The Three Wisemen of Divorce: Money, Psych & Law

New Year's Dispute Resolutions

December 31, 2020 Shawn Weber, CLS-F, Mark C. Hill, CFP®, CDFA® and Scott Weiner, Ph.D., J.D. Season 1 Episode 27
The Three Wisemen of Divorce: Money, Psych & Law
New Year's Dispute Resolutions
Show Notes Transcript

It's that time of the year for New Year's Resolutions.  When folks are facing marital problems, they often include a divorce in their plans for the New Year.  In this time of rebooting, how can people approach these changes?   From a menu ranging from better co-parenting, setting boundaries and new financial choices, what other resolutions might the newly separated consider ?   Mark C. Hill, CFP®, CDFA® Financial Divorce Consultant; Scott Weiner, Psychologist, Attorney and Mediator; and Shawn Weber, CLS-F* Family Law Mediator and Divorce Attorney, discuss letting go of the old and ringing in the New Year with a new outlook.

Shawn Weber:

Welcome to the Three Wise Men of divorce, money, psych and law podcast. Sit down with the California divorce experts, financial divorce consultant, Mark Hill, psychologist Scott Weiner and attorney Sean Weber, for a frank and casual conversation about divorce, separation, co parenting, and the difficult decisions, real people like you face during these tough times. We know that if you are looking at divorce or separation, it can be scary and overwhelming. With combined experience of over 70 years of divorce and conflict management, we are here for you and look forward to helping you by sharing our unique ideas, thoughts and perspectives on divorce, separation, and co parenting. Gentlemen, we're here again, it's getting towards the end of December. And you know what that means?

Mark Hill:

Oh, want to say, we've got New Year's coming up.

Shawn Weber:

It's a time of the year when we make promises to ourselves. And they last about a month.

Mark Hill:

If you're if you're lucky.

Shawn Weber:

Isn't that usually how it works? The New Year's resolution?

Scott Weiner:

Well, it depends on how cynical you are. I think many of them fall away almost before they escape our lips.

Mark Hill:

Yes, my comment is I bought the gym membership. Do I really have to go?

Shawn Weber:

Well, I told you guys earlier, I'm planning to lose my COVID-19. But I don't know, we'll see what happens. You know, every year, it's just about not gaining more weight.

Scott Weiner:

Well, it is that, isn't it?

Shawn Weber:

I mean, well, I also have noticed this guys, and that is at that last week of December, all of a sudden, my phone starts ringing a lot more than usual from people who are looking for divorce services, because they've made their new year's resolution to leave their spouse. And they've got through the holidays they got through Hanukkah they got through Christmas. So maybe they survived it. Maybe the wife sister made a pass at the husband and Thanksgiving. Things have been festering. Yeah. You know, I just but but people do get to a point where they want to. They want to change their outlook on life. They want to make a change in a year. And a lot of times January is a time when people do that. Absolutely. Yep. And therapy world, too. You see it in the therapy world too.

Scott Weiner:

After? Not? In my case. Of course, as you know, in psychology, it's not so much a matter of they're ready to divorce. It's that the holiday season itself is often so stressful. Yeah. All that great family cheer is?

Mark Hill:

Well,

Shawn Weber:

not so cheerful anymore.

Scott Weiner:

No, not so much. And And guess what, it really wasn't so much during December either. And the phone does start ringing. And therapists are always worried during holidays. Oh my God, my practice is, you know, going away, going all south and right. And then all of a sudden in January, like what was I think

Shawn Weber:

it's like, it's like the starting gun went off something like for me, I find that my phone's just ringing constantly until about February 1 and then

Mark Hill:

Ah, February is for me. It's about February the 16th. Is that? That's because Valentine's Day can be the last straw.

Shawn Weber:

Yeah, Valentine's Day is one of Yep,

Mark Hill:

I've had several people you know, he really screwed up and no pressure guys, but you know,

Shawn Weber:

didn't bring didn't bring card.

Scott Weiner:

The card was addressed to the other woman.

