Reshaping Life and Finding Love After Loss - Debbie Weiss : 102

How would you navigate through the wilderness of grief, discover a new version of yourself, and perhaps, find love again after losing a life partner of over three decades?

The fearless guest and inspiring Debbie Weiss have walked the path and shared her journey. Having lost her husband to cancer, Debbie provides a poignant narrative of living through loss, wrestling with grief, and finding the courage to reshape her life.

Debbie is a former attorney who earned her MFA in creative writing at 56 from Saint Mary's College of California. After losing her high school sweetheart and husband of 32 years, George, Debbie turned to writing as she lived alone and single for the first time.
In this episode, we pull back the layers of Debbie's healing process, exploring the instrumental role of therapy in dealing with her loss. The struggle to respect her husband's wishes while battling the urge to intervene is heart-rending, as is her journey back to school for an MFA. Her resilience is evident in how she dealt with loneliness and eventually ventured into online dating, leading her to find love again five years after her husband's passing.
Her journey results in a book titled "Available As Is: "A Midlife Widow's Search for Love," published in 2022.
As we wrap up, the power of Debbie's story emerges in her candid reflections. Her openness and vulnerability encourage us to listen, respond, and connect. In sharing her tale, Debbie becomes a beacon of hope, reminding us that loss is not the end but a part of life's journey. Indeed, life can and does go on, sometimes in ways we never imagined. Join us in this heartfelt conversation and let Debbie's story inspire those treading a similar path.
Debbie lives in California Bay Area.
Let's Enjoy her Story.
To Connect with Debbie: https://debbieweissauthor.com/

Transcript

Daniela: 0:08

Hi, I'm Daniela. Welcome to my podcast, because everyone has a story, the place to give ordinary people, stories, the chance to be shared and preserved. Our stories become the language of connections. Let's enjoy it, connect and relate, because everyone has a story. Welcome. My guest is Debbie Weiss.

Daniela: 0:34

Debbie is a former attorney who earned her MFA in creative writing at 56. After losing her high school sweetheart and husband of 32 years, george, debbie turned to writing as she lived alone and single for the first time. How would you navigate through the wilderness of grief, discover a new version of yourself and perhaps find love again after losing a life partner, or find hope again or motivation to continue? Debbie has walked the path and shares her journey and candid reflections with us. Her openness and vulnerability encouraged me to listen and connect even deeper as she teaches that loss, and I thought this was fascinating. It's not the end, but a part of life journey.

Daniela: 1:27

I find that grief is a complex emotion that we all experience in one way or another. Sometimes we use different names, like nostalgia or reminiscence. We could have grief for times that have passed, for people that have passed, for situations that have passed, and we all react in different ways, different times. It is not predictable. Let's enjoy Debbie's story of great insights. Welcome, debbie, to the show. Thank you for being here. Thank you for having me. Daniela, yes, and I know you have a story, an interesting story. Why do you want to share your story?

Debbie Weiss: 2:07

Well, my story is about recovering after loss, after losing my husband of 32 years and trying to make a new life. I want to share my story in case it helps other people who've suffered a loss and have a really hard time getting over their grief.

Daniela: 2:20

Yes, and thank you for that, because, it's true, some of the people usually don't hear much, but I appreciate you bringing it here. Thank you. So, debbie, when does your story start?

Debbie Weiss: 2:29

Well, my story probably starts when I was seven years old. My dad worked with a woman who had a cute 11-year-old son, and I met him. His name was George. My dad and George's mom were both scientists. Over the years, we got thrown together. We started dating when I was 17. I was a junior in high school and he was 21. He was an engineering major at UC Berkeley. That's where we met and then we started dating and we were together for 32 years. I went to law school. We were pretty happy and then, well, our story changed in 2013 because he passed away from cancer.

Daniela: 3:03

But Debbie Daniela is more than 30 years. I mean, you knew him from when he was seven and then 17.

Debbie Weiss: 3:10

Yeah, I started dating when we were 17. So we had 32 years together as a couple, but I'd known him for 42 years of my life.

Daniela: 3:17

Wow, yes, very well, he's like really soulmate I thought, so I felt like it.

Debbie Weiss: 3:22

It definitely felt like it.

