Mickey Raphael interview

Mickey Raphael started out playing on the Dallas folk scene before meeting with Willie Nelson at a jam session. Forty six years later, Mickey has toured the world with Willie.
Alongside that, Mickey has enjoyed great recording success as a session musician, playing with Emmylou Harris, the Highwayman Country Supergroup, U2, Wynton Marsalis, Ringo Starr, and more recently with Chris Stapleton. The list goes on and on.
He played at Ray Charles funeral, and was most likely the inspiration for the Blues Brothers.
Throughout it all Mickey has remained humble about his tremendous career playing the harmonica.

Select the Chapter Markers tab above to select different sections of the podcast (website version only).

Links:
Mickey's website: http://www.mickeyraphael.com/
Discography: https://rateyourmusic.com/artist/mickey_raphael/credits/

YouTube:
Mickey playing with Willie Nelson and Sheryl Crow: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSOBOJ10JZo
Mickey playing Georgia with Willie Nelson: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mt8pgr7J6g0
Mickey playing with Chris Stapleton: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4nP16bUVL8


Podcast website:
https://www.harmonicahappyhour.com

Donations:
If you want to make a voluntary donation to help support the running costs of the podcast then please use this link (or visit the podcast website link above):
https://paypal.me/harmonicahappyhour?locale.x=en_GB

Spotify Playlist:
Also check out the Spotify Playlist, which contains most of the songs discussed in the podcast:
https://open.spotify.com/playlist/5QC6RF2VTfs4iPuasJBqwT?si=M-j3IkiISeefhR7ybm9qIQ

Podcast sponsors:
This podcast is sponsored by SEYDEL harmonicas - visit the oldest harmonica factory in the world at www.seydel1847.com  or on Facebook or Instagram at SEYDEL HARMONICAS
and Blows Me Away Productions: http://www.blowsmeaway.com/

Chapters

• 1:23 Grew up in Dallas and influenced by British Blues invasion
• 2:48 Started playing guitar but soon went to harmonica
• 3:24 Donnie Brooks inspired Mickey to play
• 5:43 Paul Butterfield was a mentor to Mickey
• 7:26 First recorded with BW Stevenson
• 9:12 First met Willie Nelson
• 10:53 Important not to overplay
• 13:29 What Willie liked about the harmonica in his band
• 14:17 Red Headed Stranger album
• 15:17 Mickey appeared in two movies with Willie
• 16:37 Touring with Willie and favourite venue
• 18:13 Difference between studio and live albums
• 21:03 Range of genres playing with Willie
• 22:06 Ray Charles album with Wynton Marsalis
• 22:59 Mickey played at Ray Charles funeral
• 23:59 Played with Emmylou Harris
• 25:48 Highwayman Country supergroup
• 26:32 Playing Orange Blossom Special with Johnny Cash
• 27:33 Solo album: Hand To Mouth
• 30:32 Red River Valley instrumental album
• 32:05 Album with Chris Stapleton
• 32:43 Other big names Mickey has played with
• 34:03 Met Miles Davis
• 35:21 Mickey helped inspire formation of the Blues Brothers
• 37:46 Why the move to Nashvile and recording with Charlie McCoy
• 40:00 Some involvement in harmonica for health
• 41:14 Country style of harmonica
• 43:11 What position does Mickey usually use and working on movie scores
• 43:48 Does Mickey use Country tuning?
• 44:08 Chromatic harmonica
• 45:47 Bass harmonica
• 47:36 10 minute question
• 48:43 Harmonica of choice
• 49:40 Favourite key of diatonic
• 50:17 Different tunings
• 52:12 Overblows
• 52:20 Embouchre
• 52:36 Amps and mics
• 53:18 Effects pedals and ribbon mics
• 54:51 Tube amps
• 55:41 Future plans

Transcript

SPEAKER_00: 0:00

Hello everybody, Mickey Raphael joins me today. Mickey started out playing on the Dallas Folk scene before meeting Willie Nelson at a jam session. 46 years later, Mickey has toured the world with Willie. Alongside that, Mickey has enjoyed some great recording success as a session musician, playing with Emmylou Harris, the Hairway Man Country Supergroup, Wynton Marsalis, Ringo Starr and more recently with Chris Stapleton. The list goes on and on. He played at Ray Charles' funeral and was most likely the inspiration for the Blues Brothers band. Throughout it all, Mickey has remained humble about his tremendous career playing the harmonica. A word to my sponsor again, thanks to the Lone Wolf Blues Company, makers of effects pedals, microphones and more designed for harmonica. Remember, when you want control over your tone, you want Lone Wolf. So hello, Mickey Raphael, and welcome to the podcast. Hey, thank you for having me. So you're very well known for being Willie Nelson's harmonica player for many years. So obviously, we'll get into that. But before then, we'll start off in your early days. So you grew up around Dallas, I think, playing sort of folk and blues styles initially. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 1:30

Yeah, I grew up in Dallas, Texas. Really had no country background. I just wasn't exposed to country music. And, you know, I loved rock music. I mean, I loved, I think the British invasion was really my beginning of, you know, my music education with the Stones and the Beatles and the Kinks and, you know, listening to John Mayall play harmonica. I was more hands-on with kind of the folk scene in Dallas because there were some great little clubs there. Little coffee houses where the singer-songwriters, you know, like Michael Murphy or Jerry Jeff Walker would come through and play. So when I first started playing harmonic, it was more in that folk vein. You know, the harmonic players that I listened to, you know, were not the Chicago guys. It was more John Mayoff and Duster Bennett, who was a one-man band.

UNKNOWN: 2:22

¶¶

SPEAKER_00: 2:34

Yeah, great that you talk about Duster Bennett. So yeah, he's known in that 60s blues boom.

SPEAKER_02: 2:40

I saw him play. He was opening up for Elton John's first US tour, which I'd gone to see, but I was such a fan of Duster Bennett.

SPEAKER_00: 2:48

You started playing some guitar, and you didn't get on too well with that, and that's when you turned to the harmonica.

SPEAKER_02: 2:53

Yeah, well, I love music and I wanted to be a musician. So, as every kid has a guitar, and it just didn't click with me. You know, I don't know if it's because I didn't practice enough, but it just wasn't, I just didn't lock into playing the guitar. And a friend of my dad's played harmonica and gave me one as a kid. So I always, you know, had it close. You know, I was always interested in the thing. And I saw, I went to this club called the Rubioff, which was that little folk club in Dallas, and saw Donnie Brooks play harmonica. And it's the first time I'd seen a harmonica player in person. And he was such a brilliant player and just, just blew me away. And that's when I, you know, after I saw him play, I was like, It's like, okay, this is what I want to do.

