20. What Makes Me Bipolar

What is bipolar disorder, what does it mean, and who has it? Do you think someone you care about might be bipolar? In this episode, your hosts Kristy and Angie sit down to finally talk about a long-awaited topic: Angie’s bipolar disorder. Content warning: mania, depression, suicide.    

Highlights:

• We take a stab at defining bipolar disorders
• How bipolar disorders are classified
• How to help yourself when diagnosed with something unfamiliar
• The stigmatization and misrepresentation of bipolar disorder
• How to call out someone who is being an asshole   

Takeaways:

• Bipolar depression, like unipolar depression, is a mood disorder
• Medication is here to help, not to stigmatize
• Sleep is very f*cking important!
• A successful relationship (bipolar or not) needs communication!
• Counsellor: RMT, Psychologist: Physio, Psychiatrist: Physician   

Resources:

• BP Hope - Hope and Harmony for People with Bipolar
• How Manic Depression Became Bipolar Disorder
• The History of Bipolar Disorder   

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Transcript

Kristy Yee: 0:00

Recording. Okay. Excellent. I feel so drained already. We haven't even started. We spent literally one hour,

Angie Yu: 0:09

I know fricking technology. One of these days, we will be able to start without any problems. One of these days.

Kristy Yee: 0:16

I'm going to go do like five pushups. Okay. Okay. I'm ready

Angie Yu: 0:44

Okay. I'm ready as well.

Kristy Yee: 0:46

Welcome back to welcome back to another episode of, should we don't tell mom today we have Angie joining us today.

Angie Yu: 0:53

Today we have Angie joining us today.

Kristy Yee: 0:56

Today we are going to today. Goddamn. How long has it been since the last time we recorded?

Angie Yu: 1:03

us two,

Kristy Yee: 1:04

Yeah

Angie Yu: 1:04

probably the first episode of season two.

Kristy Yee: 1:07

So

Angie Yu: 1:08

episode

Kristy Yee: 1:09

moons that feels like like two months ago.

Angie Yu: 1:11

I think it was, I think we recorded mid December and now it's nearly mid fab. So yeah, a couple of months.

Kristy Yee: 1:18

I've been looking forward to this episode for a really long time, because I haven't asked you anything about this because I'm saving myself for this episode. So I'm being really cryptic. I'm being cryptic. Angie and I have been keeping something from our poop troops we've been hiding a secret and we wanted to dedicate a specific episode to talk about it. So, what is it?

Angie Yu: 1:45

Uh, I guess it's an update on my mental health So it would be like an update to like episo six. I wanna say. the update is that I have been diagnosed with bipolar.

Kristy Yee: 2:01

I'm really excited for this episode today, because I had been waiting months to ask you stuff about your new diagnosis, how you're feeling like all of this shit that comes with it. And I haven't, I haven't been talking to you about any of this because I've been waiting for this fucking episode to come out. So here we go. Now we're going to have this conversation that should have happened. Like four months ago. Six, Holy shit. Six months. What the fuck.

Angie Yu: 2:32

Six months.

Kristy Yee: 2:33

Okay. So six months ago you were diagnosed with bipolar,

Angie Yu: 2:37

Bipolar two.

Kristy Yee: 2:38

bipolar, too. Ah, very good, because that was that's exactly my first question for you. When I hear bipolar, I think Brittany Spears.

Angie Yu: 2:46

Britney Spears is bipolar. I don't know. I've never.

Kristy Yee: 2:51

Oh, well, let me tell you, well, okay, well, I don't know. Well now I don't know. Now I'm going to have to fucking Google and fact check this later when we edit, but either way, regardless, when you say bipolar, the first person I think of is Brittany

Angie Yu: 3:05

you know, what, it kind of makes sense from her behavior that has been seen in like paparazzi media and stuff like that. to someone with bipolar, I'm like, okay. Yeah, I can see that.

Kristy Yee: 3:14

I'm assuming there's a spectrum because everything's on a spectrum. I'm assuming there's many, many different types of bipolar, but I am not aware of them. I'm sure some of our listeners are, I'm still getting used to this,

Angie Yu: 3:27

I approve chips. Yeah.

Kristy Yee: 3:29

Our poop troopers, poop troops, our poop troops, our poop troops may also not be as familiar. What are the types of Okay. So yeah. Wow. I have not asking questions at all.

Angie Yu: 3:42

It's a it's like, okay. So, I mean, I've only started reading the literature behind bipolar, like for six months. So I'm still not an expert on it either. like, it's, it's has such a long history. There's many different classifications It's had a very up and down history, which is funny because it's bipolar.

Kristy Yee: 4:02

It's at a bipolar history.

Angie Yu: 4:04

so first I would say that the categorization is difference between classic bipolar and atypical bipolar. So classic bipolar, it's very textbook. it's like one person, like you have a certain personality. for a period of time and then you go back to normal for a period of time, and then you have like a very depressive personality for like another period of time. And that's the classic textbook one because it's very identifiable. And those periods of time are usually pretty long, like year to year, even more than that, between but that's actually less common So the classic textbook Definition of bipolar is actually the least common The other type of bipolar which is atypical which is what I've been diagnosed with is actually more common but it's often missed in practice and often misdiagnosed So atypical bipolar is where your mood swings come and go quite frequently and frequently would say like you probably go up and down Maybe like four times a anywhere between that, the thing is, like you said, it's a spectrum. So everyone experiences their bipolar swings differently. and there's also mixed States where you can be both. You have both States of manic and depression.

