Timed Feedings Vs On Demand

Do you feed on demand?

Or do you feed on a schedule?

How do timed feeds impact breastfeeding?  Tune in to find out.

If you are a new listener, we would love to hear from you.  Please consider leaving us a review on itunes or sending us an email with your suggestions and comments to badassbreastfeedingpodcast@gmail.com

WE HAVE TRANSCRIPTS!!  You can also add your email to our list and have episodes sent right to your inbox!

Things we talked about:

Feeding on demand VS. the weight issues overall [4:58]

What is feeding on demand? [6:07]

What is feeding on a schedule? [6:37]

Our scheduled culture [10:14]

Busy maternity leave [13:39]

What schedules do to milk supply [20:01]

Storage capacity [21:53]

Learning how to regulate feeds [23:35]

Educating others [27:39]

Letting go  [30:37]

*This Episode is sponsored by Original Sprout and Niki’s Natural Wipes

Links to information we discussed or episodes you should check out!

https://badassbreastfeedingpodcast.com/episode/how-much-milk-do-your-breasts-hold/

https://www.diannecassidyconsulting.com/2021/06/18/why-feeding-on-demand-is-important-for-breastfeeding/

https://www.diannecassidyconsulting.com/2021/04/21/is-it-low-milk-supply-or-small-storage-capacity/

Set up your consultation with Dianne

https://badassbreastfeedingpodcast.com/consultations/     

Check out Dianne’s blog here~

https://diannecassidyconsulting.com/milklytheblog/

Don’t Forget!!  Dianne and Abby have started the new parenting podcast!  Check out Revolution Parenting!  

https://www.buzzsprout.com/1755123/8400508

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Here is how you can connect with Dianne and Abby~

• Abby Theuring  https://www.thebadassbreastfeeder.com
• Dianne Cassidy http://www.diannecassidyconsulting.com

Music we use~

Music: "Levels of Greatness" from "We Used to Paint Stars in the Sky (2012)" courtesy of Scott Holmes at freemusicarchive.org/music/Scott Holmes

Transcript

dianne (00:20):

[inaudible] hi, Welcome to the badass breastfeeding podcast. It's Dianne, your lactation consultant,

 abby (00:25):

And I'm Abby. The badass breastfeeder. And today's episode is brought to you by Niki's natural wipes. The first all natural baby wipes made with menuca honey and coconut oil. Today's episode is also brought to you by original sprout. Original sprout carries, safe, effective, and pediatrician tested shampoos, conditioners, styling, and body care products. We'll hear more from our sponsors later, but we want you to know that these sponsors make this podcast possible. And if you can head to badassbreastfeedingpodcast.com, you can check out our sponsor page and see if you need anything. And if you can give them any of your business, and while you're there, you can scroll down and enter your email address, and we'll send episodes straight to your inbox every Monday. And right now, Dianne has our review Of the week.

dianne (01:09):

and it comes from a new listener who sent us an email at badassbreastfeedingpodcast@gmail.com. And she said, hello, first, let me say, thank you for your content. I'm a first time mom aged 35 and I'm breastfeeding My son. No one in my family has breastfed. So naturally there's judgment, passive shaming going on about my decision. My son is 10 weeks and I thought I selected a good pediatrician, but she like many doctors isn't supportive of breastfeeding. My son Isn't what she calls, which is what she wants to see a fat, chunky baby at each visit. She tells me and my husband about how he's not in the recommended percentile. and whips out the growth chart. Today I ran across your podcast and episode on growth charts and percentiles. He's currently 10 pounds, five ounces. As of Saturday, he was born seven pounds, five ounces on March 20th. He's a tall, long baby for my husband and my family's genetics, and the anatomy scans and conducted. He's going to be a tall boy. His femur is extremely long. Thank you for helping me take pressure out of my mindset. As a mom, who's worried her baby isn't getting enough, but produces ample wet diapers. I was becoming overwhelmed. My husband and I have told the pediatrician he's gaining, not losing. As an Afro-Latina, I already feel doctors will always find something wrong with my child, but I thank you too, for your candidness. It helps moms like me realize that we aren't doing anything wrong. Please keep the content coming. It's really helpful. Wishing you too all the best. I wanted to cry when I read this.