SPEAKER_00: 3:39

So was that the first harmonica playing you heard? It was really the

SPEAKER_02: 3:42

first harmonica player that I got into because it was in that he was playing in that folk scene in Dallas and playing on some Jerry Jeff Walker records. And he ended up going on to play with Whitewood, which kind of brought me into the country world, you know, when I was following Johnny's career.

UNKNOWN: 4:03

¶¶

SPEAKER_01: 4:08

You

SPEAKER_00: 4:12

heard some Donnie Brooks. I think he showed you a few things.

SPEAKER_02: 4:15

Yeah, I met him and told him I was interested in playing the harmonica, and I'd been playing a little bit back then. And he sat me down outside this little club and showed me a pentatonic scale, I think, on the harmonica, just how the notes were laid out, and it was really the basics for everything that I play now.

SPEAKER_00: 4:35

Were you listening to the sort of British blues boom before then, or did you pick up on that after you started playing the harmonica?

SPEAKER_02: 4:42

No, I think it was about around the mid-60s. You know, what Brian Jones was playing or Jagger was playing with the Stones, John Mayall, again, Duster Bennett. And then the American groups were like Canned Heat. So this is all late 60s. Canned Heat, 11 Spoonful, you know, John Sebastian, Neil Young, Bob Dylan. These were the guys. And then when I got into a little more blues feel, it was the acoustic guys. You know, it was Slim Harpo.

SPEAKER_03: 5:13

And

SPEAKER_02: 5:27

Sonny Boy Williamson. You know, before I got into, you know, the Chicago style, Little Walter. You know, my blues, my first blues records were Segal Schwall Band, Canned Heat. And then, you know, I loved the acoustic blues. And Paul Butterfield, who I met later in life, sort of became my mentor. But, you know, Butter was always one of my favorite part players for tone and phrasing. I was fortunate enough to spend a little time

SPEAKER_00: 5:54

with him. Yeah, so what was he like then? I haven't really talked to anybody who's had direct contact with him on here. You know, he was an

SPEAKER_02: 6:01

interesting guy. He was very sweet to me. But I knew him for a year and never even told him I was a harmonica player. You know, he told me that all the young harp players, they want to duel him. It was always a competition. And he really kind of respected me that I didn't try to take him on, which, of course, was, you know, a no-brainer there. He kind of took me under his wing and he would show me stuff or he would just tell me, don't ever end a solo or a lick on that note. Don't ever use that note. He took me to see Norton Buffalo, who we both loved. He's such a great player. He took me to see Norton Buffalo, and Norton would play that solo on Runaway, and he'd use four or five harmonicas on the solo. And Butter would listen to it, and he leaned over to me and says, I can show you how to play that on one harmonica. You know, there was a little competition there always with Paul, but he was, you know, I got his respect because I didn't try to challenge him, which at least he felt that everybody was doing.

SPEAKER_00: 7:26

Okay, so yeah, so moving on then. So you played around Dallas and you played with B.W. Stevenson. Was that your first band?

SPEAKER_02: 7:35

Well, I played with a guy named Mike Ames, who... You know, played kind of our flat picking Doc Watson style guitar. And we had a little jug band and would play in some of the clubs in Dallas. And then I got with B.W. Stevenson and he had a record deal. He was on RCA. So the first record I made was with B.W. And we toured across the country in a van, you know, played a lot of clubs.

UNKNOWN: 8:05

And.

SPEAKER_00: 8:17

Yeah, so when you were playing with B.W. Stevenson, were you then starting to play more country style? I had a little listen to him. He's got quite a country feel about him, hasn't he?

SPEAKER_02: 8:28

Yeah, that's, I think, when I was listening to, started listening a lot to Charlie, what he was doing. I wasn't really into the actual country music per se, but I loved, but Charlie's harmonica playing was, you know, impeccable. And the stuff he did with George Jones or with Roy Orbison, you know, that's, I was just listening to how he was, you know, his phrasing and his tone and how he approached the songs. That was my schooling at that point. And Donny Brooks, I think, were my, those were my biggest influence There were many. Jimmy Fadden from the Nitty Gritty Dirt Band. I would listen to him play.

SPEAKER_00: 9:05

Yeah, Charlie McCoy seemed to have been very influential with lots of players, certainly in the non-blues style. So then you met, as you say, in 1973, you met with Willie Nelson at a Texas University party where you had a jam with him.

SPEAKER_02: 9:20

Yes. Daryl Royal, who is the coach of the UT football team, was a friend of Willie's and a real patron of the arts and had a little pick-and-session in his hotel after one of the ballgames and had invited me over and bring my harmonicas. And Willie was there, and they just kind of passed the guitar around between a couple of singers and sang songs, and I just played along. And then afterwards, Willie said, hey, if you ever hear we're playing anywhere, come sit in with the band. That's basically what I did. I found him later several weeks and was sitting in with him, and I knew none of his songs. I'd heard Nightlife and Funny How Time Sits Away, but I wasn't really familiar with his catalog and the country music as a whole. The first gig that I played with him or sat in with him was basically a dance or it's a benefit for a volunteer fire department in a high school gymnasium. And we played that song Fraulein four times because it's a great two-stepping song. It's a great, people love to dance to it. So, and I just didn't know these songs. I mean, I could play along with them, you know, because I could hear the changes, but it wasn't something that I had as a background where all these standard, you know, country standard. So kind of had to do a crash course in what country music was about.

SPEAKER_00: 10:35

But so how did you approach that then? You were used to playing, I guess, folk music, some blues, some acoustic blues. Was it a big move away from that style of playing?

SPEAKER_02: 10:44

Not really. No, not musically. It wasn't much different. It's just that I didn't really know these melodies. And after you hear one verse, you know, you've got it basically. And with a young player, you're playing way too much. So I learned with him just to sit back and listen and you know, hear the song, and it doesn't take you long to figure it out, and then play when it's appropriate. Stay away from the vocal. You know, you don't have to play the whole time, which, you know, a lot of young harp players are pretty much guilty of, myself included. With Willie, I learned to listen and listen to him, listen to the other players, and just pick and choose your spots because it's not like, you know, that somebody's saying, okay, play here, don't play here. Willie kind of left it up to the band to orchestrate the songs ourselves. And, you know, you have to be respectful of others, not talk while somebody else is talking.

SPEAKER_00: 11:36

Yeah, it's an interesting approach. You know, I listened to a lot of your music over the last week or so that, you know, you play quite sparingly and then you've got a solo, but not always a solo in the country music. So, you know, is that the approach of country or just the way that Willie wanted it?

