{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":5.64,"endTime":7.95,"body":"Welcome to Questions from"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":5.64,"endTime":7.95,"body":"the Closet. I'm Ben Schilaty."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":8.01,"endTime":8.94,"body":"And I'm Charlie Bird."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":9.12,"endTime":11.19,"body":"Each episode we discuss a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":9.12,"endTime":11.19,"body":"question that we commonly get"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":11.19,"endTime":13.14,"body":"asked as LGBTQ Latter-day"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":11.19,"endTime":13.14,"body":"Saints."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":13.26,"endTime":15.12,"body":"We're not trying to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":13.26,"endTime":15.12,"body":"answer this question or come to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":15.12,"endTime":18.24,"body":"a consensus but simply sharing"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":15.12,"endTime":18.24,"body":"our perspectives. Today's"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":18.24,"endTime":21.84,"body":"question is, how do I overcome"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":18.24,"endTime":21.84,"body":"shame about my orientation?"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":22.32,"endTime":24.27,"body":"Charlie and I are not"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":22.32,"endTime":24.27,"body":"terribly diverse and we share"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":24.27,"endTime":25.92,"body":"many opinions and life"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":24.27,"endTime":25.92,"body":"experiences."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":26.07,"endTime":28.29,"body":"For example, we both"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":26.07,"endTime":28.29,"body":"have brothers that are hotter"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":28.29,"endTime":28.8,"body":"than we are."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":29.25,"endTime":31.71,"body":"However, there's some"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":29.25,"endTime":31.71,"body":"pretty big differences. For"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":31.71,"endTime":33.84,"body":"example, Charlie came out to his"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":31.71,"endTime":33.84,"body":"brother while hiking"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":33.84,"endTime":36.81,"body":"Kilimanjaro, and I came out to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":33.84,"endTime":36.81,"body":"one of my brothers while sitting"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":36.81,"endTime":37.59,"body":"in his living room."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":39.97,"endTime":42.13,"body":"On this podcast, we"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":39.97,"endTime":42.13,"body":"want to provide you with a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":42.13,"endTime":44.29,"body":"variety of voices and"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":42.13,"endTime":44.29,"body":"perspectives. So today, we're"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":44.29,"endTime":45.22,"body":"joined by Stacey."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":45.55,"endTime":46.75,"body":"Hey, what's up guys?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":46.87,"endTime":49.3,"body":"Welcome. We're excited"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":46.87,"endTime":49.3,"body":"to have you. Tell us a little"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":49.33,"endTime":49.96,"body":"about yourself."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":49.99,"endTime":53.32,"body":"Ooh, where do I begin?"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":49.99,"endTime":53.32,"body":"It was a dark and stormy night."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":53.59,"endTime":57.64,"body":"No. I'm from Dallas, Texas. I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":53.59,"endTime":57.64,"body":"grew up in Texas. Came to BYU"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":57.64,"endTime":60.76,"body":"when I was, when I graduated"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":57.64,"endTime":60.76,"body":"high school like most people."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":61.93,"endTime":62.89,"body":"What year did you"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":61.93,"endTime":62.89,"body":"graduate?"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":62.92,"endTime":66.46,"body":"I graduated in, well, I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":62.92,"endTime":66.46,"body":"graduated in 2014. Winter of"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":66.46,"endTime":67.15,"body":"2014."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":67.18,"endTime":68.83,"body":"Okay, so you're 24."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":69.59,"endTime":72.68,"body":"No, I went to school"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":69.59,"endTime":72.68,"body":"like, in like, 2006. I'm like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":72.71,"endTime":73.25,"body":"31."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":74.62,"endTime":75.79,"body":"You graduated from BYU in"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":74.62,"endTime":75.79,"body":"2014."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":75.94,"endTime":77.11,"body":"I thought you were"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":75.94,"endTime":77.11,"body":"talking about high school."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":77.11,"endTime":80.59,"body":"Oh, no. Oh, I was like,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":77.11,"endTime":80.59,"body":"no. I was like, you did the math"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":80.59,"endTime":82.12,"body":"so fast and no I feel so old."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":82.12,"endTime":83.86,"body":"It's a good thing they"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":82.12,"endTime":83.86,"body":"can't see you. They can only"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":83.86,"endTime":84.46,"body":"hear your voice."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":84.49,"endTime":86.23,"body":"Yeah. And you couldn't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":84.49,"endTime":86.23,"body":"see me blush even if you could."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":87.46,"endTime":91.06,"body":"Benefits of having nice"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":87.46,"endTime":91.06,"body":"chocolate skin. But um, I came"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":91.06,"endTime":95.05,"body":"to BYU and I studied public"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":91.06,"endTime":95.05,"body":"relations. I graduated BYU in"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":95.05,"endTime":99.85,"body":"2014. And then I immediately"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":95.05,"endTime":99.85,"body":"started working full time for"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":100.39,"endTime":103.99,"body":"BYU TV. I worked for on a show"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":100.39,"endTime":103.99,"body":"called Studio C, which some"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":103.99,"endTime":105.79,"body":"people in this community have"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":103.99,"endTime":105.79,"body":"heard of."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":105.79,"endTime":107.02,"body":"Hasn't Conan O'Brien heard"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":105.79,"endTime":107.02,"body":"of it?"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":107.05,"endTime":109.9,"body":"Conan O'Brien, I heard"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":107.05,"endTime":109.9,"body":"that he still tells people about"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":109.9,"endTime":111.46,"body":"it. I am flattered."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":110.16,"endTime":111.18,"body":"Weren't you on his sh"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":112.56,"endTime":116.16,"body":"I was on the Conan"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":112.56,"endTime":116.16,"body":"O'Brien Show with Conan O'Brien."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":116.19,"endTime":116.64,"body":"That's amazing."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":116.64,"endTime":118.5,"body":"It wasn't even like not"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":116.64,"endTime":118.5,"body":"with him. It was with him."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":118.65,"endTime":119.34,"body":"Wow."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":119.64,"endTime":121.95,"body":"It was very, it was one"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":119.64,"endTime":121.95,"body":"of our moments, which is very,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":121.95,"endTime":125.07,"body":"like, it made us feel like we"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":121.95,"endTime":125.07,"body":"were doing, doing all right, you"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":125.07,"endTime":125.37,"body":"know?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":125.43,"endTime":126.15,"body":"Yeah, that's cool."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":127.32,"endTime":131.31,"body":"So we actually left"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":127.32,"endTime":131.31,"body":"studio C, not too long ago,"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":131.88,"endTime":136.38,"body":"September of 2018. And then I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":131.88,"endTime":136.38,"body":"came out December of 2018"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":136.44,"endTime":137.19,"body":"publicly."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":137.61,"endTime":139.86,"body":"What was that like?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":137.61,"endTime":139.86,"body":"Especially coming from, so you"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":139.86,"endTime":141.51,"body":"waited to come out until after"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":139.86,"endTime":141.51,"body":"you graduated to come out"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":141.51,"endTime":141.87,"body":"publicly."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":141.87,"endTime":143.1,"body":"I waited until after I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":141.87,"endTime":143.1,"body":"graduated."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":143.0,"endTime":144.8,"body":"Me too. So I'm just"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":143.0,"endTime":144.8,"body":"wondering if we had similar"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":144.8,"endTime":145.37,"body":"experiences."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":145.4,"endTime":146.72,"body":"It was wild."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":146.72,"endTime":147.62,"body":"It was crazy, huh?"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":147.71,"endTime":149.48,"body":"I yeah. It's it's"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":147.71,"endTime":149.48,"body":"actually like one of those"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":149.48,"endTime":151.79,"body":"things where it's like people"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":149.48,"endTime":151.79,"body":"asked if I didn't come out"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":151.88,"endTime":155.09,"body":"earlier because of BYU. And no,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":151.88,"endTime":155.09,"body":"no, not really. I just needed"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":155.09,"endTime":156.35,"body":"time to like, figure out my"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":155.09,"endTime":156.35,"body":"stuff."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":156.35,"endTime":156.65,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":156.8,"endTime":158.87,"body":"And I'm a very"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":156.8,"endTime":158.87,"body":"headstrong person. So once I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":158.9,"endTime":161.3,"body":"know what I'm doing, I'm doing"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":158.9,"endTime":161.3,"body":"it. You know what I mean?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":161.33,"endTime":161.69,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":162.26,"endTime":165.47,"body":"It just took me a while"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":162.26,"endTime":165.47,"body":"to get there. So after, you"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":165.47,"endTime":169.1,"body":"know, talking to various Bishops"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":165.47,"endTime":169.1,"body":"and praying about it, and I took"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":169.1,"endTime":171.71,"body":"it to the temple, and I did like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":169.1,"endTime":171.71,"body":"all I talked to a Stake"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":171.71,"endTime":174.14,"body":"President. Yeah, I was like, you"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":171.71,"endTime":174.14,"body":"know, what, I'm gonna come out"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":174.14,"endTime":178.55,"body":"and I'm gonna start dating. And"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":174.14,"endTime":178.55,"body":"that, I was really, like, talked"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":178.55,"endTime":181.31,"body":"to everyone at work. I was like,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":178.55,"endTime":181.31,"body":"\"Oh, my gosh, so this could"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":181.31,"endTime":186.14,"body":"really hurt our company, because"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":181.31,"endTime":186.14,"body":"we create clean content.\" Right?"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":186.14,"endTime":188.51,"body":"And we know, we have a lot of"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":186.14,"endTime":188.51,"body":"very conservative consumers of"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":188.51,"endTime":193.07,"body":"our content. And it's, you know,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":188.51,"endTime":193.07,"body":"what's the like, the stereotype"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":193.07,"endTime":196.01,"body":"is not, is that conservatives"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":193.07,"endTime":196.01,"body":"aren't very supportive of LGBTQ."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":196.04,"endTime":196.52,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":197.47,"endTime":200.8,"body":"And so I was like, Hey,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":197.47,"endTime":200.8,"body":"guys, \"I, is this a concern for"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":200.8,"endTime":203.35,"body":"anyone?\" and my friends were all"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":200.8,"endTime":203.35,"body":"like, incredibly supportive."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":203.35,"endTime":206.35,"body":"They were like, if people feel"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":203.35,"endTime":206.35,"body":"like your sexual orientation"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":206.35,"endTime":208.69,"body":"isn't friendly, family friendly"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":206.35,"endTime":208.69,"body":"that's their problem."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":208.75,"endTime":209.2,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":209.26,"endTime":213.31,"body":"And we support you 100%."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":209.26,"endTime":213.31,"body":"So I came out publicly, and I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":213.31,"endTime":215.65,"body":"was ready for the worst. I was"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":213.31,"endTime":215.65,"body":"ready for like to lose"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":215.65,"endTime":218.71,"body":"everything and like, the world"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":215.65,"endTime":218.71,"body":"to come at me. And yeah, there"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":218.71,"endTime":221.14,"body":"were some haters, but it was"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":218.71,"endTime":221.14,"body":"overwhelmingly very positive."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":221.2,"endTime":223.06,"body":"Yeah, that's cool. I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":221.2,"endTime":223.06,"body":"had a similar experience,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":223.06,"endTime":226.57,"body":"because, I mean, I was Cosmo."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":223.06,"endTime":226.57,"body":"And I had spent years building"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":226.57,"endTime":229.24,"body":"this brand and really making"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":226.57,"endTime":229.24,"body":"Cosmo cool. And he's like, this"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":229.24,"endTime":233.02,"body":"masculine, like, energetic like,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":229.24,"endTime":233.02,"body":"I don't know."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":233.02,"endTime":233.14,"body":"Cougar?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":233.14,"endTime":236.11,"body":"And I was so worried."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":233.14,"endTime":236.11,"body":"Yeah, Cougar. And I was so"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":236.11,"endTime":237.67,"body":"worried that coming out with"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":236.11,"endTime":237.67,"body":"like,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":238.69,"endTime":239.74,"body":"Like, kind of hurt that"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":238.69,"endTime":239.74,"body":"image."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":239.75,"endTime":242.6,"body":"Yeah, yeah. Cuz like, I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":239.75,"endTime":242.6,"body":"worked so hard working on this"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":242.6,"endTime":244.91,"body":"image, and I cared about it. I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":242.6,"endTime":244.91,"body":"didn't want it to be directly"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":244.91,"endTime":248.09,"body":"associated with me or like, make"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":244.91,"endTime":248.09,"body":"it look bad. But yeah, all my"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":248.12,"endTime":251.0,"body":"like my teammates, my coach,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":248.12,"endTime":251.0,"body":"people, athletics acted the same"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":251.0,"endTime":252.44,"body":"way. They were like, you know,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":251.0,"endTime":252.44,"body":"if you feel like this is"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":252.44,"endTime":253.73,"body":"something you need to do, go for"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":252.44,"endTime":253.73,"body":"it."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":253.76,"endTime":254.6,"body":"You talked to everyone"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":253.76,"endTime":254.6,"body":"about it?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":254.6,"endTime":254.96,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":255.02,"endTime":255.98,"body":"It's kind of freaky."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":256.04,"endTime":256.43,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":256.49,"endTime":258.77,"body":"It's like, you feel like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":256.49,"endTime":258.77,"body":"you have a lot on the line, you"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":258.77,"endTime":259.01,"body":"know?