Mindfulness & Finances

Nikita Wolff is joined by Cayla Vertreese, a 3rd Decade graduate,  and a 21 year old recent graduate of Northwest Missouri State University. Cayla received her Bachelors in Human Services and Minor in Psychology. Following her college graduation in May of 2021, she moved to Mesa, Arizona where she currently works for Mindfulness First, a nonprofit that offers scientifically-informed programs based on trauma-informed Mindful Awareness and Social-Emotional Learning which equitably support children, educators, and communities with tools to manage stress and navigate life’s challenges.

In this episode, they discuss mental health, coping mechanisms, mindfulness, breathing methods, and much more. More specifically, Cayla shares some of the tools she uses in managing anxiety around finances.

Resources:
National Suicide Prevention Lifeline
Crisis Text Line
mindfulnessfirst.org
4-second box breathing
STOP
Mindful finance routine
Dan Siegel - Flipping Your Lid



Citations:
National Emergency in Child and Adolescent Mental Health
Advisory on Protecting Youth Mental Health
1 in 5 Americans will experience a mental illness in a given year

Transcript

Nikita: 0:00

Hey, 3rd Decade friends! We're happy to have you here. I'm your host Nikita Wolff. And today I'm joined by Cayla Vertreese, a 21 years old recent graduate of Northwest Missouri State University with her Bachelors in Human Services and Minor in Psychology. Following her college graduation in May of 2021, she moved to Mesa, Arizona where she currently works for Mindfulness First, a nonprofit that offers scientifically-informed programs based on trauma-informed Mindful Awareness and Social-Emotional Learning which equitably support children, educators and communities with tools to manage stress and navigate life’s challenges. As a mental health and diversity, equity, and inclusion advocate, Cayla believes these two areas go hand-in-hand with financial literacy and success. Today, I’m going to be interviewing her to learn more about how mindfulness can benefit your mental health as well as your financial health. Thank you so much for being here with me tod ay, C ayla!

Cayla: 1:03

Yeah, thank you for having me.

Nikita: 1:05

So what was it that got you interested in this field?

Cayla: 1:08

Like many others working in the mental health industry, I have a personal connection to mental health. I live with a few mental health conditions myself and have had my fair share of struggles navigating life with them. I was first diagnosed with a mental health condition in early high school, which is when I really first became interested in mental health. I was lucky to have lots of familial support during this time and access to counseling, but I soon realized that this wasn’t necessarily the norm. Mental health was and still is a very taboo subject in many communities, especially in the black community. I was never ashamed of my struggles and have always been very open about them, I think because I saw the effect that being transparent about what I was going through had on others. Anytime I have talked about the struggles I have experienced living with mental health conditions like depression and anxiety, I often am met with responses of solidarity or stories where others then open up themselves because they realize I am a safe person to talk to about the things they struggle with. In a society that often looks down on people who struggle, or don’t have it all together, or at least don’t fake as though they do, it can feel very lonely living with a mental health condition. Some mental health conditions can be resolved over time, and some are chronic and while they can be managed, you have to consistently work to find different coping skills to navigate the struggles that you live with day-to-day. Understanding mental health conditions live on a spectrum, and that they are seen and experienced differently through different people was the turning point for me. There are a lot of false narratives out there about people living with mental health conditions, which eventually made me realize the need for more mental health education in schools and communities. This is really what led me to pursue the educational path that I did in undergrad and on my career path today.

Nikita: 3:12

Yeah. That's awesome. Thank you so much for sharing that. I know that there's a level of vulnerability that goes in to saying that, but like you said, I think when that conversation's opened up, we realize how much more similar we all are than different. And I think so many people kind of live quietly with their own struggles and whenever you can break down those barriers and talk about your own struggles, it can really open up that line of community for other people to realize that they are not so alone. Even though they may have felt that way before. So thank you.

Cayla: 3:45

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Vulnerability is a huge piece for me. I think it for myself, like I said, being vulnerable helps other people realize that it's okay for them to be vulnerable. And when we kind of see that humanity in one another, it brings us back to our humanity. So couldn't agree more. Yes.

Nikita: 4:02

Yep. I can absolutely relate to that sentiment. So tell us a little bit about your current line of work.

