Finding the Expert in You: How Ann Cardin Transforms Expertise into Businesses

What if your greatest business opportunity isn't something new, but something you already possess? In this eye-opening conversation with business growth expert Ann Carden, we explore how entrepreneurs can transform their expertise into thriving, profitable businesses.

Cardens journey from teaching neighborhood craft classes at age eight to building and selling five successful companies offers a masterclass in business evolution. Rather than chasing the next shiny opportunity, she reveals how staying three steps ahead of market trends allowed her to pivot seamlessly from a global doll business to health clubs to high-ticket coaching—all while maintaining profitability.

For creative professionals who struggle with the business side of their operations, Carden offers refreshingly practical advice. "The creative side is where you can really expand and grow the business," she explains, "but you have to treat it like a business. Otherwise, what you love is not going to be fun." Her approach balances creative fulfillment with sound business strategy, ensuring entrepreneurs don't burn out on their passions.

Perhaps most valuable is Carden's concept of "growing money trees"—developing multiple revenue streams rather than relying on a single business model. This orchard approach provides stability even during market disruptions, as evidenced by how she weathered changes in both the craft and fitness industries.

Carden's "Expert in You" methodology helps entrepreneurs package their brilliance for premium pricing, often uncovering blind spots where they can't recognize their most valuable skil

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Chapters

• 9:52 [Ad] Real Talk About Marketing
• 10:40 (Cont.) Finding the Expert in You: How Ann Cardin Transforms Expertise into Businesses

Transcript

Erin Manning: 0:02

Welcome to the Dead Pixels Society podcast, the photo imaging industry's leading news source. Here's your host, Gary Pageau. The Dead Pixels Society podcast is brought to you by Mediaclip, Advertek Printing and Independent Photo Imagers.

Gary Pageau: 0:18

Hello again and welcome to the Dead Pixels Society podcast. I'm your host, Gary Pageau, and today we're joined by Ann Carden, who's a business growth expert and CEO of the Expert in You marketing company. She's coming to us from Missouri today. Hi Ann, how are you today?

Ann Carden: 0:34

Hey Gary, I'm doing great. Thanks so much for having me.

Gary Pageau: 0:37

So you've got a wide range of experiences. You've run seven companies. Tell us about that first, were you always in business, or did you grow into it? Or what happened?

Ann Carden: 0:50

Yeah, my first business was when I was about eight years old, I think, and.

Ann Carden: 0:53

I said okay craft classes to the neighborhood kids and had craft classes in my basement. So that was my first business. That actually came out on a podcast one day. I had forgot about that. But no, I actually went into retail management. I was in retail management for about 13 years, working in really high end department stores running high million dollar departments, learned about business and marketing and sales and I had. I went to school for business management. So after that my I had kids and I wanted to be a stay-at-home mom and raise my kids. I didn't want them raised by daycare. So my husband and I we were living in California at the time I was working in retail and we moved back to Missouri and there wasn't a lot of opportunity and I started my first business and that was 35 years ago. So since then I'm in my sixth and seventh and I've sold the five previous businesses.

Gary Pageau: 1:47

And just so the listeners know what are some of the businesses, where they're in the same industry. Are they the same type of business? Were they spread across different categories? Or where, what were those at?

Ann Carden: 1:57

No. So my first business I was like what can I do to make some money? There wasn't any opportunity and the craft industry was exploding across the country at that time and this was in the nineties, and I I was creative and so I thought I'm going to make something and I started making some craft things that didn't sell. And I said to the woman at the store it was a little consignment store and she said, yeah, you can come pick these things up. They're not selling. And I said what's selling? She said these rabbit dolls. Long story short, that turned into a global doll business, like a craft doll business.

Gary Pageau: 2:31

Okay.

Ann Carden: 2:32

All over the world. I was in multiple stores across the country. That was before the internet.

Gary Pageau: 2:36

I was going to say you weren't selling online then, so you bought a global business.

Ann Carden: 2:40

Print ads the old yes, I was in the old school way, right, that's the old way. I was in international magazines and there were, you know, there were a lot of craft stores all across the country, so it was in different States. I had a space in different States that I rented and I was shipping dolls every day and and I that became global. I remember the first time I got a call from Iceland. A woman was collecting my dolls. They were all signed and numbered. I had a lot of employees. I had multiple moms coming in and out of my home that were helping me with different things and that was a really successful business. I did it for seven years and then I started doing my designs for the pattern side of my business, where people could buy the patterns and they could make my dolls so that whole leather revenue stream.

