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Erik Bartell on Military Transition, Entrepreneurship, and Building Echelon Frontline | Security Halt! Podcast Ep. 440

• Deny Caballero • Season 8 • Episode 440

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In Episode 440 of the Security Halt! Podcast, Erik Bartell shares his remarkable journey from military service and leadership to entrepreneurship and founding ECHELON USA. From overcoming adversity and navigating military life to launching a brand built specifically for the military community, Erik provides valuable lessons for veterans looking to transition successfully into business ownership.

This conversation explores leadership, resilience, culture-building, startup challenges, and why community remains one of the most important assets veterans can leverage after leaving the military.
 
 About Erik Bartell

Erik Bartell is a veteran, entrepreneur, and founder of ECHELON USA. After serving as an Army officer and leading soldiers in demanding operational environments, Erik transitioned into entrepreneurship, helping build veteran-focused organizations and products designed to serve the military community.

Listen now. Follow the show. Share this with the veteran or entrepreneur who needs to hear it.


Chapters:
00:00 From Adversity to Military Service
02:52 Erik Castaneda's Journey Into the Army
05:46 Officer Training and Early Leadership Lessons
08:59 Earning Trust as a Young Military Leader
11:57 Building Respect Through Competence and Character
15:12 Leading Soldiers in Combat Environments
18:08 Leadership Under Pressure and Shared Hardship
21:04 Why Military Culture Creates Strong Leaders
24:07 The Emotional Challenges of Leaving the Military
27:01 Life After Service and Finding a New Mission
34:03 Transitioning From Military Leader to Entrepreneur
38:04 Building FitOps and Supporting Veteran Success
44:29 Launching Echelon Frontline and Scaling a Brand
49:12 Creating Products for the Military Community
56:02 Why Community Drives Business Growth
01:00:46 Advice for Veteran Entrepreneurs and Future Leaders

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Burnout, Injury, And Life After Command

SPEAKER_00

Looking back at that career, dude, and getting to that next step, how hard was it to finally accept and and continue, get back into that mindset of like, okay, this is my new role. I still have to crush it, I have to move forward.

SPEAKER_01

Dude, honestly, at that point, that was kind of I think when I decided that I was probably pretty much set on getting out of the army, to be very frank. From the officer standpoint, you go become a company commander, and this is how I looked at it at least. Is and that's your last real touch point with troops, right? That's their last time you actually get to lead dudes on the ground and have a direct impact in their lives. Everything over that, uh once you become a major, you're just miserable for the entire rank. I've never met a major that's just like really enjoying themselves. And I'm like, I don't want to be that. Like, that's not where I want to be in my life as a leader. Pretty burnt out at this point. I had nagging injuries from pretty much the onset of my career and going in there like, hey, we're either going to reclass you or you're gonna get medboarded, but you can't do it for training more. And that was the final nail in the coffin that I was like, okay, I'm done. I'm not gonna go sit in an office in the army. Had a very nice transition there where the day I signed out on permanent leave, I had a job that I was already doing.

SPEAKER_00

That is a huge stress reliever being able to figure out where you're gonna go to. Eric, welcome to Security Hub, man.

SPEAKER_01

Thank you for having me, dude. I appreciate it.

SPEAKER_00

No, dude, and a special shout out to you, Jimenez, for making this happen, my man. Thank you so much for the connection. Uh, a longtime friend and believer in the show. But um, echelon, the drink that is on everybody's social media and it's at the forefront of every veteran and service member's mind. Dude, it is it is not an easy feat to get into business. And it is not an easy feat to become an entrepreneur. But to do what you've been doing for the last few years, brother, like we've we got to dive into this because now more than ever, people want to get involved, people want to get out of the military and find a path. And being becoming an entrepreneur and starting a business seems to be a very popular thing. But when I got into it, I didn't have somebody to explain the long nights and the struggles that would be ahead. So today, dude, I want to dive into your journey and everything you're doing with echelon. But

From Poverty To The Officer Track

SPEAKER_00

before we get into that, how did you find yourself in the military?

SPEAKER_01

Oh, dude, uh, that's a fun story. Um so I mean, I'll give you the very abbreviated version, but I I grew up poor as can be, young kid, in and out of homeless shelters, in and out of evictions, like never stayed in a place more than a year. Um, just me and my mom. And um I always clung to school, clung to sports, right? And that's my real world models came from sports. And I I I guess I believe that if you do well in school, something would happen, or my mom would at least beat my ass if I didn't. Um, so I I got lucky enough that I had the right people steering me to not be uh a horrible person early on. And um when it came time to it, uh graduating high school, I was lucky enough to uh get the opportunity to go to college. So first of my family to get the opportunity to go to college, uh had a full ride to DePaul University in Chicago, uh, which is a private school. They do a lot as far as giving back to uh underprivileged and whatnot as far as grants and scholarships. And so um everything was paid for but room and board pretty much to go there. And so uh decided to do that. I wanted to either do truly like law enforcement or military, but my mom was like, You're the first person in our family to go to college, you're just gonna throw that away. So I was like, all right, it's fair. Um nice guilt trip. I got about a quarter into school um and absolutely hated it. I was working like 40 hours a week because just to pay for my livelihood, to have food, to pay for I wanted to try and get the college experience, so I did the dorms and I was paying for that out of out of my own pocket. Um, but the entire idea of school itself was paid for. Um but I mean DePaul was, I think at the time, like forty thousand dollars a year to go there. Um so it was nothing but like really just rich kids that I was surrounded by and I did not mesh well.

SPEAKER_00

I know the I know the feeling. Shout out to you, Colorado State. Shit.

SPEAKER_01

And so I I got through my first quarter and I was like, I do not belong here. Like, this is not where I should be. There's all these people are their daddy's paying their way here, and they they're just like I was very mature, I guess, for for an 18-year-old at the time, and I'm like, uh I'm not having a good time. I'm surrounded by people who don't even realize how good they have it in life, and I'm busting my ass just to be here. And so uh I decided at that point I was gonna enlist. Um and so that was kind of how I joined the army. Um, the silver lining was my mom was like, Well, why don't you give it a full year? And I was like, Yeah, and she's like, so she talked me into doing the the reserves instead of just going full active duty. So I did the reserves, and at that point they were like, hey, you need to either train at your unit, which was about two hours away from me, or you need to uh do ROTC at your school. And I was like, I don't know what that is, but I I know back in high school I used to make fun of the JROTC kids. So we'll we'll see how this goes. Um, but I was lucky enough that the ROTC unit at my school actually was kind of prime uh a lot of four uh former service guys, uh prior service guys, a couple ranger bag boys who were going back to school and uh were gonna get their green to gold and become officers and whatnot. So uh it was a really solid crew, and that's probably the what kept me in school at that point because I kind of found guys who had work ethic, actually have done some shit, seen some shit in life, and kind of took me under their wing and were like, hey, this isn't how it has to be. Um, and so that's where I ended up sticking it out, did all four years and graduated, and two weeks later was at Fort Benning for eye bullet infantry training for officer school.

IBOLC Misery And Early Humility

SPEAKER_00

The beginning. Dude, it's um it's a hard thing to try to get the American dream early on when you're not privileged, when you don't come from means. I I lived it myself. Um I was a I was a victim of the National Guard idea. Well, they're gonna pay for college, and oh yeah, they do. But you gotta affront the money and you gotta figure out how to live. And I just got tired of swindling and and and trying to figure out how to like have the life that other kids were having in college because you have to work full-time and you gotta work late night shifts, and people still want you to go party and drink. And the same thing. So many of us say, you know what, screw this. Like, I'm gonna go all in and be in the military. And I have to imagine it's a little bit more complex when you decide that you're gonna be like, no, I'm gonna do the officer route. Like, I'm gonna be a leader in this world. Like, what was it like getting to Ibola, getting through there, and then that reality sets in of like, oh shit, like I'm gonna be a leader of infantrymen.