Shawn Weber:

Well, you know, I have had a couple not so long ago this week. And the wife told me because I was talking about well, you know, when people get divorced, it's usually a two way street. You know, people don't get divorced in a vacuum. And she's like, Oh, no, I want you to know, it's completely his fault. And that brunette woman you know, and she she wasn't lacking in hurt and disgusted and what he had chosen to do. But you know, okay, so we get to these places. And sometimes people hold it together to get through the holidays, and we get through the new year, maybe they're doing it so the kids can have a nice Christmas or something. And then here we are, and we're making new plans. The other I also see the other side. And that is you've been fighting and arguing and being nasty with each other. And then you decide, I'm going to break my addiction. You know, New Years, a lot of times people resolve to break an addiction and sometimes that's alcohol or other harmful things. Gambling Who knows what credit card debt? Sure, sometimes people want to break their addiction to having a nasty contact with their, their ex spouse. And and maybe I mean, Scott, you've probably seen this like people when they're married, they kind of become accustomed to interacting with one another and almost becomes like an addiction. And then when the divorce happens, they can't see each other folks want to have a contact with the other person, even if it's a negative contact. Have you noticed that?

Scott Weiner:

I have noticed that I personally I would go further. Okay, I think I, I may have mentioned to you too, that the book I haven't yet written his step work for the rest of us. That basically I see so much of habit and repetition of behavior, as really the glory and the bane of humanity, creating all kinds of awfulness, and also creating the ability to send rockets to the moon and other such mirror, you

Shawn Weber:

can have good habits to write. Yeah,

Scott Weiner:

sure. But it's like, we form habit at a level of both delicacy, specificity, elegance, and also at the level of horribleness. Beyond all the other creatures, it's why we're top species are habit possibilities, but because we can relegate so much of our daily behavior to habit, we don't think about all those things, and they become part of our unconscious, you know, blessing and burden. You know, and here comes new year, it's, you're gonna, you're gonna, you're gonna change you think you say you tell yourself and in some ways, well, I mean, let's be fair, it does happen. It does happen. People do resolve to do something different. And what do you figure one time out of whatever they actually do it? But how often do they do it permanently? Not very often, without constant constant work? Which is, I mean, it's so honorable to me, with watching a human being struggle that hard to achieve a higher level of functioning. It's just remarkable. The thing?

Shawn Weber:

Yeah, I mean, I've seen people in my practice that that are trying to break a nasty, like a drug habit, or an alcohol habit. And you see some of them that succeed, and some of them don't. And what I've noticed the difference in the people that do succeed are the ones that recognize that this is a lifelong struggle.

Mark Hill:

Sure. And interesting, they, you know, just specific to our work. I had a conversation this week with a client who, in essence, she was the unmanaged spouse, was incredibly nervous, didn't know anything about it, but was obviously a very smart and actually well educated woman. And she said something to me today, we've been working on her case for another two or three months. She said, You told me there's a chance for me to become empowered in this process. And around the money it's actually happening. Hmm. And so actually Becoming Empowered. Yes, she's feeling empowered, because she's not dependent upon her spouse who basically handled the money and gave her an allowance, you know?

Shawn Weber:

Well, that's, that's nice to see. You see people mark that break their bad financial habits like the the the spendthrifts, the overspenders, you know, we have had more than a few of those cases. Yeah. You know, that's much more difficult. Is it really

Mark Hill:

people who, you know, people are savers or their spenders, you know, and they don't really change that much. Their patterns are very hard to change. And I've seen that not just in our work, but then in watching, you know, for the 40 years before I concentrated purely on this business, when I worked on the investment management side, I was always there were always some clients who would make a resolution, they were going to save this much they were going to contribute this much to their retirement plans. And it never happened. Never happened, because they had to buy that other that new car or they had to take that big expensive cruise, you know,

Scott Weiner:

well, it got in the way of the way they make themselves feel all right. Right. Correct. And that is the problem with changing habits is that those habits, those behaviors don't come from nowhere. They come from a comfort seeking or some other kind of, I mean, sometimes people do what they do because of a justice they were seeking when they were kids. I mean it goes that

Mark Hill:

it fills a void is there the expression that I've had, it feels like they have to fill a void by these actions and behaviors that know what the void is, you know,

Shawn Weber:

There's actually a physical characteristic of the brain that develops over time with a habit, right? Don't you like you burn these kind of pathways?

