The technology making professional tandem cycling accessible - Talking Technology Episode 114

On this episode of Talking Technology, we are joined by Jessica Kennedy, who tells us all about the technology she uses when competing internationally at tandem cycling competitions.

We explore accessible cooking and the OOrion app in your voice notes, as well as accessibility improvements for Tesco stores.

There is an audible Monopoly game for Tonieboxes in tech news, and how are blind people benefiting from the Freedom 250 UFC fight at the White House?

All that and more on the latest episode of Talking Technology.

0:00 - intro

3:10 - Voice notes

29:20 - Jessica Kennedy discusses Technology for tandem cycling

46:55 - Talking Technology News

63:43 - outro 

Transcript

0:00

This Vision Ireland podcast contains chapter markers. If you want to skip the intro or a topic you don't like, you can use chapter markers to do so. Chapter markers are only supported in some podcast apps. Enjoy the show. Welcome to Talking Technology with VILabs. At VILabs, we believe technology is the single greatest enabler for people with sight loss and all disabilities. If you're looking for the latest news and conversation on tech from a more accessible perspective, you've come to the right place. Yes, indeed, you have. Hello, gang. Welcome in to Talking Technology episode 114. Hope you're keeping well. Goodness, it's been, what's this, three podcasts, three weeks in a row. Look at you getting all lucky. We had our WWDC extra podcast last week. So if you did miss that, you can go back and check that out. But there's been so much news even since then, the news cycle, it never stops. You may have seen over the weekend that for the 250th anniversary of the United States of America and, of course, Donald Trump's birthday, his 80th birthday, they had a big UFC fight in the garden of the White House. What a world we live in. Yes, a UFC fight in the garden of the White House. But why would that be mentioned on a technology podcast for blind people, you might ask? Well, that's a very good question. And the reason for that is one of the people who was at that event was Meta CEO Mark Zuckerberg. And Mark announced at the UFC Freedom at 250 event that they will be giving free pairs of Meta glasses to all blind veterans in the United States of America. So there you go. So we do benefit even a little bit, I suppose, maybe not here in Ireland, but blind people do benefit a little bit from a wrestling event at the White House. Did you ever think you'd see the day anyway? Welcome in to Talking Technology with V.I. Labs episode one hundred and fourteen. We've a packed show coming up for you over the next hour or so. We're going to be catching up with Jessica Kennedy and Jessica will be telling us all about some of the really cool technology that goes into the world of tandem cycling. She's just back from the Tandem Cycling World Cup and we'll be chatting all about that and some of the bike computers and the different software and technology that you use in tandem cycling and how accessible or, as the case may be, non accessible that technology may be. We'll be catching up with Jessica later on in the show as well. We'll have Talking Technology news. We've got loads of voice notes this week. And yeah, we would love to hear your perspectives as well on all of that and more. So, as always, it's not just our show, it's also your show. So do feel free to get in touch because there's loads of ways that you can do so. So if you want to join the conversation, one of the handiest ways that you can do it is with a WhatsApp voice note, if you would like. You can send us a WhatsApp voice note, the number that you need there is 086-199-00-11, that's 086-199-00-11. You can find the voice message button, it's labelled with voice over at the bottom right hand side of your screen. And they've actually changed it recently as well, so it now stands out, it's in a bright green colour. So you might find that easier to see if you've got low vision as well. So you can send us a voice note on WhatsApp, 086-199-00-11, there you go, that's the way to do that. You can also send us an email if you'd like to do it the good old fashioned way, that's content at vi.ie, content at vi.ie. So no matter how you would like to get in touch with us, there are loads of ways to do so. Be it a WhatsApp voice note or an email, we would absolutely love to hear from you. And to go through some of the voice notes that we've had in, and we've had lots of voice notes in over the last two weeks, it's time to cross to Kilkenny. Yes, he's back, it's Mr Joe Lannigan. Joe, how are you? Hi David, how's it going? Not too bad Joe, thanks so much. Were you watching the UFC at the White House, Joe? No, I wasn't watching the UFC at the White House, it wouldn't be my thing and I do think it... I know, maybe you shouldn't give me an opinion on these things, if I use the lawn in the White House... You're just used to seeing him fighting in the backyard any other day, Joe. I just love giving out about things, yeah, that's just me, David. No, but seriously, I don't think the White House lawn is for UFC events, but every present to his own, you know. Each one to their own. But no, I suppose some people see that as really good fun and there was a celebration for blind veterans of the US Army, as you said, and they got something here. Yeah, exactly, and I suppose, look, it is, you know, if we look at it, there is, as you said, those free meta glasses for blind veterans, a gift from Mark Zuckerberg to the world. So there you go. It's an interesting one and people will benefit from that. It was a very interesting one actually, I think the one good thing to come out of that was it did highlight to the world that meta glasses are one tool out there for people with vision impairments that can help them do some. They're not a solution to everything, but they can help you with some everyday tasks, like giving you a summary of your post and maybe giving you a description of a scene around you and connecting to Be My Eyes and doing magic things like that. So, but yeah, it did highlight the fact that meta glasses are out there and it's one benefit Facebook and meta have brought to the world. So they have collaborated with Ray-Ban Glasses and created an amazing kind of a tool. So that was one thing that was highlighted and I found that very interesting. Absolutely. And it kind of legitimizes them as assistive technology too, doesn't it? It does. You know what I love? A universal or mainstream product that also combines accidentally on purpose, if you know what I mean, to help blind people in their everyday life. I think that that's a great, a great tool. Absolutely. There you go. Anyway, moving on from meta glasses and the UFC, let's dive into some of your voice notes from the week gone by. We're starting off with a message from Robbie Ford. And here is what Robbie had to say actually on the note of meta glasses. We're not strictly moving on. Robbie had some thoughts on the Orion app. Hiya folks, Robbie Ford here. I was talking to Dorian today. We were just chatting about the meta glasses and I was saying about the Orion app that I came across. That's O-O-R-I-O-N. I just came across it about two or three weeks ago and I just find it absolutely fantastic. It's very, very useful. You just download it