SPEAKER_01

I I didn't even know the difference between an officer and enlisted when I got told that, hey, you're gonna go train ROTC. And so I mean, at that point, they were like, oh man, he's fast and he's he's in good shape. Uh let's hopefully he's smart, let's figure this out. But maybe he could be an officer and not just come here to train when he's not doing his unit training. Um and so I very quickly, like I said, there was a lot of great dudes who took me under their wing and taught me uh everything that really went into it. And to be very fair, the having prior service dudes be your guide, your guide that have already been kind of at the end of that ROTC time and are getting ready to be officers, but I've already seen that side of the world, um, it probably gave me a little bit of an unfair advantage to maybe someone who was just going through a normal RTC program and relying on maybe just the cadre or whatnot, because my peers also had seen some all sides of that world. Um, so I'm not saying I went in with any valuable uh wisdom, but at least I knew what I I knew what I didn't know going into the officer side of the world. Um and so that gave me, I think, a level of humility at least to not be that officer who comes in and says, I know everything. I've been I've been doing this for a couple months now, guys.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Um But yeah, I mean, eyebullock was probably one of the most depressing times of my life. They don't tell you that. Um it's like I think 16 weeks, and 11 of them were on the field. We would go to the field, we would be miserable, we'd come out of the field, I'd shovel as much food in my mouth as I can over the weekend, and then we'd go right back to the field, or we'd drink from a fire hose of nauseum during a classroom week, trying to knock all of that out and do these ridiculous op orders that we're never gonna use when we get to the actual military. Like, great to know, but everything's briefed by con ops. Like, what are we doing here?

SPEAKER_00

You have to learn it, you have to do it the hard way. Get the terrain map up. Exactly. God, yeah, there's there's a lot of stuff that gets me, don't highlight that enough. The progression for a young officer. Like everybody hears the sexy stories about going to the Q course, going to S UT. It's like, dude, imagine being a young kid and saying, I want to be an officer. And then you go through all of the heartache of going through ROTC, getting all through that, and then Ibolic, where there's just like, no, you're gonna suffer and be treated like shit and get forced to do the most fucking ridiculous things. Brief it, brief it back again. Wrong format.

SPEAKER_01

And well, you gotta consider too, it's like E6s, they're ones who are running most of this stuff. And plus the E6s who hate officers and don't want to be there either. And they're like, I'm gonna make I'm gonna get even.

SPEAKER_00

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SPEAKER_01

All right. Honestly, I think we deserved it.

SPEAKER_00

It's punishment before you go into the military, actually enter and be in a unit. Yeah. Yeah. Getting through that though, on the back side of it, you know, there's something to be said for the culture, the understanding. As a young leader, did you feel like, okay, like I'm I'm I'm where I'm supposed to be? Because we hear a lot of stories from the enlisted side of getting to that unit, getting to, you know, the 101st, getting to 82nd, go through reception. But we don't often hear it from the officer side, being because you are a new person, but at the same time, as you're a leader from the get-go. You know, we I had the privilege of getting uh lots of wall-to-wall counseling before I ever had to take on a lead a leadership position. You go through schools, you go through these uh administrative settings and you go through the field training problems, and then you show up and it's like, oh shit, I'm Sir. This is this is fucking real.

SPEAKER_01

I mean, I think you know it as good as anyone who's surfed, though. Uh there's a respect for the rank and there's a respect for the individual. And if you go to any any real unit, you're earning the respect for the individual. So you hear sir differently when you're a brand new butter bar than when you're a first lieutenant who has a deployment under their belt and is actually led troops, right?

First Unit Frustration And Proving Yourself

SPEAKER_01

And so I mean, I when I showed up at the 101st, uh, I showed up injured, which didn't help. And was th we had probably uh it was at least 30 lieutenants who had just gotten there at the same time. So like they threw me an S1, dude. I was an infantry officer in S1, and there was like four other infantry officers in S1 before me. That's how many officers we had at our battalion. And I'm like, what are we doing here? They're like, we we don't really know what we're doing. So um it was actually a really weird uh experience in that respect because it was two degree chill, but also like, hey dude, wait in line because there's guys who have been here for months trying to get into a platoon and you are nowhere close.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. And and and we we have to we have to dig into this a little bit because I can only imagine you go to a historic unit, 101st, you're like, I'm gonna go right into a platoon. I'm gonna, I'm gonna get my opportunity. It's like, no, S1, chill out here for a little bit. And then you see the backlog of individuals. How did you take on that challenge of like, because you still have to be a leader? There are still soldiers in those positions that are still looking up, and they're like, how do you take on that challenge of A, it's not where you want to be, but you still have to provide that freaking quality leadership to individuals that they're probably excited that they got an infantry officer. Like, I could only imagine some of those kids were probably like, oh, dude, we got we have an infantry leader. Like, how do you navigate that?

SPEAKER_01

I don't think S1 is ever excited about us in their world, dude. No, it was it was good. And I I mean, honestly, I think it gave me a a small opportunity to not be right under the the microscope, maybe in a way, to kind of understand the culture, understand people. I was lucky enough that like I just kind of figured out who knew what they were doing from from that O side, right? I'm like, all right, who's been here for two years? Who's the first lieutenant that's on platoon time who understands how things work? And I'm gonna go pick their brain. And I hopefully won't be that annoying dude, but they'll be like, all right, this guy is trying to get right. And so that's what I did. I was like, all right, who's who's the top dog? And then who's doing this well, who's doing that well, just kind of watching, learning, and then figuring out like what makes a good platoon leader? Because that's the job I want. So who's the top platoon leader in this battalion and then what makes them that? And then just absorbing it, trying to be that, and then on the other side trying to prove myself and whatever they give me, right? I don't I don't care if if I'm an S1, okay, I'm an S1, how do I make some impact on what's going on in here? Then when I get moved to S3, like, how do I become the go-to guy for the S3 that he's like, yeah, I trust this dude, he gets shit done. Um, and that's just how I looked at kind of any position I held, whether it was a bullshit one or not, of uh I don't know, I've always had a chip on my shoulder. So like it's how do I prove that I'm worth them giving the next opportunity to?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, absolutely. And that that continues to pay off in life. Like, whatever shot you're given, don't like, hey, you're gonna be disappointed. Don't make that the priority and the center focus. Don't show up to work every day, bummed out, disappointed. You didn't get to where you wanted to go. Figure out how to utilize it to your advantage. Like, figure out how to make it the best situation possible. You're still gonna show up the as one office. Uh you should be willing to be stoked and excited about an opportunity or figuring out how you can strategize rather than being bummed out. And that, dude, that's for everybody. If you're a brand new Green Beret showing up and you get put on the B team, okay, cool. Make it an opportunity. You're gonna get to know every dude, every team, and then you can figure out which team you want to go to, figure out how to get the schools before somebody else like strategize, and that continues to pay off in life. I think we get too focused on like we missed an opportunity when we're not looking at the opportunity we have in front of us. Like when you're you were sharing that you took the ability, you had the time to look at where you wanted to go. What was it like when you finally were able to say, like, all right, now I'm gonna actually go do my job?

