Special: LIVE Holiday Hot Cocoa Edition

Although AC is no longer on the show, you can still listen to Turn up the AC's "Christmas Gifts" episode
www.acfisherpod.com

Grow Your Own Candy Canes Pin
https://www.pinterest.com/aarralynn/wtbb-holiday/

Watch our LIVE Hot Cocoa Video edition on our youtube channel and subscribe! 

https://youtu.be/o5MJ_KvoPrs?feature=shared

https://buymeacoffee.com/wtbbpod

Transcript

SPEAKER_01: 0:00

The following is the Kingfisher Media Podcast.

SPEAKER_02: 0:12

Hey WTBB family, this is AC. This episode's a little different from what you've come to expect on this show. As many of you know, Alexis and I recently hosted our very first live show for this year's Pod VCom event. If you're interested in watching the full video version, you can find the link on our Facebook page. For the rest of you, we've pulled the audio from that so you can listen while you're on the go. Please enjoy our 2020 Hot Cocoa edition of When the Bow Breaks, and as always, remember to like, follow, and share. Happy holidays, welcome.

SPEAKER_01: 0:58

My name is Alexis Erlin, and you are watching When the Bow Breaks podcast, uh, live Hot Cocoa edition. Uh, welcome here from all of us at Pod Vom and here at When the Bow Breaks, which is a Kingfisher Media production.

SPEAKER_02: 1:13

I'm AC Fisher, and all of us here at Kingfisher Media would like to express our sincere gratitude to our to our listeners and everyone who follows us on social media. We have a lot of surprises for you coming up in the next year. So please stay tuned.

SPEAKER_01: 1:28

Yeah, and remember to like and follow us on all of our media platforms. You can find us on Instagram and Facebook and Twitter, I believe. Uh, and if you're a new listener to the show or you'd like to listen, you can visit us on our website, wtbbod.com, and uh as well as all major podcast platforms.

SPEAKER_02: 1:50

And as always, if you happen to find a platform where you can't find one of our shows, let us know and we'll do everything we can to make sure that we're available where you choose to listen. And if you'd like to contact us, we'd love hearing from you, even if it's just a quick hello.

SPEAKER_01: 2:06

Yeah. And if you'd like to contact us, you can direct message either one of us on Facebook or the show Facebook, uh, or you can send an email to wtbb podcast at gmail.com.

SPEAKER_02: 2:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 2:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 2:21

So this is a a really special day for us because we've never hosted a live show before, obviously.

SPEAKER_01: 2:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 2:29

But we we are excited for everyone who's joining us here on this adventure. Um, there may be a few bumps along the way, but please bear with us. We're doing our best.

SPEAKER_01: 2:39

Yes, if we disappear for a minute, don't worry, we're coming back because that's we've been practicing some vanishing episodes up until now. But yeah, so far so good. Um so yeah, we've never hosted a live show before. This is our first live show we're hosting, which is very exciting. Um, some of the guests and listeners that we've had this past year, who I hope are watching right now, um, they've really become like family to us uh throughout this year.

SPEAKER_02: 3:09

Yeah, which I find amazing considering that when the bow breaks is all about family estrangement and broken relationships.

SPEAKER_01: 3:16

Right, right. Um, people who have experienced a form of family estrangement call in the show to uh talk about their experiences and their feelings, and um uh with losing one or more contact with one or more family members. And while we were sharing our experiences and feelings with each other, we unknowingly formed a unique bond of strength and a sense of family that may be different than what we're used to, but it's it's been yeah, it's it's been really a big win for us.

SPEAKER_02: 3:51

We feel extremely fortunate to have met all the people we've spoken to in the last year and a half. And while we've shared some of our deepest trauma and pain, we've also had the fortune of uh you know hearing stories of healing, triumph, and even a few reconnection stories. Some of these were made possible by the show, and that's something that we're both really, really proud of. One of our main goals is always to help mend broken relationships. You know, we also we also strive to provide a safe platform for guests and to facilitate understanding and perspective. And we plan to maintain these ideas as our reach continues to grow.