Daniela: 3:24

Wow, that sounds so sweet. So you were enjoying life and certainly he got sick.

Debbie Weiss: 3:30

Yeah, it wasn't too sudden. In 2009 he was diagnosed with cancer and we had a few good years. He kept working. He was a workaholic. Sadly, he kept working as an engineer. I'd retired by then. I was a lawyer and I put practicing about 10 years before, and then we just kind of went on to our life until he started to decline In mid-2012, it really hit him.

Daniela: 3:52

So when he knew that he was sick, he wasn't the kind of person who decided, okay, I'm going to change my life. He just kept everything the same as he was.

Debbie Weiss: 3:59

That's very true. He was not going to change his life. He was going to keep working. He coded a financial product called a software program called Quicken and he was going to make the best Quicken imaginable and he was going to not let his colleagues down. He was a wonderful mentor to other engineers. He was a homebody. He wanted to keep cooking. The one thing he didn't want to do was have this control his life. So he kind of treated it like another part of his job, a bad part.

Daniela: 4:26

Wow, interesting. So I guess his life, and with you it was such a beautiful life. Okay, I'm sick, but there is nothing I need to change because everything that is happening is okay in my life.

Debbie Weiss: 4:37

I think he felt that way. I like to think he felt that way. The bad way to look at it was he was a workaholic and that wasn't going to change. But I also think he was happy with the way he lived. We loved to cook, we were homebodies, we cooked a lot. We shopped a lot for ingredients. He had a little sports car. He was an engineer. We drive around fast and buy ingredients and make these dinners and I think he was happy doing that. I don't think he wanted to change anything, but I also think at some level he didn't believe he was dying. I think he believed he was going to live for a long life.

Debbie Weiss: 5:10

And what about you? Oh, I was worried. I have anxiety already and I thought maybe we would want to do some different things. I thought he might want to take some time off work and have some more time together, maybe travel a bit. Before things got worse, he had chemo every three weeks, so that was a limitation, but I thought we might want to do that and kind of I don't know what, what do you do? Take photographs, write things down, maybe look at our lives as finite. But that wasn't something he wanted. He was a stronger personality than I did. Now my personality is very strong, but then it wasn't so strong. Been in this relationship since I was 17,. Since high school we just kind of did kind of let him decide how we wanted to live.

Daniela: 5:54

It is interesting because you will say what is his life? He has to decide. However, he's gone, but you are left. I think the people who stay behind are the ones who are affected. We always think about the person who's dying, but never the person who's staying.

Debbie Weiss: 6:09

That's a really good point. I completely agree. It was terribly sad when he was gone. But yeah, then you're left. I mean I was when he died I was 49. So I still had a lot of my life left. I was overcome with grief. I felt very guilty. George had been in denial about having cancer so he never thought he was dying. At the end his mind did some weird trick and he thought he was getting better. So we never had a real goodbye. He didn't involve his parents, which was very hard for me and, of course, for them. So yeah, he was gone and I was like, well, I still have this life left, but what do I?

Daniela: 6:45

do? Yes, what do you do? Because you've been living with him for so long and he was your soulmate, and now you're on your own. Exactly, yep, that was exactly it. I guess. What happens at the beginning Were you grieving first and then, after you start to realize about you.

Debbie Weiss: 7:02

Well, I'm an ex-lawyer, so I kind of went into two modes. I got really organized. During the day I was very organized and I had lists of things to do. You know, our home was in very bad shape because he'd been had cancer for a while and we'd put all that on the back burner. So I got really efficient. I kind of blocked things out, did all the paperwork and straightened up our house and did all this stuff. But at night I was all alone and it was a small house but it felt really empty and really quiet. At night I would just listen to music, listen to his favorite records, eat a turntable and drink bourbon. I drink Manhattan's. It's kind of spaced out.

Daniela: 7:40

It felt very lost, then I can imagine how it is. You know, when my dad passed away which he was my best friend I was studying law and I got really efficient my mom wasn't there. These decisions that I had to make and I was very cold took me a long time before I started to cry. It was like about five months that it hit me and I was really sad At the beginning. These five months I was like doing, doing, doing so. It's interesting that you were doing that too.