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":259.04,"endTime":259.4,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":259.64,"endTime":261.56,"body":"I actually, there were"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":259.64,"endTime":261.56,"body":"rumors. When I was in the PR"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":261.56,"endTime":264.32,"body":"program there were rumors in the"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":261.56,"endTime":264.32,"body":"PR school that I was Cosmo."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":266.12,"endTime":266.99,"body":"Steal my thunder."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":266.99,"endTime":270.14,"body":"I like could even fit"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":266.99,"endTime":270.14,"body":"that costume. I'm five, six. It"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":270.14,"endTime":272.36,"body":"would have like, like really"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":270.14,"endTime":272.36,"body":"slack arms and like..."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":272.48,"endTime":275.57,"body":"Well, okay, don't take"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":272.48,"endTime":275.57,"body":"this wrong way. But so I, the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":275.57,"endTime":278.15,"body":"Cosmo, whoever's Cosmo has to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":275.57,"endTime":278.15,"body":"wear eye black. Because eyes"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":278.15,"endTime":281.21,"body":"look look really creepy, because"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":278.15,"endTime":281.21,"body":"you can see through the eyes."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":281.21,"endTime":283.19,"body":"Ohhh, then you do black"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":281.21,"endTime":283.19,"body":"faces Cosmo. I'm just kidding."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":284.39,"endTime":288.26,"body":"Not quite, but we were"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":284.39,"endTime":288.26,"body":"like, like eye black, like"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":288.26,"endTime":290.45,"body":"makeup around the eyes just so"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":288.26,"endTime":290.45,"body":"it matches."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":290.48,"endTime":291.86,"body":"That Cosmos like is"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":290.48,"endTime":291.86,"body":"the..."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":291.84,"endTime":297.0,"body":"Like, the dark. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":291.84,"endTime":297.0,"body":"whatever it is. And so that was"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":296.52,"endTime":307.8,"body":"That's really why."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":297.0,"endTime":301.26,"body":"like, no offense, but that wa"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":297.0,"endTime":301.26,"body":"like one of our outs, becaus"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":301.26,"endTime":303.66,"body":"people would talk about Cosmo"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":301.26,"endTime":303.66,"body":"like, \"Oh, he's one of the blac"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":303.66,"endTime":306.99,"body":"guys on campus\" and we're lik"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":303.66,"endTime":306.99,"body":", \"Awesome. We're safe. They're"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":306.99,"endTime":309.66,"body":"not gonna find us.\""},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":307.98,"endTime":309.15,"body":"Yeah, because the eye"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":307.98,"endTime":309.15,"body":"black."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":309.51,"endTime":311.76,"body":"Cuz I was like, I don't"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":309.51,"endTime":311.76,"body":"understand why people thought I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":311.76,"endTime":313.5,"body":"was Cosmo. They were like, they"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":311.76,"endTime":313.5,"body":"would be like \"Where were you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":313.5,"endTime":318.3,"body":"the other night?\" At the game I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":313.5,"endTime":318.3,"body":"see. And I was like, at home"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":318.57,"endTime":319.17,"body":"eating popcorn."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":319.2,"endTime":320.94,"body":"Well, and then I would"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":319.2,"endTime":320.94,"body":"always walk around looking like"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":320.94,"endTime":323.01,"body":"Green Day or something because I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":320.94,"endTime":323.01,"body":"couldn't get it off. And it"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":323.01,"endTime":325.62,"body":"looked like I was wearing"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":323.01,"endTime":325.62,"body":"guyliner which which you know,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":325.65,"endTime":330.42,"body":"secretly, I kind of loved. My"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":325.65,"endTime":330.42,"body":"pupils are poppin."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":330.42,"endTime":331.62,"body":"Fabulous. you was like..."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":333.72,"endTime":336.72,"body":"I know, for my job I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":333.72,"endTime":336.72,"body":"like, I like, often I get to"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":336.72,"endTime":337.95,"body":"dress up all the time for my"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":336.72,"endTime":337.95,"body":"job."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":337.95,"endTime":338.34,"body":"Yeah, yeah."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":338.37,"endTime":340.83,"body":"So it's like, really"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":338.37,"endTime":340.83,"body":"fun to be like, oooooh. You"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":340.83,"endTime":342.57,"body":"know? Anyways."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":342.84,"endTime":345.36,"body":"So I haven't dressed up for"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":342.84,"endTime":345.36,"body":"a job. And when I came out, no"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":345.36,"endTime":346.02,"body":"one had heard of me."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":347.28,"endTime":348.3,"body":"All right. That's..."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":348.3,"endTime":348.96,"body":"Not a big deal."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":348.99,"endTime":350.16,"body":"That's one of our many"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":348.99,"endTime":350.16,"body":"differences."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":350.13,"endTime":352.17,"body":"I actually had a friend"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":350.13,"endTime":352.17,"body":"recommended me. When I came out"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":352.17,"endTime":354.81,"body":"they were like, \"Hey, you shoul"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":352.17,"endTime":354.81,"body":"look up Ben Schilaty and li"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":354.81,"endTime":357.87,"body":"e his story and like talk to h"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":354.81,"endTime":357.87,"body":"m or something.\""},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":356.84,"endTime":357.38,"body":"Ah."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":357.5,"endTime":358.52,"body":"I don't know if you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":357.5,"endTime":358.52,"body":"know my friend \u003cbleep\u003e."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":359.72,"endTime":362.66,"body":"Are you kidding me? I dated"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":359.72,"endTime":362.66,"body":"\u003cbleep\u003e his roommate."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":362.69,"endTime":363.86,"body":"Shut up. Who's your"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":362.69,"endTime":363.86,"body":"roommate?"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":363.86,"endTime":363.89,"body":"\u003cbleep\u003e"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":366.05,"endTime":368.33,"body":"Well, I'm gonna keep"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":366.05,"endTime":368.33,"body":"this in but bleep out the names."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":368.84,"endTime":369.56,"body":"This is funny."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":369.95,"endTime":370.94,"body":"Wait, you did?"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":371.0,"endTime":372.26,"body":"She loves you."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":371.03,"endTime":371.36,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":372.29,"endTime":373.91,"body":"Oh I love her. She's in."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":374.42,"endTime":375.86,"body":"I love her. She's a"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":374.42,"endTime":375.86,"body":"great human being."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":375.92,"endTime":376.85,"body":"Yes, of course. That's"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":376.85,"endTime":377.45,"body":"That's so funny."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":377.45,"endTime":379.43,"body":"I actually wrote my"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":377.45,"endTime":379.43,"body":"dissertation, not my"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":379.43,"endTime":382.52,"body":"dissertation, my master's thesis"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":379.43,"endTime":382.52,"body":"about her and her sister and how"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":382.52,"endTime":384.17,"body":"they, their accents when they"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":382.52,"endTime":384.17,"body":"speak Spanish?"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":384.89,"endTime":386.03,"body":"Ohhhh, you speak"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":384.89,"endTime":386.03,"body":"Spanish?"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":386.03,"endTime":386.69,"body":"Yeah, I do."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":386.72,"endTime":387.23,"body":"Si, Senor."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":386.781,"endTime":389.841,"body":"I mean, they're amazing."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":388.68,"endTime":389.97,"body":"Just charms. I love"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":388.68,"endTime":389.97,"body":"that."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":390.0,"endTime":391.65,"body":"Yes, I wrote my thesis"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":390.0,"endTime":391.65,"body":"about them."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":391.95,"endTime":393.81,"body":"I want to talk more"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":391.95,"endTime":393.81,"body":"about it. But I don't want to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":393.66,"endTime":394.98,"body":"No we're gonna be"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":393.66,"endTime":394.98,"body":"talking about shame. Let's talk"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":393.81,"endTime":394.23,"body":"waste your podcast."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":394.0,"endTime":396.82,"body":"I don't want to waste"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":394.0,"endTime":396.82,"body":"your podcast."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":394.98,"endTime":397.38,"body":"about shame."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":396.82,"endTime":400.48,"body":"Let's take it down"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":396.82,"endTime":400.48,"body":"quite a few notches and talk"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":400.48,"endTime":401.68,"body":"about internalized shame."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":401.71,"endTime":403.45,"body":"Surprise. This is a"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":401.71,"endTime":403.45,"body":"really fun topic."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":404.65,"endTime":405.64,"body":"What do you got for us"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":404.65,"endTime":405.64,"body":"today?"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":405.0,"endTime":408.63,"body":"Gosh. Dang. Wow. That's a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":405.0,"endTime":408.63,"body":"tough one. Because it can be"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":408.63,"endTime":412.65,"body":"really, it's not like super"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":408.63,"endTime":412.65,"body":"tangible. But it's so visceral."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":412.68,"endTime":417.21,"body":"You know what I mean? We know"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":412.68,"endTime":417.21,"body":"shame is bad. I think everyone's"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":417.21,"endTime":420.06,"body":"pretty much on this same page"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":417.21,"endTime":420.06,"body":"where like, guilt can be a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":420.06,"endTime":424.14,"body":"motivator to be better. Shame is"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":420.06,"endTime":424.14,"body":"a motivator that like, motivates"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":424.14,"endTime":427.62,"body":"you to distance yourself from"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":424.14,"endTime":427.62,"body":"people like withdraw? Yeah, you"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":427.62,"endTime":430.62,"body":"guys could probably maybe define"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":427.62,"endTime":430.62,"body":"that a little bit better. But"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":430.62,"endTime":433.59,"body":"um, shame is bad. I think if you"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":430.62,"endTime":433.59,"body":"got it...."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":434.01,"endTime":437.85,"body":"What Brene Brown would say is,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":434.01,"endTime":437.85,"body":"\"Shame is 'I am bad'. Guilt is"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":437.88,"endTime":438.99,"body":"'I did something bad'.\""},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":441.33,"endTime":443.55,"body":"What a relevant topic"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":441.33,"endTime":443.55,"body":"for what we're talking about."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":444.18,"endTime":447.69,"body":"Because I know that growing up,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":444.18,"endTime":447.69,"body":"it was really hard for me to"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":447.69,"endTime":451.17,"body":"like, well, you just feel"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":447.69,"endTime":451.17,"body":"broken. You know? You feel"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":451.17,"endTime":454.62,"body":"broken. You feel like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":451.17,"endTime":454.62,"body":"disgusting. You feel like,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":454.92,"endTime":458.79,"body":"tainted or whatever. I remember"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":454.92,"endTime":458.79,"body":"thinking of my sexuality being"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":458.79,"endTime":462.27,"body":"like, it's the thorn in my side."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":458.79,"endTime":462.27,"body":"And I remember, there was a"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":462.27,"endTime":465.39,"body":"point when I was like, this"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":462.27,"endTime":465.39,"body":"thorn will never be pulled out."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":465.42,"endTime":469.23,"body":"It'll just be here. And you what"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":465.42,"endTime":469.23,"body":"a pain that is? You know?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":469.26,"endTime":470.64,"body":"Where do you think"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":469.26,"endTime":470.64,"body":"those feelings came from?"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":471.44,"endTime":474.02,"body":"Oh, man, there's"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":471.44,"endTime":474.02,"body":"probably so many factors. I grew"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":474.02,"endTime":478.64,"body":"up in Texas, Southern very,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":474.02,"endTime":478.64,"body":"like, Southern black culture,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":478.7,"endTime":481.94,"body":"right? Very, like macho and"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":478.7,"endTime":481.94,"body":"stuff. Like, in fact, when I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":481.94,"endTime":485.99,"body":"came to BYU, I was like, I did"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":481.94,"endTime":485.99,"body":"think, and I don't know if this"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":485.99,"endTime":488.69,"body":"is rude, or whatever. I thought"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":485.99,"endTime":488.69,"body":"everyone was gay. I'm gonna be"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":488.69,"endTime":491.09,"body":"honest. Because I was like, just"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":488.69,"endTime":491.09,"body":"the way people acted. I was"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":491.09,"endTime":491.33,"body":"like."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":491.36,"endTime":492.98,"body":"And they dress kind of"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":491.36,"endTime":492.98,"body":"weird, too in Provo."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":492.98,"endTime":495.02,"body":"And they're like, let's"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":492.98,"endTime":495.02,"body":"watch Disney movies."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":495.05,"endTime":497.21,"body":"Well, I was like, in"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":495.05,"endTime":497.21,"body":"Texas you would have got pegged"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":497.21,"endTime":499.52,"body":"a long time ago. You know, we"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":497.21,"endTime":499.52,"body":"get really good at like,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":499.52,"endTime":500.39,"body":"pretending and hiding."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":500.78,"endTime":500.99,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":500.84,"endTime":503.27,"body":"So we don't like, you"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":500.84,"endTime":503.27,"body":"know, so we don't let on. But I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":503.27,"endTime":505.82,"body":"came to Provo and I felt like I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":503.27,"endTime":505.82,"body":"could like, let go a little bit"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":505.82,"endTime":509.84,"body":"of that like, macho thing I was"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":505.82,"endTime":509.84,"body":"trying to be. But anyways, that"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":509.84,"endTime":513.08,"body":"comes from like, you know, how I"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":509.84,"endTime":513.08,"body":"grew up the culture, and in the"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":513.08,"endTime":514.94,"body":"church, you know what I mean?"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":513.08,"endTime":514.94,"body":"It's a little bit deeper than"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":514.94,"endTime":518.6,"body":"just like, it's bad to be gay."