onto your smartphone, open it up and once you have the glasses, meta glasses on and you have it synced with your glasses, it will activate on the glasses. It's a very, very useful tool. Basically, there's a number of different features on it. One I find very, very useful now myself is basically it explains your surroundings. So you just put them on, use the wake word Orion. So literally you say, Hey Orion, tell me what you can see. And then you say no more. And as you turn your head left to right, it'll just describe everything around you. From speaking to people that were sighted that I showed, they said it was even picking up on detail that a sighted person wouldn't even notice. For instance, the other day I was showing somebody and it said the glasses were picking up even on the pattern on the tablecloth on the table. So Orion, check it out. There you go. Thanks so much, Robbie. Appreciate that. It's an interesting one, Joe. We've looked a little bit at Orion and it's kind of bridging that gap that we don't have in Ireland with the live AI features that some other countries have. Yeah, that's true. In one way, it is kind of a live AI Orion. And thanks, Robbie, for the for the voice note. I just want to know what kind of pattern is on his tablecloth now. Yeah, that's true. That hint. Yeah. No, seriously, the live AI, it didn't come over here to Ireland and some other countries, of course. It's available in certain states in the US. It's not even available in every state. I did see people putting comments up to say it's not available when it's coming and other comments like that. But yeah, Orion, go back to that app. It is great. And the idea is brilliant. I have tried it myself, but it's not something I use all the time because I also like saying because it kind of takes over the glasses. And you have to say Orion or Hey Orion or something like that. And then you can ask it to read text or you can just leave it in AI mode or whatever. But I kind of like to say, hey, Mitha and do other stuff with the glasses. You can't really do that when the Orion is on. You know what I mean? So but then it also ends up confusing the phone and glasses sometimes, whereas I can't remember which way around it goes. But sometimes the glasses might say your your glasses is using the phone camera or your phone is using the glasses camera. Do you want to switch or then you might have to restart the glasses and turn off the Orion app and restart the Mitha app, you know, this kind of stuff. And for for maybe a user that might be not as proficient as the next, we'll say someone that's really new to this technology that could get very frustrating for them. You know. Yeah. And so I think this app is great. And thanks, Robbie, for for filling everybody in on that app. But it isn't perfect yet. And as I was talking to a colleague earlier, he said, maybe maybe Mitha might think of purchasing this app and building it more into their life. Or, you know, that that could be a plan for that company. Like there is only a few employees. They're not they're not a massive company. So it is it is the style of those type of companies to sell on their products, make it make a great product and sell it on and make a few million dollars out of it. But that's where I see it going with Orion. And hopefully they do develop and perfect it. But and please, people don't rely on this for a navigation aid as it's not a navigation aid. And hallucinations are very common. I have seen it make some great descriptions, but also some questionable errors as well. Calling a dog a cat and stuff, you know, it could be mad mad mad suggestions or you wouldn't want to say that the way is clear when it's not. So yes, don't rely on it for navigation, but it is a great tool at the same time. You wouldn't want to be mixing up those dogs and cats. Apparently, they don't like it anyway. There you go. There you go. Yeah, it's true. You know, I think it's a really great app. It's a nice start. I do think META have a while to go before they start, like, truly integrating these things properly into the META glasses. It's the same story with Aira. You know, it works really well with the glasses, but at the same time, it's as you said, it's taken over the glasses. So you're losing some of your hey META features and so on. So it's a tough one. I think we'll get there. I'd be very interested to see what Google do when they launch their smart glasses down the road. We'll see how that looks as well. But interesting times ahead for sure. What I'm really looking forward to is I know it's down the line and maybe not until the next year, rumours have it, but until Apple actually release a set of proper glasses, not affordable ones, not like the ones they have at the moment. Name escapes me. Vision Pro, that tells a story in itself, Joe, doesn't it? Yeah, Vision Pro, not those, because nobody can really realistically afford those. But I'm talking about something under one thousand dollars or one thousand euros, and that's the rumour maybe next year. So that and look, Apple will bring out something stylish that everybody wants to wear. So that's what I'm really looking forward to. And of course, the Google ones in September. Yeah, exciting times ahead for sure. Robbie, thank you so much for that. Appreciate it. If you have thoughts on Orion or any other apps that you're connecting to your glasses, do send us a voice note 0861990001. We also had a voice note in from Derry, and Derry had some really interesting thoughts about a conversation that we were having in the newsletter. Not that long ago. Here is what Derry had to say. Hi, David, Joe and Daniel, and you're all keeping well. I really enjoyed your podcast this week. You had an article about Tesco and their braille large print menus or their recipe cards. But recently, Martha, my wife, she went up to do the shopping and she was using the self checker thing. And somebody showed her in the menus to increase the print so you can have large print and also have different colour backgrounds. You can have your usual yellow and black or whatever, you know, but once you do your shopping, you can start and then you can scan your items and you can see all the stuff in the large print. But when you have paid and finished, then it reads where it's back to the small print. So it's pretty good. There's no speech yet, but I'm sure it won't be long come when you get a headphone jack and be able to hear stuff. I'm not sure how good that will play. Yeah, it's interesting that Tesco are doing some great work with accessibility there. Thanks again. Thanks, Derry, much appreciated. And yeah, there's an unexpected item in your bagging area there, Derry. You want to remove that and put that through again. Anyway, that aside, yes, it's true. I discovered this as well recently because I happened to be on a panel with the director of accessibility for Tesco, James Hurst was his name, and he was talking about how they wanted to be compliant with all the kind of international standards like the Web Content Accessibility Guidelines and stuff like that for their self-service terminals. So they do actually have those kind of large print options. They do have all of that sort of stuff. And then, of course, in the UK, they've got the partnership with Be My Eyes. You can request the accessible recipes. Some of those aren't great in Ireland. You can't