"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":384.32,"endTime":387.02,"body":"what it means to be attracted to"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":387.02,"endTime":391.46,"body":"someone's gender or not--I"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":387.02,"endTime":391.46,"body":"because gender is something that"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":391.46,"endTime":394.34,"body":"I am attracted to. But it's not"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":391.46,"endTime":394.34,"body":"exclusively that. That's the way"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":394.34,"endTime":396.86,"body":"I've always gone with \"bisexual\""},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":394.34,"endTime":396.86,"body":"or I often go with \"queer\" as"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":396.86,"endTime":400.82,"body":"well. Because it's just, it's"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":396.86,"endTime":400.82,"body":"hard for me to differentiate"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":400.82,"endTime":404.66,"body":"exactly what about a person I'm"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":400.82,"endTime":404.66,"body":"attracted to. But I can be"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":404.66,"endTime":407.3,"body":"attracted to lots of different"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":404.66,"endTime":407.3,"body":"people for lots of different"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":407.3,"endTime":407.84,"body":"reasons."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":408.14,"endTime":409.94,"body":"Yeah, how would How would"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":408.14,"endTime":409.94,"body":"you say your experience being"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":409.94,"endTime":413.87,"body":"bisexual or being being"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":409.94,"endTime":413.87,"body":"queer--how is that different"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":413.87,"endTime":416.66,"body":"from just being a gay woman or"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":413.87,"endTime":416.66,"body":"lesbian?"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":417.08,"endTime":422.12,"body":"Mm hmm. Um, I have heard"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":417.08,"endTime":422.12,"body":"a lot of, you know, talked to a"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":422.12,"endTime":424.64,"body":"lot of lesbians about their"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":422.12,"endTime":424.64,"body":"experience. And there's a lot of"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":424.64,"endTime":430.13,"body":"ways that there are similarities"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":424.64,"endTime":430.13,"body":"and crossover. But I just like,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":430.79,"endTime":434.48,"body":"still have found men attractive"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":430.79,"endTime":434.48,"body":"and other things attractive. So"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":434.96,"endTime":437.99,"body":"it's interesting because of my"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":434.96,"endTime":437.99,"body":"history, I think, my religious"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":437.99,"endTime":441.62,"body":"history and upbringing, my"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":437.99,"endTime":441.62,"body":"relationships to my attraction"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":441.62,"endTime":445.91,"body":"to men versus women have been"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":441.62,"endTime":445.91,"body":"very, very different. And so"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":445.91,"endTime":448.25,"body":"that's another reason I don't"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":445.91,"endTime":448.25,"body":"like to rate myself on, \"Am I"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":448.25,"endTime":451.16,"body":"more attracted to women are more"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":448.25,"endTime":451.16,"body":"attracted to men,\" because it"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":451.16,"endTime":455.6,"body":"feels very different for me."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":451.16,"endTime":455.6,"body":"Because growing up, you know, I"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":455.6,"endTime":458.84,"body":"knew that being attracted to"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":455.6,"endTime":458.84,"body":"women was, from what my"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":458.84,"endTime":462.41,"body":"perspective, taught to be evil"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":458.84,"endTime":462.41,"body":"and gross, and like, you know,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":462.41,"endTime":466.61,"body":"not appropriate. Um, so I"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":462.41,"endTime":466.61,"body":"suppressed a lot of that, I"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":466.61,"endTime":470.6,"body":"avoided a lot of that, and I was"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":466.61,"endTime":470.6,"body":"afraid of it. But it was"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":470.6,"endTime":473.33,"body":"nonetheless there and pretty"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":470.6,"endTime":473.33,"body":"strong, whereas my attraction to"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":473.33,"endTime":479.27,"body":"men I was allowed to experiment"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":473.33,"endTime":479.27,"body":"with and explore with. And so I"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":479.27,"endTime":483.26,"body":"don't have this feeling of like"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":479.27,"endTime":483.26,"body":"constantly being longing longing"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":483.53,"endTime":489.62,"body":"to be with a woman, like a lot"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":483.53,"endTime":489.62,"body":"of closeted lesbians I've talked"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":489.62,"endTime":492.41,"body":"to--where they, you know, even"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":489.62,"endTime":492.41,"body":"if they dated men, they just"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":492.41,"endTime":495.77,"body":"were like, always longing for a"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":492.41,"endTime":495.77,"body":"girlfriend or longing for that"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":495.77,"endTime":499.4,"body":"sort of thing. I didn't really"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":495.77,"endTime":499.4,"body":"grow up with that. But I did, I"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":499.4,"endTime":502.61,"body":"did grow up with like, noticing"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":499.4,"endTime":502.61,"body":"both attractions and completely"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":502.61,"endTime":504.77,"body":"trying to shut one down and"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":502.61,"endTime":504.77,"body":"trying to give space to the"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":504.77,"endTime":507.32,"body":"other one. But in the end, it"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":504.77,"endTime":507.32,"body":"just got to a point where it"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":507.32,"endTime":510.47,"body":"didn't really work, like my"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":507.32,"endTime":510.47,"body":"relationships with men didn't"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":510.47,"endTime":512.9,"body":"work very well, because I was,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":510.47,"endTime":512.9,"body":"you know, denying and shutting"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":512.9,"endTime":514.37,"body":"down a whole part of myself."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":515.44,"endTime":518.71,"body":"Okay, you know, I, my"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":515.44,"endTime":518.71,"body":"experience is very different."