{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Aaron Moncur","startTime":0.81,"endTime":4.02,"body":"The Being an"},{"speaker":"Aaron Moncur","startTime":0.81,"endTime":4.02,"body":"Engineer Podcast is a repository"},{"speaker":"Aaron Moncur","startTime":4.02,"endTime":7.11,"body":"for industry knowledge and a"},{"speaker":"Aaron Moncur","startTime":4.02,"endTime":7.11,"body":"tool through which engineers"},{"speaker":"Aaron Moncur","startTime":7.11,"endTime":9.72,"body":"learn about and connect with"},{"speaker":"Aaron Moncur","startTime":7.11,"endTime":9.72,"body":"relevant companies,"},{"speaker":"Aaron Moncur","startTime":9.75,"endTime":14.67,"body":"technologies, people, resources"},{"speaker":"Aaron Moncur","startTime":9.75,"endTime":14.67,"body":"and opportunities. Enjoy the"},{"speaker":"Aaron Moncur","startTime":14.67,"endTime":15.3,"body":"show."},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":29.43,"endTime":31.38,"body":"Wherever you may"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":29.43,"endTime":31.38,"body":"be, and however, you may be"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":31.38,"endTime":35.1,"body":"listening, welcome to The Being"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":31.38,"endTime":35.1,"body":"an Engineer Show with your"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":35.1,"endTime":40.53,"body":"co-host Rafael Testai, and my"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":35.1,"endTime":40.53,"body":"precious guest, Thomas Rinaldi."},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":40.98,"endTime":45.54,"body":"Thomas is actually the author of"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":40.98,"endTime":45.54,"body":"a book called Patented. And I'm"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":45.54,"endTime":48.54,"body":"going to let Thomas do an"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":45.54,"endTime":48.54,"body":"introduction of his book here."},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":48.72,"endTime":52.41,"body":"But this is right up your alley."},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":48.72,"endTime":52.41,"body":"If you're someone that likes"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":52.41,"endTime":56.37,"body":"design patents and wants to know"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":52.41,"endTime":56.37,"body":"more more about that subject. So"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":56.37,"endTime":59.46,"body":"Thomas, why don't you go ahead"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":56.37,"endTime":59.46,"body":"and take it away and explain to"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":59.46,"endTime":62.58,"body":"us what your book is, what is it"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":59.46,"endTime":62.58,"body":"about, and maybe do a little"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":62.58,"endTime":63.9,"body":"introduction of yourself?"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":64.53,"endTime":71.13,"body":"Ah, thanks. So"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":64.53,"endTime":71.13,"body":"Patented. My book is 1000 design"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":71.13,"endTime":77.07,"body":"patents. And it stems from a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":71.13,"endTime":77.07,"body":"discovery that was a discovery"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":77.07,"endTime":82.92,"body":"for me, for some people, maybe"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":77.07,"endTime":82.92,"body":"it's old hat. But the idea that"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":82.92,"endTime":86.52,"body":"there's a whole category of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":82.92,"endTime":86.52,"body":"patents out there that are"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":87.15,"endTime":93.03,"body":"called design patents, and they"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":87.15,"endTime":93.03,"body":"are specifically geared to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":93.06,"endTime":98.31,"body":"protecting the appearance of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":93.06,"endTime":98.31,"body":"things they beat, the US"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":98.31,"endTime":102.45,"body":"government began issuing them in"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":98.31,"endTime":102.45,"body":"1842. And since 1842, they've"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":102.45,"endTime":104.76,"body":"now issued something like I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":102.45,"endTime":104.76,"body":"think they just crossed the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":104.76,"endTime":108.48,"body":"900,000 mark for the number of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":104.76,"endTime":108.48,"body":"design patents that have been"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":108.48,"endTime":111.72,"body":"issued. When most people hear"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":108.48,"endTime":111.72,"body":"the word patent, I think they"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":111.72,"endTime":116.64,"body":"think of utility patents, which"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":111.72,"endTime":116.64,"body":"are a separate category of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":116.64,"endTime":120.54,"body":"patents the the predominant"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":116.64,"endTime":120.54,"body":"category, there are about 10"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":120.54,"endTime":123.75,"body":"times as many utility patents as"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":120.54,"endTime":123.75,"body":"there are design patents and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":123.75,"endTime":127.59,"body":"utility patents protect the way"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":123.75,"endTime":127.59,"body":"something functions and I think"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":127.59,"endTime":129.84,"body":"that's most people's"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":127.59,"endTime":129.84,"body":"understanding of what a patent"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":129.87,"endTime":134.37,"body":"is. So, like the cotton gin or,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":129.87,"endTime":134.37,"body":"Edison's incandescent light"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":134.37,"endTime":139.65,"body":"bulb,  that that thing. But"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":134.37,"endTime":139.65,"body":"design patents, like I said,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":139.65,"endTime":142.59,"body":"protect the way something looks."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":139.65,"endTime":142.59,"body":"So they're an incredibly"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":142.59,"endTime":148.35,"body":"valuable resource for design"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":142.59,"endTime":148.35,"body":"historians. And, having stumbled"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":148.35,"endTime":153.66,"body":"upon this suddenly,  for me, it"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":148.35,"endTime":153.66,"body":"was the the appeal, the the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":153.66,"endTime":159.18,"body":"fascination was that, here's"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":153.66,"endTime":159.18,"body":"this whole database of 900,000"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":159.18,"endTime":162.12,"body":"patents that tell you who"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":159.18,"endTime":162.12,"body":"designed something, and when,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":163.41,"endTime":165.99,"body":"and normally we think of works"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":163.41,"endTime":165.99,"body":"with design, people are thinking"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":165.99,"endTime":172.05,"body":"of higher levels of design, like"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":165.99,"endTime":172.05,"body":"architectural design or things"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":172.05,"endTime":175.86,"body":"like that. But to me, the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":172.05,"endTime":175.86,"body":"incredible thing was that"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":175.86,"endTime":180.27,"body":"suddenly, through design"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":175.86,"endTime":180.27,"body":"patents, you could study"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":180.27,"endTime":186.06,"body":"everything from like staplers to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":180.27,"endTime":186.06,"body":"lamps, to radios, to phones, to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":186.06,"endTime":190.65,"body":"cell phones, in the same way"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":186.06,"endTime":190.65,"body":"that you would study, works of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":190.65,"endTime":195.06,"body":"architectural,  architectural"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":190.65,"endTime":195.06,"body":"history. And, there's this all"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":195.06,"endTime":198.09,"body":"of a sudden, there's all these"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":195.06,"endTime":198.09,"body":"Indian, what they're called"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":198.09,"endTime":202.74,"body":"inventors and patent parlance,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":198.09,"endTime":202.74,"body":"but designers really, whose"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":202.98,"endTime":207.12,"body":"industrial designers, mainly"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":202.98,"endTime":207.12,"body":"whose names have been totally"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":207.12,"endTime":212.88,"body":"forgotten. But who were prolific"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":207.12,"endTime":212.88,"body":"and people who designed, the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":212.88,"endTime":215.7,"body":"things that are on our desks at"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":212.88,"endTime":215.7,"body":"work, or the things that are on"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":215.7,"endTime":219.81,"body":"our kitchen counters at home."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":215.7,"endTime":219.81,"body":"And, there are people who, who"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":219.81,"endTime":223.56,"body":"made whole careers and who have"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":219.81,"endTime":223.56,"body":"these incredible bodies of work"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":223.56,"endTime":228.24,"body":"that span decades and decades"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":223.56,"endTime":228.24,"body":"and decades. So that's what this"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":228.24,"endTime":232.5,"body":"is, this is a shortlist of 1000"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":228.24,"endTime":232.5,"body":"design patents that I thought"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":232.5,"endTime":237.9,"body":"were most interesting and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":232.5,"endTime":237.9,"body":"important, from 750,000 been"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":237.9,"endTime":239.4,"body":"issued since the year 1900."},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":240.57,"endTime":243.72,"body":"Very well, as I"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":240.57,"endTime":243.72,"body":"received this book in the mail,"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":243.72,"endTime":246.27,"body":"before the podcast, I was"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":243.72,"endTime":246.27,"body":"showing some of my colleagues,"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":246.27,"endTime":249.6,"body":"other engineers, and we're"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":246.27,"endTime":249.6,"body":"flipping through and like you"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":249.6,"endTime":254.49,"body":"said, you see anything from"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":249.6,"endTime":254.49,"body":"rubber ducks, to a roller"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":254.49,"endTime":258.81,"body":"blades, a phone, a toaster, a"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":254.49,"endTime":258.81,"body":"chair, all these different"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":258.81,"endTime":261.93,"body":"design patents is a pretty thick"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":258.81,"endTime":261.93,"body":"book, think of it like a big"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":261.96,"endTime":268.26,"body":"thick encyclopedia. And I want"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":261.96,"endTime":268.26,"body":"to understand who is the"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":268.26,"endTime":269.91,"body":"audience for this book?"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":270.66,"endTime":273.75,"body":"Well, I think"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":270.66,"endTime":273.75,"body":"the audience is, anybody who's"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":273.81,"endTime":277.14,"body":"interested in design, you can be"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":273.81,"endTime":277.14,"body":"seriously interested in design"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":277.14,"endTime":280.23,"body":"or passively interested in"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":277.14,"endTime":280.23,"body":"design. If you're seriously"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":280.23,"endTime":284.58,"body":"interested in design, I think"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":280.23,"endTime":284.58,"body":"you'll pick this up and suddenly"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":284.58,"endTime":288.39,"body":"maybe realize that you've been"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":284.58,"endTime":288.39,"body":"surrounded your whole life by"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":288.51,"endTime":291.57,"body":"things that are really works of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":288.51,"endTime":291.57,"body":"design, but you've never really"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":291.57,"endTime":296.43,"body":"thought of them that way. so"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":291.57,"endTime":296.43,"body":"like a pair of scissors, , or"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":297.09,"endTime":302.28,"body":"your computer keyboard or I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":297.09,"endTime":302.28,"body":"mean, recent apple products, I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":302.28,"endTime":306.15,"body":"think people think of his works"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":302.28,"endTime":306.15,"body":"of design, but more obscure"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":306.15,"endTime":311.67,"body":"things, I think a lot of people,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":306.15,"endTime":311.67,"body":"maybe a revelation to realize"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":311.67,"endTime":313.98,"body":"that, oh, there's actually"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":311.67,"endTime":313.98,"body":"somebody designed this thing."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":314.37,"endTime":316.89,"body":"And if you're somebody who's"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":314.37,"endTime":316.89,"body":"just passively interested in"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":316.89,"endTime":322.26,"body":"design, I think it might have"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":316.89,"endTime":322.26,"body":"the same impact, I hope, and so"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":322.68,"endTime":327.24,"body":"I hope people pick this up this"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":322.68,"endTime":327.24,"body":"book, and can open to almost any"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":327.24,"endTime":331.41,"body":"random page and find something"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":327.24,"endTime":331.41,"body":"that they recognize it's a very"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":331.41,"endTime":336.27,"body":"familiar object, and then, look"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":331.41,"endTime":336.27,"body":"up to the top of the page, and,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":336.96,"endTime":339.84,"body":"see the date that this thing was"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":336.96,"endTime":339.84,"body":"designed, and the name of the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":339.84,"endTime":345.12,"body":"designer, and very often the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":339.84,"endTime":345.12,"body":"commissioning manufacturer, is"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":345.12,"endTime":351.39,"body":"also listed. And suddenly all"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":345.12,"endTime":351.39,"body":"these things you realize, are"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":351.39,"endTime":353.37,"body":"connected to each other in an"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":351.39,"endTime":353.37,"body":"interesting way."