get the Braille versions and stuff over here, we found. But it seems like out of all of the supermarkets, it seems Tesco are trying, Joe. Tesco are definitely trying their best and they obviously have an accessibility department and have recognised that these problems need solutions, you could say. So they've made a good start. And look, I don't think that was screen reader. I needed their self-checkout. I didn't see one yet. No. No, that'd be mad, wouldn't it? Screen reader and then maybe a screen curtain. We could confuse the whole supermarket. We could. It's a great idea. I like it. Yeah, that's that thing that you said that there is a product in. What's that saying? You said the bagging area. Oh, an unexpected item in the bagging area. Yeah, an unexpected item. That that sound just does my head in in the supermarket. Yeah, and when I'm at the other checkouts, I can hear that reverberating around the place with the other three. Yeah, yeah. Thank you for shopping at Tesco. Yes. So I could imagine the frustrations that is happening at those self-checkouts is unbelievable. So if I was fishing a bird, people get their hands on the we're going to create chaos. Oh, we are 100 percent. Yeah, yeah. Please swipe the top card. Yeah. Derry mentioned Jack, iPhone or headphone jack in it. And I don't think that's the way anymore. I think the headphone jack is gone. You know what I mean? Yeah, nobody has one anymore in their pocket. You know what I mean? It's very, very rare you'd find anybody has one of those. And if you have to carry one out around, especially just for to use in Tesco or at bank machines, it'd be just a bit of a nuisance. Like because then you know what's going to happen? You're just going to leave it at home. You're going to forget about it. And so there has to be another solution now. It'd be great because like if you think about it, right, you're tapping half the time, you're tapping your phone off these points of sale anyway. Right. Yeah. So in theory, what if that could initiate an auto temporary connection to something like your AirPods or something? Yeah, I think that's the way. That's what I was just going to suggest. Because it's so easy nowadays to tap your phone and get a unique connection. That is what's going to have to happen. Tap your phone and it connects to your metal glasses or your AirPods or whatever you choose. And then are your even your hearing aids and then if there was a screen reader or some sort of voice feedback, maybe that's one way somebody that's almost totally blank could use the machine. But to be honest with you, though, the other issues of those kind of machines is going in, finding them, it'll take a bit of training. You know what I mean? I think a lot of training, to be honest with you, you'd have to get individual helpers to come in, show you around the supermarket, show you how the keypad works or maybe bring it into the wavefinding center or something. You know, there's going to be going to be a big if these become mainstream, there's going to be a big training operation around it. It's tough because any time we have someone in here in Invision Ireland who wants to do training on, let's say, an ATM or something like that, it's difficult because you have to go to, let's say, a bank or their local ATM more commonly. And you do kind of practice on that. But you're just you're hoping and praying sometimes that, you know, it's not a busy day and you're not holding up people. There's no like set environment that you can actually go and like the wavefinding center or whatever, practice these things in a controlled environment. Yes, it's great having, I suppose, the experience in the real world, but you get a lot of undue pressure if you because you're going to want to do it multiple times. And then you have someone in the queue who wants to use the ATM or wants to use the return machine or wants to use the self-service terminal. And they're going nuts because you're trying to practice it, you know. So it is a challenge in getting to know these devices and getting comfortable with them. I've never got a chance to truly play with them, I guess. No, exactly. And don't get me started on return machines move on before your blood pressure gets high. Yeah, absolutely. There you go. Moving swiftly, swiftly on, Derry, thank you so much for the voice note, much appreciated. And yeah, hopefully we will see some form of a screen reader or something like that on Tesco devices and indeed devices from other supermarkets soon. Our local Dons, I would like to see them improve a little bit on their self-service machines, too, because it is currently driving me nuts. But anyway, that's an aside. Right. Moving on, our third voice note in this week is from Geraldine, who had lots of thoughts on the whole world of accessible cooking. Here is what she had to say. Hi, guys, Geraldine Duggan here in Tipperary. Cooking with sight loss, a few things that helped me. I have a talking Wayne skills, which I find invaluable and couldn't possibly manage without it for baking particularly. And that's so that has allowed me to go back baking from bread and whatever again. So I find that absolutely brilliant. I suppose some of the the challenges, one of the challenges I find is that I am not being able to see if something is cooked. So cooking for grandchildren or anything that I can't see if something has turned golden or or is cooked or looks cooked. So that that that creates a challenge. And I also find managing food in the oven for everything is quite hot and that I find that very challenging. And I suppose something that I am very conscious of is that a lot of vegetables are wrapped in clear plastic. And if I find it impossible to know whether I've left some of that in with the vegetables when I'm cooking them, particularly things like broccoli and that that are wrapped in clear plastic, that that can that can be a challenge to just. And the other big challenge, of course, is cooking with eggs, can't see the shells if they're gone into them. So that's another challenge. But I find the air fryer absolutely great. It's safe and it's easy to use. I just would like to be able to expand my my my repertoire a little bit. It's fairly limited. And the other thing that I found really, really valuable, invaluable to me is the one cup kettle. It has allowed me to stop using the teapot, which was positively dangerous because I poured more of it on the table than in the cup. But with the one pot, one cup kettle, it's almost impossible to scold oneself or anybody else. So I find that really, really helpful, one of the really must haves in the kitchen for me. So they're just some of my thoughts. I'm sure there's loads more if I could think of them now. But and managing the fridge, I find managing food in the fridge quite, quite tricky as well. I never know if something is gone off or cheese, particularly. I've been known to serve musty cheese to be moldy cheese to people like when you can't see it. So things like that. But there are just a few things, too, that help me. So thanks, guys, for all your updates. And I'll continue listening. Thanks so much, Geraldine. Really appreciate that and great detail there as well. Lots of really useful tips. And I think, you know what, it's something I find a bit of a challenge is kind of cooking and stuff like that. I've never got truly comfortable