{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":5.76,"endTime":7.95,"body":"Welcome to Questions"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":5.76,"endTime":7.95,"body":"from the Closet. I'm Charlie"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":7.95,"endTime":8.31,"body":"Bird."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":8.46,"endTime":11.28,"body":"And I'm Ben Schilaty. Each"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":8.46,"endTime":11.28,"body":"episode we discuss a question"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":11.28,"endTime":13.86,"body":"that we commonly get asked as"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":11.28,"endTime":13.86,"body":"LGBTQ Latter-day Saints."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":14.07,"endTime":16.02,"body":"We are not trying to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":14.07,"endTime":16.02,"body":"answer this question or come to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":16.02,"endTime":18.33,"body":"a consensus but simply sharing"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":16.02,"endTime":18.33,"body":"our perspectives."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":18.6,"endTime":21.96,"body":"Today's question is, how do"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":18.6,"endTime":21.96,"body":"I talk to youth about LGBTQ+?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":22.68,"endTime":24.57,"body":"Ben and I are not"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":22.68,"endTime":24.57,"body":"terribly diverse, and we share"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":24.57,"endTime":27.42,"body":"many opinions and life"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":24.57,"endTime":27.42,"body":"experiences. For example, we"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":27.42,"endTime":29.94,"body":"both have photographs of"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":27.42,"endTime":29.94,"body":"ourselves featured on the covers"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":29.97,"endTime":30.69,"body":"of our books."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":30.87,"endTime":33.03,"body":"However, there are some"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":30.87,"endTime":33.03,"body":"pretty big differences. For"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":33.03,"endTime":36.21,"body":"example, Charlie's has a picture"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":33.03,"endTime":36.21,"body":"of his face. And mine is just a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":36.21,"endTime":38.91,"body":"picture of my feet. But if you"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":36.21,"endTime":38.91,"body":"put our books together, it"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":38.91,"endTime":40.02,"body":"almost makes a whole person."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":40.14,"endTime":41.7,"body":"Would you like to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":40.14,"endTime":41.7,"body":"expound on why there's a picture"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":41.7,"endTime":43.2,"body":"of your feet on your book cover."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":43.89,"endTime":47.34,"body":"So my book is called A Walk"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":43.89,"endTime":47.34,"body":"in my Shoes. And I wanted"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":47.34,"endTime":50.01,"body":"something that showed that I was"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":47.34,"endTime":50.01,"body":"like, this is like a book about"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":50.01,"endTime":53.82,"body":"being gay, but also incorporated"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":50.01,"endTime":53.82,"body":"shoes that also show that I was"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":53.82,"endTime":55.98,"body":"a Latter-day Saint. And so my"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":53.82,"endTime":55.98,"body":"brother came up with a great"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":55.98,"endTime":60.03,"body":"idea of having, like me sitting"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":55.98,"endTime":60.03,"body":"in a church chair, like a metal"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":60.03,"endTime":63.0,"body":"chair, wearing rainbow socks. So"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":60.03,"endTime":63.0,"body":"that's what it is. It's like my"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":63.0,"endTime":66.6,"body":"shoes and feet and socks and"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":63.0,"endTime":66.6,"body":"legs sitting in a church chair."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":66.63,"endTime":67.59,"body":"That's the cover of my book."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":68.01,"endTime":69.51,"body":"Can I tell the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":68.01,"endTime":69.51,"body":"embarrassing, but slightly"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":69.51,"endTime":72.42,"body":"arrogant story of how my face is"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":69.51,"endTime":72.42,"body":"on my book cover?"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":72.69,"endTime":73.2,"body":"Of course."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":73.53,"endTime":75.9,"body":"Yes. I love this story."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":73.53,"endTime":75.9,"body":"So I was in a meeting with the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":75.9,"endTime":78.6,"body":"editors. And they were like, We"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":75.9,"endTime":78.6,"body":"have an idea for your book cover"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":78.6,"endTime":80.88,"body":"and we're not sure if you're"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":78.6,"endTime":80.88,"body":"going to be comfortable with it."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":80.88,"endTime":82.62,"body":"And they kept like beating"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":80.88,"endTime":82.62,"body":"around the bush. And I was like,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":82.68,"endTime":85.77,"body":"just ask what it is. And they"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":82.68,"endTime":85.77,"body":"were like, well, you do have a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":85.77,"endTime":89.1,"body":"certain marketability. And we're"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":85.77,"endTime":89.1,"body":"wondering if you'd be"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":89.1,"endTime":92.52,"body":"comfortable if we put a picture"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":89.1,"endTime":92.52,"body":"of you on the cover. And I was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":92.52,"endTime":93.72,"body":"like, ahhhh."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":93.75,"endTime":94.65,"body":"Marketability?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":94.0,"endTime":98.11,"body":"I'm like, you think I'm"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":94.0,"endTime":98.11,"body":"hot! That's exactly what I said."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":98.53,"endTime":100.27,"body":"And they were so embarrassed. It"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":98.53,"endTime":100.27,"body":"was funny."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":100.84,"endTime":102.13,"body":"And I say, can I be on my"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":100.84,"endTime":102.13,"body":"book? And they're like, how"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":102.13,"endTime":102.67,"body":"about your feet?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":103.48,"endTime":105.91,"body":"I was like, yes, of"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":103.48,"endTime":105.91,"body":"course, you can put my face on a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":105.91,"endTime":108.4,"body":"book. That's the best thing"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":105.91,"endTime":108.4,"body":"that's ever happened to me."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":109.63,"endTime":112.48,"body":"Anyway, Ben, your book cover is"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":109.63,"endTime":112.48,"body":"perfect. I think it's wonderful."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":112.48,"endTime":115.21,"body":"It's eye-catching. It's popping."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":112.48,"endTime":115.21,"body":"It's, I love it."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":115.27,"endTime":116.86,"body":"I love it. And I actually"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":115.27,"endTime":116.86,"body":"don't like having my picture"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":116.86,"endTime":119.17,"body":"taken. And so it's nice. Just"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":116.86,"endTime":119.17,"body":"like sit there and not have to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":119.17,"endTime":119.83,"body":"smile or anything."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":120.25,"endTime":122.47,"body":"I'm gonna stop before I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":120.25,"endTime":122.47,"body":"talk, like for hours about my"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":122.5,"endTime":125.77,"body":"cover, photo shoot, and we're"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":122.5,"endTime":125.77,"body":"just gonna move right ahead. And"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":125.8,"endTime":128.23,"body":"with that, we would like to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":125.8,"endTime":128.23,"body":"provide a variety of voices and"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":128.23,"endTime":130.99,"body":"perspectives. So today, we're"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":128.23,"endTime":130.99,"body":"joined by David Smurthwaite, who"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":131.29,"endTime":133.78,"body":"has graciously laughed at our"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":131.29,"endTime":133.78,"body":"joke already."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":133.96,"endTime":135.79,"body":"Yes, absolutely. Well,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":133.96,"endTime":135.79,"body":"they're good. They're good jokes"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":136.06,"endTime":136.39,"body":"so..."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":136.42,"endTime":138.88,"body":"Thanks, Dave. Yeah, so tell"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":136.42,"endTime":138.88,"body":"us a little bit about yourself."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":139.48,"endTime":143.23,"body":"I am an active member of"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":139.48,"endTime":143.23,"body":"the church. I'm in my early 40s."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":143.77,"endTime":148.3,"body":"I am first and foremost a"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":143.77,"endTime":148.3,"body":"husband and a father. I've got a"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":148.3,"endTime":151.57,"body":"great girlfriend for the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":148.3,"endTime":151.57,"body":"eternities. Her name's Marissa."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":152.23,"endTime":157.72,"body":"We've got four amazing boys,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":152.23,"endTime":157.72,"body":"Noah, Sam Oliver and Elliot. I,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":157.81,"endTime":161.44,"body":"I'm here because I only came out"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":157.81,"endTime":161.44,"body":"earlier this year. I'm a newbie"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":161.44,"endTime":163.57,"body":"in the space, something funny"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":161.44,"endTime":163.57,"body":"about our family, we lived"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":163.57,"endTime":167.35,"body":"abroad for the last five years."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":163.57,"endTime":167.35,"body":"We moved to France, I found an"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":167.35,"endTime":171.25,"body":"MBA program that I could go to,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":167.35,"endTime":171.25,"body":"and went over there. And then on"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":171.25,"endTime":174.01,"body":"the way home, we took a really"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":171.25,"endTime":174.01,"body":"long way home. And so we lived"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":174.01,"endTime":178.0,"body":"in Spain, and Rwanda, and"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":174.01,"endTime":178.0,"body":"Vietnam for a while."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":178.0,"endTime":180.28,"body":"That, that's not the most"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":178.0,"endTime":180.28,"body":"direct route back to Utah."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":180.31,"endTime":183.91,"body":"No, it's not. No. We got"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":180.31,"endTime":183.91,"body":"trapped in Vietnam with COVID"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":184.0,"endTime":187.18,"body":"for longer than we expected. And"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":184.0,"endTime":187.18,"body":"we just got back here in July."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":187.859,"endTime":188.699,"body":"Well, welcome back."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":189.18,"endTime":190.26,"body":"Thanks. I'm excited to be"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":189.18,"endTime":190.26,"body":"here."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":190.5,"endTime":193.14,"body":"So Dave, when you came out,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":190.5,"endTime":193.14,"body":"what did you tell people about"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":193.14,"endTime":193.89,"body":"your experience?"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":194.02,"endTime":197.29,"body":"So I came out as"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":194.02,"endTime":197.29,"body":"transgender. And I didn't really"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":197.29,"endTime":202.27,"body":"know that I was transgender, at"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":197.29,"endTime":202.27,"body":"the onset. And actually, I came"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":202.27,"endTime":206.59,"body":"out privately to myself in"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":202.27,"endTime":206.59,"body":"France. I'd gone through kind of"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":206.59,"endTime":211.18,"body":"decades of cycles of repression,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":206.59,"endTime":211.18,"body":"where I'd have thoughts and"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":211.18,"endTime":215.05,"body":"feelings and just kind of tucked"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":211.18,"endTime":215.05,"body":"it under. And finally thought,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":215.05,"endTime":218.17,"body":"you know what, I'm really tired"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":215.05,"endTime":218.17,"body":"of this. And so I started asking"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":218.17,"endTime":222.07,"body":"questions. And, and that's where"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":218.17,"endTime":222.07,"body":"I learned about things like"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":222.16,"endTime":225.19,"body":"transgender and gender"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":222.16,"endTime":225.19,"body":"dysphoria. Gender dysphoria"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":225.19,"endTime":231.01,"body":"being this idea of your biology,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":225.19,"endTime":231.01,"body":"not mixing with your psychology,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":231.1,"endTime":234.1,"body":"and there being a spectrum"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":231.1,"endTime":234.1,"body":"there. So, so France is really,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":234.1,"endTime":238.57,"body":"it's this beautiful and special"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":234.1,"endTime":238.57,"body":"place where, where I came out to"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":238.57,"endTime":243.49,"body":"myself for the first time, and"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":238.57,"endTime":243.49,"body":"then came out publicly a couple"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":243.49,"endTime":245.98,"body":"of years later. So came out"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":243.49,"endTime":245.98,"body":"privately and started to have"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":245.98,"endTime":250.72,"body":"conversations with my wife, and"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":245.98,"endTime":250.72,"body":"that was hard. And then really"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":250.72,"endTime":253.63,"body":"felt prompted really felt"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":250.72,"endTime":253.63,"body":"prompted at beginning of this"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":253.63,"endTime":257.77,"body":"year, that I needed to come out"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":253.63,"endTime":257.77,"body":"publicly. Sat there for like 10"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":257.77,"endTime":261.61,"body":"minutes, just like my finger"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":257.77,"endTime":261.61,"body":"hovering over the mouse button."