Cayla: 4:08

Currently I work to support programming, culture,& special projects at a nonprofit organization called Mindfulness First. The organization was founded back in 2013 by Sunny Wight and Kimberly Narde. It is an online organization, so there is no physical office, however, the organization does provide both in-person and virtual programming. Most of the organization’s clients are here in Arizona, as that is where the organization was first started and where a majority of their mindfulness instructors are located, but as a result of the increasing mental health crisis in our country, there is higher demand for Mindfulness First’s programming services, so the organization is slowly working to expand across the nation. They are really creating an amazing impact in schools, businesses, and communities and are currently working to create one of the first Mindful School Districts in Arizona. This project is taking place in the Balsz School District, a school district located in Phoenix, AZ where a majority of students are low-income and/or students of color, which are two populations that historically have had limited to no access to mental health services like this. I highly encourage anyone listening to visit mindfulnessfirst.org to learn more about the organization’s work. While Mindfulness First does not provide clinical mental health care like you would receive through a licensed mental health professional, like a psychologist or psychiatrist, Mindfulness First provides preventative mental health support by teaching mindful awareness and social-emotional learning that is both scientifically-informed and trauma-informed. This is where you may see the connection to what I mentioned earlier in terms of how I got interested in the field. Mindfulness First is working to provide the“missing piece” that is mental health education in schools, businesses, and communities. We are taught the importance of our physical health, but mental health is often an afterthought, despite multitudes of studies that prove the clear connection between the two. Speaking from what I personally believe to be just basic morality, if we want our society to be made up of humans who are equipped with skills that allow them to live, I won’t say a stress-free life because obviously that’s not realistic, but at least a reasonably manageable life, where life's stressors don’t overtake their entire livelihood, mental health education and teaching people coping skills and how to identify their stress responses, is not the end-all-be-all of course, but it’s a big piece that can help. A mental health organization that I was a part of in college called Active Minds shared a statement back in 2020 that I felt summed it up perfectly:“An emotionally healthy world is not possible without a just world”. So while there is of course a lot of other work that needs to be done in terms of social justice and not just equal but equitable access to resources and opportunities that will also have a positive impact on mental health across our nation, there is still a present crisis that has to be addressed. We need multiple areas of support to change the trajectory of the mental health status of our society, and one of those areas is mental health education. Now, if we have differing views on what basic morality is and what humans do and do not have a right to(broadly speaking), I can speak from an economic standpoint and say that if you want a society to be made up of humans who can produce good, quality work that helps to push forward our economy, there are also a multitude of studies out there which prove taking care of your mental health can help with your productivity. So really, no matter what your belief system, mental health education is important, and dire, to improving our society and addressing what is currently the mental health crisis. Recently, the American Academy of Pediatrics, American Academy of Child and Adolescent Psychiatry and Children’s Hospital Association together declared a national emergency in Child and Adolescent Mental Health and the US Surgeon General, Dr. Vivek Murthy, issued an Advisory on Protecting Youth Mental Health. If children and adolescent mental health doesn’t feel super relevant to you, according to the CDC, 1 in 5 Americans will experience a mental illness in a given year. Even if you don’t personally live with a mental health condition, it is likely, if not certain, that you know someone else who does.

Nikita: 9:41

And part of me almost suspects, even that this number could be higher because of like under-reporting of it and surrounding shame and stuff like that. But wow. At minimum one in five, that's insane.

Cayla: 9:52

Yeah, definitely. And I, I'm glad you kind of spoke to that point of under-reporting because that is a huge thing. Like I said before, it's not just about equal access, but it's about equitable access to these resources. And while we think, oh, everyone has, you know, the opportunity to go seek out counseling, things like that, not everyone has that equitable access, whether that be, you know, they have a job that doesn't allow them to take off different hours so they can go to a counselor whenever their hours are available and things like that. Yeah. We have to look at what equitable access means and possibly adjusting the access that we have to certain resources for different communities based off of what, you know, their capacity is and what, you know, meets their needs and their schedule and things like that. Especially if you have a family to take care of. So that's a great point that underreporting and also, you know, how it's taboo in a lot of communities, like I mentioned before, even if you don't live with a mental health condition though, you, you still absolutely have mental health. Everyone has mental health. And so, we also shouldn't wait until someone's struggling to the point of needing professional health or intervention to provide mental health resources just as we don't, you know, wait to encourage people to exercise until they have a physical health condition.