SPEAKER_01: 4:46

But more on that later. Let's get into this special hot cocoa edition, starting with what we're drinking, which is a big nice cup of hot cocoa. I don't know if you can see it. I don't know. It's got a cute little candy cane in it. Oops, and it melted. That's how hot it is.

SPEAKER_02: 5:02

Yeah, you got a melted candy cane, and Mike has got a cute little red Christmas sweater on it.

SPEAKER_01: 5:08

Oh, it's cozy.

unknown: 5:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 5:11

The candy cane um is is actually something that I I wanted to share with everyone. Um, we were talking about family traditions the other day, and we're thinking, oh, you know, what's something that we can share with our listeners? Um, like a nice family holiday tradition. When I became estranged, um I didn't really know which family holiday traditions I wanted to continue with my family. So I didn't just walk away from my family. I walked away from my whole entire religious community, uh, which was very traumatic, actually. And I struggled with a lot of the traditions, especially around the holiday times. And so I decided, well, what's something new that I can do to celebrate with my family? And so I found this cute little uh Pinterest or this little thing on Pinterest uh called Grow Your Own Candy Canes. And I thought it was really cute. So you start with, okay, here's my little cute little Christmas tree I got the dollar store. Um I also got this glass jar and you fill it with sugar. Right now it's got little pine cones in it, which I thought were cute too. Um, but you fill it with sugar and you plant some candy cane seeds, which um you could get like um tic-tacks or like you know, peppermint patties or something like that. And you plant them in the sugar, and then Santa comes and spreads his magic, and then in the morning, so Santa comes and in the morning you have candy canes. It's a really fun, geeky holiday tradition. But my kids, even though they're older now, they love it. And it was just one of those things that kind of helped me cope, helped give me new traditions and new memories to make with my family, even though the structure had changed and um which was kind of scary, even a little bit. But anyway, it's really fun. So I just wanted to share it all with you. So if you want to learn how to grow your own candy canes, you can check out my uh Pinterest, which is under Alexis Ara Lynn. And um, I pinned something there that you can find that's called Grow Your Own Candy Canes. So visit me on Pinterest, y'all. Do you have any any uh fun little holiday uh traditions that you want to share with everyone, AC?

SPEAKER_02: 7:31

Yeah, actually, I I think it's kind of interesting that you developed a a new tradition for your family to sort of help cope with the loss of you know your people. I kind of cope with the loss of my people in a different way, and that was through you know embracing a tradition that you know my parents had started when I was you know 13 years old or so. And you know, I I did a whole episode uh talking about that story on Turn Up the AC. So anybody who wants to hear all the details can check it out there. It's a great episode. Yeah, but the the short version is we didn't have a Christmas tree, we didn't have anything to hang on a tree, even if we did have one. So my parents improvised. My dad just cut a branch off a tree in the yard and stuck it that in the pot in the living room, and we made decorations by wrapping up matchbooks, or sorry, not matchbooks, matchboxes with festive wrapping paper and hanging those on the tree. I don't know if you can sort of see this, but I made one for everybody to see. It just like a little tiny gift, and you know, you just hang that with a paper clip or a little piece of string on the tree. And yeah, that's sort of that's sort of my deal.

SPEAKER_01: 8:50

Yeah, so everyone, I'm gonna plug that too. Yeah, it's called Turn Up the AC. Um, what do you remember the name of the episode? Because it's really good. Um, my kids request to hear it, uh, you know, as one of their Christmas stories that they like to listen to this time of year. So it's it's been nice.

SPEAKER_02: 9:07

Um, I've done so many episodes, I've lost track of all the titles, but I think it was called Christmas Gifts.

SPEAKER_01: 9:13

Yes, I think it is called Christmas Gifts, something really obvious like that. But it's a great episode. Turn up the AC. You should definitely, definitely check it out. Um, so back to this show. So this is about estrangement, um, which is essentially the loss of an existing relationship through physical and or emotional distance. So what did you know estrangement look like for you, I guess, when when this whole thing started for you?