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":518.71,"endTime":521.65,"body":"But I remember there were like,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":518.71,"endTime":521.65,"body":"a couple years of my life where"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":521.65,"endTime":525.19,"body":"I just like prayed to have my"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":521.65,"endTime":525.19,"body":"attractions to men go away, and"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":525.19,"endTime":527.65,"body":"like be changed for attractions"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":525.19,"endTime":527.65,"body":"to women. And then I got to a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":527.65,"endTime":530.14,"body":"point where I was just praying"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":527.65,"endTime":530.14,"body":"to be bisexual. I thought I can"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":530.14,"endTime":535.69,"body":"deal with not with not dating"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":530.14,"endTime":535.69,"body":"men or kissing men or being"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":535.69,"endTime":538.93,"body":"physical with men. I just want"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":535.69,"endTime":538.93,"body":"to be attracted to women. And"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":538.93,"endTime":540.88,"body":"then when that didn't happen"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":538.93,"endTime":540.88,"body":"after a long time and praying"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":540.88,"endTime":543.46,"body":"for that, I said, like, \"God"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":540.88,"endTime":543.46,"body":"just sent me one woman, just one"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":543.46,"endTime":549.49,"body":"woman that I can that I can be"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":543.46,"endTime":549.49,"body":"attracted to.\" And, yeah, it's"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":549.49,"endTime":552.1,"body":"it's hard to feel like there's"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":549.49,"endTime":552.1,"body":"this part of you that you're"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":552.1,"endTime":554.23,"body":"constantly shutting off and"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":552.1,"endTime":554.23,"body":"trying to turn on this other"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":554.23,"endTime":554.65,"body":"part."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":555.08,"endTime":557.12,"body":"Vinnie, you talked a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":555.08,"endTime":557.12,"body":"little bit about your religious"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":557.15,"endTime":561.89,"body":"upbringing and how you felt it"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":557.15,"endTime":561.89,"body":"was more proper to be attracted"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":561.89,"endTime":565.25,"body":"to men. And now you identify as"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":561.89,"endTime":565.25,"body":"bisexual and I'm just wondering,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":565.58,"endTime":568.34,"body":"I'm curious what you would say"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":565.58,"endTime":568.34,"body":"to someone who would say, \"Well,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":568.37,"endTime":571.73,"body":"why don't you just pick one and"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":568.37,"endTime":571.73,"body":"pick the easy one? And only"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":571.73,"endTime":572.84,"body":"exclusively date men?\""},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":574.64,"endTime":577.61,"body":"Oh, yeah, pick the easy"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":574.64,"endTime":577.61,"body":"one. I've told myself that so"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":577.61,"endTime":581.81,"body":"many times,--can't you"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":577.61,"endTime":581.81,"body":"just--yeah, um, so I kind of"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":581.81,"endTime":586.04,"body":"touched on it a little bit of"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":581.81,"endTime":586.04,"body":"like, you know, repressing a"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":586.04,"endTime":589.58,"body":"part of your identity, no matter"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":586.04,"endTime":589.58,"body":"no matter what--is going to lead"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":589.58,"endTime":593.15,"body":"to like problems. And like it's"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":589.58,"endTime":593.15,"body":"hard to connect with people"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":593.15,"endTime":596.3,"body":"fully if you're not allowing"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":593.15,"endTime":596.3,"body":"yourself to be yourself fully."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":596.69,"endTime":600.65,"body":"So like, I definitely can't just"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":596.69,"endTime":600.65,"body":"shut that off. I tried and it"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":600.65,"endTime":606.17,"body":"didn't work. Um, and then like,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":600.65,"endTime":606.17,"body":"even now, I think a lot of"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":606.98,"endTime":608.51,"body":"people--this is another reason I"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":606.98,"endTime":608.51,"body":"don't like the Kinsey"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":608.51,"endTime":610.94,"body":"scale--because they say like,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":608.51,"endTime":610.94,"body":"\"Oh, well, you know, you can"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":610.94,"endTime":614.3,"body":"just you can still do the Mormon"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":610.94,"endTime":614.3,"body":"thing you can still because"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":614.3,"endTime":616.34,"body":"you're you're not gay enough"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":614.3,"endTime":616.34,"body":"you're not all the way gay.\""},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":616.94,"endTime":620.6,"body":"Just like I don't like bisexual,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":616.94,"endTime":620.6,"body":"bisexuality being like a shade"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":620.6,"endTime":622.88,"body":"of gay you're just like, \"light"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":620.6,"endTime":622.88,"body":"gay,\" you know?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":623.57,"endTime":627.32,"body":"So to you is being"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":623.57,"endTime":627.32,"body":"bisexual more about how you view"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":627.32,"endTime":630.62,"body":"yourself than who you are"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":627.32,"endTime":630.62,"body":"dating?"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":632.43,"endTime":636.03,"body":"Um, yeah, I guess you"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":632.43,"endTime":636.03,"body":"could say that--there's a, yeah"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":636.09,"endTime":639.66,"body":"there's a lot of frustration in"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":636.09,"endTime":639.66,"body":"the bisexual community where"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":639.66,"endTime":642.51,"body":"like, if you're a woman and you"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":639.66,"endTime":642.51,"body":"date a man, suddenly people"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":642.51,"endTime":644.76,"body":"think you're straight. And if"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":642.51,"endTime":644.76,"body":"you're a woman, and you date a"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":644.76,"endTime":647.07,"body":"woman, then people like, \"Oh,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":644.76,"endTime":647.07,"body":"she's actually just a lesbian.