SPEAKER_01

I mean, even that was still kind of a transition, right? Because we had, so my unit was getting ready to deploy. And so as soon they got set, they were heading down range, and then they moved a bunch of us into company commander rear D positions. And so then I took over a rear D company. Um, and so it was like uh another kind of closer to a platoon leader, but you're not quite there. Um, and so then that was just my opportunity to show, hey, like that's fine, my rear D company is gonna be the most squared away. We're gonna be sending dudes forward who are actually prepared, like they're gonna be well trained, they're gonna be the solid dudes going forward because that's the downrange, the worst thing you can do is, hey, I need I need dudes coming forward from the rear, and you're sending me shitbacks. And so it's like, all right, I'm not gonna be that guy. And then also on the back end, like, how do we do that? So, how do we have our dudes do EIB while we're back here? How do we organize things like that? And and then in the same respect, how am I gonna do some of those things that prove like, hey, I probably but so that was what I did is I had a really solid NCO, Sarn Ziegler, when I was on Rear D, who was an E5, but the dude was just squared away, helped me out a ton, and we we were just a solid team together of taking care of our dudes, getting our good dudes prepped, making sure there was actually training going on in the back and dudes weren't just fucking off and getting in trouble. Um because that's the other pain of rear D is if if they're idle, you know, they're gonna figure out a way to not be. Um and then going and getting about as many of our guys through YIV as possible, helping organize that kind of stuff. And that's luckily, I think that was the the point where the the BC at the time was like, okay, who are we bringing forward because we're swapping out a couple uh PLs, and I was lucky enough to be one of them.

SPEAKER_00

Hell yeah. That's the best that's the best situation possible. Like work your work your ass off so that the boss can see the potential. And uh, I can only imagine the property book nightmares, the long nights of dealing with headaches, but it pays off. And and now you're getting your shot to go to the big leagues, and and it's weird. People always like ask, like, why do you always why do you guys look up to it and and think of it like as your prime time? Because it is like you're a combat soldier, you're looking forward to it, and you finally got your shot. Like, what was it like getting downrange?

Combat Leadership, Trust, And Culture

SPEAKER_01

It was uh a fever dream for sure. Like falling in on a unit that's already been in country for like four months and already has set in their ways, SOPs, how they're doing stuff. Um, replacing a PL was one of my good friends, uh Quinn was he was loved. He was good at what he did, and so it's like, all right, you also have some decent sized shoes to fill. Um, and we had very different leadership styles. Like Quinn was anal retentive, very goofy dude, but like very particular about everything, neat detail, like not me. I'm very much like, you're all adults, here's your end state. Get there. Um, so I think there was probably a little bit of a culture clash there. And then at the same time, the platoon sergeant was coming back as well. So our senior squad leader then it stood up to be the platoon sergeant. So then I had a an E6 as my platoon sergeant who had something to prove, and he was a hard fucking dude. I'm still honestly great friends with him. I just saw him when we went to Best Ranger, um, Sarnovina. He's first Sarnavina now. Um, but uh me and him butted heads right off the bat. Like it was a strong month of we might not figure this out. It was like, oh man, yeah, he he had something to prove. He wasn't gonna let some new LT come in and and be in charge. And he wanted to make sure that as an NCO, because his his peers, his fellow squad leaders that were his peers a week prior, were now having to report to him, and we had very strong-willed squad leaders.

SPEAKER_00

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SPEAKER_01

So he had to be that dude. Um, but we got about a month in and we were just like, all right, this is we're working together, we're a united front. Like whether or not we fucking agree or not, they'll never know. Had that kind of conversation. And I broke in. Actually, when I got into my country, like my whole plan was I'm gonna break these fucking squad leaders in because I I Get this. Like, I understand how it works, right? You have to earn their respect. Yeah. They think they know what the fuck's going on. And so one after the other, as soon as I got in the country, I'm like, let's go get a workout. And I I was strategic about it. And they they know this now because we've talked about it. But like, I'm like, all right, this motherfucker's got some some small legs. I'm doing leg day with him. Um, and I just fucking the the gym is the great equalizer. Oh, yeah. It doesn't matter where you come from. One, it's it's an opportunity of vulnerability, right? You work out with someone, it's an easy way to have a conversation where you're on kind of a we're outside of the day-to-day, right? Now it's just two guys talking and you're getting the same lift, and it's like, oh shit, like he's going up in weight. What the fuck? Um, and so strategically one after the other, I'm like doing legs with this motherfucker. One of my squad leaders, ours is just a fucking mountain of a human. So I'm like, all right, well, the only chance I got with him is shoulders. So let's see. Now you're going to secondary muscle groups. All right, fuck. Lats only. We're doing lats.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

So I crushed him in shoulders. That was the one I was concerned about. But um, and that's how I broke them in. They're like, all right, well, if I don't have their respect yet in anything from a tactical proficiency or whatever standpoint, at least they know I can kick their ass in whatever workout we did today. Um, and yeah, that was my first week there. And so that's all of a sudden it's like, all right, we got a little bit of like rapport now. Um we can talk. It's not like uh this is the new guy, like I haven't had a conversation with him yet, and he's coming in and he's a fucking officer, so fuck him. He hasn't been in country for the last four months, he doesn't know what's going on. Um, and then Levina and I had good rapport after that, and then we were just a cohesive unit, and fucking the Joes see that and they're like, okay, this isn't this isn't a fucking huge shift, this isn't something that's gonna affect my life. If anything, it's just we're doing stuff slightly differently. But I also I've always been a big believer in when you go into any kind of unit, especially like a squad or platoon level, there's a lot of sleeper cells in that unit when it comes to who's capable of doing things that are just skirting by. And so that was also how I approached a lot of it of like, usually the people who are getting into trouble are bored. They're not necessarily bad. And so I would find those people who were bored. I'm like, all right, you're the fucking RTO now. Like, let's see what you can do. Because obviously you think you're smarter than everyone here. So I'm gonna give you that opportunity. And every time I've ever done that, I've been pleasantly surprised that it's like, no, yeah, that dude was just, he's smart. He's bored, he thinks he can do more, and he either needs to be humbled a little bit or he's gonna flourish. Same thing with like team leaders. It's like, hey, there's an E4 mafia in general, right? Like, there's lots of guys in the unit who are true leaders from a culture standpoint, and you have to identify them. Because even if they don't have that leadership stamped on their chest, they are leading the culture of your platoon or the culture of your squad. And if they're not on your side, they're working against you. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00

Yep. Yeah, the gravity, the the center of gravity for the platoon. Like who's who's the dude everybody loves and gravitates? It's not necessarily gonna always be somebody that has to rank. And if you can freaking identify that, understand, like, okay, all right, pay a little attention to that.