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":262.57,"endTime":264.4,"body":"Not sure if I wanted to publish"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":262.57,"endTime":264.4,"body":"or not. And then I hit"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":264.91,"endTime":264.94,"body":"\"publish\"."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":265.3,"endTime":268.51,"body":"So Dave, you were assigned"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":265.3,"endTime":268.51,"body":"male at birth at what, what"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":268.51,"endTime":269.8,"body":"pronouns do you use now?"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":269.89,"endTime":273.07,"body":"So I use he/him and his"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":269.89,"endTime":273.07,"body":"still. Those are the pronouns"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":273.07,"endTime":276.25,"body":"that I use, and, and I talk to"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":273.07,"endTime":276.25,"body":"individuals, if you can see me I"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":276.25,"endTime":280.45,"body":"have a beard. I don't, I don't"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":276.25,"endTime":280.45,"body":"look especially feminine."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":280.86,"endTime":282.36,"body":"Your voice might be deeper"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":280.86,"endTime":282.36,"body":"than mine."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":284.37,"endTime":288.42,"body":"I'd have to go through a"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":284.37,"endTime":288.42,"body":"lot of voice therapy, if if ever"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":288.45,"endTime":291.6,"body":"I transitioned but I use it as"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":288.45,"endTime":291.6,"body":"an opportunity to talk to people"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":291.6,"endTime":294.84,"body":"about spectrum and this idea"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":291.6,"endTime":294.84,"body":"that in everything there is"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":294.84,"endTime":298.11,"body":"spectrum, and in gender and"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":294.84,"endTime":298.11,"body":"gender dysphoria their spectrum"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":298.11,"endTime":302.31,"body":"as well. So for the large part,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":298.11,"endTime":302.31,"body":"I'm comfortable. I'm comfortable"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":302.31,"endTime":306.42,"body":"in my skin. And I'm comfortable"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":302.31,"endTime":306.42,"body":"being male. But there are times"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":306.42,"endTime":312.06,"body":"when I desire a fuller range of,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":306.42,"endTime":312.06,"body":"of gender expression. And there"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":312.06,"endTime":316.23,"body":"are things about myself that"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":312.06,"endTime":316.23,"body":"cross more into what is"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":316.26,"endTime":319.68,"body":"traditionally stereotypically"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":316.26,"endTime":319.68,"body":"more feminine. When I was 14"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":319.68,"endTime":322.05,"body":"years old, I actually, I started"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":319.68,"endTime":322.05,"body":"my own business because I"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":322.05,"endTime":325.59,"body":"couldn't get a job. And so I"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":322.05,"endTime":325.59,"body":"started a business as Dave's"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":325.59,"endTime":328.05,"body":"holiday craft. I was a toll"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":325.59,"endTime":328.05,"body":"painter. I don't know if you"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":328.05,"endTime":329.19,"body":"know what toll painting is."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":329.19,"endTime":329.91,"body":"I don't."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":329.91,"endTime":330.18,"body":"I don't."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":330.0,"endTime":334.92,"body":"So if you, if you have a"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":330.0,"endTime":334.92,"body":"mother or grandmother, which you"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":334.92,"endTime":338.88,"body":"probably do, you might go to"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":334.92,"endTime":338.88,"body":"their home during the holidays"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":338.88,"endTime":343.02,"body":"and see like little painted"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":338.88,"endTime":343.02,"body":"crafts hanging up or sitting on"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":343.02,"endTime":347.49,"body":"tables. So I would paint those."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":343.02,"endTime":347.49,"body":"I would paint those little"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":347.49,"endTime":351.12,"body":"crafts, and I would go around"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":347.49,"endTime":351.12,"body":"and it was basically extortion."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":351.12,"endTime":354.15,"body":"I would sell them to all of the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":351.12,"endTime":354.15,"body":"ladies in the neighborhood. I"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":354.15,"endTime":356.64,"body":"made a decent living for a few"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":354.15,"endTime":356.64,"body":"years. But I would like I would"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":356.64,"endTime":361.14,"body":"go to Relief Societies and do"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":356.64,"endTime":361.14,"body":"trainings on toll painting. And"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":361.44,"endTime":363.78,"body":"so I'm sure there's a there's a"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":361.44,"endTime":363.78,"body":"whole lot of, you know, sisters"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":363.78,"endTime":366.51,"body":"in my old Ward that are like,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":363.78,"endTime":366.51,"body":"no, this isn't very, very"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":366.51,"endTime":369.6,"body":"surprising for us. Those types"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":366.51,"endTime":369.6,"body":"of things. But anyway..."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":369.66,"endTime":371.49,"body":"I feel like I have an"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":369.66,"endTime":371.49,"body":"original Smurthwaite in my home."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":371.49,"endTime":372.93,"body":"Yes, yes, absolutely."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":373.38,"endTime":375.24,"body":"So Dave, can you tell"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":373.38,"endTime":375.24,"body":"us a little bit about your"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":375.24,"endTime":377.43,"body":"experience as a youth leader in"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":375.24,"endTime":377.43,"body":"church."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":377.81,"endTime":380.75,"body":"So I've served in a number"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":377.81,"endTime":380.75,"body":"of different capacities and"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":380.75,"endTime":386.21,"body":"leadership. So I was a youth"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":380.75,"endTime":386.21,"body":"leader here and also in France,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":387.08,"endTime":390.98,"body":"served in young men's"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":387.08,"endTime":390.98,"body":"presidencies. Also served as a"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":390.98,"endTime":393.92,"body":"Bishop in the Salt Lake area,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":390.98,"endTime":393.92,"body":"served in the bishopric and as"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":393.92,"endTime":398.06,"body":"Bishop there, right before"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":393.92,"endTime":398.06,"body":"leaving for France. So that's a"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":398.06,"endTime":400.82,"body":"good way to get out of a calling"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":398.06,"endTime":400.82,"body":"as a Bishop, if ever you need if"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":400.82,"endTime":403.94,"body":"you ever need one, just move"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":400.82,"endTime":403.94,"body":"abroad and and you'll get"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":404.0,"endTime":404.18,"body":"released."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":404.18,"endTime":405.17,"body":"Can't you just like move?"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":405.48,"endTime":407.52,"body":"Well, now probably with"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":405.48,"endTime":407.52,"body":"zoom, they just like oh, we'll"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":407.52,"endTime":410.58,"body":"just hang on to you actually."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":407.52,"endTime":410.58,"body":"You can just you just conduct"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":410.58,"endTime":412.95,"body":"remotely from France. But I've"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":410.58,"endTime":412.95,"body":"served in a number of"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":412.95,"endTime":415.95,"body":"capacities. I have served also"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":412.95,"endTime":415.95,"body":"as a seminary teacher, and did"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":415.95,"endTime":420.45,"body":"that in France as well. So I've"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":415.95,"endTime":420.45,"body":"had a lot of great experiences"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":420.45,"endTime":423.48,"body":"with the youth. It's just so"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":420.45,"endTime":423.48,"body":"phenomenal to be with them and"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":423.48,"endTime":427.02,"body":"to feel their spirits and see"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":423.48,"endTime":427.02,"body":"these testimonies that are just"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":427.02,"endTime":430.83,"body":"blossoming. And the questions"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":427.02,"endTime":430.83,"body":"that they have that are so"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":431.01,"endTime":431.85,"body":"sincere."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":432.24,"endTime":435.09,"body":"We're here to talk about"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":432.24,"endTime":435.09,"body":"how to talk to you about LGBTQ+."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":436.02,"endTime":438.63,"body":"Me personally, sometimes I'll"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":436.02,"endTime":438.63,"body":"get asked to do like a fireside"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":438.63,"endTime":442.77,"body":"or a lesson with youth and I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":438.63,"endTime":442.77,"body":"don't like doing it. And one of"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":442.77,"endTime":445.89,"body":"my fears is, you know, youth"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":442.77,"endTime":445.89,"body":"developmentally tend to be more"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":445.92,"endTime":447.69,"body":"black and white thinkers. They"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":445.92,"endTime":447.69,"body":"want people to give them"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":447.69,"endTime":451.23,"body":"answers. And so my worry is that"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":447.69,"endTime":451.23,"body":"if I talk to youth they're going"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":451.23,"endTime":453.09,"body":"to think, oh, well, Ben's got"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":451.23,"endTime":453.09,"body":"the answers."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":453.12,"endTime":453.36,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":453.39,"endTime":455.37,"body":"Like, like gay people"},{"speaker":"Unknown","startTime":453.39,"endTime":455.37,"body":"should just be like, Ben."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":455.4,"endTime":455.67,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":455.69,"endTime":458.6,"body":"Or if I'm gay, I should be"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":455.69,"endTime":458.6,"body":"like, Ben. And that's one of the"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":458.6,"endTime":461.3,"body":"fears I have. And so when I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":458.6,"endTime":461.3,"body":"started talking to youth, what I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":461.3,"endTime":464.96,"body":"really focused on is personal"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":461.3,"endTime":464.96,"body":"revelation and teaching them"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":464.99,"endTime":468.74,"body":"okay, how do you get personal"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":464.99,"endTime":468.74,"body":"revelation to live your life and"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":468.77,"endTime":471.05,"body":"talk to God and include him in"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":468.77,"endTime":471.05,"body":"your conversations and in your"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":471.05,"endTime":473.57,"body":"decision so that you can figure"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":471.05,"endTime":473.57,"body":"out what to do? Because that's"},{"speaker":"one of my big fears","startTime":473.57,"endTime":476.66,"body":"People"},{"speaker":"one of my big fears","startTime":473.57,"endTime":476.66,"body":"feeling like I've got the"},{"speaker":"one of my big fears","startTime":476.66,"endTime":477.47,"body":"answers for them."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":477.5,"endTime":480.26,"body":"Yeah. I was, I had a"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":477.5,"endTime":480.26,"body":"conversation with a good friend"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":480.26,"endTime":484.85,"body":"recently. And, and he said, you"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":480.26,"endTime":484.85,"body":"know, I realized really early on"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":485.27,"endTime":488.84,"body":"that, that I wasn't on a"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":485.27,"endTime":488.84,"body":"personal journey. I wasn't on a"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":488.84,"endTime":493.04,"body":"world's journey. And I wasn't in"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":488.84,"endTime":493.04,"body":"on a Church's journey. I was on"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":493.04,"endTime":495.83,"body":"a God's journey. And I think"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":493.04,"endTime":495.83,"body":"this speaks to personal"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":495.83,"endTime":498.83,"body":"revelation. And my experience"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":495.83,"endTime":498.83,"body":"has been that, that it's not"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":498.83,"endTime":503.3,"body":"something that conforms easily"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":498.83,"endTime":503.3,"body":"with church policies. It's not"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":503.3,"endTime":505.94,"body":"something either that conforms"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":503.3,"endTime":505.94,"body":"really well with the world's"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":505.94,"endTime":509.0,"body":"policies, like the world would"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":505.94,"endTime":509.0,"body":"say, what, go one way, the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":509.0,"endTime":512.0,"body":"church would say go another way."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":509.0,"endTime":512.0,"body":"And what I have to do is figure"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":512.0,"endTime":517.01,"body":"out my own way, in that messy"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":512.0,"endTime":517.01,"body":"middle, and I think, I think"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":517.01,"endTime":520.13,"body":"that's exactly what what needs"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":517.01,"endTime":520.13,"body":"to happen for the youth, and"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":520.19,"endTime":523.13,"body":"what they're doing, what they're"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":520.19,"endTime":523.13,"body":"having to do, because of the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":523.13,"endTime":524.96,"body":"ecosystem that exists currently."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":525.14,"endTime":527.54,"body":"So Dave, when you were a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":525.14,"endTime":527.54,"body":"leader, like what do you wish"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":527.54,"endTime":528.2,"body":"you had known?"