Kristy Yee: 5:19

So when you say both, like, do you mean both of atypical and classic

Angie Yu: 5:23

both. I'm sorry. So bipolar, the definition of bipolar is that you experience mania but you also experienced depressed. the definition of bipolar comes from the fact that the, by. Polar aspect. The polarizing is between mania and men melancholy, melancholy. Yeah. Mania and melancholy. And those two were coined by like ancient Greeks and ancient Roman. Like mania means elevate a mood melancholy, low mood. a lot of people, I think bipolar is like multiple personality disorder, but that's a completely different thing. Bipolar is a mood disorder and it means that you have two very polarizing moods that can switch back and forth at any time. And mix dates as means that you can experience both within a very short amount of time, like within days. so that's atypical, bipolar, even though it's more common, it's called atypical, bipolar. I think classic and atypical is just more from the diagnostic perspective. then you have bipolar one and bipolar two, which is the classification of how you experience mania. Actually bipolar used to be called manic depression.

Kristy Yee: 6:27

Hmm. I've heard of manic depression. I didn't know that they were

Angie Yu: 6:32

Yeah. So when I wasn't aware of bipolar yet, I thought manic depression just means like super depressed. I just thought it means like ultra depression. Right. But actually manic depression is literally you are manic and then you're depressed. so that's no longer like a term that's used instead it's called bipolar. so when you have bipolar one, you experience really elevated moods where you think you're like, I don't know, like. You can do anything in the world. And it's just like, you have the sense of grandiosity. And you can do really dangerous things too. and some people with when they have full blown mania, they experience things like psychosis, hearing things, et cetera. So that's bipolar one where your mania reaches a pretty high level and your depression usually reaches a low that's equivalent to people with depression. And bipolar too. When you are a manic it doesn't quite reach a full blown manic episode. It reaches something called the hypomanic state. which means like under manic, I guess you want to go into the etymology. but it basically means like, You still experience all these elevated moods and elevated energy, there's no psychotic episodes or anything like that. But the scary thing is anybody with bipolar too, if you don't take care of yourself, it can turn into bipolar one. So it's not like a static diagnosis.

Kristy Yee: 7:53

Okay. So bipolar two sounds like a milder version of bipolar one, whereas bipolar one it's you're like so hot riding that high of mania that you reach into a psychosis state

Angie Yu: 8:09

right.

Kristy Yee: 8:10

mind. And then when you write down really low, it's like super down in the pits where it's. and like hollow

Angie Yu: 8:20

think about as a roller coaster, or you just think of it as a sky train track sky train tracks though has up and down So for those of you who don't live in Vancouver sky train is our version of The subway except it goes into the sky too because it's very mountainous here So it kind of goes up and down if you equate the sky train track to like a person right You've had a shitty day You're going to go down a little bit You've had a really good day You're going to go up a little bit You just got a promotion You're going to feel great Right You just lost a loved one I'm going to feel like a really shit So everyone has those ups and downs but people with mood disorders have greater changes in mood and to the point where like it can affect your life in a very traumatic if you think about someone with bipolar, then it's kind of like a rollercoaster.

Kristy Yee: 9:04

Now I have two questions. Changing between different States. Is it triggered by anything or does it just kind of come like, it's just like four days later. Okay. Now I'm PI four days later. Now I'm like, it's kind of predictable, like a period or, or not, or is it triggered by

Angie Yu: 9:25

For me, it's both, and for most people it's both. and the scary part is that sometimes it can just come out of nowhere. but there's definitely triggers as well. Like, so it is both, and sometimes I can kind of sense it coming. So like, I can feel like the rollercoaster starting to go downwards,

Kristy Yee: 9:44

the period cramps is about to start happening. You're like, Ooh, I think I'm going to get it in the next few

Angie Yu: 9:48

Yeah. So same thing, but with your, with your brain. And, and of course, like when I, before I even research about bipolar, I, I'm not aware of that stuff. Right. But once you become aware of it, you're like you start to notice these.

Kristy Yee: 10:00

Have you noticed what some of your triggers might be?

Angie Yu: 10:03

one of the things about bipolar is that you really, really have to focus on keeping your life well balanced. And if I don't stick to like a stable sleeping schedule, it's really easy to trigger my mania. Then I don't know why that is. I don't know how the chemistry works. Like. if I don't sleep the less I sleep, the more energetic I get.

Kristy Yee: 10:26

Do you think that balance comes from almost compensating? The fact that you Teeter back and forth as a person with bipolar? Like, is that fair to

Angie Yu: 10:35

so Yeah I feel that like I feel like when I'm super stressed I get this extra burst of energy when I'm not sleeping enough I get Even more energetic I think it could be my brain's way of like compensating for it But then but then I Right And then I when I crash it it sucks So the thing with bipolar is like when you're depressed you're the same level of depressed as people with depression but relatively it feels even worse because when you're elevator you're higher up So when you fall down the relative newness

Kristy Yee: 11:09

of your fall is

Angie Yu: 11:10

further.

Kristy Yee: 11:11

Wow. That is a good point. That's not something I thought of before. So then does this mean that you have bipolar and depression or like just bipolar and you have depressive States because of bipolar? can you have both

Angie Yu: 11:28

so like depression is part of bipolar.

Kristy Yee: 11:30

So, so then, so then can you have like, So, this is how I'm thinking. I don't want, I don't know why I'm picturing Balzac's okay. We're going to go with this. Okay. So you got one ball sack, and that's like mania, right? And then you have the other ball and that's depression, right? Yeah. Correct. Correct. Like it holds it all together. Okay. So now you have that's, that's what it is. The ball sack is bipolar. Can you swing back and forth between the two either it's it's triggered or not triggered or whatever, but it's, it's going. Okay. Ball sack one ball sack two up and down again.