with it, but it is definitely possible, Joe. Yeah, you're too much of a mammy's boy, David. Oh, don't start now, don't start. And I know I'm joking. Hey, no, seriously, though, that was great advice from Geraldine. And it does highlight the cooking difficulties of anyone that has required a vision impairment or has always had a vision impairment. There's always going to be challenges, but everybody does find their own way eventually. And Geraldine did say she finds the air fryer great. Like myself, I have a Ninja AF300, two drawers on it, so I cook two things at once. And it doesn't speak to me, but I have bump-ons on it. So a bump-on on the turn on the machine shows me where the turn on machine button is. Then the air fryer button has a bump-on and the start button has a bump-on and that's it. And after that, I can just put my own timers on Alexa or whatever else, you know. So you don't have to go all the way down the smart home technology route because there is other ways. And Geraldine has a talk on Wayne scales. We also have one of them in the house. They're brilliant. So you put your product on, tells you the weight, you let it recalibrate and then you put your next item on the Wayne scale. So great job as well. But there is all types of ways. Don't forget your newest BMI eyes and your phone. You can connect with volunteers who want to really check something and they can do their best to tell you what's there in front of you. As you said, dates in the fridge, famous one as well, very difficult. Maybe look for personal assistance if anyone has it or sometimes you can use BMI eyes app again to do that. CNAI, sometimes if the print is good, you can take a picture of the label, it'll tell you the date as well. This is using the iPhone now. I know you can get them on Android as well. And meta glasses, of course, is a good job too for sometimes checking dates. But it depends on the print and the product as well, David. Sometimes it can be very faint or it can be put on a corner, you know, and it's very hard to read something when it's on when a sticker is put from over the edge of a product and it's on a corner. So it won't read correctly either. So, yeah, look, cooking has its challenges and lots of them. Just a thing there, Joe, with the meta glasses, I've heard a few people getting kind of surprised or caught with this. Make sure in your meta glasses settings. So you go into your meta AI app and into the settings for the glasses and make sure your language is set to English, United Kingdom. Found this out actually by default when you install them, most of them default to United States. What happens is your dates are coming, you know, if you take the 6th of February or something, it would read the 2nd of June. So, yeah, of course, you mightn't be too bad with some of the, you know, some products out there. But if you picked out a carton of milk and it says best before 2nd of June and it's the 1st week of February or the last week of January, you're there. OK, yeah, that doesn't sound right with the milk. Yeah, that's a good tip actually, Daniel. It's a great tip, yeah. Americanized kind of dates can be turned backwards, yeah. But it's something to keep in mind, your region settings in your glasses and even in your phone as well sometimes. Yeah, there you go. Yeah, a great note. Thank you so much as well to Geraldine for that. A brilliant tip and brilliant info on some of that stuff. You really have to give some credit, I think, as well to companies. And I don't want to single out any in particular, but I'm going to anyway. If you look at companies like Cobalt or whatever, they've done a huge amount in that space to make a lot of different talking appliances. And while it might not always be the best approach for everyone, they've got quite a range of options, to be fair to them. Yeah, it is a solution for some. It's actually that's a good point, David, if like not everybody is a smartphone user either. So and some people even choose not to have a mobile phone. So, yeah, it's it's a great option. Some of those Cobalt products like the talking airfare, as you said, I think they might have had a talk in microwave one stage. And I'm sure if you still do, they possibly make some of those ways as well. So, yeah, no, there's a good range of products out there now from Cobalt. Absolutely. There you go, Geraldine. Thank you. And also thank you to Derry and Robbie for their voice notes earlier. If you have thoughts on any of that, do send us a voice note or a message to 086-199-0011. That's all we're going to go through this week. We did have other voice notes in as well. But we're going to keep it to just the three for this week. And we're not ignoring people. We will include some of the other voice messages in future shows. So be sure to subscribe or follow wherever you get your podcasts for that. But thank you to everyone who contributed. It is very much appreciated. Moving on, the world of accessible tandem cycling or tandem cycling in general even is obviously it's sporty. But you wouldn't necessarily always think about the technology that goes into things like that. Well, I caught up with Jessica Kennedy, who's just back from the Tandem Cycling World Cup, if you don't mind, to learn some of the tech that she uses, learn about some of the tech she's using and find out how technology can be used and often is used in the world of tandem cycling. Here's what happened when I caught up with Jessica earlier this week. So joining me now on Talking Technology to discuss all things technology in tandem cycling. I am joined by Jessica Kennedy. Jessica, how are you? I am really good, David. Thanks. How are you? Really good. Thank you so much for joining me. Now, it must be said, Jess, you have been absolutely killing it on the tandem cycling stage in the last little while. We mentioned it very briefly on the podcast only a couple of weeks ago. But you're back from Italy from the Tandem Cycling World Cup. Yes. Yeah, that was my first ever World Cup. And we placed fifth in the time trial and in the road race, which I was just beyond happy with. Yeah, that's incredible. Like and how many people like there's a large cohort participating in that? I would say there was probably around 15 female bikes in and around that anyway. Super. So a decent enough field for the female tandems. And that's all visually impaired people then? Yes. Yeah, every single person on the back of the bike has been classified as visually impaired, either have no sight at all or partial vision. OK, so you are are you a B1 cyclist or a? I'm a B3. You're a B3. OK. Yes, so B1 is someone who has absolutely no sight and then B2 they have a little bit of sight, B3 they have more sight but are still legally blind. OK, there you go. And how long have you been doing it? This will be my third season, so I haven't been doing it a long time at all. But, you know, I'm so grateful for all the races and all the trips and stuff I've gotten to go on so far. And you've got the bug now, so you can't escape it. Yes, unfortunately, it's such an expensive sport, but I have absolutely gotten the bug for it now. Brilliant stuff. So I suppose then to talk about the technology in tandem cycling, I guess to get right down to basics. For those who maybe aren't familiar, tandem cycling is, as the name would suggest, you've two cyclists on the bike. You have the