},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":354.96,"endTime":356.61,"body":"Talk to us a"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":354.96,"endTime":356.61,"body":"little bit more about the"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":356.61,"endTime":359.55,"body":"connection in an interesting"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":356.61,"endTime":359.55,"body":"way, what are some that some of"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":359.55,"endTime":362.13,"body":"the take home points of the book"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":359.55,"endTime":362.13,"body":"that you've written?"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":363.57,"endTime":366.3,"body":"Well, I mean,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":363.57,"endTime":366.3,"body":"for me, the connections are"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":366.99,"endTime":374.7,"body":"almost implied more than"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":366.99,"endTime":374.7,"body":"specifically highlighted in, in"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":374.73,"endTime":378.33,"body":"looking at design patents, if"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":374.73,"endTime":378.33,"body":"you really get into the nitty"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":378.33,"endTime":384.09,"body":"gritty of it. And, say now there"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":378.33,"endTime":384.09,"body":"are databases online, Google"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":384.09,"endTime":388.56,"body":"patents, and others where you"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":384.09,"endTime":388.56,"body":"can go on and search by a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":388.56,"endTime":393.21,"body":"designer, so say, you stumble"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":388.56,"endTime":393.21,"body":"upon some object that's always"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":394.02,"endTime":396.6,"body":"been familiar to you, or that"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":394.02,"endTime":396.6,"body":"you've admired or that's"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":396.6,"endTime":399.57,"body":"interesting, it could be like,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":396.6,"endTime":399.57,"body":"something as simple as a tape"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":399.57,"endTime":404.04,"body":"dispenser, and you suddenly now"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":399.57,"endTime":404.04,"body":"are armed with the name of the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":404.04,"endTime":407.28,"body":"designer of said, tape"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":404.04,"endTime":407.28,"body":"dispenser, you can then go to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":407.28,"endTime":410.55,"body":"the database and punch in that"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":407.28,"endTime":410.55,"body":"name, and suddenly see, in some"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":410.55,"endTime":415.14,"body":"cases, everything else that this"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":410.55,"endTime":415.14,"body":"designer has designed in,  so it"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":415.14,"endTime":422.76,"body":"could be everything, from"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":415.14,"endTime":422.76,"body":"radios, to toys, to sometimes"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":422.76,"endTime":427.23,"body":"even buildings come up,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":422.76,"endTime":427.23,"body":"industrial designers, the lines"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":427.23,"endTime":431.94,"body":"blurred a bit with architecture."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":427.23,"endTime":431.94,"body":"And then from those topologies,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":433.2,"endTime":437.13,"body":"across the breadth of any given"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":433.2,"endTime":437.13,"body":"topology, there are all these"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":437.13,"endTime":441.12,"body":"other designers who have dabbled"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":437.13,"endTime":441.12,"body":"in that same topology or been"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":441.12,"endTime":444.39,"body":"commissioned by someone to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":441.12,"endTime":444.39,"body":"design something of like I said,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":444.39,"endTime":448.38,"body":"it could be a pair of scissors."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":444.39,"endTime":448.38,"body":"And so there are these like"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":448.38,"endTime":454.5,"body":"lineal lines of inquiry that"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":448.38,"endTime":454.5,"body":"that you can do, and it relates"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":454.5,"endTime":456.96,"body":"all these different objects to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":454.5,"endTime":456.96,"body":"one another, in what I think is"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":456.96,"endTime":459.75,"body":"a very interesting way, I mean,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":456.96,"endTime":459.75,"body":"things that you never really"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":459.75,"endTime":465.42,"body":"considered as being related,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":459.75,"endTime":465.42,"body":"across spans of could be a gap"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":465.42,"endTime":469.89,"body":"of topology,  totally disparate"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":465.42,"endTime":469.89,"body":"types of objects, or two objects"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":469.89,"endTime":472.86,"body":"of the same type ology, but that"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":469.89,"endTime":472.86,"body":"were made decades apart from one"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":472.86,"endTime":476.31,"body":"another, could be the work of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":472.86,"endTime":476.31,"body":"the same designer,  they might"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":476.31,"endTime":479.04,"body":"look completely different,  if"},{"speaker":"Thomas 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was"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":496.71,"endTime":500.61,"body":"failing to make the connections"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":496.71,"endTime":500.61,"body":"and the relationships. So I was"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":500.61,"endTime":504.3,"body":"hoping that with the podcast, we"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":500.61,"endTime":504.3,"body":"could help some of our listeners"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":504.3,"endTime":507.06,"body":"who may be thinking about buying"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":504.3,"endTime":507.06,"body":"the book, what some of those"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":507.06,"endTime":509.73,"body":"relationships may be, so that as"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":507.06,"endTime":509.73,"body":"they're reading the book, and"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":509.73,"endTime":513.09,"body":"flipping through the patents,"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":509.73,"endTime":513.09,"body":"they can start to see them as"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":513.09,"endTime":514.14,"body":"they're flipping through"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":515.17,"endTime":517.39,"body":"that the book is"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":515.17,"endTime":517.39,"body":"arranged chronologically,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":517.99,"endTime":523.48,"body":"because I wanted to array, all"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":517.99,"endTime":523.48,"body":"the different pens that are"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":523.48,"endTime":529.48,"body":"included in a straight line, so"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":523.48,"endTime":529.48,"body":"you could see how the way, their"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":529.48,"endTime":532.99,"body":"style, their various different"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":529.48,"endTime":532.99,"body":"styles evolved, transcended all"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":532.99,"endTime":536.86,"body":"the different typologies, there"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":532.99,"endTime":536.86,"body":"was their two ways to do a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":536.86,"endTime":539.71,"body":"project like this, which is to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":536.86,"endTime":539.71,"body":"group everything type of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":539.71,"endTime":544.15,"body":"logically, or to do it"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":539.71,"endTime":544.15,"body":"chronologically. And we yield it"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":544.15,"endTime":548.56,"body":"to the temptation of doing a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":544.15,"endTime":548.56,"body":"type of logical organization of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":548.56,"endTime":551.83,"body":"things, by in the front of the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":548.56,"endTime":551.83,"body":"book, pulling out 10 different"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":551.83,"endTime":557.35,"body":"case studies where you can see"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":551.83,"endTime":557.35,"body":"how cell phones evolved through"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":557.35,"endTime":560.86,"body":"time. And it's neat to see,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":557.35,"endTime":560.86,"body":"like, every 10 years or so, a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":560.86,"endTime":564.97,"body":"different cell phone, or cell"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":560.86,"endTime":564.97,"body":"phone every couple of years, a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":564.97,"endTime":569.59,"body":"different cell phone design, see"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":564.97,"endTime":569.59,"body":"how, how that evolved. But for"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":569.59,"endTime":575.92,"body":"me, it was important to stress"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":569.59,"endTime":575.92,"body":"and underscore how the stylistic"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":575.92,"endTime":578.98,"body":"evolution involved transcended"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":575.92,"endTime":578.98,"body":"different topologies. So as he"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":578.98,"endTime":583.87,"body":"flipped through the book, you"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":578.98,"endTime":583.87,"body":"you might notice that there's an"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":584.14,"endTime":590.47,"body":"aesthetic that is shared between"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":584.14,"endTime":590.47,"body":"objects of all different kinds."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":591.22,"endTime":597.61,"body":"And that aesthetic is a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":591.22,"endTime":597.61,"body":"reflection of what the designers"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":597.64,"endTime":601.24,"body":"whose work is featured in the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":597.64,"endTime":601.24,"body":"book had available to them in"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":601.24,"endTime":604.66,"body":"the way of manufacturing"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":601.24,"endTime":604.66,"body":"techniques and materials and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":604.66,"endTime":609.13,"body":"materials, the material that was"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":604.66,"endTime":609.13,"body":"available to a designer say in"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":609.16,"endTime":615.43,"body":"1930 versus 1950 versus 1970 was"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":609.16,"endTime":615.43,"body":"itself reflection of the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":615.43,"endTime":617.83,"body":"manufacturing techniques that"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":615.43,"endTime":617.83,"body":"were available. And so these"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":617.83,"endTime":622.06,"body":"things are continuously"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":617.83,"endTime":622.06,"body":"changing. And so you go from the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":622.06,"endTime":625.3,"body":"early part of the 20th century,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":622.06,"endTime":625.3,"body":"where objects of all different"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":625.3,"endTime":629.53,"body":"kinds have, you'll very often"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":625.3,"endTime":629.53,"body":"see like classical motifs, the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":629.53,"endTime":632.56,"body":"same kinds of design details"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":629.53,"endTime":632.56,"body":"that you'd see in classically"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":632.56,"endTime":636.85,"body":"inspired architecture of the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":632.56,"endTime":636.85,"body":"period. And suddenly, in about"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":636.85,"endTime":643.03,"body":"1930, this changes dramatically."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":636.85,"endTime":643.03,"body":"And so all those old fussy"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":643.03,"endTime":647.62,"body":"details of classically inspired"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":643.03,"endTime":647.62,"body":"design as applied to, be a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":647.62,"endTime":652.0,"body":"toaster or whatever else yield"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":647.62,"endTime":652.0,"body":"to this very pared down"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":652.15,"endTime":657.76,"body":"streamlined aesthetic. And also,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":652.15,"endTime":657.76,"body":"at the same time you get Art"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":657.76,"endTime":662.53,"body":"Deco, is influencing the way"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":657.76,"endTime":662.53,"body":"things work. Art Deco yields to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":662.53,"endTime":666.73,"body":"streamlining in the late 1930s."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":662.53,"endTime":666.73,"body":"And after world war two things"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":666.94,"endTime":674.68,"body":"take on a different aesthetic."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":666.94,"endTime":674.68,"body":"And so there's, this influenced"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":674.68,"endTime":679.3,"body":"by, say, the ability to make"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":674.68,"endTime":679.3,"body":"something by stamping it out of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":679.3,"endTime":683.89,"body":"a single piece of metal versus"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":679.3,"endTime":683.89,"body":"having to, in years before"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":684.07,"endTime":686.29,"body":"assemble it from different"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":684.07,"endTime":686.29,"body":"pieces of metal that each"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":686.29,"endTime":691.6,"body":"individually had to be stamped,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":686.29,"endTime":691.6,"body":"or the availability of plastics,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":691.63,"endTime":695.14,"body":"early plastics, like Bakelite,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":691.63,"endTime":695.14,"body":"or catalin. And then later"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":695.14,"endTime":700.78,"body":"plastics, more modern kinds of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":695.14,"endTime":700.78,"body":"plastics versus having had to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":700.81,"endTime":704.05,"body":"make things out of wood, in"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":700.81,"endTime":704.05,"body":"decades, earlier decades of the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":704.05,"endTime":709.18,"body":"20th century. And so these are"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":704.05,"endTime":709.18,"body":"the kinds of undercurrents that,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":709.81,"endTime":715.87,"body":"steered and shaped literally how"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":709.81,"endTime":715.87,"body":"objects of all different kinds"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":716.02,"endTime":721.24,"body":"looked and how this, like I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":716.02,"endTime":721.24,"body":"said, this style, transcends all"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":721.24,"endTime":726.16,"body":"the different topologies as it"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":721.24,"endTime":726.16,"body":"evolves through time. So I'm"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":726.16,"endTime":729.37,"body":"hoping that some of you could in"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":726.16,"endTime":729.37,"body":"theory, flip through the book,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":729.67,"endTime":736.93,"body":"and just see, even if, like,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":729.67,"endTime":736.93,"body":"say, take your glasses off, you"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":736.93,"endTime":741.91,"body":"could see like how things go"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":736.93,"endTime":741.91,"body":"from being like one shape to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":741.91,"endTime":745.15,"body":"like, more rounded shapes to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":741.91,"endTime":745.15,"body":"then being more square shapes,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":745.15,"endTime":751.45,"body":"again, to it even on that basic"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":745.15,"endTime":751.45,"body":"of a level.  