Angie Yu: 12:10

The listeners who can't see Christy is gesturing a lot right now, and I'm trying really hard not to laugh

Kristy Yee: 12:15

I'm jiggling ball sacks right now.

Angie Yu: 12:19

But you can always edit out my left or so,

Kristy Yee: 12:22

No now depression is in ball number two. Okay. Now when you have bipolar and you have depression, does that mean there's a third bowl or is it just like the second ball okay. So when you have bipolar, it's like you have bipolar and within bipolar, at that encompasses that depression. It's not like there's an additional depression on top of the bipolar

Angie Yu: 12:45

Yeah, correct. That's why bipolar is often diagnosed as depression first, and then maybe you're diagnosed as bipolar because the depression is so obvious. Whereas the mania is less obvious because one, you just think like, that's you when you're happy. before, like especially when I was younger and especially before I started seeing therapy, when I had these episodes of mania or hypomania, I just thought I was living life. Like I just thought that was regular happiness. I didn't think that, there was anything wrong with me or not that there's anything wrong but I didn't know that I was in an elevated mood and. And that's the dangers of bipolar is that you would only really seek help when you're really depressed. so that's why it's often diagnosed as depression. And of course, for me, I was diagnosed with depression and then I was started on antidepressants. Right. And then I had something called serotonin syndrome. So antidepressants. so back in the day, antidepressants were pretty dodgy. They were very addictive, et cetera, et cetera. Nowadays, there are a lot more safe. They're not addictive. and what they do actually is they do something with the binding neural transmitter. I don't know, I'm just like making shit up, but basically all the serotonin that's like floating in your head. people without mood disorders can regulate the serotonin pretty well. people who are your receptors are not binding to the serotonin. So those serotonins they're in your head floating around it just, your is not receiving it properly. So antidepressants kind of make your brain go, okay. Like this is serotonin bind to it. And then you feel that serotonin hit. So serotonin syndrome is like, Okay. I'm all antidepressants. And then I'm coming up the rollercoaster I'm, I'm, I'm soaring up, but then I also have an extra dosage of being able to bind to the serotonin. Now I have a lot of serotonin and I have a lot of like energy and I have a lot of feeling great about myself and, and then, and then it triggered me to go into another hypomanic episode.

Kristy Yee: 14:53

so then the drugs kind of made her worse then.

Angie Yu: 14:56

Yeah, exactly. So, because I, because that happened and I was talking to my therapist about it in hindsight, like three months after the fact, she was kind of like, okay. Cause I did bring it up before, like when she was just treating my depression. We talked about it And then she started giving me some strategies and coping with these manic States. And then we had a conversation and she was like, you know, I don't really like labels. I like to help people with whatever it is that they're experiencing. But in the industry, of course, people like to, you know, diagnose label to help you better. So she's like, yes. So I would like, I would classify this as a type of bipolar, but I'm not an expert. On this I can only help you with like, you know, CBT, which is cognitive behavioral therapy, which is like, if I'm feeling really high and I want to do something, then I step back and question myself, why do I want to do this? this was like in September. So she recommended me to a, a psychiatrist who specializes in bipolar. I wait about three months to actually get an appointment. And then I had that appointment. it was a really long appointment and it was with two psychiatrists. One was doing her residency and one had been helping bipolar patients for like 20 years. the session went off for nearly two hours and I was diagnosed with atypical, bipolar.

Kristy Yee: 16:18

When you walked out of that psychiatrist office that day with your shiny brand new label, what was that like for you?

Angie Yu: 16:29

Okay. Well, it was over zoom, so it was like when I click to leave me

Kristy Yee: 16:34

Oh my gosh. I, Oh, how did I not even think about

Angie Yu: 16:38

that's so, well, one, I guess, because I was at home, so it was less. Like, Oh, like, I didn't feel like lost or anything like that, but it felt different. I think, because I'm already like, well into my mental health journey, I wasn't like, Oh my God, what is happening? Like, I wasn't caught off guard because I had already done some research. I hadn't been talking to my therapist about it and I'm already aware of like how to deal with mental health issues and how to embrace mental health. So when, when I was diagnosed, I myself had less stigma towards mental health like different mood disorders, right. Because I'm more knowledgeable, I've been educated. So I didn't have that same reaction when I was diagnosed with depression. And I think the other aspect is like the bipolar made so much sense. Like the depression. Yeah. Like I also saw the similar like traits and whatever, but it didn't really explain a lot of other parts of my life.

Kristy Yee: 17:39

like, you knew that there was something more

Angie Yu: 17:41

Yeah. Yeah. Like I felt like there was something more to it.

Kristy Yee: 17:44

and then when you got diagnosed with a bipolar, it was almost like a ha so that's what it, like now everything makes

Angie Yu: 17:50

Yeah. when my got diagnosed with depression, it was also like, aha, everything makes sense. But then as time went on, it was like, okay. so it definitely helped me out of my depressive hole, but there's still other things in my life that it's not really covering.