SPEAKER_02: 11:49

Well, it was kind of the approach to country overall is that the lyric is the most important thing. And with Willie, that's definitely so. And also Trigger, his guitar. He's one of these guys that would take a solo or he'd share a solo with you or give you the solo. You know, he was very gracious. But just don't play when the singer's singing. I mean, that could be the best advice I could tell anybody.

SPEAKER_00: 12:11

So I think when you started playing with Willie, he wasn't a household name, was he? He wasn't particularly famous at that point, was he? No. No, we were playing,

SPEAKER_02: 12:19

you know, country-western joints. He was just getting known by young people, you know, and this is the late 60s, early 70s, and the Vietnam War was still going on, and so you had your hippie types and your rednecks, but his music, when he moved back to Texas, brought those two factions together, and everybody got along, you know, and Willie saw something there. He saw how the music could have people with two different political views and social views and get along with each other.

SPEAKER_00: 12:51

Is it right that when you joined, a lap steel guitar player just left the band, so you sort of replaced him?

SPEAKER_02: 12:58

Yeah, Jimmy Day was playing pedal steel. He left the band, and Willie wasn't going to replace him with another pedal steel player. I was starting to sit in with the band at that time. You know, I kind of fell into the other solo spot, solo being... Like Willie's guitar was always first. And then Bobby, Willie's sister, when she played with us, she was a soloist, also a rhythm player on piano. But then I became a soloist. So instead of replacing Jimmy with another steel player, Willie just threw that chair to me.

SPEAKER_00: 13:29

Was there anything particularly you think that Willie liked about the harmonica as part of the band?

SPEAKER_02: 13:34

Yeah, I think he liked the sound of it. And nobody was doing it other than Waylon. Donnie Brooks was playing with Waylon. So I guess... You know, Willie thought it was safe to have a harmonica player in the band. Nobody was doing it that had a player that just played harmonica. And then Donnie didn't stay with Waylon that long. Donnie left Waylon, I think, the first year that I was playing with Willie. And then I went out with Waylon for a summer because Waylon's music just fit harmonica so well. And Donnie had really made some nice contributions to Waylon's music. And when Donnie left, I kind of killed in his spot for a little while because Willie was taking the summer off of 73. And then decided to go back to work, you know, go back on tour. So I left Wayland and went back with Willie.

SPEAKER_00: 14:16

Yeah, so I think Willie Nelson had his big break in 1975 when he released the Red-Headed Stranger album, which, of course, you appeared on, yeah.

UNKNOWN: 14:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 14:46

So was that the start of things really taking off with him?

SPEAKER_02: 14:50

It hadn't really taken off

SPEAKER_00: 14:52

yet.

SPEAKER_02: 14:52

But yeah, Red Headed Stranger was the first record that I played with Willie. And then after that came out, I mean, we were starting to get some interest. And after that came out, things started really picking up and we started maybe playing more bigger clubs or some small, you know, theaters. And then when Stardust came out later in the 70s, it got, you know, a lot of critical acclaim too and really helped. And then Willie started doing movies. So Honeysuckle Rose really boosted his appeal.

SPEAKER_00: 15:23

Yeah. Did you

SPEAKER_02: 15:23

appear in that movie yourself? I did. I was in both the movies, Honeysuckle Rose and Songwriter. And just appeared as, you know, Willie... had a band his character had a band so the band played themselves basically great so you got acting to your

SPEAKER_00: 15:39

credits as well

SPEAKER_02: 15:40

yeah sort of it wasn't something i was really loving or comfortable with but yeah you can go back and watch those films and it's pretty funny but we're really just playing ourselves and there's a lot of good music in those movies and i mean that's where on the road again came from so

SPEAKER_00: 16:13

So I haven't seen the movies. I haven't had a chance to check them out. So were they, is it kind of like a documentary on following the band or is it a fictional?

SPEAKER_02: 16:20

No, it's totally fictional. It was about a, it was a love story of a philandering country singer. You know, there was a lot of touring and a lot of road jinx. And, you know, we just played ourselves and played a lot of music in the movie.

SPEAKER_00: 16:36

So this was the start of you then having a great, successful time touring with Willie, which you've done for getting on for 40 years now, I guess, more than that, is it? As you're starting in the mid-70s when you started your touring schedule with him.

SPEAKER_02: 16:50

Yeah, 46 years, maybe 47 years. Started in 73.

SPEAKER_00: 16:54

Wow. So I guess you played in lots and lots of countries, lots and lots of big venues. Any particular big venues that you're a favorite?

SPEAKER_02: 17:05

You know, we played, well, it wasn't that big a venue, but, oh, well, we played Shepherd's Bush, which I loved. But I think my favorite, if I had to pick one in the world,

SPEAKER_00: 17:15

would be Royal Albert Hall. Excellent. Yeah, I was just talking to Jerry Porno, and he played at Royal Albert Hall, coincidentally, with Eric Clapton. So, yeah, what drew you to, what was the event at the Royal Albert Hall?

SPEAKER_02: 17:27

Just a Willie concert. We played there with Willie, you know, with Willie three or four times. We used to come over for the big country festival at Wembley. You know, then that was a big package show with lots of bands. But then when Willie was able to fill a theater himself, I think we played two or three times. But it was just such an iconic venue and such a great sound in there. And the audiences were great. I mean, there are a lot of great venues in the world, but if I had to pick one, that was the most exciting place. I like the way the stage is set up almost out in the audience. It's not in the round, but you're very open to the audience.

SPEAKER_00: 18:04

Lots of iconic recordings, playing with Willie Crazy, of course, is one of his famous songs. Listening to some of the albums, you seem to get more freedom on the live albums to play and to do solos. So what was that difference between playing the studio recordings and the live albums with Willie and how much space you got to play?

SPEAKER_02: 18:23

Well, the live was, I think, not as structured as you are in the studio. Because the studio stuff, albums, you know, you can stretch out more in a live situation. For the studio albums, you know, you're playing on a song, and it's a three-minute song, and there's not four solos. And again, the harmonic has to serve the song. It's not Mickey and Willie. It's called Willie Nelson's record. You have to play what fits the song. So you're a little more limited, I think.

SPEAKER_00: 18:53

Yeah, and for example, I think the studio recording of Crazy, you don't play on yet, but there's certainly some live recording of you playing on that.

SPEAKER_03: 19:08

Yeah, I

SPEAKER_02: 19:12

mean, Crazy, that was done before I was in the band. And that's really a song that I don't play on that much anyway.

SPEAKER_00: 19:20

Is there any particular decision or discussion about which songs you do or don't play? Because again, it's interesting talking as a harmonica player and the harmonica player is listening about that decision process and where the harmonica does fit.