Ann Carden: 3:29

And then when I sold, I actually sold my designs and I sold out to that pattern company started business and fitness, two health clubs. Well, one was a high-end women's training center, one was a health club, huge health club and then I had two weight loss centers and those were for businesses, and now I have my coaching and consulting and then I have my agency. So yeah, it's been quite a run.

Gary Pageau: 3:52

So how do you square the circle with a creative person in business? Because a lot of times people struggle with that because they've got the creative energy of and I think you know that's a lot of our audience. You know photographers, printers, people like that. You know that's a lot of our audience. You know photographers, printers, people like that, people who are maybe got into the business for creative reasons but then you got to do the business side of it. How did you grow in that area?

Ann Carden: 4:15

I really just had to learn that skill set. To be honest, when you the thing that the thing that I try to get people to understand when I'm coaching them or working with them is that the creative side is where you can really expand and grow the business. But you do have to treat it like a business and have to think of it like a business. Otherwise what you love is not going to be fun. I mean, you're going to probably burn out on it. So most people get into business because they want to make money, not just because they love what they do, but they want to make money. That's why they turn it into a business. But then so many people never go that direction and it's because they're not excellent at business their ideas. I don't want to take the time to learn it. I was actually even that way, like I hate the business side. I love what I'm doing, but eventually I had to really make that shift Like I'm not going to love this if I don't really do something with it.

Gary Pageau: 5:08

Well, not a lot of people love failure either.

Ann Carden: 5:10

Exactly the freedom comes. I always say get yourself to such a great place in your business that now you get to do what you love when you want to do it, but you don't have to do it all the time. That, to me, that's the beauty of a real business.

Gary Pageau: 5:24

Because that's one of the things that you know. A friend of mine once said was you know, nothing kills the joy of photography faster than owning a photography business.

Ann Carden: 5:32

It's that way with everything. It's kind of like, you know, when I was building my health clubs, I was training clients. I was coaching clients on weight loss thousands of people and I was teaching fitness classes. I was teaching fitness classes. I was teaching a lot. For years I would teach five and six classes a day. That's insane to people. And eventually I said, ok, this thing can't really grow if I'm in the middle of everything. Right?

Ann Carden: 5:53

It was hard to let go of that. That's one thing. It's just hard for people to let go of that, and you think nobody can do it like I can, because I'm the face of this business, but the reality is that isn't true, and I learned that, and when I did, though, the thing that was so great about that is not only did I learn other skill sets, that became fun as well, but now I got to actually mentor people up to also be doing great things, which was very rewarding in itself, and I was able to still teach and train when I wanted to, but I didn't have to, and that was the difference, so I had a lot more freedom. I was able, then, to go to my kids games, and I was able to be involved in their school activities and the things that were really and my family and really important to me, and I can't I couldn't do that if I was in the midst of everything, like nothing's going to grow, if you're it.

Gary Pageau: 6:47

Yeah, cause, cause it's hard to scale people and and you know, I mean like an owner right, and that's really one of the things I think a lot of people in the industry and photo industry struggle with is because maybe they're the, the son of the founder or the daughter of the founder who founded the camera store 40 years ago and then they took it over and now they've got to kind of put it in a position to pass on. Yeah, it's a struggle because so much of it is in their head.

Ann Carden: 7:12

Yeah, well, and not only that, gary. That's kind of the old way of doing business. It's not the new way of doing business. Now we have the internet. Now you can create products. Now you can get products done. Now there's so many other ways now to make money. Or you can just create another like invest in other businesses and bring in money other ways.

Ann Carden: 7:32

I learned that all along the way and so I my main thing always expanded into other opportunities and other things that were also making money. So then you're not so tied to I don't mean to say have a whole bunch of businesses, that's not my point you get your core business successful and then you start looking for ways. I say grow your money trees. So most people think, okay, my business is a money tree, I can grow it however big I want. But I say grow your orchard right. So now you grow another money tree and another money tree. And when you start thinking like that, now you're really thinking like someone in business and you're not tied. If something happens over here it's not gonna matter.