Debbie Weiss: 8:09

Yeah, I was. I was. I just tried to look at it very practically like well, how are my finances? What do I need to do to the house? You know, the bathroom was leaking into the dining room. How am I going to forget this? Straightened out and I wasn't really thinking well about how sad I was and how much I missed him. I'd lost my mom when I was 10, so those feelings did start to creep back in, no loss before it took a while before, you know, it felt like armor. You know, I think maybe we kind of go into a mode where we're a little bit armor.

Daniela: 8:40

And you said you fell alone. Did you have people around you? Not?

Debbie Weiss: 8:43

so much. You know I don't have kids and George and I were real isolated. We didn't have close friends. You know we had acquaintances. My dad was in his mid 80s then and he had some health problems and, as is my stepmom, I'm an only child, george was an only child. I didn't have people around me. You know I would go visit my dad nearby, I'd visit him a lot of the days and, just you know, sit and hang out with them, but they had their own health problems so they couldn't really help me. So how do you help yourself?

Debbie Weiss: 9:10

Eventually I got things in order and I realized, you know, I kind of got out of fight or flight mode, that real organized kind of thing, and things were done and I looked around and it was like, okay, there's nothing, there's no real crises right now, and I just started doing things I used to do. I started taking long walks again. I joined a yoga studio. I went back into writing. That really helped me. I used to take a weekly writing class before George got sick and I went back to the writing class and just kind of joined a bunch of groups to try to meet people and to get out of the house and to talk to people that felt real different to me. I felt so isolated. I was like trying to re-socialize myself.

Daniela: 9:53

And how was that in different times? How was that?

Debbie Weiss: 9:56

Well, some of it was good and some of it wasn't. Going to the local rotary club probably wasn't. For me, it's very conservative. I joined a car club because George had this car and the people were really nice. But I'm not really a car person. But we had breakfast Saturday mornings and it was nice. People were very nice. Some of them had known us as a couple and it was nice to have people hang out with. And then the yoga studio had some really friendly women and I went to evening classes and that broke up the nights because I wasn't just alone all the time. Writing took a lot of time and I made friends and joined a writing group and that turned into a much larger thing. Things started to feel a little bit better that way.

Daniela: 10:35

You had a feeling, an interesting or different feeling, because you felt well, I am a widow, so perhaps I don't know. You had some kind of story that you told in your head.

Debbie Weiss: 10:45

Well, I told myself, I was pulled together. I was very conscientious, I had the right makeup and I made sure George's sports car was washed. I didn't want to look pathetic. I had little coordinated outfits. I didn't realize it. People thought I looked terrific, but I was way too thin because I wasn't really eating. I was so amped up and I had a story in my head that I'd had a good life with my late husband and now I was venturing out and I was fine. I think I pulled it off, but inwardly I wasn't really fine and I felt very, very lonely and bereft and kind of lost. Why am I here? Why?

Daniela: 11:26

am I still here? I can imagine Wow. And this is how, many months after.

Debbie Weiss: 11:30

Probably six months.

Daniela: 11:31

So six months you're feeling like that and what happened?

Debbie Weiss: 11:35

Well, I got into a bad relationship that wasn't so brilliant when a George's former caregivers. We started out as friends and then it got a little crazy. At first it was fun. He was really into cinema and we went to all these film festivals and I live in this little lived in this suburban town. That was pretty boring and we'd go to the city and we'd go out and we both loved eating these burgers and milkshakes and it was kind of a lot of fun. But ultimately he got kind of controlling and I realized that I shouldn't have been in a relationship anyway and this was not a good relationship, a healthy relationship ultimately. So I had to break away from that?

Daniela: 12:12

What did you learn besides that? You already knew that, because that's the way you are. Did it help?

Debbie Weiss: 12:17

Well, it all made me grow. Even the bad relationship made me realize that I had to be stronger and I had to learn to stand on my own. I got into therapy after that because I realized I needed help to learn to stand on my own. But I also learned I had the capacity to love again, that I could feel passion and love and that ultimately that was something I was going to want again. All the groups and things I joined I realized, you know, I was fine, I wasn't that strange or socially awkward. I could join a group and I could talk and I could try things, and it wasn't the end of the world if it didn't work. So I definitely did learn some gratitude, because I still wanted to live and I felt like I could probably do that if I stayed away from the wrong guys and worked a little more on finding a life on my own.