SPEAKER_02: 9:49

It was kind of uh a different emotional experience for me. You know, um with when you when you get used to being surrounded by certain people, you know, whether or not these people provide a comfortable environment, you still become very used to having them around. And I guess if the comfort isn't in the relationship, the comfort is in the familiarity of the situation. And losing that, it kind of put me into like a a bit of a tailspin. I wasn't really sure how I fit, where I fit, or even entirely who I was, and especially with like this time of year, the holiday season, it was a very, very lonely time.

SPEAKER_01: 10:36

Right. Yeah, when when I became estranged, yeah, I was really depressed and I had a lot of grief, like just crying, like all the time, you know. Um I had experienced like public shaming and uh smear campaigns, you know, things like that. Um, the loss, yeah, like you said, the the loss of identity, because you know, I not just walking away from my family, but the you know, the religious group too, and I didn't really know who I was. It was really awkward. And um, so it makes you feel like you you played this character, you know, all growing up, and then you step away, and now all of a sudden you're supposed to be yourself and you don't really know who that is. And you know, that can be a major challenge when you're in the your 30s and you know you're married with a bunch of kids and you're like, who am I? You know, it's awkward.

SPEAKER_02: 11:33

Um no, it's it's a really difficult thing to go through. I mean, there's you know, there's a there's a lot of downsides of the situation. I mean, like you say, you kind of lose sight of who you are. It's like you like you're walking away from this character you've been playing, you don't remember how to play real authentic you anymore. And at the same time, while you're trying to find your footing inside of your own headspace, you're dealing with this complex uh uh array of emotion. You know, I I know that I dealt with a lot of you know feelings of grief. You know, I had lost these people that I cared about. I felt isolated. You know, it's um when when you get used to having a certain support system, whether or not they're a productive support system, it's it's difficult to find yourself without all of that. And uh just to take a brief pause here, it looks like we've lost Alexis temporarily. She will be back, don't worry. Um, dealing with this grief and isolation, it did send me into you know, like a fairly difficult period of of depression. I wasn't really sure how to deal with any of this. It was completely unfamiliar, unfamiliar territory. The the whole experience of losing family and friends, and um for me at the same time as the family estrangement started, I was also dealing with a crisis of faith. I had lost a lot of the support system that I had become accustomed to through the church environment. And all these things combined, it just it created like an overwhelming trauma. I mean, there was me dealing with a mountain of hurt and confusion. And, you know, like Alexis had alluded to just a little bit earlier, you know, the the the public shaming and the smear campaigns. I mean, these were unexpected elements. I expected to miss my mom and my siblings. I didn't expect to find myself in a situation where I was missing other family members and missing friends, people that had always been there suddenly were not. It was um almost like a a bunch of dominoes started falling over. You know, you lose a couple of people that are right at the center of your existence, and you think, hey, not a big deal. I can cope without one or two of them, but trying to cope without all of them that's uh kind of a it's a bigger thing. Um one of the other kind of like unexpected downsides that there was really no way to prepare for was uh it was almost like family friends uh felt compelled to retaliate against me without even um uh understanding the ins and outs of the situation. It seemed like these people all wanted to uh present themselves as author authorities on uh the details of my life. And you know, I think like many people that have dealt with estrangement, we don't uh hate the people that we're isolated from. We we still love them very much, we may even hold the like a fair amount of respect for them. So because of of these things, we don't really want to uh smear them back. We want to protect the integrity of of their image, we want to make sure that you know we speak kindly, we want to take the high road, things uh uh of this nature. So as tempting as it is when somebody is besmirching our good name, we don't ever want to end up in a position where our only means of defending ourselves is to talk smack about the other half of a difficult situation. And I think uh when we don't jump into the fray with a whole bunch of nasty talk of our own, uh the people that are attacking us, they they almost feel empowered and and and validated in their approach because hey, like, look, this person doesn't have anything to say in their own defense, they must know that they're wrong, and they kind of they almost want to dial up the pressure on us, uh which can become extremely overwhelming. We don't need all this other stuff. It looks like we've got Alexis back here. So what what what you missed while you were lost down the uh the the the black hole of loss of internet connection? I just sort of finished up going through everything associated with the uh with the cons of finding oneself estranged, right?