SPEAKER_01

And it's also the dude who's gonna tell you when you're fucked up if you have a good enough relationship with him, right? And it's like, hey, the dudes are not fucking happy about this. And you either need to explain why we're doing it, or you're gonna, it's only gonna get worse, right? Like, you also have to have that pulse on it, can't just always be freaking do it, do it, do it. And like, even back when we got back from deployment, like I was a PL for like it's like 18 months, like it was something stupid. Um, and I mean, that was my thing. It was like, hey, when we're not doing shit, smoke and joke all you want. But make sure when it's time to turn it on, like I swear to God, you better turn it the fuck on. And that's how we operated, and it worked out well. Like, we definitely had we had issues for sure. Like, we were that platoon that like we were always the assaulting element, but also when we weren't the assaulting element, it was hey, can you fucking I already know where this is going? Can you can you got can you just make sure your guys aren't doing this right now? Like when we were in country. It's always that way. It's always that way. Yeah. Well, I I just had fucking dogs and I trained them to be dogs. Like I was that was our culture. Like we're fucking dogs and we're gonna we're gonna do infantry tasks. Um, but I'm not gonna make you guys do stupid shit if you guys perform. And so I would shield them from the stupid shit, and when it came to game time, they would go all out and they would have my back no matter what. Um, and that's that was how I saw things. Um, but also like we so we were we were rockassans, um, and there's obviously the notoriety of the Tory. And so when we were in country, like these dudes would be putting Tories everywhere, and that's one of the things that got us in trouble. Um, and so we were we were out of calf um when we weren't scattered to the winds. Um, but like calf was like technically our our home station before and we were uh TRF, so they would just send us anywhere, anywhere freaking fifth group was going, they would just attach us because at the time fifth group had to have a conventional force and uh uh what's it called, uh, Afghan force with them whenever they were doing operations. So they would just attach us to fifth group, we'd go out with them, and then whenever the fifth group was like, we don't fucking need you, go away, we'd go back to CAF or we would go sit somewhere in the middle of nowhere doing nothing. Um, but so anytime we were at CAF, these dudes would be like stenciling Tories on shit. And it got to the point where we were under another unit at the time because our we were separate from our battalion, and they made a rule: no fucking Tories bigger than one foot by one foot are allowed to be stenciled anywhere on this base. Like that's how bad it got. And so these dudes took their one foot by one foot stencil Tory and they stacked them on top of each other to make a 13-foot Tory across a tiny uh giant freaking uh T-Wall. So, like that give you an idea of like you can imagine how that went. And I'm like, how do I get mad at them? Like, technically, they did only make a one foot by one foot Tory, like they abided by the rules. You made the rules, guys.

SPEAKER_00

Dude, that's that's the beauty of our infantrymen. That's that's the most amazing skill set.

SPEAKER_01

Like, yeah, like talk about innovation, ingenuity, and adaptability. Like, there you go.

SPEAKER_00

That's what we need more in this world. That's what we need more. That's like you can't tell me there's a better fighting force anywhere else on earth. Yeah. Do you guys uh please tell me there's a picture of that somewhere?

SPEAKER_01

Oh, I have a picture saved in my phone somewhere. I've had people send it to me too. I don't like I've told this story on another podcast and whatnot, and someone's like, dude, I was there two years later and I've seen that Tory. And then, of course, I think 82nd came in like one or two uh like uh tours after us or whatever, and then they just vandalized it. But I've I got that picture somewhere too.

SPEAKER_00

Nice, dude. It's it's um, it's important to understand like how wonderful like the the the history of having this position stays with you forever.

The Pain Of Moving On

SPEAKER_00

It'll always be with you. But the other thing we gotta talk about is at one point that ends for everybody. And when you're leadership, we don't we don't talk about that. Like it's always you hear the stories of the guys, you get back, you rotate out, the family disbands, as they say. But what was it like for you? That that is the epitome of going to the Super Bowl. You get to command a platoon in combat, you come back, at some point, somebody from higher is gonna be like, hey, guess what, sir? Got a new job for you. What was it like having to say goodbye to the boys and move on?

SPEAKER_01

I mean, I was I was a slightly lucky, right, that I got to stay in that platoon for way longer than I deserved.

SPEAKER_00

Um stories shape culture, they build trust, and when they're told the right way, they move people to action. That's what we do at Security Hall Media. We don't just produce content, we create authentic, impactful, and purpose-driven storytelling for podcasters, nonprofits, brands, and leaders who are on a mission. For people who've lived real experiences and want their message to actually matter, from podcast production and video to strategic storytelling and distribution. We hope you clarify your voice, elevate your brand, and connect with the audience you're trying to serve. You have a story worth telling and a purpose behind it. Security Hall Media is here to help you tell it the right way. Click the link in the episode description to learn more today.

SPEAKER_01

And I mean, I it was the almost a little bit of the opposite where I was losing a lot of my studs. Like, as soon as you get back, get back from leave, and then it's like, oh, this dude came on drill drill orders, this dude came on drill orders, this dude's hey, Dico needs a stud and they're falling apart. We're taking your dude. And so there's a lot of that more than like, oh, I'm leaving my guys. And so I almost had like two platoons from when like the guys I deployed with, and then six months later when I was still PL of this platoon, and the changeover that we had from a lot of the enlisted side leaving. Um, and so that was like, I think the first hard thing of like, dude, I trained these dudes, I deployed with these dudes, and like you're taking all of my dudes away. These are my kids, damn it. Yeah. And then then the other side, it's there's a silver lining of then some of your guys that were E3s and then E4s are now becoming E5s, and those are now your team leaders, and some of your team leaders are like stepping up to be squad leaders, and so there's like a level of kind of pride there of like, yeah, dude, I remember when you did this stupid shit, and now look at you, you're yelling at him for doing the same shit. Circle of life. Yeah. Um, so that that was kind of that first phase, and then there is the all right, man, I think uh I think the time's coming to an end, and then he gets thrown back in like an S3 shop, and then you're just watching someone else like take your kids, and you're like the divorced dad, where like part of me is like, I want this new PL to succeed, and the other part of me is like, I hope he crashes and burns, man. I hope they never love me as much as they love him. I love him as much as they love me, right? Like, and the dude, it's so funny too, because my soldiers would come up to me and they'd be like, Hey man, you're so much better than him. We hate him. Like, he's an idiot. Yeah, yes. And then, like, dude, it was like a month in or something. They one of them sent me a picture of them tying him to the fucking Tory. They duct taped him to the Tory and they left him out there for like an hour. I'm like, oh, I love you guys.

SPEAKER_00

Oh man. It's family, man. It's it's a weird thing to explain. I still talk to my my 82nd boys, man. My that's that is something that stays with you. The the shared suffering of infantrymen, what you go through stays with you for the rest of your life. And it is hard. It is hard to watch somebody else come in and fill your shoes, even if you are moving on, the you know, greener, brighter pastures, your your career's progressing. It will always hurt, man. It will always sting. And it has to because you're it's a family, you're deeply committed to each other. There's no greater love than going to combat and knowing that like at some point, like these dudes are going to be in the fight of their lives, they're gonna be fighting for each other together as a unit. Like, there's that that warrior culture, that warrior tribe connects you for the rest of your lives. And it is a hard fucking band-aid to pull off when you gotta walk away, man.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I mean, you hit it on the head though, like shared suffering. That's I think that's one of the strongest bonds you can form with someone. Like, and and if you're shooting back to back with someone in the same slit trench on the field, like that's you're pretty comfortable with them. Like, man, there's not there's very few people you're gonna do that with in life to the point where hey man, we we might be close. Yeah. I love my wife, wouldn't be doing that.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

So yeah, no, you're spot on. Like, there's there's a lot of things you just force you to be close with people in the military to let down your guard and and you just have to trust that person explicitly, and you also know stuff about them that probably no one else in their life knows about them, no matter how close they are, whether a wife, spouse, or uh child, uh will ever get to see that side of them.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Or you.

SPEAKER_00

Yep. That's absolutely true, man.

Medboard, FitOps, And A New Mission

SPEAKER_00

Like looking back at that career, dude, um getting to that next step, how hard was it to finally accept and and continue, get back into that mindset of like, okay, this is my new my new role. I still have to crush it, I have to move forward.