Scott Weiner:

There's that. And there is the fact that when you try to operate in a different way, it releases stress hormones cortisol, and it's suffer its people suffer when they try to change.

Shawn Weber:

Well, and then some of these habits people use, like, I think you were hitting on this, people use the habit as a way to cope with stress.

Scott Weiner:

I would say that anything that gains that kind of strata, the Stratus, I'm thinking about clouds in the stratosphere. Anything that that attains that kind of status, did originally emerged as not necessarily a solution for some big problem, but kind of like an appealing way to, to operate, whether it's maybe mom or dad approved of it, maybe, maybe a teacher told them it was great. Maybe it vaulted them into a position of more success among friends or something like that. Nothing, nothing necessarily grand. Somebody who picks up the tab a little too often at the restaurant, whatever it is,

Mark Hill:

I think it's familiarity. In a way, it's where we just go back to being comfortable. This is kind of who I am. Yeah, I've worked all my life never saved a lousy time. Haha, that's who I am. You know? Uh huh.

Shawn Weber:

Yeah. Or, you know, the couples that we see come in, and they're really good at fighting with each other. You can tell they've had a lot of practice and experience. And you

Mark Hill:

can tell the minute it starts, where it's going to end after you've seen him do it once or twice, like,

Shawn Weber:

Oh, here we go. Yeah. becomes like

Mark Hill:

a roller coaster. And there's no way off, you know?

Shawn Weber:

Yeah. And I always just want to say to people, do you want to stop this cycle? And, and and sometimes they do sometimes, yes. Stop it. But it's hard. Because you're, you're in this, this run. And I do think you get some kind of a release some kind of an endorphin out of I think, fight, right.

Mark Hill:

But they're paying us to have that fight in front of us. And I think they do it because they both feel justified in their positions. And they expect us to validate them both, which of course, is not what we do. And I will often say to clients, you know, we can continue down this road if you feel we're being productive. And I stop. Yeah. Is this helping you watch the body language change in the room when that? Well?

Shawn Weber:

I've done this. Okay. Are you finished? Are you finished? Are you done? Okay. So what's your proposal? What do you think Scott? I see you kind of looking like you got something to say over there.

Scott Weiner:

No, I was just eating a cheese crunchy. But that is very that's

Shawn Weber:

another whole addiction.

Mark Hill:

Yeah, well,

Scott Weiner:

it kind of you know, I mean, you know, I resolved when this bag is gone to stop until I go downstairs and get the next back.

Mark Hill:

Such control. I

Shawn Weber:

was so impressed with your willpower external, if

Scott Weiner:

you know what I'm saying. God, I don't know. I just, I just think that, you know, when the people are there with us in a in a mediation are in a collaboration. They that alone is a counter habitual activity for them, they usually don't do this in front of somebody else. And, and they are really, to be I don't know if it's spurious, but it's to they are about to undo a marriage, which is a

Mark Hill:

big, big deal, from every standpoint, every standpoint because it's probably the biggest financial transaction of that lifetime. That's so it impacts their family. Oh, all levels beyond the nuclear family.

Shawn Weber:

Well, like you, you and I, Mark A lot of times, say to people, you know, you're building a new muscle. Yep, you're fine. You're building muscles you didn't even know you had. Yep. Like, you know, when you go to the gym for the first time in a long time, you're like, Oh, my gosh, I didn't even know I could hurt there.