SPEAKER_01: 16:49

Right. So yeah, so there's a lot of cons. Sounds pretty depressing. Um, so why did we want to make a show about this, considering all of those things?

SPEAKER_02: 17:06

Yeah, like this is actually like a really, really common question. People are like, wow, this is really, really heavy subject material. Why do you guys want a podcast about it? That does not sound fun.

SPEAKER_00: 17:16

It doesn't sound fun.

SPEAKER_02: 17:17

It's it's weird, like it is rarely, but yeah, yeah, it doesn't sound fun, but the relationships we make, the conversations we have, I mean, it's it's amazing how much laughter and good times you can have when you're unpacking really ugly situations with complete strangers.

SPEAKER_01: 17:33

Right. And I didn't want it just to be a show where people just called in and just you know cried about their trauma. It's like that's definitely part of it, but I wanted the show to be a resource. There weren't that many podcasts out there, not that I could have that I look, I couldn't find any podcasts about estrangement at all. And I thought, well, maybe that's just something I could do, you know. And I was like, oh, well, if it takes off, if we work hard at it, it can be a resource. And that's really uh why I decided to go ahead and do it. So it's been it'll be like two years on on December 31st when I first started working on the podcast. So that's pretty exciting. So two years, happy anniversary, WTVB.

SPEAKER_02: 18:15

No, and you know, like it's I I think it's a great resource. I mean, that's how I became involved with the show. I was the first guest on the first episode, uh-huh. And I sort of have stuck around ever since.

SPEAKER_00: 18:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 18:27

I mean, for me, I I was finding it difficult coping with a difficult family situation and without like having a real support system, and um finding somebody to talk to who had experienced a similar thing through the show really was a huge part of my healing process.

SPEAKER_01: 18:48

Yeah, and with that, we found, you know, going through this process and talking with other people about this, you know, we found that there is also a lot of pros. There can be pros to estrangement. Um, you know, when I became estranged, I after I got through my grief and, you know, most of my the bulk of my depression, um, I gained more independence. You know, being raised in a very religious family, there's a lot of rules, there's a lot of ways of thinking that you're kind of stuck in. And so, you know, it takes time to kind of separate from that and just develop your own sort of free thinking. And um, with that, I found uh I started to get more like a healthier, developed sense of self, I guess. Um and with that came more peace and functionality in my life, which is something I didn't have before. Um, did you notice any you know pros of your estrangement when you were going through that, AC?

SPEAKER_02: 19:47

Yeah, it was a lot of what you're talking about. Like for me, I had always found like in a way a couple of key family members were really in the way of my ability to develop. Improve or even express myself because every time I wanted to implement the change on a personal level, it felt like there was a whole bunch of people there lining up to remind me of who I really was.

SPEAKER_01: 20:12

Right.

SPEAKER_02: 20:13

And they were so stuck on where I was coming from that they didn't really care to give me room to go where I was going. So, I mean, yeah, you lose the support system, you lose the familiar, but you do gain the freedom to move and to just explore yourself, figure out who you are inside the privacy of your own head. Like that's a big thing.

SPEAKER_01: 20:36

Yeah, yeah. And I felt like I felt calmer after that when I went through that whole process, you know, like the grief and all that stuff that came out after that. And then once all of those really strong feelings started to kind of subside a little bit, I was able to kind of re-examine the facts about certain things that had happened or certain things that I went through. I was able to see it as an adult, not just as a child going through it, like we had kind of talked about before earlier on in kind of making plans for this episode. Uh there were certain things that I couldn't have thought those things that way if I didn't have time to myself, um, if that makes sense. You know, removing myself from the toxic environment and putting myself into something that promoted peace and um, you know, room for my brain to breathe, I guess.