stoker on the back and then the pilot at the front, the pilot sighted and the stoker, as you said, visually impaired or blind. But technology plays, you were saying to me, a massive role in tandem cycling, actually. Yes, it does. So everything is driven by technology. So we have power pedals, which tell us how much power we're putting out, we have heart rate monitors, we have bike computers, we have smart trainers. Everything you could think of that could be tracked is tracked. So we have all the metrics. And how then do you find, say, the accessibility of that? Like if you are checking those stuff, can you check that independently in real time or are you kind of left to kind of find out almost after the fact? Yeah, so that's a really good question, actually. So on I have the Wahoo Element Roam, which is a bigger screen on a bike computer. I think there's only one step above that, which is almost like a phone, but mine's a little bit smaller than that. So you can change how big the numbers are, but obviously the bigger the numbers are, the less you see on the screen. So I have mine set up that I can only see the kilometers that we've done and my power. I can't see my heart rate or my cadence or any of that in real time. I can only kind of check that afterwards. If I'm on a train and spin, it's kind of a little bit more lax and I can pick up the computer and like turn down almost the font size. So I can bring it closer to my face and see like my heart rate or my cadence or whatever like that. But during a race, I wouldn't do that. I would just concentrate. So, yeah, it's kind of you see a lot of that stuff after the fact, whereas like the pilots would be able to see all of their stuff like their cadence, their average power, their speed, the time, all that sort of stuff in real time. Now, they do. If I asked my pilot, who was Alice, like how long have we been going, she'd be able to tell me we've been going for half an hour or, you know, stuff like that. But I mostly see it after the fact. And how does technology say like a bike computer in the sense that you're using it? How does it differ from something like a smart wearable, like, let's say, a Fitbit or an Apple watch? So Fitbit or an Apple watch, you know, like obviously that's on your wrist. But for me, with my sight anyway, I would have to put my watch quite close to my face and then zoom into it with my with my other hand. And obviously then you're taking your hands off the handlebars. And it's not ideal, like, yeah, it's not ideal in a race situation or even on a train and spin kind of thing. Like you kind of want it like right in front of you where you can like just look down and have a quick glance at it and then just settle back into whatever position you're in. And is there any kind of of those kind of devices that integrate maybe with speech or anything like that? Is that something that you've explored at any point? So I haven't personally, but I know that Damian Verker, he had some sort of app on his phone that he could connect his bike computer to like an earpiece. And it could tell him, I don't know specifically, but maybe like his watts every three or five seconds. And I was told that the app was kind of clunky. It wasn't really like fit for purpose kind of thing. So he doesn't use it anymore, but he does use the meta glasses and definitely in training anyway. I'm not sure about racing because I know that they are banned by UCI for able bodied. So I'm not entirely sure what the rules are for stokers, but he definitely uses them in training and it can tell him his watts and all that, like the vital information that he needs in order to train efficiently. That's very interesting that they're banned for those who are able bodied because it's not, I would imagine, like a performance enhancer, if you know what I mean. No, it's more so you're not allowed to record while you're racing. OK, then I suppose the other thing that you were mentioning is, you know, sometimes because, you know, obviously a tandem bike is usually operated by two people. Sometimes you're not always going to have a partner in crime that's able to train with you, so you end up doing a lot of kind of indoor training. And there are other solutions that you can use in those cases. Yes, so I have a smart trainer, it's the Wahoo Kickr. And so I use Zwift to train, there's loads of platforms that you could use, but I use Zwift. And not the most accessible platform, I will say that straight off the bat. I know people who have had a lot of trouble with it, with the accessibility, but my Kickr can connect to my laptop through Bluetooth. And then I can get the resistance that I need to do the watts that I need for my training through that program, if that makes sense. So I can connect to my Kickr, my heart rate, and I have a Zwift controller. So if I'm just doing a free ride, that will control the gears. But in terms of accessibility, I have found that there is a Zwift companion app. So I have that on an old phone that I have and I have a little stand on my, not stand, a holder, sorry, on my handlebars on my bike, because I can't see the details of the session on my laptop, no matter how close it is to me, there'd be no point in having the program on. So I have the companion app on my phone and that will show me what watts I'm doing, my cadence and my heart rate, and the intervals that I'm doing and how long is left in the intervals. And because it's on my phone and it's right next to me, I can zoom in and out with my magnifier as much or as little as I need. And I find that that works best for me with my training. I wonder. It's a bit of a work around, but if it works, it works. Exactly. There you go. I do wonder, like I wonder, just I'm talking out loud. I wonder if that could integrate me with an iPad or something even, too. Yeah, definitely. I have had it up on a tablet beforehand when I was doing a race and I had one of my parents there with me to help me, like, just tell me what watts I was doing and like how many kilometers I'd done and that sort of stuff. So they had the tablet and then the laptop was kind of in front of me. OK, very good. And how would you like to see technology in this space evolve? Like, what would make life easier for you if you could control the world? I actually had a conversation similar to this with one of my teammates when we were in Poland. And for me personally, if I could get some sort of technology that was like, you know, I was able to use during a race in my ear, that could tell me my watts and my heart rate and that sort of stuff. And that like it was reliable, especially during time trials, because they're in such an aggressive, like, aero position that I'm not actually looking at my computer. Because if I do, then I come out of the aero position, slows us down, drag, all that sort of stuff. So if I could have something that could just tell me what I was doing, that would help me so, so much. It's fascinating because you would think at this point it's quite achievable because I know now I'm not doing anything near the level you're doing. But like, if I'm doing a workout at home, I will use sometimes WorkoutBuddy on Apple Watch. And that will give me kind of prompts as I progress through AirPods. And I know that does do like some cycling bits, but the difficulty there will be to have it integrate with your bike computer