Mark Hill:

Yes. Yeah. And I think that's why I just buy the membership guys,

Shawn Weber:

right? Just buy the membership. But don't you know, come on, go go, why, why have pain? Why have physics, but sometimes, you know, people really, I mean, it hurts to do something that's outside of your comfort zone to do something that you're not used to doing. You're not used to interacting in this way. And when you tried it, and

Mark Hill:

it impacts the roles that both of them have cemented as their, you know, it's, you know, I was talking about the lady who's Becoming Empowered. It is freaking out the husband that

Shawn Weber:

was airing on here. This

Mark Hill:

is what he does. What do you mean, she can ask me a question about it, you know, and and his area of expertise. It's diminishing him to have Her become more powerful. Well, we're

Shawn Weber:

seeing that happen on a couple of our cases, Mark. You know, we got a couple of people that were somebody stepping up in a way that and we see it with sometimes it's usually the guys, I don't want to pick on the guys, but it's usually the guys who they've been working outside of the home the whole marriage, and then all of a sudden, they want to be a 5050. Dad. Yeah. And I'm like, that's great. But do you realize what that's gonna take? And then they're, they're having to build a new muscle there and work outside of a comfort zone and actually show they Oh, you mean, I have to show up to the parent teacher conference? With Hallmark. Oh, okay. And and I always tell these guys come on and step up, build that muscle?

Mark Hill:

Or look into why you want that? Well, that's the other. Do you want it? Because you want to have a closer relationship with your children? And they want it to? Do you want it because you think it'll advantage you financially? Because unfortunately, the way the rules work in the state, you know, we tend to end up buying and selling children in support calm, because

Shawn Weber:

of the percentage of time that you have a child support amount. Yeah, no, I will say this, though, you know, I see that happen a lot, where there's an accusation that the only reason somebody wants to have more time is because they want money, I think nine times out of 10, they actually really do want to have more time with their kids.

Mark Hill:

Yes, I agree.

Shawn Weber:

But But what happens is a lot of folks, they're not able to be realistic about what it's going to take to make that shift so that you can be a 5030 parent. Right? Right.

Mark Hill:

And at the same time, I've seen people try to do that and become extremely resentful because they're also having to work and pay support.

Shawn Weber:

Well, I got a guy now who we're talking about a parenting plan. And I see him start to melt, I'm seeing just absolutely start to melt down because he's very stressed at work. And, you know, he's, he's like, I'm having panic attacks, because I'm having to do more than I ever thought I'd have to do. And he wasn't used to that. And so it's like, Okay, well, let's think about this. Is this really the best use solution in the family? Yeah, yeah. To be a full time parent? Or is it better to keep? I mean, is it better to keep doing what you were doing while you were married? But now do it as separate individuals. The problem with that for folks, though, is this guy, you know, the concern is, well, if I don't have 5050, then that means I don't get to see my kids at night. You know, when when when I was hard working, at least come home, and I'd be able to see them at night. Maybe I read them a story or help them the bath time. And now I can't do that, because we're in separate houses. So maybe I get that once every other weekend. Well, that doesn't work for me. Yeah. You know, something happened. And that's

Scott Weiner:

a thing. We've created creative. You know, resolutions to that. But it requires that the too soon to be ex spouses have a, you know, a peaceable reality in which they can come into each other's domiciles. And, you know,

Shawn Weber:

yeah.

Mark Hill:

And also build in some flexibility. For both of you, you know, that the right of first refusal, for example, you know, you've got the you got the working parent who, sometimes I just can't make it in time to pick the kid up from Montessori school, or wherever they're going. So I have to get someone else to pick them up for me. And then the non working or the one who is provided more childcare throughout the marriage is resentful. Why didn't you pick them up? I don't want you to have the kids so you can get a babysitter and just go out and party.

Shawn Weber:

Yeah, oh, and then this also happens, the parent that is typically the one that spends most of the custodial time with the kids starts to resent that this other person is now stepping up. And starts to feel that this other person is encroaching on what had been their domain.

Mark Hill:

Sure. The reverse of the money thing I said before, right.

Shawn Weber:

Yeah, this had been my domain, what is he doing? Or what is right up in here? And I get I sit down,

Mark Hill:

right? it degrades me it means I have less value if he's able to do this, or she's able to do this.

Shawn Weber:

Well, that's it isn't a zero sum game. So if you have a benefit of that means I'm losing something.

Mark Hill:

Yep. And

Shawn Weber:

that happens in divorce a lot. And that's not true. It's actually a fallacy.