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":528.27,"endTime":531.51,"body":"So when I came out"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":528.27,"endTime":531.51,"body":"publicly, I had the opportunity"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":531.51,"endTime":534.3,"body":"to, I was approached, actually"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":531.51,"endTime":534.3,"body":"by a group of seminary teachers"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":534.45,"endTime":538.5,"body":"in Tooele. They had this they"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":534.45,"endTime":538.5,"body":"had this question of what can"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":538.5,"endTime":541.53,"body":"we, what can we talk to our"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":538.5,"endTime":541.53,"body":"youth about? They wanted to be"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":541.53,"endTime":543.48,"body":"more inclusive. They're an"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":541.53,"endTime":543.48,"body":"exceptional group. They just"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":543.48,"endTime":546.75,"body":"wanted to be more inclusive and"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":543.48,"endTime":546.75,"body":"loving in their classrooms. And"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":546.75,"endTime":549.72,"body":"they said, hey, I knew one of"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":546.75,"endTime":549.72,"body":"the seminary teachers, they"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":549.72,"endTime":552.87,"body":"said, hey, can you come and talk"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":549.72,"endTime":552.87,"body":"to us? Because you're part of"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":552.87,"endTime":556.32,"body":"the LGBT community so like, come"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":552.87,"endTime":556.32,"body":"and give us come and give us"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":556.32,"endTime":556.74,"body":"answers."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":556.74,"endTime":557.61,"body":"You've got all the answers."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":557.64,"endTime":559.68,"body":"You have all the answers."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":557.64,"endTime":559.68,"body":"Absolutely. You are the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":559.68,"endTime":560.28,"body":"spokesperson."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":560.34,"endTime":561.42,"body":"You came out so you know"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":560.34,"endTime":561.42,"body":"everything."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":561.45,"endTime":562.95,"body":"This has not happened to"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":561.45,"endTime":562.95,"body":"you, I'm sure."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":563.1,"endTime":563.64,"body":"Never."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":563.562,"endTime":567.102,"body":"Never, never. I said,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":563.562,"endTime":567.102,"body":"well, yeah, of course, I'm not"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":567.102,"endTime":569.472,"body":"going to turn this opportunity"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":567.102,"endTime":569.472,"body":"down. I'm sure that it's, you"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":569.472,"endTime":572.562,"body":"know, it's something that I"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":569.472,"endTime":572.562,"body":"should do. I felt like I should"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":572.562,"endTime":576.492,"body":"do it. But then as soon as I"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":572.562,"endTime":576.492,"body":"said, yes, I thought, you know"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":576.492,"endTime":582.132,"body":"what, I'm, I'm this 40 year old"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":576.492,"endTime":582.132,"body":"dude, who recently came out as"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":582.222,"endTime":586.572,"body":"transgender. I'm like, one, I'm"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":582.222,"endTime":586.572,"body":"a sliver of the spectrum. I'm a"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":586.572,"endTime":590.022,"body":"tiny, tiny sliver of the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":586.572,"endTime":590.022,"body":"spectrum. And two, I'm like 20"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":590.022,"endTime":595.182,"body":"years older than your...I'm more"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":590.022,"endTime":595.182,"body":"than that. Like I'm 25 years"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":595.182,"endTime":599.202,"body":"older than your seminary"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":595.182,"endTime":599.202,"body":"students, and the world that"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":599.202,"endTime":603.912,"body":"they're living in. So, so what I"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":599.202,"endTime":603.912,"body":"decided to do was was try and"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":603.912,"endTime":609.462,"body":"reach out and ask youth and"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":603.912,"endTime":609.462,"body":"young adults their perspectives."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":609.792,"endTime":614.052,"body":"And so I just put it out"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":609.792,"endTime":614.052,"body":"organically on Facebook. And I"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":614.052,"endTime":617.532,"body":"was astounded at the response"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":614.052,"endTime":617.532,"body":"from individuals that I was not"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":617.532,"endTime":621.282,"body":"expecting. There wasn't a space"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":617.532,"endTime":621.282,"body":"for these individuals to share"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":621.282,"endTime":623.802,"body":"their perspectives in a lot of"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":621.282,"endTime":623.802,"body":"nstances."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":624.59,"endTime":626.39,"body":"Dave I noticed you start to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":624.59,"endTime":626.39,"body":"get a little emotional as you"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":626.39,"endTime":628.34,"body":"talk about these responses."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":626.39,"endTime":628.34,"body":"Could you help us understand"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":628.34,"endTime":629.75,"body":"where those emotions are coming"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":628.34,"endTime":629.75,"body":"from?"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":630.2,"endTime":633.38,"body":"Part of the part of the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":630.2,"endTime":633.38,"body":"project for me was that I didn't"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":633.38,"endTime":636.65,"body":"want to limit it to individuals"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":633.38,"endTime":636.65,"body":"who were active members of the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":636.65,"endTime":640.04,"body":"church, because quite honestly,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":636.65,"endTime":640.04,"body":"if you're not actively"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":640.04,"endTime":642.5,"body":"participating right now, then"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":640.04,"endTime":642.5,"body":"some of the feedback that you"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":642.5,"endTime":646.64,"body":"might have is really, really"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":642.5,"endTime":646.64,"body":"important for us to hear. Just"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":646.7,"endTime":649.94,"body":"the the vulnerability that was"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":646.7,"endTime":649.94,"body":"shared there the transparency"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":649.94,"endTime":653.87,"body":"that was shared in their"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":649.94,"endTime":653.87,"body":"responses, it was, like I said,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":653.87,"endTime":657.8,"body":"it was it was both beautiful, to"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":653.87,"endTime":657.8,"body":"hear of individuals journeys."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":657.8,"endTime":660.02,"body":"And just these are glimpses,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":657.8,"endTime":660.02,"body":"these are in paragraphs, right."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":660.02,"endTime":661.88,"body":"I don't I haven't had the chance"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":660.02,"endTime":661.88,"body":"to actually meet these"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":661.88,"endTime":665.66,"body":"individuals. Some I've had video"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":661.88,"endTime":665.66,"body":"interviews with, but just in"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":666.14,"endTime":670.64,"body":"three or four sentences, hearing"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":666.14,"endTime":670.64,"body":"their heartache, and hearing"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":671.03,"endTime":674.87,"body":"their personal victories and"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":671.03,"endTime":674.87,"body":"their journeys. It's just it's a"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":674.87,"endTime":680.69,"body":"tremendous collection of just"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":674.87,"endTime":680.69,"body":"really snippets of, of what our"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":680.75,"endTime":686.21,"body":"phenomenal, amazing lives and"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":680.75,"endTime":686.21,"body":"just to get that glimpse was was"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":686.33,"endTime":689.39,"body":"I felt, I felt honored quite"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":686.33,"endTime":689.39,"body":"honestly."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":689.66,"endTime":691.64,"body":"I'm really glad you"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":689.66,"endTime":691.64,"body":"shared that. When I think back"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":691.64,"endTime":693.71,"body":"to my time, as a youth in the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":691.64,"endTime":693.71,"body":"church, people didn't really"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":693.71,"endTime":697.13,"body":"talk about this. I'm 27 right"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":693.71,"endTime":697.13,"body":"now. This would be like 10 to 15"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":697.16,"endTime":700.04,"body":"years ago. And this was a taboo"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":697.16,"endTime":700.04,"body":"topic, it was never really"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":700.04,"endTime":703.04,"body":"brought up. So actually,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":700.04,"endTime":703.04,"body":"sometimes youth leaders will be"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":703.04,"endTime":704.78,"body":"like, well, what do you wish"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":703.04,"endTime":704.78,"body":"your youth leader would have"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":704.78,"endTime":707.54,"body":"done? And I'm like, I don't"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":704.78,"endTime":707.54,"body":"know, like nothing was done"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":707.54,"endTime":710.84,"body":"ever. Right? Most of the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":707.54,"endTime":710.84,"body":"information I got was was me"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":710.84,"endTime":715.13,"body":"seeking it out. But I remember"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":710.84,"endTime":715.13,"body":"strong messaging as a youth"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":715.43,"endTime":719.63,"body":"about like, church versus world,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":715.43,"endTime":719.63,"body":"right? I really internalized"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":719.63,"endTime":722.18,"body":"that. And in fact, there was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":719.63,"endTime":722.18,"body":"this general conference, quote,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":722.39,"endTime":724.37,"body":"there was like, you can't have"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":722.39,"endTime":724.37,"body":"one foot in the church and one"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":724.37,"endTime":726.74,"body":"foot in the world. They're"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":724.37,"endTime":726.74,"body":"rapidly diverging and you will"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":726.74,"endTime":729.71,"body":"lose your balance. And I printed"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":726.74,"endTime":729.71,"body":"it off. And I made like a cute"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":729.71,"endTime":733.82,"body":"little like, framed thing with a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":729.71,"endTime":733.82,"body":"nice font, and I put it above my"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":733.82,"endTime":736.67,"body":"bed, and I would look at it"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":733.82,"endTime":736.67,"body":"every day. And like that was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":736.67,"endTime":740.63,"body":"such a strong message that I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":736.67,"endTime":740.63,"body":"internalized. The way I was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":740.63,"endTime":745.43,"body":"viewing it was like church"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":740.63,"endTime":745.43,"body":"versus world, world being LGBTQ,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":746.27,"endTime":749.18,"body":"or just any type of thing that's"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":746.27,"endTime":749.18,"body":"viewed as sinful, or deviant, or"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":749.18,"endTime":752.39,"body":"just different, right? I look"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":749.18,"endTime":752.39,"body":"back on that. And I'm a little"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":752.39,"endTime":755.03,"body":"bit, I feel a little bit"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":752.39,"endTime":755.03,"body":"conflicted about that because on"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":755.03,"endTime":757.85,"body":"the one hand, it helped me make"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":755.03,"endTime":757.85,"body":"really good choices and maybe"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":757.85,"endTime":761.33,"body":"like weed out some of the wild"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":757.85,"endTime":761.33,"body":"activities that I would have"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":761.33,"endTime":764.51,"body":"participated in, had I not had"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":761.33,"endTime":764.51,"body":"that mindset of I need to like,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":764.57,"endTime":767.81,"body":"be spiritual. But at the same"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":764.57,"endTime":767.81,"body":"time, I noticed that it made me"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":768.05,"endTime":771.38,"body":"sometimes even consciously push"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":768.05,"endTime":771.38,"body":"away people I thought were too"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":771.38,"endTime":773.99,"body":"worldly, and not listen to their"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":771.38,"endTime":773.99,"body":"experiences..."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":774.02,"endTime":774.29,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":774.38,"endTime":777.59,"body":"...and close myself off"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":774.38,"endTime":777.59,"body":"from children of God. I'm just"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":777.59,"endTime":780.89,"body":"thinking about, like, how we can"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":777.59,"endTime":780.89,"body":"like rebrand messaging for youth"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":781.01,"endTime":785.51,"body":"these days. How beautiful would"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":781.01,"endTime":785.51,"body":"it be if we could keep that idea"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":785.54,"endTime":792.5,"body":"of virtue and power and strength"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":785.54,"endTime":792.5,"body":"in a gospel sense, but not at"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":792.5,"endTime":795.41,"body":"the expense of pushing away"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":792.5,"endTime":795.41,"body":"other children of God who we"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":795.44,"endTime":798.59,"body":"think are too different from us"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":795.44,"endTime":798.59,"body":"or who we individually deem"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":799.04,"endTime":799.61,"body":"worldly?"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":799.69,"endTime":803.44,"body":"Yeah, I had had a similar"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":799.69,"endTime":803.44,"body":"experience when I, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":803.44,"endTime":809.05,"body":"when I was, I was 12 years old."