Nikita: 11:06

That's a great way of putting that.

Cayla: 11:08

Yeah. So preventative mental health resources are just as needed as urgent or emergency ones. And this is something that I wish was prioritized for me when I was up in school and is also why I really believe in the mission of mindfulness first.

Nikita: 11:23

So when did you start using mindfulness as a tool to take care of your own mental health?

Cayla: 11:27

That’s a difficult question because for me, I was using mindfulness before I ever knew what it actually was. As a concept, my understanding of mindfulness and toolbox of mindfulness exercises has really grown since I first got connected with Mindfulness First during my internship with the organization in the Spring semester of 2021. Mindfulness is very versatile, which is why I feel it has been the tool that has helped me the most throughout my mental health journey. Many people hear the word“mindfulness” and imagine someone sitting still, with their eyes closed and legs crossed. This is definitely a mindfulness method that people can do(e.g. mindfulness meditation), but mindfulness is really about being present and aware of what’s going on inside of you and around you in the present moment, whatever that looks like for you. That could mean meditating, or practicing mindful movement, mindful art, mindful journaling etc. Its origins are widely debated as mindfulness-based practices have been used across a multitude of different cultures and communities for ages, namely Asian and Indigenous communities, so I strongly encourage those interested in mindfulness to do some research into the different types that are out there. For me personally, I take a very secular approach to mindfulness, meaning I don’t follow any specific religion or spirituality in connection with my mindfulness journey. The difference for me has really been connecting my mind with my body and being able to recognize when I’m feeling or thinking certain things, then, having different ways to reconnect myself to the present moment like a simple breathing technique. It sounds silly, I know, but it actually works. Not all of the time, but it definitely gets easier with practice. It’s always difficult to unlearn things, especially when you’re trying to unlearn habits like reacting on impulse, but it makes all the difference when you are able to reset in the moment and change your reaction to a mindful response. And that’s a lot of jibber jabber, so what do I actually mean? For example, I struggle with anxiety that can be pretty debilitating at times. It can make overthinking a full-time job. Mindfulness helps me slow down my thoughts to the point where now I am getting better and better at recognizing what initially triggered the anxiety, and then I can start to decipher what’s in my control, what’s out of my control, and what I can do in the moment to move forward without obsessing over that one thing or sometimes even a bunch of different things at once. Another big one is the compassion piece. Mindfulness has helped me have a lot more compassion for myself because it reminds me in this grind culture of a society that we live in that I’m human and can only do so much and that it’s okay to slow down, it’s okay to rest, it’s okay to make mistakes, it’s okay to have a bad day. Once I developed that compassion for myself, I also have a lot more compassion for others. You don’t always know what someone is going through, or even what someone’s background or culture is. I think we can often forget that our norms aren’t the entire world’s norms, or even our entire community’s norms, so being able to recognize in the moment when you have a thought pop up that may derive from a stereotype, and correcting yourself to be open to getting to know an individual or group through direct experience rather than second-hand experience can make all the difference. So that has allowed me to have a LOT more patience and acceptance for others who are different from me, which again, I attribute to my journey with mindfulness.

Nikita: 15:33

Wow. That is, this already is such a rich conversation. Thank you so much for everything that you're sharing with us. So, specific to finances, how do you use mindfulness to ease stress that maybe you experience around finances and, you know, the state of the financial world, I guess that we're all living in now.

Cayla: 15:51

Yeah, absolutely. I absolutely love this question because, you know, as I just mentioned, I'm someone who struggles severely with anxiety. So for me, that means I don't do well with uncertainty. And, when it comes to finances, uncertainty is like you said, basically the name of the game. So, oftentimes I use a similar strategy to the one I discussed before. It, it kind of depends on the situation. But usually what it looks like is, you know, first I'll recognize the financial anxiety has been triggered. So for example, I'll use, worrying that I'll never be able to afford a house because of the current housing market. Definitely something, I think about a lot,

Nikita: 16:30

So many people right now.

