In this episode, listen in as Cory Wong, Musician and Producer, and Brian Gaunt, Vice President, Accelerated Digitalization, DHL Supply Chain, discuss supply chain orchestration and insights into the custom song Cory wrote and produced around harmony in the warehouse. Gain insights into the unique role that people, technology and analytics play in orchestration.
In this episode, listen in as Cory Wong, Musician and Producer, and Brian Gaunt, Vice President, Accelerated Digitalization, DHL Supply Chain, discuss supply chain orchestration and insights into the custom song Cory wrote and produced around harmony in the warehouse. Gain insights into the unique role that people, technology and analytics play in orchestration.
Will (00:03.82)
Okay, welcome to you both. Really excited for this episode. Been looking forward to it for a long time and we'll talk about one of the exciting events that preceded this in the course of the episode. But Corey, welcome to the All Business No Boundaries podcast. This is your first time here and I think you're our first, I know you're our first musician on the podcast. Brian, I believe you've been on before, correct?
Brian Gaunt (00:31.023)
Yes, that's correct.
Will (00:32.528)
Okay, good, good. Well, welcome back. Last episode, we talked with Sally Miller and Scott Suredden and we talked about the concept of supply chain orchestration. And maybe to bridge the gap, Brian, I wondered if you might kind of give us a refresher on your interpretation of what supply chain orchestration is in general and what it means for DHL.
Brian Gaunt (00:57.527)
Yeah, absolutely. Supply chain orchestration for DHL means coordinating our complexities within supply chain. So optimizing and coordinating both our systems that we utilize, our associates that operate in our business, in conjunction to how those work with some of our automation and robotics that we have in our systems. All that working together to fulfill our customers' orders and meeting our customers' demands.
Will (01:29.292)
Okay, great. So Corey, how did you find yourself here? Give us some of the backstory on how you got involved with DHL and why is a musician talking about supply chain?
cory wong (01:45.506)
Well, what's interesting is that I was approached because of kind of my history of collaboration and my history as an arranger and band leader. I was approached, hey, we have this idea to draw a line and a metaphor of orchestration in this realm with music. And we need somebody who can help illustrate that for us. How do you think about X, Y, Z? And then I just kind of was like, off the top of my head, well, I think about, you know, orchestration works this way ,there's different sections and each of these sections has to work together and they have their own role, but they have to work together for the greater whole. And within each section, there's, you know, individuals that all have to work within that section. So to me, it actually, interestingly enough, made so much sense to think about orchestration in music and arrangement in music. And in my band, I think, you know, for this composition that I wrote for you guys is rhythm section, horn section, string section, how those orchestrate all together, but then how each of those sections has their own thing. You know, and, you know, much like coming to see the warehouse, it's like these people are all working together in their one department, and these people are all working together, and then they're gonna go to this area. And they all need to know what each other are doing and how they do what they do in order to do it better. And when they all work together and are aware of each other, that's when it's the most efficient and best. And it was really interesting to see that because I see it from a musician standpoint where it's so obvious to me. You guys see it from a supply chain standpoint where it's so obvious to you. And I think drawing the correlation between the two, it's like, oh yeah.I definitely see how this makes a lot more sense. And when you actually see it, it really drives the point home.
Will (03:44.404)
So you composed a song.Tell us about the start of that and how did you describe it at a high level just a minute ago, but into the brass tacks of you know, what did you see in the warehouse and how did you think about that translating into your band and the sound of the piece overall?