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":803.44,"endTime":809.05,"body":"When I started, like, exploring"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":809.11,"endTime":812.65,"body":"gender. I started having these"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":809.11,"endTime":812.65,"body":"feelings. I went into my"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":812.65,"endTime":816.31,"body":"mother's closet when she was not"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":812.65,"endTime":816.31,"body":"around and I found this hideous"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":816.34,"endTime":819.43,"body":"blue dress that's like, she"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":816.34,"endTime":819.43,"body":"hadn't worn in ages and with"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":819.43,"endTime":822.88,"body":"good reason. And then I like"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":819.43,"endTime":822.88,"body":"ransacked, like the old really"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":822.88,"endTime":826.6,"body":"old, like the dregs of makeup"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":822.88,"endTime":826.6,"body":"that she had in some other"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":826.6,"endTime":829.42,"body":"closet, that wasn't her main"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":826.6,"endTime":829.42,"body":"area. And I like snuck those up"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":829.42,"endTime":832.93,"body":"to my bedroom. And it was"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":829.42,"endTime":832.93,"body":"horrible. Like, it was like, you"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":832.93,"endTime":836.86,"body":"know, like, Frankenstein. It was"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":832.93,"endTime":836.86,"body":"just, you know, but I felt"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":836.86,"endTime":840.55,"body":"really bad about it, because of"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":836.86,"endTime":840.55,"body":"similar messaging of like, okay,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":840.55,"endTime":844.21,"body":"this is, I'm in the world. I'm"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":840.55,"endTime":844.21,"body":"not, I'm not where I need to be"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":844.21,"endTime":848.05,"body":"right now. So I went to my"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":844.21,"endTime":848.05,"body":"Bishop, and, who was like a"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":848.05,"endTime":851.83,"body":"grandfather to me, I absolutely"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":848.05,"endTime":851.83,"body":"loved him. And I confessed, and"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":851.83,"endTime":855.22,"body":"bless his heart, he, he just"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":851.83,"endTime":855.22,"body":"had, he had zero context for"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":855.22,"endTime":858.52,"body":"what I was talking about. So he"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":855.22,"endTime":858.52,"body":"was loving, and he was kind, we"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":858.52,"endTime":860.98,"body":"had a wonderful relationship,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":858.52,"endTime":860.98,"body":"but he basically said, you know"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":860.98,"endTime":863.83,"body":"what, we probably shouldn't do"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":860.98,"endTime":863.83,"body":"this. That's so that the message"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":863.83,"endTime":866.8,"body":"that I took away from that was"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":863.83,"endTime":866.8,"body":"like, oh, okay, like, this is"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":866.8,"endTime":870.94,"body":"bad. And so that kind of that"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":866.8,"endTime":870.94,"body":"started me down this decade's"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":870.94,"endTime":874.09,"body":"long journey of like, okay, if"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":870.94,"endTime":874.09,"body":"these feelings come up, push"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":874.09,"endTime":874.6,"body":"them down."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":874.9,"endTime":877.48,"body":"Dave, I'm so sorry you felt"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":874.9,"endTime":877.48,"body":"like you couldn't talk about it."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":877.54,"endTime":880.48,"body":"You know, as you guys been"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":877.54,"endTime":880.48,"body":"talking, I don't really remember"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":880.48,"endTime":883.21,"body":"anything homosexuality related"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":880.48,"endTime":883.21,"body":"talked about in my youth. I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":883.21,"endTime":885.28,"body":"mean, I'm sure it was it just"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":883.21,"endTime":885.28,"body":"didn't stick to me."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":885.43,"endTime":885.79,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":885.45,"endTime":887.79,"body":"Yeah, well I just I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":885.45,"endTime":887.79,"body":"don't think we can afford that"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":887.79,"endTime":890.82,"body":"anymore. You know? And I, I wish"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":887.79,"endTime":890.82,"body":"there would have been some sort"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":890.82,"endTime":894.9,"body":"of messaging even. I remember my"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":890.82,"endTime":894.9,"body":"first semester at BYU, I had a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":894.9,"endTime":899.19,"body":"mission prep teacher, and he was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":894.9,"endTime":899.19,"body":"talking about same sex"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":899.19,"endTime":902.22,"body":"attraction and a conference that"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":899.19,"endTime":902.22,"body":"was coming up. Obviously, I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":902.22,"endTime":905.01,"body":"wasn't out yet. And I was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":902.22,"endTime":905.01,"body":"listening to that, like, queasy"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":905.01,"endTime":909.0,"body":"and excited, but also like,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":905.01,"endTime":909.0,"body":"terrified. And he talked about"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":909.0,"endTime":914.16,"body":"this summit that was going to be"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":909.0,"endTime":914.16,"body":"in Provo. I ended up going and"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":914.16,"endTime":917.34,"body":"pretending that it was a school"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":914.16,"endTime":917.34,"body":"assignment. And my friends"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":917.34,"endTime":919.35,"body":"wanted to go with me. I was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":917.34,"endTime":919.35,"body":"like, oh, I have to go to this"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":919.35,"endTime":921.9,"body":"stupid school assignment hoping"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":919.35,"endTime":921.9,"body":"that someone would go with me."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":921.93,"endTime":926.01,"body":"Nobody did. So I went alone,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":921.93,"endTime":926.01,"body":"looking back, like, some of the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":926.01,"endTime":929.58,"body":"things that were shared at the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":926.01,"endTime":929.58,"body":"conference were like, right now,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":929.58,"endTime":933.75,"body":"they don't resonate with me at"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":929.58,"endTime":933.75,"body":"all. But it was something, right"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":933.75,"endTime":938.07,"body":"it, it helped me get a different"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":933.75,"endTime":938.07,"body":"frame of reference, or at least"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":938.07,"endTime":941.07,"body":"see other people who are like"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":938.07,"endTime":941.07,"body":"me, and it gave me, I don't"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":941.07,"endTime":943.26,"body":"know, I just remembered that I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":941.07,"endTime":943.26,"body":"totally forgot I did this."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":943.59,"endTime":946.02,"body":"Because I like blocked it out of"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":943.59,"endTime":946.02,"body":"my mind, because it was like,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":946.05,"endTime":949.05,"body":"almost a little bit traumatic"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":946.05,"endTime":949.05,"body":"for me to like, like a mini"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":949.05,"endTime":950.94,"body":"coming out experience like"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":949.05,"endTime":950.94,"body":"associating..."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":950.97,"endTime":951.48,"body":"Yeah, yeah."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":951.27,"endTime":955.83,"body":"...when I was 19. And I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":951.27,"endTime":955.83,"body":"don't know, like, even that"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":955.83,"endTime":958.83,"body":"professor is, and I don't even"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":955.83,"endTime":958.83,"body":"know if he's still alive. He was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":958.83,"endTime":961.14,"body":"really old. And this was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":958.83,"endTime":961.14,"body":"probably 10 years ago, I guess."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":961.14,"endTime":964.02,"body":"Actually, it was a little long."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":961.14,"endTime":964.02,"body":"Sorry. Sorry. Sorry, if you're"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":964.02,"endTime":969.09,"body":"still alive. But some of those"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":964.02,"endTime":969.09,"body":"ideas have been like debunked"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":969.09,"endTime":970.41,"body":"and are a little bit outdated."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":970.44,"endTime":970.62,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":970.62,"endTime":973.77,"body":"I remember what was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":970.62,"endTime":973.77,"body":"shared. But still, it helps me."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":973.95,"endTime":977.76,"body":"Right. So that just like,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":973.95,"endTime":977.76,"body":"opening the opportunity to have"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":977.76,"endTime":981.6,"body":"dialogue is so important. And"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":977.76,"endTime":981.6,"body":"as, if you're a youth leader,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":981.69,"endTime":984.69,"body":"that's important. You know, you"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":981.69,"endTime":984.69,"body":"have to give people like you"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":984.69,"endTime":988.89,"body":"said, be someone's France, like"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":984.69,"endTime":988.89,"body":"you weren't able to introspect"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":989.1,"endTime":992.01,"body":"and figure out who you were"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":989.1,"endTime":992.01,"body":"until you had a quiet open space"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":992.04,"endTime":995.16,"body":"in France. How beautiful would"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":992.04,"endTime":995.16,"body":"it be if our leaders could be"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":995.16,"endTime":996.15,"body":"France for someone?"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":996.48,"endTime":997.44,"body":"Beautiful. I love that."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":997.89,"endTime":999.45,"body":"As you've been talking"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":997.89,"endTime":999.45,"body":"Charlie, I've been thinking,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":999.63,"endTime":1002.03,"body":"just like really digging deep,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":999.63,"endTime":1002.03,"body":"like, what did people say? And"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1002.03,"endTime":1006.8,"body":"the Family Proclamation came out"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1002.03,"endTime":1006.8,"body":"in 95. I was 11. And so the"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1006.8,"endTime":1008.96,"body":"family was like this, like,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1006.8,"endTime":1008.96,"body":"throughout my youth was like,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1008.96,"endTime":1011.66,"body":"really heavily emphasized. And"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1008.96,"endTime":1011.66,"body":"so we didn't really talk about"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1011.69,"endTime":1015.68,"body":"gay people, or LGBTQ people, it"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1011.69,"endTime":1015.68,"body":"was just gay marriage is bad."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1016.22,"endTime":1016.58,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1016.61,"endTime":1019.49,"body":"Like that, like that was"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1016.61,"endTime":1019.49,"body":"the message I got. So so I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1019.49,"endTime":1021.23,"body":"didn't get the message of that"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1019.49,"endTime":1021.23,"body":"we should love gay people, we"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1021.23,"endTime":1023.45,"body":"should include them. It was just"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1021.23,"endTime":1023.45,"body":"like gay marriage is bad."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1024.62,"endTime":1028.22,"body":"I mean, the reality is, is"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1024.62,"endTime":1028.22,"body":"that we haven't talked about it."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1028.46,"endTime":1033.17,"body":"And what we're finding is that"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1028.46,"endTime":1033.17,"body":"suddenly, there's this critical"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1033.17,"endTime":1038.12,"body":"need, right? Because, because as"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1033.17,"endTime":1038.12,"body":"the world was evolving, and"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1038.12,"endTime":1042.26,"body":"acceptance was happening, at the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1038.12,"endTime":1042.26,"body":"world level, those conversations"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1042.29,"endTime":1044.96,"body":"hadn't or weren't happening yet"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1042.29,"endTime":1044.96,"body":"in the church and suddenly,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1044.96,"endTime":1049.73,"body":"we're at this point where our"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1044.96,"endTime":1049.73,"body":"youth are at the same level as"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1049.73,"endTime":1054.56,"body":"the world in terms of commentary"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1049.73,"endTime":1054.56,"body":"and understanding. It's a common"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1054.56,"endTime":1058.19,"body":"conversation that's happening"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1054.56,"endTime":1058.19,"body":"with our youth. Either they are"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1058.19,"endTime":1062.03,"body":"LGBTQ, or they have friends who"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1058.19,"endTime":1062.03,"body":"are LGBTQ, or they're seeing it"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1062.03,"endTime":1067.22,"body":"every day. And those of us that"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1062.03,"endTime":1067.22,"body":"grew up in the church, where it"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1067.22,"endTime":1070.7,"body":"wasn't talked about, most of us"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1067.22,"endTime":1070.7,"body":"being leaders, right now,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1071.12,"endTime":1074.78,"body":"suddenly, we've got this whole"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1071.12,"endTime":1074.78,"body":"world that's coming to us. And"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1074.78,"endTime":1077.36,"body":"we don't know what to do with"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1074.78,"endTime":1077.36,"body":"it. And there's, there's so many"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1077.36,"endTime":1080.3,"body":"of us that are that are, that"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1077.36,"endTime":1080.3,"body":"sounds like a revolution, that"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1080.3,"endTime":1082.82,"body":"are rising up in this space,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1080.3,"endTime":1082.82,"body":"that are having these"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1082.82,"endTime":1085.28,"body":"conversations. And I really"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1082.82,"endTime":1085.28,"body":"think it's for a reason. I think"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1085.28,"endTime":1089.57,"body":"we need to expedite the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1085.28,"endTime":1089.57,"body":"knowledge and the empathy that"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1089.57,"endTime":1090.86,"body":"exists in this space."