\""},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":647.28,"endTime":651.06,"body":"When neither one is true, we are"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":647.28,"endTime":651.06,"body":"bisexual like, and that is our"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":651.06,"endTime":653.64,"body":"identity, no matter who we're"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":651.06,"endTime":653.64,"body":"dating. And that's important for"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":653.64,"endTime":655.05,"body":"us, no matter who we're dating,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":655.0,"endTime":657.19,"body":"Vinnie, I have heard what"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":655.0,"endTime":657.19,"body":"you were saying--what you're"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":657.19,"endTime":661.09,"body":"talking about described as"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":657.19,"endTime":661.09,"body":"\"bi-eraser.\" That you're either"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":661.12,"endTime":663.34,"body":"not gay enough for the gay"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":661.12,"endTime":663.34,"body":"community or not straight enough"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":663.34,"endTime":668.29,"body":"for the straight community. And"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":663.34,"endTime":668.29,"body":"based on whom you're dating, you"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":668.29,"endTime":671.71,"body":"kind of lose that identity, or"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":668.29,"endTime":671.71,"body":"people view you as a certain"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":671.71,"endTime":674.2,"body":"way. What's that what's that"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":671.71,"endTime":674.2,"body":"experience like for you?"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":674.51,"endTime":678.98,"body":"I do feel like I'm going"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":674.51,"endTime":678.98,"body":"to be erased, I do feel like, I"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":678.98,"endTime":681.71,"body":"want that to be able to exist. I"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":678.98,"endTime":681.71,"body":"think a lot of people I've"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":681.71,"endTime":685.28,"body":"encountered, which is weird for"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":681.71,"endTime":685.28,"body":"me to understand, because this"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":685.28,"endTime":687.92,"body":"is my experience. But people who"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":685.28,"endTime":687.92,"body":"are gay or people who are"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":687.92,"endTime":690.68,"body":"straight, have a really hard"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":687.92,"endTime":690.68,"body":"time wrapping their brain"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":690.68,"endTime":696.8,"body":"around, being attracted to both."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":690.68,"endTime":696.8,"body":"And so and so the world is built"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":696.8,"endTime":700.01,"body":"up that way. And even like, you"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":696.8,"endTime":700.01,"body":"know, it's obviously the world"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":700.01,"endTime":704.33,"body":"is more heteronormative. But"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":700.01,"endTime":704.33,"body":"when you go into a queer space,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":704.42,"endTime":707.57,"body":"and it talks all about gay and"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":704.42,"endTime":707.57,"body":"gay men and lesbian women,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":708.08,"endTime":711.02,"body":"you're like, cool, but some of"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":708.08,"endTime":711.02,"body":"us have both, and you're not"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":711.02,"endTime":714.35,"body":"talking to us at all. And you're"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":711.02,"endTime":714.35,"body":"not referencing like, you're"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":714.38,"endTime":717.95,"body":"sometimes, um, sometimes,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":714.38,"endTime":717.95,"body":"especially lesbian women will"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":717.95,"endTime":722.06,"body":"treat me like, I don't have a"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":717.95,"endTime":722.06,"body":"right to complain, because I can"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":722.06,"endTime":724.7,"body":"fit in with the world because I"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":722.06,"endTime":724.7,"body":"can marry a man or I could be"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":724.7,"endTime":729.95,"body":"with a man. And that leads a lot"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":724.7,"endTime":729.95,"body":"of bisexuals to be very more"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":730.28,"endTime":732.62,"body":"have a lot of anxiety and"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":730.28,"endTime":732.62,"body":"depression and things like that,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":732.62,"endTime":735.71,"body":"because we just feel like, I'm"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":732.62,"endTime":735.71,"body":"not allowed to complain. But"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":736.34,"endTime":739.82,"body":"nobody's talking to me. And"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":736.34,"endTime":739.82,"body":"nobody's, you know, admitting at"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":739.82,"endTime":742.13,"body":"least that, that there are"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":739.82,"endTime":742.13,"body":"difficulties about this"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":742.13,"endTime":743.03,"body":"identity, you know."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":743.21,"endTime":745.61,"body":"So it's like you have this"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":743.21,"endTime":745.61,"body":"perceived privilege that then"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":745.61,"endTime":747.95,"body":"leads to people invalidating you"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":745.61,"endTime":747.95,"body":"in your experience."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":748.52,"endTime":751.1,"body":"That is very articulate"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":748.52,"endTime":751.1,"body":"way of putting it. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":751.28,"endTime":754.64,"body":"What lessons have you"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":751.28,"endTime":754.64,"body":"seen that stem from your"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":754.67,"endTime":756.68,"body":"specific and unique orientation?"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":757.29,"endTime":761.16,"body":"Oh, that's a great"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":757.29,"endTime":761.16,"body":"question. I feel like, um, first"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":761.16,"endTime":763.98,"body":"and foremost, like, I was"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":761.16,"endTime":763.98,"body":"always, like, I explained, kind"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":763.98,"endTime":768.45,"body":"of afraid of the part of me that"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":763.98,"endTime":768.45,"body":"liked women, and, you know, kept"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":768.45,"endTime":772.8,"body":"thinking like, that was that was"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":768.45,"endTime":772.8,"body":"my way of being more righteous"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":772.8,"endTime":775.68,"body":"as if I could shut that down."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":772.8,"endTime":775.68,"body":"But like, when I when I got to"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":775.68,"endTime":779.79,"body":"it, I was so afraid. But when I"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":775.68,"endTime":779.79,"body":"first was like, I think, I need"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":779.79,"endTime":782.61,"body":"to use this label. I think this"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":779.79,"endTime":782.61,"body":"is who I am. I prayed about it."