there's this, this"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":751.69,"endTime":757.06,"body":"continuum, this this lineal"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":751.69,"endTime":757.06,"body":"trajectory that moves through"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":757.06,"endTime":757.54,"body":"time."},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":758.41,"endTime":761.92,"body":"I see, it says"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":758.41,"endTime":761.92,"body":"that you're an architectural"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":761.92,"endTime":765.22,"body":"designer, that's not a term that"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":761.92,"endTime":765.22,"body":"a lot of our listeners are"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":765.22,"endTime":768.16,"body":"familiar with, including myself,"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":765.22,"endTime":768.16,"body":"could you explain what that is?"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":768.46,"endTime":770.35,"body":"An architectural"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":768.46,"endTime":770.35,"body":"designer is an architect, she"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":770.35,"endTime":773.74,"body":"doesn't have his or her"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":770.35,"endTime":773.74,"body":"architecture licensed yet, but"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":773.77,"endTime":778.27,"body":"they may find themselves as I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":773.77,"endTime":778.27,"body":"do, doing very similar kinds of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":778.27,"endTime":782.5,"body":"work to an architect. But for"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":778.27,"endTime":782.5,"body":"legal reasons. I can't call"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":782.5,"endTime":784.96,"body":"myself an architect until I have"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":782.5,"endTime":784.96,"body":"my license, hopefully."},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":787.06,"endTime":788.98,"body":"What's the"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":787.06,"endTime":788.98,"body":"process like of getting the"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":788.98,"endTime":790.75,"body":"license? How many years is that"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":788.98,"endTime":790.75,"body":"take?"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":791.56,"endTime":794.86,"body":"It differs from"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":791.56,"endTime":794.86,"body":"state to state and country to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":794.86,"endTime":800.41,"body":"country. In New York State,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":794.86,"endTime":800.41,"body":"which is where I am, if you"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":800.41,"endTime":805.63,"body":"depends on what degree you have"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":800.41,"endTime":805.63,"body":"undergraduate or graduate"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":805.63,"endTime":808.51,"body":"degree, and then you just"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":805.63,"endTime":808.51,"body":"certain out of work experience,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":808.54,"endTime":812.35,"body":"and then you can start taking"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":808.54,"endTime":812.35,"body":"your licensing exams, which,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":812.77,"endTime":817.78,"body":"over the years that I've been"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":812.77,"endTime":817.78,"body":"procrastinating, doing this, the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":817.78,"endTime":821.56,"body":"number of exams has changed, I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":817.78,"endTime":821.56,"body":"think instead of five exams now,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":821.92,"endTime":826.69,"body":"had been significantly more than"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":821.92,"endTime":826.69,"body":"that, at one point. Anyway, this"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":826.69,"endTime":832.63,"body":"is something I've got to get off"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":826.69,"endTime":832.63,"body":"my butt and do here soon. I've"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":832.63,"endTime":839.59,"body":"fulfilled my work experience by"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":832.63,"endTime":839.59,"body":"handy margin at this point. So"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":839.62,"endTime":842.29,"body":"no more excuses, plenty busy"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":839.62,"endTime":842.29,"body":"reading books."},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":842.83,"endTime":845.62,"body":"That's the right"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":842.83,"endTime":845.62,"body":"mindset. I think we all have"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":845.62,"endTime":848.56,"body":"things that we want to do, and"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":845.62,"endTime":848.56,"body":"we sometimes procrastinate. But"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":848.56,"endTime":851.17,"body":"I think it's good that we're"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":848.56,"endTime":851.17,"body":"honest with ourselves. So that's"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":851.17,"endTime":855.31,"body":"good. So a lot of our listeners"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":851.17,"endTime":855.31,"body":"are proficient with SolidWorks"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":855.31,"endTime":859.72,"body":"and 3D CAD modeling. What if"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":855.31,"endTime":859.72,"body":"when they flip across your book"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":859.72,"endTime":862.93,"body":"or they listen to our podcast,"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":859.72,"endTime":862.93,"body":"they become inclined towards"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":862.93,"endTime":868.48,"body":"maybe helping an inventor do a"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":862.93,"endTime":868.48,"body":"design patent? Can a CAD person"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":868.48,"endTime":871.87,"body":"that's proficient in SolidWorks"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":868.48,"endTime":871.87,"body":"and CAD, help an inventor create"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":871.87,"endTime":873.43,"body":"some drawings is how it works?"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":874.12,"endTime":877.84,"body":"I think the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":874.12,"endTime":877.84,"body":"short answer is yes, definitely."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":877.87,"endTime":883.36,"body":"Yes. I approach this more as a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":877.87,"endTime":883.36,"body":"design historian and approach"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":883.36,"endTime":886.09,"body":"the exercise as a curatorial"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":883.36,"endTime":886.09,"body":"exercise. But I mean, the world"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":886.09,"endTime":889.12,"body":"of patents is one of the things"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":886.09,"endTime":889.12,"body":"that like has really impressed"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":889.12,"endTime":895.48,"body":"me about the world of patents"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":889.12,"endTime":895.48,"body":"is, how in depth it is and how"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":896.53,"endTime":903.37,"body":"how many people have devoted"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":896.53,"endTime":903.37,"body":"their entire careers, just two"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":903.52,"endTime":909.88,"body":"patents, either as patent agents"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":903.52,"endTime":909.88,"body":"who are there for an adventure"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":909.88,"endTime":912.43,"body":"to approach called the Patent"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":909.88,"endTime":912.43,"body":"Agent say, I have this idea, can"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":912.43,"endTime":916.36,"body":"you help me like, apply for and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":912.43,"endTime":916.36,"body":"get a patent for it, then the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":916.36,"endTime":921.01,"body":"patent agents work with drafts"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":916.36,"endTime":921.01,"body":"people who actually like do the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":921.01,"endTime":923.98,"body":"drawings, who is like a whole"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":921.01,"endTime":923.98,"body":"separate discipline, and then"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":923.98,"endTime":928.18,"body":"their patent attorneys, legions"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":923.98,"endTime":928.18,"body":"of patent attorneys and the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":928.18,"endTime":931.81,"body":"whole world of patent law,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":928.18,"endTime":931.81,"body":"which, there are the subtleties"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":931.81,"endTime":934.48,"body":"of the nuanced difference"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":931.81,"endTime":934.48,"body":"between design patents and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":934.48,"endTime":937.09,"body":"utility patents that come into"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":934.48,"endTime":937.09,"body":"play here. And some people"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":937.09,"endTime":940.78,"body":"specialize in one or the other,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":937.09,"endTime":940.78,"body":"maybe you're able to do a bit of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":940.78,"endTime":943.09,"body":"both, but then you've got all"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":940.78,"endTime":943.09,"body":"the career professionals in the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":943.09,"endTime":949.81,"body":"patent office, and it gets into"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":943.09,"endTime":949.81,"body":"the reviewers who are reviewing"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":949.81,"endTime":954.43,"body":"applications whose job it is to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":949.81,"endTime":954.43,"body":"then look at these drawings. And"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":954.43,"endTime":957.61,"body":"in the case of utility patents,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":954.43,"endTime":957.61,"body":"read the often very extensive"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":957.61,"endTime":961.42,"body":"accompanying text, and make sure"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":957.61,"endTime":961.42,"body":"this is in fact, something"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":961.42,"endTime":963.52,"body":"that's not overlapping with"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":961.42,"endTime":963.52,"body":"something that's already been"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":963.52,"endTime":966.07,"body":"patented. And they have to go"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":963.52,"endTime":966.07,"body":"through and do these side by"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":966.07,"endTime":970.45,"body":"side comparisons to, to make"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":966.07,"endTime":970.45,"body":"sure that this is a In fact, a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":970.45,"endTime":972.94,"body":"new design, because a lot of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":970.45,"endTime":972.94,"body":"applications get rejected, if it"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":972.94,"endTime":975.88,"body":"turns out it's not something"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":972.94,"endTime":975.88,"body":"new. One patent agent I talked"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":975.88,"endTime":978.07,"body":"with told me, I said, Do you"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":975.88,"endTime":978.07,"body":"have any patents of your own."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":978.4,"endTime":982.6,"body":"And he said, I've applied for"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":978.4,"endTime":982.6,"body":"three, and I've been rejected,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":983.08,"endTime":986.05,"body":"this is a guy whose job it is,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":983.08,"endTime":986.05,"body":"he's quite successful at getting"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":986.05,"endTime":991.72,"body":"other people's patents,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":986.05,"endTime":991.72,"body":"approved. But the ironic twist"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":991.72,"endTime":992.05,"body":"there..."},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":994.6,"endTime":997.12,"body":"To say, just my"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":994.6,"endTime":997.12,"body":"first thought that came in my"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":997.12,"endTime":1000.45,"body":"mind is, we're gonna keep this"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":997.12,"endTime":1000.45,"body":"person anonymous, but he must"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1000.45,"endTime":1002.94,"body":"not be that good. If you can't"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1000.45,"endTime":1002.94,"body":"get along with you..."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1003.78,"endTime":1007.29,"body":"Really, really"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1003.78,"endTime":1007.29,"body":"notice it, that's the irony,, is"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1007.29,"endTime":1011.07,"body":"the guy's is a sharpshooter, a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1007.29,"endTime":1011.07,"body":"total ace it like getting,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1011.55,"endTime":1013.8,"body":"patents for other people, when"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1011.55,"endTime":1013.8,"body":"it comes to his own patents"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1014.61,"endTime":1019.8,"body":"rejected, I thought it was a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1014.61,"endTime":1019.8,"body":"funny irony, but I think he has"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1019.8,"endTime":1023.85,"body":"a sense of humor about it, too."