SPEAKER_02: 21:30

Well, I mean, you do get kind of battered by a toxic situation. And if somebody just it's like the the way I always kind of looked at it, it's you know, like when kids sort of tease each other and they'll just like poke each other like one spot, like over and over and over again. And it's like they're not poking hard. But after you've been poked in the same spot like 40-50 times, it starts getting tender.

SPEAKER_00: 21:55

You can get sore, you can eventually break a bone.

SPEAKER_02: 21:58

And the thing is, like, all you want is like can like I'm okay with you poking me, but can you poke me from a different angle for a little while? But family, they don't really like to do that, they're just so used to hitting that one spot over and over again. Like, even if you haven't gone and fixed the bruise or like the pain hasn't gone away, at least the pain's not getting worse. Like, yeah, that was a serious upside. Like taking my my leave, getting a bit of space, it's like, man, I hurt all over. But the stuff that I don't know how to address, just leaving it alone, it starts feeling better. And the stuff I can address, it's like, yeah, I'm gonna patch myself up without fear of re-injury.

SPEAKER_01: 22:39

Yeah, it was like too much at once, and then taking a step away, I was able to kind of you know get my own like priorities in order and uh focus on those things and kind of clean up my own life in certain areas so that I could focus on you know those tougher things. Um, like you said, just allowing yourself to heal.

SPEAKER_02: 23:00

So, what did that process look like for you?

SPEAKER_01: 23:03

Oh god. It was like there's so many feelings or so many emotions. Uh looking back on it, I just I kind of get sick to my stomach thinking about it. But there were a lot of good things that came out of that. Um, you know, I found some new hobbies and, you know, adjusted my lifestyle into a way that was more comfortable for me and I felt like I could live with and, you know, something that promoted, you know, a good, healthy lifestyle, I guess. Um, changed the way that I managed my home. I changed the way that I managed my relationships. I started painting, I started podcasting. Uh I started trying things that I never would have done before had I still been in a relationship with them. Um, I started to set boundaries, which is something I'd never really done before. And that was kind of a new experience for me. Um, so you know, what did you do? Like when the grief subsided and everything, and you were kind of going through this like time where you were like finding yourself, you know, what did that look like for you?

SPEAKER_02: 24:13

I was really fortunate in the sense that like I while I had lost access to my biological family, I had maintained access to um my best friend Jason, who anybody who's familiar with me online knows that I always refer to him as my brother. And in every sense of the word, he always has been more family to me than my blood relations have been. He really, you know, he was the crutch that I leaned on.

SPEAKER_00: 24:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 24:48

And um he was always there to like ask me the tough questions and like to say, hey, like, how you doing today, brother? Like, do you need to talk? I got so used to talking to him about this stuff that it kind of spilled over into other areas of life. I was able to start talking to my at the time wife about things that she had never known about me. I was able to talk to, you know, not like strangers, but like more casual kind of acquaintances, friends. And through talking to all these different people and just learning to open up, I realized that it wasn't enough just to open up. We I actually needed some professional help. And I was always a very, very prideful person. I couldn't have brought myself to go see a counselor, but I think that was the biggest change for me was going and getting a bit of therapy, a little bit of medication to get my emotions out of the way while I sorted out my headspace. And I think all the pieces really started to fall into place through that.

SPEAKER_01: 25:54

Yeah, so we're talking about like you know, who we can who can we talk to? Like for those who are listening who this whole estrangement thing is kind of new to them or they they don't really understand it very much. It's like, yeah, how how does one go about their life like while they're estranged? It's like you need support and you need a lot of it. And you know, not everyone we know is going to be supportive. That was something I found out or very early on. People who I thought would support me all my life were just gone. They didn't like the situation, they didn't like what was happening, they they didn't want to be involved in my life anymore. And I had some, you know, my feelings were kind of mutual. Um, some friends are just, you know, they're really fun to be around, but they're not exactly the sort of people that, you know, we would trust with our problems. So, you know, going to see a counselor or something like that is definitely like, you know, a good thing. And there are some bad ones out there, I'll tell you. Like, there are some, you know, you can shop around. Like, if you don't like one, you know, then try someone else. Um, but anyway, there's also like support groups. Like I joined a support group online and it was it was great for me because I was able to just kind of type out my stuff kind of whenever I felt like it. Um, and that was good. There's lots of support groups for estranged people on Facebook. You can find them. Um, one really good one is called Each. Uh, it stands for Estranged Adult Children in Healing, and that is a really, really good support group to join. They the admins and the moderators are fabulous people. The group is really close, tight-knit. They're about growth and healing. Um, and it's very confidential. Um, anyway, good stuff.