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1090.89,"endTime":1093.62,"body":"Well, I think the Holy"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1090.89,"endTime":1093.62,"body":"Ghost is working on us as a, as"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1093.62,"endTime":1096.86,"body":"a Zion community to so that we"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1093.62,"endTime":1096.86,"body":"can have these conversations. I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1096.86,"endTime":1098.51,"body":"really think this is a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1096.86,"endTime":1098.51,"body":"spirit-driven thing."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1098.54,"endTime":1098.87,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1099.29,"endTime":1101.78,"body":"So you know, we all talked"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1099.29,"endTime":1101.78,"body":"about, you know, there wasn't a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1101.78,"endTime":1104.6,"body":"lot said when we when we were"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1101.78,"endTime":1104.6,"body":"youth, and a fear that I've"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1104.6,"endTime":1106.58,"body":"heard a lot of people expressed"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1104.6,"endTime":1106.58,"body":"that, well, if we talk about"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1106.61,"endTime":1109.88,"body":"same sex attraction, if we talk"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1106.61,"endTime":1109.88,"body":"about being transgender, then"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1109.88,"endTime":1112.7,"body":"youth are going to think that"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1109.88,"endTime":1112.7,"body":"they are and maybe experiment"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1112.7,"endTime":1113.75,"body":"when they really aren't."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1113.81,"endTime":1114.17,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1115.26,"endTime":1117.48,"body":"But you know, what you"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1115.26,"endTime":1117.48,"body":"said, Dave, was, you, no one"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1117.48,"endTime":1119.01,"body":"ever talked about this, but you"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1117.48,"endTime":1119.01,"body":"were experimenting with your"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1119.01,"endTime":1120.69,"body":"mom's clothes and makeup when"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1119.01,"endTime":1120.69,"body":"you were 12."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1120.72,"endTime":1121.08,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1121.11,"endTime":1123.06,"body":"You know, Charlie and I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1121.11,"endTime":1123.06,"body":"didn't talk about this at all in"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1123.06,"endTime":1128.01,"body":"our, in our teens and early 20s."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1123.06,"endTime":1128.01,"body":"And yet, here we are. Yeah. So I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1128.01,"endTime":1130.17,"body":"think that's a fear that that we"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1128.01,"endTime":1130.17,"body":"just don't need to have."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1131.43,"endTime":1134.4,"body":"Well, it's interesting,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1131.43,"endTime":1134.4,"body":"because the more we talk about"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1134.4,"endTime":1136.95,"body":"this and give people space, the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1134.4,"endTime":1136.95,"body":"more people who are going to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1136.95,"endTime":1140.13,"body":"come out. But it's not because"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1136.95,"endTime":1140.13,"body":"they've, it's not because we've"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1140.13,"endTime":1142.92,"body":"convinced them or trick them"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1140.13,"endTime":1142.92,"body":"into coming out. It's because"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1142.92,"endTime":1146.49,"body":"they're actually LGBTQ, and they"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1142.92,"endTime":1146.49,"body":"just needed space to understand"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1146.49,"endTime":1150.27,"body":"themselves. I like have a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1146.49,"endTime":1150.27,"body":"personal testimony that like"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1150.3,"endTime":1153.75,"body":"changing orientation does not"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1150.3,"endTime":1153.75,"body":"work. And so if you're afraid"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1153.75,"endTime":1156.75,"body":"that talking about gay people,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1153.75,"endTime":1156.75,"body":"or seeing gay people is gonna"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1156.75,"endTime":1161.85,"body":"make your youth or your child"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1156.75,"endTime":1161.85,"body":"gay like that, that doesn't"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1161.85,"endTime":1164.4,"body":"happen, or else I'd be the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1161.85,"endTime":1164.4,"body":"straightest personal alive."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1168.53,"endTime":1172.16,"body":"So, so Dave, what would you"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1168.53,"endTime":1172.16,"body":"say to let's say, a Young Womans"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1172.16,"endTime":1174.26,"body":"leader is listening to this? And"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1172.16,"endTime":1174.26,"body":"she said, you know, I want to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1174.32,"endTime":1176.48,"body":"have this conversation with my"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1174.32,"endTime":1176.48,"body":"youth, but I don't know what to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1176.48,"endTime":1177.98,"body":"do. What would you tell her?"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1178.55,"endTime":1181.49,"body":"So I actually in"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1178.55,"endTime":1181.49,"body":"preparation for this, because I"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1181.49,"endTime":1184.13,"body":"was so inspired by this exercise"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1181.49,"endTime":1184.13,"body":"that I went through, and this,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1184.13,"endTime":1187.55,"body":"and these respondents, actually"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1184.13,"endTime":1187.55,"body":"grabbed some of their responses"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1187.55,"endTime":1189.83,"body":"going back to, going through the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1187.55,"endTime":1189.83,"body":"same exercise. I'm like, yeah,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1189.83,"endTime":1193.22,"body":"sure I can. I can speak to these"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1189.83,"endTime":1193.22,"body":"youth leaders or I can use the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1193.22,"endTime":1196.82,"body":"voices of the youth to speak to"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1193.22,"endTime":1196.82,"body":"these youth leaders and I'd love"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1196.82,"endTime":1201.08,"body":"to share the voices of these"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1196.82,"endTime":1201.08,"body":"individuals. As a way to speak"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1201.08,"endTime":1201.89,"body":"to the youth leaders."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1201.92,"endTime":1202.37,"body":"Love it."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1202.9,"endTime":1206.68,"body":"Let's start with Alexis."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1202.9,"endTime":1206.68,"body":"Active youth in the church"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1206.74,"endTime":1212.77,"body":"identifying as bisexual had this"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1206.74,"endTime":1212.77,"body":"advice for leaders: Love first,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1212.8,"endTime":1216.64,"body":"second, and third. Another youth"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1212.8,"endTime":1216.64,"body":"who wanted to remain, remain"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1216.64,"endTime":1220.24,"body":"anonymous was identifying as"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1216.64,"endTime":1220.24,"body":"transgender said, you know what,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1220.24,"endTime":1223.78,"body":"just accept me as I am. I'm a"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1220.24,"endTime":1223.78,"body":"person and I just want to be"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1223.78,"endTime":1227.92,"body":"loved. And then Emma, who is a"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1223.78,"endTime":1227.92,"body":"young adult, said it slightly"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1227.92,"endTime":1231.37,"body":"differently. She identifies as"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1227.92,"endTime":1231.37,"body":"bisexual. She said, please know"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1231.52,"endTime":1236.59,"body":"that the message, love the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1231.52,"endTime":1236.59,"body":"sinner, hate the sin and it's"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1236.59,"endTime":1240.22,"body":"not the attraction, but acting"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1236.59,"endTime":1240.22,"body":"upon it are messages that we've"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1240.22,"endTime":1244.87,"body":"heard 100 times. It's not what"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1240.22,"endTime":1244.87,"body":"we need to hear. The message we"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1244.87,"endTime":1248.71,"body":"need to hear more is that we are"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1244.87,"endTime":1248.71,"body":"loved exactly as we are. That"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1248.71,"endTime":1252.07,"body":"there is hope for us that we"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1248.71,"endTime":1252.07,"body":"aren't condemned for how we"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1252.07,"endTime":1255.58,"body":"feel. That there is a place for"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1252.07,"endTime":1255.58,"body":"us in this church."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1255.88,"endTime":1257.95,"body":"I've actually been kind of"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1255.88,"endTime":1257.95,"body":"emotional as you share that just"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1257.95,"endTime":1262.03,"body":"because I until my late 20s,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1257.95,"endTime":1262.03,"body":"when I thought a guy was"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1262.03,"endTime":1265.54,"body":"attractive, I felt bad about it."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1262.03,"endTime":1265.54,"body":"And that was a pain I carried"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1265.54,"endTime":1266.41,"body":"for a really long time."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1266.8,"endTime":1268.66,"body":"These are real youth"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1266.8,"endTime":1268.66,"body":"that said these things?"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1268.69,"endTime":1269.11,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1269.74,"endTime":1273.07,"body":"I'm just thinking right"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1269.74,"endTime":1273.07,"body":"now about how my generation and"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1273.13,"endTime":1275.5,"body":"the next one, I don't... Are"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1273.13,"endTime":1275.5,"body":"y'all in my generation? No."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1275.5,"endTime":1275.68,"body":"No."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1275.74,"endTime":1278.92,"body":"We're technically both"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1275.74,"endTime":1278.92,"body":"millennials. I mean, I'm an old"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1278.92,"endTime":1279.4,"body":"millennial, but..."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1279.45,"endTime":1280.38,"body":"You're on the cusp."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1280.71,"endTime":1281.88,"body":"And I'm just outside."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1282.89,"endTime":1285.17,"body":"Well, I mean, I think"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1282.89,"endTime":1285.17,"body":"we grew up hearing this message"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1285.17,"endTime":1289.43,"body":"that our generation was saved"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1285.17,"endTime":1289.43,"body":"for the latter-days and called"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1289.43,"endTime":1292.49,"body":"for a special purpose. And then"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1289.43,"endTime":1292.49,"body":"we are the noble and great ones."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1292.61,"endTime":1295.73,"body":"And I'm listening to these three"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1292.61,"endTime":1295.73,"body":"people who are the noble and"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1295.73,"endTime":1299.18,"body":"great ones. Because they get it."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1295.73,"endTime":1299.18,"body":"They understand it. They don't"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1299.18,"endTime":1302.72,"body":"need someone to say, well, how"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1299.18,"endTime":1302.72,"body":"do I love this person that's"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1302.72,"endTime":1305.42,"body":"different from me? Like that,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1302.72,"endTime":1305.42,"body":"there's an intuition there."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1305.42,"endTime":1308.78,"body":"There's, there's a Christ like"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1305.42,"endTime":1308.78,"body":"understanding of how to treat"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1308.78,"endTime":1311.36,"body":"people, how to love, how to show"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1308.78,"endTime":1311.36,"body":"up and be there for someone"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1311.75,"endTime":1315.59,"body":"without all of these like,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1311.75,"endTime":1315.59,"body":"biases and questions and trying"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1315.59,"endTime":1318.92,"body":"to give advice or consultations."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1315.59,"endTime":1318.92,"body":"It's just they get the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1318.92,"endTime":1322.37,"body":"simplicity of the gospel. And I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1318.92,"endTime":1322.37,"body":"mean, that was my biggest"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1322.37,"endTime":1326.63,"body":"takeaway from this is that, as"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1322.37,"endTime":1326.63,"body":"youth leaders, it's not what"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1326.63,"endTime":1330.14,"body":"advice can I give to this youth"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1326.63,"endTime":1330.14,"body":"to guide them on their path?"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1330.38,"endTime":1332.3,"body":"It's what can I learn from this"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1330.38,"endTime":1332.3,"body":"youth?"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1332.33,"endTime":1332.81,"body":"Amen. Amen."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1332.99,"endTime":1335.6,"body":"Because this youth"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1332.99,"endTime":1335.6,"body":"knows something that I don't."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1335.93,"endTime":1338.6,"body":"And rather than trying to say,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1335.93,"endTime":1338.6,"body":"well, have you tried this made"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1338.6,"endTime":1342.02,"body":"me do this? Say, tell me more"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1338.6,"endTime":1342.02,"body":"about your experience. Let me in"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1342.02,"endTime":1344.93,"body":"because I want to see, and I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1342.02,"endTime":1344.93,"body":"want to understand you?"