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1019.8,"endTime":1023.85,"body":"But, but yeah, then within the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1023.85,"endTime":1026.58,"body":"patent office, there are people"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1023.85,"endTime":1026.58,"body":"whose job it is just to analyze"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1026.58,"endTime":1031.02,"body":"the statistics. And, it's an"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1026.58,"endTime":1031.02,"body":"insane amount of statistics"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1031.41,"endTime":1038.52,"body":"that, patents can be analyzed"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1031.41,"endTime":1038.52,"body":"for, I did a little bit of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1038.52,"endTime":1042.3,"body":"statistical analysis of my own"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1038.52,"endTime":1042.3,"body":"and looking at them,  but if you"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1042.3,"endTime":1045.72,"body":"really have access to the full"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1042.3,"endTime":1045.72,"body":"breadth of data, I mean, the,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1045.9,"endTime":1050.07,"body":"the statistical inquiry"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1045.9,"endTime":1050.07,"body":"inquiries that you could do,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1051.21,"endTime":1054.6,"body":"becomes a whole rabbit hole of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1051.21,"endTime":1054.6,"body":"its own,  I was interested in"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1054.6,"endTime":1058.74,"body":"looking at, how many patents"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1054.6,"endTime":1058.74,"body":"were issued to applicants from"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1058.77,"endTime":1061.05,"body":"other countries, and then that's"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1058.77,"endTime":1061.05,"body":"broken down by whichever"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1061.05,"endTime":1064.5,"body":"country, and so it's interesting"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1061.05,"endTime":1064.5,"body":"to see, for instance, over the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1064.5,"endTime":1069.36,"body":"past 20 years or so, the number"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1064.5,"endTime":1069.36,"body":"of patents issued to applicants"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1069.36,"endTime":1074.61,"body":"from China has gone from like 50"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1069.36,"endTime":1074.61,"body":"a year to, I think, broke"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1074.64,"endTime":1079.47,"body":"20,000, issued last year, to two"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1074.64,"endTime":1079.47,"body":"applicants from China. And this"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1079.47,"endTime":1085.38,"body":"is a really staggering trend,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1079.47,"endTime":1085.38,"body":"it's at the moment is, on a, on"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1085.38,"endTime":1089.01,"body":"a graph, it's almost like a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1085.38,"endTime":1089.01,"body":"vertical line. So be interesting"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1089.01,"endTime":1091.41,"body":"to see how that continues. And"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1089.01,"endTime":1091.41,"body":"then through the years, they've"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1091.41,"endTime":1094.8,"body":"been applicants from different"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1091.41,"endTime":1094.8,"body":"countries who have had peaks,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1094.8,"endTime":1098.88,"body":"and then new numbers have"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1094.8,"endTime":1098.88,"body":"plateaued and leveled off, it's"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1099.09,"endTime":1104.49,"body":"an interesting indicator of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1099.09,"endTime":1104.49,"body":"globalization, as a phenomenon,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1104.52,"endTime":1107.25,"body":"too. So there's, there's lots of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1104.52,"endTime":1107.25,"body":"interesting things and that's"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1107.43,"endTime":1112.05,"body":"getting into patents in a, in a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1107.43,"endTime":1112.05,"body":"in from an angle that it's"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1112.08,"endTime":1115.53,"body":"completely different than the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1112.08,"endTime":1115.53,"body":"angle that intrigued first"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1115.53,"endTime":1119.25,"body":"intrigued me about them. But"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1115.53,"endTime":1119.25,"body":"it's also by way of saying just"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1119.25,"endTime":1125.13,"body":"how rich the field  like how"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1119.25,"endTime":1125.13,"body":"actually very interesting it can"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1125.19,"endTime":1125.88,"body":"it can get."},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1171.67,"endTime":1173.6200000000001,"body":"Alright, real"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1171.67,"endTime":1173.6200000000001,"body":"quick, I just want to take a"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1173.6200000000001,"endTime":1178.0900000000001,"body":"short break and share with our"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1173.6200000000001,"endTime":1178.0900000000001,"body":"listeners that teampipeline.us"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1178.1200000000001,"endTime":1180.8500000000001,"body":"is where you can learn more"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1178.1200000000001,"endTime":1180.8500000000001,"body":"about how we can help medical"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1180.8500000000001,"endTime":1183.97,"body":"device and other product"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1180.8500000000001,"endTime":1183.97,"body":"engineering or manufacturing"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1183.97,"endTime":1188.3200000000002,"body":"teams develop turnkey equipment,"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1183.97,"endTime":1188.3200000000002,"body":"custom fixtures and automated"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1188.3200000000002,"endTime":1192.19,"body":"machines to characterize,"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1188.3200000000002,"endTime":1192.19,"body":"inspect assemble, manufacturer"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1192.19,"endTime":1196.66,"body":"and perform verification testing"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1192.19,"endTime":1196.66,"body":"on their devices. So back to the"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1196.66,"endTime":1200.17,"body":"show here with Thomas. And I"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1196.66,"endTime":1200.17,"body":"wanted to ask you, what's"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1200.17,"endTime":1202.66,"body":"something that you think I"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1200.17,"endTime":1202.66,"body":"should ask you that I haven't"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1202.66,"endTime":1203.8,"body":"asked you yet?"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1204.97,"endTime":1210.88,"body":"Uh, oh, gosh."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1204.97,"endTime":1210.88,"body":"Boy, usually new questions"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1210.88,"endTime":1215.0800000000002,"body":"thrown at me. But that's the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1210.88,"endTime":1215.0800000000002,"body":"one. I could think of the kinds"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1215.0800000000002,"endTime":1216.8500000000001,"body":"of questions that other people"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1215.0800000000002,"endTime":1216.8500000000001,"body":"have asked me."},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1218.3500000000001,"endTime":1220.54,"body":"You may want it"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1218.3500000000001,"endTime":1220.54,"body":"to tell a lot of people that's"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1220.54,"endTime":1222.31,"body":"important that you haven't had a"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1220.54,"endTime":1222.31,"body":"chance to."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1223.48,"endTime":1226.66,"body":"Uh, oh, gosh."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1223.48,"endTime":1226.66,"body":"Okay, that is a good question."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1226.72,"endTime":1228.8500000000001,"body":"Let me see if I can come up with"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1226.72,"endTime":1228.8500000000001,"body":"a good answer for you here."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1230.14,"endTime":1232.15,"body":"Something I've wanted to tell a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1230.14,"endTime":1232.15,"body":"lot of people that haven't"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1233.3200000000002,"endTime":1238.39,"body":"haven't had a chance to. Well, I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1233.3200000000002,"endTime":1238.39,"body":"have had a chance a little bit"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1238.42,"endTime":1247.15,"body":"too. One of the things that I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1238.42,"endTime":1247.15,"body":"was happiest about with this"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1247.15,"endTime":1251.5,"body":"project, both from my own like"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1247.15,"endTime":1251.5,"body":"edification, but also because I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1251.5,"endTime":1256.63,"body":"think it's like a contribution"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1251.5,"endTime":1256.63,"body":"to, like the study of design"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1256.63,"endTime":1263.05,"body":"history of large is, how many"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1256.63,"endTime":1263.05,"body":"prolific designers are alluded"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1263.05,"endTime":1266.41,"body":"to this a little bit earlier."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1263.05,"endTime":1266.41,"body":"But how many prolific designers,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1266.5900000000001,"endTime":1272.2,"body":"I discovered in the course of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1266.5900000000001,"endTime":1272.2,"body":"doing this project, who I've"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1272.2,"endTime":1275.38,"body":"never heard of these people"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1272.2,"endTime":1275.38,"body":"before. And I'm somebody who's"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1275.8300000000002,"endTime":1278.92,"body":"been interested in design"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1275.8300000000002,"endTime":1278.92,"body":"history for a long time,  and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1278.92,"endTime":1283.21,"body":"these people were not just"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1278.92,"endTime":1283.21,"body":"obscure, but I don't know, like,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1283.21,"endTime":1287.3500000000001,"body":"I'm not gonna say, nobody's ever"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1283.21,"endTime":1287.3500000000001,"body":"heard these names. But there are"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1287.41,"endTime":1289.96,"body":"certain people out there for"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1287.41,"endTime":1289.96,"body":"whom these are familiar names,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1289.96,"endTime":1295.6000000000001,"body":"but it's, it's not a very big"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1289.96,"endTime":1295.6000000000001,"body":"circle. And so, I was able to go"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1295.6000000000001,"endTime":1300.52,"body":"in and flip on the stadium"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1295.6000000000001,"endTime":1300.52,"body":"lights and suddenly see, like,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1300.52,"endTime":1303.46,"body":"the entire bodies of work of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1300.52,"endTime":1303.46,"body":"these industrial designers who"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1304.66,"endTime":1307.3300000000002,"body":"are as prolific as the ones"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1304.66,"endTime":1307.3300000000002,"body":"you've heard of, like, a lot of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1307.3300000000002,"endTime":1309.52,"body":"people have heard of like"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1307.3300000000002,"endTime":1309.52,"body":"Raymond Loewy, a lot of people"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1309.52,"endTime":1313.75,"body":"have heard of Henry Dreyfus in"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1309.52,"endTime":1313.75,"body":"more recent years, Johnny, Ivan"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1313.75,"endTime":1319.42,"body":"apple and Phillipe Stark, and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1313.75,"endTime":1319.42,"body":"then other prominent names, but"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1319.42,"endTime":1322.3,"body":"like, for every one of those"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1319.42,"endTime":1322.3,"body":"prominent names that listener"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1322.3,"endTime":1325.3600000000001,"body":"may have heard of, there are"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1322.3,"endTime":1325.3600000000001,"body":"dozens of people who are like,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1325.3600000000001,"endTime":1330.04,"body":"just as prolific and have"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1325.3600000000001,"endTime":1330.04,"body":"created the things that are"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1330.04,"endTime":1333.91,"body":"there in the backdrop of our"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1330.04,"endTime":1333.91,"body":"everyday lives, who whose names"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1333.91,"endTime":1338.14,"body":"have just been totally lost, and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1333.91,"endTime":1338.14,"body":"so it's just, to me, like, I'm"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1338.26,"endTime":1345.97,"body":"proud to have spotlighted, some"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1338.26,"endTime":1345.97,"body":"of these forgotten figures a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1345.97,"endTime":1351.43,"body":"little bit. And there's some"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1345.97,"endTime":1351.43,"body":"designers who, like, they went"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1351.43,"endTime":1355.45,"body":"to 1000 patents that are in the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1351.43,"endTime":1355.45,"body":"book, and they will have a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1355.45,"endTime":1359.5900000000001,"body":"handful by this person or that"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1355.45,"endTime":1359.5900000000001,"body":"person who turns out to be"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1361.78,"endTime":1365.1100000000001,"body":"pretty important, actually, I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1361.78,"endTime":1365.1100000000001,"body":"think when it comes to the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1365.14,"endTime":1369.1000000000001,"body":"history of design history, but"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1365.14,"endTime":1369.1000000000001,"body":"then I hope that people will"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1369.64,"endTime":1374.3500000000001,"body":"take certain, I hope this book"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1369.64,"endTime":1374.3500000000001,"body":"will be the book that launches"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1374.3500000000001,"endTime":1379.51,"body":"like 1000, rabbit hole dives of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1374.3500000000001,"endTime":1379.51,"body":"people saying, huh, Oh, that's"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1379.51,"endTime":1385.39,"body":"interesting, this person"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1379.51,"endTime":1385.39,"body":"designed, I don't know, my, my"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1385.39,"endTime":1390.01,"body":"mom's typewriter or this person"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1385.39,"endTime":1390.01,"body":"designed this chair that I saw"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1390.01,"endTime":1392.65,"body":"in a museum, like, I wonder what"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1390.01,"endTime":1392.65,"body":"else they design and like, Okay,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1392.65,"endTime":1396.8500000000001,"body":"then, like, take that and like,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1392.65,"endTime":1396.8500000000001,"body":"do your own search, and see what"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1396.8500000000001,"endTime":1400.93,"body":"I saw, which is everything else"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1396.8500000000001,"endTime":1400.93,"body":"that comes up in a search,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1401.0800000000002,"endTime":1404.23,"body":"although the caveat there is"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1401.0800000000002,"endTime":1404.23,"body":"that Google patents, which is"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1404.23,"endTime":1408.28,"body":"currently really the easiest way"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1404.23,"endTime":1408.28,"body":"to do that, is just hugely"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1408.3400000000001,"endTime":1411.3400000000001,"body":"buggy, right now. So you can"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1408.3400000000001,"endTime":1411.3400000000001,"body":"like punch in somebody's name"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1411.3400000000001,"endTime":1413.74,"body":"and Google patents and like, get"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1411.3400000000001,"endTime":1413.74,"body":"different results, depending on"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1413.74,"endTime":1417.0700000000002,"body":"which internet browser you're"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1413.74,"endTime":1417.0700000000002,"body":"using. In certain things that"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1417.0700000000002,"endTime":1419.77,"body":"you research result you get one"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1417.0700000000002,"endTime":1419.77,"body":"day you might not get the next"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1419.77,"endTime":1424.15,"body":"day, I don't know what's going"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1419.77,"endTime":1424.15,"body":"on with it. But in any case,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1424.21,"endTime":1426.3400000000001,"body":"eventually, they'll figure that"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1424.21,"endTime":1426.3400000000001,"body":"out. And then you can take an"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1426.3400000000001,"endTime":1430.9,"body":"obscure name, like Everett"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1426.3400000000001,"endTime":1430.9,"body":"Worthington, and discover that"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1430.9,"endTime":1434.26,"body":"this is a guy I've never heard"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1430.9,"endTime":1434.26,"body":"of, who had he not died of a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1434.26,"endTime":1440.5,"body":"heart attack in 1938. He had"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1434.26,"endTime":1440.5,"body":"been, up until that point, like"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1440.5,"endTime":1445.45,"body":"one of the busiest hustlers in"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1440.5,"endTime":1445.45,"body":"the whole industrial design."