Daniela: 13:03

Yes, I find it interesting what you said. You knew that you were a strong woman and that you can stand on your own, but you felt that you were looking for that love. You still needed that.

Debbie Weiss: 13:13

Well, no, I did it first. I wanted that. It was very hard to be alone all the time, and another reason I got therapy was also I had PTSD because you know, when George was sick and in denial, I was his caregiver and that didn't go so great and so I'd keep seeing him. You know how he looked at the end and I had a lot of guilt over his death. So I needed to fix that and definitely get rid of some of that and be able to sleep again and function.

Daniela: 13:40

You always forget about the caregiver and you always think that you can do it because you are the wife or the partner, but not necessarily always true. Would you have changed anything on that area?

Debbie Weiss: 13:51

I would have. Yeah, I couldn't change George being in denial. I wish I could have. He didn't let me be involved in his treatment or anything at the hospital I discovered later he even asked the hospital not to talk to me, even though I was a competent person I'm a lawyer, you know and I think, looking way back, I would have gone behind his back and I would have talked to the hospital. I would have said we have a real mental problem here and this is impacting his care and this is impacting his what's left of his life. And I, you know and I doubt his judgment, which I didn't then he'd always been the one to make the choices. But, looking back, I would have. I would have intervened at a different level and I might have involved his parents. He didn't want to, but they're good people and they were strong people and he loved. They loved him. Of course. I think I would have gone behind his back and given them the chance to be with him and probably ganged up on him with them.

Daniela: 14:43

Huh, so you think that his behavior was for mental issues?

Debbie Weiss: 14:47

I think so in retrospect I do. I mean, he was fine. It's just that it was so very subtle, you know, at one point he's fine, he's walking around or he's even wheelchair bound and he's making very rational things. He's saying no, I don't want this, I don't want that, we can work on this, we can do that. And Then from there, suddenly he seemed to not even suddenly it just that just seemed to kind of morph into a denial. It was almost kind of subtle. You know, from I'm doing great to I won't die, and that was subtle.

Daniela: 15:18

Hmm, people wouldn't think that there is a mental problem here, because it would say, oh, it seems like an optimistic, positive person, right, right?

Debbie Weiss: 15:26

Yeah, exactly, he's still taking care of things. He was still working, he was interacting great with the folks at work. If, when he spoke to his parents, he was perfectly pleasant, he just didn't talk to them about being sick or let them see him. So he's wonderful to me, is loving, you know. And he was sick, he'd say, okay, well, why don't you go out to lunch, you know? Why don't you go to school, friend, or go to lunch, or why don't you go do this or do that?

Debbie Weiss: 15:47

What wasn't clear was we weren't getting any help and he was in very bad shape and I was doing his kind of medical kinds of care at home and I wasn't trained to do that. So that was scary, or he'd send me out of the house and I think, oh god, what if he falls? Should he really be alone? He was turning down outside care. So, yeah, I don't think so. I think we have such an idea I think it's particularly American of you know, being the strong person and doing things on your own and being super positive, that on the surface, that looked like the things he was doing and that his attitudes were good or healthy.

Daniela: 16:20

Yes, it's interesting what you're saying. I think people will hear these and and maybe think twice when the person is ill and how they behave. I had my uncle who was sick of cancer and then my aunt and the doctors didn't want to tell him the truth that he was dying and I always thought, well, that's strange. Don't you want to know that everybody has different behaviors?

Debbie Weiss: 16:40

I think so. I mean maybe like when you put somebody in a situation that's that hard that they've never been in before you know something. It's like probably be dead in three years.

Daniela: 16:47

I mean I think that maybe changes people's how they think you don't know what's how that's gonna affect you until it happens, I guess this also should come with therapy when they tell you, okay, you're dying, you know, you know you have three years or six months that you get to talk to people, some Experts, so that you can make the best decisions, not only for you but also for the people around you, because he loved you, but was he thinking about how you were going to feel or his parents were gonna feel after he's gone? People always think, okay, I'm the one dying, so I'm the one who has to make all the decisions, but by the other people. That makes sense.