Ann Carden: 8:18

It's like when the craft industry was starting to shift, I was doing patterns. I had already gone that route. I saw the shifts in the market. I still had a business. I wasn't out of business because of all the imports and things coming in. Same thing with the health clubs. You know, the weight loss centers came in because I saw shifts in gyms and in what was going on in gyms and the pricing and all of those kinds of things and I knew that I still wanted to make an impact and work at a higher level with people. And that's where the whole weight loss thing kind of came in. So it was part of the core, like they fed each other, but it was a whole nother business but it wasn't disconnected. And so those to me that's the best way to grow and scale if you do still love what you do, but there's other ways to make money and that's what you could be.

Gary Pageau: 9:07

So one of the things you kind of touched on there is, you know, identifying trends, right, and you know the Internet's out there now, and maybe in the 1990s there was a craft industry association or a newsletter or something you could read. But you know there's a lot of terrible information out there and misleading information, especially on the Internet. You know I hate to be the first one to inform you but not everything on the Internet is truthful.

Gary Pageau: 9:30

That's true, right you, but not everything on the internet is truthful. So so you know, when you have somebody who's maybe looking at that let's say they built a successful camera store or whatever and they're looking for like going to where the puck is going to be, I think is you know. If I was to use a sports analogy, that's what you're talking about. You know, don't be lagging behind, but be where the puck is going to be. What are some of the things you can look at to identify future growth opportunities?

Ann Carden: 10:31

Yeah, you always really do have to stay ahead of everybody else. That's one thing I always did was I was always looking for what's the new thing I think about in my health clubs. You know what's the new thing coming out now, and I stayed on top of those things. Now you can do it so easy. Now you can easily research.

Ann Carden: 10:51

You can see who's leading the industry, who's running the conferences, who's doing the big stuff and follow them and you'll be able to kind of see where the trends are going, because there are those people that they live that. But if you can stay with those people and you can start, you can figure out who do I follow, who's got the inside track, who knows things, and you can stay really in tuned. You can always be ahead, you can always be steps ahead of your competition and you can always get to market with things that other people are. They're just lagging so far behind. I did that in all of my businesses. I was always the first to get everything my competition used to knock me off. They would knock off my ads, they would knock off my ideas and I used to get so mad. But looking back now I say hey, they were chasing me, I wasn't chasing them.

Ann Carden: 11:41

I was three steps ahead, and that's what you have to do if you're going to stay relevant.

Gary Pageau: 11:45

But isn't there a danger, though, to kind of just being too trendy and just following trends that maybe just there, maybe they're more of a fad than a trend, right, and that's that's really a problem for some people who, you know, maybe can't afford to do too many, maybe not radical shifts. But you know, let's say, for example, you know a certain type of thing gets hot on Instagram or TikTok and you decide you want to follow that trend, but then it peters out in two weeks and you're kind of out of luck.

Ann Carden: 12:13

Well, I mean, what kind of trends are we talking about?

Gary Pageau: 12:15

That's what you, I guess that's where I'm getting to is how do you identify a trend right, A growth trend?

Ann Carden: 12:20

I think you have to look at is this something that's viable? So I don't when I say a trend, it has to have a little bit of juice behind it. So, for example, right now, podcasting, we're on here, right, it's exploding. I mean, I've had a podcast for four years and I, at the time I had my podcast, it was not it, there were a lot out there, but it was just starting to kind of get right.

Ann Carden: 12:45

Now I'm hundreds of episodes in and other people are just getting started. Now I we help people launch one. And so my next thing came because I saw that, hey, this isn't going away, this is okay. How can I now help people launch their podcast if they want to launch their show? I picked up on the trend, but in a different way. So sometimes you can test the waters, but I think you have to look at way. So sometimes you can test the waters, but I think you have to look at is this a viable? I mean some of it's gut instinct, to be quite honest.

Gary Pageau: 13:14

Yeah, well, that's it.

Ann Carden: 13:16

It is. It's like do I really see a future in this? But if you really sit down and look at things, you can usually tell this is going to take off, this is going to do well. Can I tell a quick story?

Gary Pageau: 13:27

Absolutely.