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":514.94,"endTime":518.6,"body":"It's more like your eternal"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":518.6,"endTime":521.45,"body":"salvation is at stake. You know"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":518.6,"endTime":521.45,"body":"what I mean? It's a little more"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":521.45,"endTime":524.66,"body":"like, perspective a little more"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":521.45,"endTime":524.66,"body":"than like, it sucks now."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":525.02,"endTime":527.63,"body":"So you were worried that"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":525.02,"endTime":527.63,"body":"your orientation was something"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":527.63,"endTime":529.4,"body":"that would jeopardize your"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":527.63,"endTime":529.4,"body":"eternity?"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":529.64,"endTime":531.86,"body":"Oh, man, my orientation"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":529.64,"endTime":531.86,"body":"I knew was gonna jeopardize my"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":531.86,"endTime":536.45,"body":"chances here for work, for"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":531.86,"endTime":536.45,"body":"friends, for my family loving me"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":536.45,"endTime":538.91,"body":"or like accepting me and my"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":536.45,"endTime":538.91,"body":"parents being proud of me. And"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":538.91,"endTime":542.42,"body":"then I knew that like, God hated"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":538.91,"endTime":542.42,"body":"me. I knew he'd like hated that,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":542.45,"endTime":545.54,"body":"you know what I mean? It took me"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":542.45,"endTime":545.54,"body":"a really long time to, to get to"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":545.54,"endTime":548.12,"body":"the point where I was like, God"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":545.54,"endTime":548.12,"body":"hates that. Not me. And then to"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":548.12,"endTime":550.88,"body":"get to the point where it's"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":548.12,"endTime":550.88,"body":"like, oh, maybe he doesn't hate"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":551.0,"endTime":552.86,"body":"that. You know what I mean?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":553.05,"endTime":556.35,"body":"When I was growing up,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":553.05,"endTime":556.35,"body":"I had this reoccurring I would"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":556.35,"endTime":558.69,"body":"say dream, but it was more of a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":556.35,"endTime":558.69,"body":"daydream it was more my thoughts"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":558.69,"endTime":561.93,"body":"running wild. And it was always"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":558.69,"endTime":561.93,"body":"Judgment Day. And I was standing"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":561.93,"endTime":565.08,"body":"there like surrounded by the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":561.93,"endTime":565.08,"body":"generations, my whole family and"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":565.08,"endTime":568.59,"body":"there was this big screen. And"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":565.08,"endTime":568.59,"body":"everyone like gasps when they"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":568.59,"endTime":571.65,"body":"see like the world from my point"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":568.59,"endTime":571.65,"body":"of view and see that I'm"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":571.65,"endTime":575.46,"body":"attracted to men. And everyone"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":571.65,"endTime":575.46,"body":"just like yelling at me and"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":575.46,"endTime":579.3,"body":"they're so disappointed and God"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":575.46,"endTime":579.3,"body":"hammers and there's a pit that"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":579.3,"endTime":582.42,"body":"opens and I just, like, fall"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":579.3,"endTime":582.42,"body":"into hell and watch my family be"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":582.42,"endTime":583.32,"body":"separated from me."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":584.2,"endTime":586.93,"body":"Oh my gosh! That's"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":584.2,"endTime":586.93,"body":"intense."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":585.69,"endTime":587.97,"body":"Yeah, yeah, it was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":585.69,"endTime":587.97,"body":"dramatic and, and like that was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":587.97,"endTime":595.77,"body":"my view of, of like the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":587.97,"endTime":595.77,"body":"afterlife. And yeah, like, I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":595.77,"endTime":598.14,"body":"don't know. Now. I'm just kind"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":595.77,"endTime":598.14,"body":"of sad thinking about that"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":598.14,"endTime":601.5,"body":"because I just, I'm just crushe"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":598.14,"endTime":601.5,"body":"that like, the little 15 year"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":601.5,"endTime":605.58,"body":"ld me was, was so worried that j"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":601.5,"endTime":605.58,"body":"st my very existence was go"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":605.58,"endTime":608.13,"body":"na distance me from everybody"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":605.58,"endTime":608.13,"body":"nd everything that I lov"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":610.26,"endTime":613.2,"body":"I didn't have anything"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":610.26,"endTime":613.2,"body":"quite that significant..."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":613.0,"endTime":613.9,"body":"I'm kind of dramatic."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":613.54,"endTime":618.28,"body":"...or dramatic. But when I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":613.54,"endTime":618.28,"body":"was when I was 23 and getting to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":618.28,"endTime":620.23,"body":"a point where I had to come out"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":618.28,"endTime":620.23,"body":"because I just couldn't deal"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":620.23,"endTime":623.02,"body":"with, deal with what was going"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":620.23,"endTime":623.02,"body":"on on my own anymore. I remember"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":623.02,"endTime":625.78,"body":"going to see a movie with some"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":623.02,"endTime":625.78,"body":"friends and just, I just could"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":625.78,"endTime":628.15,"body":"not stop thinking about being"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":625.78,"endTime":628.15,"body":"gay and how much I just wanted"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":628.15,"endTime":631.87,"body":"it to go away. And we saw Spider"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":628.15,"endTime":631.87,"body":"Man 3, which is not a great"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":631.87,"endTime":634.9,"body":"movie, but it was a wonderful"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":631.87,"endTime":634.9,"body":"escape from reality for me. And"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":634.9,"endTime":636.94,"body":"before the movie started, one of"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":634.9,"endTime":636.94,"body":"my friends could tell something"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":636.94,"endTime":639.31,"body":"was going on with me. She said,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":636.94,"endTime":639.31,"body":"Ben, \"Are you okay? Like what's"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":639.31,"endTime":641.41,"body":"going on?\" And in my head, I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":639.31,"endTime":641.41,"body":"thought , \"If you knew you would"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":641.41,"endTime":643.84,"body":"hate me.\" I really felt like if"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":641.41,"endTime":643.84,"body":"people knew about my"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":643.84,"endTime":644.83,"body":"orientation, they would hate me."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":645.55,"endTime":648.76,"body":"So, Stacey, how did you"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":645.55,"endTime":648.76,"body":"overcome those feelings? How did"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":648.76,"endTime":649.09,"body":"you?"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":649.63,"endTime":651.67,"body":"What do you mean \"How"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":649.63,"endTime":651.67,"body":"did I\"? How am I..."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":651.67,"endTime":654.67,"body":"How are you still? You"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":651.67,"endTime":654.67,"body":"know, it's still kinda baked in"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":654.67,"endTime":654.79,"body":"to us."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":654.72,"endTime":656.61,"body":"Yeah, I think that's"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":654.72,"endTime":656.61,"body":"kind of the thing is like, it's"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":656.61,"endTime":660.96,"body":"not just like, and now I'm"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":656.61,"endTime":660.96,"body":"shameless. But I do think, and"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":660.96,"endTime":665.64,"body":"I'm gonna be honest, guys, like,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":660.96,"endTime":665.64,"body":"I do think in some ways, coming"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":665.64,"endTime":669.27,"body":"out has been a more pleasant"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":665.64,"endTime":669.27,"body":"journey for me. And I think it's"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":669.27,"endTime":672.21,"body":"because it's not my first rodeo"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":669.27,"endTime":672.21,"body":"as a minority, to be honest."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":672.78,"endTime":675.21,"body":"Like, there's so many"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":672.78,"endTime":675.21,"body":"internalized messages, there're"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":675.21,"endTime":677.94,"body":"so many messages, we internalize"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":675.21,"endTime":677.94,"body":"that the world tells us about"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":677.94,"endTime":680.49,"body":"sexuality, about ourselves about"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":677.94,"endTime":680.49,"body":"what it means to be a man and"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":680.91,"endTime":683.34,"body":"don't be a pansy. Like we're"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":680.91,"endTime":683.34,"body":"constantly filtering these"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":683.34,"endTime":685.08,"body":"messages out, right, and"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":683.34,"endTime":685.08,"body":"changing our behavior"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":685.08,"endTime":687.12,"body":"accordingly, or how we treat"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":685.08,"endTime":687.12,"body":"ourselves or look at ourselves."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":687.9,"endTime":691.47,"body":"But growing up black, so for all"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":687.9,"endTime":691.47,"body":"the viewers out there can't tell"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":691.5,"endTime":696.12,"body":"I am black and proud. Nice"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":691.5,"endTime":696.12,"body":"little short chocolate, man. All"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":696.12,"endTime":701.4,"body":"right. So um, so like, being"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":696.12,"endTime":701.4,"body":"black in this country is not"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":701.4,"endTime":705.33,"body":"necessarily like an easy thing"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":701.4,"endTime":705.33,"body":"all the time. And so my parents"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":705.33,"endTime":708.57,"body":"knew that growing up that I, we"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":705.33,"endTime":708.57,"body":"needed to believe something"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":708.57,"endTime":710.82,"body":"about ourselves that the world"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":708.57,"endTime":710.82,"body":"wasn't gonna tell us. And so"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":710.82,"endTime":714.57,"body":"they tried so hard to infuse"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":710.82,"endTime":714.57,"body":"messages of our worth and our"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":714.57,"endTime":717.72,"body":"value. And just like, you know,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":714.57,"endTime":717.72,"body":"those kind of things that are"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":717.72,"endTime":720.24,"body":"like, \"You are worth something."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":717.72,"endTime":720.24,"body":"You are important. You have a"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":720.24,"endTime":724.35,"body":"voice that means something.\" And"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":720.24,"endTime":724.35,"body":"I, and I don't know, just like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":724.35,"endTime":727.47,"body":"growing up from that moment. I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":724.35,"endTime":727.47,"body":"was like being tested all the"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":727.47,"endTime":731.46,"body":"time. I remember having to like,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":727.47,"endTime":731.46,"body":"really, really, really believe"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":731.46,"endTime":733.65,"body":"that or I would have been, like,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":731.46,"endTime":733.65,"body":"crushed. When I first came to"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":733.65,"endTime":738.15,"body":"BYU someone was like, hey, like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":733.65,"endTime":738.15,"body":"a friend of mine, in quotations,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":739.68,"endTime":741.21,"body":"and they because, I say that"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":739.68,"endTime":741.21,"body":"because they weren't trying to"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":741.21,"endTime":743.13,"body":"be rude about it, they were just"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":741.21,"endTime":743.13,"body":"like, \"Hey, you should know"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":743.13,"endTime":746.13,"body":"you're only here because you're"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":743.13,"endTime":746.13,"body":"black. Like, like, that's the"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":746.13,"endTime":748.41,"body":"reason why you're here.\" You"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":746.13,"endTime":748.41,"body":"know what I mean? It's like,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":748.41,"endTime":751.8,"body":"stuff like that. And like, for"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":748.41,"endTime":751.8,"body":"someone who is like, I didn't"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":751.8,"endTime":753.51,"body":"really know too much about"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":751.8,"endTime":753.51,"body":"affirmative action, you know, I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":753.51,"endTime":755.25,"body":"mean, it's like for someone"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":753.51,"endTime":755.25,"body":"learning these things. I was"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":755.25,"endTime":758.13,"body":"like, constantly on the verge of"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":755.25,"endTime":758.13,"body":"like, second guessing who I am"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":758.13,"endTime":761.1,"body":"or what my value was, or if I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":758.13,"endTime":761.1,"body":"had value, you know, that kind"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":761.1,"endTime":761.49,"body":"of thing."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":761.58,"endTime":762.0,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":762.03,"endTime":764.04,"body":"But you just have to"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":762.03,"endTime":764.04,"body":"build yourself up because the"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":764.04,"endTime":766.35,"body":"difference about being gay and"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":764.04,"endTime":766.35,"body":"being black is people can look"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":766.35,"endTime":767.55,"body":"at me and tell I'm black, you"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":766.35,"endTime":767.55,"body":"know?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":767.58,"endTime":767.97,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":768.11,"endTime":771.08,"body":"So it's like, there was"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":768.11,"endTime":771.08,"body":"no, no chance of hiding."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":771.89,"endTime":778.19,"body":"Anyways, jump to nowadays coming"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":771.89,"endTime":778.19,"body":"out. The essential, I kind of"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":778.19,"endTime":780.68,"body":"just talked about this. Guys,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":778.19,"endTime":780.68,"body":"I'm obsessed with plants. You"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":780.68,"endTime":782.42,"body":"should know that I love house"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":780.68,"endTime":782.42,"body":"plants."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":782.45,"endTime":784.97,"body":"What kinds of plants? Like"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":782.45,"endTime":784.97,"body":"succulents?"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":785.12,"endTime":788.36,"body":"Ah, I'm not a huge fan"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":785.12,"endTime":788.36,"body":"of succulents, but I'll tolerate"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":788.0,"endTime":789.89,"body":"What about a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":788.0,"endTime":789.89,"body":"philodendron?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":788.36,"endTime":788.48,"body":"them."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":790.13,"endTime":791.45,"body":"Ooooh yes."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":791.48,"endTime":791.99,"body":"I just got one."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":791.99,"endTime":794.21,"body":"How about a nice little"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":791.99,"endTime":794.21,"body":"barrel cactus?"