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1344.0,"endTime":1349.79,"body":"Yeah, amen. Amen. I cannot"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1344.0,"endTime":1349.79,"body":"agree more. I think that if we"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1349.79,"endTime":1353.42,"body":"read in the scriptures, and we"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1349.79,"endTime":1353.42,"body":"think about our own lines, God"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1353.42,"endTime":1357.05,"body":"has moved the needle on the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1353.42,"endTime":1357.05,"body":"gospel, not through policies,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1357.53,"endTime":1361.1,"body":"but through people. As we think"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1357.53,"endTime":1361.1,"body":"about the church that we would"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1361.1,"endTime":1365.18,"body":"like to see, in the future, the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1361.1,"endTime":1365.18,"body":"conversations that we'd like to"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1365.18,"endTime":1370.28,"body":"have, this is how he does it."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1365.18,"endTime":1370.28,"body":"And it is with this rising"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1370.28,"endTime":1373.4,"body":"generation. I could not agree"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1370.28,"endTime":1373.4,"body":"more. This is this is how change"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1373.4,"endTime":1376.31,"body":"happens. It's through these"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1373.4,"endTime":1376.31,"body":"individuals. A quick aside I was"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1376.31,"endTime":1380.12,"body":"studying in Fourth Nephi this"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1376.31,"endTime":1380.12,"body":"week, it's it's a really"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1380.12,"endTime":1383.42,"body":"interesting chapter because it"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1380.12,"endTime":1383.42,"body":"kind of like it starts in Sesame"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1383.42,"endTime":1386.99,"body":"Street. But then it ends in Game"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1383.42,"endTime":1386.99,"body":"of Thrones, like, everyone's"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1387.11,"endTime":1390.35,"body":"very happy, and there's no"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1387.11,"endTime":1390.35,"body":"contention. And there's this"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1390.35,"endTime":1397.55,"body":"perfect unity that exists with"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1390.35,"endTime":1397.55,"body":"this group. And the verse that's"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1397.58,"endTime":1400.52,"body":"stuck out to me the most even"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1397.58,"endTime":1400.52,"body":"just the phrase with this idea"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1400.52,"endTime":1403.31,"body":"of \"no manner of -ites\". And I"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1400.52,"endTime":1403.31,"body":"thought about that, in the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1403.31,"endTime":1407.66,"body":"context of my own experience,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1403.31,"endTime":1407.66,"body":"and this, this recognition,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1407.66,"endTime":1412.49,"body":"there was gladness and sadness"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1407.66,"endTime":1412.49,"body":"at the same time of, I'm proud"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1412.52,"endTime":1415.97,"body":"of my life journey so far. And I"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1412.52,"endTime":1415.97,"body":"know that it's very dynamic, and"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1415.97,"endTime":1419.3,"body":"I know that it will continue to"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1415.97,"endTime":1419.3,"body":"change and the idea of, of"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1419.3,"endTime":1424.58,"body":"taking upon myself, the label of"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1419.3,"endTime":1424.58,"body":"trans or accepting gender"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1424.58,"endTime":1428.99,"body":"dysphoria is part of my"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1424.58,"endTime":1428.99,"body":"experience. It's been difficult,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1428.99,"endTime":1434.45,"body":"but it's also been empowering."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1428.99,"endTime":1434.45,"body":"It has facilitated a lot. But I,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1434.48,"endTime":1438.56,"body":"but I have to, and I'm honest"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1434.48,"endTime":1438.56,"body":"with myself, it's an \"-ite\","},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1438.86,"endTime":1444.56,"body":"like the idea of being gay, or"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1438.86,"endTime":1444.56,"body":"lesbian or bi, or trans. They're"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1444.56,"endTime":1449.09,"body":"all \"-ites\". And they're \"-ites\""},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1444.56,"endTime":1449.09,"body":"because they have to be, because"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1449.15,"endTime":1452.96,"body":"because we've needed to find,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1449.15,"endTime":1452.96,"body":"we've needed to find our group"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1452.96,"endTime":1456.05,"body":"of people community, our"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1452.96,"endTime":1456.05,"body":"community, but theyre \"-ites\"."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1456.08,"endTime":1462.38,"body":"So the perfect world, the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1456.08,"endTime":1462.38,"body":"perfect gospel is where I'm not"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1462.98,"endTime":1467.87,"body":"trans. And Ben you're not gay."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1462.98,"endTime":1467.87,"body":"And Charlie, you're not gay."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1468.62,"endTime":1469.94,"body":"We're just who we are."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1470.69,"endTime":1472.82,"body":"I think it might come"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1470.69,"endTime":1472.82,"body":"off as controversial. Like"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1472.82,"endTime":1476.63,"body":"people have tried to say this in"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1472.82,"endTime":1476.63,"body":"ways that have landed wrong for"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1476.63,"endTime":1476.9,"body":"me."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1477.05,"endTime":1477.38,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1477.86,"endTime":1482.27,"body":"I really think the only"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1477.86,"endTime":1482.27,"body":"reason that I have to identify"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1482.27,"endTime":1486.65,"body":"this way is because society"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1482.27,"endTime":1486.65,"body":"makes me have to identify this"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1486.65,"endTime":1492.38,"body":"way. But I have relationships"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1486.65,"endTime":1492.38,"body":"with people where me being gay"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1492.41,"endTime":1494.66,"body":"is not me being gay. It's just"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1492.41,"endTime":1494.66,"body":"me being Charlie."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1494.69,"endTime":1494.99,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1495.11,"endTime":1497.6,"body":"And that's like, that's"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1495.11,"endTime":1497.6,"body":"like some sort of like"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1497.6,"endTime":1500.51,"body":"consecration. That's like a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1497.6,"endTime":1500.51,"body":"higher law. That's an elevated"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1500.51,"endTime":1504.2,"body":"plane of thought. And so it's"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1500.51,"endTime":1504.2,"body":"not that like labeling is bad or"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1504.2,"endTime":1506.9,"body":"it's not that like, people"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1504.2,"endTime":1506.9,"body":"aren't gay or transgender..."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1506.9,"endTime":1507.17,"body":"Absolutely."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1507.0,"endTime":1509.97,"body":"And everyone just is"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1507.0,"endTime":1509.97,"body":"only a child of God, because"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1509.97,"endTime":1512.61,"body":"like, that kind of reduces the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1509.97,"endTime":1512.61,"body":"experience because there is this"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1512.64,"endTime":1515.82,"body":"element of societal pressure and"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1512.64,"endTime":1515.82,"body":"complexity that we have to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1515.82,"endTime":1519.06,"body":"navigate through. So we are"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1515.82,"endTime":1519.06,"body":"forced to quote unquote, \"-ite\""},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1519.09,"endTime":1519.69,"body":"ourselves."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1519.72,"endTime":1520.02,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1520.48,"endTime":1523.99,"body":"But to be an ally, to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1520.48,"endTime":1523.99,"body":"be a true leader in this space,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1524.23,"endTime":1526.57,"body":"as someone who can give that to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1524.23,"endTime":1526.57,"body":"someone to where they don't have"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1526.57,"endTime":1529.96,"body":"to be an \"-ite\" and they just"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1526.57,"endTime":1529.96,"body":"are who they are. And it is"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1529.96,"endTime":1532.9,"body":"like, the acceptance of a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1529.96,"endTime":1532.9,"body":"wholeness of a person."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1533.32,"endTime":1535.24,"body":"I'm trying to put into"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1533.32,"endTime":1535.24,"body":"words, my thoughts, I'm not"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1535.24,"endTime":1539.08,"body":"quite sure. Because I've been"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1535.24,"endTime":1539.08,"body":"told before, like, Ben, you're"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1539.08,"endTime":1540.16,"body":"not gay, you're a child of God."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1540.19,"endTime":1540.55,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1540.58,"endTime":1541.48,"body":"And that..."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1541.57,"endTime":1542.32,"body":"But I am gay."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1543.56,"endTime":1544.31,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1544.33,"endTime":1545.53,"body":"It's not mutually"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1544.33,"endTime":1545.53,"body":"exclusive."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1545.54,"endTime":1548.03,"body":"And so what I'm what I'm"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1545.54,"endTime":1548.03,"body":"trying to think of, you know, as"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1548.03,"endTime":1551.48,"body":"long as, as long as someone's"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1548.03,"endTime":1551.48,"body":"not like taking away this part"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1551.48,"endTime":1556.22,"body":"of me, you know, if someone can"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1551.48,"endTime":1556.22,"body":"accept my orientation, and it's"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1556.22,"endTime":1559.19,"body":"not a big deal than I think I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1556.22,"endTime":1559.19,"body":"would find less need to label"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1559.19,"endTime":1562.07,"body":"myself exactly what like when I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1559.19,"endTime":1562.07,"body":"lived in Arizona, I didn't wear"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1562.07,"endTime":1565.31,"body":"a rainbow ring, because being"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1562.07,"endTime":1565.31,"body":"gay wasn't weird there. But now"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1565.31,"endTime":1568.46,"body":"that I'm in Utah, I wear a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1565.31,"endTime":1568.46,"body":"rainbow ring, because I want to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1568.46,"endTime":1569.48,"body":"give representation..."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1569.54,"endTime":1569.81,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1569.81,"endTime":1570.02,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1570.56,"endTime":1572.81,"body":"...to this, this, you know,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1570.56,"endTime":1572.81,"body":"something that doesn't have a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1572.81,"endTime":1576.35,"body":"lot of representation around"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1572.81,"endTime":1576.35,"body":"here. And so I feel like if I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1576.35,"endTime":1578.72,"body":"didn't need to represent then it"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1576.35,"endTime":1578.72,"body":"wouldn't, it wouldn't be such a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1578.72,"endTime":1579.35,"body":"big deal."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1579.38,"endTime":1582.11,"body":"Exactly. And if there"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1579.38,"endTime":1582.11,"body":"wasn't like pressure, like if"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1582.14,"endTime":1584.45,"body":"everyone wasn't always trying to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1582.14,"endTime":1584.45,"body":"set me up on dates and force me"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1584.45,"endTime":1586.85,"body":"to get married, then I wouldn't"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1584.45,"endTime":1586.85,"body":"have to be like, no, I'm gay."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1586.94,"endTime":1587.18,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1587.18,"endTime":1590.06,"body":"Right? Because, because"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1587.18,"endTime":1590.06,"body":"that would just be like less"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1590.06,"endTime":1592.22,"body":"people trying to put people in a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1590.06,"endTime":1592.22,"body":"box."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1592.25,"endTime":1592.61,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1593.38,"endTime":1595.45,"body":"And like, with the people,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1593.38,"endTime":1595.45,"body":"I know, well, people don't like,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1595.66,"endTime":1598.12,"body":"blah, blah, blah, Ben you're"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1595.66,"endTime":1598.12,"body":"gay. But I can, like, talk about"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1598.12,"endTime":1599.98,"body":"having a crush on someone or"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1598.12,"endTime":1599.98,"body":"someone I think is cute, and"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1599.98,"endTime":1600.58,"body":"like that's just normal."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1600.58,"endTime":1603.07,"body":"And it's like,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1600.58,"endTime":1603.07,"body":"understood that you are gay, but"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1603.07,"endTime":1605.98,"body":"it's not like, you know. I hope"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1603.07,"endTime":1605.98,"body":"this makes sense."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1606.01,"endTime":1608.56,"body":"Just like you would talk"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1606.01,"endTime":1608.56,"body":"about any crush, like, or any"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1608.56,"endTime":1609.43,"body":"life experience."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1609.43,"endTime":1609.97,"body":"Exactly."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1610.42,"endTime":1613.09,"body":"It's been so interesting."