SPEAKER_01

Dude, honestly, at that point, that was kind of I think when I decided that I was probably pretty much set on getting out of the army, to be very frank. From the officer standpoint, you go become a company commander, and this is how I looked at it at least, is and that's your last real touch point with troops, right? That's the last time you actually get to lead dudes on the ground and have a direct impact in their lives. Everything over that, uh, once you become a major, you're just miserable for the entire rank. I've never met a major that's just like really enjoying themselves. And then you get to lieutenant colonel, and then you're so out of touch with what's actually happening on the ground with the E1s through fours that like even you have to be, right? Like otherwise you're not doing your level of work. And I'm like, I don't want to ever, I don't want to be that. Like, that's not where I want to be in my life as a leader. And so that was kind of where I was at. And like, I can't be a PL forever. Pretty burnt out at this point. And I had nagging injuries from pretty much the onset of my career. And um, and at that point, uh, I was like, yeah. So I did the S3 thing for a year and a half, maybe. Um, and same thing though, like I'm not gonna shitbag it. I was I was again rare DS3 or unit deployed again. Um, and just was like, I'm gonna make sure that the S3 doesn't have to worry about shit. And so I did all his reporting for him, and that gave me a lot of freedom, actually. Um, so then at the time the army had just migrated to a new new reporting system. He never even learned it. He was he was like, hey man, can you just make sure you're sending this stuff up? And I'm like, I I will take care of you. Um and he took care he took great care of me. I'm not gonna name any names because uh I don't know if he's out yet or not. I haven't seen him in a minute. But um, in the same respect, uh, that was when I started kind of looking at my transition out of the army. Um and I found a nonprofit called FitOps. Uh, and they had just started, and uh I applied for it because I was gonna actually look at going back to grad school. Uh my undergrad in psychology, psychology just kind of came natural to me. It seemed really easy. And I'm like, well, I have no clue what I want to do as a big boy job, so I'm gonna potentially just go back to school for this and get my doctorate and see where it goes. But it was just always interesting to me. Um, but I was like, I do love fitness, I just don't see a career in it where I'm actually gonna be able to raise a family on it. Um, and so I was looking at like just different programs to get my personal training certificate while I was in school. Um that's when I found FitOps. It had just started, and I just applied for it on the website, and they hit me back and they're like, hey, we're just standing this up. We don't really know what we're doing, to be honest with you. Love for you to come out. And I like you sounds like you have a lot of ops experience, planning experience. You seem like you're into fitness, and we we think maybe you could be a good member of the team. Um and so this is where he scratched my backpack. But so I was doing all this reporting for him, but then I would randomly fly to Texas to do uh this nonprofit stuff. And like I remember specifically, he called me at one point. He's like, hey man, where are you? And I was like, Do you actually want to know? There's a little bit of liability here, I'll tell you. And he's like, What the fuck are you talking about? And I'm like, I'm in Texas right now, I'm helping out this nonprofit. Um, but what do you need? He's like, dude, you need to be back like fucking tomorrow. I'm like, I will be back by Friday. Um well, what do you do? Like he's like, fuck, dude, seriously. And I'm like, yeah. Well, like, so we there was that trade-off in the relationship of like, hey man, like I know I'm doing a lot of your work for you right now. I need you to cover for me. Um, but that that was how I started my transition out of the army. Um and the other part of that was uh I so I had torn my meniscus, actually. That was what I how I got injured at eyeblock. I they just sent me to the unit. I was doing physical therapy on and off, but as you as you know, in infantry units, you don't go to sit call. Um and so I deployed with a torn meniscus. Uh just didn't do a lot of running, thankfully. Um and uh eventually what it happened is because I was offsetting a lot of things, it ended up I ended up getting stress fractures in my back, uh uh twisted vertebrae and all kinds of other random shit. And then I actually had stress fractures in my uh, or not stress fractures, I had tears in my quad of that same leg. Um so then at that point I was while I was in S3, thankfully, I was at least like, okay, I can go to uh physical therapy, I can start healing this, and then I got about a year in at that point, and they're like, hey, you're we're either gonna reclass you or you're gonna get medboarded, but you can't do infantry anymore. And that was the final nail in the coffin that I was like, okay, um I'm done. Like I'm I'm not gonna go sit in an office in the army. Um, and so that's when I like, that's actually when I full fully found FitOps and kind of started doing the medboard process and started doing that and had a very nice transition there where the day I signed out on on permanent leave, I had a job that I was already doing. Fuck yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, that that is a a huge stress reliever being able to figure out where you're gonna go to. That was an amazing program too. I know I got a buddy that went through it. Um and watching him go through that program, I'm like, dude, this makes sense. Like you're already, you're already focused on fitness if you're in the infantry world, if you're in a combat arms, like it's already at the forefront of your mind. It makes sense. But how do we go from FitOps to thinking, okay, I'm gonna branch off and I'm gonna go into creating an energy drink?

SPEAKER_01

Dude, it

Bootstrapping FitOps And Learning Business

SPEAKER_01

was it was a much longer path than that. So I I took over FitOps. I was the executive director for it. Uh oh, no shit. Yeah, so I fell in on it. The executive director at the time uh was, I don't know, doing I I don't know. Um, I'm not gonna talk badly about anyone, but um, about six months in, I took over the program, rebuilt it, um, and I was running it with a skeleton crew of previous graduates that had gone through the class that I just ran. Um, and we were just bootstrapped. It was I I would host a camp, right? So all we had was a U-Haul full of gym equipment and and our stuff, and the whole premise was we're gonna do this for 25 to 30 days where we're gonna bring in as many veterans as we can bring in, and we're gonna have hands-on training for them to learn how to become personal trainers. And so the organization was all very much in a gym setting. There was classroom setting stuff too, but I'm like, I know how I learn, I know how most other military veterans learn, and we're not gonna learn by just sitting in a classroom for eight days reading about it. Like, let's do this. And so I would also bring in as many people as I can get. I would cold outreach anyone in the industry I could that was a subject matter expert and be like, hey, can we bring you out to teach this? Can we bring you out to teach this? And that's how we did a lot of it. And so I would bring in physical therapists to teach a lot of the stuff and find people who were good teachers at that of like, let me make this make sense for you. And so it was it was really just amazing. From there was nothing else like it at the time, really, where you can go somewhere for 25 days, actually learn that, and then on top of that, what we would do was we would do business training. And so where most personal trainers fail is they're really good at personal training, but they have no clue how to talk to clients, get clients, how to get a job in the first place, right? Like, and so we would bring in like we brought in the uh what was he at the time? Uh they called it the chief people officer uh at Equinox. And so we brought him in to build a partnership with Equinox so that we had a hiring map that as soon as you graduate, you go work at Equinox. And we did the same thing for a ton of other gym chains of like, hey, if you graduate FitOps, you have a job when you get out of here. And it's because we're doing interview. Days at camp where they're like, Yeah, I love these guys. Um, anywhere you want to go, you have a job. Um, and so that was like how we structured it, and then we did a whole like kind of loose mental health component of at the end of the day, we're gonna sit around a bonfire, we're gonna relax. We've had a long day of just in inundation of insane amounts of information and learning, and we would let people tell their stories, and Cadre would go first, and we would just be like, hey, this is why I'm fucked up. And if anyone else wants to share why they're fucked up, and this is an opportunity for you to do so because you may not tell anyone else in the world what's going on in your head right now, but we're all fucked up here, so no one's gonna judge you.