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":784.92,"endTime":787.8,"body":"This is the weirdest thing, but"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":784.92,"endTime":787.8,"body":"it's, it's the only time this"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":787.8,"endTime":790.26,"body":"has happened where I felt like I"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":787.8,"endTime":790.26,"body":"got back an answer that was like"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":790.29,"endTime":794.52,"body":"a little bit exasperated, like,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":790.29,"endTime":794.52,"body":"a little impatient, like, \"Yes,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":794.55,"endTime":797.58,"body":"I know. And now that, you know,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":794.55,"endTime":797.58,"body":"like, we're gonna get some work"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":797.58,"endTime":800.97,"body":"done with this.\" And so I felt"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":797.58,"endTime":800.97,"body":"like, like I explained it, it"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":800.97,"endTime":804.42,"body":"affects the way I view myself"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":800.97,"endTime":804.42,"body":"and the way I can connect with"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":804.45,"endTime":809.76,"body":"people. And I think it's a real"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":804.45,"endTime":809.76,"body":"blessing to be able to connect"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":809.76,"endTime":814.23,"body":"and understand gay men and"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":809.76,"endTime":814.23,"body":"women, their experience as well"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":814.23,"endTime":817.98,"body":"as straight men and women and"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":814.23,"endTime":817.98,"body":"their experience. To feel like I"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":817.98,"endTime":821.97,"body":"can relate to all sides of that,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":817.98,"endTime":821.97,"body":"and I can love all sides of"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":821.97,"endTime":826.11,"body":"that. And I can love people who"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":821.97,"endTime":826.11,"body":"are transgender, or who are"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":826.14,"endTime":829.44,"body":"non-binary things like that. And"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":826.14,"endTime":829.44,"body":"I think that's like a beautiful"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":829.47,"endTime":832.8,"body":"blessing. Like, I kind of think"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":829.47,"endTime":832.8,"body":"it's a it's a cool thing to be"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":832.8,"endTime":837.75,"body":"bisexual and to, you know, and I"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":832.8,"endTime":837.75,"body":"love being a part of the queer"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":837.75,"endTime":841.11,"body":"community because it's such a"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":837.75,"endTime":841.11,"body":"loving community. And it teaches"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":841.11,"endTime":845.16,"body":"me a lot about love, especially"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":841.11,"endTime":845.16,"body":"Christ like love and"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":845.31,"endTime":848.73,"body":"unconditional love, and being"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":845.31,"endTime":848.73,"body":"able to listen to people, give"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":848.73,"endTime":851.55,"body":"space to people, like all of"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":848.73,"endTime":851.55,"body":"that has been such a beautiful"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":851.55,"endTime":854.82,"body":"thing to learn. And if I had"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":851.55,"endTime":854.82,"body":"been too afraid to accept this"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":854.82,"endTime":857.85,"body":"part of myself, I never would"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":854.82,"endTime":857.85,"body":"have met the people that I've"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":857.85,"endTime":861.06,"body":"met, and I never would have been"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":857.85,"endTime":861.06,"body":"able to experience this kind of"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":861.09,"endTime":864.18,"body":"level of love, which is like,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":861.09,"endTime":864.18,"body":"been the best thing ever."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":864.48,"endTime":865.98,"body":"That's very beautifully"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":864.48,"endTime":865.98,"body":"said. Thank you."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":867.49,"endTime":869.83,"body":"Yeah, you just gave us a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":867.49,"endTime":869.83,"body":"beautiful list of things you've"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":869.83,"endTime":873.73,"body":"learned. What other what other"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":869.83,"endTime":873.73,"body":"lessons have you learned, that"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":873.73,"endTime":876.07,"body":"you think God wanted you to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":873.73,"endTime":876.07,"body":"learn as as you've stepped into"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":876.07,"endTime":876.73,"body":"this identity?"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":878.31,"endTime":882.0,"body":"Well, that's it's such a"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":878.31,"endTime":882.0,"body":"beautiful question. Um, well,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":882.0,"endTime":888.03,"body":"that that love is good, and that"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":882.0,"endTime":888.03,"body":"questions are good and progress"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":888.03,"endTime":893.37,"body":"is good. And if we want to"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":888.03,"endTime":893.37,"body":"expand the amount of light that"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":893.37,"endTime":896.49,"body":"we have as human, the light and"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":893.37,"endTime":896.49,"body":"truth that we have as humans"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":896.52,"endTime":900.51,"body":"like--we have to go to the dark"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":896.52,"endTime":900.51,"body":"places, which I was afraid to do"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":900.54,"endTime":905.94,"body":"you know. You have to bring it"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":900.54,"endTime":905.94,"body":"back to Eve, my home girl, you"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":905.94,"endTime":908.79,"body":"gotta like, you gotta take the"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":905.94,"endTime":908.79,"body":"forbidden fruit, you gotta go to"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":908.79,"endTime":911.31,"body":"the place where things are gonna"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":908.79,"endTime":911.31,"body":"get hard and things are gonna"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":911.31,"endTime":915.42,"body":"get confusing. And through that"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":911.31,"endTime":915.42,"body":"you can learn how to be a better"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":915.42,"endTime":919.11,"body":"person. And like, I kind of feel"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":915.42,"endTime":919.11,"body":"like that's where the church