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1447.46,"endTime":1452.3200000000002,"body":"sphere, in its early years in"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1447.46,"endTime":1452.3200000000002,"body":"the 1930s. Had he lived past"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1452.3200000000002,"endTime":1456.8200000000002,"body":"World War II, he might have been"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1452.3200000000002,"endTime":1456.8200000000002,"body":"one of the most familiar"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1456.8200000000002,"endTime":1461.0800000000002,"body":"household names and design of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1456.8200000000002,"endTime":1461.0800000000002,"body":"anyone and he had all these"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1461.0800000000002,"endTime":1466.18,"body":"accounts with like Coca Cola,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1461.0800000000002,"endTime":1466.18,"body":"and like Toastmaster, like these"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1466.45,"endTime":1472.1200000000001,"body":"like, big, big businesses. And"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1466.45,"endTime":1472.1200000000001,"body":"his career being cut short, like"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1472.1200000000001,"endTime":1475.15,"body":"a lot of his accounts will end"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1472.1200000000001,"endTime":1475.15,"body":"up going over to Raymond Loewy."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1475.15,"endTime":1477.7,"body":"And then what was the one whose"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1475.15,"endTime":1477.7,"body":"name we know now, nobody's ever"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1477.7,"endTime":1481.0,"body":"heard of Everett Worthington?"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1477.7,"endTime":1481.0,"body":"But you can  do that search and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1481.0,"endTime":1484.03,"body":"then suddenly see, like, all"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1481.0,"endTime":1484.03,"body":"these things that he designed,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1484.03,"endTime":1485.26,"body":"and I think it's fascinating."},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1485.74,"endTime":1488.65,"body":"Right on so you,"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1485.74,"endTime":1488.65,"body":"when you wrote thebook, you say"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1488.65,"endTime":1492.19,"body":"we quite often did you have a"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1488.65,"endTime":1492.19,"body":"call a co-author or a team I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1492.19,"endTime":1495.46,"body":"I didn't, no, I,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1492.19,"endTime":1495.46,"body":"I'm using the royal we a little"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1495.46,"endTime":1501.49,"body":"bit and including my editor,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1495.46,"endTime":1501.49,"body":"Virginia McLeod Phaidon, who is"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1501.49,"endTime":1504.55,"body":"really a collaborator in this"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1501.49,"endTime":1504.55,"body":"project as well."},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1505.06,"endTime":1507.0700000000002,"body":"Okay, and how"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1505.06,"endTime":1507.0700000000002,"body":"many books have you launched?"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1507.94,"endTime":1512.3500000000001,"body":"This is my third"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1507.94,"endTime":1512.3500000000001,"body":"book, not counting like a self"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1512.3500000000001,"endTime":1516.7,"body":"published book in high school."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1512.3500000000001,"endTime":1516.7,"body":"But all three books have a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1516.7,"endTime":1519.25,"body":"couple of things in common. And"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1516.7,"endTime":1519.25,"body":"the last one was a book called"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1519.25,"endTime":1524.98,"body":"New York Neon, which was a look"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1519.25,"endTime":1524.98,"body":"at neon storefront signs from"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1525.01,"endTime":1529.72,"body":"before what I call like the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1525.01,"endTime":1529.72,"body":"Helvetica, watershed moment of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1529.72,"endTime":1533.14,"body":"about 1970 that are found"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1529.72,"endTime":1533.14,"body":"throughout the five boroughs of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1533.14,"endTime":1539.23,"body":"New York City, a rapidly"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1533.14,"endTime":1539.23,"body":"disappearing species here in the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1539.23,"endTime":1542.53,"body":"city. And the one before that"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1539.23,"endTime":1542.53,"body":"was a book called Hudson Valley"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1542.53,"endTime":1546.7,"body":"Ruins which I co authored. with"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1542.53,"endTime":1546.7,"body":"Rob Yasinsac, and that looks at"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1547.18,"endTime":1550.3300000000002,"body":"historic buildings in the Hudson"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1547.18,"endTime":1550.3300000000002,"body":"River Valley of New York State"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1550.3600000000001,"endTime":1553.45,"body":"between New York and Albany that"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1550.3600000000001,"endTime":1553.45,"body":"have in common that they are"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1553.48,"endTime":1556.75,"body":"threatened by neglect. So there"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1553.48,"endTime":1556.75,"body":"are all kinds of studies in"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1556.75,"endTime":1561.94,"body":"design history a bit, and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1556.75,"endTime":1561.94,"body":"they're all looking at the one"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1562.42,"endTime":1564.94,"body":"thing that I think all three"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1562.42,"endTime":1564.94,"body":"books have in common is a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1564.94,"endTime":1571.75,"body":"fascination with the passage of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1564.94,"endTime":1571.75,"body":"time. And its impact on the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1571.75,"endTime":1576.3400000000001,"body":"built environment, and the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1571.75,"endTime":1576.3400000000001,"body":"evolution of design and the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1576.3700000000001,"endTime":1582.91,"body":"aesthetic of manmade things, and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1576.3700000000001,"endTime":1582.91,"body":"how things come and things go"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1582.91,"endTime":1589.15,"body":"and we build things. And then"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1582.91,"endTime":1589.15,"body":"there's some fundamental change."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1589.15,"endTime":1593.5900000000001,"body":"And suddenly, things that we've"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1589.15,"endTime":1593.5900000000001,"body":"built, become abandoned, and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1593.5900000000001,"endTime":1597.91,"body":"become endangered, and become"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1593.5900000000001,"endTime":1597.91,"body":"interesting in a way that they"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1597.91,"endTime":1602.2,"body":"might not have been interesting"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1597.91,"endTime":1602.2,"body":"before, neon signs through the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1602.2,"endTime":1605.89,"body":"history of neon, which is this"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1602.2,"endTime":1605.89,"body":"fascinating, like roller coaster"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1606.25,"endTime":1612.73,"body":"of a history, neon was hugely"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1606.25,"endTime":1612.73,"body":"admired as a symbol of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1612.73,"endTime":1617.56,"body":"authority, and then became"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1612.73,"endTime":1617.56,"body":"really derided as a something"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1617.56,"endTime":1621.19,"body":"that people thought of, is"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1617.56,"endTime":1621.19,"body":"really tawdry and sleazy, and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1621.19,"endTime":1626.38,"body":"associated with grit and decay,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1621.19,"endTime":1626.38,"body":"and then became admired and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1626.38,"endTime":1632.05,"body":"beloved again, in a nostalgic"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1626.38,"endTime":1632.05,"body":"way, in more recent decades. So"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1632.05,"endTime":1636.7,"body":"I, I, and then when it comes to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1632.05,"endTime":1636.7,"body":"patents, like I said, having"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1636.73,"endTime":1639.73,"body":"done this chronological"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1636.73,"endTime":1639.73,"body":"arrangement of the things that"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1639.73,"endTime":1642.76,"body":"are featured in the book, I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1639.73,"endTime":1642.76,"body":"think it's, it's very"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1642.76,"endTime":1646.96,"body":"interesting to me, how the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1642.76,"endTime":1646.96,"body":"passage of what's really in the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1646.96,"endTime":1652.06,"body":"grand scheme of things a very,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1646.96,"endTime":1652.06,"body":"very, very short blip in"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1652.0900000000001,"endTime":1656.29,"body":"history, you can go like, look"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1652.0900000000001,"endTime":1656.29,"body":"at something that was made 10"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1656.29,"endTime":1660.1000000000001,"body":"years before something else and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1656.29,"endTime":1660.1000000000001,"body":"see this incred dramatic"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1660.1000000000001,"endTime":1665.98,"body":"difference, you think of like a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1660.1000000000001,"endTime":1665.98,"body":"car, from 1930, versus a car"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1665.98,"endTime":1669.79,"body":"from 1960. I mean, 30, what's 30"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1665.98,"endTime":1669.79,"body":"years, and then the history of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1669.79,"endTime":1674.98,"body":"the world is nothing, and yet,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1669.79,"endTime":1674.98,"body":"how incredibly different those"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1674.98,"endTime":1679.81,"body":"two cars look from each other?"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1674.98,"endTime":1679.81,"body":"It's just, that is something"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1679.81,"endTime":1685.6000000000001,"body":"that seems to continue"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1679.81,"endTime":1685.6000000000001,"body":"continuously interests me. So"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1685.6000000000001,"endTime":1689.17,"body":"that's what the three books have"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1685.6000000000001,"endTime":1689.17,"body":"in common, I think, not that you"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1689.17,"endTime":1691.21,"body":"asked me that. There you go."},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1692.74,"endTime":1695.74,"body":"Alright, so where"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1692.74,"endTime":1695.74,"body":"I was getting out with the book"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1695.74,"endTime":1698.89,"body":"question actually wanted to"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1695.74,"endTime":1698.89,"body":"know, what's the process, like,"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1698.92,"endTime":1701.71,"body":"when writing a book and"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1698.92,"endTime":1701.71,"body":"publishing it, I'm sure our"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1701.71,"endTime":1704.0800000000002,"body":"audience would be interested in"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1701.71,"endTime":1704.0800000000002,"body":"knowing that and not it's not a"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1704.0800000000002,"endTime":1707.65,"body":"subject that nobody else I think"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1704.0800000000002,"endTime":1707.65,"body":"has addressed in this podcast so"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":1707.65,"endTime":1708.13,"body":"far."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1709.1200000000001,"endTime":1712.5700000000002,"body":"Well, uh, I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1709.1200000000001,"endTime":1712.5700000000002,"body":"think it sounds probably a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1712.5700000000002,"endTime":1717.22,"body":"little cheesy, but perseverance"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1712.5700000000002,"endTime":1717.22,"body":"would be, if I was talking to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1717.22,"endTime":1719.71,"body":"somebody who's interested in"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1717.22,"endTime":1719.71,"body":"writing a book, I would just"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1719.71,"endTime":1725.0800000000002,"body":"say, perseverance, like,  just"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1719.71,"endTime":1725.0800000000002,"body":"write it on a index card, they"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1725.0800000000002,"endTime":1728.29,"body":"still make index cards, and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1725.0800000000002,"endTime":1728.29,"body":"like, pin it above your desk,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1728.5900000000001,"endTime":1735.49,"body":"and be prepared for having to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1728.5900000000001,"endTime":1735.49,"body":"overcome discouragement, in"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1735.79,"endTime":1738.73,"body":"every imaginable and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1735.79,"endTime":1738.73,"body":"unimaginable form that it might"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1738.73,"endTime":1741.91,"body":"come in, and be prepared to,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1738.73,"endTime":1741.91,"body":"like hunker down and like be"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1741.91,"endTime":1748.78,"body":"pursuing this objective for"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1741.91,"endTime":1748.78,"body":"years. But, I mean, for me, the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1748.81,"endTime":1753.28,"body":"the first book, I had this idea,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1748.81,"endTime":1753.28,"body":"I loved photographing these"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1753.31,"endTime":1757.99,"body":"ruined and abandoned buildings"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1753.31,"endTime":1757.99,"body":"in the Hudson River Valley, back"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1757.99,"endTime":1762.88,"body":"in the 90s. And I thought, make"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1757.99,"endTime":1762.88,"body":"a great book,  these things are"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1763.0,"endTime":1766.18,"body":"so photogenic, and really was"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1763.0,"endTime":1766.18,"body":"just all about the aesthetic to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1766.18,"endTime":1773.1100000000001,"body":"me, but I said, Well, how am I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1766.18,"endTime":1773.1100000000001,"body":"gonna, like, actually, make this"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1773.1100000000001,"endTime":1776.23,"body":"a book, like, how are we going"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1773.1100000000001,"endTime":1776.23,"body":"to sell this idea to somebody."