SPEAKER_00

That's that's warriors taking care of warriors, man. That's some of the earliest things that you know, when the warriors came back to the tribe, they circled up, they talked, they shared the experience. So it wasn't just on your shoulders. And I think that's um that's something that modern healers and psychologists and therapists, that's something that are just now starting to tap into. Because if you utilize any of these retreats or any of these getaways that are, you know, in the clinical setting, um, that's something they incorporate. Like bringing everybody around the fire to be able to say, like, hey man, like, hey, I'm I'm Jimmy, I'm the leader of this, this trip, this program, and let me share my story. And then veteran after veteran, that's something we've forgotten about, man. I'm so glad you shared that.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, we I mean it was meaningful. And like, so as we did that, we got about a year or two in, and it was do that for 30 days, load everything up into the U-Haul. I would drive that U-Haul to storage unit, I would unload all that shit into a storage unit, I would go back and start fundraising for the next camp. The next camp, I would fly out, and we would just bounce whatever camp would give us the best rate. Like we were going from a Girl Scout camp here to this random, should be condemned camp in like Mississippi. Like, but whoever would give us a deal, we were like, all right, man, we're just trying to host the veterans' camp. We got to make it as cheap as possible because we're fundraising. And at the time, when I came in, FitOps was under a brand called Performix. Um, and then Performix went from like doing really, really well to doing not so well because they were specifically in GNC, and a lot of things happened in GNC where they were going into bankruptcy, and Performix suffered. Um, and so it went from like FitOps is this really cool thing that's well funded by this supplement brand to like figure it out. Um, and in the same respect, Performix had this really bougie gym that they had just built in New York City that was supposed to be a marketing kind of engine for the brand that all of a sudden they're like, hey, this thing actually needs to make money. Um, and so that's an actually how I got deeper into that side of the brand and into the supplement brand and into the marketing was um the CEO of Performix had been like, hey man, like you've bootstrapped the nonprofit, you've been my guy for that, and uh like it wouldn't be here without you. Like you took it from new baby to where it is today, and it's it's doing well. Can you come and run my gym? Um, and so my wife was seven months pregnant, and we had just kind of really finally settled down in Nashville, and we uprooted and we moved to New York City, and I did that for a year. I ran a gym that was designed to cater to C-suite executives and celebrities and some of the top athletes in New York. It was a beautiful space, um, but it was never designed to make money, and it was never designed to have a team. It was just designed to have a lot of of the top trainers in New York come in and train their clients and get pictures taken. Um, and so that was that was an interesting year, but that was also where I really learned a ton about some of the business side of things, learned about startups, learned about marketing, really got my foot in the door from fitness perspective because that's where I started working with men's health and muscle and fitness um and doing a lot of the face side of that. Um and then eventually that's where I met my current partner in echelon uh through Bravo Sierra, which was his previous uh startup that he was founded. And I they brought me in on the founding team. So I was I was about at the end of my tenure in New York. I I did the one year there and I was like, I gotta get out of the city. Um and so I was I started consulting for some different entities. I consulted for Spartan Race, a couple other startups, and then I offered them to help them with what they were doing because I was like, I have no interest in deodorant or or whatever bot personal care items you guys are doing. But I do love that you guys are doing this for the military. You guys are testing with the military and you have a component there, and that's something that I always kind of want to be a part of. Um, and so then they brought me in and I started working on the marketing team there, and I just ran community. Um, and so I did that for two years and kind of just worked my way up at Bravo to the point where Echelon was a project under Bravo. And so Oh, really? Bravo Sierra had this weird thing where this was back in the money where VCs just gave you way too much money to do whatever you wanted. And so the whole concept was we're gonna start with personal care because it's infinite shelf life, it's super easy to produce. Um, but really we want to test and develop products for an end user like the military. And so one of the founders was a former Palantir uh worker uh or employee, and he brought over like 12 other or 15 other dudes from Palantir to build out this complex development system where we had at one point like 2,5-2,600 active duty soldiers, airmen, Marines, and whatnot, that we would be sending just products out to non-stop. And then they would slack us in this like closed slack channel. They would provide all the feedback that they wanted to. The software would aggregate that feedback into product development, and then we would reiterate the product. And so that's how we did that with Bravo Zero products, but then we started doing that with wound care. We started doing that with uh different types of wipes, whether or not you were a firefighter or whether or not you were on a gun range.

Building Echelon Without VC Money

SPEAKER_01

Um, and then we started doing it with like random nutrition stuff, and echelon was one of them, was one of the things we got was like, hey, the military loves rippet, but it's not a very clean, good-for-you product, and it's not very efficacious. And so we started developing a answer to that. How do we make a rippet that the military will love that's designed for that military end user that's drinking three, four monsters a day?

SPEAKER_02

Yep.

SPEAKER_01

Um, but isn't gonna give them kidney stones. Or a heart attack. Heart attack. And so that's that's how we developed echelon. And then about a year in, uh the startup world was uh coming to a very uh screeching halt with COVID and then the iOS 12 update, where you had all these D to C startups that were just spending money on Facebook and acquiring customers for virtually free. All of a sudden iOS 12 update happens and now it's 6x what you were paying to acquire one customer. Um and COVID put all kinds of different restraints on that as well. Um, so everyone's like, all right, we need to go omni-channel, everyone's plan needs to change. We have these billion-dollar D2C companies like Casper or whatever that are going bankrupt all of a sudden when they were doing these insane rounds. Um, and so uh Bravo Sierra was not immune from that. Bravo Sierra ended up having they launched Target. Well, who would have guessed, you know, a military-centric brand didn't do the best in Target. Um I don't know. Uh and then there was just a ton of hurdles that everyone else was trying to figure out as well at the time. But then that's where there's an opportunity to roll echelon out. Um, and so me and my partner bought out echelon and we've been running it ever since. And the whole thing we kind of swore to was we're not gonna take VC money, we're not gonna go that route, we're gonna own our company, we're gonna run our company the way we want to, and we're gonna be in control the whole way. And I think that's been kind of a saving grace of a lesson learned, kind of the hard way.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. Dude, it and it's the the thing that I mean, it's rooted in understanding that from the its inception, from the go, like it was heavily focused on understanding what the end user wanted, what the service member wants, whether that's taste or the amount of energy it's getting, like you put that at the forefront, which wasn't uh the what wasn't what we got when we got Rip It. It was because who the fuck likes atomic palm?

SPEAKER_01

I mean, you have to consider too, rip it is just it's a gas station energy drink, and I'm not trying to offend whoever's no, it's forever in our hearts.

SPEAKER_00

It's forever in our hearts.

SPEAKER_01

It's forever in our hearts. Well, like you you know how you get a military contract, and I know how you get a military contract. You have to be the lowest bidder. And in order to be the lowest bidder, you have to have a very cheap product. And rip it is a very cheap product. There's not much in there, there's no real actives, there's caffeine, and so that's what you're getting. But at that, you can sell it for five cents a can to the DOD and you can distribute a shit ton of it. Like I joke about it and I'd love for echelon to be one day become the rippet of the military, but in reality, I would never be able to afford being the rippet of the military because I could never get a product that cheap that I would be like, yeah, I feel good about giving this to our troops.

SPEAKER_00

Well, we have to we have to it the official, uh, it's the unofficial. Like that's a thing popular, the the the people's court still matters in this arena.

SPEAKER_01

It is the non-military grade energy drink in the military. But you know There's active ingredients in it, guys. Like those aren't free.

SPEAKER_00

I'm not trying to poison you, that's why it costs money.