is"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":919.11,"endTime":921.33,"body":"right now where we're all trying"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":919.11,"endTime":921.33,"body":"to figure out what this thing"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":921.33,"endTime":927.75,"body":"is. But no progress was made for"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":921.33,"endTime":927.75,"body":"me personally, when I was"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":927.78,"endTime":932.01,"body":"ignoring and shutting out and"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":927.78,"endTime":932.01,"body":"closing myself off in a closet,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":932.01,"endTime":935.52,"body":"just like this one that I'm in"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":932.01,"endTime":935.52,"body":"right now. No progress happened"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":935.52,"endTime":939.0,"body":"in that space. And so it can be"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":935.52,"endTime":939.0,"body":"it can be scary, like, you"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":939.0,"endTime":941.97,"body":"don't, you don't want to--and"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":939.0,"endTime":941.97,"body":"I've changed a lot. And I've"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":941.97,"endTime":945.12,"body":"evolved a lot. And sometimes I"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":941.97,"endTime":945.12,"body":"sometimes I still ask God, I'm"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":945.12,"endTime":948.06,"body":"like, \"I'm sorry, are you"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":945.12,"endTime":948.06,"body":"disappointed?\" Like, I'm not the"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":948.06,"endTime":952.8,"body":"Mormon girl I used to be like."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":948.06,"endTime":952.8,"body":"And I don't ever feel like God's"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":952.8,"endTime":956.58,"body":"disappointed because I'm trying"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":952.8,"endTime":956.58,"body":"to find a better, better space"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":956.58,"endTime":958.47,"body":"for myself and a better space"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":956.58,"endTime":958.47,"body":"for others. So.."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":959.22,"endTime":963.15,"body":"I just had a conversation"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":959.22,"endTime":963.15,"body":"with a mutual friend of ours, in"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":963.15,"endTime":966.81,"body":"Tucson, and, and he was telling"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":963.15,"endTime":966.81,"body":"me about, like, the path he's"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":966.81,"endTime":969.99,"body":"going on and, and he said, \"I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":966.81,"endTime":969.99,"body":"don't think God is going to send"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":969.99,"endTime":973.38,"body":"me to hell for trying to figure"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":969.99,"endTime":973.38,"body":"things out. I'm going to do"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":973.38,"endTime":977.94,"body":"exactly what I feel is right."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":973.38,"endTime":977.94,"body":"And God is trusting me to figure"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":977.94,"endTime":979.71,"body":"this out right now. And He's"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":977.94,"endTime":979.71,"body":"been with me the whole time.\""},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":980.04,"endTime":982.41,"body":"I think a good way to"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":980.04,"endTime":982.41,"body":"put it is God, trusts me. And I"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":982.41,"endTime":985.5,"body":"feel like, it's also been a"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":982.41,"endTime":985.5,"body":"lesson to me that I need to"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":985.5,"endTime":988.59,"body":"trust myself and I need to trust"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":985.5,"endTime":988.59,"body":"other people that you know,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":988.59,"endTime":991.62,"body":"we're all just trying to do the"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":988.59,"endTime":991.62,"body":"best we can and to learn how to"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":991.62,"endTime":994.71,"body":"give other people space and give"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":991.62,"endTime":994.71,"body":"yourself space to like, maybe"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":994.71,"endTime":998.13,"body":"make mistakes, but you know,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":994.71,"endTime":998.13,"body":"still be at least progressing"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":998.13,"endTime":999.72,"body":"going in a direction that's"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":998.13,"endTime":999.72,"body":"useful."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1000.44,"endTime":1002.96,"body":"The one thing that I think"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1000.44,"endTime":1002.96,"body":"is so interesting is like to me,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1002.99,"endTime":1006.11,"body":"like I wanted to identify as"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1002.99,"endTime":1006.11,"body":"bisexual To me it was like, like"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1006.11,"endTime":1008.42,"body":"a, like a crutch, like this"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1006.11,"endTime":1008.42,"body":"thing that was going to like"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1008.42,"endTime":1014.18,"body":"help me be the person that I was"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1008.42,"endTime":1014.18,"body":"supposed to be. And like it, but"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1014.18,"endTime":1017.81,"body":"it wasn't who I was, it was like"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1014.18,"endTime":1017.81,"body":"this suffocating term. But then"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1017.81,"endTime":1020.24,"body":"to you like this the same term,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1017.81,"endTime":1020.24,"body":"the same thing has been"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1020.24,"endTime":1023.45,"body":"something that's been so freeing"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1020.24,"endTime":1023.45,"body":"and revelatory for you."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1024.11,"endTime":1026.24,"body":"Yeah, that's really"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1024.11,"endTime":1026.24,"body":"interesting to hear, too,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1026.24,"endTime":1028.43,"body":"because I feel the same about"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1026.24,"endTime":1028.43,"body":"the term \"straight\" or the term"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1028.43,"endTime":1032.21,"body":"\"lesbian.