 abby (02:40):

Yeah. I mean, why do we, I feel like there's so many ridiculous things out there. I feel like sometimes they're just looking for a problem.

dianne (02:48):

Yeah. And she obviously knows that because she said, I always feel like, you know, that they're always going to scrutinize what I do anyway. Well

 abby (02:57):

Then thank you for pointing out the racism that obviously this person experiences personally, in the healthcare system and it was so deeply ingrained and people say, you know, that people report all the time that they're being discriminated against and how, how awful and difficult it must be to go up against that all the time when parenting is already so stressful.

dianne (03:20):

So I am so glad that she found us. Thank you so much for letting us know that we have helped you. That meant the world to me. And it seriously did touch me when I read this. Um, because I just, I hate that's one of my biggest, probably one of my biggest pet peeves with the breastfeeding is that mothers, parents are constantly told that their child doesn't look the way they're supposed to or doesn't weigh what they should or, you know, and that is my, that, you're not just saying, okay, we don't think your child is doing well. You're also saying you're not doing well as a parent and that's not fair. And I just, I hate it. So I'm really glad that you found that episode because I think it was perfect for what you needed and I'm so glad you reached out. So thank you. And you're doing an amazing job. I don't care what anybody else says.

 abby (04:10):

We're obsessed with weight.

dianne (04:11):

We are.

 abby (04:12):

From the Beginning. I mean, in the beginning, it's like, you're not fat enough. And then you get older and then you're too fat. And it's just like an obsession about weight constantly when like it's shown over and over again, that it is not an indicator at all of Health.

dianne (04:28):

I had somebody tell me that the other day that her baby isn't chunky, like her nieces and nephews. And I'm like, it's, he's perfect.

 abby (04:37):

He's not going to be, yeah. You look at weight alone. It does nothing. It gives you zero information about a person, A baby or an adult.

dianne (04:44):

Look how early It starts. The diet culture. Yeah. Right. Hate it. It's a whole different topic.

 abby (04:52):

sort of. I mean,

dianne (04:53):

Well, yeah,

 abby (04:56):

It's just not what we're talking about today.

dianne (04:58):

And it kind of, it almost kind of like maybe it's into it, right. Like feeds into it a little bit, feeding on demand and scheduled feeds and weight gain and all of that stuff. So that's why we're doing this episode today. I just wrote a blog on this a couple of weeks ago. So, or maybe it was even last week. So it's very, very fresh in my mind. And it is something that I've been like, I feel like I've been pushing a lot more recently. I don't feel like maybe even a year ago, I was saying so much of feed on demand, feed on demand, feed on demand. I don't know if it's just like falling to the wayside now and I have to push it back in or what, but I feel like it's just something I've been talking about a lot more.

 abby (05:40):

Yeah. I mean, I don't know. I feel like things circulate right in the, in the conversation and um, you know, what's being put out there by other like medical places and other big blogs and stuff like that, that people get influenced by. Cause we all do. And how these conversations circulate. I don't know.

dianne (06:07):

It's just so first of all, let's explain the difference between feeding on demand and timed feeds because people might not, people might be doing one and not even realize what they're doing. They're just like, this is what we settled into. I didn't realize that I settled into doing something specific. Right? So feeding on demand is just kind of following your baby's cues. You know, they look like they want to go on and feed, you put them on and feed. It doesn't matter that they fed an hour and a half ago. You just you're following their cues.

 abby (06:35):

And just when in doubt, whip it out.

dianne (06:37):