SPEAKER_02: 19:32

Now when we're making a record, like we're working on a Sinatra tribute, the second one that he's doing. And again, you know, the harmonica has to fit the song. And they sent me 10 songs and I didn't hear harmonica on all of them. You know, they were fine like they were. I mean, I played on That's Life. I thought there was a, you know, the harmonica fit there. And a song called We Small Hours of the Morning, played the solo on that. But it's just, you know, there's some strings on it, and it's, again, you have to serve the song, and the lyric is the most important thing. You know, you

SPEAKER_00: 20:05

just have to play what fits. So are you recording that against the tracks they've laid down, early tracks, or is this different versions?

SPEAKER_02: 20:13

I think they cut the rhythm tracks in L.A. with some L.A. guys, and then they bring them to me in Nashville, and I do my part, and then they go to Willie in Austin and put his vocal on.

SPEAKER_00: 20:23

Is that how you'd normally record now, you know, sort of remotely, or is that just due to the current situation?

SPEAKER_02: 20:28

No, I think it's just due to the current situation. And I mean, we're also working on another record of original songs that, you know, that are covers that Willie's doing. You know, it's more of a country record. And since Willie's not traveling out of Austin right now, we cut most of the tracks here with the studio band live. So I was in cutting with the band at that point. You know, if I was on the road, you know, we tour a lot, and they were cutting tracks for that record, and I wasn't able to be there physically, I would, when I got back to Nashville, I would go in the studio and do my part.

SPEAKER_00: 21:02

And Willie, you know, you do quite a different range of genres, don't you? I mean, you certainly do a bit of blues, don't you? There's a Milk Cow Blues song, which is probably a full-on blues song, yes?

UNKNOWN: 21:12

Yes.

SPEAKER_00: 21:27

you get quite a lot of scope to play different genres with uh with willie as well do you

SPEAKER_02: 21:37

yeah i mean he's all over the place as far as genres go i mean he just i just say he plays good music you know i can't even put a label on it yeah i have to kind of be a uh a jack of all trades and a master of none You know, we do a couple of blues songs. I mean, Nightlife is a blues tune. But it's not like, you know, the whole set is that we'll do some western swing and just some kind of ballads and genre. It's all over the place. Willie just plays the music that he likes.

SPEAKER_00: 22:06

Yeah, and another one is well associated with, of course, is Rare Charles. He did the tribute album with Wynton Marsalis.

SPEAKER_02: 22:13

Yeah, that was one of my favorites, playing with Wynton's band and doing those songs. And with having Nora Jones, you know, singing with Willie on that. That was a live record.

SPEAKER_00: 22:34

You know, again, an interesting fusion, isn't it, with Willie playing, you know, in the sort of jazz setting there as well.

SPEAKER_02: 22:40

Yeah, we get to play out a little more too. You know, the solos, you didn't just take one verse as a solo. Wynton would say, play more, play more. And I'd say, well, how long do I play? And he goes, you get tired of playing.

SPEAKER_00: 22:52

Yeah, that's jazz for you, isn't it? 15-minute solos, that's what we like to hear. So yeah, brilliant. And of course, that association with Ray Charles, and you played at Ray Charles' funeral, didn't you?

SPEAKER_02: 23:02

Yes, that was pretty amazing. Willie, myself, and Jim Cox, who was a keyboard player, we did Georgia at his funeral. And I think that's where we met Wynton, because Wynton was there playing his trumpet. And Stevie Wonder was there, and Quincy Jones, and Little Richard. The audience was the people in the church that came to pay their respects at that funeral. It was pretty iconic. And besides being as upsetting as it was to play with an open casket, Just seeing Stevie Wonder in the front row was a pretty

SPEAKER_00: 23:37

harrowing experience. Did Willie or yourself know Race Charles? Is that how that came about?

SPEAKER_02: 23:44

Yeah, Willie did. Willie had played some music with him and they'd get together and play chess. They were big chess players.

SPEAKER_00: 23:53

So we're moving a little bit from Willie now, I'll just go back to him, we'll touch back on some, but you play with lots of people. So you play with Emmylou Harris through the 70s as well and did a few recordings on a few of her albums. So I think the first one in 1975, Elite Hotel. Yeah. So during the time playing with Willie, were you also quite, you know, you're doing session work with quite a lot of people as well?

SPEAKER_02: 24:15

Yeah, I love playing with different people, and it really keeps my chops up. So I was playing on Emmy's records and going out to L.A. every couple of months to record with her. And so I ended up getting an apartment in L.A. just for a change, just to get out of Texas. for a little bit. Emmylou is very gracious and I love working with her and her husband slash producer, Brian Ahern, who was just great in the studio and really knew how to get a good performance and a good sound out of the harmonica and a lot of the stuff that I played on, I recorded. The studio was in a mobile truck outside her house in Beverly Hills, this big kind of sprawling ranch style house and a mobile truck outside and they recorded it in the house. So they set me up with a microphone and a shower in one of the bathrooms. So that's all the Emmylou stuff was done, you know, in a shower stall. And that's where we actually came out and Willie recorded Stardust in that house. Did you record in the shower then as well? I did. That's the only place I've recorded at that house. And it's just real great ambience in there. And I mean, whatever you hear, the harmonica is pretty much, you know, a natural sound. I mean, I used an Electro-Voice RE-20 microphone. You know, it was a small shower.

SPEAKER_00: 25:46

Yeah, so you played with Emmylou and also with Willie. In 1985, they formed the Highwayman Supergroup with Willie Nelson, Johnny Cash, Waylon Jennings and Chris Christopherson. So you played some tracks with those guys as well.

SPEAKER_02: 26:01

Yeah, we did a record in Nashville with those guys. And then that's really all they had planned to do was just an album together. And it went over so well, they thought maybe we should tour. Let's put a band together. And they were lucky enough to get the studio, the same guys, everybody that played on tour played on the record. And that was the rule, too. If you didn't play it on the record, don't play it live. So there was no jamming going on. But we just reproduced the record in a live version. We did three or four world tours.

SPEAKER_00: 26:30

Some real giants there at Country Music. And Johnny Cash, of course, what was he like to work with?

SPEAKER_02: 26:35

He was great. I mean, he was still intimidating to me. He's bigger than life. But he was just one of the sweetest guys on the planet. And every night he would do Orange Bosom Special and play a little harmonica, which is not my forte. I mean, I'm not a real fast harmonica player. He would do it and then he would kind of throw it to me to play with him. And then he would start getting faster and faster. I mean, I played it, but I didn't really, I don't know if I played it right. I pulled it off enough, but it definitely wasn't virtuoso like a Charlie McCoy moment at all. But Johnny did play a little harmonica and would just kind of start off the song and then throw it to me. So he couldn't play the whole Orange Blossom Special and Harmonica? No, but I think he would do it just to make me uncomfortable, just to mess with... Chris would joke with Waylon and Johnny would joke with Chris and Willie would be the guys trying to stir everybody up.