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":794.45,"endTime":795.41,"body":"A what?"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":795.44,"endTime":796.43,"body":"A barrel cactus."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":796.43,"endTime":797.0,"body":"What did you call them?"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":797.39,"endTime":798.53,"body":"Is that just your"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":797.39,"endTime":798.53,"body":"traditional like..."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":798.8,"endTime":799.88,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":799.9,"endTime":802.6,"body":"I'm into it. And I just"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":799.9,"endTime":802.6,"body":"like really like houseplants."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":802.84,"endTime":805.96,"body":"And I'm gonna go on a little"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":802.84,"endTime":805.96,"body":"tangent, but it has a point I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":805.96,"endTime":810.37,"body":"think. There is, so venus"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":805.96,"endTime":810.37,"body":"flytrap. So you guys heard of"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":810.37,"endTime":813.67,"body":"it? Carnivorous plant. It's the"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":810.37,"endTime":813.67,"body":"coolest plant. Everyone loves"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":813.67,"endTime":817.06,"body":"it. It's really flashy. It's"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":813.67,"endTime":817.06,"body":"really neat. It eats insects."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":817.06,"endTime":821.41,"body":"Like come on, that's awesome."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":817.06,"endTime":821.41,"body":"Right? And then there's another"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":821.41,"endTime":823.72,"body":"plant that you probably haven't"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":821.41,"endTime":823.72,"body":"heard of called the Z Z plant."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":823.78,"endTime":824.62,"body":"I have not heard of that."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":824.62,"endTime":825.13,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":825.46,"endTime":826.21,"body":"I know it."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":826.3,"endTime":828.61,"body":"You've heard of it? It's"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":826.3,"endTime":828.61,"body":"not that flashy. And it's not"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":828.61,"endTime":831.88,"body":"that cool looking and stuff. And"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":828.61,"endTime":831.88,"body":"people don't necessarily like,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":832.12,"endTime":835.24,"body":"it's not like the first plant"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":832.12,"endTime":835.24,"body":"people like, ooh. But the thing"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":835.24,"endTime":838.93,"body":"about the Venus Flytrap is that"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":835.24,"endTime":838.93,"body":"the Venus Flytrap needs to eat"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":838.96,"endTime":843.4,"body":"like insects, because it's like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":838.96,"endTime":843.4,"body":"soil is so poor in its root"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":843.4,"endTime":845.62,"body":"system, root system isn't like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":843.4,"endTime":845.62,"body":"amazing, like the things you"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":845.62,"endTime":849.31,"body":"don't see aren't necessarily"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":845.62,"endTime":849.31,"body":"like crazy fortified so it needs"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":849.31,"endTime":852.1,"body":"to get it from external places."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":849.31,"endTime":852.1,"body":"It needs nutrition from external"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":852.1,"endTime":854.53,"body":"places, and that plant is"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":852.1,"endTime":854.53,"body":"finicky. You put it in a"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":854.53,"endTime":857.62,"body":"different source of light, it's"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":854.53,"endTime":857.62,"body":"weak. You know, you feed it a"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":857.62,"endTime":860.14,"body":"different type of water. And"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":857.62,"endTime":860.14,"body":"it's like withering. It's a"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":860.14,"endTime":864.4,"body":"finicky plant. Right and the ZZ"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":860.14,"endTime":864.4,"body":"plant is a champ, you could put"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":864.4,"endTime":866.86,"body":"that thing in a dark corner and"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":864.4,"endTime":866.86,"body":"everything would thrive. It"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":866.86,"endTime":869.71,"body":"doesn't die. It's called the"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":866.86,"endTime":869.71,"body":"plant of steel. And the trick is"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":869.71,"endTime":874.0,"body":"that the ZZ plant has incredibly"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":869.71,"endTime":874.0,"body":"fortified roots that store water"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":874.03,"endTime":877.78,"body":"and nutrients like a boss. The"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":874.03,"endTime":877.78,"body":"ZZ plant gets its strength from"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":877.78,"endTime":881.32,"body":"internal places and that Venus"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":877.78,"endTime":881.32,"body":"flytrap needs all this external"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":881.32,"endTime":885.25,"body":"help. And I feel the same way"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":881.32,"endTime":885.25,"body":"about us as people where it's"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":885.25,"endTime":890.35,"body":"like, if you get your value from"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":885.25,"endTime":890.35,"body":"external places, that will"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":890.35,"endTime":893.74,"body":"control you and a flip of a"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":890.35,"endTime":893.74,"body":"switch something slightly"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":893.74,"endTime":895.6,"body":"different will just make, it'll"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":893.74,"endTime":895.6,"body":"make, make it'll make you"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":895.6,"endTime":898.06,"body":"crumble. You won't have a"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":895.6,"endTime":898.06,"body":"foundation. You need to have"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":898.06,"endTime":901.0,"body":"your like, your sense of worth"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":898.06,"endTime":901.0,"body":"and value, you what you believe"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":901.0,"endTime":903.97,"body":"about yourself has to come from"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":901.0,"endTime":903.97,"body":"like an internal place. You have"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":903.97,"endTime":906.37,"body":"to believe it first and"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":903.97,"endTime":906.37,"body":"foremost. You know what I mean?"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":906.82,"endTime":910.0,"body":"Because things change around"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":906.82,"endTime":910.0,"body":"you. Someone tells me I'm butt"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":910.0,"endTime":913.3,"body":"ugly. And I'm like, \"Nah, I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":910.0,"endTime":913.3,"body":"already know I'm a beautiful"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":913.3,"endTime":913.84,"body":"chocolate man."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":913.87,"endTime":916.99,"body":"So, so what are some of the"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":913.87,"endTime":916.99,"body":"external sources that that gave"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":916.99,"endTime":918.04,"body":"you feelings of shame?"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":918.0,"endTime":923.52,"body":"Yeah. So for example, I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":918.0,"endTime":923.52,"body":"think honestly, like, family"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":923.52,"endTime":926.25,"body":"growing up and not, not even"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":923.52,"endTime":926.25,"body":"purposely, it's like our parents"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":926.25,"endTime":928.59,"body":"were like, I'm gonna make you"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":926.25,"endTime":928.59,"body":"feel good about being black, but"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":928.59,"endTime":930.93,"body":"bad about being gay. They didn't"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":928.59,"endTime":930.93,"body":"know. But you get those mean,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":930.96,"endTime":933.51,"body":"you hear like your dad talk"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":930.96,"endTime":933.51,"body":"about what it means to be a man."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":934.08,"endTime":937.26,"body":"And like, or your people saying,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":934.08,"endTime":937.26,"body":"stop being a pansy. Or don't be"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":937.26,"endTime":939.84,"body":"a little like, why are you"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":937.26,"endTime":939.84,"body":"acting like a girl? You know"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":939.84,"endTime":942.87,"body":"what I mean? I hate to bring"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":939.84,"endTime":942.87,"body":"attention to that. Because it's"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":942.87,"endTime":946.05,"body":"such a such a rude thing to say."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":942.87,"endTime":946.05,"body":"But family or friends, you know"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":946.05,"endTime":948.09,"body":"what I mean? Like little"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":946.05,"endTime":948.09,"body":"offhanded things people say"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":948.09,"endTime":949.14,"body":"those things like stick."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":949.35,"endTime":949.59,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":949.62,"endTime":951.99,"body":"I get so many messages"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":949.62,"endTime":951.99,"body":"from kids that are like, I want"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":951.99,"endTime":956.01,"body":"to come out to my dad, who's a"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":951.99,"endTime":956.01,"body":"Bishop or something. But he once"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":956.01,"endTime":959.07,"body":"one time, sneered while watching"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":956.01,"endTime":959.07,"body":"like when Will \u0026 Grace came on,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":959.07,"endTime":960.33,"body":"and I can never talk to him."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":960.48,"endTime":960.78,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":960.78,"endTime":961.74,"body":"Those little things"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":960.78,"endTime":961.74,"body":"stick."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":961.74,"endTime":962.7,"body":"Like micro aggressions."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":962.7,"endTime":967.17,"body":"Yes. And then moving on."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":962.7,"endTime":967.17,"body":"The church has I think made it a"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":967.17,"endTime":970.05,"body":"really, really tough place for"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":967.17,"endTime":970.05,"body":"me, especially just being like,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":970.65,"endTime":973.77,"body":"how we talk about LGBTQ people,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":970.65,"endTime":973.77,"body":"especially back in the day when"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":973.77,"endTime":974.34,"body":"I was growing up."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":974.37,"endTime":974.73,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":975.06,"endTime":975.63,"body":"You know what I mean?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":975.66,"endTime":976.44,"body":"Yeah, absolutely."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":976.69,"endTime":978.61,"body":"I often say that most of"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":976.69,"endTime":978.61,"body":"the times I've heard about gay"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":978.61,"endTime":981.91,"body":"people talked about at church in"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":978.61,"endTime":981.91,"body":"the sense that it's bad and..."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":981.94,"endTime":982.39,"body":"Yeah"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":982.42,"endTime":982.87,"body":"awful"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":983.2,"endTime":983.74,"body":"Perverts."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":983.73,"endTime":985.44,"body":"And most of the times I've"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":983.73,"endTime":985.44,"body":"heard gay people talk about in a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":985.44,"endTime":988.17,"body":"nice way at church have been"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":985.44,"endTime":988.17,"body":"when I have said it."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":988.85,"endTime":989.27,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":989.84,"endTime":992.6,"body":"Yeah. So there's,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":989.84,"endTime":992.6,"body":"there's a lot of those external"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":992.6,"endTime":995.9,"body":"pressures that are just really"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":992.6,"endTime":995.9,"body":"tearing you down. You know what"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":995.9,"endTime":996.26,"body":"I mean?"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":996.44,"endTime":1000.25,"body":"Yeah. And what, where's"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":996.44,"endTime":1000.25,"body":"this internal, internal, this"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1000.25,"endTime":1003.19,"body":"internal sense of self worth,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1000.25,"endTime":1003.19,"body":"like, where does that come from?"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1003.25,"endTime":1007.18,"body":"I'm gonna be honest. The"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1003.25,"endTime":1007.18,"body":"way I feel about myself and I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1007.18,"endTime":1010.12,"body":"think friends can help that"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1007.18,"endTime":1010.12,"body":"sense. But the way I feel about"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1010.12,"endTime":1015.4,"body":"myself has come, is like, not"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1010.12,"endTime":1015.4,"body":"from, like, feedback I've gotten"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1015.4,"endTime":1018.64,"body":"from people. It comes from, like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1015.4,"endTime":1018.64,"body":"a very internal place, like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1018.67,"endTime":1021.82,"body":"almost something like spiritual"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1018.67,"endTime":1021.82,"body":"and sacred. Like, I have a very"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1021.82,"endTime":1025.45,"body":"firm belief that like, the more"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1021.82,"endTime":1025.45,"body":"you strive to stay close to the"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1025.45,"endTime":1028.45,"body":"Lord, the more he puts you where"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1025.45,"endTime":1028.45,"body":"he wants you and makes you what"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1028.45,"endTime":1030.16,"body":"he wants you to be. You know"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1028.45,"endTime":1030.16,"body":"what I mean?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1030.25,"endTime":1030.58,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1030.69,"endTime":1032.91,"body":"He just like transforms"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1030.69,"endTime":1032.91,"body":"you. I was speaking to a youth"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1032.91,"endTime":1035.37,"body":"group a couple weeks ago. And"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1032.91,"endTime":1035.37,"body":"after I finished, I was taking"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1035.37,"endTime":1040.41,"body":"questions, and one of the girls"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1035.37,"endTime":1040.41,"body":"raised her hand, and she says,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1040.5,"endTime":1044.01,"body":"\"You were talking about praying,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1040.5,"endTime":1044.01,"body":"and asking God for guidance,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1044.04,"endTime":1047.82,"body":"like coming out.\" And I was"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1044.04,"endTime":1047.82,"body":"like, Yeah, of course. And she"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1047.82,"endTime":1052.23,"body":"started crying. And she says,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1047.82,"endTime":1052.23,"body":"Why would I talk to someone who"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1052.23,"endTime":1060.09,"body":"hates me? And I broke, it was so"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1052.23,"endTime":1060.09,"body":"hard and, and part of the reason"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1060.09,"endTime":1063.87,"body":"I was breaking is because I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1060.09,"endTime":1063.87,"body":"remembered being exactly her age"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1063.93,"endTime":1068.79,"body":"and feeling exactly the same"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1063.93,"endTime":1068.79,"body":"thing. And I didn't realize this"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1068.79,"endTime":1072.66,"body":"at the time, but I was ashamed"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1068.79,"endTime":1072.66,"body":"of who I was. I remember I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1072.66,"endTime":1076.05,"body":"would, I would start my prayers"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1072.66,"endTime":1076.05,"body":"and apologize for my existence."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1076.5,"endTime":1080.25,"body":"I'd be like, Heavenly Father,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1076.5,"endTime":1080.25,"body":"I'm so sorry, that, that I am"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1080.25,"endTime":1086.55,"body":"me. I was so ashamed to be me."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1080.25,"endTime":1086.55,"body":"And I, I was just convinced that"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1086.55,"endTime":1087.81,"body":"God was ashamed of me."