\" Like, neither neither"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1028.43,"endTime":1032.21,"body":"one feels good to me. They all"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1032.21,"endTime":1035.24,"body":"feel restrictive. They both feel"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1032.21,"endTime":1035.24,"body":"restrictive, but this one,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1035.24,"endTime":1039.32,"body":"obviously, not. And I think that"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1035.24,"endTime":1039.32,"body":"that's interesting. I think the"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1039.32,"endTime":1043.31,"body":"whole thing with like, people"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1039.32,"endTime":1043.31,"body":"who are gay, but start out"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1043.67,"endTime":1046.64,"body":"identifying as bisexual, and"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1043.67,"endTime":1046.64,"body":"think they're bisexual. I mean,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1046.64,"endTime":1050.06,"body":"like, I think an important"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1046.64,"endTime":1050.06,"body":"takeaway is like, if someone"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1050.06,"endTime":1053.18,"body":"comes out to you as bisexual,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1050.06,"endTime":1053.18,"body":"even if they're wrong, even if"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1053.18,"endTime":1055.88,"body":"they're hiding, even if it's a"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1053.18,"endTime":1055.88,"body":"phase for them, or whatever,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1056.24,"endTime":1058.97,"body":"never ever invalidate that, and"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1056.24,"endTime":1058.97,"body":"never say, \"I don't think you're"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1058.97,"endTime":1062.72,"body":"bisexual.\" Because they might"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1058.97,"endTime":1062.72,"body":"be. And, you know, like, no"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1062.72,"endTime":1067.37,"body":"matter what, just validate where"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1062.72,"endTime":1067.37,"body":"they are. I think sexuality, you"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1067.37,"endTime":1070.22,"body":"know, for some people is very,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1067.37,"endTime":1070.22,"body":"very clear. They're like, \"I"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1070.22,"endTime":1073.19,"body":"know what this is.\" But for a"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1070.22,"endTime":1073.19,"body":"lot of us is not very clear, and"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1073.19,"endTime":1076.01,"body":"it takes a long time to figure"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1073.19,"endTime":1076.01,"body":"out. And for some people, that"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1076.01,"endTime":1078.68,"body":"means they actually think"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1076.01,"endTime":1078.68,"body":"they're bisexual, some people"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1078.98,"endTime":1082.55,"body":"think you're only just like, too"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1078.98,"endTime":1082.55,"body":"scared to identify as gay, and"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1082.55,"endTime":1085.4,"body":"they go through that bisexual"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1082.55,"endTime":1085.4,"body":"label. And I think that that's"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1085.4,"endTime":1089.36,"body":"fine. But I think no matter"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1085.4,"endTime":1089.36,"body":"what, like, understand that"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1089.36,"endTime":1092.84,"body":"every identity is real and valid"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1089.36,"endTime":1092.84,"body":"and embrace anybody wherever"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1092.84,"endTime":1094.58,"body":"they are with those labels, you"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1092.84,"endTime":1094.58,"body":"know?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1095.26,"endTime":1098.2,"body":"Yeah, I'm so glad you"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1095.26,"endTime":1098.2,"body":"said that. Because I've often"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1098.23,"endTime":1101.8,"body":"felt a little bit guilty for the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1098.23,"endTime":1101.8,"body":"way I used \"bisexual\" to kind of"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1101.8,"endTime":1105.61,"body":"like springboard myself into"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1101.8,"endTime":1105.61,"body":"being okay with with being \"100%"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1105.91,"endTime":1111.01,"body":"gay\" air quotes, you know. But"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1105.91,"endTime":1111.01,"body":"that being said, it really did"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1111.01,"endTime":1115.69,"body":"help me. And I'm so grateful"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1111.01,"endTime":1115.69,"body":"that that was there to kind of"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1116.11,"endTime":1120.1,"body":"put me in, in the place that I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1116.11,"endTime":1120.1,"body":"was darkest for me, you know."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1120.19,"endTime":1124.78,"body":"And so I guess I'm grateful to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1120.19,"endTime":1124.78,"body":"people like you who are visible"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1124.81,"endTime":1129.94,"body":"visibly bisexual. If even in"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1124.81,"endTime":1129.94,"body":"that small way, those two"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1129.94,"endTime":1132.49,"body":"weeks--it's my joke that I was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1129.94,"endTime":1132.49,"body":"bisexual for a whole two"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1132.94,"endTime":1136.69,"body":"weeks--but those two weeks"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1132.94,"endTime":1136.69,"body":"really, really helped me get to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1136.69,"endTime":1141.58,"body":"a place where I could accept"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1136.69,"endTime":1141.58,"body":"myself. And I'm so proud of you."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1141.61,"endTime":1146.5,"body":"And, and really, it's amazing to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1141.61,"endTime":1146.5,"body":"see that you've been able to, to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1146.5,"endTime":1150.85,"body":"find yourself in such what I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1146.5,"endTime":1150.85,"body":"consider so much more of a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1150.85,"endTime":1153.67,"body":"difficult space. It's really,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1150.85,"endTime":1153.67,"body":"it's really beautiful. And"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1154.75,"endTime":1155.59,"body":"you're amazing."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1155.869,"endTime":1157.249,"body":"Thanks. Thanks, friend."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1158.59,"endTime":1161.11,"body":"Vinnie, I remember when you"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1158.59,"endTime":1161.11,"body":"and I were living together, you"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1161.23,"endTime":1164.92,"body":"were like reading blogs about"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1161.23,"endTime":1164.92,"body":"bisexual Latter-day Sainta or"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1164.92,"endTime":1169.51,"body":"something like that. And, and,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1164.92,"endTime":1169.51,"body":"and you were telling me, like"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1169.54,"endTime":1172.21,"body":"how important it was for you to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1169.54,"endTime":1172.21,"body":"find voices that were similar to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1172.21,"endTime":1176.2,"body":"yours. What what was that like"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1172.21,"endTime":1176.2,"body":"for you to find experiences"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1176.2,"endTime":1177.4,"body":"similar to yours online?"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1178.47,"endTime":1183.48,"body":"Um, initially, it was"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1178.47,"endTime":1183.48,"body":"pretty difficult. Like I said,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1183.48,"endTime":1187.26,"body":"most of the queers, the queer"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1183.48,"endTime":1187.26,"body":"Mormon spaces I went to, were"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1187.26,"endTime":1191.34,"body":"all about--first of all, a lot"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1187.26,"endTime":1191.34,"body":"of them were just, \"This is my"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1191.34,"endTime":1194.1,"body":"story about my gay son and me"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1191.34,"endTime":1194.1,"body":"being a parent.