There you Go. Feeding on a schedule is up every three hours, feed your baby or every, you know, it doesn't matter what they seem to be doing. It doesn't matter if they just ate and they want to go on again, you can't feed them. You have to wait that three hours, which is what a lot of the books say. A lot of those, um, like baby wise and stuff like that. I'm totally calling out.

 abby (07:02):

A lot of pediatricians too.

dianne (07:04):

Yeah. Oh, well, why are you feeding the baby so frequently? You shouldn't be doing that because a lot of times, and I feel for these parents, they'll go to their pediatrician and be like, I'm exhausted. The baby feeds all the time. And I just feel like, you know, and they say, oh, but at his age he shouldn't be feeding like that anymore. Put them on a schedule or I've parents that are at, you know, the baby is three weeks old and they're saying, well, there's really no schedule. I don't have a schedule yet. I don't, I don't have a schedule for the baby. The baby doesn't care about a fricking schedule.

 abby (07:35):

No. And I, I think this is where like the bottle-feeding culture comes in. Right? Because you want a schedule,

dianne (07:42):

You just fall into it. Cause you have so much control over their feeds.

 abby (07:46):

Well, right. But I mean, you Also like kind of need to like, wouldn't you, if you were bottle feeding, you would follow a schedule more.

dianne (07:55):

Oh yeah. And that's usually what I tell parents. Like, because this comes up when I have parents that are feeding on demand and getting ready to go back to work and then they're panicking because they're like, oh my God, well, the baby feeds on demand. How are we going to do this? And I want to get into my whole spiel about how ridiculous it is that we have to send parents back to work so early when their baby is still feeding on demand, but that's futile. So I usually end up telling them, you know what, your baby will probably get into a regular feeding routine once they're in a daycare situation or a childcare situation, because they just can't help it. You know? I mean, a stranger in a daycare has a schedule.

 abby (08:40):

The daycare has a schedule.

dianne (08:41):

Even if it's a grandparent, that's watching your baby, a family member. They don't know your baby like you do. So they're not going to know the cues. They're not going to really know how to feed them on demand. So they are going to end up and they want a schedule too, cause they don't want to do wrong. Well, how often should I feed the baby? When should I feed the baby? And it's like, they just, I don't know. They just feed them when they seem hungry that doesn't work for people. They want a concrete number. So your baby usually ends up getting it on more of a schedule when you have to go back to work and you have to have more of a structured routine. But if you are just feeding your baby on demand, that is the best thing for your baby. It is totally the best thing for your baby. And we will talk about why that is and all the benefits to feeding on demand. The other thing I want to say about the scheduled feeds and I'll probably be, I don't know, burned at the stake for saying this. I hate those freaking apps I hate them. And I know that they're helpful for people. I do. I know that it's really helpful for people to remember, like when they fed last and you know, all of that stuff and the doctors always ask, well, how often is the baby feeding? And you know how many times, especially like your first couple appointments, how many times was the baby feeding, blah, blah, blah. But I hate them because people like live and die by those things, oh, I didn't push the button. I didn't push the button. And they're like, you know, looking for their phone and have to record every single time. And here's when I fed all the, all the times that I've fed. And it's like, oh my gosh, just listen to your baby. We waste so much time.

 abby (10:14):

You don't Need to do that. You don't need to do it, but I it's so much of the culture that we live in now with everything is being, you know, recorded. There's an app for everything. There's a schedule for everything. And we're completely overwhelmed. We're overwhelmed by things that, um, are this, the other thing about feeding on demand is like where we are designed to like have a baby and then lay around with that baby for like months to just like lay around and nurse the baby. But we don't live in a culture that like allows for that. So you still have to keep up if you have to either go back to work or even just to take care of all the other kids and the house and all the other responsibilities that just don't that aren't that go against like what the biology asks, which is for you to just lay around and feed the baby or nurse the baby, you know, because again, feeding or breastfeeding is so much more than food, you know, it's not, that's the thing I think that gets confusing is just like, well, when's the last time they ate. It's like, I don't, they've been latched on for eight hours, man. I don't know. They're like eating and then sleeping and then let it, but they never let go. You know? So, um, it just gets confusing. And when our culture is just like, so counter to all of that, and then let's schedule everything with an app and then let's, we gotta get moving. We gotta get going. We gotta be multitasking. We have to be doing all of these things that just work against what we're actually designed to do with our babies.