or whatever. But it all seems like technically achievable in the 21st century. So who knows what the future brings? Oh, absolutely. You never know. Like a couple of years ago, we never thought these metaglasses would be out, you know, it's. The technology in the world is forever evolving, forever changing. So who knows what's going to be here in like two or three years, let alone five or ten? Absolutely. So even then, outside of, you know, tandem cycling and all of the world of sport, is there other technology? I know you mentioned the metaglasses, but is there other technology that's kind of stood out to you? What do you use in your day to day? Day to day, I mostly just use my phone as like a magnifier. I have the Samsung A56 I got for my birthday last year. And it actually, yeah, it actually has an accessibility feature where you can turn the camera into a magnifier. So if you press, I think it's the up volume and the power button at the same time, it'll bring you to a specific magnifier camera type thing. So there's a little bar down the bottom you can zoom in and out, you can freeze the screen, you can zoom in, do all that sort of stuff that like a normal handheld magnifier would be able to do. But it's on your phone, so it's so much easier. You don't have to carry another device or another piece of equipment with you. That's what I've been using. Awesome stuff. We often hear a lot of people on the podcast talk about how much they prefer iPhone and stuff like that. Do you find that the Android is kind of meeting all your needs? You would say it's from a low vision perspective, like you find it works really well for what you need to do? Yeah, definitely. I think I've always had Androids. I think I had one iPhone when I was like 12 and I broke my Android and I borrowed an iPhone from a family member or something like that. But I've always had Androids and they have worked for my needs. Like I have a Samsung tablet now, I would have had an iPad for years in school. And I think just even the gestures for like the magnification and stuff like that, I find it a bit easier to use. I know on the iPad, I'm not sure if it's still the same now, but it used to be that you would have to tap with like three fingers and stuff like that. And it would be the same on the iPhone. It's still the same. OK. On the Android, you just have to tap with one finger and then you can pinch and zoom and all that. So I just find it a little bit easier because I've got smaller hands anyway. So that's just a bit easier for me. There you go. Yeah. It's incredible the different kind of technology people use and in different kind of niche specific circumstances like the tandem cycling that you're doing and stuff like that. So I then I guess to wrap up, what is next for Jessica Kennedy? What is next in the tandem cycling world? What are your ambitions longer term? Oh, that's such a loaded question. Obviously, my ambitions are to like continue growing, continue improving myself on the bike and go to world championships, maybe go to the Olympics. Who knows, maybe one day be world champion. There you go, dandelion a little bit, but you know, you always have to be working towards something you got a dream big, don't you? You sure do. And why set the bar low? Good on you. How can people find out more? Do you do much in the social media sphere, anything like that? Oh, yeah, so I have an Instagram and a tick tock and the tick tock is just a power cyclist and my Instagram is Jesse 131 X. I need to change that name to something a bit more professional now, but that's how you can find me on the Instagram. I post loads just about the cycling and then the tick tock is more kind of the day to day sort of training stuff. Excellent stuff. Well, listen, Jess, thank you so much for joining us. Really do appreciate it. And I guess all we can say is best of luck. You are doing a stellar job representing Ireland on the world stage and more power to you. Thank you so much. Thank you so much for having me. Thanks so much to Jessica. They're a really interesting conversation. It's always good to catch up on technology that I suppose oftentimes we don't consider. I know we've talked about things like smartwatches and stuff on the show before, but it's fun to dive into some of the specifics and what's being used out there in the real world. So thank you so much to Jessica for that. Just on that meta glasses ban from the governing body, we did look into that a little bit. And thank you as well to Jessica, who helped with this. But Daniel, we have the official line there from that governing body. What is it exactly that they're saying? OK, so using any device, including phones, cameras, video cameras or recording enabled glasses to capture images or video during the race is strictly forbidden. And any athletes found doing so will face disqualification. So it's a very clear and firm policy. Yeah, there you go. It's an interesting one. But yeah, I suppose that whole concern around privacy and all of that sort of stuff, it is everywhere. So it is one worth being aware of. But there you go. If you have thoughts on that or any of the things, maybe you do tandem cycling yourself or maybe you're into other sport. We are actually working in Vision Ireland on a new group that is merging the kind of realms of technology and sport. They are developing some stuff all around that. So if that is part of your world, we'd love to hear from you as well. You can send us a WhatsApp voice note to 086-199-0011 or you can send us an email to content at vi.ie. Is there something in the world of sport that we should be looking into? We're looking into loads of this stuff already with that team, as I mentioned, that's collaborating with Vision Sports and VIA Labs, but we would love to hear your perspective. So do send us a voice note or indeed an email. We would love to hear from you. But now, though, it's time to cross to Daniel Dunn for your latest Talkin' Technology News. This is Talking Technology News. So with your latest Talking Technology News, I'm Daniel Dunn. The FIFA World Cup is in full swing and FIFA have launched a new dedicated audio description app for blind users. When you open the app, you can select the game and then you can quickly double tap to start listening live. The audio described feed doesn't have crowd sounds and is mainly just a raw feed of speech. So it does lack some of the atmosphere, but it's a useful tool to be aware of. RTE are unfortunately not providing audio description for the competition, but you can watch all the games for free on the RTE player. Sign language coverage is also being provided by FIFA for the competition. So it does seem like they really did consider accessibility for the event. Hopefully, people use these services over the next few weeks, as ultimately, the more people use them, the more likely they are to become mainstream for all events like this in the future. Have you been watching the World Cup? Do let us know with a WhatsApp voice note now. Tonys, who make the popular Tony Box audio player for kids, have announced a new partnership with Hasbro to bring some of their popular games to the Tony Box 2 in audio form. Traditionally, the Tony Box would work with mini character figures that, when placed on the box, contain a story, audio adventure or music. On the second generation of the box, however, these audio