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1610.42,"endTime":1613.09,"body":"When I you know, as part of this"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1613.09,"endTime":1617.17,"body":"journey, it's been fascinating"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1613.09,"endTime":1617.17,"body":"for me to see the, I'm using the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1617.17,"endTime":1620.38,"body":"word spectrum a lot, but"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1617.17,"endTime":1620.38,"body":"spectrum of responses, and"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1620.44,"endTime":1625.9,"body":"pegging those somewhat, pretty"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1620.44,"endTime":1625.9,"body":"consistently to age groups as"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1625.9,"endTime":1626.38,"body":"well."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1626.65,"endTime":1627.34,"body":"For sure."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1627.4,"endTime":1631.06,"body":"And, you know, coming out"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1627.4,"endTime":1631.06,"body":"publicly to my nieces and"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1631.06,"endTime":1633.97,"body":"nephews that are in high school,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1631.06,"endTime":1633.97,"body":"they're like, oh,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1634.42,"endTime":1635.05,"body":"Like cool."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1635.08,"endTime":1635.41,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1635.44,"endTime":1636.1,"body":"Whatever."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1636.13,"endTime":1637.18,"body":"Great. Awesome."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1637.0,"endTime":1639.73,"body":"Yeah. And then if come out"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1637.0,"endTime":1639.73,"body":"to people in their 60s and 70s"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1639.76,"endTime":1641.08,"body":"and they're like, how can this"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1639.76,"endTime":1641.08,"body":"be?"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1641.08,"endTime":1642.01,"body":"Yeah, yeah."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1642.43,"endTime":1643.09,"body":"Let me sit down."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1643.42,"endTime":1647.95,"body":"I mean, that when I"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1643.42,"endTime":1647.95,"body":"decided to publicly come out,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1647.95,"endTime":1651.01,"body":"and I mentioned, coming out to a"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1647.95,"endTime":1651.01,"body":"really small group of"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1651.01,"endTime":1655.42,"body":"individuals. It was, it was the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1651.01,"endTime":1655.42,"body":"parents in the room, the parents"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1655.42,"endTime":1659.47,"body":"and grandparents who said,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1655.42,"endTime":1659.47,"body":"listen, like, this is not a good"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1659.47,"endTime":1663.13,"body":"idea. Do not do this. And these"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1659.47,"endTime":1663.13,"body":"are all the reasons why you're"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1663.13,"endTime":1666.67,"body":"going to mess up your life by"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1663.13,"endTime":1666.67,"body":"doing this. And I, and I had to"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1666.67,"endTime":1670.45,"body":"go back to them and say, listen,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1666.67,"endTime":1670.45,"body":"thank you so much. I love and"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1670.45,"endTime":1672.52,"body":"appreciate you so much for the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1670.45,"endTime":1672.52,"body":"concern that you have. You're"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1672.52,"endTime":1676.21,"body":"not, this isn't like hateful"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1672.52,"endTime":1676.21,"body":"responses. These are people"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1676.21,"endTime":1678.76,"body":"really wanting the best for me"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1676.21,"endTime":1678.76,"body":"and my family and saying, you"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1678.76,"endTime":1681.28,"body":"know, this is really going to"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1678.76,"endTime":1681.28,"body":"hurt you and your family if you"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1681.28,"endTime":1684.37,"body":"do this. And I had to say, you"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1681.28,"endTime":1684.37,"body":"know, I'm not crowdsourcing this"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1684.37,"endTime":1687.7,"body":"decision. I just, I was letting"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1684.37,"endTime":1687.7,"body":"you know, that this is the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1687.7,"endTime":1691.06,"body":"decision that I was making, and"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1687.7,"endTime":1691.06,"body":"that I really, I feel inspired"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1691.06,"endTime":1693.37,"body":"that I need to move this"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1691.06,"endTime":1693.37,"body":"forward. For everyone who is"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1693.37,"endTime":1697.3,"body":"younger. It's like, okay. Great."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1693.37,"endTime":1697.3,"body":"Awesome. We love you."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1697.87,"endTime":1699.88,"body":"I'm thinking about the"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1697.87,"endTime":1699.88,"body":"story of you stealing your mom's"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1699.88,"endTime":1703.57,"body":"makeup and running upstairs. And"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1699.88,"endTime":1703.57,"body":"it's, it's actually very cute"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1703.57,"endTime":1706.93,"body":"and endearing. And I'm sorry"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1703.57,"endTime":1706.93,"body":"that it was also traumatic for"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1706.93,"endTime":1709.42,"body":"you, because you probably felt"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1706.93,"endTime":1709.42,"body":"like excited and beautiful as"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1709.42,"endTime":1713.8,"body":"you were doing it, you know. And"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1709.42,"endTime":1713.8,"body":"I don't want to, like, make an"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1713.8,"endTime":1717.34,"body":"example, like a bad example of"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1713.8,"endTime":1717.34,"body":"your leader. Because, like, we"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1717.34,"endTime":1719.23,"body":"all know that when we know"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1717.34,"endTime":1719.23,"body":"better, we do better."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1719.26,"endTime":1719.65,"body":"Yeah, absolutely."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1719.65,"endTime":1722.26,"body":"And I'm sure he was"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1719.65,"endTime":1722.26,"body":"like acting to the best of his"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1722.26,"endTime":1727.39,"body":"knowledge. But I think sometimes"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1722.26,"endTime":1727.39,"body":"as leaders, and basically as"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1727.39,"endTime":1729.73,"body":"anyone, when we're trying to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1727.39,"endTime":1729.73,"body":"like talk to someone, sometimes"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1729.73,"endTime":1733.9,"body":"we take almost like a fear-based"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1729.73,"endTime":1733.9,"body":"approach to the person. And if"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1733.9,"endTime":1737.92,"body":"it's an experience, or a feeling"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1733.9,"endTime":1737.92,"body":"that we don't feel comfortable"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1737.92,"endTime":1741.07,"body":"with, or that we've never"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1737.92,"endTime":1741.07,"body":"encountered before, there's like"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1741.07,"endTime":1744.13,"body":"a fear of, oh, this could be a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1741.07,"endTime":1744.13,"body":"slippery slope, or we don't know"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1744.13,"endTime":1746.62,"body":"where this is gonna go. When"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1744.13,"endTime":1746.62,"body":"really like there's nothing"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1746.62,"endTime":1749.23,"body":"inherently wrong with putting on"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1746.62,"endTime":1749.23,"body":"your mom's makeup at all."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1749.26,"endTime":1749.5,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1749.53,"endTime":1751.63,"body":"Like that's not sinful."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1749.53,"endTime":1751.63,"body":"That's not wrong. It's actually"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1751.63,"endTime":1756.79,"body":"pretty normal. Like a lot of"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1751.63,"endTime":1756.79,"body":"people do it. And, but but he'd"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1756.79,"endTime":1758.98,"body":"never encountered it before. So"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1756.79,"endTime":1758.98,"body":"he was like, don't do it. I've"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1758.98,"endTime":1759.97,"body":"never seen this before."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1759.99,"endTime":1760.29,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1760.53,"endTime":1763.5,"body":"And I don't know, I"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1760.53,"endTime":1763.5,"body":"just, I feel like if we're"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1763.5,"endTime":1765.96,"body":"always in that mindset, it kind"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1763.5,"endTime":1765.96,"body":"of limits our ability to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1765.96,"endTime":1767.94,"body":"progress and learn more."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1768.0,"endTime":1770.64,"body":"It ties in really"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1768.0,"endTime":1770.64,"body":"perfectly though, with kind of"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1770.64,"endTime":1773.85,"body":"the second category of advice."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1770.64,"endTime":1773.85,"body":"President Nelson says good"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1773.85,"endTime":1776.7,"body":"information leads to good"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1773.85,"endTime":1776.7,"body":"inspiration. You hear that a lot"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1776.7,"endTime":1779.25,"body":"in leadership, right? And we"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1776.7,"endTime":1779.25,"body":"just don't have that"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1779.25,"endTime":1782.55,"body":"information. We haven't had that"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1779.25,"endTime":1782.55,"body":"information as leaders and so we"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1782.55,"endTime":1783.3,"body":"get scared."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1783.69,"endTime":1786.99,"body":"Well, what a beautiful"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1783.69,"endTime":1786.99,"body":"like, calling to get that"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1786.99,"endTime":1790.32,"body":"information. If you're if you"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1786.99,"endTime":1790.32,"body":"feel uncomfortable with LGBTQ"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1790.32,"endTime":1793.62,"body":"experiences and topics educate"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1790.32,"endTime":1793.62,"body":"yourself, expose yourself to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1793.62,"endTime":1796.62,"body":"this area and see what you can"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1793.62,"endTime":1796.62,"body":"glean and learn. Ask people"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1796.62,"endTime":1799.68,"body":"about their experiences. Listen"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1796.62,"endTime":1799.68,"body":"to podcasts. Read books. Watch"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1799.68,"endTime":1804.42,"body":"TV. Like, understand what this"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1799.68,"endTime":1804.42,"body":"is, and then you will I fully"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1804.42,"endTime":1808.35,"body":"believe like, I like have a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1804.42,"endTime":1808.35,"body":"testimony of God and leadership"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1808.35,"endTime":1813.33,"body":"and callings. And like, if you"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1808.35,"endTime":1813.33,"body":"are looking for how to do this,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1813.72,"endTime":1816.84,"body":"educate yourself and get that"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1813.72,"endTime":1816.84,"body":"good information. So you can be"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1816.84,"endTime":1821.61,"body":"inspired to not only make things"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1816.84,"endTime":1821.61,"body":"okay for the youth, but to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1821.61,"endTime":1825.63,"body":"empower them and strengthen them"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1821.61,"endTime":1825.63,"body":"and give them resolve and create"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1825.99,"endTime":1829.2,"body":"a culture of, of unity and peace"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1825.99,"endTime":1829.2,"body":"and love."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1829.23,"endTime":1829.65,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1829.99,"endTime":1832.15,"body":"There's this awesome"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1829.99,"endTime":1832.15,"body":"website for church leaders"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1832.15,"endTime":1835.24,"body":"called"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1832.15,"endTime":1835.24,"body":"counselingresources.churchofjesuschrist.org."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1835.24,"endTime":1838.09,"body":"I'll say it again,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1835.24,"endTime":1838.09,"body":"counselingresources.churchofjesuschrist"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1838.12,"endTime":1840.55,"body":"org, and you have to have a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1838.12,"endTime":1840.55,"body":"leadership login. And so to be"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1840.55,"endTime":1843.88,"body":"like in a Bishopric, or or Ward"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1840.55,"endTime":1843.88,"body":"counselor, Stake Council to have"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1843.88,"endTime":1847.99,"body":"access. Under the same sex"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1843.88,"endTime":1847.99,"body":"attraction tab it in the opening"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1847.99,"endTime":1850.9,"body":"paragraph, it gives an"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1847.99,"endTime":1850.9,"body":"invitation and a promise and it"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1850.9,"endTime":1853.48,"body":"says that if you take time to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1850.9,"endTime":1853.48,"body":"educate yourself, and seek the"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1853.48,"endTime":1856.21,"body":"guidance of the Holy Spirit,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1853.48,"endTime":1856.21,"body":"that your capacity to minister"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1856.42,"endTime":1859.75,"body":"will be magnified. And you'll"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1856.42,"endTime":1859.75,"body":"receive the guidance of the Holy"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1859.75,"endTime":1862.54,"body":"Ghost. I think that's what it"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1859.75,"endTime":1862.54,"body":"was, oh, you'll develop charity,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1862.57,"endTime":1865.51,"body":"and your capacity to minister"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1862.57,"endTime":1865.51,"body":"will be will be magnified. And I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1865.51,"endTime":1867.58,"body":"love that, that as we educate"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1865.51,"endTime":1867.58,"body":"ourselves and seek the guidance"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1867.58,"endTime":1869.14,"body":"of the Holy Ghost, that's how"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1867.58,"endTime":1869.14,"body":"we're going to be able to really"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1869.14,"endTime":1872.56,"body":"minister and you know, educate"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1869.14,"endTime":1872.56,"body":"like educating yourself, if"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1872.56,"endTime":1875.44,"body":"you're a leader of youth, it's"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1872.56,"endTime":1875.44,"body":"gonna be so important to really"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1875.44,"endTime":1877.6,"body":"understand, you know, what's"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1875.44,"endTime":1877.6,"body":"going on when they when they say"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1877.6,"endTime":1880.36,"body":"words like transgender and"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1877.6,"endTime":1880.36,"body":"bisexual like to know what that"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1880.36,"endTime":1882.85,"body":"means and to know what those"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1880.36,"endTime":1882.85,"body":"experiences might be like for"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1882.85,"endTime":1883.27,"body":"the youth."