dianne (11:43):

I mean, we're primates first and foremost, you know, like you're supposed to have your baby in close proximity to you. You're supposed to just feed on demand. that's how things are supposed to be. And it's exhausting as a, as a new parent. Sometimes the last thing you want is that baby attached to you all the time. Like, absolutely. But that's how they're designed and there's not a whole lot we can do about that.

 abby (12:08):

Right? Well, well, because in, you know, in, you know, more village type settings or whatever throughout human history, there's been more than one person tending to the people. Absolutely. It wasn't just like you, someone had a baby and then they were like over there, over there by themselves for months on end, you know, there were like people around, it was like a, you know, a community setting where people were taking care of each other and babies and the and the bigger kids and the, and that's not now, we're just, it's just you and your house by yourself. And so again, that's just completely counter to what we are designed actually to do with Our babies. I.

dianne (12:56):

t's really, it's really crazy. You know, it's really crazy.

 abby (13:01):

Yeah. Yeah. And that's people get overwhelmed and like, I can't figure this out and this isn't working and I'm so, oh, I'm so stressed and I'm overwhelmed and it's like, you know, it's not. Yeah.

dianne (13:13):

And then you have society saying things like, oh, your baby's feeding again. Are they not getting enough milk? Oh your baby, shouldn't be feeding every two hours. Or you maybe shouldn't be feeding every hour, hour and a half. Why, why are they doing that? They must not be getting enough. Right? Oh yeah. They're using you as a pacifier.

 abby (13:30):

Yeah. And why are you being so lazy and laying on a couch all day? Would you laid on the couch all day? Okay. God, how could you do that?

dianne (13:39):

What are you thinking? I love it when people like are, are, um, they haven't had their baby yet, but they have, you know, they're, they're about to go out on maternity leave and they have all these plans for maternity leave, you know? Like, and I've had people tell me, like even colleagues, people that I know know better that are like, oh my God, I was going to do so much on maternity leave. And I did nothing. That's what you're supposed to do. Yeah. It's ridiculous that we even have a maternity leave, but you're supposed to do nothing on that maternity leave. You're not supposed to be building jungle gyms and reading 18 books and doing all those things. Like it just

 abby (14:24):

Yeah. Well and everyone else and no one and people who haven't been there, um, think it's vacation. Yeah. Oh, you just get, you're going to get a vacation. You're going to be on vacation for three months or six weeks or not at all, whatever your job says. Um, like as if taking care of a baby is a vacation, I know, but this just highlights. How much of a misunderstanding and how much terrible information there is about babies and what we're supposed to be doing with them.

dianne (14:57):

It's just, it's crazy. It's crazy. And the ones, you know, who suffers is the baby. So.

 abby (15:04):

yeah. And the parent.

dianne (15:04):

And the baby can't speak for themselves, you know? And the parents just kind of is like going along with whatever society is telling them. But one of the, one of the benefits to feeding on demand is... Like Abby just said, there's so much more to breastfeeding than food and feeding on demand. When you respond to your baby, you are helping to strengthen their attachment, their brain development, their psychological stability, all of that is affected by feeding on demand. I mean, just think about it, your baby cries, you pick them up and you nurture them, right. How much are you doing for your child? Like, there's nothing else that your child needs, but that, and that's what happens when you respond to them. Like, oh, it's not time yet. It's not time yet. We can't do this yet. And then they're kind of like, they don't know what time it is, you know? Like they, they don't know. So that is the biggest thing to feeding on demand

 abby (16:13):