SPEAKER_00: 27:45

I don't know. We're going to go. Yeah, we're gonna take a sip of my hot cocoa real quick. I'll let you take it away.

SPEAKER_02: 27:52

Yeah, because whereas like I think you found a lot of value in seeking out the the online groups and online supports. Some of us don't really thrive in an environment like that. I'm one of those people. I actually found a surprising amount of support from people I just do not know. I continue to find support in complete strangers. And I think part of that is because I've learned to be so open about what's going on with me emotionally and what's going on with like any of my my big challenges. I just start talking to uh people literally while I'm pumping gas, uh, you know, and I I think that when we make ourselves vulnerable and available like that, it invites other people to be just as vulnerable and available themselves, and we end up finding ourselves in these mutually supportive um dynamics with people that we've never seen before and may never see again, but it's a contagious thing when we start just opening up and removing a lot of that stigma that's attached with hurting.

SPEAKER_01: 29:13

Do you think the show has kind of helped with that?

SPEAKER_02: 29:17

I'd like to think that it's it's helped our our listeners and our guests. I mean, having been a guest and now also being a host. I I've I've seen both from our listeners.

SPEAKER_01: 29:30

Yeah, we get things from our listeners like all the time, like emails and um you know, people thanking us to do the show sometimes, which is really neat.

SPEAKER_02: 29:41

But um, so many people feel like they're going through it alone, they don't realize that there's other people with similar stories.

SPEAKER_01: 29:48

Yeah, lots of them. It's more common than you think. Like when I first became estranged, I didn't really know there was, I mean, I'm sure there was a word for it, but I wasn't really thinking about that. I wasn't thinking there was a word for it. I didn't really know, I didn't know I fit into this category, and I didn't know there was a lot more people. You know, almost every other person I met seemed to have kind of an estrangement story. Um, but anyway, you got some um, you were we were talking about this the other day, and we were talking about how we haven't really had a parent on this show, an estranged parent, um, which I've been trying to do since the beginning. Yeah, but it's been really tough. I feel like the parents maybe don't feel comfortable. Um, and and or maybe it's just a generational thing. I don't know, maybe they're not into podcasts, but um, you know, who knows? But I really would like to hear from some of the parents, but I know that you know, you've got some statements from some parents, you know, that you wanted to kind of share on the show.

SPEAKER_02: 30:48

On the side of the show, yeah, it it gave us a little bit of insight into like what they're going through. And like I know I've heard at least some of these statements before. Um, the the first one that was submitted to me was I don't understand how you could do this to us.

SPEAKER_00: 31:07

Yeah, I got that.

SPEAKER_02: 31:09

Do you want to respond to like the parents out there?

SPEAKER_01: 31:13

Yeah, yeah. No, I got that a lot. I got that from my mom, I got that from family of family friends. Um, and you know, I I have to say I in response to I don't understand how you could do this, it's like I didn't understand everything either. It wasn't something that I did on a whim. I actually debated it heavily in counseling for a year. Um, I didn't want to, but I had gone through a year trying other things, trying other forms of communication. And uh, you know, it was just it was really, really difficult. Um it wasn't easy. Let's just say that. It wasn't easy.

SPEAKER_02: 32:03

Yeah, um, I I think we're probably gonna end up covering some of these statements in like a a future episode.