Cayla: 16:31

Exactly. Especially, you know, people who are close to my age and who are kind of seeing what that looks like. And so this is definitely something that I think about often. So yeah, the first step is recognizing the financial anxiety has been triggered. And then the next step that I take is to kind of like I spoke to before, identify what is in my control, what is out of my control and what I can do immediately. So, going off the same example of not being able to afford a house because of the current housing market, what I can identify, that's not in my control in my direct control is the trajectory of the housing market. So while, you know, maybe there's minor things that I can do here or there maybe I can, you know, vote and things like that. That's not in my direct control. Right, and so what is in my control is, you know, my saving strategies and what my goals are. And so kind of taking, I taking that piece and identifying what's in my control and what's out of my control. I then move to step three, which is to decide on my immediate steps. So what can I do in this moment to address, you know, these feelings of anxiety that I have. And so that may look like adjusting my budget and, you know, deciding what I can give up, what I, where I can, you know, save a little bit more, on and things like that weighing, like we learned in, in class, what is the opportunity cost? And so, you know, am I willing to decrease my, you know, monthly fun money, a little bit to reach my goal a little bit faster, things like that. I still am a very, very much think that it's important to have fun money, to some extent at all times if you can, you know, do that because it's that, you know, reward that you need to kind of give yourself to make it through and kind of seeing the fruit of your labor, essentially. I think that's really important. So yeah.

Nikita: 18:11

And just enhancing your quality of life.

Cayla: 18:13

Yeah, exactly. And having that healthy relationship with money really, and not feeling bad about spending it because, you know, you budgeted that that is the money that you spend. So I think it's important to have that, but sometimes, you know, if you have a more immediate goal that you're trying to achieve, you know, seeing if you have areas within your budget that you can adjust subscriptions, you can cancel things like that. Right. It also may look like setting up recurring deposits to your savings account. So, you know, out of sight, out of mind, if you know that you have money going into your savings account every single month, that's, you know, helping you to eventually reach that goal, then you can kind of get some peace of mind from that, knowing that at, you know, while I'm not there yet, I don't know what the future holds, but this isn't my immediate control. And I'm working to get there. Often times I find myself kind of obsessing over, well, I could do all the saving and then it can mean absolutely nothing, but that's really the negative, you know, self talk. And I think the alternative to that would be, I do all the saving and things do get better and now I'm prepared. And would I rather not be prepared if it does, if things do get better. And so I kind of have to think about that way and remind myself of those things. And then just another thing that I could do another immediate step that I can think about is education. So, you know, maybe it's learning more about the housing market. So I feel more prepared to, you know, make that step to start, you know, looking to buy a house and things like that. Or, you know, if you're not, if you don't have any extra money to save or things like that during, you know, through each month to reach your goal of buying a house, maybe that looks like researching for different programs that are out there that can help provide you additional support in, you know, with your, down payment or things like that. So, education could just look like, you know, preparing yourself more or possibly finding additional resources that can help you kind of address that anxiety that you have about not being able to afford, a house. So yeah.

Nikita: 20:06

Education can look like a lot of different things in this context, for sure.

Cayla: 20:09

Yeah, absolutely. So yeah, that would be my third step is deciding on my immediate steps. And then the fourth one is to recognize after, you know, I've gone through that after I've, you know, done my immediate steps, if there's still stress that I'm carrying in my body and then deciding how I will release it. So, you know, that may be easy. It may just be a few quick, deep breath and, you know, being like, okay, you know, we're gonna move on to the next thing and being able to transition that way. It could be moving my body. So, you know, maybe taking a walk, getting some exercise, get my mind off of things and just releasing that stress in that way. I like to take a shower sometimes just, you know, focus on the water, hitting my body and just not letting anything in my brain. Just kind of that relaxation that you get from it, lots of people like listen to music or podcasts. There's a multitude of different things that you could do, but just finding the way, the best way for you to release that stress. I think is that's the last step and one of the most important, because if you don't release the stress you're carrying in your body, it absolutely will translate to something else. So if you think of the phrase, you know, blow your top, if you constantly let things boil up inside you, you're a lot quicker to literally blow your top. So by moving through that process completely in releasing that stress, you can also increase your window of tolerance. So you may be less likely to, for example, yell at your partner for something minor or, you know, less likely to experience road rage, whatever that looks like for you. But you'll, you'll find that your window of tolerance increases because you've allowed yourself to release that stress and you're not carrying it to another situation. Yeah. So yeah, this process is, is this is a process that I might do in my head or depending on the complexity of the situation, actually writing it down in a journal. So, but I typically do go through all of those steps. And I find it to be very beneficial to me when I'm having some financial anxiety.