Kristy Yee: 18:05

what were some of

Angie Yu: 18:06

one of the symptoms Of like I guess not symptoms. One of the side effects of being bipolar is that you tend to, you tend to lose a lot of people in your life. And it's because for people who aren't aware of their bipolar or for people who haven't quite grasped how to handle their bipolar, is that in my different moods. I lose control of my mood. I lose control of my temper, and sometimes this can create a lot of conflict. And when I'm in a hypomanic state, I want to do all these things and friends or family who are like, you shouldn't do this. Then I get angry because I'm like, why are you stopping me from being who I am? When in reality, they're just trying to protect me. So I've read a lot of blogs and stuff like that. people talking about the relationships that they've lost because of their bipolar. And when I was growing up I had a really, really difficult relationship with my mom when I was a teenager, but I thought that was normal. Cause it's like every

Kristy Yee: 19:13

yeah. angst. Everybody hates their

Angie Yu: 19:15

Exactly. And that's like, that's literally one of the things that they talk about, about being bipolar is that a lot of bipolar comes around the age of puberty. So it, because it coincides with something that's like really common, it's really hard to identify. Right. Like I used to get into these shouting matches with my mom and it's just like, well, a lot of teenage girls go through that with their mom. Like it's it's so Carmen, I guess the difference is that my mom became scared of me. Like she started walking on eggshells around me and

Kristy Yee: 19:45

can you give me an example?

Angie Yu: 19:46

I can't even, I don't even remember, like, I don't have any examples because I'm not aware when I'm doing those things.

Kristy Yee: 19:58

How did you know that mom was walking on eggshells then?

Angie Yu: 20:03

in hindsight,

Kristy Yee: 20:04

Good for her.

Angie Yu: 20:05

she told me like more recently when we started talking more about our emotions. Right. But I do remember like when I first started dating my ex she was like I know Angie has this temper. And it's one thing to be like, Oh yeah, like, ha she has a temper ha ha. You know, but it's like, she always labeled it as like this temper because it only comes out sometimes. And when it comes out, I don't even know that it's happening.

Kristy Yee: 20:36

when you say you don't even know, is it like a, like a blackout period you can't control it when it's happening? So you don't realize that you are being super mean?

Angie Yu: 20:51

Yes that the ladder unless somebody points it out

Kristy Yee: 20:57

Like, Hey Andy, you're being an asshole right

Angie Yu: 21:01

and I guess like, When my mom did pointed out, I don't know I was a teenager and I'm like, well, you're being an asshole to like seven. My mom never called me at school. She was just like, you're being difficult. I'm like, you're being difficult too like

Kristy Yee: 21:12

such a typical

Angie Yu: 21:13

exactly. So that's why it was like never a thing. Like. I didn't think anything different of it. My mom didn't think anything different events. and then as an adult, she would like tell people how difficult of a teenager I was. I was like I didn't, I didn't smoke. I didn't drink. I didn't do drugs. I didn't have unsafe sex. Like I thought I was a pretty good teenage. It's only in hindsight that I was like, okay, that kind of makes sense. And then with my last relationship there was one time where my ex brought up. He's like, sometimes I feel like you have this rage inside of you and I'm like, huh, what are you talking about? I'm such a nice person. I'm so easy going. And I'm so chill. And he's like, yeah, Yeah. Most of like most of the time, like 99% of time, but I feel like there's this rage inside of you. And I was just like, I don't know what that means. I guess, like, I don't know, I'm an angry Asian girl because like the world is unfair and stuff like that. We didn't really talk about it in too much detail because he didn't really have the knowledge. Right. And then at the end of the relationship when things were not going well, we were arguing a lot. this was like, Well, I guess we were talking about our relationship and he said, this kind of stuck with me because he said, when things are good, they're really good. And when things are bad, they're really bad. And at the time I'm just like, yeah, but that's all relationships are relationships have their up and down. And, and then, and then he kind of looked at me. He was like, sometimes I think you might be bipolar.

Kristy Yee: 22:46

he actually said bipolar.

Angie Yu: 22:48

and then of course in the moment I was like, I don't know. I just thought he was like saying that because I thought he was just being an asshole.

Kristy Yee: 22:56

and we weren't as educated, like you weren't as educated on what bipolar

Angie Yu: 22:59

yeah,

Kristy Yee: 22:59

felt

Angie Yu: 23:00

it felt like an attack. I felt like he was calling me crazy. After I was diagnosed by the psychiatrist. and then I started reading more blogs and more things about other people who talk about what it's like to live with bipolar and how that it's very often that you hurt the people closest to you. I cried a lot about how I've hurt my mom and I've hurt my previous relationships. I've hurt friends and I never mean to. But I have heard them, so it doesn't matter what my intentions are. Right. And of course I've also lost friends because of that too. because I would do things that at the time, I don't think anything of it. but in hindsight it either hurt them or it made them realize that they didn't want to be around someone that could hurt them again.

Kristy Yee: 23:58

When, when you made that connection or when that memory resurfaced, again, from what your ex had said to how soon did you make that connection And like what,

Angie Yu: 24:13

it was probably a couple of days because as soon as I finished that appointment and I was diagnosed and prescribed. Medication like mood stabilizers. I was like, okay, I'm going to do more reading about this. cause before that I was just doing some light reading. I'm like, okay, well, if it's something I have, I should know it really well. Especially since it's hereditary, it means that it's very likely my kids will have it especially daughters. So I want to make sure that they're properly educated as well. Right. So I started reading more There's one website that I've been reading a lot. it's called BP hope, which bipolar hope. So it's BP hope.com. We'll link it in the show notes. there was someone who wrote a blog about how she never realized that. These moments that she has hurt the people closest to her a lot. And how bipolar is literally known to be like, you tend to hurt the people closest to you It was just that sentence. Like you heard the people closest to you that made me go, Oh fuck. And then I made that connection. Yeah.

Kristy Yee: 25:17

For our poop troops out there who are listening to, you know, how Andrew you're describing ups and downs and how it felt like such a normal thing, like the way that you have conversations with mom and the way that, you know, relations ships have ups and downs with the people that you date for the people who are listening, who might feel like, Oh, I can identify. What would your advice be for people who might think like, do I have bipolar? Like, is this a thing for me?