Debbie Weiss: 17:21

I'm guessing he was probably offered therapy at the hospital but he turned everything down. You know, when he was sick I discovered later he turned down paleo-dive care. He turned down any concept of hospice. The hospital had services and referrals and things for home care. He turned all that down. He didn't think we needed it. I did towards the end I pushed him and we got some home care, but he turned everything down. I'm guessing therapy had been an option but that he turned it down. I did ultimately go for therapy after he was diagnosed and then again after he died, and how was the therapy while he was sick?

Daniela: 17:56

How did I help you when he was sick?

Debbie Weiss: 17:58

didn't use it much. I tried to work with it. To say he's a workaholic. I want my time with him and I was scared. Therapist was very nice, but I didn't get any significant takeaways after he was dead I got a lot of very good takeaways. A lot of things started to make sense through therapy.

Daniela: 18:15

Okay, well, that's good. I'm glad that you had the help. Yeah, that helped a lot. You went through therapy, he helped you and you stopped going to therapy or you continue.

Debbie Weiss: 18:24

I stopped after a while. The problem is I had a wonderful therapist but she retired and I was stronger by then he'd been gone, or over a year and a half didn't find another therapist I clicked with. You know, I never really clicked with anybody else, except for this first therapist, who was amazing. She'd give me little tasks, like she'd say you have to go to something out of the house and you have to tell people you're a widow. Or when I got in this bad relationship she said okay. She said you know this isn't your problem. She said you know you're a vulnerable widow.

Debbie Weiss: 18:53

He came on to you, you didn't do anything wrong. Or she said can't feel that guilty. You work with your feelings about George, but we're gonna get through your guilt because he turned down all the outside help. You did the best you could and those were the things that were helpful. I didn't find anybody else, but I really believe in therapy. I mean, I'm in therapy now for anxiety and I'm functioning quite well. I just find it helpful. Yes, something I've done on and off over the years. I think it's important, you know, to see therapy is kind of a wellness thing as opposed to, maybe, something you do in crisis.

Daniela: 19:24

Therapies is like having a best friend, that you're not boarding them with your problems. I don't feel that you should have your friends and tell them always your issues, because they get tired and they have their own right. Well, the professionals know how to not take all your energy, but help you and be helpful to you, so I think that's better right.

Debbie Weiss: 19:45

I think so too. You know, with a friend or anybody, you tend to censor yourself, and a therapist isn't somebody you socialize with and you don't think of them judging you or looking at you in your daily life. So I think it's good to do something that's kind of outside your circle, yes, and get kind of a more objective, maybe, viewpoint.

Daniela: 20:01

Yes, now it's a bit more common and I'm glad that people are using that to help themselves, because people don't have to keep secrets or feelings and you never know. Sometimes you said, oh, I won't go, because I listened to Devi and she had a harder time than me when my dad passed away. I didn't think anything of it, but I'm still kind of affected by that time and if I talk about it was one of the most sad times that I had. I think it is important that people talk about grief. It's like if you lose a job, if you lose a partner, anything, people don't touch the subject. They don't say, hey, how are you, how are you feeling? Because they're afraid that the drama or or to to be too indiscreet, asking you questions.

Debbie Weiss: 20:42

I agree, people, they're really uncomfortable, at least here. People are very uncomfortable with the concept of grief and I think they're very uncomfortable with seeing you unhappy or sad. So they just want to hear you're over it. When I would go to things or I'd be like, oh, but you're over it. Or oh, but you're doing good, you're out of the house, so you're doing good. Oh, but you should be over it. Or oh, but you have so much of your life ahead of you. People always want to look on the positive side. You can be positive in the sense that this person left you with wonderful memories and you still have a lot of wonderful life ahead. But it's still sad and I think people don't. They don't like to talk about grief and they don't like to hear that you're not doing great. It makes them uncomfortable.

Daniela: 21:20

What do you suggest that people can say?

Debbie Weiss: 21:22

Well, I mean, for one thing, they cannot gloss it over. I mean not this sense of oh, but you're doing great. I'm sorry for your loss, that I can't imagine what that's like. And if they can share a memory of the person who died, tell them a good story, you know, say something positive, like I remember when this person did this for me, or they did that, or I'll always remember that. So you feel like they made a positive impact and they were loved and that they live on in people, and I think that's that's the most helpful. But, you know, not demanding this kind of false cheerfulness.