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1883.33,"endTime":1883.69,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1883.93,"endTime":1886.48,"body":"And then from there,"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1883.93,"endTime":1886.48,"body":"this factor of ooh, I don't know"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1886.48,"endTime":1888.91,"body":"what to do, because everyone's"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1886.48,"endTime":1888.91,"body":"experience is different, is kind"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1888.91,"endTime":1890.56,"body":"of taken away, because then"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1888.91,"endTime":1890.56,"body":"you're just dealing with"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1890.56,"endTime":1893.35,"body":"personal revelation. You're"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1890.56,"endTime":1893.35,"body":"educating yourself, and you're"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1893.35,"endTime":1896.08,"body":"praying. And then you can be an"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1893.35,"endTime":1896.08,"body":"individual leader for each"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1896.08,"endTime":1899.74,"body":"person in your ward, and take"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1896.08,"endTime":1899.74,"body":"different approaches and be"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1899.74,"endTime":1904.6,"body":"guided by the Spirit. And by a"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1899.74,"endTime":1904.6,"body":"Christ, a God who knows us"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1904.6,"endTime":1907.72,"body":"personally, and really does know"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1904.6,"endTime":1907.72,"body":"what each person needs at every"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":1907.72,"endTime":1908.26,"body":"stage."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1908.3,"endTime":1912.83,"body":"Yeah. I have a testimony"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1908.3,"endTime":1912.83,"body":"of the calling of Bishop, I have"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1912.83,"endTime":1916.46,"body":"the testimony of the mantle of"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1912.83,"endTime":1916.46,"body":"Bishop of these blessings that"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1916.46,"endTime":1918.62,"body":"are given to us as leaders. And"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1916.46,"endTime":1918.62,"body":"I totally agree with you,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1918.62,"endTime":1922.91,"body":"Charlie, that, that the Spirit"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1918.62,"endTime":1922.91,"body":"is there in those moments. And"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1922.91,"endTime":1927.02,"body":"if we can take ourselves our"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1922.91,"endTime":1927.02,"body":"heads out of the equation, we"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1927.02,"endTime":1928.37,"body":"can let the spirit do its job."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1928.58,"endTime":1931.04,"body":"Yeah, you know, I'm hearing"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1928.58,"endTime":1931.04,"body":"you say a couple of things Dave."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1931.04,"endTime":1935.3,"body":"I'm hearing you say that, that"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1931.04,"endTime":1935.3,"body":"there is sacredness and strength"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1935.3,"endTime":1938.27,"body":"that comes with these callings"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1935.3,"endTime":1938.27,"body":"in leadership. And also that we"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1938.27,"endTime":1940.91,"body":"need to be a receptacle for"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1938.27,"endTime":1940.91,"body":"whatever the people we're"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1940.91,"endTime":1944.12,"body":"serving are feeling. And youth"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1940.91,"endTime":1944.12,"body":"leaders need to be a place where"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1944.15,"endTime":1946.28,"body":"the youth can come and talk to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1944.15,"endTime":1946.28,"body":"them and share what's going on"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1946.28,"endTime":1948.65,"body":"in their lives. And it's"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1946.28,"endTime":1948.65,"body":"important to build those"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1948.65,"endTime":1950.6,"body":"relationships by expressing"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1948.65,"endTime":1950.6,"body":"interest in them and what"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1950.6,"endTime":1953.99,"body":"they're doing and, and allowing"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1950.6,"endTime":1953.99,"body":"them to really just open up."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1954.74,"endTime":1960.53,"body":"And be honest. I had Lucas"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1954.74,"endTime":1960.53,"body":"who is closer to my age, who"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1960.53,"endTime":1964.34,"body":"said, listen, if you're willing"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1960.53,"endTime":1964.34,"body":"to acknowledge that you're, that"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1964.34,"endTime":1968.09,"body":"you don't know what to say, that"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1964.34,"endTime":1968.09,"body":"maybe you don't have the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1968.09,"endTime":1970.67,"body":"answers, or that you're"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1968.09,"endTime":1970.67,"body":"uncomfortable with the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1970.67,"endTime":1974.75,"body":"situation, then you've just"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1970.67,"endTime":1974.75,"body":"entered my world. You've walked"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1974.75,"endTime":1977.75,"body":"into a space where we can now"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1974.75,"endTime":1977.75,"body":"walk together. They've heard"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1977.75,"endTime":1981.95,"body":"canned responses so often that"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1977.75,"endTime":1981.95,"body":"they don't they don't resonate"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1981.95,"endTime":1984.11,"body":"with them. Because it's not"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":1981.95,"endTime":1984.11,"body":"real."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1984.63,"endTime":1986.22,"body":"Dave as you've been talking"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1984.63,"endTime":1986.22,"body":"I've been thinking like what"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1986.22,"endTime":1988.83,"body":"would I have wanted my youth"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1986.22,"endTime":1988.83,"body":"leaders to say. I'm trying to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1988.83,"endTime":1990.78,"body":"think of like how I would have"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1988.83,"endTime":1990.78,"body":"felt because I was so insecure"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1990.81,"endTime":1994.41,"body":"about being attracted to other"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1990.81,"endTime":1994.41,"body":"guys when I was a teenager, that"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1994.41,"endTime":1997.05,"body":"if someone said, if you are"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1994.41,"endTime":1997.05,"body":"attracted to men, you know, I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1997.05,"endTime":1999.81,"body":"love you, I respect you, that"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":1997.05,"endTime":1999.81,"body":"would have been really, I think,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2000.47,"endTime":2002.24,"body":"I feel like that would have been"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2000.47,"endTime":2002.24,"body":"hard for me to hear like that"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2002.24,"endTime":2004.58,"body":"would have been scary to just"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2002.24,"endTime":2004.58,"body":"like acknowledge the reality of"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2004.58,"endTime":2007.55,"body":"that. But if a youth leader had"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2004.58,"endTime":2007.55,"body":"said something like, like, I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2007.55,"endTime":2011.99,"body":"have a gay friend, and I love"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2007.55,"endTime":2011.99,"body":"him, that would have really, I"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2011.99,"endTime":2016.19,"body":"think, changed my world and and"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2011.99,"endTime":2016.19,"body":"erased a lot of years of pain,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2016.19,"endTime":2016.76,"body":"perhaps."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2016.78,"endTime":2019.96,"body":"Yeah. A couple of things"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2016.78,"endTime":2019.96,"body":"came out that were really"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2019.99,"endTime":2022.48,"body":"striking to me. And that was"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2019.99,"endTime":2022.48,"body":"that the overwhelming majority"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2022.48,"endTime":2026.8,"body":"of them came out privately to"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2022.48,"endTime":2026.8,"body":"themselves during adolescence."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2026.8,"endTime":2029.95,"body":"They first knew that question of"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2026.8,"endTime":2029.95,"body":"when did you first know? It was"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2029.95,"endTime":2034.03,"body":"during adolescence. It was"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2029.95,"endTime":2034.03,"body":"during their youth. And when"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2034.03,"endTime":2038.05,"body":"asked, do you have experiences"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2034.03,"endTime":2038.05,"body":"where you were hurt? Also, the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2038.05,"endTime":2045.04,"body":"majority came from leaders,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2038.05,"endTime":2045.04,"body":"either from Ward leadership, or"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2045.04,"endTime":2049.24,"body":"from youth leaders or seminary"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2045.04,"endTime":2049.24,"body":"teachers. And again, we're in an"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2049.24,"endTime":2053.98,"body":"extremely vulnerable spot in"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2049.24,"endTime":2053.98,"body":"that, in those moments, and so,"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2054.43,"endTime":2057.28,"body":"so no judgment on the leaders."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2054.43,"endTime":2057.28,"body":"But what it speaks to is this"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2057.28,"endTime":2061.06,"body":"idea that, why do the leaders"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2057.28,"endTime":2061.06,"body":"want to know what to say?"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2061.06,"endTime":2063.94,"body":"Because they're on the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2061.06,"endTime":2063.94,"body":"frontlines, like they are on the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2063.94,"endTime":2067.15,"body":"frontlines, and sometimes they"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2063.94,"endTime":2067.15,"body":"are the first responders, or"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2067.15,"endTime":2070.57,"body":"they will be the first"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2067.15,"endTime":2070.57,"body":"responders to these youth that"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2070.57,"endTime":2073.99,"body":"are wanting to talk about this."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2070.57,"endTime":2073.99,"body":"We should be encouraging the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2073.99,"endTime":2076.96,"body":"youth to have these"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2073.99,"endTime":2076.96,"body":"conversations with us. Because"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2076.96,"endTime":2081.07,"body":"as leaders as youth leaders as"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2076.96,"endTime":2081.07,"body":"leadership in a ward, we are"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2081.07,"endTime":2084.25,"body":"going to learn so much from"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2081.07,"endTime":2084.25,"body":"having these exchanges with"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2084.25,"endTime":2087.94,"body":"individuals and and gleaning"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2084.25,"endTime":2087.94,"body":"from them and their experiences."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2087.94,"endTime":2091.66,"body":"We need to learn from them and"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2087.94,"endTime":2091.66,"body":"their perspectives as well."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2092.11,"endTime":2094.18,"body":"Well, Dave, thank you so"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2092.11,"endTime":2094.18,"body":"much for sharing your life with"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2094.18,"endTime":2096.79,"body":"us for being so open and"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2094.18,"endTime":2096.79,"body":"vulnerable and for also sharing"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2097.12,"endTime":2098.35,"body":"your expertise in this area."},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2098.38,"endTime":2101.89,"body":"Wow. Thank you. Thanks for"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2098.38,"endTime":2101.89,"body":"having me. Really cherished the"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2101.89,"endTime":2103.66,"body":"moment together. It was"},{"speaker":"Dave","startTime":2101.89,"endTime":2103.66,"body":"fantastic. It was really great."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2103.75,"endTime":2104.35,"body":"Us too."},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2105.61,"endTime":2108.13,"body":"Thank you for joining"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2105.61,"endTime":2108.13,"body":"us today. If you enjoyed this or"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2108.13,"endTime":2111.25,"body":"other episodes, please consider"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2108.13,"endTime":2111.25,"body":"leaving us a podcast review. And"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2111.25,"endTime":2113.71,"body":"as always, please remember that"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2111.25,"endTime":2113.71,"body":"we do not represent the Church"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2113.71,"endTime":2115.96,"body":"of Jesus Christ of Latter-day"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2113.71,"endTime":2115.96,"body":"Saints or Brigham Young"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2115.96,"endTime":2118.9,"body":"University. We are not trying to"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2115.96,"endTime":2118.9,"body":"be prescriptive or tell anyone"},{"speaker":"Charlie","startTime":2118.9,"endTime":2120.1,"body":"what to think or what to do."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2120.37,"endTime":2122.14,"body":"You've heard three"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2120.37,"endTime":2122.14,"body":"perspectives and there are many,"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2122.17,"endTime":2125.11,"body":"many more. We encourage you to"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2122.17,"endTime":2125.11,"body":"listen to other voices and hear"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2125.11,"endTime":2127.33,"body":"wide variety of experiences. If"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2125.11,"endTime":2127.33,"body":"you would like to submit a"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2127.33,"endTime":2129.55,"body":"question or share a comment"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2127.33,"endTime":2129.55,"body":"about today's episode, you can"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2129.55,"endTime":2131.5,"body":"email us at"},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2129.55,"endTime":2131.5,"body":"questionsfromthecloset@gmail.com."},{"speaker":"Ben","startTime":2132.31,"endTime":2133.12,"body":"Until next time."}]}