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1776.98,"endTime":1780.3700000000001,"body":"And there are books about"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1776.98,"endTime":1780.3700000000001,"body":"writing book proposals. And so I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1780.3700000000001,"endTime":1784.96,"body":"got my hands on some of those"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1780.3700000000001,"endTime":1784.96,"body":"books about book proposals. And"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1787.15,"endTime":1789.94,"body":"then said about crafting a book"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1787.15,"endTime":1789.94,"body":"proposal, which is basically"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1789.94,"endTime":1796.21,"body":"like writing a small book, it's,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1789.94,"endTime":1796.21,"body":"like, you do an outline, like a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1796.21,"endTime":1801.6100000000001,"body":"table of contents, and you pitch"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1796.21,"endTime":1801.6100000000001,"body":"your idea, and then you maybe"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1801.6100000000001,"endTime":1805.21,"body":"have another section that gives"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1801.6100000000001,"endTime":1805.21,"body":"a little mock up of what the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1805.24,"endTime":1809.2,"body":"book might actually look like,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1805.24,"endTime":1809.2,"body":"if it's gonna be, it may or may"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1809.2,"endTime":1813.19,"body":"not be graphic graphics"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1809.2,"endTime":1813.19,"body":"intensive, or it may be really"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1813.19,"endTime":1817.27,"body":"text, heavy, but you do like"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1813.19,"endTime":1817.27,"body":"some sample pages, basically,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1818.3200000000002,"endTime":1820.39,"body":"and then you have a section"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1818.3200000000002,"endTime":1820.39,"body":"with, okay, well, who's the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1821.23,"endTime":1823.24,"body":"target audience of this, like,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1821.23,"endTime":1823.24,"body":"who's actually going to buy"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1823.24,"endTime":1827.1100000000001,"body":"this? Like, have I thought about"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1823.24,"endTime":1827.1100000000001,"body":"that? And how are you going to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1827.14,"endTime":1833.2,"body":"sell this to the skeptical"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1827.14,"endTime":1833.2,"body":"editor at a publisher, and then"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1833.2,"endTime":1837.46,"body":"you look at related titles for"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1833.2,"endTime":1837.46,"body":"as you went to just like with"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1837.46,"endTime":1841.27,"body":"patents, you want to make sure"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1837.46,"endTime":1841.27,"body":"you're not doing something that"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1841.27,"endTime":1845.68,"body":"somebody else has done before."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1841.27,"endTime":1845.68,"body":"And so you have to, like"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1845.68,"endTime":1849.94,"body":"summarize all these things in a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1845.68,"endTime":1849.94,"body":"nice neat little like small book"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1850.78,"endTime":1853.45,"body":"of its own, and then start"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1850.78,"endTime":1853.45,"body":"shopping that around to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1853.45,"endTime":1858.64,"body":"publishers, you get to find"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1853.45,"endTime":1858.64,"body":"shortlist, which publishers have"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1858.67,"endTime":1862.51,"body":"published books of this nature."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1858.67,"endTime":1862.51,"body":"Before we, where the publishers"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1862.51,"endTime":1865.8400000000001,"body":"who seem to have demonstrated an"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1862.51,"endTime":1865.8400000000001,"body":"interest in this particular"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1865.8700000000001,"endTime":1869.3500000000001,"body":"genre, whatever it is, I'm"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1865.8700000000001,"endTime":1869.3500000000001,"body":"trying to get published here."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1869.65,"endTime":1874.42,"body":"And then sometimes you have to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1869.65,"endTime":1874.42,"body":"do the homework to get the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1874.42,"endTime":1879.01,"body":"editors names that may or may"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1874.42,"endTime":1879.01,"body":"not be easy to find, you might"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1879.01,"endTime":1883.21,"body":"have to get creative and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1879.01,"endTime":1883.21,"body":"tracking those people down. And"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1883.21,"endTime":1886.81,"body":"then, more and more often, I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1883.21,"endTime":1886.81,"body":"found through the years"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1886.81,"endTime":1891.1000000000001,"body":"publishers, we'll have you go to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1886.81,"endTime":1891.1000000000001,"body":"the website of almost any"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1891.1000000000001,"endTime":1894.49,"body":"publisher, and they'll have"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1891.1000000000001,"endTime":1894.49,"body":"usually submission guidelines to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1894.49,"endTime":1897.8500000000001,"body":"tell you exactly what format,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1894.49,"endTime":1897.8500000000001,"body":"they want a book proposal to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1897.8500000000001,"endTime":1900.88,"body":"come in, but very often, they'll"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1897.8500000000001,"endTime":1900.88,"body":"have like, just don't send us"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1900.88,"endTime":1904.48,"body":"anything. But you have to know"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1900.88,"endTime":1904.48,"body":"how to be like, well, I'm gonna"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1904.48,"endTime":1913.54,"body":"send this to you anyway. And, do"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1904.48,"endTime":1913.54,"body":"it gently. I've even encountered"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1913.54,"endTime":1916.24,"body":"some publishers in recent years"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1913.54,"endTime":1916.24,"body":"that, like, you have to send"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1916.24,"endTime":1918.01,"body":"them like 100 bucks or"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1916.24,"endTime":1918.01,"body":"something, or they won't even"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1918.01,"endTime":1921.43,"body":"look at your project. And I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1918.01,"endTime":1921.43,"body":"think that actually was enough"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1921.43,"endTime":1925.27,"body":"to discourage me from submitting"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1921.43,"endTime":1925.27,"body":"to those publishers. But, I did"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1925.39,"endTime":1928.45,"body":"think about just sending them"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1925.39,"endTime":1928.45,"body":"something anyway, without the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1928.45,"endTime":1930.8500000000001,"body":"100 bucks and saying, if you're"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1928.45,"endTime":1930.8500000000001,"body":"interested in this, take it out"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1930.8500000000001,"endTime":1935.47,"body":"of my commission, if you're not"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1930.8500000000001,"endTime":1935.47,"body":"interested that the 100 bucks"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1935.47,"endTime":1936.7,"body":"isn't going to make the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1935.47,"endTime":1936.7,"body":"difference. But you could"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1936.7,"endTime":1938.92,"body":"publish this or not, if you're"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1936.7,"endTime":1938.92,"body":"interested in this idea, you're"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1939.28,"endTime":1941.68,"body":"not gonna care about whether I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1939.28,"endTime":1941.68,"body":"sent you a check for 100 bucks,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1942.01,"endTime":1947.71,"body":"it's bigger than 100 bucks to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1942.01,"endTime":1947.71,"body":"you, as a publisher. So anyway,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1947.89,"endTime":1956.26,"body":"sometimes you have to get"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1947.89,"endTime":1956.26,"body":"creative, and looking at"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1956.6200000000001,"endTime":1961.69,"body":"whatever the challenges might be"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1956.6200000000001,"endTime":1961.69,"body":"the myriad challenges anyway, I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1961.69,"endTime":1966.76,"body":"hope I didn't discourage people."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1961.69,"endTime":1966.76,"body":"Like I said, perseverance. It"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1966.79,"endTime":1970.18,"body":"does sound like a lot of work."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":1966.79,"endTime":1970.18,"body":"But, it's you got to look at it"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2012.05,"endTime":2014.69,"body":"is unless, well, depending on"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2012.05,"endTime":2014.69,"body":"how much free time you have,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2015.9199999999998,"endTime":2020.27,"body":"it's probably going to be at"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2015.9199999999998,"endTime":2020.27,"body":"least a year process to develop"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2020.27,"endTime":2022.94,"body":"an idea for a book and then"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2020.27,"endTime":2022.94,"body":"pitch it and then hopefully get"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2022.97,"endTime":2028.82,"body":"an editor. I mean, I started out"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2022.97,"endTime":2028.82,"body":"looking at it as like it's going"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2028.82,"endTime":2033.98,"body":"to be several years before I get"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2028.82,"endTime":2033.98,"body":"this thing off the ground. And"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2034.37,"endTime":2037.52,"body":"two of the three books had been"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2034.37,"endTime":2037.52,"body":"lucky. And it was quicker than"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2037.52,"endTime":2041.45,"body":"that. But the first book was,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2037.52,"endTime":2041.45,"body":"first books always gonna be the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2041.45,"endTime":2046.73,"body":"hardest. But the first book was,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2041.45,"endTime":2046.73,"body":"was yours was really yours. I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2046.73,"endTime":2052.04,"body":"was about to give up. But then"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2046.73,"endTime":2052.04,"body":"along came, someone interested?"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2053.63,"endTime":2054.89,"body":"Yeah, perseverance."},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2056.57,"endTime":2059.2400000000002,"body":"There's one thing"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2056.57,"endTime":2059.2400000000002,"body":"that I wondered sometimes, and I"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2059.2400000000002,"endTime":2062.27,"body":"think always discusses with"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2059.2400000000002,"endTime":2062.27,"body":"other friends and colleagues,"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2062.27,"endTime":2065.81,"body":"and I never had a chance to ask"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2062.27,"endTime":2065.81,"body":"an actual author. And this is"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2065.81,"endTime":2068.27,"body":"not about your book, in"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2065.81,"endTime":2068.27,"body":"particular, just books in"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2068.27,"endTime":2073.13,"body":"general. My question is, why are"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2068.27,"endTime":2073.13,"body":"books so long? I mean, why can't"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2073.13,"endTime":2075.4700000000003,"body":"we just get the idea across in"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2073.13,"endTime":2075.4700000000003,"body":"10 pages?"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2077.42,"endTime":2081.62,"body":"Well, some are"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2077.42,"endTime":2081.62,"body":"pretty sure. Behind me, I have"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2081.62,"endTime":2085.4,"body":"some big books and some little"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2081.62,"endTime":2085.4,"body":"books, my Patented is 1000 page"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2085.4,"endTime":2094.3399999999997,"body":"book. Well, Kurt Vonnegut had,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2085.4,"endTime":2094.3399999999997,"body":"like, 10 commandments. For"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2094.3399999999997,"endTime":2097.3399999999997,"body":"writers, I think I'm remembering"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2094.3399999999997,"endTime":2097.3399999999997,"body":"this right, I'm paraphrasing a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2097.3399999999997,"endTime":2099.89,"body":"little bit, one of those 10"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2097.3399999999997,"endTime":2099.89,"body":"commandments was: Don't waste"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2099.89,"endTime":2105.1099999999997,"body":"your readers' time. Patented is"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2099.89,"endTime":2105.1099999999997,"body":"a very graphically intense book."