Daniela: 21:56

Yes, and I'm glad you said that because he's through a friend of ours from school. He passed away two years ago and the first thing I said oh you know, I'm going to text his daughter and say you remember this from your father? And she was so grateful and I think this is true. You can say sorry for your loss to share a story. That's a very good point. Thank you for saying that.

Debbie Weiss: 22:17

That helped me. You know George's colleagues at work. They gave me some letters and emails with good memories of him and that was really. That was really great. I appreciated that.

Daniela: 22:27

Yes, it has been many years now. It's been 10 years, 10 years and you have been taking care of yourself. Yeah, do you feel that time heals?

Debbie Weiss: 22:37

Yes, I do. You don't forget the person, you don't stop loving them. That really sharp pain, you know, when you have that kind of a loss you probably have this with your dad it feels physical, right. You feel kind of wounded. You're going about your activities but you feel just this pain at least I did. I mean it was everywhere. It was like my heart hurt, my head hurt, everything, and I felt kind of weakened, like I had this huge blow and that goes away. Other things that helped me was, you know, all that venturing out eventually led to some activities I loved and making some friends and getting some connections. And then ultimately, you know, I've been with someone now for five years and I moved to a new home and a place that I love. That helped, you know, making changes in time helped a great deal.

Daniela: 23:22

You said to me when we met the first time that it was maybe not so positive that you were so close with your husband all the time that you were your own little world. That's true.

Debbie Weiss: 23:33

I was so very alone, you know, I didn't have friends, I didn't have people to reach out to and more than that, you know, when we were living together I mean that was our lives and it made sense to me and I'd always been pretty driven I went to college and I went to law school. Then, you know, I practiced law for 11 years and then I retired and I was just with George and he was very high energy and we sort of did everything that he wanted to do. He worked from home some days. Those days we'd hang out, you know, we would have dinner every night. But I never really did develop a lot of my own interests after I quit practicing law and I didn't make my own friends or have my own connections. And I think I don't have any regrets. But these are all kinds of things I could have done when I was still married and I could have had a life where I followed my passions more when I was still married and I think that's important. There was no need to be that isolated.

Daniela: 24:23

Have you met any other women similar to your situation, that they were so one small world with their husband or partners?

Debbie Weiss: 24:30

I've met a few who were widowed. They generally had more friends and most of them had children, so they have more of a network and they also have more of a reason, I think, to keep it together. But I certainly have met some women who married their one and only the ones they loved and were together for many, many years. Without their partner. They're just really devastated. Most of these women I know haven't dated again and they just have a life and they're resilient, wonderful people, strong people, but they just have had a life that's more with friends and with their children and they haven't really looked to another partner Debbie, during these 10 years, when you said you have a partner now for the last five, but the first five years were you going always up, up up in improving.

Daniela: 25:14

or you had days that you would go up and down, or months that you were not well and other months that you were really well. How was the path?

Debbie Weiss: 25:23

I would say weeks here and there. Yeah, people say grief isn't linear and they're right. They'll show, like I think you've probably seen, the image for grieving. It's a ball of yarn and it's all kinked up in places and sometimes it's unruling nicely and sometimes it's all kinked up and tangled and I had times like that. I got in a bad relationship for a while but at the same time I was getting essays published, doing new things with writing. The good part was the writing, the bad was this crummy relationship, or I'd have a setback or I'd feel sad and maybe I'd spend a few days watching movies and hanging out, but then I'd have weeks that were very good, with groups that I was involved in or writing or friends. So yeah, there were definitely ups and downs and there were times I felt that I was living a good life, taking care of myself and moving forward towards things that I might want, and other times I felt like this was just really crappy without George.

Debbie Weiss: 26:24

How did you meet your new partner? We met online. It was actually at a low point. I just had kind of a crummy breakup, but I was pretty independent At that point. I was going to start school. I went back to college so I was going to get a master's. When I met him, I was set to do some traveling by myself with a tour group. I didn't have people to travel with. I toured with my university alumni association. I had big trips set up. I got this note, one of my profile pictures on the dating app. I was standing against a car and I had these tennis shoes on. They're like slip on, like vans and they had skulls on them. I really like those tennis shoes you're wearing in that picture. Are those vans with skulls? Yes, they are. And he said I kind of want to get a pair. What do you think? And we started talking from there. From there we texted and he sent me pictures and we met for tea.