Nikita: 22:03

I love these, I love the way you've kind of broken them down. I, I'm probably gonna be making a little note for myself even to use these in my own life. It's just great.

Cayla: 22:11

Absolutely. Yeah.

Nikita: 22:12

In what ways do you think that everyone can apply mindfulness in their own finances?

Cayla: 22:17

Yeah, so there's a lot of different ways. I think that people can apply mindfulness, to their own finances. Like I said, it's not a one size fits all. So you have to find works for you. You can use, you know, the example that I provided beforehand, or, I also have a few other techniques that I like to use. So you can use four second box breathy. And what that looks like is you inhale for four seconds, hold for four seconds and then exhale for four seconds and hold for four seconds. And so while you're doing that, you're kind of imagining a square. So, as you inhale, you go up the square and then you hold that for four seconds. As you go across the square, exhale, go down the square and then hold for four seconds, you go across the square and it starts over. So, you know, if you can't do four seconds, starting out, try for two or three, you know, mindfulness, like I said, versatile. So you can always adjust exercises in ways that work best for you. But I do really like that four second box breathing. It's something simple that you can do anytime, wherever you are whenever. And it's a quick way to kind of check back in with yourself, calm yourself down, things like that and bring you back to kind of reality. So you can think of whatever the situation is from a more rational state of mind, I guess you can say.

Nikita: 23:30

You I've heard that this particular breathing method has scientifically proven ways of like bringing your physiological, like your heart rate down. It's just really well known. And I think well respected by the scientific community.

Cayla: 23:43

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, there's lots of, like you said, there's lots of evidence out there for how, you know, breathing can help us regulate, you know, our, our stress, our emotions, our heart rate, things like that. And so, like I said before, it seems silly. It seems super simple. You know, it's kind of going back to when we were younger and, you know, we were told count to 10 seconds and we're angry and we didn't really think too much of it, but all we realized there was a reason for it. Yeah. There's a reason for it. Exactly. So, yeah. But yeah, I definitely think that the box breathing method is a great one. Another one that I like is the STOP method. And so stop it stands for S is literally stop. So stop what you're doing. If you're, you know, in the moment where you're stressed or you find yourself getting worked up, just I, even in my head, I yell to myself. I don't say that loud. Maybe I will usually, I don't yell in my head, like stop and then T stands for take a breath. So, you know, like we were just talking about taking that deep breath, trying to regulate your body back to kind of a consistent, you know, heart rate and things like that. And then the O stands for observe. So observe what's going around you, that's that kind of grounding, you know, recognizing where you're at in the present moment and bringing yourself back to that present moment, looking at addressing what you might be feeling inside of you, you know, things like that. And just trying to, reregulate how you're feeling, how your body is feeling, and then the P would be to proceed. So, once you feel like you're back to, you know, that regulated state of being, you can proceed with whatever it is that you're doing, whether that be, you know, you decide to go and take a break and do something else that you can mindfully do. So whether that be just washing the dishes and, and thinking about what, you know, how the sponge fills in your hand end and how the water's hitting your hand and, and just really paying attention to what you're doing, doing the laundry, folding it, you can even set an alarm throughout the day to stop intentionally. So it doesn't always have to be, you know, when something's going wrong, but you can set an alarm throughout the day to do that, like one minute reminder of stopping and taking a breath, observing what's around you in the proceeding with your day, whatever that looks like. So that's another good me method that you can do, you know, anytime the third method that I wanted to talk about would be to build a mindful finance routine. And so that looks like scheduling a time to review your finances regularly. So you aren't just obsessing over them when things feel insecure. You know, speaks to kind of what I was talking about before building that healthy relationship with your, finances. And this also helps you set limits on how much you're thinking about your finances. So, you know, the more familiar you are with your financial plan, your financial goals, the easier it is to trust that things will work out because you are well prepared for whatever may come. And it's important to find the balance between staying present and planning for the future. So being present doesn't mean ignoring your future, but it does mean finding a way to be here. And now remembering that the present moment is all you have for sure, while also allowing a healthy relationship with preparing for what may come in the future, whether that be goals you're trying to achieve or unplanned emergencies. Yeah. And this can also especially help with impulsive spending. So the more mindful you are with your finances, the better you are reconnecting your mind to your financial goals in the moments where you may experience brief jumps of dopamine, which is the chemical in our brains that are connected to feelings of reward. Like I said, you have to practice and practice and practice these skills. But once you do, it'll become more natural in terms of when you're in that moment of, oh, I wanna buy this a hundred dollars. I don't random thing that I don't actually really need that I want right now, you will get better at reconnecting your brain to, oh, wait, I have this financial goal in mind. This isn't really necessarily a need. And sometimes if I, do have that kind of impulsive want in that moment, I'll make a note of it, whether that be a mental note or actually writing it down and, you know, revisit it in a few more months and say, do I still really want it? And if I do, then I'll start to make a financial goal to purchase it. But that also allows me to decide, okay, I don't really need this anymore. I'm not gonna get any use out of it or no, this is something that I want and then I can set a goal to it. And then it, I don't feel as bad about it because, you know, I'm still sticking with my finance plan. I'm still reaching my financial goals while also being able to achieve that thing that I'm wanting. So, building a mindful financial team is definitely another thing that people can apply in their own finances.