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2105.1099999999997,"endTime":2108.2599999999998,"body":"So there's not a lot of text in"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2105.1099999999997,"endTime":2108.2599999999998,"body":"Patented. I mean, you could"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2108.2599999999998,"endTime":2114.08,"body":"spend hours and hours I spent"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2108.2599999999998,"endTime":2114.08,"body":"years looking at that. And but I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2114.08,"endTime":2119.8399999999997,"body":"think he was more intending that"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2114.08,"endTime":2119.8399999999997,"body":"particular commandment for"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2119.8399999999997,"endTime":2122.12,"body":"people who are thinking about"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2119.8399999999997,"endTime":2122.12,"body":"writing something, it was more"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2122.12,"endTime":2126.2,"body":"text intensive. But if you"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2122.12,"endTime":2126.2,"body":"could, don't waste your your"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2126.2,"endTime":2128.5699999999997,"body":"readers time, I mean, if you"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2126.2,"endTime":2128.5699999999997,"body":"have an idea that you can convey"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2128.5699999999997,"endTime":2132.1699999999996,"body":"in 10 pages, right, in 10 pages,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2128.5699999999997,"endTime":2132.1699999999996,"body":"maybe it's a magazine article,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2132.1699999999996,"endTime":2136.13,"body":"and not a book,  but if you have"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2132.1699999999996,"endTime":2136.13,"body":"an idea that's going to take 200"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2136.13,"endTime":2142.5499999999997,"body":"pages, well,  don't make it 500"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2136.13,"endTime":2142.5499999999997,"body":"pages, make 100 pages, and like"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2142.5499999999997,"endTime":2150.7999999999997,"body":"the editors jobs are to look at"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2142.5499999999997,"endTime":2150.7999999999997,"body":"a an idea. And if a writer gives"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2150.7999999999997,"endTime":2155.96,"body":"them 500 pages to say, I think"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2150.7999999999997,"endTime":2155.96,"body":"this can be on 200 pages. And"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2156.2,"endTime":2161.81,"body":"but no, there's value in being"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2156.2,"endTime":2161.81,"body":"succinct and this is something"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2161.81,"endTime":2167.72,"body":"that I have, I didn't come to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2161.81,"endTime":2167.72,"body":"writing books, knowing this."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2167.93,"endTime":2170.5099999999998,"body":"This is something that I have"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2167.93,"endTime":2170.5099999999998,"body":"had to work at, and it's"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2170.5099999999998,"endTime":2175.61,"body":"incredible, how few words you"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2170.5099999999998,"endTime":2175.61,"body":"can actually get a an idea"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2175.61,"endTime":2179.87,"body":"across. And sometimes, maybe you"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2175.61,"endTime":2179.87,"body":"thought it was going to take 500"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2179.87,"endTime":2182.57,"body":"words to articulate this and you"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2179.87,"endTime":2182.57,"body":"could, you might be surprised"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2182.57,"endTime":2187.82,"body":"when you could do it in 100. So,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2182.57,"endTime":2187.82,"body":"and there's real value, like you"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2187.82,"endTime":2190.22,"body":"as a writer are like, totally,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2187.82,"endTime":2190.22,"body":"you think this is most"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2190.22,"endTime":2193.7,"body":"interesting thing in the world."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2190.22,"endTime":2193.7,"body":"But your reader might not think"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2193.7,"endTime":2195.56,"body":"it's the most interesting thing"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2193.7,"endTime":2195.56,"body":"in the world or might not have"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2195.56,"endTime":2200.54,"body":"as much time to give it as you"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2195.56,"endTime":2200.54,"body":"do. And so like Kurt Vonnegut"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2200.54,"endTime":2203.9,"body":"said, Don't waste your readers"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2200.54,"endTime":2203.9,"body":"times one or two of my earlier"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2203.9,"endTime":2207.17,"body":"editor's is going to hear me say"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2203.9,"endTime":2207.17,"body":"that maybe in be like, what"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2207.23,"endTime":2213.92,"body":"renaldi. to bed? Do you bet you"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2207.23,"endTime":2213.92,"body":"hadn't read that Vonnegut thing"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2213.95,"endTime":2218.66,"body":"before you sent me that giant"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2213.95,"endTime":2218.66,"body":"wild grab?"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2220.61,"endTime":2223.19,"body":"I'll have to ask"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2220.61,"endTime":2223.19,"body":"another question that only an"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2223.19,"endTime":2226.64,"body":"author can can answer. These are"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2223.19,"endTime":2226.64,"body":"very candid questions. So I hope"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2226.64,"endTime":2231.5,"body":"you're not offended. But so"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2226.64,"endTime":2231.5,"body":"like, for my question is from a"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2231.5,"endTime":2235.88,"body":"purely selfish standpoint, what"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2231.5,"endTime":2235.88,"body":"do you get out of publishing a"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2235.88,"endTime":2236.36,"body":"book?"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2237.0499999999997,"endTime":2238.73,"body":"I would say"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2237.0499999999997,"endTime":2238.73,"body":"multiple things, not that hard"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2238.73,"endTime":2241.82,"body":"of a question to answer. I don't"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2238.73,"endTime":2241.82,"body":"think I'm not finding it hard."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2243.65,"endTime":2247.64,"body":"It's certainly gratifying. And"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2243.65,"endTime":2247.64,"body":"this is, like, maybe the first"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2247.64,"endTime":2251.06,"body":"thing that some people will"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2247.64,"endTime":2251.06,"body":"think it's gratifying, and I'm,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2251.06,"endTime":2254.15,"body":"like, thrilled to think like,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2251.06,"endTime":2254.15,"body":"long after I'm dead. There'll be"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2254.15,"endTime":2256.85,"body":"a book with my name on it spine"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2254.15,"endTime":2256.85,"body":"in the New York Public Library"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2256.85,"endTime":2259.61,"body":"somewhere, Lord knows what the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2256.85,"endTime":2259.61,"body":"future of libraries and books"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2259.61,"endTime":2265.73,"body":"are, but like these ideas of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2259.61,"endTime":2265.73,"body":"mine have a life that's longer"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2265.73,"endTime":2268.4,"body":"than mine. And that's that's"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2265.73,"endTime":2268.4,"body":"just gratify Zeus playing"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2268.4,"endTime":2273.89,"body":"gratifying, but I think, when I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2268.4,"endTime":2273.89,"body":"approach that I've written three"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2273.89,"endTime":2276.65,"body":"books. Now, I hope to be able to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2273.89,"endTime":2276.65,"body":"one day say, I've written more"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2276.65,"endTime":2279.77,"body":"than that it's not that many"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2276.65,"endTime":2279.77,"body":"compared to a lot of authors."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2279.98,"endTime":2288.23,"body":"But when I approach a project, I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2279.98,"endTime":2288.23,"body":"do keep in mind, okay, is this"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2288.23,"endTime":2293.0,"body":"something that has been done"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2288.23,"endTime":2293.0,"body":"before? And if it has, can I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2293.0299999999997,"endTime":2296.9,"body":"really do it better? And even if"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2293.0299999999997,"endTime":2296.9,"body":"I can do it better? Is that"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2297.0499999999997,"endTime":2300.62,"body":"like, a waste of paper? Am I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2297.0499999999997,"endTime":2300.62,"body":"wasting the readers time? And if"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2300.62,"endTime":2305.66,"body":"the answer is, yes, then well,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2300.62,"endTime":2305.66,"body":"there's plenty other ideas out"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2305.66,"endTime":2315.08,"body":"there? Yeah, I think. So what do"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2305.66,"endTime":2315.08,"body":"you then get out of, I don't"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2315.08,"endTime":2318.77,"body":"know, I think you're wasting"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2315.08,"endTime":2318.77,"body":"your own time as an author, if"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2318.77,"endTime":2321.47,"body":"you're writing something that"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2318.77,"endTime":2321.47,"body":"somebody else has already"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2321.47,"endTime":2325.0099999999998,"body":"written in, then okay, I guess"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2321.47,"endTime":2325.0099999999998,"body":"you get the gratification. But,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2325.4,"endTime":2327.89,"body":"I mean, for me that the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2325.4,"endTime":2327.89,"body":"gratification in that instance,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2327.89,"endTime":2335.12,"body":"would be quite a lot mitigated"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2327.89,"endTime":2335.12,"body":"by the lingering thought that I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2335.12,"endTime":2341.54,"body":"had just wasted paper, just done"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2335.12,"endTime":2341.54,"body":"something that, that somebody"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2341.54,"endTime":2344.54,"body":"else had done before. So, I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2341.54,"endTime":2344.54,"body":"mean, there's certain subjects"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2344.54,"endTime":2347.15,"body":"that I find quite interesting,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2344.54,"endTime":2347.15,"body":"and somebody has written the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2347.15,"endTime":2349.13,"body":"book, but then somebody else"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2347.15,"endTime":2349.13,"body":"comes along, read book, there's"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2349.13,"endTime":2351.32,"body":"another book, there's another"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2349.13,"endTime":2351.32,"body":"book is a book here, this is"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2351.32,"endTime":2355.58,"body":"another book. And it's really,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2351.32,"endTime":2355.58,"body":"we really need all these books"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2355.61,"endTime":2357.62,"body":"on the same subject."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2359.57,"endTime":2365.57,"body":"But what do you get out of it?"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2359.57,"endTime":2365.57,"body":"For Patented, this began as this"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2365.57,"endTime":2369.5,"body":"is something that I found"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2365.57,"endTime":2369.5,"body":"fascinating, regardless of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2369.5,"endTime":2373.37,"body":"whether or not it was going to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2369.5,"endTime":2373.37,"body":"be a book, regardless, it's,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2373.4,"endTime":2377.81,"body":"it's great to be able to share"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2373.4,"endTime":2377.81,"body":"something that I think is really"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2377.81,"endTime":2380.99,"body":"interesting with other people,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2377.81,"endTime":2380.99,"body":"and hopefully, maybe interest"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2380.99,"endTime":2383.72,"body":"other people or, like, light up"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2380.99,"endTime":2383.72,"body":"an interest in somebody else"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2383.99,"endTime":2387.0499999999997,"body":"that they didn't even know, they"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2383.99,"endTime":2387.0499999999997,"body":"had, I think that's, that's"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2387.0499999999997,"endTime":2393.68,"body":"really great. But, for me, I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2387.0499999999997,"endTime":2393.68,"body":"just got a lot out of this"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2393.68,"endTime":2397.16,"body":"rabbit hole of looking at all"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2393.68,"endTime":2397.16,"body":"these patents,  it's changed the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2397.16,"endTime":2400.61,"body":"way this particular book has"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2397.16,"endTime":2400.61,"body":"changed the way I look at the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2400.61,"endTime":2405.11,"body":"world, I mean, almost any room"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2400.61,"endTime":2405.11,"body":"I'm in at any given time, I'm"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2405.11,"endTime":2409.49,"body":"sitting in my office today, and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2405.11,"endTime":2409.49,"body":"I had to go make a phone call."