Mark Hill:

Yeah, I agree. But it's the way people approached divorce. If she's getting something it's one less thing I'm getting.

Shawn Weber:

Okay, boy, we've gone full circle. So we started off with we started resolutions, New Year's resolution. Yeah, I mean, these are these are important resolutions to make resolutions for your family.

Mark Hill:

How about Guys, if we're in the you have a couple in the middle of a divorce, what resolutions can they make? to complete their divorce in a more perhaps efficient or I dread to say I have a lot of elaborative Why

Scott Weiner:

do I have a lot of those? That? That's that's mission statement all over the place, isn't it?

Shawn Weber:

Yeah. Well, I resolved that I will complete the homework assignments that I need to complete in order to continue to finish this case,

Mark Hill:

in a timely fashion place

Shawn Weber:

a timely fashion, or I resolve to accept that this divorce is happening. Yeah. That's a hard one. Yep.

Scott Weiner:

I resolve to act in a manner during this process that is somehow less hostile, and less divisive than how we have been acting over the past whatevers that brought us here in the first place.

Mark Hill:

By post Scott, they've got to acknowledge that, that they're doing that.

Shawn Weber:

Well know when they got a problem is the first step.

Mark Hill:

Yeah. Because most of the time, it's the fix this jerk. And then everything would be fine.

Shawn Weber:

Yeah, I resolved to focus on what I can change and not what I can't change.

Mark Hill:

There you go. I like that one.

Shawn Weber:

Or I resolved to be more generous.

Mark Hill:

That's a hard one. As you know, that's my final when I'm out of your out of out of it. I just say, you know what, we tried everything we haven't tried. Yeah, really? See what happens. In one case,

Shawn Weber:

I resolved to not let my buttons be pushed. Wow. So many people tell them? Oh, she pushes my buttons. And like, but you know what, you're not a computer? Yeah, you're

Mark Hill:

allowed to you have the button not be connected.

Shawn Weber:

What differentiates us from a lot of the other species and from machinery is that when a button is pushed, we have a moment where we can use judgment and not allow an emotional hijacking to occur.

Mark Hill:

So how can anybody Scott simply create an interruption that stops them going to the place they've been in, that caused them to come in to offices in the first place? Yes.

Scott Weiner:

This is one of my two, five letter cure alls. Oh, this

Shawn Weber:

is gonna be good.

Scott Weiner:

Yeah. The first five letter cure all is in the interactive universe. And that one is D, E, LAY

Shawn Weber:

to delay the delay anyway. Okay,

Scott Weiner:

if you interpose even a moment, this guarantees nothing, but it offers the possibility that the actual freedom, whatever freedom, you have to choose how to react may come into your mind, it might, it just might. And instead of instead of, you know, going for that fight. I mean, even if you said, God is so pissed off right now, but I'm not gonna go there with you. Even if you did that, it gives you a chance, there's no guarantee, no guarantee. But I've seen

Mark Hill:

the opportunity for the one who is initiating it to add a qualifier that when there's a pause that actually makes it not so reactive for the person that you're in it. I've seen that happen, too. Yeah, that's a great one like that shocking for both of them. Yeah.

Shawn Weber:

Well, you know, that's a really important mediation technique when I'm working with couples that are each other's throats, is to really get them to slow down. No, I stopped them, I deliberately kind of interrupt their process and stop them and let them just kind of slow down and have very controlled responses. Yep. Yeah. to one another. And when that happens, then they start hearing each other in a different way. But yeah, I think your your point of just just just just slowing it down. Generally,

Scott Weiner:

the lessons from kindergarten. Use your words. Word.