Nikita: 28:16

Yeah. And kind of going back to what you said towards the beginning of that people waste so much time, like overthinking and, and stressing about finances, but like in kind of vague ways where they just feel this like general like level of concern, I guess, around them, like throughout the whole week. And you think how much time is spent on that, which we could argue is not necessarily helping the situation at all. Like there's no tangible steps being taken to improve the situation. Whereas if instead, like you were saying, you have time scheduled to like actually review your finances. Like you could be doing one hour a week where you actually look at the truth of, you know, what's going on, what are my account balances at? Like, am I good until next payday? You know, am I funding my goals? Whatever your financial meetings with yourself might look like, but doing that one hour of very intentional financial, like observation and mindfulness can end up really like drastically reducing the number of hours in the week that you're stressing about it in these like intangible ways.

Cayla: 29:21

Absolutely. I couldn't agree more. And that's exactly. I like how you said being more intentional about it. I actually have that quote on my home screen on my phone and it says live, live less out of habit and more out of intent. And so I think that's a big thing is like, you know, we can get so used to obsessing over these things that we don't even tend to realize how much time we're spending or how it's really affecting our emotions in the day to day and how it's, like I said before, translating to different situations that it has nothing to do with. So yeah, setting that intentional time out to review your finances and go over it. Even if you know, you're in a little bit of a financial bind at one period, you still know that this is something that's going to be regularly occurring. So you'll continue to check on it at this specific time and you're limiting yourself so that you're not wasting any additional time that you don't need to be wasting, that you could be spending with your family or that you can do be doing something you enjoy on that. Because at the end of the day, like I said, you have to find that balance. You can't, you know, make it your whole life because it's just, it's just not realistic. It's not sustainable. And, and it's, it's not healthy. So definitely being intentional about how you approach, reviewing your finances and trying to set more of a routine on reviewing them. So it feels more natural and it doesn't feel like a scary thing every time you look at it because you're only looking at it because you know, something's wrong. Yeah. It helps to kind of see when you're making progress too. And it encourages you as you, you know, work to reach different financial goals.

Nikita: 30:46

Yeah. Well put, so what are some common pitfalls in people's interpretation of mindfulness?