SPEAKER_01

Like it's not chalk full of preservatives and caffeine and sugar and whatnot. Like, but I mean that's the that was the that was the point of why we made it, right? Like there's five ingredients on that in that can that aren't active ingredients with the purpose of what you're actually doing. Like that was it's exactly what you said. We made it for the military. We made a drink that I would be drinking if I was still in. And that was part of it. Because when I was getting out, like I went through the whole monster phase, and then I started doing Zions. If you've ever done Zionce, I was like, this makes me feel a little bit better. And then I was at the point where I'm like, I need something stronger, but I don't want the 60 ingredients that are on this random pre-workout powder. So I just started mixing, I would go to bulk supplements and I would mix exactly the actives that I wanted, and I would just throw them in water and down them. And that was my my what I would do, but it tasted like absolute garbage. Like it was so hard to get down, but I'm like, I want this much caffeine, I want this much beta-alanine. And that was what that was like the last year of my army career as I was just doing that, and I didn't even have any idea that I would be getting into uh supplements or energy drinks down the road. I was just like all of a sudden aware of all the crap that was in these products like monster or or like some of these ridiculous powdered pre-works outs I was taking. And I'm like, I don't, I if I can't pronounce it or if I can't figure out what it is in there for, I don't want to take it.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I think that's the the new generation of service member is right there with you. They want to be informed what they're putting. They've seen, they've heard the stories from the GWAT era guys, they've seen enough podcasts, they've seen enough interviews where guys are talking about their health, and they were raised in a different environment where it was more it was more culturally respected when somebody said, and you know what, I'd rather have this. It's a it's a little bit better for me. What was it what's it been like to have created something like this and get feedback from your old platoon mates, from your old soldiers, from your peers being like, hey man, uh this is fucking good.

SPEAKER_01

It's it's cool. I mean, most of the military is still doing the spicy stuff, so you know it's always hit or miss there. Um, I will never get rid of the spicy, but now we have the new lines of the hydration line, which is not spicy. We have our new performance line, which is what's going into gyms now on the civilian side, not spicy. And mainly that's just because the I think the military is so much more open to spiciness because I think a lot of us throw hot sauce on our MREs to just give it something that makes it digestible, at least I did. Um, and other, I mean, just also there's a level of trauma there where the spice helps. Um like the pain. Exactly. I yeah, I swear to god, the the military kind of craves it a little bit. Like they want that that kind of pain in the morning to wake them up because otherwise they're not opening their eyes. Um, and so there's still some who are like, dude, I can't do spicy. And like I'm like, yeah, that's fine, man. I I made a spicy energy drink. I get it. I didn't think everyone would be like, fuck, I love that.

SPEAKER_00

Um I didn't expect for this thing to be successful, but it but here we are. Honestly, it was it was a toss-up.

SPEAKER_01

But it is super cool because like I do have like a lot of my old soldiers who will hit me up and like they'll submit a picture of it in the shop at or like when I was just at Best Ranger, like I took a whole couple hours to leave Best Ranger and go meet up with my old platoon sergeant sergeant of Vina, who's a first sergeant at IBOC right now. And or no, he's now he just got moved into S3 star major. Um, but I went in there and I brought him a bunch of cases because he freaking he loves he loves the spicy free round. He's he's like a proud dad. He's like, yo, this is my PL, bro. Look at this is his product. You guys need to drink it. Like it's it's cool, like for sure.

SPEAKER_00

Dude, it's it's absolutely thrilling to see like when it's made by somebody from your community, you feel like you're that's what I I get from everything that people are posting. Because like it's great to see your content, but look at all the other individuals in this space, whether it's just a random user on Instagram that's sharing your stuff, they're hyped about it, not just because it's it's a good drink, but because it's part of the culture.

Brand Community, Mental Health, And Meaning

SPEAKER_00

Like that's the thing, that's like the bigger thing to study. I know you're you're in it because you live this world, but the marketing is brilliant. It's absolutely brilliant. You make something that's good, but you make it so that they understand that they're represented as well. Like this is your, this is for you as well. This is your drink. And when people get behind it, it's sort of fanatical. You're you're making some fanatics out of it.

SPEAKER_01

I mean, we're just I think the whole premise there was we made it for the military. Half the team is vets and understands that culture. Like there's yeah, there's a natural divide, I think, where there's so many companies out there that try and pay their way in.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

I'm not gonna name names.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, don't need to. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

But they'll they'll try and just drop a check at Best Ranger and and show up and think that they belong. Um, and they'll just try and pay their way into military events and send random people and don't understand the culture, don't understand like the military. We eat each other alive. Like, how do you think we're gonna treat someone who isn't from this community? Right? Like, there's a level of that, and there's just a level of I've been there, right? Like, I I understand what it's like to feel like you're not taken care of, to feel like no one gives a shit about you, and to want to pull, put a gun in your mouth, right? Like, and that's just that is an honest part of our culture, which is it's sad, but it is a part of our culture. And if we try and hide it, like we're full of ourselves, or not full of ourselves, we're full of shit. Um, but so like that's also part of why, like I it's not a founder brand. Like, the brand is not about me, the brand is about the the military service member. Yep. And no matter how big we expand into civilian, like that is the core of our identity as a brand. And that's why the Instagram is what it is. Like, I wanted the Instagram to be that place where you could go and understand immediately, like we don't have a ton of product on our page, but it it's uh in my eyes, it's like a barstool of the military. Because if I'm an E4 or lower enlisted in the military and I open up Echelon's Instagram page, I want to see me and my buddies. I don't want to see us pretending like we're doing hard shit. I want to see us smoking and joking. Like the actual best times you remember in the military are those. It's it's your buddy doing something absolutely goofy, being an idiot. It's the times where you were absolutely suffering, but you made the best of it. Like that's what I wanted to show, and that's the mirror I wanted to project when we created the Instagram of dude, this is the best days. Like, these are those moments where no matter how shitty it feels right now, in eight years, 10 years, 15 years, this moment right now when fucking this dude did that stupid shit, you're gonna remember that, and it's gonna be one of your core memories of your time in service. And and then then, same respect, like we've had people message us in the DMs and be like, hey man, like I was so low for as long as I can remember now, and I was gonna end it all the day. But I opened up Instagram and I saw one of your one of your reels, and honestly, I laughed. And it's like the first time I laughed in weeks, and so maybe it's not that bad. Like, I just I just wanted to message you and say thank you. And like, so like that's that is why the Instagram is we're not trying to pretend we are fucking not not everyone can be David Goggins, right? You can't just be hard all the time, right?

SPEAKER_00

Like as much as you deviants would like to, you can't. Yeah. That's a medical condition.

SPEAKER_01

The the package does warn against that. So um, but no, that's that's why the Instagram is what it is. It's it's it is a a uh mirror of of what I consider at least some of the best times you're gonna have in the military, and it's the dude to your left and your right, and and it's it's reflective of that.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, absolutely, man. It it immediately evokes that those those powerful emotions of like, dude, that's what it that's what it felt like being a kid back back in the day in the in the platoon bay or the company area, waiting for the fucking word. Like that's that's a thing that we all have to remember. And it it resonates well with the veteran too, that that was there, that wants to reconnect with that little bit of their past life, like and want to feel like they're supporting an organization that at least understands who the fuck they were. And I think that's important, man. Um, what do you got?

SPEAKER_01

It gives it gives them the in my eyes at least, it gives them like a a level of validation that, hey, you're still, you're still someone. And it gives civilians uh like civilians love it too, which is wild, but it's it kind of peels back the curtain a little bit and it humanizes the service member of like, hey, this isn't just this big war machine, like these are still freaking real people behind the curtain that are in the military, they're just like you, like they're just goofing off. Like the military is just another version of college. We just have guns and and equipment and shit that probably should we shouldn't have on our property books.

SPEAKER_00

So true, man. Like, what do you guys look forward? Like, what's what's next for you guys as a company, as an organization? Like, what are you guys uh dipping your toes in that you're excited about?