cory wong (04:18.166)
Well, really I wanted to know what does supply chain mean to DHL, what are the components? What are the players in the game or to walk me through this. Send me some videos of people working in the space. Send me some videos of the robotics you guys have working in the space. Send me your vision for how things work. Talk me through the process and what your different warehouses look like. Literally show me, just go in with your phone and take a video so I can see what's happening at any point. So I got a whole presentation of kind of what everything is and what the different machines are, what the roles of the different people are, and kind of how things move through. And then some actual videos of the warehouse. And I thought to myself, okay, I would like to assign instruments sections of the band to these sort of individuals, kind of personify the instruments in supply chain roles. And I was thinking, I could orchestrate this in a bunch of different ways. And also the word orchestration kind of feels like, oh, you should have strings. I think the general public associates string section with orchestra. So yes, I wanted to bring that in, which is an added element. to on top of what I would normally do, which is rhythm section and horn section. So there's four of us in the rhythm section that are drums, bass, guitar, and keyboards, and we function as one unit. There's a horn section that is three saxophones and two brass instruments, trombone and trumpet, that work as one unit. And then we had the string section, which is six people, which I just chose to arrange for six which functions as its own unit. And I kind of personified each of those sections as parts of the supply chain and then each of the individuals in there kind of have their own thing as well. And I wanted to, I took some of the imagery of like, okay, I have this lift that's going up to, you know, so it's like, I could use some of the, some string or horn lines that kind of go along with that, or there's something that has like a steady the way that something just kind of steadily moves through the aisles or goes down and has its groove of the way that it flows through. I wanted to personify that in the rhythm section. And there's certain things that are just happening, certain outbursts or whatever, or certain just like quick things that happen that are represented in the horn section. But then also just the sections of the song, compositionally, so that was one thing, just have some vision. Like here, we're just gonna identify roles. But now as far as actually writing it, it's okay. I would have something that feels like it's moving along, like it's doing its thing. Like it's not too, like when it's working, it's totally fine and it doesn't feel hectic. It doesn't feel like anything's out of line, but also sometimes it like it picks up in energy and there's like a lot happening and sometimes it's a little more chill.
and grounded and tighter and sometimes it opens up and it needs a little more attention and maybe more attention to detail. So some of those things I was conceptualizing as I was writing this. And then also it's like, there's, in this song, there's actually some more key changes than the average song that I write because things happen in different buildings. And I was kind of thinking, this happens in a warehouse and then it goes to this place. That's like a new key. And then it goes to this place and it's like a new key or something, you know, so I was in some ways also kind of taking ideas, you know, here's this one melodic idea where this thing starts and then we're gonna move it into another key. It's still the same idea, but now it's just in a new place. And then we do it somewhere else and it kind of is in a similar but different key. So I would take these melodic motifs that were like, you know, the Carhartt jacket that is being shipped from here to there, to there, to there. The jacket is still the same, the process is different and where it goes along is different. So there was a lot of these, this imagery that I was trying to conjure up, like what is the movie of this jacket being shipped or taken, pulled from this box in a warehouse to somebody's house or like, you know, all of these things. And what is the process and what's the storyline of that? And then also showing what's the storyline of the person in the warehouse at the same time. So I think there's a lot of those things that gave me enough information to let my imagination just kind of fill in the blanks with whatever melody, grooves, rhythms I was feeling.
Will (09:16.864)
Yeah, that's great. So Brian, you may not hear the music in the supply chain like Corey does, but, you know, translate that into kind of the supply chain professional engineer, you know, lens. You know, how do you see orchestration from that vantage point?
Brian Gaunt (09:36.055)
Yeah, it's interesting to hear that. I think, and you know, there are similarities. We look at the warehouse as, you know, connected, but also separated as well in a series of different kind of use cases, focusing on accomplishing certain roles. So, in the traditional warehouse we have certain processes- receiving , putting away and picking all done by different pieces of equipment and different associates in the warehouse as well, working together to manage our supply chain or manage that in output for the customer. You know, I think previously I didn't think about it quite like that, but yeah, we're applying best in class technologies to the warehouse to ensure that we have, you know, the best in warehouse management systems connected to the best robotics and as well as getting a feedback loop from our data analytics.
Will (10:43.624)
Yeah, yeah, this is definitely bringing a different perspective to kind of what we think about on the everyday. And in that vein, I want to talk about the day that we filmed the video. And I wonder if you both, I know we were all there, but I wonder if you both could kind of set the scene, maybe Brian starting with you, what was the facility where we were at, what did it look like, what's it look like on a typical day versus the day we were doing the video. And then Corey, I'd be interested in.
in what it was like for you and your band and your crew, which is an extensive group of people to enter an environment like that. And while the warehouse was doing its thing that it does every day, putting on basically a big concert. So Brian, you first.