Your Body is more, it's breastfeeding is so much more than food and your body is the only environment that they're acclimated to. They're born and then supposed to be with you, held by you or somebody. Um, and when they're not, they're in, They're in distress, You know, they're designed and wired to be close and be touched and held by people. And that's, that doesn't mean you can't go to the bathroom Or something, although I know you all hold it until you're going to die. I know. I know, But that's not what that means. You know, you can put them down sometimes that was the other thing about feeding on demand. Or I think it's confusing is like, oh my God, you know, like I can't, I have to, I'm feeding on demand and breastfeeding all the time and I can't take a shower or pee or, you know, take a walk around the block and like, yeah, you can. It doesn't mean that the baby has to be attached to like 24 7. No, they just want to be, they want to be able to do it when you, you know, when you can

dianne (17:18):

And respond to them when they need you. Right. That's it. That's all you gotta do, but let's talk about our capitalism. And then we're going to talk about what feeding on demand does for your milk supply.

 abby (17:28):

Oh, awesome. All right. We'll be right back. Today's episode is brought to you by Niki's natural wipes. Niki's was created out of the passion of two new parents wanting to protect the health of their precious new baby Niki conventional baby wipes contain harsh chemicals that can lead to redness, itchiness, dry skin, a burning sensation, even blisters and urinary tract infections. utilizing the miraculous antibacterial qualities of menuca honey, combined with the proven ability of coconut oil to moisturize dry skin Niki's has set a new global standard for premium baby wipes. The smell and feel of the wipes is unique. 100% natural ethically sourced EWG certified and biodegradable. Check out the first all natural baby wipes made with menuca honey and coconut oil, uh, Nikiscom. N I K I s.com and use code badass10 for 10% off badass10. Use that code and get 10% off of your purchase. And today's episode is also brought to you by original sprout. Original sprout, carries safe, effective, and pediatrician, tested shampoos, conditioners, styling, and body care products produced and packaged in California USA. The leave-in conditioners, lightweight formula is made with nourishing, emollients and arnica for split ends, making it ideal for detangling any eliminating frizz from damaged hair. The miracle detangler is perfect to making combing hair easier for babies, toddlers, and children, and anyone with long hair, the Rosemary can help prevent lice. All of original sprouts products are paraben and falate free vegan, and cruelty-free. Their proprietary formulas contain nourishing extracts from fruits, vegetables, and flowers that the whole family can enjoy. They are not just for babies anymore. Check out the entire line@originalsprout.com and use code badass for 25% off of your purchase. And all of these, um, sponsors and their promo codes can be found in our show notes. Under this episode on badassbreastfeedingpodcast.com our show notes will also include further information about things we talked about in this episode. And you'll also find our breastfeeding resources, all of our other episodes and information about scheduling your very own one-on-one online lactation consultation with Dianne. And now back to...what are we Talking about? Feeding on demand and timed feeds.

dianne (20:01):

Absolutely. And we're going to talk about now what it does for your milk supply. So milk supply is driven by how frequently the baby feeds, right? That tells your body, your baby is telling your body. This is what I need. And your body responds. If you're feeding on a schedule, your supply is going to be different than if you're feeding on demand, feeding on demand, you're going to have a plentiful milk supply. Your baby's going to be constantly telling your body what they need. They're going to gain the weight that they need to gain, because they're eating frequently. When you're feeding on a schedule, you might actually be taking away from the baby. You know, you're, you're, that's what, one of the things with like night weaning, but that's a whole different ball game, you know, and I know we have episodes on that and stuff, but if you are denying your baby feeds, when they want them, you could be leading to dehydration. It could be leading to decreased milk supply. It could be leading to, you know, decreased weight gain. All of those things can happen when you're scheduling feeds. The other thing. And we did talk about this a few episodes ago. We'll link back to some of these episodes too, in the show notes, but the storage capacity, right? Every, every breast and chest feeding parent has different storage capacity. And if you have lower storage capacity than the next person, you are going to be feeding more frequently and that's fine. There's nothing wrong with that. You're ensuring that your baby is getting what they need. And that is one of the reasons why we say feeding on demand is really important because you need to ensure that your baby is getting what they need. Yeah. That is the only way to do it is to feed on demand

 abby (21:53):