SPEAKER_01

So we just launched uh Marine Corps, we're doing a pilot at Camp Pendleton. So that was fun. Um we brought out O'Hearn and we brought out Tyler Vargas Andrews to Pendleton. Um that was a really cool moment too, because that was Tyler's first time being back at his unit since Afghanistan. Um so we took him to 2-1. Um he got to kind of go to his old stomping grounds. He just shit he used to eat to lunch there. Um, but he hadn't been back since he deployed. So that was like a really kind of somber moment. Um we did that. We got to go out and watch the Marines do training. Um, and then we did a big lifting competition, or not competition, but kind of seminar where O'Hearn taught a bunch of Marines kind of different variations of how to lift and fix some of that stuff. So that was really cool. Um so excited for MCX and kind of Marine Corps side now because we haven't been doing anything with the Marines for a while. Um and then the rest of it is really civilian expansion. Um we're launching a ton of gyms on the civilian side now, and so we are doing crunches, we're launching golds here in a couple months, um, and a lot of the smaller kind of regional chains, um, and then some bigger civilian retail coming probably towards the second half of the year.

SPEAKER_00

Hell yeah, dude. The dreams coming together, man.

SPEAKER_01

They're getting there, man.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, it's um, you know, I I don't want to let you go without giving us some insight into the entrepreneurial world. If if

Entrepreneur Playbook And Mentors

SPEAKER_00

for the audience listening that's looking at their transition, what are some tips that you would give for either an officer or enlisted that wants to dip their toes into the business world right off the bat?

SPEAKER_01

Um, I mean, it's gonna be different for everyone, obviously. I think the only things that have gotten me this far are that I'm utterly relentless. Like, if you and I think the military is a good test of it, right? Like, if you're not okay with just getting shit on every single day, like feeling like you're failing every single day, but still progressing, like that is entrepreneurship. Like you have a win and you feel like so good for one day where you're like, yes, this is all clicking, this is all making sense. And then the next day you have three new problems that are like, this what what am I what am I even here for? Like, what am I doing? Um so I think at the core, like the reason you're doing it, it can't be like I'm trying to get rich. Like, because you'll never last. There has to be that purpose. You have to figure out exactly why you're doing it and just remind yourself of that daily of like, this is what I'm doing this for. This, this is something I truly am inspired to build. And for me, a lot of that comes back to a lot of what we do in the military community, in the veteran community, and a lot of the purpose that our brand drives and what we drive through our brand of the cool stuff that we're able to do. Um, but I tell my team and I tell a lot of the active duty guys that we bring on is like, hey, we want to do the cool shit. Yes, we want to do this impactful shit, but you have to do the unsexy shit first, right? I can't, I can't do a huge fundraiser for a nonprofit if I don't sell those cans the month before, right? Because that's where the money's coming from, in case you didn't realize how this works, right? And so there's there's a level of that where it's like, okay, well, this is a business, and in order to make money, we have to do the unsexy stuff. But when we make money, we're able to then turn around and do something impactful and something good. And so that's a lot of how I do this and from a business perspective and and kind of justify suffering every single day through all the nonsense and bullshit of running a business. Um, the other side of it is just finding mentors. And I think that is one of the most invaluable things. Finding people that have already learned the lesson the hard way is gonna cut years off of how long it takes you to do stuff. Um, and that is, I think, simpler than a lot of people expect. I think it really just comes with putting yourself out there. Sometimes I will just, whether it's appropriate or not, like if I'm having a conversation with someone, I'm like, this person can help me. And it's there's a very different approach than I'm gonna go and put my hand out and ask them for something free, right? Because there's also that. It's like you get that all the time where it's like, hey, this dude has ulterior motives. This person just wants something from me. And that is never an approach to take. But in the other realm of it, there's a much more respectful way of saying, like, hey, I'm building this, I see what you've done. How can I take advantage of your time or an opportunity? This is I'm down to help you in any way I can. And a lot of times what I tell people is just give, give, give, and people will come to you. The more you put out there, the more you give, the more, the more people you're just gonna have in your corner because it's like this dude is doing it the right way. This dude is actually trying to make an impact and help others and and is not this doggy dog that you usually see in the veteran world where everyone's smiling to your face but talking shit behind your back, or this nonprofit is better than this nonprofit because we do this and that. And when at the end of the day, it's like you all have the same mission set. Like you're all trying to help the same community. And if you're not willing to work together, you're not helping that community to the respect that you can. And that was one of the things I saw in the nonprofit world so much. But um, from an entrepreneurial perspective, it's all kind of the same is like, how are you making something positive into the community? Because that's truly if you want to be an entrepreneur nowadays, you have to understand community. No one's just selling stuff anymore. You're building community, you're building an identity, you're selling the identity that happens to be attached to a product. Um but that goes with then finding people who have done it before you who understand things that you may not understand yet, and trying to bring them into your world and get their advice and and then understanding what advice is relevant and what advice isn't.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, it's so true, man. And Eric, I can't thank you enough for being here today and sharing the insight, but more importantly, man, just sharing your journey with us,

Final Links And Friendship Challenge

SPEAKER_00

dude. Uh, I think a lot of us, when we're just starting to navigate the transition, we feel like it's a a brand new problem set that nobody else has gone through. And the reality is, man, you just have to realize that it is the last true mission in the military, and you just have to approach it just like you approached every mission. A little bit of analysis, a little bit of fucking attention to detail, and willing to reach out to the other organizations that have been there and done it before. And by organizations, now it just means the other human being across the way. Reach out, talk to people, man. LinkedIn is a powerful resource. I know it can seem dumb to sit up there, take a photo of yourself in a suit or a business attire and set it up, but do it because more often than not, people will reply back and they'll have a virtual cup of coffee with you. You can ask them everything, anything you want. No questions too dumb. Let me rephrase some. Just put the questions through Chat GPT first, and then ask individuals.

SPEAKER_01

But again, that's a solid point though, too, is like, don't waste people's time. Yes. Also, Google does exist, chat Claude exists, and it's like, hey, brother, like, yeah, do some research before you ask real, because I get that a lot too. It's like, hey, how do I do XYZ? And it's like, have you actually done any research? Are you asking me to do the work for you?

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

So that is a big part of too. But also when you go to someone, like, make sure you've done research into them, research into what you're asking them before you're just like, hey, how do I how do I start a business?

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

With $39, Northwest Mutual Registered Agents, you can do it today. That's brother.

SPEAKER_01

Ask me a specific question, please.

SPEAKER_00

Is it true that if you don't use it, you lose it? Absolutely. Eric, again, thank you for being here, brother. People would like to connect or reach you to ask any question that's informed and directed towards something you specifically done. Where the where can they connect?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, honestly, Instagram is probably where I'm slightly the most active. I really uh am not super active on social media nowadays. Um, but also if you reach out to Rashalon, it'll make its way to me.

SPEAKER_00

Heck yeah. Dude, thanks again for being here. And everybody listening, do me a favor, you know the spiel. It's almost over. Go to his episode description, click those links, support Echelon, get yourself some today, buy it for a friend or two, and think of all the great times you shared together in the field and enjoy one with a friend. Reconnect, that's shameless plug for Special Sports Foundation's Project Reach. We're challenging you to connect with five of your friends, get connected, stay connected, because you can't expect what you don't inspect. And the same can be said for your friendships and your friends when they're starting to struggle. You can't expect them to reach out if you're not plugged in. So help us fight the suicide epidemic and reach out to your friends today. Eric, again, thank you for being here and everybody tuning in. We'll see y'all next time. Till then, take care.

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Deny Caballero

Host