SPEAKER_00: 27:29

Yeah, so great. Playing in that big country super group must have been a great experience too. And then you did a solo album in 1988 called Hand to Mouth.

SPEAKER_02: 27:38

Yeah, that was, I was just hanging out with some guys. Well, I was actually playing I did a record with Ben Keith, who is a wonderful steel player, pedal steel, and he played with Neil Young for many, many years. He did a little instrumental record, and I went to play on it, and the guys that did it asked me to do one. So I did, and I just sat with my friend who was a keyboard player, and we just made up songs, just turned on the tape machine, and just kind of wrote Stream of Consciousness instrumentals. At that time, I was hanging out with Paul with Butterfield, And he came by the studio one day. So the last song, which I call Hand to Mouth, was him just dropping in and us having just a little jam session together.

SPEAKER_00: 28:20

Oh, that's right. I was going to ask because I noticed there were two harmonica players on there. Sorry, two harmonicas. I was wondering if it was you who had recorded the two harmonicas.

SPEAKER_02: 28:27

No, it was me and Paul. I'm the first harmonica player, and Paul is answering me. That was a one-take thing just between me and Paul. It might have been the last recording he'd ever done, too.

UNKNOWN: 28:45

Bye.

SPEAKER_00: 29:12

And yeah, you've got quite a mixture of songs on there as well. You've got Asia Minor and Mexico Co. So you've got a few different styles and genres on there as well.

SPEAKER_02: 29:21

Yeah, we just, well, we wrote these songs and then tiled them later, you know, because again, it was just a lot of these songs, like The Search is one take. We didn't figure out what we're doing beforehand. That's why I call it The Search, because I was just searching for the next chord. But I had a good rapport with Gene Rabbi, is the guy's name, was the keyboard player. And we just sat in the room together with eye contact and just played together. These songs were just kind of crafted on the spot. And then I did Somewhere Over the Rainbow, which obviously I did not write, but it's a song that I love the melody and

SPEAKER_00: 29:58

I love playing. Yeah, and you did that with If I Only Had a Brain, didn't you, sort of medley?

SPEAKER_02: 30:03

Yeah, that was kind of the intro.

UNKNOWN: 30:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 30:26

So, yeah, that's your solo album, I think, reissued in the year 2000, right, as well. And then there's another album under your name, which is Red River Valley, which is this kind of country instrumental song as well, albums, right?

SPEAKER_02: 30:40

Yeah, I mean, that wasn't really my record. I mean, that was Cracker Barrel, which is a big chain of restaurants in the U.S. that have a store connected with them. that sell all kinds of souvenirs and music, a lot of instrumental country music. And they had just contacted me and said, we're going to do a harmonica record. Will you do it? And I said, yes, but it's not a Mickey Raphael record. We'll just call it harmonica, and I'll just be another player on the record. And I mean, they had all the songs picked out. So I really had no creative input other than just they wanted these songs played. Just play the melody and don't stray from the melody. So it was kind of crafted. You know, it's funny because if you Google my name, that comes up. But it's really not a representation of what I it's a representation of what I can be hired to do. I had no creative input.

SPEAKER_00: 31:33

Yeah, I mean, it's nice, isn't it, from the point of view? It's all those kind of very well-known melodies, You Are My Sunshine and these sorts of songs. And it's nice playing, but yeah, it's all very, like you say, almost kind of background music, that sort of style, isn't it? So it's nice, nice stuff, yeah. Zoom forward to 2015, you had a big album with Chris Stapleton.

SPEAKER_02: 32:08

Yeah, I was lucky enough to play on that record, Traveler. And then when I'm not with Willie, I tour with him live. I was able to do... Probably 20 dates a year with Chris and his band. I'm on a couple of the records. He's got a new record that I'm not on. I'll still tour with him next year, I think, if the schedule allows.

SPEAKER_00: 32:41

And you played with all sorts of other big names, you know, Elton John and U2 and Bob Dylan and Ringo Starr even, I think you played with.

SPEAKER_02: 32:49

Yeah, well, Willie did a duet, you know, sang with one of his songs and Ringo had me play harmonica, which was great, great fun. He's just a sweet guy and one of my favorite drummers

SPEAKER_00: 33:00

too. So of all these names, I mean, any particular recordings you pick out or any memories from playing with all the different people you played with?

SPEAKER_02: 33:08

Well, I love everything I played with, you know, with Stapleton, You know, Wynton Marsalis was so much fun to play with. I've just been very fortunate. Kenny Chesney, all the Emmylou stuff. Oh, I'm on a new Sheryl Crow record. She did a duet with Willie, and they just released a video of it. It's called Lonely Alone. For the video, I recorded my part here, you know, at my house in Nashville. Filmed it with the iPhone, and... And, you know, they sent me the stems, they sent me the tracks, and I just, I re-recorded my harmonica live, you know, for the video and they cut it together. But, you know, because of COVID-19, nobody's in the room together playing. But it's one of my, that's one of my favorite new songs that I've played on.

SPEAKER_00: 33:55

Great stuff, yeah. So a great long list and played with so many people and fantastic. A couple of notable things as well. I believe you met Miles Davis at one point and he even played your harmonica.

SPEAKER_02: 34:07

Yeah, I did. I was able to meet Miles. Willie's manager, Mark Rothbaum, also managed Miles. And Miles was a friend and a fan of Willie's. So he came to, we were playing in Vegas at Cedars Palace, and he spent a couple of weeks, we were there for two or three weeks, and he spent a week out there just hanging out with us and sitting on the side of the stage every night. on my side of the stage, which is a little unnerving. I mean, I'd spent a lot of time with him, so I knew him, but he still was such an icon. You know, I had so much respect for him. I had to really be on my toes with him on the side of the stage. And one night he came out, just walked out after the show, came out and picked up one of my harmonicas and said, you know, how do you play this thing? He just started kind of blowing on it and checking it out. And somebody came by with a camera and was able to snap a picture of Miles and I kind of cheek to cheek with both harmonicas in our mouths. Brilliant. And did Miles

SPEAKER_00: 35:04

get a good sound out of the harmonica?

SPEAKER_02: 35:06

About as good a sound as I would have out of a trumpet.

SPEAKER_00: 35:10

Probably better. Trumpets are hard to play, aren't they, when you haven't played them before? Yeah, very hard to get a sound out of those things to begin with. But yeah, fantastic. Yeah, so Miles Davis, great. And also, I believe you helped inspire the formation of the Blues Brothers, even.