Ann Carden: 13:28

Okay, please.

Gary Pageau: 13:29

Tell me a story.

Ann Carden: 13:31

Yeah, so I remember back when I had my health club and spinning came onto the scene. Everybody knows spinning now, right, right, but it was new and I was following what was going on in the fitness industry, and so this is a way for people to think too to get very innovative and spin bikes at that time I don't know they were going to be 25 or 30 grand to put into my health club and I didn't really know if people were even going to love it, and I wasn't.

Ann Carden: 13:58

I didn't want to just go buy the bikes and stick them into my gym and okay, here you go, because people don't appreciate stuff like that, right, it's just 30 grand out of my profits. So what I did is I got innovative and I put together a game plan and I said I'm going to have these bikes paid for before I buy them or I'm not going to do it, right? So I put packages together and I went out into my club and I marketed and sold those and I said this is what it is and this is what we're going to do. And if you want to be in on this, this is how many spots we have per class and going to do. And if you want to be in on this, this is how many spots we have per class and this is how many. And so people bought the packages and I said if I don't get the interest, I'm not going to buy the bikes and I'll refund your money.

Gary Pageau: 14:38

Right.

Ann Carden: 14:38

And bought into that, and before I put in the spin bikes I had the bikes paid for. So you can do things like that and it's a great way to test the market too. So market research in some way shape or form. I teach people that now I'm like don't go out and build a course, or don't go out and build a product, Go sell the product and then build the product.

Ann Carden: 14:59

And that will tell you when people have to pay instead of when they have to pay with money instead of their words. You will find out if there's really a market for something.

Gary Pageau: 15:10

You know it's interesting. You say that because that is sort of the way GoFundMe works, right? I mean, it's sort of like I've seen several photo manufacturers come out with products and they launch them on GoFundMe. I mean even companies as big as Canon, right, you know? Because they just want to see is this a real product or is this something that people in our R&D department just dreamt up? Will people actually buy it, right?

Ann Carden: 15:34

Absolutely. You know I'm getting ready to do another book. I have a speaking engagement coming up. It's around a topic I haven't released a book around like specifically for that topic, and I said, ok, I need to write a book for this. And I thought, well, if I don't get the book done in time, I'm going to pre-sell the book at the speaking engagement. People can buy the book and then I'll ship it to them when the book is done, and so you can do things like that. You can. Now that's just a matter of I'm not sure I'm going to have the book done.

Gary Pageau: 16:05

That's not a money thing, that's a you thing.

Ann Carden: 16:08

But you can, because I'm real close to having it done, but I don't know if it will get done in time. So you can do things like that as well, but you know it keeps me from having to go out and buy, you know, hundreds of books.

Gary Pageau: 16:21

Right.

Ann Carden: 16:22

Just sell it with a nice marketing card and my speaking engagement and people can buy it and then from there I'll be able to, you know, put it on Amazon and get to bestseller or whatever. So so a lot of people don't think like this and I try to get people to sort of think outside the box and innovate what they're doing.

Gary Pageau: 16:43

I've done a lot of bootstrapping so I got really good at it, but yeah, Well, it sounds like it and that's actually kind of exciting, because I think that's one of the things that I like to see with people is, you know, the thing about bootstrapping is you tend to make more informed decisions because you have to. You're spending your own money, not the bank's money.

Ann Carden: 17:01

Exactly, and you know, it's really interesting too. I I actually and I don't want this to sound bad because I believe that there are situations where you need investors, there are certain businesses or certain investors, but one of the things that really bugs me and I think, just because I didn't come from this and I didn't do that, do it this way One of the things that really bugs me is when I see people wanting to get into business and the first thing they go out and do is try to find investors. I'm like you know what you need to put a little skin in the game. I mean, because you're just. I I've watched, uh, so my son is in it and he's worked for companies where they were funded by investors, and when he would tell me the millions of dollars they would lose a month that they would just there's no care, there's no concern.

Ann Carden: 17:47

You don't learn how to do anything. No care, there's no concern, you don't learn how to do anything. People are just throwing money at you, and I just feel like that's why a lot of businesses fail because people don't really learn the skill sets they need.