experiences can be more interactive. Games in the new collection include Monopoly, Guess Who, and The Game of Life. The new games look to still have some basic board game elements, so it's unclear if they are fully accessible for blind kids to play without assistance. But the move of audio-based, screen-free gaming into the mainstream is one to watch. Some competitors in this space, like Yoto, have quite accessible companion apps too. So these audio experiences seem really promising. And now for a look at our upcoming webinars and training courses. On the 18th of June, we have booking public transport. On the 23rd of June, we have Microsoft Teams training. On the 25th of June, we have everyday accessibility with Be My Eyes. On the 26th of June, we have our technology support hub, where you can speak with a dedicated IT trainer. Then on the 30th of June, we have chat, GPT, and AI. On the 2nd of July, we've got Siri and Google Assistant commands. So if you have any interest in any of these events, please do drop an email to training at vi.ie. Or for further information on any of these events, please log on to our website, vi.ie. Choose the news and events section and upcoming events for details on each of those called out. Back to the news now, and Fox Corporation have announced a 22 billion deal to buy Roku, the maker of streaming sticks and smart TVs. The Fox, not to be confused with 20th Century Fox or its related film studios, is the current owner of the Fox News brand. They want to acquire Roku to develop a next generation media technology company with the plan to integrate advertising from Fox more deeply into the Roku smart TV platform. Fox also owned the TV streaming platform Tubi, and owning a smart TV brand may make it easier to have services like Tubi and Fox News to be displayed more prominently to users in the TV menu. The Fox Corporation share price seemed to drop after the announcement, so it's unclear how much shareholders actually approve of the decision. The Fire TV platform is probably one of Roku's best non-competitors. Amazon, who own Fire TV, also own services like Freevy and Amazon Prime. So smart TV platforms owning their own streaming services is nothing new. Do you think there's too much advertising everywhere now? Do let us know your thoughts with a WhatsApp Vice Note. And that's it for now. More stories like this, be sure to sign up for the Tech On Tap newsletter in the Vision Ireland website. For now though, it's back to you David. Thank you very much, Daniel. I'm going to jump straight to Mr Joe Ronigan, because I know Joe is very passionate on this particular subject. Joe, is there too much advertising everywhere? I'm just going to sit back now. Is there too much advertising everywhere? Well, of course, of course there is. Anyone that uses YouTube on the free version, I suppose, will first of all tell you, look, it's very annoying, but it's annoying for a reason because I'm trying to push it towards the paid subscription version of YouTube. I didn't mean to pick them out, but it is everywhere. You know, and even now I've seen people pay for Netflix, but the basic version of Netflix seems to have a tiny bit of advertising. Same with the basic version of Prime Video. I'm not sure about all the others. I don't use most of the others. HBO certainly does, yeah. HBO, yeah, that does, from what I hear. Disney Plus doesn't seem to have, I didn't see advertising on it yet. But look, this, yeah, it's, when does it get to the stage that they're going to push it to some massive subscription thing that, you know, will reduce all sorts of, all advertising or whatever. I just think it's a bit much, you know, they've already got the few bob off you, so they don't need to be advertising, you know what I mean? But I know these companies have to sell their products. But Fox News, yeah, they'll be trying to put their little labels and their logos everywhere on their smart TVs in the future if they get this Roku deal over the line. So look, thankfully, I want people to see their logos, but when I'm reading the talkback, maybe they'll announce it. I don't know. It's a bit much, David, yeah, and it's part of life at the moment. So it's not going to stop anytime soon. So it might be a bit of acceptance needed. There you go. Yeah, it's going to be an interesting one to watch. Twenty two billion dollars, though. It's a lot of money for Fox Corporation, their owner of Fox News and Chuby, as well as Fox Sport and a number of other little kind of stations as well. Fox Nation, all of those trying to acquire Roku for twenty two. Yeah, David, just before we move on from that, the competition authority. Like, I mean, it does seem a little bit much. I wonder, is it one for the competition authority? Because I've seen the EU get involved in competition like this in situations like this before and putting a halt to it. So that might be an interesting one coming next month or two to see if anyone gets involved. But I think the competition laws in America are a little bit looser. Sure. Yeah, it's going to be interesting one to watch for sure. In terms of European companies, then the Tony Boxes interactive stories coming to the Tony Boxes. This is with their new Tony Play initiative and a partnership with Hasbro to bring Monopoly and a few other games. Are you a Monopoly fan first off, Joe? Yes, I am actually a Monopoly fan. I think it's a great game. It's a brilliantly designed game. Yeah, trouble is, you never know when to stop. When does it end? That's the other issue with Monopoly, maybe when the time runs out. But or when somebody gets taken, wipes the whole board off the table. That's the other thing. Yeah, right. We don't talk about that, Joe. It was an accident. No, no, I shouldn't have brought that one up. Yeah, that's happened to me once or twice. But anyway, Monopoly on the Tony Box, that'd be very interesting. I'd love to see what it's like. And Tony Box, there is one in my house, not the newer version, but there is one of the older ones. And even the older version is a great little story audio player. And it's interactive, it's tough, and it doesn't break easy. You can hit a slap on the side of it to make it go fast forward or move to the next chapter. So, no, it's a brilliant box and brilliant player for little kids, especially little kids that have vision impairment. So I'd be very interested to see if any of those games are entertaining or if they're intuitive as well and they're easy to use. I'd love to try one. It might be on the next present list, if you know what I mean. Sure, absolutely. Yeah. And there are other ones as well, like Yoto there Daniel mentioned. I believe they have a really accessible app. And I think I was looking at the Yoto app there at one point, and they actually have, I don't know if they still have it, but they have or had some stuff with RTE. So you could listen to RTE Junior Radio on your Yoto player. There is the Yoto player and the Yoto Mini. And those you could listen to RTE Junior Radio on those and some of the RTE Junior podcasts, which was very cool for sure. Do you have one in your house, Daniel? No, we don't. It's something I haven't really come across. So, yeah, I didn't come across the radar, you know, where people want to get these things. So maybe, maybe. Who knows what the future holds? Absolutely. Yeah, I did. Actually, I do have to say