SPEAKER_02: 35:27

That's what I hear. Yeah, we would do Saturday Night Live. We did it maybe once or twice a year, you know, when they were first starting out. And after the show, we would go to the—or after rehearsals, we'd go to a club in New York called Lone Star Cafe. And Belushi would come with us and— Danny, Danny Aykroyd and Bill Murray and Gilda Redner and whoever else in the cast, you know, at the time was there, but we'd go sit in with Willie, you know, the whole band would go and play. And then, uh, Belushi and Danny Aykroyd would come up and, uh, and do their songs. And they, you know, they would just practice, you know, some of the blues and stuff that, uh, that we started playing with them. And, uh, Bill Murray would sing too. That's what I hear. Dan said that that was, you know, kind of, they got the idea or, you know, the, uh, The idea of doing a band, you know, from sitting in with us, but there were such music lovers. And I think Belushi had a little bar, a little private bar in Chicago where we would go after our concerts there. You know, he would just open it up for us and whatever, you know, guests we had. And we would just play, which really was, Willie was really keen on is after a concert, we'd go find a club or something like that, just to jam. And so we spent a lot of time with John Belushi and Danny Aykroyd just playing some blues. And he gave Willie a chance to really stretch out too.

SPEAKER_00: 36:50

Yeah, it's interesting. I was, well, the Blues Brothers, I liked those a lot when I was younger. And, you know, they helped get a lot of interest in the blues music for people who, I mean, I was into blues then, but when they came along, they were great. And Danny Aykroyd is a pretty good harmonica player, certainly did a good job. Was he playing harmonica at that point?

SPEAKER_02: 37:07

I don't think he was playing the harmonica that much. I remember having a night out in New York with Butterfield. We all went to the Hard Rock after our show and Danny was there and we tried to get him to play, but he wouldn't play. But yeah, he can definitely hold his own, you know, on the harmonica.

SPEAKER_00: 37:26

So you think he, so did he start learning harmonica really for the sort of Blues Brothers act that they started doing on Saturday Night Live?

SPEAKER_02: 37:32

Yeah, I think he probably took it a little more serious then. I mean, I'm sure he was playing for a while before all that. But this was also an outlet for him. And he might have played a little bit when we were jamming at the Lone Star Cafe.

SPEAKER_00: 37:46

You obviously live in Nashville now. So at what point did you move to Nashville? Any particular involvement? Was it for the music scene particularly that you moved across to there?

SPEAKER_02: 37:54

No, I was in L.A. for a while. And the 96 earthquake happened. and kind of got my attention. And I thought, okay, it's time to make a change. And as soon as the airport opened a couple of days after the earthquake, I flew to Nashville to find a place here and moved. It was either going to be L.A., New York, or Nashville because I wanted to be by some kind of studio scene, and Nashville was the obvious choice. I really hadn't spent that much time here other than just coming with Willie and playing or recording. But it was a great move, and I'm glad I did. So I came here in 96.

SPEAKER_00: 38:36

Yeah, I think you're the third Nashville resident to have on here. I had Charlie McCoy, of course, and Petey Gazelle also lives in Nashville. So yeah, it's obviously a music town.

SPEAKER_02: 38:44

And Charlie's great. I mean, Charlie's been so supportive of me and other harmonica players when they're starting out. And I even got to play on one of his records, which was quite exciting. He did a cover of City of New Orleans. And I do this train rhythm that I actually picked up from Donnie Brooks. And so he wanted me to play it while he took, you know, the solo, you know, because he does those instrumentals. He took the solo, and then he let me play, let me fill one verse, which was very gracious of him. But, you know, it's a little scary being in the studio with him, playing, you know, with him listening. But I tell you, I watched every move he made when he played, too, how he worked the microphone. You know, I was trying to make a big deal of it, but he just plays. It's not rocket science, you know, but he's such a good player and such a natural. how close he was to the mic, how he stood, how he held it in his hands.

SPEAKER_00: 39:59

Do you do any teaching at all? I've seen that you've got some involvement with this kind of harmonica for lung health. Is that something you've been involved with?

SPEAKER_02: 40:07

Well, we started doing that. It never really amounted to much. We thought, I was working with some guys at the Mayo Clinic in Rochester, Minnesota, because they thought that maybe the harmonica would be good for breathing to strengthen the I mean, the in and out, exhale and inhale would help strengthen the lungs for COPD patients. We know it does. I mean, it helps patients, but we didn't get the scientific proof, you know, the actual hard data. So it's still kind of in the works, but I'm not really doing anything yet. And when I do, it'll be just more of a cheerleader or motivator. I'm not a teacher. I don't know enough to teach. I'm not patient enough to teach. What I can teach you is when not to play, not what to play. So I think that's my strong point. So I would never try to teach. There's so much great stuff online with, you know, Dennis Grueling or, I mean, there's so many, Jason Ritchie. I mean, there's so many great teachers out there.

SPEAKER_00: 41:13

Going back to the country style of harmonica, which obviously you're synonymous with now, although you do play lots of different styles. Anything particularly about the country style? Are you using a particular scale? Are you using a pentatonic scale? What's your approach to playing country harmonica?

SPEAKER_02: 41:29

I use a diatonic harmonica. I just approach it melodically. I try to stay close to the melody. Try to complement the melody. Keep it simple. Willie always stressed, less is more. You have to read the song, and it's just kind of, you have to play what fits the song, not throw out every lick that you know for the tune. I mean, sometimes it might just be one or two notes that just add some coloring.

SPEAKER_00: 41:57

Yeah, it's interesting, and Excellent advice for people listening. I think, you know, the harmonic is an instrument where you feel, you know, you do have to play, you know, you have to have some wow solo. But like you were saying there, you know, the approaches serve you so well is, you know, making it fit with the song, you know, making it melodic, you know, and not kind of going for wow solos all the time. Is that, you know, definitely how you've approached it?

SPEAKER_02: 42:18

Yeah, and especially if it's asked for. I mean, I played on Miley Cruz smoking in the boys' room. And that's kind of an aggressive solo. But then also on Blue Eyes Crying in the Rain, I played the echo harp, that double reed harp that Hohner makes that's like the notes are tuned in octaves. It sounds almost like a concertina. So harmonica solo is not going to fit on Blue Eyes Crying in the Rain. They really just want or I only heard the harmonica as a pad. to just laying under the vocal or under Willie's guitar, and it's very, very sparse.

SPEAKER_00: 43:10

And when you're playing, what position are you normally playing in?