\" And I was like,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1194.1,"endTime":1197.7,"body":"I don't want to hear, I don't"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1194.1,"endTime":1197.7,"body":"that doesn't relate to me. And"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1197.7,"endTime":1203.46,"body":"so a lot of them were gay and"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1197.7,"endTime":1203.46,"body":"lesbian. And but what I found"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1203.49,"endTime":1209.19,"body":"was bisexual, bisexual stuff"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1203.49,"endTime":1209.19,"body":"was,--we tend to be a little bit"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1209.19,"endTime":1213.84,"body":"more hidden for various reasons."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1209.19,"endTime":1213.84,"body":"And a lot of bisexuals who got"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1213.84,"endTime":1216.39,"body":"married first and then realized"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1213.84,"endTime":1216.39,"body":"they were bisexual and didn't"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1216.39,"endTime":1219.75,"body":"feel safe to come out because"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1216.39,"endTime":1219.75,"body":"they were happy in their"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1219.75,"endTime":1222.57,"body":"relationship, but they didn't"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1219.75,"endTime":1222.57,"body":"understand, you know. You know,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1222.57,"endTime":1225.15,"body":"so there's a lot of stories like"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1222.57,"endTime":1225.15,"body":"that of people trying to"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1225.15,"endTime":1229.56,"body":"discover things. But I found it"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1225.15,"endTime":1229.56,"body":"to be one of the most helpful"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1229.56,"endTime":1233.46,"body":"things that I could have done"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1229.56,"endTime":1233.46,"body":"because it kept solidifying my"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1233.46,"endTime":1235.74,"body":"identity, because there were"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1233.46,"endTime":1235.74,"body":"there are a lot of things about"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1235.74,"endTime":1238.65,"body":"the bisexual experience that are"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1235.74,"endTime":1238.65,"body":"also my experience. And so it"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1238.65,"endTime":1242.31,"body":"was like, \"Oh, I'm not the only"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1238.65,"endTime":1242.31,"body":"one. Oh, that's exactly how I"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1242.31,"endTime":1246.42,"body":"felt.\" And especially right at"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1242.31,"endTime":1246.42,"body":"the beginning. I don't know if"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1246.42,"endTime":1248.67,"body":"you guys felt the same way."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1246.42,"endTime":1248.67,"body":"Right? When you first start"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1248.67,"endTime":1251.4,"body":"coming out, there's still that"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1248.67,"endTime":1251.4,"body":"part of you that's like, \"But I"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1251.4,"endTime":1254.31,"body":"might be wrong. I might be"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1251.4,"endTime":1254.31,"body":"really wrong. And what I have to"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1254.58,"endTime":1258.99,"body":"re-come out to everybody?\" I"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1254.58,"endTime":1258.99,"body":"think a lot of bisexuals, still"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1258.99,"endTime":1261.78,"body":"to this day, sometimes I'm like,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1258.99,"endTime":1261.78,"body":"\"I think I'm actually lesbian.\""},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1261.81,"endTime":1264.78,"body":"Which I am not. Because Timothe"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1261.81,"endTime":1264.78,"body":"Chalamet me and Tom Hardy"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1264.78,"endTime":1272.28,"body":"exists. So clearly...I will not"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1264.78,"endTime":1272.28,"body":"be lesbian. You know, and vice"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1272.28,"endTime":1275.61,"body":"versa. So we always vacillate"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1272.28,"endTime":1275.61,"body":"back and forth. When you hear"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1275.64,"endTime":1280.02,"body":"stories and things of other"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1275.64,"endTime":1280.02,"body":"bisexuals--it can be really"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1280.02,"endTime":1282.69,"body":"validating. And you know, you"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1280.02,"endTime":1282.69,"body":"realize you sort of think that"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1282.69,"endTime":1285.78,"body":"there's like one story for every"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1282.69,"endTime":1285.78,"body":"identity. And of course, that's"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1285.78,"endTime":1288.54,"body":"not true. And so you can hear"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1285.78,"endTime":1288.54,"body":"the different the different"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1289.02,"endTime":1291.87,"body":"spaces that that and you know,"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1289.02,"endTime":1291.87,"body":"they're the people who knew when"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1291.87,"endTime":1293.88,"body":"they were five years old, and"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1291.87,"endTime":1293.88,"body":"they're the people who didn't"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1293.88,"endTime":1296.94,"body":"know till they were 40, you"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1293.88,"endTime":1296.94,"body":"know. It's like, you just get to"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1296.94,"endTime":1299.64,"body":"find yourself among those"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1296.94,"endTime":1299.64,"body":"stories, then you find kind of a"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1299.64,"endTime":1304.08,"body":"family, to bond to around that."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1299.64,"endTime":1304.08,"body":"And that's really nice and"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1304.08,"endTime":1307.56,"body":"really helpful for making you"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1304.08,"endTime":1307.56,"body":"feel confident making you feel a"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1307.56,"endTime":1309.15,"body":"little more safe in who you are."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1309.39,"endTime":1312.12,"body":"So Vinnie, you've talked"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1309.39,"endTime":1312.12,"body":"about how sometimes you'll say"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1312.12,"endTime":1314.76,"body":"that you're \"bi.\" And people"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1312.12,"endTime":1314.76,"body":"say, \"Well, you're not straight"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1314.76,"endTime":1316.56,"body":"enough for the straight world,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1314.76,"endTime":1316.56,"body":"you're not gay enough for the"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1316.56,"endTime":1320.46,"body":"gay world.