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1087.84,"endTime":1090.33,"body":"Could you imagine a parent"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1087.84,"endTime":1090.33,"body":"hearing their child feel that"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1090.33,"endTime":1092.19,"body":"way about them? That's gonna be"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1090.33,"endTime":1092.19,"body":"like, heartbreaking."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1092.25,"endTime":1095.67,"body":"Yeah. And in my"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1092.25,"endTime":1095.67,"body":"perceptions of who God was,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1096.27,"endTime":1099.09,"body":"weren't based on my actual"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1096.27,"endTime":1099.09,"body":"relationship with God. They were"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1099.09,"endTime":1102.66,"body":"based on what other people had"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1099.09,"endTime":1102.66,"body":"said about what it means to be"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1102.66,"endTime":1103.02,"body":"gay."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1103.14,"endTime":1103.89,"body":"Like what you thought."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1103.92,"endTime":1108.66,"body":"Yeah. And, and when I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1103.92,"endTime":1108.66,"body":"finally made that shift to, I'm"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1108.66,"endTime":1111.72,"body":"not broken, I'm not"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1108.66,"endTime":1111.72,"body":"unsalvageable, God didn't make"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1111.72,"endTime":1119.04,"body":"me by mistake, or purposefully"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1111.72,"endTime":1119.04,"body":"like, like, making me as like a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1119.04,"endTime":1120.39,"body":"rude joke. You know?"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1120.39,"endTime":1121.26,"body":"Like an accident."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1121.29,"endTime":1121.59,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1121.62,"endTime":1124.11,"body":"But he spilled the like,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1121.62,"endTime":1124.11,"body":"sexuality liquid and like,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1124.11,"endTime":1124.5,"body":"whoops."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1124.13,"endTime":1126.38,"body":"Right. And I'm like,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1124.13,"endTime":1126.38,"body":"and when I realized that, and I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1126.38,"endTime":1129.71,"body":"realized that he'd been there"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1126.38,"endTime":1129.71,"body":"the whole time, and who my"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1126.58,"endTime":1127.51,"body":"Yeah keep going."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1129.71,"endTime":1132.86,"body":"savior was, and who my heavenly"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1129.71,"endTime":1132.86,"body":"parents are, is so much"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1130.9,"endTime":1148.9,"body":"Stand on that box of"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1130.9,"endTime":1148.9,"body":"soap and preach."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1132.86,"endTime":1134.9,"body":"different than who I expected"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1132.86,"endTime":1134.9,"body":"them. That's when I was able to"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1134.9,"endTime":1138.89,"body":"start climbing out of my shame,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1134.9,"endTime":1138.89,"body":"and sharing the burden with"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1138.89,"endTime":1142.49,"body":"other people and coming out and,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1138.89,"endTime":1142.49,"body":"and instead of like, creeping"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1142.49,"endTime":1147.68,"body":"away into the dark closet, and,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1142.49,"endTime":1147.68,"body":"like, I mean, that there's a"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1147.68,"endTime":1150.65,"body":"reason that's the term we use."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1147.68,"endTime":1150.65,"body":"It's dark. It's horrible in"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1149.05,"endTime":1157.18,"body":"Well, it's just so"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1149.05,"endTime":1157.18,"body":"interesting, because I, at one"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1150.65,"endTime":1155.51,"body":"there. Once I started actually"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1150.65,"endTime":1155.51,"body":"creating a relationship with"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1155.51,"endTime":1158.27,"body":"God, like you were saying,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1155.51,"endTime":1158.27,"body":"that's when I was able to find"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1157.18,"endTime":1177.31,"body":"point, I was, I was in college,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1157.18,"endTime":1177.31,"body":"I was more popular than ever. I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1158.54,"endTime":1163.85,"body":"my identity and find my sel"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1158.54,"endTime":1163.85,"body":"worth. I have more to say, if I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1164.06,"endTime":1165.74,"body":"can I just stay on my soapbox"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1164.06,"endTime":1165.74,"body":"for a little bit"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1177.31,"endTime":1182.02,"body":"had a ton of cool friends. I was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1177.31,"endTime":1182.02,"body":"Cosmo. I loved my life. I had a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1182.02,"endTime":1185.35,"body":"4.0 and I had an athletic"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1182.02,"endTime":1185.35,"body":"scholarship. I had an academic"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1185.35,"endTime":1187.39,"body":"scholarship. I was killing it."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1187.84,"endTime":1190.84,"body":"The 4, 4.0 is like the"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1187.84,"endTime":1190.84,"body":"most impressive part of that."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1190.87,"endTime":1192.34,"body":"I'm like, blown away."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1192.43,"endTime":1194.35,"body":"Because I could be Cosmo,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1192.43,"endTime":1194.35,"body":"but I couldn't get a 4.0."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1194.35,"endTime":1197.23,"body":"Never. I could I could"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1194.35,"endTime":1197.23,"body":"hack in that suit."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1198.61,"endTime":1202.3,"body":"Well, thanks well as"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1198.61,"endTime":1202.3,"body":"amazing as all that was, I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1202.39,"endTime":1206.47,"body":"thought I was the worst. I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1202.39,"endTime":1206.47,"body":"didn't see that side of me. I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1206.47,"endTime":1209.77,"body":"only saw this side of me that"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1206.47,"endTime":1209.77,"body":"was freaking out and scared and"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1209.77,"endTime":1211.51,"body":"anxious and hated myself."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1211.54,"endTime":1212.68,"body":"Wondering when it was"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1211.54,"endTime":1212.68,"body":"all gonna crumble."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1212.74,"endTime":1216.4,"body":"Right. And I was so"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1212.74,"endTime":1216.4,"body":"blinded by my shame of just not"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1216.4,"endTime":1219.4,"body":"wanting to be myself. So all of"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1216.4,"endTime":1219.4,"body":"those other things that I was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1219.4,"endTime":1223.0,"body":"just like, really excelling at,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1219.4,"endTime":1223.0,"body":"weren't even, I couldn't even"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1223.0,"endTime":1227.11,"body":"recognize that and see my worth."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1223.0,"endTime":1227.11,"body":"And I don't know."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1227.8,"endTime":1229.6,"body":"It's really interesting. I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1227.8,"endTime":1229.6,"body":"feel like I've had a bit of a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1229.6,"endTime":1232.51,"body":"different experience than, than"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1229.6,"endTime":1232.51,"body":"both of you because I was never"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1232.51,"endTime":1235.3,"body":"like mad at God never felt like"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1232.51,"endTime":1235.3,"body":"I was a mistake. It was always"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1235.3,"endTime":1238.0,"body":"just like a trial and a phase I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1235.3,"endTime":1238.0,"body":"was going through."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1238.06,"endTime":1238.69,"body":"Oh, interesting."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1238.69,"endTime":1241.9,"body":"So I knew like there was no"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1238.69,"endTime":1241.9,"body":"doubt in my mind in the future."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1242.11,"endTime":1245.35,"body":"I just had to do enough things,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1242.11,"endTime":1245.35,"body":"and I would be straight. So it"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1244.809,"endTime":1248.157,"body":"Ummm, I did believe that"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1244.809,"endTime":1248.157,"body":"too. I was a great missionary."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1245.35,"endTime":1245.44,"body":"was..."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1248.218,"endTime":1251.75,"body":"Oooh, I was like, I'm gonna"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1248.218,"endTime":1251.75,"body":"marry a woman when I get back."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1252.5,"endTime":1255.83,"body":"Exactly. And so I just kind"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1252.5,"endTime":1255.83,"body":"of got to a point where I'm just"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1255.83,"endTime":1258.41,"body":"gonna keep doing the best things"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1255.83,"endTime":1258.41,"body":"I can, all the good things and"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1258.41,"endTime":1260.72,"body":"then then I'll be fixed. So it"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1258.41,"endTime":1260.72,"body":"wasn't like I was ever mad at"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1260.72,"endTime":1261.53,"body":"God or like..."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1261.56,"endTime":1263.3,"body":"But it stemmed from the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1261.56,"endTime":1263.3,"body":"same idea that there was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1263.3,"endTime":1264.11,"body":"something to be fixed."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1264.11,"endTime":1264.83,"body":"Yeah, exactly."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1265.19,"endTime":1266.54,"body":"That's cool, though,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1265.19,"endTime":1266.54,"body":"that you were like, I'm not mad"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1266.54,"endTime":1270.47,"body":"at you, God but I realize that"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1266.54,"endTime":1270.47,"body":"this test is tough. But I'm"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1270.47,"endTime":1271.52,"body":"gonna pass it kind of thing?"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1271.51,"endTime":1273.43,"body":"Yeah, exactly. And like,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1271.51,"endTime":1273.43,"body":"what, when, when is this gonna"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1273.43,"endTime":1276.97,"body":"get fixed? I thought if anyone"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1273.43,"endTime":1276.97,"body":"ever knew, then they would hate"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1276.97,"endTime":1280.33,"body":"me. And I just had to keep it to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1276.97,"endTime":1280.33,"body":"myself until I got it taken care"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1280.33,"endTime":1283.87,"body":"of. And interestingly, like,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1280.33,"endTime":1283.87,"body":"shortly after I came out to my"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1283.87,"endTime":1287.77,"body":"parents, they encouraged me to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1283.87,"endTime":1287.77,"body":"go to therapy to, to fix my"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1287.77,"endTime":1291.64,"body":"orientation. And I did and it"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1287.77,"endTime":1291.64,"body":"didn't work. And my dad has"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1291.64,"endTime":1293.35,"body":"apologized so many times for"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1291.64,"endTime":1293.35,"body":"that."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1293.38,"endTime":1295.21,"body":"What? Can I pry?"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1295.24,"endTime":1295.63,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1295.66,"endTime":1299.08,"body":"Like, what kind of"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1295.66,"endTime":1299.08,"body":"therapy, was it like ummm. You"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1299.08,"endTime":1300.4,"body":"don't have to go into that if"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1299.08,"endTime":1300.4,"body":"it's like super..."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1301.63,"endTime":1302.56,"body":"Conversion therapy?"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1302.74,"endTime":1304.24,"body":"Essentially like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1302.74,"endTime":1304.24,"body":"conversion therapy, right?"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1304.27,"endTime":1304.51,"body":"Uh, huh."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1304.27,"endTime":1306.16,"body":"What did they do?"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1306.67,"endTime":1308.23,"body":"They basically told me..."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1308.26,"endTime":1310.81,"body":"Dainty ankles and"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1308.26,"endTime":1310.81,"body":"women's body parts."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1310.81,"endTime":1313.9,"body":"It wasn't that bad. But"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1310.81,"endTime":1313.9,"body":"they basically told me that it"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1313.9,"endTime":1315.88,"body":"was a learned, like being"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1313.9,"endTime":1315.88,"body":"attracted to men was a learned"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1315.88,"endTime":1318.22,"body":"behavior. And I just had to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1315.88,"endTime":1318.22,"body":"learn to be attracted to women."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1318.64,"endTime":1321.01,"body":"And I only went to two sessions,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1318.64,"endTime":1321.01,"body":"because it made me so"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1321.01,"endTime":1323.68,"body":"uncomfortable. And I had already"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1321.01,"endTime":1323.68,"body":"read a bunch of books about how"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1323.68,"endTime":1326.35,"body":"people become gay and how to fix"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1323.68,"endTime":1326.35,"body":"it. That as he was talking, I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1326.35,"endTime":1328.72,"body":"was like, Oh, this is what he's"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1326.35,"endTime":1328.72,"body":"trying to do. And I had already"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1328.72,"endTime":1331.0,"body":"come to a conclusion that it"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1328.72,"endTime":1331.0,"body":"didn't work. So it's basically"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1331.0,"endTime":1332.23,"body":"like classical conditioning."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1332.329,"endTime":1334.519,"body":"I also want to be like,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1332.329,"endTime":1334.519,"body":"you don't think we've tried all"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1334.519,"endTime":1339.049,"body":"those things. I did some I did"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1334.519,"endTime":1339.049,"body":"some weird things to fix my"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1339.049,"endTime":1341.449,"body":"being gay. I'm not gonna go into"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1339.049,"endTime":1341.449,"body":"right now."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1342.5,"endTime":1344.96,"body":"But that's one of the nice,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1342.5,"endTime":1344.96,"body":"you know, those people who kind"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1344.96,"endTime":1348.71,"body":"of reinforced my shame like my"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1344.96,"endTime":1348.71,"body":"dad never meant to. But"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1348.95,"endTime":1351.92,"body":"realizing what, what that had"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1348.95,"endTime":1351.92,"body":"done, he has apologized a number"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1351.92,"endTime":1355.37,"body":"of times, and a lot of people"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1351.92,"endTime":1355.37,"body":"have been so kind and apologized"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1355.37,"endTime":1357.23,"body":"for a lot of things that they,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1355.37,"endTime":1357.23,"body":"they didn't mean they were just"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1357.23,"endTime":1358.22,"body":"trying to be helpful."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1360.17,"endTime":1360.95,"body":"Gosh dang."