So storage capacity is the amount of milk that your breast can hold at a time. And some people, it doesn't have anything to do with big boobs and small boobs. It has to do with how much milk your breast holds at a time. And then that'll determine how frequently your baby's nursing. Everybody, somebody who has very large storage capacity and somebody has very small storage capacity at the end of the day, has the same amount of milk that the baby needs. But with smaller storage capacity, you're, you're emptying your breasts more frequently. And so the time feeds makes no sense because it doesn't take into consideration these things like one schedule can not possibly fit all people. When these variations take place in our bodies.

dianne (22:38):

The other thing is babies take what they want when they are, when they're breast and chest feeding. You know, they are in control of their feeds, which is really important. That's what we want. That brings its own set of benefits. When your baby learns how to control and regulate their own feeding behaviors, and they might, you know, just be thirsty and want to just take a little bit, and then maybe an hour and a half later, they might want to actually have more of a feeding and then maybe they'll take a nap and then they'll wake up and they'll want, you know, and even bigger feeding. It doesn't matter because we're not looking at the amount every single time, but they can do that when they are feeding on demand, they can just take what they want to at that time, I think, and this is also a bottle feeding culture thing, and it doesn't matter what's in the bottle, but when you are monitoring every little thing your baby is taking in, we don't give them the freedom to learn how to regulate their own feedings. And when we feed by bottle, we tend to give them the same exact amount every single time. Now think about how are as human beings. We don't eat the same thing, the same amount every single time. Why should your baby? But that's one of the reasons why we see them feed... Sometimes they feed every three hours, you know, maybe there's a chunk of day where they feed their feeds are spread out a little bit more. And then there's a part of the day where their feeds are closer together. That is perfectly normal for, for them. I mean, we do the same thing as adults. We do the exact same thing, right? Some babies are grazers, so are some adults, some babies, you know, will only eat, we'll eat every, you know, couple hours and be satisfied. So are some adults, it, there's no reason why they can't do the same thing.

 abby (24:32):

Yeah. And you see this too, when you get into this as a little bit off topic, but we were comparing the, um, you know, the kind of diet culture and the feeding things as they go on weight and stuff, as it goes on throughout life. But you see this too, like later on like people I see, um, like, you know, bloggers or influencers or whatever, talking about how to get your kids to eat more at meals. And it has a lot to do with like limiting their food at other times. And like, I don't know. I feel like if we just let people eat when they're hungry and people learn about their bodies, that's gonna make everyone a healthier eater. But we live in this, in this culture. It's like here, we have three big meals a day, which first of all, hasn't always been true throughout history and is not true across cultures. This is our culture. And we put all of this value on this. Like we, we time feeds throughout our life.

dianne (25:32):

Yeah.

 abby (25:34):

And this is just not how everybody eats. And some people work really well with that and it's fine. And they, you know, they, it just fits well with them and it doesn't work for everybody. And it just leads to lots of stress when you're trying to get like, uh, for example, and this is not a personal thing at all, a seven year old to sit down and have like meals when like, that's just not how they eat when you know, they just, you're gonna, no matter how you cut it, if it's like a baby or a toddler or a grownup, and you're trying to fit their, eating, their natural eating habits into a schedule or a cultural norm or whatever, it's sometimes you're going to end up with a headache that could be avoided.

dianne (26:24):

Absolutely. Yeah. I mean, we never really learn how to regulate our own feeding.

 abby (26:28):

Yeah. We Never ever let anybody learn how to yeah. How to control their own, how to listen to their own bodies.

dianne (26:35):