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2409.49,"endTime":2412.43,"body":"So I went to like the room and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2409.49,"endTime":2412.43,"body":"they in the office, where you"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2412.43,"endTime":2415.07,"body":"could, like, make a phone call"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2412.43,"endTime":2415.07,"body":"without bothering your co"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2415.07,"endTime":2418.4,"body":"workers. And I'm sitting in the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2415.07,"endTime":2418.4,"body":"room and looking around the room"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2418.4,"endTime":2422.84,"body":"and I'm like, Ah, that new"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2418.4,"endTime":2422.84,"body":"computer, and I think I've found"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2422.84,"endTime":2426.2599999999998,"body":"a design pattern for that"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2422.84,"endTime":2426.2599999999998,"body":"computer. And I think to myself,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2427.34,"endTime":2429.56,"body":"Oh, I like but I can't remember"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2427.34,"endTime":2429.56,"body":"the names of the designers. I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2429.56,"endTime":2432.7999999999997,"body":"got to go look that up, when I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2429.56,"endTime":2432.7999999999997,"body":"when I think of it, then I'm"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2432.7999999999997,"endTime":2435.62,"body":"going to like see what else they"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2432.7999999999997,"endTime":2435.62,"body":"designed and  that you start to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2436.31,"endTime":2440.09,"body":"notice it's made everything so"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2436.31,"endTime":2440.09,"body":"much more interesting. I wanted"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2440.09,"endTime":2445.7599999999998,"body":"to BestBuy a few months ago. And"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2440.09,"endTime":2445.7599999999998,"body":"it's just looking at all of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2445.7599999999998,"endTime":2450.32,"body":"these products, these vacuum"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2445.7599999999998,"endTime":2450.32,"body":"cleaners and cameras and phones"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2450.32,"endTime":2453.59,"body":"and computers and like it just"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2450.32,"endTime":2453.59,"body":"they were so much more"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2453.65,"endTime":2458.54,"body":"interesting to me because of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2453.65,"endTime":2458.54,"body":"this project. And I'm going to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2458.54,"endTime":2461.66,"body":"plug my Instagram I have my own"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2458.54,"endTime":2461.66,"body":"Instagram but then there's an"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2461.66,"endTime":2467.39,"body":"Instagram for the book. And it's"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2461.66,"endTime":2467.39,"body":"it's design patent daily is the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2467.39,"endTime":2471.98,"body":"handle all one word design"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2467.39,"endTime":2471.98,"body":"patent daily. And I try it turns"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2471.98,"endTime":2475.52,"body":"out to not be quite daily, but I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2471.98,"endTime":2475.52,"body":"pick something usually something"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2475.52,"endTime":2479.72,"body":"from the book almost always have"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2475.52,"endTime":2479.72,"body":"something from the book. And I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2479.72,"endTime":2482.69,"body":"try to do like a little one"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2479.72,"endTime":2482.69,"body":"paragraph blurb about that"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2482.69,"endTime":2484.7599999999998,"body":"particular thing because the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2482.69,"endTime":2484.7599999999998,"body":"book I didn't really have the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2484.7599999999998,"endTime":2488.0,"body":"opportunity to tell you much"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2484.7599999999998,"endTime":2488.0,"body":"about the things that are"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2488.15,"endTime":2491.72,"body":"featured in the book. So when"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2488.15,"endTime":2491.72,"body":"these Instagram posts, I can"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2491.72,"endTime":2494.2999999999997,"body":"tell you a little bit more about"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2491.72,"endTime":2494.2999999999997,"body":"what these things actually are."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2494.54,"endTime":2498.59,"body":"And the process of doing this,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2494.54,"endTime":2498.59,"body":"this is no longer a book, this"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2498.59,"endTime":2503.72,"body":"is an Instagram account. But the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2498.59,"endTime":2503.72,"body":"process of doing this is just"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2504.23,"endTime":2510.14,"body":"hugely informative, I look"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2504.23,"endTime":2510.14,"body":"forward to doing these posts"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2511.25,"endTime":2516.92,"body":"just so, so much, like, I'd be"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2511.25,"endTime":2516.92,"body":"like, okay, what are the couple"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2516.92,"endTime":2519.92,"body":"of patents, I might be able to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2516.92,"endTime":2519.92,"body":"do an Instagram post about today"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2519.92,"endTime":2523.4,"body":"from the book, and look down"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2519.92,"endTime":2523.4,"body":"this list of maybe six or eight"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2523.4,"endTime":2527.33,"body":"things, and sometimes it's like,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2523.4,"endTime":2527.33,"body":"ooh, like, I want to, like, take"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2527.33,"endTime":2529.85,"body":"that one. And I'm gonna, like,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2527.33,"endTime":2529.85,"body":"now I'm going to take a little"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2529.85,"endTime":2536.0299999999997,"body":"time and research this thing."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2529.85,"endTime":2536.0299999999997,"body":"And then write a paragraph about"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2536.0299999999997,"endTime":2542.45,"body":"this thing in the, the exercise"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2536.0299999999997,"endTime":2542.45,"body":"of doing this, it's just, so I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2542.45,"endTime":2546.2,"body":"just loving doing it, and I'm"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2542.45,"endTime":2546.2,"body":"learning so much in the, in the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2546.2,"endTime":2550.46,"body":"course of doing it. So, this,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2546.2,"endTime":2550.46,"body":"I'm giving a very long answer to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2550.46,"endTime":2552.32,"body":"this question, and I have more,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2553.97,"endTime":2557.57,"body":"We're gonna have to answer. But"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2553.97,"endTime":2557.57,"body":"the New York Neon, for instance,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2557.75,"endTime":2562.64,"body":"the last week, I did, this"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2557.75,"endTime":2562.64,"body":"started as photographs, I wanted"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2562.64,"endTime":2565.13,"body":"to take photographs of these"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2562.64,"endTime":2565.13,"body":"neon storefront signs,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2565.13,"endTime":2568.22,"body":"particularly neon storefront"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2565.13,"endTime":2568.22,"body":"signs, in the five boroughs of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2568.22,"endTime":2570.95,"body":"New York City, because I saw"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2568.22,"endTime":2570.95,"body":"that they were disappearing, and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2570.95,"endTime":2574.1,"body":"I wanted to get the pictures"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2570.95,"endTime":2574.1,"body":"before what's seen, the pictures"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2574.1,"endTime":2575.45,"body":"are going to be all that's left."},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2574.1,"endTime":2575.45,"body":"And if I didn't take the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2575.45,"endTime":2579.11,"body":"pictures, they wouldn't even be"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2575.45,"endTime":2579.11,"body":"that, and started just as"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2579.11,"endTime":2582.2599999999998,"body":"photographs, but then I wanted"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2579.11,"endTime":2582.2599999999998,"body":"to write an introduction to the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2582.29,"endTime":2585.62,"body":"book, to put these things into"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2582.29,"endTime":2585.62,"body":"context and explain the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2585.62,"endTime":2588.35,"body":"significance. And the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2585.62,"endTime":2588.35,"body":"introduction turned out to be"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2588.35,"endTime":2594.5,"body":"half the book, and it's much to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2588.35,"endTime":2594.5,"body":"my editors, conservation, but it"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2594.5,"endTime":2598.0099999999998,"body":"got boiled down from what it was"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2594.5,"endTime":2598.0099999999998,"body":"gonna be God, which everyone can"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2598.0099999999998,"endTime":2601.19,"body":"be thankful for. But in the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2598.0099999999998,"endTime":2601.19,"body":"course of writing an"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2601.19,"endTime":2607.34,"body":"introduction, I had to educate"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2601.19,"endTime":2607.34,"body":"myself on well, the practical"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2607.34,"endTime":2611.33,"body":"and the history of neon on a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2607.34,"endTime":2611.33,"body":"practical level, okay, when was"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2611.33,"endTime":2614.2999999999997,"body":"neon gas discovered? And what"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2611.33,"endTime":2614.2999999999997,"body":"are the tools and who are the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2614.2999999999997,"endTime":2618.5,"body":"people that made the signs, but"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2614.2999999999997,"endTime":2618.5,"body":"then also the cultural history I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2618.5,"endTime":2622.31,"body":"had to get up to speed on,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2618.5,"endTime":2622.31,"body":"because we have these, neon is,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2622.34,"endTime":2626.96,"body":"is a subject that people have,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2622.34,"endTime":2626.96,"body":"like, very strong responses to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2626.96,"endTime":2631.5499999999997,"body":"it. And I was interested in"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2626.96,"endTime":2631.5499999999997,"body":"sussing out like, okay, like,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2631.5499999999997,"endTime":2634.91,"body":"what's his steered those"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2631.5499999999997,"endTime":2634.91,"body":"reactions that people have to"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2634.91,"endTime":2638.96,"body":"neon, so I'm looking at neon is"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2634.91,"endTime":2638.96,"body":"represented in song and neon is"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2638.96,"endTime":2642.56,"body":"represented in literature, neon"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2638.96,"endTime":2642.56,"body":"is represented in film. And so"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2642.56,"endTime":2646.37,"body":"then I'm having to watch, like"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2642.56,"endTime":2646.37,"body":"hundreds of movies, and I'm"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2646.37,"endTime":2650.54,"body":"having to read, like, every book"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2646.37,"endTime":2650.54,"body":"I can get my hands on, and not"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2650.54,"endTime":2653.81,"body":"just like, histories, but books"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2650.54,"endTime":2653.81,"body":"like on the road, like, I'd"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2653.81,"endTime":2656.39,"body":"never read Jack Kerouac on the"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2653.81,"endTime":2656.39,"body":"road. And I picked it up and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2656.39,"endTime":2659.75,"body":"read it to be able to inform"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2656.39,"endTime":2659.75,"body":"what I was going to write in my"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2659.75,"endTime":2662.57,"body":"introduction. And I found these"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2659.75,"endTime":2662.57,"body":"incredible quotes where Jack"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2662.57,"endTime":2668.69,"body":"Kerouac is specifically writing"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2662.57,"endTime":2668.69,"body":"about, neon is a way of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2668.87,"endTime":2675.2599999999998,"body":"developing and illustrating his"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2668.87,"endTime":2675.2599999999998,"body":"scenes and in that book, and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2675.2599999999998,"endTime":2679.31,"body":"then the hard boiled detective"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2675.2599999999998,"endTime":2679.31,"body":"novels of a, a couple years, a"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2679.31,"endTime":2682.64,"body":"couple decades before Kerouac,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2679.31,"endTime":2682.64,"body":"like the Dashiell Hammett kinds"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2682.64,"endTime":2687.08,"body":"of novels, and reading those, I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2682.64,"endTime":2687.08,"body":"never read those before, and"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2687.08,"endTime":2692.0,"body":"I'll sit down now and like,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2687.08,"endTime":2692.0,"body":"watch jeopardy, and I'll get,"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2692.09,"endTime":2694.46,"body":"like a lot of things, right. And"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2692.09,"endTime":2694.46,"body":"I'll think to myself, I never"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2694.46,"endTime":2697.46,"body":"would have known that if I"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2694.46,"endTime":2697.46,"body":"hadn't written that book, I'd"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2697.46,"endTime":2701.57,"body":"never would like it's just it's"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2697.46,"endTime":2701.57,"body":"so what is it? What I get out of"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2701.57,"endTime":2705.47,"body":"it? What does an author get out"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2701.57,"endTime":2705.47,"body":"of writing a book? It's, this"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2705.47,"endTime":2707.69,"body":"would be different if it were"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2705.47,"endTime":2707.69,"body":"the work of fiction versus"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2707.69,"endTime":2712.67,"body":"nonfiction. But, there are some"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2707.69,"endTime":2712.67,"body":"of the things in a very, very"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2712.67,"endTime":2718.67,"body":"long answer. Things that they've"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2712.67,"endTime":2718.67,"body":"gotten out of it besides just it"},{"speaker":"Thomas Rinaldi","startTime":2718.67,"endTime":2720.2,"body":"being gratifying, but, yep."},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2720.79,"endTime":2723.4,"body":"All right. That"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2720.79,"endTime":2723.4,"body":"is all we have for this episode."},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2723.4,"endTime":2726.49,"body":"Thank you everyone for joining"},{"speaker":"Rafael Testai","startTime":2723.4,"endTime":2726.49,"body":"and until next time."},{"speaker":"Aaron Moncur","startTime":2730.12,"endTime":2733.57,"body":"I'm Aaron Moncur,"},{"speaker":"Aaron Moncur","startTime":2730.12,"endTime":2733.57,"body":"founder of Pipeline Design, and"},{"speaker":"Aaron Moncur","startTime":2733.57,"endTime":2736.6,"body":"Engineering. If you liked what"},{"speaker":"Aaron Moncur","startTime":2733.57,"endTime":2736.6,"body":"you heard today, please share"},{"speaker":"Aaron Moncur","startTime":2736.6,"endTime":2740.14,"body":"the episode. To learn how your"},{"speaker":"Aaron Moncur","startTime":2736.6,"endTime":2740.14,"body":"team can leverage our team's"},{"speaker":"Aaron Moncur","startTime":2740.14,"endTime":2743.89,"body":"expertise developing turnkey"},{"speaker":"Aaron Moncur","startTime":2740.14,"endTime":2743.89,"body":"equipment, custom fixtures and"},{"speaker":"Aaron Moncur","startTime":2743.92,"endTime":2747.91,"body":"automated machines and with"},{"speaker":"Aaron Moncur","startTime":2743.92,"endTime":2747.91,"body":"product design, visit us at"},{"speaker":"Aaron Moncur","startTime":2747.94,"endTime":2750.97,"body":"teampipeline.us. Thanks for"},{"speaker":"Aaron Moncur","startTime":2747.94,"endTime":2750.97,"body":"listening."}]}