for transparency that I did. I do have a small few shares in the Tony company. I am just required to say that. So we keep the advertising standards, people happy. But we have nothing to do with them in Vision Ireland. So it's just clear to say that. There are loads of other competitors like Yoto available. Moving on then, that other story that we had, that first story, it's a really interesting one, FIFA and the World Cup. Are you watching the World Cup, Joe? Yes, I am in spits and spats, put it that way, because it's on so late. Some of the matches are 2am, but the ones that are accessible to me in the other way, which is time. Yeah, I am watching them, I suppose. Watching them and listening to them, whatever way you want to put it. Yeah, and some of it is very interesting. But going back to the app, the FIFA app, it's actually brilliant. I've tried it and I think you mentioned it in your story. The only thing, it does lack a bit of atmosphere. There's a bit of noise in the background, but nothing works. Adding atmosphere to it. But there is a bit of, what I do like about it is after the game, it does, they pass over sometimes to a lady commentator, that will describe what the players are doing and they're going over to the fans and clapping to them and describing the management team and all these different things that you never really take in. Usually it cuts off and goes to the analysis and that's the end of that. So that's another interesting feature of it. But yeah, I think they could do with a small bit more feedback and there is improvements they could make. And it does make a show of some of the people that don't include audio description, but we won't go on too much about that. But also another thing is the fact that some of the major radio stations out there, I know they're from BBC and Talksport and stuff, they're geo blocked. So I used to enjoy listening to those when the World Cup was on, but they're geo blocked, so I can't listen to them. So this FIFA audio description app is a big help there. So if I'm out and about and I want to listen to a bit of football, at least I'll have the FIFA World Cup audio description app. And that's a bonus. Absolutely, yeah. And something I noticed about it as well is they're calling it the FIFA audio description app rather than the World Cup audio description app. So I do wonder if this will expand to future FIFA tournaments and stuff like that as well, because didn't they do stuff with other events for I think was it the Women's World Cup or something like that had audio description as well previously? The FIFA Club World Cup as well last summer. They had a kind of, I suppose, that was in America as well. And it was probably a precursor to this to test out some of the features, the stadiums and all that kind of stuff. So, yeah, they have tested this already. So they've had a little test run on it and this is the real thing now. And look, the thing is it goes on a while. So maybe they can get feedback and improve it even through the tournament. Absolutely. And I'm hopeful people use it. I had an interesting conversation with someone. It sounds unrelated, but stick with me. I had an interesting conversation with someone in Irish Rail last week about how they were looking for people, let's say, if you were requesting assistance for people to book it in advance because the statistics that get gathered through that, just if someone does book it in advance, it makes it easier for them to plan things. It makes it easier for them to actually make an argument that they need more assistant staff, all of that sort of stuff. But it goes back to that point that if people use a service and make it clear that they are using a service, even if you're just watching something with audio description on Netflix or you're using the audio description for the World Cup or you're filling in an accessibility form or whatever, it reminds these companies that actually accessibility is important. People do use it. It is part of our customer base. And ultimately, then it gets more of a focus, you know. It's very rare now that you've anything without captions on a service like Netflix or whatever, because so many people use them. And the same principle applies across the board for these things, I think. Yeah, I think like it's the old adage, you know, if, you know, for everything good that's done, you know, the news of it doesn't really travel that well, but if there's something bad, like if, let's say, if FIFA didn't do this for the World Cup or whatever, then there's loads of complaints in about it. So I think, yes, it's just unfortunate, you know, unfortunate that we often see these companies kind of reacting to something and then being proactive because when, you know, when they put on these extra services, you know, go that little extra mile often, you know, at the end of the day, somebody in the boardroom is sitting down and counting, basically. And if the feedback is not there, it's assumed it's not being used, appreciated or wanted. Take your pick of one of those three or all of those three. So, well, obviously, if something is done bad, the complaints come in. Well, then, you know, that volume of complaints coming in gets things done differently or brought in. You know, so while we're fond of as a people, as human being nature, we're fond of criticising companies, often deservedly so. But we should pay the compliments to and give good feedback in order to encourage more development of services. Absolutely. There we go. Daniel, Joe, thank you so much for that. Do let us know if you're watching the World Cup, what your favourite game has been so far. Loads of people talking about the Spanish game the other night, a surprise upset for Spain there. So who knows who will be winning the World Cup? There's still a ways to go. There's a little bit of Irish interest in Cape Verde because there's a soccer player living in Dublin. Born in Dublin, in Cromwell, and he's playing for Cape Verde. And, yeah, he he actually had a great performance there and in the match against Spain. So I think that'll part of Dublin and Cromwell and definitely have a big team to follow there. And it's great for them. So great excitement. Excellent stuff. Yeah, you want to root for an underdog as well. I love rooting for an underdog with these kind of things. That's awesome. So thank you so much, gents, for that much appreciated. If you do want to join the conversation, as always, you can send us a WhatsApp voice note. There's a new lovely green button there. It's all bright and green. Hopefully it stays that way. That is now in the WhatsApp app there at the bottom right of the screen. You can send us a WhatsApp voice note 086-199-0011 is the way to do it. But hey, for now, that is our show. Thank you all so much for listening. We will be back in two weeks time. Yes, we get a break next week after our three weeks of continuous episodes. But we get a break next week. We'll be back in two weeks time for another episode of Talking Technology with VILabs. In the meantime, stay safe. We'll talk to you then. Thanks for listening to the Talking Technology podcast with VILabs. If you'd like to support our show, please visit vi.ie slash donate. Talking Technology is proudly sponsored by IA Labs, the market leader in digital accessibility services. IA Labs, digital inclusion, your legal obligation. Oh