SPEAKER_00: 32:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 32:12

One of the um the the the challenges of doing our first live stream is we weren't really sure exactly how much time was gonna take to cover everything.

SPEAKER_01: 32:20

And yeah, and we've had some technical difficulties too, so we don't know where we're at on the timeline, really.

SPEAKER_02: 32:26

We're we're we're really running out the the the clock here. It looks like we've got about 10 minutes left, so we may gloss past some of these things a little bit more quickly than we had planned to, but I think it's like important stuff to cover, and we definitely will address it in more detail in the near future.

SPEAKER_01: 32:44

Yes, we will.

SPEAKER_02: 32:45

So that being said, we'll just jump into like the next statement uh that I received from a parent. You've blown this way out of proportion. Like I know I've heard this one a lot. You probably have too. Did you want to speak to that?

SPEAKER_01: 33:07

It's tough. It's like we're sitting here giggling about it, but I mean, it's it's so tough. It's like it's hard. It's it it felt like again, it's something that you we felt like we had to do, um, you know, in order to kind of maintain our own mental health and sanity. And um, you know, that I struggled with that. It's very difficult to answer. I could have answered differently, you know, the within the first six months of it. I would answer differently now, you know, certain questions, some of these questions.

SPEAKER_02: 33:44

Um, like here's the reality is like, how do you determine like what is an appropriate proportion to deal with things in?

SPEAKER_00: 33:50

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 33:52

Like my whole world is blown up, and you want me to play according to how you think you would handle it when you're not affected.

SPEAKER_01: 33:58

Like, yeah, it's like a little bit of a going to say, yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 34:03

Sorry, didn't mean to cut you off.

SPEAKER_01: 34:04

No, that's okay. No, it feels like that. It feels like you're just standing here drowning, and and someone's like, Why can't you just get up and get out? It's like, uh I kind of can't. I'm kind of preoccupied. There's a lot going on up here and in here, you know, and uh it's confusing. And I just want some time, you know, to sort some of this stuff out. You know.

SPEAKER_02: 34:28

No, it's it's hard because your whole world is blown up, you've lost your whole support system, and this is when spectators expect you to communicate and act rationally and calmly. Yes, and that's and I don't how do you convince these people that, like, hey, I think I'm reacting appropriately, and y'all need to just mind your own damn business?

SPEAKER_01: 34:51

Yeah, and that's why you end up cutting out a lot more people than you thought, you know, you were going to, because you know, they're not really giving you the space or the time to to manage those things. They just want a response, like, and they want one now, you know, and you just can't give that to them. So it's like, you know, from the perspective of someone who's been estranged, you know, from the inside looking out, you know, being lonely and stuff, especially around the holidays, you know, I would encourage everyone to just kind of reach out to people that they know who like aren't really talking to or seeing certain family members because it's very difficult and we're not one to kind of feel like we're not gonna invite ourselves over for Thanksgiving dinner or for Christmas dinner, you know, because we're at home and we're lonely and we're not around our family like we usually are. We're not gonna do that. But, you know, if you could start to think about those people in your life who maybe don't have a lot of family around and just kind of, you know, invite them more, talk to them more, um, give them a call once a week or have, you know, social distance coffee in the parking lot and tailgate it or something. You know, that that's something that we really wanted to share before we sign off on this show. Um and then also, you know, if you are estranged, don't be afraid to reach out. Don't we're here on the show. Um, you know, you could message us and talk to us. We're always here. Um, and you know, the groups too, if you know you like that sort of thing, those Facebook groups. Um, but yeah, you know, let your friends know, hey, I don't have a whole lot going on, you know, these holidays. Do you think we could spend some time? Don't be afraid to do that.

SPEAKER_02: 36:27

Something I want to reach out. Something I like to put out there too is I recently lost a wonderful friend. Um he took his own life for, you know, he had his own reasons, I suppose. But I don't think anybody should ever find themselves in a position where they're that alone. If you feel like you don't have any other friends, you don't know who to talk to, I'm willing to put my money where my mouth is. Send me a message, send me a friend request. I don't want to lose any of you.