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1360.98,"endTime":1364.34,"body":"Being ashamed of myself"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1360.98,"endTime":1364.34,"body":"for being gay also affected the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1364.34,"endTime":1367.43,"body":"way I treated other people,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1364.34,"endTime":1367.43,"body":"especially other gay people. So"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1367.43,"endTime":1371.24,"body":"I remember I was friends with a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1367.43,"endTime":1371.24,"body":"kid in high school, and he came"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1371.24,"endTime":1376.04,"body":"out senior year, and I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1371.24,"endTime":1376.04,"body":"completely cut him off, and"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1376.07,"endTime":1379.34,"body":"would make fun of him and just"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1376.07,"endTime":1379.34,"body":"like try to be on like, the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1379.34,"endTime":1383.48,"body":"macho, masculine, homophobic"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1379.34,"endTime":1383.48,"body":"side of that, like on purpose"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1383.48,"endTime":1386.69,"body":"because I was so, I kind of like"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1383.48,"endTime":1386.69,"body":"you were saying, you don't want"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1386.72,"endTime":1391.73,"body":"anybody like, onto you. But"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1386.72,"endTime":1391.73,"body":"also, I figured if I push so"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1391.73,"endTime":1399.05,"body":"much hatred towards LGBTQ"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1391.73,"endTime":1399.05,"body":"people, then that would somehow"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1399.11,"endTime":1401.54,"body":"I don't know, it's a flawed"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1399.11,"endTime":1401.54,"body":"mentality. But that's what I was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1401.54,"endTime":1402.02,"body":"doing. You know?"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1402.02,"endTime":1403.7,"body":"It's the idea of like,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1402.02,"endTime":1403.7,"body":"being something you're so"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1403.7,"endTime":1406.13,"body":"ashamed of, when you have it"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1403.7,"endTime":1406.13,"body":"manifest in front of you I bet"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1406.13,"endTime":1408.68,"body":"you that like vitriol and that"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1406.13,"endTime":1408.68,"body":"anger can like go towards that."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1408.71,"endTime":1409.22,"body":"Exactly."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1409.22,"endTime":1412.55,"body":"Like the idea of like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1409.22,"endTime":1412.55,"body":"hating, or hating behavior about"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1412.55,"endTime":1415.76,"body":"yourself and then hating people"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1412.55,"endTime":1415.76,"body":"that, like, you know, exhibit"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1415.76,"endTime":1416.72,"body":"that type of behavior."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1416.75,"endTime":1417.2,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1417.32,"endTime":1419.54,"body":"I mean, what do we call"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1417.32,"endTime":1419.54,"body":"that internalized homophobia?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1419.63,"endTime":1420.5,"body":"Yeah, exactly."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1420.48,"endTime":1423.36,"body":"You know what I mean?"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1420.48,"endTime":1423.36,"body":"Where it's like, I have fought"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1423.36,"endTime":1426.99,"body":"so hard to be something I am not"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1423.36,"endTime":1426.99,"body":"that I like, hate that aspect."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1427.17,"endTime":1430.59,"body":"And breaking down those walls is"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1427.17,"endTime":1430.59,"body":"not easy. It's not and I'm still"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1430.59,"endTime":1433.62,"body":"trying to figure it out. But I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1430.59,"endTime":1433.62,"body":"do have some theories that"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1433.62,"endTime":1437.97,"body":"worked for my own life. Please"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1433.62,"endTime":1437.97,"body":"consult a professional. I don't"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1437.97,"endTime":1442.71,"body":"know it's not that bad. But um,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1437.97,"endTime":1442.71,"body":"I have a theory that like, like,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1442.71,"endTime":1445.35,"body":"so embracing yourself, it's"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1442.71,"endTime":1445.35,"body":"absolutely necessary. And"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1445.35,"endTime":1449.28,"body":"embracing yourself I define it"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1445.35,"endTime":1449.28,"body":"as the internalized process of"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1449.28,"endTime":1453.0,"body":"learning who you are and on,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1449.28,"endTime":1453.0,"body":"like learning about like, what"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1453.0,"endTime":1455.49,"body":"do you like, you know, learning"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1453.0,"endTime":1455.49,"body":"preferences and like, what you"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1455.49,"endTime":1457.65,"body":"need to be healthy. It's like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1455.49,"endTime":1457.65,"body":"learning if you're an introvert"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1457.65,"endTime":1459.84,"body":"or extrovert. It's like learning"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1457.65,"endTime":1459.84,"body":"about yourself and like your"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1459.84,"endTime":1462.9,"body":"preferences, right? Embracing"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1459.84,"endTime":1462.9,"body":"yourself. And then I think"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1463.02,"endTime":1466.71,"body":"authenticity is the outward"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1463.02,"endTime":1466.71,"body":"expression of that internal"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1466.71,"endTime":1469.53,"body":"process. So you learn about"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1466.71,"endTime":1469.53,"body":"yourself and then to be"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1469.53,"endTime":1473.58,"body":"congruent you act that way. You"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1469.53,"endTime":1473.58,"body":"know what I mean? Like, if you"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1473.58,"endTime":1476.61,"body":"don't like carrots, and you're"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1473.58,"endTime":1476.61,"body":"eating carrots to impress"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1476.61,"endTime":1479.25,"body":"someone else, you're gonna"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1476.61,"endTime":1479.25,"body":"experience an incongruity."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1479.46,"endTime":1481.02,"body":"You're gonna experience some"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1479.46,"endTime":1481.02,"body":"dissonance and I don't think"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1481.02,"endTime":1484.98,"body":"our, we want that. I think we"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1481.02,"endTime":1484.98,"body":"have we crave being like, in"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1484.98,"endTime":1487.95,"body":"line with our inner and outside"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1484.98,"endTime":1487.95,"body":"expression, our you know,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1487.95,"endTime":1491.73,"body":"embracing ourselves and being"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1487.95,"endTime":1491.73,"body":"authentic. And so I think, for"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1491.73,"endTime":1494.7,"body":"me, it's been really helpful as"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1491.73,"endTime":1494.7,"body":"I've tried to like learn more"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1494.7,"endTime":1497.07,"body":"about myself, like finally get"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1494.7,"endTime":1497.07,"body":"to a place where I'm like, I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1497.07,"endTime":1499.56,"body":"don't have to be afraid of the"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1497.07,"endTime":1499.56,"body":"these parts of myself or hate"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1499.56,"endTime":1502.89,"body":"them. And then as I try to honor"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1499.56,"endTime":1502.89,"body":"that by living in a way that"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1502.89,"endTime":1505.26,"body":"reflects that, I think that's"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1502.89,"endTime":1505.26,"body":"been really helpful for me."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1505.68,"endTime":1507.57,"body":"And sometimes you get"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1505.68,"endTime":1507.57,"body":"positive, a lot of times I've"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1507.57,"endTime":1510.12,"body":"gotten positive reinforcement."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1507.57,"endTime":1510.12,"body":"Reinforcement, like people"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1510.12,"endTime":1514.53,"body":"accept me as I am like, without"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1510.12,"endTime":1514.53,"body":"hiding anything. And then that"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1514.59,"endTime":1516.78,"body":"helps me be more of myself and"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1514.59,"endTime":1516.78,"body":"feel more comfortable."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1516.84,"endTime":1519.0,"body":"Like you like baking,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1516.84,"endTime":1519.0,"body":"but you don't bake because you"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1519.0,"endTime":1521.4,"body":"feel like it might out you as"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1519.0,"endTime":1521.4,"body":"being gay or might make you look"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1521.4,"endTime":1522.0,"body":"more feminine."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1522.0,"endTime":1522.39,"body":"Exactly."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1522.39,"endTime":1523.11,"body":"Nah, playa...."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1523.2,"endTime":1524.16,"body":"I don't like baking."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1524.19,"endTime":1526.59,"body":"You will be happy baking"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1524.19,"endTime":1526.59,"body":"unless you're Ben. Yeah, no, but"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1526.59,"endTime":1529.65,"body":"you know what I mean? Like,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1526.59,"endTime":1529.65,"body":"don't, don't edit yourself"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1529.65,"endTime":1532.02,"body":"because of any external"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1529.65,"endTime":1532.02,"body":"pressures. Don't be the Venus"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1532.02,"endTime":1532.77,"body":"Flytrap man."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1532.84,"endTime":1535.18,"body":"This is really interesting."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1532.84,"endTime":1535.18,"body":"Because I wonder, you know, we"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1535.18,"endTime":1538.15,"body":"want to be like, have this"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1535.18,"endTime":1538.15,"body":"internal sense of self worth and"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1538.15,"endTime":1540.85,"body":"not something that's external."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1538.15,"endTime":1540.85,"body":"And I'm wondering, like, how"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1540.85,"endTime":1543.4,"body":"much of my sense of like"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1540.85,"endTime":1543.4,"body":"internal self worth was"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1543.4,"endTime":1547.06,"body":"facilitated by people on the"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1543.4,"endTime":1547.06,"body":"outside, seeing me as the way I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1547.06,"endTime":1549.55,"body":"needed to be seen, because I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1547.06,"endTime":1549.55,"body":"think one of the things that's"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1549.55,"endTime":1552.22,"body":"helped me most with my shame is"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1549.55,"endTime":1552.22,"body":"coming out to people. And then,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1552.25,"endTime":1556.39,"body":"and then them responding well."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1552.25,"endTime":1556.39,"body":"Like these awful ideas I had,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1556.6,"endTime":1559.78,"body":"about how people were going to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1556.6,"endTime":1559.78,"body":"respond, never came true in my"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1559.78,"endTime":1563.23,"body":"case. And I wonder how I would"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1559.78,"endTime":1563.23,"body":"be different with my sense of"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1563.23,"endTime":1565.48,"body":"internal self worth, if that"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1563.23,"endTime":1565.48,"body":"hadn't happened."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1565.0,"endTime":1567.73,"body":"And the easiest people"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1565.0,"endTime":1567.73,"body":"for me to come out to were the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1567.73,"endTime":1572.14,"body":"people that I was already"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1567.73,"endTime":1572.14,"body":"closest to my true self. Like my"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1572.14,"endTime":1574.66,"body":"little sister was so easy to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1572.14,"endTime":1574.66,"body":"come out to, because I never"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1574.66,"endTime":1576.22,"body":"really felt the pressure to hide"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1574.66,"endTime":1576.22,"body":"me."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1576.25,"endTime":1578.56,"body":"Hmm. That's really cool."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1578.59,"endTime":1578.98,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1579.01,"endTime":1582.07,"body":"I do think, I do think"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1579.01,"endTime":1582.07,"body":"that can be super helpful. Like,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1582.1,"endTime":1585.04,"body":"I think for sure, there's things"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1582.1,"endTime":1585.04,"body":"that I feel about myself that"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1585.04,"endTime":1587.65,"body":"maybe I'm like, a little"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1585.04,"endTime":1587.65,"body":"insecure about, but my friends"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1587.65,"endTime":1590.86,"body":"that are like, very validating"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1587.65,"endTime":1590.86,"body":"in some ways. And so if it's"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1590.86,"endTime":1594.88,"body":"like really helpful. My only"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1590.86,"endTime":1594.88,"body":"fear is when it becomes your,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1594.91,"endTime":1597.94,"body":"your means of gauging, you know"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1594.91,"endTime":1597.94,"body":"what I mean, your worth, is"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1597.94,"endTime":1601.06,"body":"like, oof, that stuff can"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1597.94,"endTime":1601.06,"body":"switch. I think you're right, I,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1601.06,"endTime":1603.13,"body":"there are a lot of things that I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1601.06,"endTime":1603.13,"body":"feel about myself that comes"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1603.13,"endTime":1605.35,"body":"from feedback and external"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1603.13,"endTime":1605.35,"body":"means. So..."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1606.22,"endTime":1608.05,"body":"Before we started, you"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1606.22,"endTime":1608.05,"body":"were talking about community,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1608.32,"endTime":1610.27,"body":"and how you like building"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1608.32,"endTime":1610.27,"body":"community and"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1610.27,"endTime":1612.22,"body":"I love building"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1610.27,"endTime":1612.22,"body":"community. I'm going to build a"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1612.22,"endTime":1612.91,"body":"community one day."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1613.24,"endTime":1616.78,"body":"I'm just happy that"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1613.24,"endTime":1616.78,"body":"there is more like, this is a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1616.78,"endTime":1618.22,"body":"shared experience for all of us."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1618.22,"endTime":1618.73,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1618.78,"endTime":1621.81,"body":"Shame, internalized"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1618.78,"endTime":1621.81,"body":"homophobia, really having to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1621.81,"endTime":1626.46,"body":"work to to be okay with who we"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1621.81,"endTime":1626.46,"body":"are just because we are"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1626.79,"endTime":1630.99,"body":"ourselves. You know, and so, I'm"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1626.79,"endTime":1630.99,"body":"just thinking about anybody out"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1630.99,"endTime":1634.17,"body":"there listening, that might kind"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1630.99,"endTime":1634.17,"body":"of be you know, I used to listen"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1634.17,"endTime":1636.45,"body":"to things and say, \"Oh, gosh, me"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1634.17,"endTime":1636.45,"body":"too. Oh, me too. Me too.\""},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1636.51,"endTime":1637.38,"body":"Listening in secret?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1637.41,"endTime":1640.14,"body":"Yeah. And that's so"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1637.41,"endTime":1640.14,"body":"nice. And I just hope everyone"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1640.14,"endTime":1644.13,"body":"knows that these aren't, these"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1640.14,"endTime":1644.13,"body":"feelings aren't uncommon. You're"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1644.13,"endTime":1646.41,"body":"not alone. It's like in Dear"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1644.13,"endTime":1646.41,"body":"Evan Hansen. Like you're not"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1646.41,"endTime":1649.29,"body":"alone. Now, we're all gonna"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1646.41,"endTime":1649.29,"body":"start crying."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1649.41,"endTime":1650.28,"body":"Didn't you just watch that?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1650.49,"endTime":1651.27,"body":"I've seen it a lot."