\" People say this is"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1316.56,"endTime":1320.46,"body":"just a phase or be invalidating"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1320.46,"endTime":1323.37,"body":"that way. Let's say you came out"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1320.46,"endTime":1323.37,"body":"to an important person in your"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1323.37,"endTime":1326.58,"body":"life as bisexual, what would you"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1323.37,"endTime":1326.58,"body":"want them to say? Or ask you?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1327.38,"endTime":1329.78,"body":"You know, I don't think"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1327.38,"endTime":1329.78,"body":"there's a perfect way to do it."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1329.78,"endTime":1334.22,"body":"I just think people who give me"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1329.78,"endTime":1334.22,"body":"space, then to expound upon"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1334.22,"endTime":1335.78,"body":"that, who asked me little"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":1334.22,"endTime":1335.78,"body":"questions."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1337.73,"endTime":1340.19,"body":"So one of the one of the"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1337.73,"endTime":1340.19,"body":"best questions I was ever asked,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1340.19,"endTime":1343.52,"body":"after coming up to someone was"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1340.19,"endTime":1343.52,"body":"actually my bishop. He said,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1343.61,"endTime":1346.43,"body":"\"Ben, what do I need to know and"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1343.61,"endTime":1346.43,"body":"understand so I can serve you"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1346.43,"endTime":1351.05,"body":"better?\" And that question just"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1346.43,"endTime":1351.05,"body":"made me feel understood, and"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1351.05,"endTime":1352.4,"body":"loved and cared for."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1353.3,"endTime":1355.85,"body":"That's a beautiful one."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1353.3,"endTime":1355.85,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1358.16,"endTime":1359.21,"body":"Any other final"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1358.16,"endTime":1359.21,"body":"thoughts?"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1359.9,"endTime":1362.96,"body":"Um, I mean, we could"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1359.9,"endTime":1362.96,"body":"just like do a quick little"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1362.96,"endTime":1366.83,"body":"mention that bisexuals are not"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1362.96,"endTime":1366.83,"body":"more likely to cheat. I had a"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1366.83,"endTime":1369.38,"body":"conversation with someone at an"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1366.83,"endTime":1369.38,"body":"Affirmation thing where they're"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1369.38,"endTime":1372.68,"body":"like, \"I don't understand if"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1369.38,"endTime":1372.68,"body":"you're dating a man. But you're"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1372.68,"endTime":1375.71,"body":"still gonna want to be with a"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1372.68,"endTime":1375.71,"body":"woman.\" And I'm like, \"That's"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1375.74,"endTime":1379.37,"body":"not necessarily how it works.\" I"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1375.74,"endTime":1379.37,"body":"mean, like, it was just like, if"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1379.37,"endTime":1382.13,"body":"you are married, if you're"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1379.37,"endTime":1382.13,"body":"straight, and you're married to"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1382.43,"endTime":1385.85,"body":"a different gender, you might"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1382.43,"endTime":1385.85,"body":"look at other people, other men"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1385.85,"endTime":1387.95,"body":"the same way. But you wouldn't"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1385.85,"endTime":1387.95,"body":"want to be with them. Because"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1387.95,"endTime":1391.34,"body":"you've committed yourself to"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1387.95,"endTime":1391.34,"body":"that one person. Bi-sexuals are"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1391.34,"endTime":1391.85,"body":"the same."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1393.86,"endTime":1396.44,"body":"Vinnie, thank you so much"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1393.86,"endTime":1396.44,"body":"for being on. You're one of my"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1396.44,"endTime":1399.35,"body":"very good friends. And it's just"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1396.44,"endTime":1399.35,"body":"so good to see you and and hear"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1399.35,"endTime":1401.45,"body":"your experiences. And I'm so"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1399.35,"endTime":1401.45,"body":"glad that you are willing to be"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1401.45,"endTime":1402.74,"body":"so open and honest with us"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1401.45,"endTime":1402.74,"body":"today."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1403.1,"endTime":1405.77,"body":"Thanks for having me on."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1403.1,"endTime":1405.77,"body":"It's good to see you and get to"},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1405.77,"endTime":1409.31,"body":"talk about these things. Always."},{"speaker":"Vinnie","startTime":1405.77,"endTime":1409.31,"body":"Always interesting conversation."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1410.84,"endTime":1413.0,"body":"Thank you for joining"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1410.84,"endTime":1413.0,"body":"us today. Please remember that"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1413.0,"endTime":1415.1,"body":"we do not represent the Church"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1413.0,"endTime":1415.1,"body":"of Jesus Christ of Latter-day"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1415.1,"endTime":1416.96,"body":"Saints or Brigham Young"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1415.1,"endTime":1416.96,"body":"University."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1417.5,"endTime":1419.51,"body":"You're not trying to be"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1417.5,"endTime":1419.51,"body":"prescriptive or tell anyone what"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1419.51,"endTime":1422.18,"body":"to think or do. You were three"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1419.51,"endTime":1422.18,"body":"perspectives today, and there"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1422.18,"endTime":1423.08,"body":"are many, many more."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1423.65,"endTime":1425.48,"body":"We encourage you to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1423.65,"endTime":1425.48,"body":"listen to other voices and hear"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1425.48,"endTime":1428.48,"body":"a wide variety of experiences."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1425.48,"endTime":1428.48,"body":"If you would like to submit a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1428.48,"endTime":1431.24,"body":"question or share a comment"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1428.48,"endTime":1431.24,"body":"about today's episode, you can"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1431.24,"endTime":1434.06,"body":"email us at"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1431.24,"endTime":1434.06,"body":"questionsfromthecloset@gmail.com."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1434.54,"endTime":1435.38,"body":"Until next time..."}]}