SPEAKER_00: 37:04

He's a great person to talk to.

SPEAKER_02: 37:06

Your family may not see your value, but I promise I do. You know, um and for anybody who's trying to be supportive of their friends and they don't they're not really sure how to approach them, you know, for years my brother Jason wasn't sure how to help me entirely. And in those times when he wasn't sure he did something really, really uh tiny, and you know, it may seem insignificant, but it meant the entire world to me. Sometimes it was just a simple text message saying, Hey brother, uh, I just want you to know that I love you. Or hey, hope you're having a fantastic day. You don't know how life-changing a little message like that can be to a person who needs to hear it, and it takes literally five seconds out of your day. So don't feel awkward, don't let these like weird hang-ups, you know. I know guys are especially bad with each other, especially like those of us who are a little bit older, we're so worried about looking like you know, we're romantically inclined towards our male friends. There's nothing wrong with telling your your bro, hey, I love you. Yeah, you know, build on that. You guys matter to each other, you know. If somebody is gone, either because they check out of your life or you know, heaven forbid something happens to them, you don't want to be crying in their absence when you could have just had a conversation in their presence.

SPEAKER_00: 38:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 38:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 38:47

Yeah, good stuff. Well, do you have anything else you want to say before we sign off here in a few minutes?

SPEAKER_02: 38:58

Yeah, there's a couple of things I'd like to shamelessly plug. Um the first is probably the most wonderful podcast you're ever gonna come across called Turn Up the AC. It's written and hosted by yours truly. Um my my whole goal with that show is just to lead by example in the sense that it's okay to bear your soul. It's okay to be open about the areas where you've really messed up. It's okay to learn from your experiences, and it's okay to share what you've learned and how you've learned it. I try to communicate in very, very short format. I don't spend a lot of time on the biography of my stories. I'd rather focus on the uh the philosophy and the psychology of my stories. I want to leave room for everybody to put themselves right in the middle of what I'm saying. I think everybody would benefit from. Just checking out one or two episodes, it might change the way you approach things. Um, the other thing that I would like to put out there, which maybe I'm preaching to the choir here, but keep on listening to when the bow breaks. We've we've had like some fantastic guests so far, and we've got some really unbelievably good guests lined up for the near future. You do not want to miss a single moment of what's coming.

SPEAKER_01: 40:27

Yeah, for sure. And uh, you know, Kingfisher Media, we've got a couple of other projects under our belts too that we're working on. They're in pre-production. Um, so we're going to give very few details about that, but um, they're going to be completely different shows, completely different concepts, and uh different from the shows that we're currently doing. And we're kind of excited about it. So yeah, stay tuned and support Kingfisher Media as you see more of them. And thank you for listening to When the Bell Breaks. Again, you can visit us on our website, www.wtbb pod.com. You can email us at wtbb podcast at gmail.com or find us on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter. And iTunes, like us on iTunes.

unknown: 41:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 41:18

Yes, like and review and share with everybody you know.

SPEAKER_01: 41:22

And share, share, share. Yes. You never know. Somebody like on average, every other person I meet has an estrangement story, whether it's temporary or currently going on or it's been permanent. Um, it there's a lot of people out there. So yeah, definitely share.

SPEAKER_02: 41:38

Okay, so for all of us here at When the Bell Breaks and Kingfisher Media, happy holidays, and we will talk to you soon.

SPEAKER_01: 41:44

Happy holidays.

SPEAKER_02: 41:47

The views expressed on this show are opinion and experience-based and are not intended as a substitute for therapy. Thoughts expressed by our guests do not necessarily reflect the views of WTBB or its affiliates. Content should not be taken as medical advice and is here for informational purposes only. Please consult your healthcare professional for any medical or mental health related questions. If you are experiencing estrangement from a family member and would like to be a guest, please email us at WTBpodcast at gmail.com. Your privacy is important to us. Guests have the option to remain anonymous. As always, please remember to like, follow, and share. Links in this week's show notes.