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1651.27,"endTime":1652.05,"body":"Oh, you're in New York."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1652.08,"endTime":1654.39,"body":"Yeah, I've watched it"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1652.08,"endTime":1654.39,"body":"many, many times."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1655.83,"endTime":1658.29,"body":"Oh, man. And that's, I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1655.83,"endTime":1658.29,"body":"think you were like, spot on."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1658.35,"endTime":1661.59,"body":"It's like, you're not alone in"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1658.35,"endTime":1661.59,"body":"this. And like, and I come from,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1661.59,"endTime":1663.84,"body":"like, I very much believe in"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1661.59,"endTime":1663.84,"body":"God. And I know everyone"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1663.84,"endTime":1665.88,"body":"doesn't. And that's totally"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1663.84,"endTime":1665.88,"body":"fine. And I'm so sorry, if this"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1665.88,"endTime":1668.61,"body":"feels like really pushy, but"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1665.88,"endTime":1668.61,"body":"like, at the end of the day, you"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1668.61,"endTime":1671.16,"body":"just know that like, at least"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1668.61,"endTime":1671.16,"body":"for me, it's so helpful to know"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1671.16,"endTime":1674.13,"body":"that someone knows exactly what"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1671.16,"endTime":1674.13,"body":"I've gone through. And I can't"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1674.13,"endTime":1676.71,"body":"hide it from if I wanted to, you"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1674.13,"endTime":1676.71,"body":"know what I mean? Yeah, it's"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1676.71,"endTime":1678.99,"body":"like, they just know exactly"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1676.71,"endTime":1678.99,"body":"what I've gone through. And then"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1678.99,"endTime":1680.94,"body":"open that up a little bit more."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1678.99,"endTime":1680.94,"body":"And there people that are going"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1680.94,"endTime":1683.43,"body":"through similar experiences I'm"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1680.94,"endTime":1683.43,"body":"going through like, like you"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1683.43,"endTime":1686.34,"body":"just said, like, right now we"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1683.43,"endTime":1686.34,"body":"have, we know what it's like."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1686.49,"endTime":1688.14,"body":"And maybe we don't have, we"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1686.49,"endTime":1688.14,"body":"didn't live the exact same"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1688.14,"endTime":1689.01,"body":"lives, we can relate."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1689.07,"endTime":1690.21,"body":"And there's echoes for"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1689.07,"endTime":1690.21,"body":"sure."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1690.27,"endTime":1693.84,"body":"You guys out there."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1690.27,"endTime":1693.84,"body":"Listen, we get it. We do."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1695.46,"endTime":1698.58,"body":"Yeah. Any other things you"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1695.46,"endTime":1698.58,"body":"guys did to help you work"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1698.58,"endTime":1700.68,"body":"through these feelings of shame,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1698.58,"endTime":1700.68,"body":"like things that we can"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1700.98,"endTime":1702.03,"body":"encourage people to do?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1702.96,"endTime":1705.99,"body":"I sought a lot of"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1702.96,"endTime":1705.99,"body":"resources, when I finally got to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1705.99,"endTime":1710.97,"body":"the point where I just couldn't"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1705.99,"endTime":1710.97,"body":"take it anymore. And I realized"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1710.97,"endTime":1713.46,"body":"that it was affecting my ability"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1710.97,"endTime":1713.46,"body":"to connect with people and I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1713.46,"endTime":1715.89,"body":"couldn't sleep at night, and all"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1713.46,"endTime":1715.89,"body":"of these things were just piled"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1715.89,"endTime":1720.24,"body":"on me. I reached out and I found"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1715.89,"endTime":1720.24,"body":"a therapist, and I started"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1720.24,"endTime":1723.33,"body":"reading blogs. Ben has a great"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1720.24,"endTime":1723.33,"body":"blog."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1723.84,"endTime":1724.68,"body":"You didn't read mine,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1723.84,"endTime":1724.68,"body":"though."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1725.91,"endTime":1726.51,"body":"Did you not?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1726.84,"endTime":1727.2,"body":"No."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1729.06,"endTime":1730.08,"body":"It's fine."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1730.11,"endTime":1733.74,"body":"And and doing and like,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1730.11,"endTime":1733.74,"body":"obviously, my own pace, what I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1733.74,"endTime":1736.38,"body":"was comfortable with but kind of"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1733.74,"endTime":1736.38,"body":"reaching out and looking at"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1736.38,"endTime":1738.84,"body":"different perspectives and"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1736.38,"endTime":1738.84,"body":"trying to find, build community,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1738.84,"endTime":1740.28,"body":"I guess. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1741.02,"endTime":1743.84,"body":"That's like, I like,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1741.02,"endTime":1743.84,"body":"really smart, very much second,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1743.84,"endTime":1746.03,"body":"that. It's really great that"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1743.84,"endTime":1746.03,"body":"there's like things to find"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1746.03,"endTime":1748.73,"body":"about people in similar places."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1746.03,"endTime":1748.73,"body":"And there wasn't a ton. I always"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1748.73,"endTime":1751.28,"body":"tell people, it's like, there's"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1748.73,"endTime":1751.28,"body":"no manual written for us. You"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1751.28,"endTime":1752.96,"body":"get in the church and you're"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1751.28,"endTime":1752.96,"body":"like, Where's my strength of"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1752.96,"endTime":1755.48,"body":"youth pamphlet? Because the"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1752.96,"endTime":1755.48,"body":"rules are different. Let me tell"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1755.48,"endTime":1759.89,"body":"you, you know, but yeah, I like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1755.48,"endTime":1759.89,"body":"reached, I like read a lot of"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1759.89,"endTime":1762.38,"body":"stuff. I'd be secretly like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1759.89,"endTime":1762.38,"body":"looking at Mormons and Gays."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1762.41,"endTime":1765.74,"body":"Yeah. It came out when"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1762.41,"endTime":1765.74,"body":"I was on my mission, and like,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1765.77,"endTime":1769.19,"body":"it was kind of like a big, like"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1765.77,"endTime":1769.19,"body":"\"ooooo Mormon and gay\" all the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1769.19,"endTime":1772.64,"body":"elders, you know. And it was one"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1769.19,"endTime":1772.64,"body":"of the approved websites. And on"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1772.64,"endTime":1775.67,"body":"P day, I would just like,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1772.64,"endTime":1775.67,"body":"\"Should I do it?\" It took me so"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1775.67,"endTime":1778.82,"body":"many days to actually go to the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1775.67,"endTime":1778.82,"body":"page. And I was like, had it"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1778.91,"endTime":1781.79,"body":"hidden in a tab and I was like,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1778.91,"endTime":1781.79,"body":"reading and then I'm like, \"Oh,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1781.79,"endTime":1783.65,"body":"I'm just emailing my mom over"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1781.79,"endTime":1783.65,"body":"here.\""},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1783.71,"endTime":1785.42,"body":"And them seeing your"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1783.71,"endTime":1785.42,"body":"shady behavior trying to figure"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1785.42,"endTime":1786.05,"body":"out what you're up to."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1786.08,"endTime":1786.86,"body":"Exactly."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1786.93,"endTime":1787.44,"body":"It's nothing."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1788.44,"endTime":1790.63,"body":"One of the things that I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1788.44,"endTime":1790.63,"body":"started to do was I stopped, I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1790.66,"endTime":1793.99,"body":"learned to filter myself less"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1790.66,"endTime":1793.99,"body":"when it came to my orientation."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1794.68,"endTime":1797.77,"body":"So for example, there's a show"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1794.68,"endTime":1797.77,"body":"you know, like many shows, there"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1797.77,"endTime":1800.14,"body":"was a woman who was in a love"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1797.77,"endTime":1800.14,"body":"triangle with two men and people"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1800.14,"endTime":1802.72,"body":"would talk about \"Oh, does she"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1800.14,"endTime":1802.72,"body":"like, are you more team so and"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1802.72,"endTime":1806.14,"body":"so or team so and so?\" I'm not"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1802.72,"endTime":1806.14,"body":"talking about Twilight. I'm"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1806.14,"endTime":1809.47,"body":"talking about Jane The Virgin."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1806.14,"endTime":1809.47,"body":"And..."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1809.47,"endTime":1810.43,"body":"I thought it was"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1809.47,"endTime":1810.43,"body":"Twilight."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1810.49,"endTime":1812.35,"body":"...and I would watch with"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1810.49,"endTime":1812.35,"body":"my friends and I would share my"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1812.35,"endTime":1814.39,"body":"opinions and like that was"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1812.35,"endTime":1814.39,"body":"really nice to be like, Well, I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1814.39,"endTime":1817.84,"body":"think this person is attractive"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1814.39,"endTime":1817.84,"body":"or a better fit. And, and we"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1817.84,"endTime":1820.42,"body":"were just able to have this"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1817.84,"endTime":1820.42,"body":"conversation about who I was"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1820.42,"endTime":1823.12,"body":"attracted to, and which"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1820.42,"endTime":1823.12,"body":"personality I preferred and, and"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1823.12,"endTime":1826.15,"body":"that really helped to get rid of"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1823.12,"endTime":1826.15,"body":"a lot of my feelings of shame."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1826.0,"endTime":1830.14,"body":"You know what I, so when"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1826.0,"endTime":1830.14,"body":"I came out to my family I was, I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1830.14,"endTime":1834.97,"body":"was like, I'll be danged if I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1830.14,"endTime":1834.97,"body":"am, if this becomes uncle"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1834.97,"endTime":1839.11,"body":"Stacey's secret. I was like, I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1834.97,"endTime":1839.11,"body":"will not have my sexuality be"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1839.11,"endTime":1843.52,"body":"taboo in family conversations."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1839.11,"endTime":1843.52,"body":"So I brought it up a lot. I was"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1843.52,"endTime":1846.04,"body":"like, well, the goal, and I know"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1843.52,"endTime":1846.04,"body":"it was so annoying, but the goal"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1846.04,"endTime":1849.04,"body":"was to normalize it for my"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1846.04,"endTime":1849.04,"body":"family. I wanted them to get to"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1849.04,"endTime":1851.05,"body":"the point where they could just"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1849.04,"endTime":1851.05,"body":"like toss it out and feel"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1851.05,"endTime":1854.05,"body":"comfortable about it. I did a"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1851.05,"endTime":1854.05,"body":"Q\u0026A with my family when I came"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1854.05,"endTime":1856.84,"body":"out because it came out in"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1854.05,"endTime":1856.84,"body":"December. And then I went home"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1856.84,"endTime":1859.6,"body":"for Christmas. I purposely came"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1856.84,"endTime":1859.6,"body":"out before so I could like face"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1859.6,"endTime":1863.47,"body":"them all. Like all my old ward"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1859.6,"endTime":1863.47,"body":"family. But I did a Q\u0026A. And I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1863.47,"endTime":1866.8,"body":"was like any question goes. I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1863.47,"endTime":1866.8,"body":"got some weird questions, y'all."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1868.06,"endTime":1868.87,"body":"But it was really cool."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1868.87,"endTime":1870.07,"body":"But that's cool."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1868.87,"endTime":1870.07,"body":"Because you can get it out of"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1870.07,"endTime":1870.61,"body":"the way."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1870.54,"endTime":1872.46,"body":"It was. Yeah, it was"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1870.54,"endTime":1872.46,"body":"like we normalize it and every"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1872.46,"endTime":1875.94,"body":"time on the phone my parents now"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1872.46,"endTime":1875.94,"body":"I'm like, \"Yeah, dating the guy"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1875.97,"endTime":1880.77,"body":"or not dating a guy if you know"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1875.97,"endTime":1880.77,"body":"someone.\" But then it's like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1880.77,"endTime":1883.35,"body":"those those elements of like not"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1880.77,"endTime":1883.35,"body":"editing yourself. I was like,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1883.38,"endTime":1884.49,"body":"\"Where was I going with that?\""},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1884.67,"endTime":1887.46,"body":"Yeah and I think just like"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1884.67,"endTime":1887.46,"body":"normalizing it helps to reduce"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1887.49,"endTime":1888.51,"body":"shame so much."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1888.54,"endTime":1890.97,"body":"Yeah like talking about"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1888.54,"endTime":1890.97,"body":"it and having a safe place to"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1890.97,"endTime":1895.8,"body":"talk about it. I, I teach a spin"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1890.97,"endTime":1895.8,"body":"class. This is like barely, I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1895.8,"endTime":1896.58,"body":"feel like I'm really..."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1896.61,"endTime":1897.36,"body":"That's pretty gay."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1897.36,"endTime":1899.61,"body":"...who I am. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1897.36,"endTime":1899.61,"body":"right. I like it's one of those"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1899.61,"endTime":1901.56,"body":"things where I look back and I'm"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1899.61,"endTime":1901.56,"body":"like, oh, there are some"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1901.56,"endTime":1904.53,"body":"stereotypes that I don't even"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1901.56,"endTime":1904.53,"body":"realize. Like houseplants I love"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1904.53,"endTime":1904.65,"body":"them."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1905.14,"endTime":1906.28,"body":"I decorate cakes. So..."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1906.4,"endTime":1906.97,"body":"Oh, really?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1907.0,"endTime":1907.21,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1907.36,"endTime":1909.58,"body":"Okay, let's join powers"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1907.36,"endTime":1909.58,"body":"and eat cake and spin."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1909.61,"endTime":1912.52,"body":"I eat cakes. And I've been"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1909.61,"endTime":1912.52,"body":"to a spin class."