Angie Yu: 25:50

Well, I think it's okay to question. especially if you're being self-aware right. So if you're questioning, Hey, are my moods affecting other people? Like, I think that's a positive thing. I just hope that you don't go into this rabbit hole and start diagnosing yourselves because that can be dangerous. So one of the biggest of bipolar is that the less sleep you get, the more energetic you become.

Kristy Yee: 26:15

That is not me

Angie Yu: 26:16

Yeah. Remember, remember when I was telling you about, I think this was either in like episode. Three or episodes six. and I was saying how, like, there was this period of time where I was like barely sleeping, but I have like, I'm just like having the time of my life.

Kristy Yee: 26:29

Yeah. And you were like out drinking and like partying and like, you know, having sex everywhere.

Angie Yu: 26:39

Yeah. I mean, that's not true, but yeah, like basically like engaging in all this activity where it was very out of character for

Kristy Yee: 26:46

Like you felt like you were just living life. were just riding this high and you're like, I'm just gonna do me and I'm going to do all the things that I want to do.

Angie Yu: 26:56

a very definitive What do you call that? A definitive symptom of hypomania. And if I kept going, it could have escalated to. A full manic episode. especially since drugs and alcohol can really like push people with bipolar into those moods.

Kristy Yee: 27:15

Like if like whole

Angie Yu: 27:20

That's right. so that's one of the symptoms is just like your body.

Kristy Yee: 27:26

We're not scientists.

Angie Yu: 27:28

Another telltale is if you have a family history of mental health diagnoses or mood disorders that's also the case. women often are more susceptible to bipolar, too. I have no idea that that was just a study that some scientists did back in 2003.

Kristy Yee: 27:46

I wonder, I wonder if maybe instead of women being more susceptible, women are just diagnosed more help and treatment, or like willing to talk to people about shit. You know what I'm saying? Like, there's that

Angie Yu: 28:00

yeah, I actually can see I actually believe that so there's, there's also that there's also, basically for me when, when I'm in an elevator mood, I think I can do anything in the world

Kristy Yee: 28:16

that sounds like, like. Drugs to me, like when, when, the way you describe it, I'm like, that sounds like I'm just riding on this real big. Hi, and I am flying on a cloud of unicorns and you know what I'm

Angie Yu: 28:31

Like actually, like, you feel like you

Kristy Yee: 28:34

feels

epi 20 - kristys raw audio: 28:34

like

Angie Yu: 28:34

spy. Like that's how much of a grant, like the, they call it the grandiose. Like you have thoughts of grandiose city. I don't know how to pronounce it properly, but like, Grandiosity. Yeah, you think you can, like, I don't know, like do all these different things where normally you would be like a gnat. That's crazy. You know, and, but the, the dangerous part is, is that you might engage in things that are very risky, like impulsive spending, unprotected sex. Risky things like abandoning your day-to-day life to do something that you think you can do. so that's when you're at your high and if you're a full blown, manic episodes, then there's psychosis episodes, which is where you're hearing things that are not there or seeing things that are not there. in the low, the low depression. Point is very similar to normal depression where you are so melancholy that you think the world sucks and everything sucks and you suck. And there's no point in living which also happens at the manic episode too, because you're like, well, it doesn't matter if I die. That's how I felt when I was in my elevator. Moods doesn't matter if I die when I'm in my low moods, maybe also doesn't matter if I die. And that's where the danger comes from because people with bipolar, like the, the mood disorder of being bipolar has the highest suicide rate amongst all the mood disorders more than depression. Because again, the highs are so high that the depression feels lower

Kristy Yee: 30:05

further

Angie Yu: 30:06

exactly. Yeah. The drop is further.

Kristy Yee: 30:13

this?

Angie Yu: 30:14

I, I told her over the phone.

Kristy Yee: 30:16

like ring, ring, yo, what's up mom. Guess

Angie Yu: 30:19

well, I texted her because I'm like, I, I did both like a voice. Well, at the time, like I already told her about my depression. Right. and I was like, Oh, by the way, like, it was like, by the way, I'm bipolar. at this point I think she just like wanted me to be okay. She just wanted make sure that I got the help I needed So I like looked up bipolar and Chinese I don't remember.

Kristy Yee: 30:47

Google

Angie Yu: 30:47

Okay. on. Let me Google translate it's called. It's all you Jen, which literally translates to manic depression. Yeah, I don't, I don't know how to, I don't, I don't know what it is in Cantonese. and I remember like telling her that, and I guess she did some of her own research and she was just like, Okay. yep. Makes sense.

Kristy Yee: 31:11

I'm thinking right now, like stereotypes and misunderstanding, and like me thinking about Brittany Spears and, and you previously associating the word crazy right? So, what are some of the things you would say to these stereotypes and these misrepresentation of what bipolar is?

Angie Yu: 31:30

I think, I think the stereotypes and the stigma comes from the fact that people who aren't familiar with bipolar don't know what to make of it. Right. They're like, Oh, how can you be so happy at one moment? It's so sad. The other moment.

epi 20 - kristys raw audio: 31:44

Mm

Angie Yu: 31:44

I was reading about the history of bipolar. it goes back like super far, like super, super ancient. So the ancient Greeks and the ancient Romans came up with the words, mania and melancholy. So that that's, that has nothing to do with, with bipolar. That's just like different sides of the spectrum of moods. And it was actually Aristotle who attributed mania. he thanked mania for being the source of all these artists and poets and writers and just like creative people. He said that mania is like a source of those creativity, which is true because people in their manic States are very creative.