Brian Gaunt (11:34.855)
Okay, so set in the stage. Let's see the warehouse that we went to handles both e-commerce and as well as store fulfillment. So nice environment to get a mix of picking e-commerce orders and typical case picking orders. The customer site that we have to be at was Carhartt and we entered their facility. It was a normal working day for them. We have plenty of activity that particular warehouse is fairly automated as well. We have mobile robotics and different solutions as well throughout the warehouse. And for this particular event, we had carved out a space that we could shoot the video and it was quite exciting, a lot of energy at the time. So it's great.
Will (12:27.188)
Yeah, so Corey, what did you think as we sort of pitch this idea to you? How did you think about laying it out and how did you describe it to your band members?
Cory Wong (12:39.394)
Well, the thing is my band is used to me coming up with ideas where I'm like, hey, we're gonna go record on an ice rink and you're gonna be wearing a full hockey outfit. Like this is what we're doing. Just don't get hurt. Make sure your instruments are insured sort of thing. And if you gotta bring your cheaper version of the instrument on the ice, fine. They're used to that sort of thing. So this is not really a surprise. It's like, hey, we're gonna go record at this warehouse in Columbus, Ohio. It's like, all right. Cool. Anything in particular we gotta wear, it's like, it'll be provided. So, I told the band about it and I told them the vision and really a lot of it was with my video team as well. So it's like recording in a warehouse has its own challenges as far as visual and sound. Like is it gonna look stale with fluorescent lighting above, the type of lighting that's necessary for a warehouse to function. Is it gonna look good on camera? Is it gonna feel like it's got a nice vibe? Well, let's just enhance that. Let's do some things to make it look great. And let's set a scene in the warehouse where it feels not just like, oh yeah, they'd like set up a concert stage in a warehouse. Like, no, let's like utilize the warehouse for what it is and use some of those things, build staging that feels like it's appropriate for where we are. And then sound considerations are one thing, but honestly I have a really great team, a production team, and then I do the mixing and producing of the music where I can make sure that it sounds good no matter where we record it. And it's fun because going to the warehouse, and it's a lot of us, and I'm thinking like, oh man, these, just. A lot of these cats are just going by their regular workday. And they're like, what do you mean there's a band showing them? I'm like, I don't, I'm in your way. I'm sorry. Like if I'm in your way, like, yeah. But, you know, it's fun to be able to go in there and then for the folks that are in the warehouse every day for us to provide some sort of fun, different entertainment for them while they're doing it also is really cool. So for us, it's our team. My production team had questions.
how are we gonna pull this off? Where are we gonna get gear? Are we bringing it all in? You know, this sort of thing. And I said, yes, here's what we do. This, this, it's, you know, we do it. And they're like, okay, fine. It's our regular setup and we bring in everything. And you know, the only difference is there isn't a gigantic PA, there isn't typical staging and whatever. And you know, there's some power considerations and things you have to have. But you know, once all that stuff's figured out, then the fun is just in going in there and doing it. and making it exciting.
Will (16:20.008)
But back to the crew. So, you know, we've talked about sort of the musical aspect of it. But As a musician with a fairly large band, and I know you do work with other musicians as well, I wanted to talk about the notion of orchestration of just moving the band around. I mean, how many people were with you that day with us? 15, right? So that's a lot of instruments and equipment and support staff. From an orchestration of getting everything to a place and then to the next place and to the next place. I'm interested in sort of how you think about that as a musician and how that works. I mean, it's not like the kind of cliche roadie thing. I mean, there's really some science to all of that, I would imagine.