Daniela: 27:12

Very clever, very clever, focusing on something else. And so what, the masters, were you doing? I did a.

Debbie Weiss: 27:19

It's called an MFA and it's a master's of fine arts. You can get it in music or dance or anything, and I got mine in creative writing.

Daniela: 27:27

Oh, I see Wonderful, wonderful. Okay, so you had a during these five years that you've been with your new partner. Do you still have sad moments or guilty moments because of George?

Debbie Weiss: 27:39

I don't really feel guilty anymore. I feel like I've gotten through that. I still occasionally do. I wish I'd been a better caregiver and I wish I'd been calmer. So I still have to go through that sometimes and think about it and kind of remind myself hey, you didn't. You know, you did the best you could. This happens to a lot of people Still feel a little sad sometimes because George's life was cut short. Overall I'm pretty happy. And my new partner he never, obviously met George, but we both love George. We think of him as an absent friend. George really liked desserts so, like on his birthday, we'll go to this restaurant we like and get this ice cream, this big ice cream Sunday. It's pretty discussed, it's enormous, and we'll say well, that's for George. You know, we'll share the ice cream Sunday at George's birthday.

Daniela: 28:21

That's very nice. Actually, that's very nice. We talk about him.

Debbie Weiss: 28:24

You know I still talk. I talk about him a lot. I think that's another problem sometimes is people don't like hearing about people who died because they think you're going to cry or get upset. But if this person was your life, you're going to talk about them because they were a big, huge part of your life.

Daniela: 28:37

That's true. That's a very good point. You did the masters in creating writing. So what happened? You wrote a book.

Debbie Weiss: 28:44

I wrote a book, yeah, yeah, you know, one thing that really saved me when George died was returning to my writing. I took a weekly class with adult education and I got into a writing group with some wonderful people and we meet every week and share our writing and those people are really good friends and I got more serious and I got some things published. From there I started to write a book and I realized I didn't know how to write a book. I'm an ex lawyer. It's very it's easy to write A 1500 word essay is one thing, or 2500 words, but a whole book that you want to read like a real book, right, not like a kid wrote it or whatever is hard. So, yeah, I hired a professional editor and I went back to school and got the MFA.

Debbie Weiss: 29:26

And what is your book about? Well, my book is called Available, as Is A Midlife Widow's Search for Love, and it's a memoir. It's about losing George and creating a life on my own after essentially being a child for 32 years. A child, well, kind of a child, because I never lived on my own. You know George took care of everything and I'd never dated. You know I hadn't. I only dated when I was in high school. George was my one and only and he took care of the finances and he decided what we were going to do, kind of like, what was it like to wake up at 49 and try to create a new life? Wow, we just did everything together. So I never had to make friends and go play with the other children or whatever. So you know, at that point it was, I mean, it was kind of like being young again, because it was like, well, what do I want to do and who do I want to hang?

Daniela: 30:15

out with. Yeah, and why did you stop working Practicing law? I quit at 40.

Debbie Weiss: 30:21

It was extremely stressful. I worked at a conventional law firm. We built in six minute increments which we filled out in time sheets which were like grids. I started to see those in my dreams, nightmares, and it was very stressful. It was very much. You know, how many hours can you put in? Having a balanced life was out of the question. This was in the late 1990s and I started in the 80s and it was very sexist. It wasn't a very welcoming environment for a woman and it was hard to get your voice heard.

Daniela: 30:51

Huh, interesting, and so I guess writing you get your voice heard.

Debbie Weiss: 30:55

I do, yeah, I do Now. It's not like going to court and it's not like I necessarily have an audience, but I do have a voice at this point.

Daniela: 31:05

You do have an audience, it's funny, and so you wrote this book and it's just a wonderful book to help others. Are you planning to have other things that you're going to write, or Well?

Debbie Weiss: 31:17

I've written some essays and things in support of the book. Two weeks ago I had an essay in the Huffington Post Personals. That was fun. I'm doing writing and guest posts in support of the book. The next thing I might do two things. I'd like to write about my father, because he's 93 and he's at a very interesting life as a nuclear physicist. Oh, wow, yeah, he was. Yeah, he's a couple generations maybe later than the Manhattan Project and he's I mean, it's someone who thinks in terms of quantum physics is an interesting person and he was an amazing person. You know, my mom died when I was 10 and he raised me on his own as a single parent, and he certainly wasn't his generation to do that. No, that's true. So I probably write about him because he's pretty remarkable. And the other thing I might do is try to turn my book into something else, a screenplay or something for fun.