Kristy Yee: 32:27

And there's so much to express. I'm thinking like there's so much emotions, feelings you're riding on this high, or you're riding on this low that there's like, it's gotta come out

Angie Yu: 32:39

extreme on both sides. It's extreme happiness and extreme sadness. And when you express them, you express out this type of creativity. And I remember experiencing that. I was writing a lot when I was experience all this, I haven't. Written anything since going on medication, because I don't have that same kind of inspiration as I used to because I, I remember Steve No, he was like, Hey Angie, like, what's your routine for writing? What's your inspiration for writing? And I'm like, I don't have one. It'll just click in my head. I'll sit down. And two hours later I've written something. You get into this flow and people have talked about the creative flow and that's still normal, but for me, it just comes out of nowhere. It's not like I've sat there for four hours trying to get into the flow. And then the flow comes. It just comes out of nowhere. And then boom, I run something and I have no idea how to do that again.

Kristy Yee: 33:34

Doesn't

Angie Yu: 33:37

Yes. But flow usually comes from practice. Like you're already sat down, working. work. So you start working

Kristy Yee: 33:44

then you get

Angie Yu: 33:45

the flow Yeah. Whereas for me the flow just

Kristy Yee: 33:48

like you're taking a shit and then boom, the flow comes and you're get in front of a laptop now you like wipe your ass and you go to the laptop,

Angie Yu: 33:55

It almost feels like a little bit of a superpower. And when I started reading more about bipolar I'm reading people's blogs, there's something called the manic trap is when people chase this feeling and chase this ability to be extra expressive and extra

Kristy Yee: 34:10

Um, because not only is it a high, but you're actually, you could be more productive, more creative, you're doing more things and people like that. And they want

Angie Yu: 34:21

so it is kind of like a drug and people try to chase this. But the thing is all those times when I did experience a high, the depression that followed was really bad sucked Yeah. And so there are, all these like literature out there that says why you shouldn't chase it because it's dangerous. And it is dangerous and I can totally see during my manic period how dangerous it was. And if I didn't have the kind of support system that I do have, like, I don't know where I would be.

Kristy Yee: 34:53

when you swing between the different States, do you have control over, like, I'm going to, I decide that tomorrow I'm gonna go into my manic

Angie Yu: 35:02

Oh, absolutely not. for me, a trigger would be not sleeping properly.

Kristy Yee: 35:09

Hmm. Got they'll like purposely put themselves into a situation where it can be triggered, but knowing that the fall is going to be quite detrimental, but they're willing to do it because the highest so good. like

Angie Yu: 35:25

yes,

Kristy Yee: 35:25

Right. It's like, they know there's a consequence. I shouldn't be taking drugs, but the highest soul God that it doesn't matter. Like I'm willing to do that, which, and drugs in itself, very risky business

Angie Yu: 35:38

Yeah. And you know, what's the funny thing is that I don't really do drugs and I've never really done drugs. And people would be like, Oh, like, have you ever tried this? Or have you ever tried that? I'm like, no, I don't think I need it. That was always my response. I'm like, I don't think I need it. Like, I, I feel like I'm like already tripping most of the time where like I'm already, so like whatever, most of the time I'm like, I don't think I need it.

Kristy Yee: 36:01

you think because of the mania Like why you don't need it because you're already high.

Angie Yu: 36:08

Yeah. I think so I'm already high and if it just makes me even more high than I'm just like no

Kristy Yee: 36:16

And so is there medication to help manage bipolar

Angie Yu: 36:20

I think when I was reading about the history of it, there's like been good times for people with bipolar and bad times for people with bipolar the bad

Kristy Yee: 36:27

depending on where the timeline in

Angie Yu: 36:30

So the bad times was obvious. Like people thought that these people with bipolar what possessed, right. Especially people with bipolar one, cause they're seeing things and hearing things. So they literally thought people were possess so that they would be, I don't know, like what is it called when they de possess people? okay. And like people would just be euthanized or like, I don't know if we're into the river. and they're, they're the good times. I think I forget, I feel like this is also the Romans, but I could be wrong. They would just make these people take baths because there was something called lithium salt in these baths. And even to this day, people

Kristy Yee: 37:11

element salt

Angie Yu: 37:17

Okay. and now like to this day people with classic bipolar they are treated with lithium. atypical bipolar, like myself were treated with both ends depressants and mood stabilizers. And I say, mood stabilizer, because that's the less stigmatized phrase. The actual medication is anti-psychotic, which sounds scary. And when the psychiatrist first mentioned it, she's like, Oh, this is a mood stabilizer. And I was like, okay, that sounds great. Mood stabilizer. That sounds great. And then she's like, yeah, it's like an anti-psychotic. And I was like, Oh, and in that moment I did find myself like being really terse.

Kristy Yee: 37:53

okay. It's it's amazing how. Our choice of words has effect on how we think about Because when you say mood stabilizer, you're like, great. Hook me up. And then when you say anti-psychotic, you're like, Whoa, I'm not psychotic. I'm not crazy. Like, are you going to give me drugs? Because you think I'm crazy. And then why am I not going to be who I am? I'm just going to be a shell version of myself because I'm being all drugged up by your That was my stereotype. I just literally verbalized all my stereotypes. I word vomited it.