cory wong (17:30.666)
Yes, the two main roles that really help or the heads of departments would be the production manager, Miles, who runs all things on the production side, audio. So he runs audio and then like the lighting and just stage setup and all that. And he has a crew of a lighting director and a stage manager that work with him, typically when we're on the road. And he runs all the audio stuff. And normally in a venue, there will be some people from the venue that know the room and that will help us, normally a couple people. And then, so that's the production side. The tour manager side, I have, his name's also Corey. He kind of helps manage, our flights, accommodations, make sure that everybody knows where and when to be, and he organizes all of that sort of stuff. And...and takes care of that sort of thing. And then for this particular project, I had my video crew, which was headed up by my friend Michael Bowden, and he had a few people with him that helped that process go along. And I oversee kind of those, all of those individual departments or all those heads of departments, and then they kind of help delegate. And it's not like I don't communicate with the other people as well. I'm making it sound more maybe more corporate than it is. These are also just friends. The lighting director is a friend of mine, but he is in the production and Miles is the production manager. So it's not like it has to go up a chain of command or whatever. It's just like in certain realms, Miles can make these decisions. I don't need to be the one to do it. And I think that's kind of what helps me have more hours in my day, is being able to delegate certain things to certain departments and people. I trust that they know what my preferences taste and budgets and whatever are. I know that they'll keep it within the realm of things.
Will (19:38.764)
Good. Brian, thinking about it from the supply chain standpoint and the departments or roles like Corey talked about with a touring band, how does that work in your world?
Brian Gaunt (19:53.787)
Similar, we have departments and functions. And that, you know, we work under work instructions and directions so people have an idea what they're expected to do from the day to day basis. And those responsibilities are delegated down to the individuals to make those decisions to do what's right for their area of control to service our customer and ultimately get the product out the door. So in a lot of ways, it's quite similar. We're breaking down our organizational structure to focus on those particular areas, whether it's human resources or operations or some other function in the business. We're all kind of tasked within our...realm of expertise to deliver those goods. So very similar in a way, breaking things down.
Will (21:02.208)
Good, yeah, and I just wanted to say if any of the listeners are thinking Corey sounded corporate in that, I can assure you he's wearing a sweater that has a musical score on it. Corey, if I might, I know you are an avid podcaster too, so one to another. Tell us about your podcast. It looks like it's been going for a long time. And maybe starting with the history, and then I'd be interested in.a couple of your favorite guests. So maybe some of our listeners could pick up those episodes to kind of get introduced to it.
cory wong (21:39.338)
Yeah, there's not a lot of guitar podcasts that are, there's a couple, there's a couple of good guitar podcasts that have existed for several years, I wanted to focus on creative process, artistry, how the guitar relates into that, and an artist to artist thing, not like a journalist sort of thing, somebody who's a professional guitar player talking to other professional musicians. And...I'm not saying that I do it the best. There have been a couple other, there is other guitar podcasts that I like, but there's certain things that I wanted out of a guitar podcast that I wasn't hearing. And I started doing it early 2020. And then it's just been a blast to do, because also it's in partnership with Premier Guitar Magazine. And part of it has been fun because it's also like a lot of my guitar heroes. that I would have just paid any amount of money to get a lesson from, I can now just ask them those questions in the form of a podcast and get my free guitar lesson. I mean, honestly, I've interviewed most of my favorite guitar players on the planet and some of them have since become friends and peers, they treat me as a peer, which is very wonderful. But some of my favorite episodes, there's two episodes I had to break it up because we did like five hours of hanging out in the studio. I did an interview with John Mayer that was great.Pat Matheny was really fun. George Benson for the Jazzheads. Joe Satriani was my first episode I did. That was pretty fun. Jacob Collier was a great one. He's not a guitar, well, he is a guitar player, but he's just kind of like music genius. That was really fun to discuss with him. Victor Wooten was a great one, talking about just conceptual art and music and life and just getting really deep. There's been a lot of really great ones. So I am overflown with amazing guests and they continue to come, which is so much fun.
Will (25:12.957)
Yeah, that's awesome. What's the podcast called?
cory wong (25:15.21)
It's called Wong Notes, Wong Notes podcast. Yeah.