SPEAKER_02: 43:14

Mostly second position, but a little third position, and I'm just kind of experimenting with first too now. It's kind of just for a pad. I mean, I'm not playing the Jimmy Reed kind of first position. I'm really liking a few things in first position because I've been working on a couple of movie scores and doing cues, And these cues are maybe no more than 30 seconds long. And there's dialogue over them. So you've got to kind of have to play between the words and just they want the harmonica for coloring, not solos.

SPEAKER_00: 43:47

So when you're playing, you say predominantly you probably played second position, but a third. Are you playing country tuning there to get that major seventh?

SPEAKER_02: 43:55

No, I'm playing just the regular diatonics. I mean, if I need to, I mean, I have a set of country tuned harps. But mostly I'll just play the regular diatonic setup.

SPEAKER_00: 44:07

And what about chromatic harmonica? I believe you're playing a bit of chromatic harmonica on this Sinatra album that Willie Nelson is recording at the moment.

SPEAKER_02: 44:14

Very little, very little chromatic. But yes, the solo I had to write out on one of the songs that the chromatic really fit well. And Matt Rollins, who is co-producing the Sinatra record, There are certain things, because I have strings, he orchestrated the strings, there are certain lines that he wanted specifically. So he wrote them out, and they just fit better and play better on a chromatic.

SPEAKER_00: 44:43

So have you played much chromatic before? Are you quite familiar?

SPEAKER_02: 44:47

No, not at all. I haven't. There's one song, the live show with Willie, that I play chromatic, but it's in the key of G, and I use a C chromatic. And I'm not a great reader, I play it if I need to, and if the piece is written out and I have time to learn it beforehand. I would never say that I was a chromatic player, but it's part of my arsenal. It's just like bass harmonica, which I've played on a lot of stuff, but I'm not so prolific.

SPEAKER_00: 45:13

Yeah, so when you choose the chromatic, is that then for the sound of the chromatic, or is it more to get all the notes that you need to play the written part?

SPEAKER_02: 45:22

Both, if the notes aren't on the diatonic harmonica, I'll go to a chromatic, but I also like the tone. So if the song, you know, if it's maybe a horn line or something I want to play, then have the, you know, the harmonica really, you know, kind of stand out as such a different tone. You know, so it's both. It's for tone and just versatility of the chromatic.

SPEAKER_00: 45:45

And you mentioned the bass harmonica there. Yes, I think you play... I've seen quite a lot of credits with bass harmonica with you. It seems to be quite a popular choice for you.

SPEAKER_02: 45:53

Yeah. Some people really like it. Some producers, you know, and they'll have a specific idea where they want the bass harmonica. On the Emmylou Harris and Rodney Crowe song called Bluebird Wine.

UNKNOWN: 46:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 46:22

I played just a rhythm thing on bass harmonica. And I got to tell you, I did take a couple of lessons from Rob Paparazzi, and he's such a brilliant player. And in one lesson, he gave me enough stuff to learn for the rest of my life, really. This is on the bass harmonica, is it? No, it's on chromatic. Yeah, and he does teach. He's a great source of knowledge.

SPEAKER_00: 46:48

I helped organize a chromatic weekend here in the UK in July, and Rob was one of the teachers on that. Yeah, no, Rob. And Rob writes for the Harmonica magazine in the UK as well, who he did do. Yeah, yes, Rob's a great guy. And of course, the Blues Brothers link too. Joe comes over a lot, doesn't he?

SPEAKER_02: 47:05

Joe Flisco comes over, yeah. He's brilliant. He's really customized my harmonica, you know, does my custom harmonicas, and I've been playing his harps, Toner harps, for a while. So I'm

SPEAKER_00: 47:17

a big fan of his. Are you still using those? I am. Everyone seems to use his harps. He's got some magic with those harps, doesn't he? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, I had

SPEAKER_02: 47:26

some. Actually, Donny Brooks turned me on to him. I don't know how long, 20 years maybe. As long as he's been doing it, I've been using his harmonicas.

SPEAKER_00: 47:35

The question I ask each time, Mickey, is if you had 10 minutes to practice, what would you spend those 10 minutes doing?

SPEAKER_02: 47:41

You know, I would put on a record. I put on Jimmy Reed the other day. or Jimmy Reed and Big Walter Horton. There were a couple albums I liked and just play along because we're not playing that. We're not touring right now. So I've just got to keep my chops up. And even though I don't play the blues in my day job, you know, it's a great exercise and it's great. You know, it's just, you know, fun stuff to play. So those were actually the last two records that I played on. Oh, and Traveler and the Chris Stapleton record because I've kind of, you know, we'll tour next year with him. And I've got to kind of remember what we're doing, you know, when I played on the record.

SPEAKER_00: 48:22

Yeah, so playing along with those records, as you say, keeping those muscles toned for playing and everything, yeah. Lots of ways that people learn, don't they, by playing along with records is one of the...

SPEAKER_02: 48:31

And Marcellus, the Ray Charles record is fun to play too because the solos stretch out a little more on that. So that's good exercise.

SPEAKER_00: 48:41

Turning to talking about gear now. So your favorite harmonica of choice is the Marine Band, yeah?

SPEAKER_02: 48:47

Yeah, the Marine Band or anything, you know, Hunter's come up with some great stuff. I love to record with the Rocket, which I use some live too, but I like the Marine Bands. I like the wooden combs, you know, or some of the custom combs. I basically started out playing the Marine Band, so that's what I gravitate to.

SPEAKER_00: 49:05

Which flavor of the Marine Band do you use these days?

SPEAKER_02: 49:08

You know, just the old, the 1896 or the Marine Band Deluxe or... What's the other one?

SPEAKER_00: 49:15

Crossover.

SPEAKER_02: 49:16

Yeah, yeah. Anything with a wooden comb, I love. Rocket is a great sounding harp too. And that's kind of an upgraded version of the Special 20.

SPEAKER_00: 49:24

Yeah, I have a Rocket and I really love it. And I don't usually, a bit like yourself, I sort of prefer the wooden combs, but I really love the Rocket. So it's sort of bigger holes, isn't it? It's quite loud and aggressive sort of sounding. It's great.

SPEAKER_02: 49:35

Yeah,

SPEAKER_00: 49:36

they record really well. And, you know, I like to take that into the studio. And do you have a favorite key of diatonic?

SPEAKER_02: 49:43

You know, I like playing a B-flat harp. I don't get to play, so that would put me in F. I don't get to use it that much, but it seems to, I love using that harmonica. And A, the key of A, so that would be a D harmonica.

SPEAKER_00: 50:03

Yeah, I noticed a few of your records I was playing with, there was a few on D harmonicas, Yeah, B-flats and A are the popular choices, answers to that question for sure. That range is great, isn't it? And what about different tunings? We've talked a little bit about you've got some country tunings and do you use other tunings?