Ann Carden: 17:59

So maybe I'm old school in that way, but I just don't think it benefits people. Now, again, I think there are some businesses you have investors for. But even if you watch Shark tank I love shark tank you probably watch it too, and you know you'll even see them say well, how much have you gone out and tried to market this business? How much have you done? What have you done so far? And if they haven't done anything, they're like yeah, we're not vesting in you because not putting in the time or the work. So I think that's a really important thing.

Gary Pageau: 18:28

Yeah, because that's one of one of the things that, again, if you watch the shark tank one of the things I mean they talk about you know they talk about the financials, but they also want to know the person's story who came up with the idea? And, again, what their skin in the game was right. Were they an early investor where they just or, like you said, are they just one of many people working on this thing and they're not as interested in it? Or, as they say, I'm out?

Ann Carden: 18:51

Right, here's the thing about business. It's not just about the business.

Ann Carden: 18:57

It's about the person but the business, because you can have the best product in the world, but if the person trying to build the business isn't going to put in the work and they're just not committed, they're just not willing to go all in on it, that business is going to fail. It doesn't matter. So it doesn't matter even the best product. And when you know, when I look back to whether it was in fitness or whether it was coaching people in their businesses, the only people that failed ever because they had guidance, they had support from me and I knew how to help them and I knew what, what to show them to do. The only people that ever failed or didn't have results were people that just wouldn't do it. That's it. The people that did it, the people that would do the thing and be committed to their success, would have success.

Ann Carden: 19:48

And I, I used to get frustrated with some of the coaching clients I would work with because at the when I first started coaching, I didn't really know to look to not work with these people and got frustrated. I actually almost quit my coaching because all the a lot of the clients I was working with, it's like I wanted their success more than them. Yeah, that doesn't work and I said this is not a business I'm loving. Yeah, figure out how to figure out.

Gary Pageau: 20:12

You just need different clients yeah, well, you gotta, you gotta always be able to fire bad customers, right. So let's talk a little bit, because you kind of touched on something which I think is the theme of one of your books, which is like the expert in you, right, can you talk a little bit about that concept of you know where you're, the product, essentially? Yeah.

Ann Carden: 20:33

Yeah, so expert in you was really that whole idea and that model came out of. I was part of a coaching organization and they were trying to teach people how to be business coaches and a lot of these business coaches were failing and I was not doing well in their system, in their program, and I took a step back and I said what's wrong? I'm bringing in clients. I'm not like I said. I wanted their success more than they did. I wasn't getting paid what I felt like. I wasn't even getting to use my expertise and my experience with them. And I was very frustrated and I took a step back and I said what's wrong here? And I realized two things I wasn't working in my expertise, in the thing that I was really good at, and those were not the clients I was working with. And the second thing is I wasn't working at in a premium model, which is what I always did in all of my other businesses. I knew that was where the real profitability was.

Ann Carden: 21:27

So I redesigned my business and then I implemented it and it blew up and then I started helping other people do that and it expanded. And so then I would this company kind of kept promoting me and putting me on the calls and saying, hey, you know, look what Ann's doing, and I realized I was starting to build their business. So I had these coaches coming to me saying okay, show me what to do, how do you do this? And I would say to them what was your background and they would say oh, I was a music teacher and you're trying to be a business coach. Like I'm not getting that. Why don't we take what you're really great at, let's take all the things you're really great at, let's build a business around that. That's how the whole philosophy around that started.

Gary Pageau: 22:08

I've seen your brilliance, your expertise your skills your experience you know that takes a lot of uh, I want to say gumption or self-awareness, though I mean, because there are people who have natural tendencies, right, they're good at certain things, or not good at other things, or whatever, and some people have blind spots, right. So who should they be listening to?

Ann Carden: 22:28

People like me that know what they're doing. Okay, let's just be real. You know it's really funny. You say that, gary, because it's also one of the things I do with people. They think they know what their thing is and they'll start down that path, but what they're really incredible at doing, they don't even see it, because they're too good, and so one of the things I do is help people really level up their business and so if they're already like coaching or consulting.

Ann Carden: 22:56

I've taken people from making $1,500 a client to $50,000 a client. I helped an agency owner who was making like $30,000 get a $400,000 client because she couldn't even see how to package her brilliance her real, true brilliance.