Will (25:17.064)
Wong notes. All right. And you can find it in the normal spots. Yeah. Yeah, that's great. So just back to orchestration and supply chain, maybe to wrap it up, harmonization is probably another kind of angle at this. And maybe, Corey, that's an easier term for you to. you to start with and I'll let Brian think about it for a second from the supply chain standpoint. But where does orchestration and harmonization, where do those concepts overlap? Is it a total overlap? Are they slightly different things? What do you say?
cory wong (26:03.274)
So if I have one melodic line and I want to embellish that line with some context, I will add harmony to give it a feeling of, of tension and release. Like a melody on its own has some tension and release, but the harmony around it really is kind of what makes it feel like it's resolved or not. It helps really sell the point on whether something is resolved or not. or how rich a certain harmony is something that feels like it's simple or it's something that feels really complex. A harmonic, a melodic note can be inside of a really dense harmony to give it a feeling of something really lush. and it also doesn't necessarily need to be really interesting jazz harmony or something like. You listen to the way that Bruce Hornsby plays just regular major and minor chords. He adds all this color to it in a way that most people don't do or can't do. They don't hear it that way. And it's not like he's adding in these notes that are outside of the scale. It's still all very diatonic, meaning like part of the key that you're in. He does very diatonic harmony, but he does it in a way that's still really colorful. And there's ways to bring in notes that are not part of your scale that will really perk the ear harmonically. And it all of a sudden creates something like, oh, that was a surprise. So harmony to me is more part of the composition and telling the story of where the melody, of how the melody relates to anything in its tension and release of things and the emotional journey of it. And orchestration to me is how are you presenting the melody and harmony together. Is it through the string section? In a lot of cases, in this composition I wrote with you guys is the melody was in the guitar and strings and the harmony was happening around it. And then it gets passed to the horn section who plays the melody. And the harmonization is happening elsewhere. So sometimes it's taking this melody and rather than just having one voice doing it, it's being passed off from one to the next. even though again, like I talked about, sometimes it's the same melodic line, it's just being moved over somewhere else. So the orchestration, it helps a composer take an idea and get a lot of mileage out of it, where it's like, ah, I've heard the guitar player do this. I wanna hear this in a different context to make it more interesting. And you can just get a lot more mileage out of your ideas because...You can pass it around, you can contextualize it differently, you can give different textures around it, and the melodic idea will still hold up, but the orchestration itself and how it gets passed around and moved around and the energy arc of, is it really big energy or is it tight and quiet? Those things really help propel an arrangement along and keep it interesting.
Will (29:21.716)
Yeah, great. So Brian, where do you see diatonics in the warehouse? Easy question, I know. But you broaden it out. Sort of how do you think about harmonization versus orchestration? Or are those similar concepts? Or are we getting too abstract for what happens in the supply chain world?
Brian Gaunt (29:29.621)
I think of it as orchestration is kind of connecting everything together to work. Harmonizing for me means taking it to the next level. So it's not that I can just have robots and people working together. They're coming together at the right point. So it's more of an optimization of supply chain. they're connected with orchestration. but I'm not getting the most out of it. As I harmonize, then I'm having the right people at the right time with the exact right labor force meeting all together at the perfect timeframe. To me, that's what harmonizing means. So that takes a lot of data, a lot of analyzing and optimization along those lines to ensure that it's all coming together at just...the right timeframe.
Will (30:44.576)
Yeah, good answer. That was a tough one. All right, so Corey, you're on a tour break, is that right?
cory wong (30:53.238)
I'm on tour the whole month of February. I've been on a break kind of the last month or so. West Coast, U.S. tour, and West Coast and South. So Texas, Oklahoma City, you know, that sort of stuff, and through to the West Coast.
Will (31:14.428)
Okay, good. And if, if folks wanted to look at your concert schedule, Corey Wong.com or music.
cory wong (31:20.942)
Cory Wong music or just Google my name. I'll be the first one that shows up. Yeah. Somebody, I think some guy in Canada owns corrywong.com and tried to sell it to me for an exorbitant amount of money. And I just, I don't care. Cause people, yeah, I think people just type in the name now and then it just like shows up on Google and they click it. So I don't know. I was spewing my thoughts out loud. I mean, I'm an external processor as you can.
Will (31:51.212)
Yeah, pick that up. Yeah. Well, listen, really appreciate you being with us today and the partnership overall. Brian, as always, it's great to have you here. Good luck on the tour, Corey. We hope to see you again soon and look forward to listening to your music far into the future and your podcast.
cory wong (32:13.858)
Thank you. Appreciate it.
Will (32:15.944)
All right, good luck, take care.
cory wong (32:17.336)
Peace.
Brian Gaunt (32:19.223)
Take care.