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1912.57,"endTime":1914.61,"body":"Is that gay because I'm"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1912.57,"endTime":1914.61,"body":"sure most gay people have eaten"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1914.61,"endTime":1919.59,"body":"cake too. Straight people write"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1914.61,"endTime":1919.59,"body":"in and tell us. But I teach a"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1919.89,"endTime":1923.73,"body":"indoor spin class a couple and"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1919.89,"endTime":1923.73,"body":"one of the times I teach a lot"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1923.73,"endTime":1927.54,"body":"of moms come to and I always"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1923.73,"endTime":1927.54,"body":"like share experiences because I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1927.54,"endTime":1930.36,"body":"want to be like, I'm like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1927.54,"endTime":1930.36,"body":"motivating, we have a good time,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1930.36,"endTime":1933.21,"body":"whatever. But I do not talk"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1930.36,"endTime":1933.21,"body":"about my sexuality because I'm"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1933.21,"endTime":1938.37,"body":"so like, I don't want to make"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1933.21,"endTime":1938.37,"body":"anyone uncomfortable. And but"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1938.37,"endTime":1941.04,"body":"like one day, I kind of like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1938.37,"endTime":1941.04,"body":"started talking about something"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1941.04,"endTime":1944.07,"body":"and then I like edited it. And I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1941.04,"endTime":1944.07,"body":"know someone like responded and"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1944.07,"endTime":1946.98,"body":"the next spin class all these"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1944.07,"endTime":1946.98,"body":"moms showed up with rainbow"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1946.98,"endTime":1950.58,"body":"socks to show support. They were"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1946.98,"endTime":1950.58,"body":"like, \"We love you as you are\""},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1950.61,"endTime":1954.96,"body":"and I, it. got. me. And it was"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1950.61,"endTime":1954.96,"body":"like a good reminder where it's"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1954.96,"endTime":1957.96,"body":"like, I don't need to be editing"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1954.96,"endTime":1957.96,"body":"myself. I don't need to be like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1958.38,"endTime":1962.19,"body":"jumping through these hoops."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1958.38,"endTime":1962.19,"body":"Yeah, it was it was really like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1962.19,"endTime":1964.23,"body":"barely happened. I like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1962.19,"endTime":1964.23,"body":"Instagrammed about it."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1964.26,"endTime":1964.59,"body":"That's so cute."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1964.59,"endTime":1966.6,"body":"I'm like, they're too"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1964.59,"endTime":1966.6,"body":"great."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1966.69,"endTime":1968.43,"body":"Yeah, it's really"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1966.69,"endTime":1968.43,"body":"interesting because all of us"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1968.46,"endTime":1971.01,"body":"want to have this internal locus"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1968.46,"endTime":1971.01,"body":"of control, like this internal"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1971.01,"endTime":1974.76,"body":"sense of self worth. At the same"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1971.01,"endTime":1974.76,"body":"time, I think all of us are"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1974.76,"endTime":1977.31,"body":"affected by what happens on the"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1974.76,"endTime":1977.31,"body":"outside and people say anything"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1977.31,"endTime":1980.7,"body":"on the outside and so someone"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1977.31,"endTime":1980.7,"body":"who who knows an LGBTQ person"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1980.97,"endTime":1983.7,"body":"can really help them by, by"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1980.97,"endTime":1983.7,"body":"being validating and wearing"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1983.7,"endTime":1985.08,"body":"rainbow socks to spin class."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1985.11,"endTime":1988.89,"body":"Dude, being an ally can"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1985.11,"endTime":1988.89,"body":"sometimes take so little, just"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1988.89,"endTime":1992.01,"body":"letting yourself be known as a"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1988.89,"endTime":1992.01,"body":"safe place. I had a friend once"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1992.01,"endTime":1994.77,"body":"one of my best friends was just"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1992.01,"endTime":1994.77,"body":"like, we were talking once and"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1994.77,"endTime":1997.68,"body":"he was like yeah, I know this"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1994.77,"endTime":1997.68,"body":"gay guy. He was really cool. And"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1997.68,"endTime":1999.33,"body":"I was like, that's like all it"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":1997.68,"endTime":1999.33,"body":"took."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1999.36,"endTime":2000.29,"body":"Yeah, that's it."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2000.29,"endTime":2001.7,"body":"It's like what a nice"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2000.29,"endTime":2001.7,"body":"person."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2001.88,"endTime":2004.19,"body":"It's like a flag like"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2001.88,"endTime":2004.19,"body":"this person says I can be me."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2004.19,"endTime":2004.61,"body":"Exactly."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2004.61,"endTime":2007.58,"body":"Yeah. and not have to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2004.61,"endTime":2007.58,"body":"worry about repercussions or..."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2008.69,"endTime":2010.82,"body":"And I think that's like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2008.69,"endTime":2010.82,"body":"the tough thing is like external"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2010.82,"endTime":2015.14,"body":"means do affect us so much. That"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2010.82,"endTime":2015.14,"body":"that's, that's what makes it so"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2015.14,"endTime":2018.2,"body":"hard to like build that like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2015.14,"endTime":2018.2,"body":"internal resistance."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2018.0,"endTime":2019.17,"body":"To be a ZZ plant."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2019.17,"endTime":2020.58,"body":"I'm still working on it. You"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2019.17,"endTime":2020.58,"body":"know?"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2020.61,"endTime":2021.06,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2021.12,"endTime":2024.51,"body":"I will say that like the"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2021.12,"endTime":2024.51,"body":"shame I, there were habits I had"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2024.51,"endTime":2027.78,"body":"before I came out that like I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2024.51,"endTime":2027.78,"body":"don't have any more, like really"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2027.78,"endTime":2029.88,"body":"bad, like habits that I felt"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2027.78,"endTime":2029.88,"body":"were really negative. And this"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2029.88,"endTime":2032.04,"body":"is not the same for everyone but"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2029.88,"endTime":2032.04,"body":"things that I would like because"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2032.04,"endTime":2036.27,"body":"of the shame like I over, I over"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2032.04,"endTime":2036.27,"body":"ate like crazy. Food was like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2036.27,"endTime":2037.11,"body":"one of my go tos."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2037.14,"endTime":2037.5,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2037.74,"endTime":2039.69,"body":"And like after coming"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2037.74,"endTime":2039.69,"body":"out, I'm not saying this is the"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2039.69,"endTime":2042.9,"body":"case for everyone. I don't, I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2039.69,"endTime":2042.9,"body":"don't do, I don't eat, I don't"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2042.9,"endTime":2046.14,"body":"turn to food in my times of"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2042.9,"endTime":2046.14,"body":"trouble anymore. It's, it's like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2046.14,"endTime":2046.68,"body":"a treated."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2046.77,"endTime":2049.41,"body":"There's no, there's"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2046.77,"endTime":2049.41,"body":"less of a coping mechanism"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2049.41,"endTime":2050.43,"body":"because there's not as much to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2049.41,"endTime":2050.43,"body":"cope with."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2050.43,"endTime":2051.66,"body":"Yeah, there's not as"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2050.43,"endTime":2051.66,"body":"much to cope with."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2051.039,"endTime":2053.199,"body":"And so it's not about what"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2051.039,"endTime":2053.199,"body":"you were eating. It was about"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2053.199,"endTime":2054.969,"body":"what was eating you."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2054.72,"endTime":2055.95,"body":"Oh Ben."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2055.95,"endTime":2056.67,"body":"Put that on a t-shirt."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2056.67,"endTime":2057.36,"body":"He's a therapist."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2057.39,"endTime":2057.75,"body":"Market that."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2057.75,"endTime":2058.62,"body":"You heard it here"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2057.75,"endTime":2058.62,"body":"first."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2061.14,"endTime":2063.18,"body":"I still love food,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2061.14,"endTime":2063.18,"body":"though. So I'll throw that out"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2063.18,"endTime":2065.67,"body":"there. So don't walk up to me in"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2063.18,"endTime":2065.67,"body":"a restaurant if you see me going"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2065.67,"endTime":2066.87,"body":"to town on some crab legs."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2067.44,"endTime":2069.12,"body":"Like Stacey, where is your"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2067.44,"endTime":2069.12,"body":"shame?"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2069.0,"endTime":2070.11,"body":"I thought you said...."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2070.98,"endTime":2072.27,"body":"He really is shameless."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2074.61,"endTime":2079.38,"body":"He really is shameless."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2074.61,"endTime":2079.38,"body":"Listen here, buckaroonies, and"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2079.38,"endTime":2086.07,"body":"allies of the buckaroonies, I,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2079.38,"endTime":2086.07,"body":"it's like so important for me to"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2086.07,"endTime":2090.06,"body":"like express to people how"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2086.07,"endTime":2090.06,"body":"valuable they are, how important"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2090.06,"endTime":2093.57,"body":"they are. And I think really"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2090.06,"endTime":2093.57,"body":"believing that and like I feel"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2093.57,"endTime":2095.49,"body":"like embracing yourself and"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2093.57,"endTime":2095.49,"body":"being authentic that and like"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2095.49,"endTime":2099.06,"body":"believing your worth is like a"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2095.49,"endTime":2099.06,"body":"great way to do that. How? Man"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2099.06,"endTime":2101.28,"body":"there's so many different ways I"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2099.06,"endTime":2101.28,"body":"wish you the best. I've shared"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2101.28,"endTime":2106.62,"body":"some that I've, that have helped"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2101.28,"endTime":2106.62,"body":"me. But you must know we are the"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2106.62,"endTime":2109.74,"body":"LGBTQ community. We are, there"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2106.62,"endTime":2109.74,"body":"are a lot of us out there. But"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2109.74,"endTime":2113.43,"body":"we're kind of rare. We're not"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2109.74,"endTime":2113.43,"body":"the majority. And rare things"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2113.46,"endTime":2117.81,"body":"are precious and like valuable."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2113.46,"endTime":2117.81,"body":"And they're, and like, you are"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2117.81,"endTime":2121.62,"body":"so important. And your"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2117.81,"endTime":2121.62,"body":"perspectives are just like so"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2121.62,"endTime":2125.13,"body":"necessary. And what you bring to"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2121.62,"endTime":2125.13,"body":"the table is like, of immense"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2125.13,"endTime":2127.77,"body":"value. And I cannot express that"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2125.13,"endTime":2127.77,"body":"enough. I believe it"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2127.77,"endTime":2131.58,"body":"wholeheartedly. And I think"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2127.77,"endTime":2131.58,"body":"helping, walking in that"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2131.58,"endTime":2133.53,"body":"direction of trying to"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2131.58,"endTime":2133.53,"body":"understand why that's a thing"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2133.53,"endTime":2137.22,"body":"can really help you, you know,"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2133.53,"endTime":2137.22,"body":"value yourself a little bit"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2137.22,"endTime":2137.58,"body":"more."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2137.65,"endTime":2139.69,"body":"Yeah. What you said"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2137.65,"endTime":2139.69,"body":"reminded me of something someone"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2139.69,"endTime":2143.35,"body":"told me once that, \"We think"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2139.69,"endTime":2143.35,"body":"that, as humans we think that"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2143.35,"endTime":2145.72,"body":"things that are differen"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2143.35,"endTime":2145.72,"body":"are beautiful.\" Like people go"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2145.72,"endTime":2148.57,"body":"he the Grand Canyon, becau"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2145.72,"endTime":2148.57,"body":"e it's different, and it's bea"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2148.93,"endTime":2152.41,"body":"tiful. And if we're you know,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2148.93,"endTime":2152.41,"body":"just a small percentage"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2152.41,"endTime":2154.78,"body":"of the population, that's so"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2152.41,"endTime":2154.78,"body":"ething that makes us bea"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2154.81,"endTime":2155.29,"body":"tiful."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2155.32,"endTime":2156.916,"body":"That's beautiful. You're"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2155.32,"endTime":2156.916,"body":"rare. You're precious. You're"},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2156.945,"endTime":2157.98,"body":"expensive, I'm going to keep going."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2157.98,"endTime":2161.23,"body":"That's great."},{"speaker":"Stacey","startTime":2161.23,"endTime":2162.7,"body":"I believe it."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2162.7,"endTime":2165.325,"body":"Well, Stacey, thank you so"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2162.7,"endTime":2165.325,"body":"much for joining us today. And"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2165.371,"endTime":2167.813,"body":"everyone else. Thank you for"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2165.371,"endTime":2167.813,"body":"joining us today. Please"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2167.859,"endTime":2170.301,"body":"remember that we do not"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2167.859,"endTime":2170.301,"body":"represent the Church of Jesus"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2170.347,"endTime":2173.203,"body":"Christ of Latter-day Saints or"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2170.347,"endTime":2173.203,"body":"Brigham Young University. We're"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2173.249,"endTime":2176.29,"body":"not trying to be prescriptive,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2173.249,"endTime":2176.29,"body":"or tell anyone what to think or do."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2176.38,"endTime":2178.12,"body":"Today you h"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2176.38,"endTime":2178.12,"body":"ard three perspectives and there"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2178.15,"endTime":2180.94,"body":"are many, many more. We encour"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2178.15,"endTime":2180.94,"body":"ge you to listen to other voice"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2180.94,"endTime":2183.76,"body":"and hear a wide variety of ex"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2180.94,"endTime":2183.76,"body":"eriences. If you would like t"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2183.76,"endTime":2186.19,"body":"submit a question or share"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2183.76,"endTime":2186.19,"body":"a comment about today's episod"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2186.19,"endTime":2190.06,"body":", you can email us at question"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2186.19,"endTime":2190.06,"body":"fromthecloset@gmail.com. Unt"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2190.06,"endTime":2190.33,"body":"l nex"}]}