Angie Yu: 38:26

verbalize the first thoughts that went through my head. Those were my thoughts. Exactly. Those thoughts, because it was all stigma, stigma, stigma, stigma. of course I was just like, I didn't say anything. Right. I was just like, okay, well obviously I'm going to sit on it and think about it. but she the psychiatrist, she was like, so positive. She's like, yeah, we'll get you some anti-psychotic to, you know, basically the antidepressant is to raise the floor of my mood. And the anti-psychotic is to push down the ceiling of my mood. So it keeps me at a good medium. So I'm still like the same person. Like you can see my, my personality. I'm still very like raw and stuff like that. I don't think it's taken away any of my personality, are definitely more medium.

Kristy Yee: 39:12

in a place where you're not putting yourself or people around you in danger, in a place where you're not, you know, going days with just like three hours of sleep and still riding that high, like. I can't be healthy for

Angie Yu: 39:29

thing is like, during that period of time, even though I was only getting a few hours of sleep a night and I still had all this energy. But I couldn't concentrate. I couldn't focus at work because when you don't sleep, still can't do those things. I had energy, but I didn't have focus. I had, I had like bigger, but I didn't have a memory. Like short-term memory was really bad and like all those things because that's affected by sleep. fucking important guys.

Kristy Yee: 39:59

I'm going to go back a little bit. We talked about how your ex was one of the first few people who had mentioned even the word bipolar. that relationship didn't go well. How did you first tell your current boyfriend about your diagnosis and what are some strategies for the, both of you

Angie Yu: 40:18

Yeah, actually, that's a great question. the short answer is communication. The long answer is well on our second date We were sitting on my couch and we were just talking and I was like, I'm going to be completely like transparent with you. I might be bipolar. It's something that I've only learned about myself recently, but I can see it being probably very true. and I told him that straight up and he was like, I really appreciate you telling me that. And I was like, okay. And I thought he was just being polite. Right. And I think after a few more dates and also because this was COVID dating, it was like, we became exclusive very fast. Cause I'm like

Kristy Yee: 40:57

one by mom by Christie. That's actually what happened

Angie Yu: 41:06

I was like, I was like I don't know how you feel about this whole thing, but I'm

Kristy Yee: 41:10

like I

Angie Yu: 41:11

like we should only be seeing one person at a time. He's like, yeah. Yeah. so, and then I was asking him, I was like, Oh, like at what moment did you think? Like, Hey, I, I would want to be in a relationship with this person. So we exchanged our examples and his. First example was the fact that I told him about my bipolar on our second date. And I was like, really? He's like, yeah, he said he really appreciated that. And I was like, okay. And then ever since then, it's just all about communication. Like I remember actually it was more recent, like obviously at first when everything's like, feel so great. I literally like, felt like I was higher. Right. And I told him that and I was like, yeah, like I just feel everything more intensely, like good things. I feel like it's fantastic. Bad things. Even if it's really minor, I feel like it's the end of the world. And I don't know, he's just been so good at listening when it happens, because I'm more aware of it now, I just ramble about it and he listens and he understands. And the other week I snapped at him, it was that bipolar irritability that came in and I just snapped at him. And the first thing he said was, why are you yelling at me? And I was like, I'm yelling at you. I'm not yelling. He's like, yes, you are yelling. I'm like, Oh my God, I'm so sorry. The guy didn't even realize I was yelling at him. called me out and I felt shitty about the next day I woke up. I'm like staring at him, waiting for him to wake up. wakes

Kristy Yee: 42:33

creepy.

Angie Yu: 42:38

I was like on my phone reading about. Like bipolar anger again. And as soon as he wakes up, I'm sure he was like, that was not the first thing he wanted to do when he woke up. But I'm like, okay. So about yesterday when I snapped at you, he's like what I saw right away. I explained to him what happened. And I'm like, even though, like, there was a reason behind it, it's not an excuse. So I appreciate you calling me on it. Please. Don't stop calling me out on it.

Kristy Yee: 43:04

In fact, I think just from our whole conversation today, you need someone to call out when you're being an asshole when you're being mean. And when you're in that state, because you don't know when you're in that state. And I think. In the past, before we were able to better understand what was going on, the people that you loved and the people around you, they were tiptoeing because they knew that there was this rage, as you know, your ex had put it, or this temper that your mom had put it, you know, there's something that was in you. And everybody felt like it's some bomb that could go off any minute. So people were really tiptoeing around that, thinking that that was. What was best for you and best for everybody in the relationship, but really what it actually did was hold a lot of tension in that relationship. And over time, that tension ruins that beautiful relationship that you had in the first place, because it made everybody uncomfortable. And you don't know when you're doing something that is assholey right. So your current boyfriend now, he's just like edgy, you're being, you're being an asshole. need that.

Angie Yu: 44:12

And I've lost friends like that too Like when I know what I'm being, and the thing is like, it turns into resentment, especially like things that you don't communicate and the person keeps doing it. But they don't know that it's upsetting you. That just turns into resentment,

Kristy Yee: 44:26

Especially because like, they love you. And so they put up with it, feel like that's what's in so many roles whether this is a dating relationship like a romantic relationship or a familiar relationship or a platonic relationship it doesn't matter because when you care about another human being you want what's best for them But you also know that in any relationship there's ups and downs. So people just put up with another person's bullshit. When in reality, yes, there are ups and downs, but that's why you got to call each other out and talk to each other about it and be like, you're being an asshole, you know? And I think also on the other hand, like as someone who has bipolar, I think it's important to communicate that as well. Not only because it makes you more of an attractive girlfriend potential, but it's also, it's also like, Hey, I need this. Like, I. When I am being an asshole, I don't know I'm being an asshole and I need someone to call me out on it. And so when you don't realize that yourself, you don't know that you need to ask that from other people

Angie Yu: 45:26

that's really well put. And that's why I like tout therapy. That's why I'm such an advocator for therapy, because it can honestly improve your relationships, not only with other people, but also with yourself.