Daniela: 32:07

Oh, yes, that's true, that's true, and you're that and you can record stories from him.

Debbie Weiss: 32:13

Yeah, I would like to have some some things to remember him by at this point.

Daniela: 32:17

Yes, david, anything else that you are interested on studying, doing, because you still have a whole life in front of you.

Debbie Weiss: 32:24

Well, I'm looking from, like I said, my next writing project, like that's going to be. I'm a big hiker so I do that. I'm thinking of doing yoga teacher training just for fun. I don't think I want to get any more graduate degrees at this point, but you know I've been putting a lot of effort into promoting the book. So I'm kind of at a juncture here of you know what's next.

Daniela: 32:45

Yes, Good, good, wonderful. And what is your goal?

Debbie Weiss: 32:49

I want to offer hope. You know that sometimes things you have a devastating loss and you think life is terrible and you don't know if you want to go on. But if you can make it through that part and just take a few little steps, you can start to move forward and they can start to add up.

Daniela: 33:04

I know, do you ever thought about losing your husband? Because for me, maybe because I lost my dad is a very scary thought, like I always think, okay, I have to do everything with him now, because, oh my God, what if I lose him?

Debbie Weiss: 33:18

I feel that way about my current partner. We both do. Yeah, my current partner, when we first got together, he'd lost his mom nine months before and he was very sad about that. His parents are both gone and he misses them. You know, I'm aware that my dad's 93 and after losing George and my mom's so young yeah, we're both very aware of that and thinking well, we want to live, well, we want to. You know, we don't want to have regrets, we want to make sure to spend time together and always be kind to each other.

Daniela: 33:43

Yeah, not a fun feeling, I have to say Not a fun feeling.

Debbie Weiss: 33:48

No, it isn't fun. Like someone like me, with anxiety, we both kind of go through. Well, how much do I want to do so I don't have any regrets. But how safe do I want to feel because we're more mortal?

Daniela: 34:00

Right, talk about joyful things and just try to remember and try not to avoid the question what about you meeting people that have the same situation as you but they cannot lift their head up?

Debbie Weiss: 34:13

People contact me through I8 or Facebook. You know they just live differently. Maybe what their new life, what their life with their husband is like, isn't big but they still love it. You know they have a group of friends. Maybe they knit with or they garden with and they don't want to date again and that's fine too. You know I meet a lot of women who are like I've done that, I'm finished, I don't want anymore. They call men children. I've raised a child, you know. I've raised a man done with. You know, done with looking after people and some people I see they just have quieter lives or they travel in groups. But I do get notes from folks who aren't okay or not feeling okay, and those are usually about two years out, one or two years out. You know I think some people are sad, though I see they're not happy and I don't know how to work with that. Some people, I know, want to be partnered again. Then they don't find the right person or life just doesn't feel very enjoyable without their partner.

Daniela: 35:07

Well, I'm glad you have any experiences or people reaching out from your book, being grateful also that you wrote the book and make them connect and relate.

Debbie Weiss: 35:15

I hope so. Yeah, I'm always grateful when someone reaches out to me, just and I answer everybody people who are sad or something that's that's what I do. Anybody's listening and they want to reach out and tell me their story, I will email back. It'll take me a little bit, but I do.

Daniela: 35:30

Wonderful, wonderful. So, debbie, thank you so much for sharing your story and being so vulnerable. I really appreciate that. You told us all kinds of nuggets. That is making me richer and I think he's going to help a lot of people too. So, thank you no, I hope so. Thank you so much. I hope you enjoyed today's episode. I am Daniela and you were listening to, because everyone has a story. Please take five seconds right now and think of somebody in your life that may enjoy what you just heard, or someone that has a story to be shared and preserved. When you think of that person, shoot them a text with the link of this podcast. This will allow the ordinary magic to go further. Join me next time for another story conversation. Thank you for listening. Hasta pronto.