SPEAKER_02: 50:24

Yeah, I've always used the country tuning. I like the natural minor tunings. You know, I love, Lee Oscar's a friend of mine. And even though I'm a honer, see, I love his tunings. I think he was the first one to come up with those natural minor tunings, I think. You know, I think he makes a great harmonica, but I love that. You know, I love what I started playing on. You know, I love the old school stuff. And I picked up, you know, like the Asia Band. Are you familiar with that one? Yeah, from Brendan. Brendan Power, yeah. Yeah, Brendan, anything. I love, you know, supporting the guys that are... just creating these off-brand things too. I've been loyal to Hohner, but I like to check everything out, everybody out.

SPEAKER_00: 51:08

I had Lee Oscar on the podcast, and yeah, he was great, wasn't he? So innovative with what he did. He really did push the boundaries of the harmonica and really sort of opened up that idea of different tunings, didn't he?

SPEAKER_02: 51:17

Yep. And so I still use some of his in my, you know, my road kit. But, you know, Hohner will tune harmonicas for me any way I want. But I've got a couple of these. Like when I play Georgia, I use a natural minor tuning. Yeah. I should get that major seven. So I could probably use a, you know, a country tune harmonica. But again, I was using Lee's harmonicas way back. I just got kind of a sample of the pentatonic tuning that that honer is doing. They're doing one with a pentatonic scale to try to appeal, I think, to guitar players, which I am not. So I've just been kind of messing around with it to see. I haven't recorded with it yet because I've really just got a test. So just kind of testing out the idea. But, you know, I like the natural minor tunings. And the country tunings, I think, are my favorite. And do you use

SPEAKER_00: 52:13

any overblows?

SPEAKER_02: 52:15

No, I really don't.

SPEAKER_00: 52:16

Well, hence the reason you turn to chromatic when you need it, too. And what embouchure do you use?

SPEAKER_02: 52:22

Pucker. I mean, I do a little tongue blocking, but if I'm playing single notes, I'll just pucker style or something, or not the tongue blocking. If I'm playing octaves, I'll definitely use the tongue blocking.

SPEAKER_00: 52:35

And talking about equipment now, what about amplifiers? What's your amplifier of choice?

SPEAKER_02: 52:40

I don't, you know, I love Fender amps, but I really don't play using amp on. I have an amp on stage, but it's not mic'd. It's really just for me. But what I do use, I use a ribbon, a Beyer M160 ribbon that actually Lee Oscar turned me on to. And I go to an AEA mic pre for the ribbon and then directly into the PA. But out of that pre, I'll take a line out of it and go into an amp on stage, but it's really just for me. But what you hear in the room, really just the Beyer M160 through a pre. And then as far as effects, with Stapleton, I'll use one of these Amog, kind of an overdrive and delay unit that's just like a stomp box. I just put a little delay on the harp. And a little of the overdrive signal. But mostly my sound is just, you know, I love just being able to walk up to any mic and being able to play acoustically. But I wanted the mobility of moving around the stage. So I'll use a handheld mic, but I'll use a nice ribbon. I use that at a buyer.

SPEAKER_00: 53:51

Yeah, it's interesting you should say about the M160. So I've always done a little bit of home recording, but this year I've really got into doing more. And I want to buy the M160. That's kind of on my ribbon list. So I'm very interested in getting that. So that one is the one for the harmonica, is it the M160?

SPEAKER_02: 54:08

Well, no, it's not. Made for a harmonica. I think it's made for, they use it for kick drum. Yeah, but I love it. It's very consistent. As fragile as ribbons are, I've dropped mine so many times and it's still sounding good after maybe 10 years.

SPEAKER_00: 54:22

Yeah, no, I've heard it works. I mean, I know it's not built for harmonica, but it works well with a harmonica because it sort of takes that high edge off, doesn't it? It has a nice warm sound to it. I haven't actually tried one, but yeah, I'm interested to get one of those at some point soon.

SPEAKER_02: 54:32

For my recording rig, I use a Royer 122, which is also a ribbon.

SPEAKER_00: 54:38

so yeah so as you say though so you're you're basically going for a clean sound you're playing through a PA you're using acoustic uh you know style microphones uh straight into the PA yeah with a little bit of effects as you say right I mean what about uh if you are playing a sort of a more bluesy tune or you want a blues a blues sound do you have any you know tube amps that you use at all

SPEAKER_02: 54:59

yeah I've got a you know a Fender a Princeton a Champ Fender's just come out with a really nice, it's actually a Chris Stapleton model. I can't remember if it's a Princeton or what it is, but it's, you know, I like any small Fender amp. And if I was in a big lab, I'd use a Vox

SPEAKER_00: 55:21

AC30. When you've got a concert then, would you normally have a tube amp to use on maybe one or two songs?

SPEAKER_02: 55:27

No, because I haven't really had the need for any of the bands that I play with. I'm still just going through the PA because I'm getting a nice fat sound through the mic pre, through the AEA mic pre.

SPEAKER_00: 55:40

Great. So final question then, what's your future plans now? Obviously, we're still in pandemic time. You're still hoping to get out touring next year and plenty lined up by the sounds of it?

SPEAKER_02: 55:50

Yeah, yeah. We've got a bunch of dates with Willie and a bunch of dates with Stapleton. Hopefully more records. I mean, we've got two records that are unfinished with Willie. I'm working on a film score right now. So, you know, I'm semi-busy and enjoying just being home for a change.

SPEAKER_00: 56:09

Yeah. So when is your touring schedule due to start at this point?

SPEAKER_02: 56:13

You know, guessing. I mean, we've got a couple of dates that are tentative in March, but we'll just have to see how the pandemic goes. goes, what's going on. You know, we want to keep Willie safe, so.

SPEAKER_00: 56:23

Yeah, sure, yeah. But hopefully you can get those going again. Are you, any plans to come over to Europe next year or anytime soon?

SPEAKER_02: 56:30

Not that I know of yet. You know, that's a hard trip for Willie and Willie's 88, Bobby is going to be 90 this year. Wow. We'll see. I mean, maybe we can just shoot over to the UK and just, you know, play and not do all of Europe. But there's no plans right now that I've heard of.

SPEAKER_00: 56:48

Well, hopefully you get over it. I'll come and see you for sure. So thanks very much for speaking to me today. Real pleasure. Thank you very much for having me. It was fun. That's it for today, folks. Final word from my sponsor, the Longwolf Blues Company, providing some great effects pedals and microphones, all purpose-built for the harmonica. Be sure to check out their website. Mickey, take us out with some of that sweet, natural minor harmonica.

SPEAKER_03: 57:51

Georgia.