Kristy Yee: 45:46

Also point out that those relationships that you had lost. Sure. Some of it might be because. Of the bipolar because of how you behave and how you had acted because you were being an asshole. But I also think that part of it is from the other side as well, like, because they were tiptoeing because they were putting up with your shit. Right, right. And they weren't communicating on their end about it. They were walking on eggshells. Like they, they didn't know what to do and that's perfectly fine. dunno, ask or be open about open about it and say like, yo, you're being really unreasonable right now. Like what's going on? help?

Angie Yu: 46:19

Which is why communication is so important because if the other person's being an asshole, you gotta tell them. then to them, they probably don't think they're being an asshole. And this is not just for people with bipolar. This is for everybody. Right?

Kristy Yee: 46:32

Yo, I did not realize that the takeaway episode I'm today, we're going to talk about bipolar disorder and it turns out to be like call each other out

Angie Yu: 46:40

Yeah Yeah. You can not resent someone for something you've never communicated I don't know, because in Chinese culture, we're just, everything's just rise on expectations. And there's so little communication and communication, but massive amounts of expectations. So it can create a lot of problems. So again, therapy, therapy, therapy, therapy.

Kristy Yee: 47:15

Before we wrap up. I want to ask you a question, cause I know your mom was super woke, so I'm not surprised that she took it really well. When you told her what

Angie Yu: 47:26

I don't know because my mom told him and he hasn't like brought it up ever. typical. Yeah. I don't think he understands, so he just goes, okay, and also my dad does still quite doesn't understand what therapy is. So how I tried to explain it to him, I'm like, okay, compare mental health to physical health. Right. So a counselor would be like an RMT, right? Let's say you pulled your back doing some exercises. So now there's trauma on your back. So you're like, you don't know what, like it's sore. I'm going to go to the arm to try to get that knot out. Right. So I feel like if something traumatic happens, like you lose a loved one or a relationship ends badly or something like that, and you need that extra emotional massaging. Then you can go to a counselor. It's the same thing. Like they're trying to get that knocked out. But if you have something that's very, long-term like an old injury, that's still bothering you. That's very psychological, you know, it's recommended you go see a therapist for that. Something that's has long lasting effects. Just like, I don't know if you injured your knee when you were like, I don't know. And it was a bad injury. You still got to go to. Go seek help for it. The professional help you with seek would be a physio and I would equate a physio to it. Therapist, because they're trying help you manage it on a day-to-day basis. a physio will teach you stretches and exercises that can alleviate this pain, right? Because that pain is not going anywhere. You're stuck with that pain. Now, same thing with the emotional pain, your psychologist, is going to try to help you alleviate that pain on a day-to-day basis. And then let's say you break a bone or something. They need you to go to the doctor cause you're going to need drugs for that

Kristy Yee: 49:05

and sometimes you need all three of those folks on your team at once. And sometimes you just want one of them. Nice. Nicely put. That is a good way to wrap up for today's episode. But before we do that, we're also going to read out another one of our feel good comments. I think that's what we're going to call it. Feel good I like that feel good comments.

Angie Yu: 51:00

Wow. thank you, to this member of our poop troop. I'm also Newfoundland rural Newfoundland. That's amazing. I kind of I want to hear that story That's w so I want to know where a Newfoundland because 700 people Wow That's just so so so different I bet their perspective on life is is just so different provide more value to our perspective.

Kristy Yee: 51:25

And honestly like, yeah, Angie and I were Chinese Canadians. We market this podcast as for people who are a part of the Asian diaspora, but really this comment. It makes me feel like, like, of course we welcome anybody to listen to our podcasts. and it's amazing to hear that, not only are we shedding light on being uncomfortable and being vulnerable and saying that that's okay to do on the fucking internet, but we're also teaching other people about our own cultures as well. And, I think that's super, super cool.

Angie Yu: 51:58

I think so, too. Yeah.

Kristy Yee: 51:59

not like We're like, let's start a podcast so that white people And I

Angie Yu: 52:05

and I think that's the, beauty of us being humans that we embrace each other as humans. And the thing is like, My coworkers, listen to our podcast every week and there'll be like, Oh yeah, like I totally get this. I totally relate to this. And neither of them are Asian. And it just seeing that like, Hey yeah, like we have an Asian podcast because whatever we talk about, there's an Asian spin to it because we're Asian. But at the end of the day, like a lot of things we talk about is just the human condition and we all relate to it. And. Talking about this stuff would just make us a better human.

Kristy Yee: 52:40

so thank you so much, Jay. For sending this in

Angie Yu: 52:43

glad that we can like retain people's focus and attention. That's like

Kristy Yee: 52:47

because we ramble.

Angie Yu: 52:49

Like that's, that's so like heartwarming to know that we're like doing an okay job. And just like FYI, like we do put a lot of my friend to cut the stuff that we think is mumble, jumble.

Kristy Yee: 53:03

most of the time, our episodes are somewhere between 45 to like an hour 15. And we would probably talk for over two hours.

Angie Yu: 53:12

yeah. That episode where it was an hour and 15 and we cut it down from like 200 hours.

Kristy Yee: 53:18

All right. Thank you so much for joining us today.

Angie Yu: 53:20

Thank you, everyone for listening to my story.

Kristy Yee: 53:24

if you guys have any questions or you want to talk more about Andrew's experience as a recent day, no seed diagnoser more about this shit, Drop us an email at shit. We don't tell mom@gmail.com and follow us on Instagram at shit. We don't tell mom. Okay. Bye.