Yeah. It's really, I mean, and this is where it starts, honestly, this is where it starts. One of the other issues with feeding on the schedule, like we said, you can be feeding your baby less, but that also leads to less milk supply. And your milk supply will start to dwindle if you are feeding on a schedule. And that is because you're leaving the breast fuller longer, which sends the message of, we don't need to feed. We don't need this milk and less feedings equal less milk. So you are risking a problem with milk supply. If you are scheduling those feedings, it's, it can be dangerous to do that. You know, to schedule feeds like that because you know, your baby might not be getting what they need and then your milk supply could suffer. And we don't want either one of those things to happen.

 abby (27:26):

Right? And the answer is not complicated. The answer is simply just stop scheduling. The feedings is just feed on demand feed, you know, when in doubt, whip your boob out and put it in their mouth.

dianne (27:39):

and, you Know, take that time to educate other people. If you have somebody that's telling you, you shouldn't be feeding your baby again, or why is your baby eating again? Didn't they just eat like an hour ago, take that time to educate them on why and what it's doing for your baby. The other thing that happens with it is that your baby is, is getting so much benefit of being skin to skin with you at the breast, right? Your chest, you know, they're getting lower cortisol levels help to regulate your baby's body Temperature helps to regulate their breathing and their glucose levels. Physiologically This is good for your baby.

 abby (28:17):

That's what we mean by this is the environment that they're acclimated to. Yes, this is like they came from the womb and now on your chest, this is like the safest and healthiest place for them to be.

dianne (28:28):

It is really kinda cool. Cause you know, I've seen a zillion babies in my day and the babies that are fed on demand where the parents tell me, oh, you know, we just, cause I always ask like, how often is your baby eating? Cause I do need to get an idea of how often they're eating. And I love it when the parent says, I don't know, this is when I seem like they need it. I put them on and that's perfect. I'm like, that's the perfect answer. That's exactly what I want to hear. But those parents often also tell me that their baby is less fussy. You know, like those are not where I see the fussy babies that is usually I see the fussy babies with, I'm trying to get him to sleep on his own. He's not doing it every time I lay him down. He won't do it. Um, you know, feeding on demand, offering a lot of bottles from the beginning because you're trying to control the intake like that is where I tend to see more fussiness with babies. Sometimes it can't be helped if there's an issue or if you're separated from your baby or whatever, but when you're just home with your baby and you're able to feed on demand and keep them close all the time, baby wearing and you know, just always having them, they're always holding them, not worrying about other they're going to be spoiled or any of that garbage. Those are the babies that acclimate to life a lot easier. It's just, they just do

 abby (29:53):

Easier for them. Um, yeah, they do studies on like, um, cultures where, um, babies are held, you know, more, more baby wearing is more of a common practice and um, babies cry less in these cultures.

dianne (30:12):

And that is something like, if you are feeling overwhelmed with feeding on demand, because a lot of times people say, well, I put the baby there and they don't even eat. Yes. They just want to be there. The baby wearing can help with that. Baby wearing keeps your baby in close proximity to you. They're in their space. They're against your skin. They can hear your heartbeat. They'll just, they'll be happy there. Let's keep them close with you all the time.

 abby (30:37):

But yeah, it is. Yeah, it is stressful. And like, you know, there's things in this, in that we don't have control over that we need to do that. We can't like, you need to take care of older kids. Like that's just, obviously you can't get around that. And you know, but there are things that you can get around, which is like, I think that, you know, again with the like cleanliness of the house and you know, not wanting to accept, help from people, which is sometimes what happens. I know that happened with me just being like, no, I'm fine. I'll do it. You know, not really wanting anybody to help. Um, you know, trying to, if we can make some of these adjustments and change some of the things that we do have control over and try to make a little bit more time where we can just sit around, just like, that's your job to be sitting around with your newborn. It's it's not lazy. It's not, you know, you're not, um, cause we live in this, you know, again, this culture that only values you if you're like being productive, but that's not what your baby needs. And so we need to really like educate ourselves on this and try to reject that. And if there is something that you can leave on done, then do that. Or if there's somebody who wants to help and you know, wants to, is offering to help let them,

dianne (32:01):