Cayla: 30:52

There, there are actually quite a lot. Mindfulness is only meditation- there are a multitude of different ways to practice mindfulness. It’s not a one-size-fits-all, so what works for me may not work for you and vice versa. My suggestion is to first start with learning about what mindfulness is so you can start to identify what ways it might benefit you personally, then begin trying out different exercises and activities. There are lots of great free resources out there that you can find. Mindfulness is also not a replacement for urgent mental health care, so if you are experiencing a mental health crisis it’s important that you seek out support from a licensed mental health professional. You can also call the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline 24/7 to speak with a counselor that can connect you to local resources if needed. To access this resource you can call 1-800-273-8255. Starting July 16th of this year, you can also call using the new three-digit dialing code(9-8-8). If you aren’t comfortable speaking over the phone, there is also a Crisis Text Line resource available 24/7 that serves the same purpose. To access this resource you can text HOME to 741741. So, definitely if you need more immediate mental health care, if you're in a mental health crisis, things like that, I would encourage you to reach out to those. Mindfulness is just kind of a, I wanna say, a supplemental resource that you use alongside professional support. A lot of the times, it's something that you can do without it, if you, you know, are something who maybe isn't presently experiencing a mental health crisis, but does want to work on your mental health.

Nikita: 33:20

It's just a preventative measure.

Cayla: 33:21

That's what I was gonna say. Or, you know, just work as preventative to stay on top of your mental health. You can absolutely do it on your own. There's lots of resources out there.

Nikita: 33:30

Yeah. Thanks so much for providing both of those resources for listeners

Cayla: 33:33

Yeah, of course. Of course. I would say another pitfall is that people believe mindfulness will help them turn off their thoughts and mindfulness isn't necessarily about turning off your thoughts. That's just, it's not realistic. We have thoughts. We have brains. We're thinking all the time.

Nikita: 33:51

That's why I've always thought I struggled with mindfulness. It's because my brain would still be going. And now as we're going through this episode, I'm thinking to myself, like I do some of this stuff without even realizing that what I'm engaging in is mindfulness.

Cayla: 34:04

Yeah, exactly that, and that's, that's why I said the question that you asked me in the beginning of like, how long have you done it? I'm like, well, before I even knew what it was, I was actually doing it. So yeah, definitely. Cool. That's a great example, but yeah, so, so turning over your thoughts, isn't realistic. It's mindfulness is about being able to notice without judgment so that you can then begin to shift your thinking and self-talk in ways that improve your quality of life. So, you know, negative self-talk is a very common struggle for many people and has a larger impact on our day to day emotions and behaviors than we tend to realize. So being able to recognize when that negative self-talk or, or those roaming thoughts are happening and then shifting the narrative or bringing ourselves back to the present each time to the point, it becomes our natural way of thinking is the ultimate goal, in my opinion. So yeah. Yeah. Mindfulness may, you know, help you to quiet, you know, some of those thoughts, but you're not gonna turn them off completely. It's just, that's just realistic and that's not what most mindfulness exercises are trying to help you do so. Yeah. And then I would say a third major pitfall or myth about mindfulness is that, people think once I learn mindfulness, I'm always mindful. Mindfulness may feel easy to understand when you first learn about, for a lot of people, the concept seems, you know, super obvious and you tend to have that like, aha moment where you're wondering why you didn't connect it before, why we aren't teaching it to everyone. You know, I definitely had that experience, but actually living mindfully takes work like a lot of work and it's not easy because it often requires you to look inward, face, you know, certain realities. And like I said before break habits that may not be serving you, but are comfortable because they're what you're used to. So that kind of goes back to my quote of"live less out of habit and more out of intent". Once you get through that hump though, it gets easier over time, but again, it will never be perfect. So mindfulness really requires you to accept being an infinite learner.

Nikita: 36:07

That's a great way of putting that.

Cayla: 36:08

Yeah. You have to know, you know, that you will never know it all and that sometimes things that work before may not work as your life changes. So your mindfulness journey will definitely have to grow with you.

Nikita: 36:20

So in what ways has this practice benefited you? And in what ways are you still maybe kind of figuring it out?

Cayla: 36:28

So mindfulness helps to influence my neuroplasticity, which is basically a complicated term that that means our brains have the ability to adapt and change over time based on our experiences.

Nikita: 36:41

I don't think I've heard that word since my college days.