Mark Hill:

Yeah. Use your word. And also, keep it as your reaction, not what the other person did. This is how it made me feel. Because you can't argue with that. You did this? No, I didn't. When that happened, it made me feel this. No, it didn't. Well, wait a minute. Yes, it did. I'm the only one who knows how

Shawn Weber:

I feel. Yeah,

Scott Weiner:

exactly. Once you do that with the name of a feeling as opposed to, you know, it's just my feeling. I feel that you're a total asshole. Now. That's the feeling I'm entitled to. Those are my feelings. I'm in touch with my feelings. I feel that you are, you know,

Mark Hill:

yeah, Jared

Shawn Weber:

reminds me of a training I did with a very well known attorney. I was training her in the collaborative practice model. Yeah, this was in Los Angeles. And she was role playing the part of the of the wife, who wanted spousal support. And this poor other person that was role playing the part of the facilitator. And, and she says to her, what can you tell us what your interest is? Well, I want spousal support. Yeah, and I want this much. And she says, what could you say that more positively? You know, and she says, I positively want more spousal support.

Mark Hill:

I want to add another 1000 a month to that. That's positive. Yes.

Shawn Weber:

But yeah, I love that the slowing down, slowing down. Well, what else? Scott, what's another technique?

Mark Hill:

Wow.

Scott Weiner:

Got it. Yeah, this is an amazing discussion, because I'm flooded with thoughts about these techniques. And I'm also still can't help it stuck on this new year's resolution thing we're talking about, and resolutions that we that we make, and I'm thinking about how any resolution has an element of it, have an honest admission

Shawn Weber:

that we have an issue, something needs to change, you wouldn't resolve it, there's

Scott Weiner:

something about there's something about me that I honestly admit is, you know, either a flaw or an error or a something or other than, you know, the core of it, even though we tease about how, you know, ai works. I bought the membership, what the hell else do you want from me?

Mark Hill:

I signed up for mediation, you may not have to participate.

Scott Weiner:

I'm here at mediation. He isn't, you know, whatever. Yeah. But yeah.

Mark Hill:

So it requires some self awareness.

Scott Weiner:

Yes, yes. Yes. What What part of this? You know, I've been in these, these couple situations where it's like, you know, I'll, I'll in very good, kindly faith and say, Well, you know, Mr. Johnson, what part of this do you think you bring to the table? Well, one of my flaws in judgment is that I select people like her

Shawn Weber:

choice and women. That's my biggest blocker.

Unknown:

It's like, you know, it's

Shawn Weber:

Yeah, that I've seen that one, too.

Unknown:

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I

Shawn Weber:

think also, judgment, I really lacked judgment, you know, the ability to look inward at where maybe you might be part of the problem is a hard one. Yeah. Isn't it requires a little bit of an attack on our own ego.

Mark Hill:

And think about what we're asking people to do at one of the most so difficult periods of their life to do hard work at a difficult time in their life. Yes. Because it is hard work. You know, I mean, I look at some of our clients after a two hour mediation session. You and I are tired, but the reality is they're exhausted. They're worn out. Yeah, they are depleted, you know?

Shawn Weber:

Yeah. Yeah, it's absolutely true. Yeah. Like I can tell you guys are just, you're done.

Mark Hill:

Yep, exactly. And we say that all the time we go, okay. Sometimes we need to truncate this right now we achieve some things and now you're starting to disintegrate. So let's look at

Unknown:

their their hard disk account.

Shawn Weber:

And just, you know, one, one of the most important techniques that I like people to focus on when they're thinking about a change, and that is the ability to, to get out of the past and be in your present. You know, folks, sometimes they come to the, they come with experiences, like you were talking about earlier, Scott, where they've had experiences just kind of tread pathways in their, in their psyche. And, and now they're having to change that and being able to say, you know, I'm going to leave what's behind behind and I'm going to make a plan for now and for my future. Is, is it is a challenge. And so I I'm always telling people, okay, where are we now, that was Ben, what are we doing now? What is your proposal, and so the proposal would be a proposal for the future. Yeah. And just kind of getting you in that mindset is a challenge, but it's important.