I had a mom recently, I might've already told the story. Not today. I probably, but I told it probably another time that was had called me was concerned because the baby was fussy and wanting to be held and difficult to put down and all that stuff. And um, she was like, it's taking me three days to mow the lawn because I can only go out for a few minutes at a time while he's napping. I'm like, don't mow your fricking lawn. Like that's not right.

 abby (32:32):

It's not essential.

dianne (32:33):

It shouldn't be a priority right now. And you can always hire somebody to do that too. If need be, if you really feel like the appearances are, you know,

 abby (32:43):

I know that's the other thing is that like in, in wherever you live, you might have a thing where if your lawn is overgrown, like it's a really big deal, which is so freaking dumb. I can't even, I can't even stand it. I know what the suburbs do with their manicured, you know, yards and stuff. It's so, oh, it's so frustrating for me to see that people are stressing about this, but like, I get it. If that's the, where you live and that's, what's expected like with people it's going to stress people out. And that's what I mean is like the expectations of people and you know, the things that we value are sometimes just ridiculous.

dianne (33:22):

Yeah. I mowed my lawn with a baby strapped to me.

 abby (33:26):

Yeah. You can totally do that.

dianne (33:28):

I've done that.

 abby (33:29):

Or I would, I mean, if I knew somebody in my neighborhood, I don't have, I live in Chicago I don't have a lawn, but if I lived in a neighborhood, if I did have a lawn and somebody on my block had a baby, I'd be over there mowing their lawn. I won't even ask them. I know. I'd just be like, pardon me? Sorry, then. Excuse the noise. I'm mowing your lawn. Just like we do. I have a, an elderly man who lives next door. Like the whole block is just like, whoever's out there first shovels Jim's sidewalk.

dianne (33:58):

Oh, that's nice.

 abby (33:59):

Cause we just started like, that's just a normal thing.

dianne (34:01):

Yeah. You just look out for each other. That's living in a community.

 abby (34:05):

Yeah. And who was not doing that? Who's not, why is this lady? You know, when someone has a baby, first of all, you see them wobbling around and then you don't see them now, you know that they had the baby. So like mow their lawn. put a big sign out more on my lawn.

dianne (34:22):

I know something like that should be the last thing she needs to worry about.

 abby (34:25):

Right. That's what I'm talking about. We are left to do everything. Absolutely every last thing ourselves And it doesn't even occur to some people to like to ask or it's like, oh, I don't know. She might get mad if I'm stepping on her lawn. And then, and then everybody else is kind of worried about this, you know? Oh, I don't know if I should, because every we live because being isolated is so normal. Yeah. It's so normal that we're like, oh we don't, we don't, we don't want to overstep our bounds by like, you know, mow her lawn or something. It's So weird.

dianne (34:56):

I know. So go out today and do something good for somebody else who just had a baby. If you don't know anybody,

 abby (35:04):

Yeah if you know someone.

dianne (35:04):

Spread the good. Right. If you know somebody who had a baby go out and do something for them today. And if it was you that just had a baby, let somebody do something for you. That's important. It's just as important to let somebody help you.

 abby (35:23):

Yeah, we have that episode. Didn't wasn't it. One was this, is it out yet? Or is it not out yet? Oh, the making breastfeeding easier. Is that, is that not? Is that not? Is that out yet? Oh, it is out now. As of you listening to us right now, it is last week's episode. I think

dianne (35:38):

As of us recording right now It's not so Follow us here.

 abby (35:43):

anyway. Yeah. Check out last week's episode things, you know, that can help make Easier and, and do that for somebody. Maybe it's not for you, but maybe do it for somebody else too. Yeah, that's it. Thanks Dianne.

New Speaker (35:57):

Have fun. Bye bye.