Cayla: 36:44

Right. I know. But yeah. So the reason I, why I've mentioned wishing I had more access to mental health education growing up is because I know that our brains have a lot more plasticity when we're younger. So yeah. You know, similar to how many of us know it's easier to are in a different language when we're younger. It's also easier to develop mindful thinking habits when we're younger as well. However, it's not impossible to develop these habits as we get older. Like I said before, it just takes a little bit more time and effort. So it definitely has personally helped me with my neuroplasticity. And, Dan Siegel actually has a video on YouTube where he explains the"flipping your lid" concept or blow your top thing I was talking about, in connection to the structure of the brain. So, you know, it's a quick explanation that I found really helped me to understand the science behind how mindfulness works. So yeah, if you are interested, I would suggest go on YouTube, type up flipping your lid Dan Siegel, and you should find the video and it may be a helpful explanation for you.

Nikita: 37:38

And I'll go ahead and include the, that in the show notes on this podcast as well.

Cayla: 37:41

Okay, awesome. Awesome. Thank you. And so then what ways am I still figuring it out? I would have to say where I still struggle is with finding a routine. So as a 21 year old, you know, fresh out of college, I'm in the very beginning stages of adulting and understanding what that looks like for my life. So developing routine that works is the biggest area that I find myself revisiting and changing. I'm also a recovering perfectionist, so mindfulness, mindfulness is really teaching me to have more acceptance for change and uncertainty. I am in a place where I recognize that I will likely have to change my routine quite often in these early stages of adulthood. But instead of having feeling the stress about that, like I would have in the past, it gets me excited to know that I'm finally, you know, giving myself the time and attention I both need and deserve. Hmm. Yeah. Taking care of my, myself and my mental health makes me a better person and it makes life feel a little more tolerable. So yeah, having a routine rooted in mindfulness is important for me because, you know, that's what I found, puts me in the best state of mind more consistently I'm I just am a and who finds comfort in routines, but on the flip side, sticking to a routine 24 7, isn't always realistic either. So, also remembering to practice that self compassion when I break my routine is another big thing that I often have to remind myself of. Yeah. So, you know, mindfulness, doesn't always have to look super uniform, like for example, scheduling morning or evening journaling into your everyday routine. It can be as simple as taking a few moments throughout the day to check in with yourself, like, you know, some of those examples, I provided the box breathing, the stop method, things like that. And you know, that still absolutely counts and it still absolutely has an impact and always say, you know, slow progress is still progress.

Nikita: 39:37

I love that phrase. I think it's so important. I think so much of the time people think that it's an all or nothing approach, but some small movement in the right direction is better than nothing hands down.

Cayla: 39:49

Absolutely. And you have to be realistic with your goals too. Like you can't think that you're going to start something new and then be a pro at it. You know, you have to give yourself that, that time to go through that learning curve and, you know, fail a few times and understand that you're going to stay, you're gonna stick with it. And you're still going to see results, even if it's not necessarily as fast as you're hoping you're still making progress even at times where you may not feel or see it. So definitely just practicing that self compassion with yourself and, and that patience with yourself to understand that you're learning something new, for my friends who listen to Brene Brown, you know, your"FFT".

Nikita: 40:27

Yes! I'm so glad you're a fellow Brene Brown fan.

Cayla: 40:31

So yeah, definitely just being patient with yourself and practicing that self-compassion is, is incredibly important when you're practicing mindfulness and just in general throughout your life,

Nikita: 40:42

Are there any other closing thoughts that you'd like to share before we sign off for the day?

Cayla: 40:47

I don't think so, but I do want to share, a quote that I love from Oprah Winfrey in honor of mindfulness. And the quote is"Breathe, let go, and remind yourself that this very moment is the only one you know you have for sure".

Nikita: 41:01

I love that. Thank you so much for sharing that. And thank you for sharing your time with us today. I'm so excited for our listeners to be able to hear this. You have such a valuable insight to bring to the table. I am still blown away that you're only 21 years old. You're wonderful. And I'm so grateful that you, you shared your life experience and your expertise with all of us. And I know that listeners will certainly benefit from what you share today. So thank you for that.

Cayla: 41:25

Yeah, absolutely. Thank you so much for having me and so much to, you know, the 3rd Decade program, you know, I'm huge on finances and financial literacy and things like that. And I'm just so grateful to have found this program and to be able to, you know, help provide my insight, wherever it's needed to help support the rest of the 3rd Decade community. So, thank you!