Mark Hill:

But so when I look at our deliberations

Scott Weiner:

at the collaboratives, we've done yeah, the moments when I feel actually dissatisfied with what we got done. are times when we just couldn't manage and I don't even know I don't blame us. I just don't think it's always doable, but we just Couldn't get them to make that, that dividing point. And so they drift, they bring forward the same psychological or emotional Mo, about a new situation that is so toxic. And it just, you know, it just makes this process so incomplete and so unsatisfying,

Mark Hill:

because we hope that the clients can make change through the process, we hope that it does empower, we hope that it does enable them to have deeper relationships with that doesn't

Shawn Weber:

always happen. But when it does is it's so rewarding.

Mark Hill:

It's great, right?

Scott Weiner:

It's so great. It's so

Mark Hill:

that sometimes guys would just it's just triage at the end with just getting the deal done.

Shawn Weber:

When you know what else I was thinking about? I'm talking to you guys is, you know, the, you know, the Scott, the marshmallow experiment where the kids are brought into a room.

Scott Weiner:

Yes, yes.

Mark Hill:

Oh, yes. Can they Wait, really?

Shawn Weber:

How long can they wait, like if they don't eat the marshmallow? And then when the person comes back, they'll bring them a second marshmallow? And so yes, right, you get two marshmallows, but he gets a marshmallow right now, if you want. And then they followed up with these same children, if I'm not mistaken, and found out that the ones that were able to wait, did better in life.

Scott Weiner:

I like the fact that they'll often ask that little one. Did you eat that other marshmallow? And they'll say, No. Right?

Shawn Weber:

That's clearly

Mark Hill:

the person in the room. But I don't know where it went.

Shawn Weber:

I don't know. I don't know where that marshmallow. And

Scott Weiner:

so, I mean, some of those kids are a very few of them probably could become president. But if you anyway, I'm sorry. It's a little 20.

Shawn Weber:

couldn't resist could you

Mark Hill:

know, Eric, you're sorry. We're close to wrapping up. We nearly got through the whole thing without a political commentary. I

Scott Weiner:

know. I know. I just can't tell you how sorry I am.

Shawn Weber:

That was very well said, I can't do

Unknown:

like it. Sorry. I know you.

Shawn Weber:

Well,

Scott Weiner:

it's so hard. It's so hard to actually make these transitions. And it's so honorable, when we can, it's so respectable.

Shawn Weber:

I do a thing every year with my business advisor, where we come up with an a word, to define what we want our experience in the next year to be. So it's not so much a resolution as much as it is. What do we want to what do I want to experience in my career in my work? In 2021, and I'm working on a word right now, I don't have it yet. But it tends to kind of define how I'm going to relate to my, my practice and my profession. I think you could do the same thing with a divorce. And that is, what do you want your experience to be? Do you want it to be chaos? insanity? Or do you want your experience in the new year to be peace?

Mark Hill:

Oh, boy, I would take it a step further. What do you want your children's experience? Yeah, divorce to be. And I do Is that it? Oh, my experience, I can tough it out. I can work through this, I can do this. But my children, that's different.

Shawn Weber:

And I do think that's much more powerful than necessarily resolution. Like, as I shall not yell at my ex husband anymore. I mean, that's nice. But maybe the resolution is I want my experience in 2021. I want my experience of 2021 to be one of, of increased peace, or, you know, come up with the word satisfaction. That could be a word. It could be a phrase moving forward. Yeah. And these are just ideas. And I think if a person spends a lot of quality time, just kind of setting an intention, as opposed to, you know, I'm going to eat less doughnuts. You know, maybe your intention word is I my experiences I want to experience a more healthy 2021. Right. And I think that works with divorce. And there is something about writing down an intention. And but really meaning it not just some cockamamie intention because you want to satisfy a to do list item where we got to come up with intention word, but really, really an important word that maybe relates to you or a porn concept that relates to you, and how you want to experience life in the coming year.

Mark Hill:

But you also brought up accountability and what you just said, Shawn? Yeah, so you have to be either accountable to yourself or account. To in our process, the third party neutrals you're working with

Shawn Weber:

and the other spouse.

Mark Hill:

Yeah, no true.

Shawn Weber:

And your children mentioned that the children, the other the players that are not in the room,

Mark Hill:

and that I think helps greatly to move away from everything focused on us on the individual. Helping the clients understand the wake, they leave behind.