Gary Pageau: 23:11

Right.

Ann Carden: 23:12

Most people can't see that, but here's the thing I'll tell you. Most people can't see that, but here's the thing I'll tell you Everyone has amazing opportunity inside of them, but they might need to work with someone to figure out what that looks like Like. I help people strategize. You know a million dollar business around a book, so you can do a book around your expertise and then build a whole business around that. So there's opportunity. If you've done anything at all in life, you've got opportunity. So there's opportunity.

Gary Pageau: 23:37

If you've done anything at all in life, you've got opportunity. Who is the typical customer for your agency? Because he says it's a media agency and marketing. What does that mean in the context of your business?

Ann Carden: 23:47

Yeah, so I have kind of two sides to my business.

Ann Carden: 23:50

So I help business growth. And the agency actually came out of that core expert in you business where I was helping people elevate their brand, get you know, speak, launch their podcast, write their best selling book. We were doing all those things with them and all of their high level, what I call high impact marketing strategies, and so I was sending them other places to go get those things done and I thought, and so this is another way to innovate, right? Well, why would I do this Like this doesn't make sense. Let me just build my own team and now they can buy those services from me. And I've already vetted these people. I already know these people are great.

Gary Pageau: 24:30

They've already been pre-selected.

Ann Carden: 24:32

Exactly, I became like this one-stop shop and this resource for my clients. So now I'm not just helping them build their business, but I have all the different things they need and I can help them with all the different pieces. And so now the agency we're getting ready to actually expand that and really build it out, because it's kind of been hidden within my coaching business. Now we're actually expanding that because that will be an exit strategy for me. I will sell that at some point, but I've already got the team. So we'll do their best selling book. We'll write it for them in 90 days we can get it written. We will launch, help them launch their podcast. We'll strat. We do strategy with them.

Ann Carden: 25:12

So, tell me what you want to accomplish in your business. I'll help you strategize that whole game plan. What do you want to accomplish in your business? I'll help you strategize that whole game plan. What do you want to make? How do you want to work? Here are my ideas. This is what it looks like and we can help them. So it's more than just a marketing and media agency. I also I don't know if you can see it I have my magazine back here that I launched because I wanted to be able to give my clients an opportunity to be in the media for credibility. So I launched that really high-end magazine and I can feature my clients in there in a beautiful featured section. So those are all products and things that and I also monetize my magazine. So those are things that have expanded off of my core business, but now it's become a whole nother business.

Gary Pageau: 25:55

When does someone realize they need a coach? I guess the question because I think some people either think it's too late or they don't need one, right? So?

Ann Carden: 26:05

well, if they think they don't need one, they're not ready for one.

Gary Pageau: 26:10

Okay, there, that's a good, that's a good response.

Ann Carden: 26:12

Seven businesses. I've had incredible success. I've sold five businesses and I still hire coaches and mentors. Why? Because there are always people that know things I don't know and we only know so much. That's it. You will only go as far as what you know. You cannot see beyond that. You can't go beyond that. And the other thing is I'm older and I don't have years to keep bootstrapping. I now I realized a long time ago actually the speed comes when you find the people that have already done it and they know what they're doing and they can just give you the plan, like they can just help you. And so, in my opinion, if people don't have a coach they are, they have no clue what they're missing, no clue at all. It will change their world.

Gary Pageau: 27:02

Speaking of which, where can people go to get more information about the various things that you do?

Ann Carden: 27:08

Yeah, so you can go to annlcardincom. That's my website and you can. My books are on there. You can get some free resources, but you can find me all over social. I have a huge YouTube channel, my Facebook groups, I mean. All those things are on my site.

Gary Pageau: 27:25

So so they just had to find Ann Cardin, and there you are.

Ann Carden: 27:29

Yeah, you can Google me, but my my website does have my middle initial, so it's annlcardincom.

Gary Pageau: 27:36

Great and listen. It's been great talking to you and learning a lot about business coaching and I've learned a couple of things, so I appreciate that and thank you so much.

Ann Carden: 27:45

Thank you so much, it's been fun.

Erin Manning: 27:48

Thank you for listening to the Dead Pixels Society podcast. Read more great stories and sign up for the newsletter at wwwthedeadpixelssocietycom.