Shawn Weber:

Yeah. Yeah, I think that's really important.

Mark Hill:

So, guys, this is the last of 2020. You know, I, I, I recall that somebody around a couple months ago sent me an email saying that they weren't going to change their clocks, because they couldn't stand the thought of one more hour of 2020. But we've almost gotten through it. And I hope and I expect that 2021 will be a better year for us all. And I pray it is for all of our listeners,

Shawn Weber:

truly, from your mouth to God's ears. Amen. Oh, yeah,

Scott Weiner:

I have a nickname for it that's emerging right now. In my mind. I'll call it 2021. Vision.

Shawn Weber:

As opposed to 2020 vision.

Mark Hill:

Yeah, well,

Shawn Weber:

yeah. 2020 Wait, boy, we

Scott Weiner:

we saw it pretty clearly this year. 2020. Oh, my God.

Shawn Weber:

Yes. Well, and also be prepared. You know, another thing that's important is is is we've learned some skills in 2020, about how to be resilient, and how to adapt. And we can carry those skills forward into the new year. And so if something comes our way, if we get another curveball, which, I mean, I think in life if you're not gonna have a struggle here and there, you're not getting your money's worth. Yeah, I agree. So, so being prepared, psychologically, physically, financially, for a curveball. Mm hmm. We can do that now. Because look what we did.

Mark Hill:

Yep. Because the muscle we built,

Shawn Weber:

we get another pandemic and 21 we'll be we'll be ready for it. Oh, my God.

Mark Hill:

That is a strange disease in India. Have you heard about that

Scott Weiner:

one? That is frankly, a terror of mine. Yeah,

Mark Hill:

yeah. Well, I'm just talking to someone the other day who said to a doctor he said, You don't know how lucky we got this time because your mobility mobility of this is pretty low for Coronavirus. Yeah. So we got lucky. Just think about that. This could have been so much worse. If it was like SARS, or even Spanish Flu that was killing young men. Young men would come in healthy to a hospital in the morning and be dead by afternoon you know, yeah, that's that's morbidity and we got lucky. We don't feel lucky, but we should be considering that you know.

Shawn Weber:

Well, what's that pat answer? Count your blessings. Yep. Name them one by one.

Mark Hill:

Okay, guys, brothers good Holidays to you all holidays.

Shawn Weber:

Absolutely. Peace on earth and all that comes with it.

Mark Hill:

And a good divorce tool, man. Oh, man,

Scott Weiner:

we wish you We wish you well, we wish you safety. And can we enjoy each other in the new year?

Shawn Weber:

Here here? All right. Well, if somebody wants to enjoy you in the next year, Scott

Scott Weiner:

Well, the way they would enjoy me hope they would do such oh my i just not even gonna begin there. Oh, there No, no, no, no. This is a family.

Shawn Weber:

The way they would enjoy your your professional services. The way

Scott Weiner:

they would engage me to talk about things would be to call me. I am in Solana Beach, California. My name is Scott Weiner with a W e i n ER and I am at 619-417-5743 and two those of you to moderns How would they reach you?

Shawn Weber:

You know if you want to go with a young, youthful person in this group because you want to satisfy a need to settle a dispute no matter what the dispute is where we can match you with a mediator who can help you get past a fight that you're having. You go to Weber dispute resolution.com that's Weber with one B dispute resolution.com

Mark Hill:

and if you have a financial issue related to divorce, you would go to my company website Pacific divorce management. Pack divorced.com pacd ibrc.com. Pick up the phone from there, call us or fill out a contact form and We'll be in touch.

Shawn Weber:

All right, gentlemen, that's a wrap. We'll see you next year. Thanks for listening to another episode of the three Wiseman divorce, money, psych, and law. If you like what you heard, be sure to subscribe. leave us a review and share with others who may be in a similar place. Until next time, stay safe, healthy and focused on a positive, bright future. This podcast is for informational purposes only. Every family law case is unique. So no legal, financial or mental health advice is intended during this podcast. If you need help with your specific situation, feel free to schedule a time to speak with one of us for a personal consultation.